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Bail o' Lies

Member Since 06 Apr 2015
Offline Last Active Yesterday, 10:20 AM

#991764 The Great Naruto Discussion Thread

Posted by Bail o' Lies on 04 November 2026 - 01:49 AM

They need to do Kushina=Naruto and Minato=Hinata because Kushina is too much like Sakura. So when people years ago tried to do Kushina=Hinata it was picked apart pretty quickly.

 

Both of them have long hair...ok so did Sakura at one point, and Kushina has her long hair due to the fact Minato likes her hair. Hinata has it just as a shorthand to make clear she is from a noble family.

They were both abducted by the Cloud(Black) Ninjas. Due to the race the Cloud ninja are often depicted as it is not allowed to depict them as evil. So this parallel is buried. Also Minato rescued her, Naruto didn't.

Minato complimented Kushina's red hair just like Naruto complimented Sakura's forehead...with he never really complimented Hinata beyond a "you are all right" once. 

 

So they had to switched to Minato=Hinata as they are both the calm one, and Naruto=Kushina as they are the energetic one. No matter how shallow that is compared to NS=MK.

 

Tsunade also concluded that speech by saying Naruto likes big breast as the final ultimate conclusion of why they wouldn't work out.

 

Again, the switched was a last minute thing because he was told "fans wanted it" and it would help out Ikemoto's manga sales.

 

He is not going to do anything that stabs Ikemoto in the back. At least not intentionally.




#991744 After 10 years, Naruto is officially getting a revival in 2027

Posted by Bail o' Lies on 15 October 2026 - 05:08 AM

Its a Naruto vs Sasuke final battle rematch fight before Naruto becomes Hokage. Since Salad was just born that means they have actually contradicted the old established Naruto's inauguration. As he was knocked out by the daughter and Kakashi was still Hokage when Mirai was a genin 6 years before her side story. Even then it was constantly implied that Naruto had only recently became Hokage. Now he has been Hokage for most of Bolt's life.

 

Problem is, a better fight is nice, but it doesn't fix anything. Being a Hokage longer doesn't mean anything unless he does some reforms like he was suppose do. Which if they keep to Boruto, he cannot do. Not only that but its been 13 years since the ending when it comes out.

 

This is too little a fix at too late time for addressing the issues with the franchise. While he probably always wanted to expanded upon the final battle. As it was clearly rush due to him needing to end it before chapter 700. That should have been done years ago. Preferably before The Anime went with the gag inauguration, twice.

 

The only way for any revival or fix to work is something drastic and eye catching. It not like it would take long to make a better story than Ikemoto's Boruto. It would only take about 3 years to make a manga better and longer than his. Due to how little of story he has made over the past decade. But Kishimoto doesn't have the spine for that. This is too safe and will be either rejected or accepted but forgotten afterwards. It is plugging holes on a sunken ship.




#991741 The Great Naruto Discussion Thread

Posted by Bail o' Lies on 12 October 2026 - 07:55 PM

Well, I hyped this up for nothing. The sketches on the Shadow Rising previews shows Naruto just becoming Hokage, and Sakura with baby Sarada. So... this is happening before Chapter 700.

To be fair. That is something that needed to be address more than just Sasuke and Naruto hanging out and doing missions while avoiding talking about their love lives.

 

As I have pointed out for years. It feels like Naruto only became Hokage very recently in the story like at best a year before Boruto became a genin. Also Kakashi according to the Mirai novel/manga was still Hokage when she was a genin so 6 years ago story wise. To when she was 18 in that story.

 

Looks at the preview images. Looks like its a rewrite of Naruto becoming Hokage and somewhat the ending of Naruto. While not changing it. Remember the old version where he is knocked out by his daughter is Boruto canon. So this is going somewhat against Boruto. He faces Sasuke again in a rematch, I guess Sasuke visit his wife and daughter, and Naruto become hokage. Though this does counter the vague timeline that Boruto was working with.

 

Its a 13 years too late patch to a story that was heavily damaged. This should have happened a year or two after Naruto ended. Seeing how much of a backlash the ending got. Not over a decade later after it sequel destroyed its prestige and reputation.

 

Would it be better if Kishimoto did a complete rewrite of it fixed the pairings, the rivalry, and Naruto plans/actions once he becomes hokage? Yes. The only way to restore Naruto is to do something dramatic that captures the world's attention with radical changes. Safe patches will be looked at. Then either accepted or ignored but forgotten after. But Kishimoto isn't bold enough to do something like that. So he just going to put patches over rusted holes on the ship that's already sunk and hope that fixes it.




#991736 The Great Naruto Discussion Thread

Posted by Bail o' Lies on 11 October 2026 - 05:42 AM

So... I'm hearing a new manga is coming out, called Shadow Rising. And yes, Masashi is back writing it. Announced in New York Comic-Con. It looks like The Last happened, judging from Naruto and Sasuke's designs... oh boy

 

It's part of a new project that will last about 3 years: Project Rasengan. That limited anime they announced awhile back is actually a crossover with...

 

Now, bare with me because I just found this out very recently and looks like those who followed Masashi didn't even pick it up. Now here was a clue: what was the inspiration of the Rasengan attack?

 

It came from the series, Ninku, a mixture of ninjas with some 90s modern flare, which came in the mid-1990s. I came across this series when I saw there was a fighting game that was released in Japan for the Sega Saturn.

 

Other stuff is a brand new collectible card game, not sure if its gonna compete with Pokémon. 

 

Naruto Mobile is now coming out worldwide.

 

A Symphony Concert based on Shippuden is going to be on US tour.

 

... and other stuff such as Anniversary merch from Shonen Jump.

Boruto is pretty much dead they just don't want to admit it. Or cancel it. Since it has been 12 years too much of the IP is tied up with it. Despite the fact that there is barely a story within the manga. Only someone that is a bold brave innovative risk taker could turn this around. Which Kishi isn't. Like with the Minato one shot, he will likely focus on the part of the story he wants; while avoiding the aspects he wants to avoid. So, it will be Last Naruto and Sasuke hanging out going on missions while avoiding talking about their love lives. Which again means Sakura will likely not be in it and team 7 is once again just Naruto and Sasuke.

 

Yeah I recall Ninku. Never watched it but if anyone look at google images of Ninku. One of the main character's poses is him with an air ball in his hand that looks very much like a Rasengan. Kishimoto was inspired by a lot of 80's and 90's anime/manga. If you watch one of those early 90's anime and think "hey this reminds me of Naruto." The answer often is Kishimoto likely saw it and was inspired by it. Oh its because they are doing a cross over anime event. Where Naruto crosses over into Ninku's world.




#991730 The Great Naruto Discussion Thread

Posted by Bail o' Lies on 07 October 2026 - 04:43 PM

Ah they have leaks for the Naruto Live Action.

 

new-details-about-the-live-action-naruto

 

There is nothing more blatant of a lie in Hollywood. Than the phrase, "Faithful to the Source Material."

 

From what I understand its going to be an "adaptation" of the Land Of Waves Arc. Let's be honest. That is the only really adaptable arc in the manga.

 

Well, they are going with SS. Sakura is going to be a rich girl boss, Naruto is going to be a nerd, and Sasuke probably going to be the cool guy that loves her. They are 18. Besides the Sasuke thing they actually swapped Naruto and Sakura backstories. Granted you are not allowed to kill the mom in a Hollywood movie. It offends the primary target audience of Liberal Middle Age White Woman in Hollywood.

 

They will likely keep Naruto crying over Sasuke's body and him flipping out to make them queer coded. But If Kakashi is not there Sakura is going to be soloing Zabuza.

 

This is going to do...wonders isn't it. Mind you, "Sakura was apparently so hated in the West Kishimoto. That they decided she needed to be the main character of the movie." The Irony.

 

Reminder that this has taken over 12 years to make at this point. And it is likely going to be a complete mess and likely bomb.




#991722 The NEW NaruSaku Debate Thread

Posted by Bail o' Lies on 31 August 2026 - 12:54 AM

I love how naruhina is getting cooked on twitter lately, I haven't been following naruto at all since it ended, but seeing anti naruhina/ pro NS stuff on my timeline is nice to see. Something very nostalgic about it.  https://x.com/sticke...068186120049042

Hello don't think we ever talked.

 

Anyways. The Hinata obsession is a very millennial thing. They spent over ten years while they were growing up surrounded by peers saying she was the most perfect woman ever. She didn't really have much competition of her archetype so she felt unique. Not many anime weren't being brought over to the West during Naruto's prime, even then the Tsundere was still dominant love interest in shounen at the time, and no show in the West would have a female like Hinata.

 

Take out those years and just watch/read Naruto today without the mindset millennials developed overtime. And. It is just awkward that a story that went on for 15 years building up one girl as the love interest, Sakura. Only to change in the last chapter for a girl that was barely in 15 chapters of a 700 chapter manga. That you can have the revived father met the original girl see her interact with his son, be reminded of his own wife, approve of her getting together with him, and then abandon it. Also, how they justify the switch of the pairings is a character having to die to tie them together for the new pairing because it is just that underdeveloped. Help along by streaming giving people more access to anime and in general eastern entertainment, by people watching more anime they find that Hinata is a very, if not the most, basic underdeveloped character of her archetype, AI translations help people find interviews they couldn't find years ago, and people just increasingly not caring about western entertainment anymore.   

 

This a major reason why the switch of love interest at the last second was a bad idea. It only appealed to the Western Millennials that grew up reading it and building a romance in their heads for over a decade. As someone just picking it up will just have a last minute switch that doesn't have the satisfaction they had, as who could really be that happy that the main character got with a girl you may not even remember it you just casually read it, and it leads to Boruto, which no one feels satisfaction about.




#991715 The Great Naruto Discussion Thread

Posted by Bail o' Lies on 22 July 2026 - 09:31 PM

Make sense bout I don't see much Boruto universe skins.

Simple. Who would pay for that? The companies know Boruto isn't that popular. Both the Japanese companies that own the rights to Naruto-Boruto and the gaming companies buying the rights to make skins for their game. The gaming companies, when ideology isn't blinding them, do research to see what will make them the most money. They know Naruto is still fondly regard, but notice any cameo is his part two version not the Last or Hokage Naruto. Any research would show Boruto isn't worth that much compared to Naruto. Look at any data Boruto seems to have anywhere from a 75-95% drop from Naruto in earning and sales. He just not that valuable. So they only time you will see a (non Naruto-Boruto) game having him as a skin is, when they need new skins for the sake of needing new skins.




#991677 The Hinata Paradox Syndrome

Posted by Bail o' Lies on 22 May 2026 - 06:16 PM

I have a question.. never watched/read and of the Boruto stuff. Did Ikimoto/Kishi or whoever brainstorms these plots. Has Hinata ever been "relevant" on a consistent basis in the post-Naruto era as the female lead? 

What? Are you asking about the term or something else? Because reading it should make clear an important part of it is, it isn't planned. Its an accidental.

 

Kishimoto has taken a back seat since he gave control over to Ikemoto. As for him, thinking things through is not something Ikemoto does. If you were to read Boruto manga you will realize he is very predictable and easy to read. The only surprises are curve balls to shake up the monotony that often backfire. 

 

I don't watch the anime anymore so for that its hearsay to a degree.

 

At large after the ending Hinata was given more prominence because she was the heroine now and the mother of the next hero. So she had to do more. But this backfired along with the backlash to the ending because she doesn't have much of a personality, personal interest besides Naruto, charisma, or storylines that make her interesting. So she was largely shove back into the background as much as they could. As she was not liked by the Japanese fans, that weren't her supporters, and they see her as the reason Naruto was ruined.

 

The anime made her an almighty mom to try to counter the notion she a passives wife that has lets her husband neglect their children while they became spoiled rotten unlikable brats. It didn't work, and it doesn't surprise me if she had a lot of scenes in the anime even after I stopped watching. But how unlikable her kids are reflects on her because she is clearly the one who is raising them. So she doesn't get the positive only appears when its important that she used to have. As how her kids behave is part of the story. So she is always somewhat in the back of readers' minds whenever Boruto starts having a hissy fit. That this is Hinata's fault they have to suffer through this brat's behavior. 

 

In the manga, she rarely appears but that is the same for most Naruto characters or even next gen characters that aren't Ikemoto's own creations. Not helped that she was sealed away at the end of part 1 along with her husband. She was largely stuck as the wife of Naruto and the mother of his kids as she seems to have retired unlike the rest of the cast. Kawaki doesn't treat her like a parental-figure like he does Naruto. Her biggest moment was slapping Kawaki because he wants to kill her son and then she was sealed away with no resistance; undermining her big moment.

 

She is no longer the secretly powerful most beautiful ninja that only appears when its important and is the only one who truly loves and understands Naruto; in her fans' minds at least. She is now a housewife doing nothing while her family is a mess.

 

Sakura benefited from the reduced role because that means most people impression of her as an adult is not her crying, doing nothing, but hitting Naruto they had she was when she was a heroine. Instead, while yes, most people do not like her with Sasuke, outside her shippers. She now largely appears to either heal someone, or its related to her daughter. Her daughter is a very well received and well like character so this reflects positively on her, as she was the one who raise her on her own. Her big moment was her speech to her daughter in chapter 34. Besides issues among other things the art that undermined it so it can't truly be called great. Most people seem to agree it is the best scene in Boruto.




#991670 The Hinata Paradox Syndrome

Posted by Bail o' Lies on 21 May 2026 - 04:40 PM

The Hinata Paradox Syndrome: This occurs when a creator dislikes or feels apathetic toward a character, to the point they lose all interest in writing them. Consequently, the character is only brought into the story for strictly necessary scenes that require them and are quickly written out once their task is done. However, because they only appear to perform crucial actions, this creates a false impression in some readers' minds that the character must be highly important.

 

I created a term. This is what led to Hinata being made the Heroine at the end of Naruto. As well as why Sakura is so well received in Boruto.




#991667 The NEW NaruSaku Debate Thread

Posted by Bail o' Lies on 20 May 2026 - 03:03 PM

Nothing is going to happen as long as Boruto is ongoing. That four episode mini-series that has taken four years to make is not to compete with Boruto, but to check the profitability of the IP and maybe prep themselves when they do to Boruto what they did with Bleach: Thousand Year Blood War. Like everything else they have released since the end of Naruto. After that, it depends entirely on both the various companies that used to profit from Naruto, desire to continue to profit from Naruto and seeing it as profitable. Most likely they will do a sequel with Boruto's and Sarada's son Saruto or a prequel with Minato. Less likely but might actually succeed, realize nH/SS was a mistake go back to NS, but that would require them to admit fault. There is the live action stuff but that keeps getting delayed as well.




#991640 Bail o' Lies issues with Boruto.

Posted by Bail o' Lies on 21 January 2026 - 01:59 AM

Have a migraine due to that chapter make better opening post later, and fix the posts below.

 

There are as many mistakes in the Boruto manga as there are stars in the night sky.

 

Such that it is difficult to notice, find, explain, and categorize them all. So at the moment I have limited to 6 general topics to focus on those for the moment; as that is what the AI said my summaries mainly complained about:

 

1) Art, though I don't have much of understanding of it, Ikemoto work as an assistant of Kishimoto that work on the background and Kishimoto trusted to run the sequel when he refused to make it.

 

2) Story as something I can understand, so I can notices the issues of.

 

3) Plot Devices that I have a problem with.

 

4) Combat, as this is a shounen battle manga.

 

5) One of the highlights when people talk about Naruto is, its cast of characters. Which the Boruto manga inherited...that it does nothing with.

 

6) Relationships because two relationships/pairings that define the manga is Boruto and Sarada, that should be the core of the story, as her goal is to become Hokage while he wants to become her enforcer, but this is completely neglected to focus on the Bond of Bros between Boruto and Kawaki.

 

But before that lets talk about how Boruto came about, and to do that we have to talk about Naruto and its ending.

 

Now, Naruto was started in 1999 by a young energetic talented but inexperienced mangaka named Masashi Kishimoto. He had incredible luck in two ways his First Editor Kosuke Yahagi, and a content drought in animation during the mid 2000's. Most Weekly Shounen Jump Editors are only on a manga for about two years; even if they are the ones to approve the manga's publication. Yahagi who approved the publication of Naruto, stayed on the manga for an impressive 10 years; from the development of Naruto to until right before the start of the Pain Arc. This gave him deep understanding of Naruto that most manga editors don't have, as he was there from the beginning. Dictating the story's direction at first to young inexperience mangaka, but slowly switching to guiding and advising, that editors are suppose to do, once Kishimoto found his footing. This helped Naruto become the success it became, but this relationship left Kishimoto with a trust in editors most mangaka know not to have. Second, while Naruto was well received and popular in Japan, it was always second to One Piece domestically. However, when it hit the international market, there was a content drought in animation. A lot of popular animated shows had ended and new ones hadn't start up yet. Not only that but its anime competition had problem when they went international. One Piece, was given to 4Kids, a young children's program, where it was butchered to fit their standards. While Bleach due to it being about death was relegated to Adult Swim, a late night program. So, because it had no real competition when it started internationally. It became a popular, well received international success considered the best animated show of its time. To such an extent that it would not be surprising during some years of its run it was the most successful manga/anime IP ever, for a time.

 

However, that led to its own problems as Toonami aired only part one before it was cancelled. Which disrupted the most vocal international viewers, Americans, watching of Naruto. Which affected how they see the story. As they watched part one, which had very little filler, until after The Sasuke Retrieval Arc. When it then had its giant 2 to 3 years of filler before it started part two. So, if they wanted to continue watching onto Part Two, they had to hunt for it either on other stations or online. However, this disrupted the connection the viewers had with the story, not help that filler arcs were more intermixed in part two. This created in Naruto's American Viewership a disconnect with the two parts. Similar to how they see Dragon Ball as an unimportant prequel to Dragon Ball Z, instead of the same story. They see Part One of Naruto as the true definitive story of Naruto and Part Two as just filler. So what was focused on, or more importantly what they perceived to be focus of the story, in part one particularly in the Chunin Exam when viewership was at its highest: hard work, pain of loneness, defying fate, loser nobody dreaming to be Hokage, following your dreams, and the Hyuuga clan. Were seen as vastly more important than what was focused on in Part Two: Restoring Team 7, His Promise of A Lifetime, Bonds, His budding relationship with Sakura, Ending the Cycle of Hatred, Naruto being seen as a weapon and his desire to be recognize as human, and the Uchiha clan. All of that is seen as unimportant filler. That is part of the reason why they are so obsessed with Hinata as the heroine, because if you saw the Chunin Exam. Just the Chunin Exam itself, not even the entire arc, as the whole story of Naruto. Then, it should be no surprise they wanted Hinata as the Heroine and some even declared they saw her as the true main character of Naruto.

 

Since I keep expanding this, let's talk about the Chunin Exam Arc. Again, if you looked just at the Chunin Exam. Right before the first exam starts, we are introduced to this nice shy quite girl, Hinata, who is sat right next to Naruto for the first test. She is just so nice and kind that she was willing to let Naruto cheat off her paper. Even though he refuses because he remembers the examiners are watching at the last second. But she doesn't know that, so she just thinks he is being noble. Sakura meanwhile was planning on quitting the exam even though it would anger Sasuke to protect Naruto's dream of becoming Hokage, as the Examiner had threatened that if one fails the final question they will never make it to chunin and Naruto hasn't been able to answer a single question so far. They don't interact during the second part of the exam, The Forest of Death. Instead, we see Sakura chastise Sasuke for being a coward while praising Naruto's bravery in fighting Orochimaru without fear, and then protecting both her teammates while they were knocked out. Then at the preliminaries for the 3 part of the exam. She silently supports Naruto, and recalls how much she admires him, while he fights her teammate Kiba. Sakura meanwhile is openly cheering for Naruto. Just like he did for her fight with Ino, even helping her resist Ino possessing her. Then, when it her turn to fight her Cousin Neji, who is so much more gifted than her, she wants to quit, but Naruto cheers her on, so she fights. When she loses Naruto vows to avenge her lost against her opponent Neji. They talk before the match and he compliments her. Since Neji is his last opponent he faces in the Chunin Exam, this must be the most important fight, right? If you think the Chunin Exam arc is literally only the Chunin Exam. They talk about being bound by fate and defying it. Naruto avenges Hinata. Since this clearly is the end of the Chunin Exam and nothing important happens afterwards. Hinata is therefore the most important female character. She deserves Naruto. She deserves to be the Heroine. No, she deserves to be the true main character. The manga should be renamed to HINATA the second she was introduced. She deserves it. She is entitled to it, in her fans mind at least.

 

However, if you look at the Chunin Exam as a whole. Naruto starts off being punched for claiming Sakura is his girlfriend to a bunch of kids, he is embarrassed by opponents in the upcoming Chunin Exam while making Sasuke shine by coming to the rescue, and the biggest threat of the exam Gaara makes it clear. There is no point in Naruto telling him his name because he is so beneath him. By the end of the arc Naruto is fighting Gaara to save Sakura with people around him assuming she is his girlfriend by how fiercely he is fighting for her, while he is to busy to respond because he is trying to rescue her, Sasuke has been shoved to the wayside forced to watch Naruto fight someone he can't handle then afterwards tell Sakura Naruto was the one who rescued her, Gaara who dismissed him before is terrified by the end that after a speech he changes his world view, and Sakura gives Naruto an admiring look after hearing what he did for her. Sakura starts off as spoiled focused only her desire to date Sasuke, is forced to realize she must take being a ninja seriously to protect the people she cares about, is frightened by Sasuke once he uses the curse seal which is the start of her losing faith in him, makes peace with Ino, and start to look at Naruto and care about him. Sasuke got a taste of power and started down the path of darkness. As for Neji, Hinata, and the Hyuuga clan yes they were important for the arc, but they stopped being mention or involved in the story much afterwards.

 

Please note. That Dragon Ball IP was dormant for most of the Naruto's run. Even if, it was more successful as well as profitable overall, it wasn't really doing anything during Naruto's prime. It was Toriyama's disgust at DragonBall Evolution that he decided to involve himself again in Dragon Ball, revitalizing the franchise after Naruto ended. As far as everyone was concerned during Naruto Dragon Ball had all already ended and wasn't starting up again so it was a non-factor until Super, Kai was just making extra off an already ended IP. That said there are Western Fans that quite literally refuse to watch another Anime besides Dragon Ball Z. While Naruto is considered by many in the West as a gateway into anime and when Toonami ended fans went to the internet to search for more Naruto anime episodes really kicking off streaming being a part of watching anime for Western Anime fans subculture nearly a decade before streaming became mainstream. Cruchyroll was made for the streaming of and then made legitimate by Naruto. In 2009, Cruchyroll went to TVTokyo to convinced them to legally allow them to stream Naruto. Which an executive Yukio Kawasaki allowed on a gamble. So which is more valuable over all then? 

 

Huh. I decided to ask the AI if they knew all Kishimoto's editors. But they say there were only three...wait now it gives me four. Though note that the AI keeps giving me other editors. Apparently the 15 editors I have always said were the problem, as Yahagi worked with Kishimoto for the first ten years, then supposedly the next 5-6 were about 14 editors. Since the normal tenure is 2 years, that means there had to been constantly fights with editors being let go only for a new one to come in and all last on average less than 6 months. According to it, those were the assistants or sub editors. It was always a pain to find info about this and I was disinclined to buy the manga volumes again after the ending to check. Also, apparently, it likely wouldn't have help because their translators had a problem mistranslating the terms. Viz media was also notorious for taking liberties and changing meaning in their translations of Naruto. I think the Gemini ai started to translate Japanese sources finally. As I could never find this info online before, beyond hearsay...Ah I just remembered, how Twitter was doing the same recently and the Japanese Twitter hated it because they now have to deal with Westerners and are constantly being harassed.

 

Kosuke Yahagi (1999 – 2008 / Chapters 1 – 402)

Seikimatsu Leader Den Takeshi!

Hunter X Hunter 

Current Editor-in-Chief of Jump Square

 

Yuka Takemiya (2008 – 2010 / Chapters 403 – Early 500s)

Jump Festa Manager 

 

Yuki Honda (2010 – 2012 / Mid-500s)

Current Vice Chief of Weekly Shounen Jump 

Haikyu!!

Dr. STONE

Assassination Classroom

Undead Unluck

 

Jo Otsuki (2012 – 2014 / Climax to Chapter 700)

Naruto: The Last Movie

Nisekoi: False Love 

Boruto: Naruto Next Generations

 

Always stick to what you know, even if its hearsay, until you can find actual information. Then be willing to change your position after careful consideration of the new information. 

 

Even the editors I am using for this post might still be wrong. So it best to check as this is still hearsay.

 

So, after his time with Yahagi, Kishimoto had great deal of trust in Editors. So when the new editor, Yuka Takemiya, came in he trusted her. Old rumors said that the new editor was such a huge fan Hinata and demanded she become the new heroine. That still might be the case, but given that everything the AI said about her is. She is a trans-multimedia brand manager that focuses less on the manga and more on marketing the brand/IP as a whole. She probably talked to the anime staff, who were always huge supporters of Hinata, and was convinced that Hinata must be a popular character that needs to be the heroine to increase sales. She is apparently the one that would never stop bugging him about Hinata to the point he finally publicly complained about it at Jump Festa 2010. Of course her actions backfired. She was in charge of the Pain arc till around that start of the War Arc. So I believe she is the one that helped to sabotage Sakura's early/premature confession into the False Confession as fans call it.

 

So just imagine Kishimoto had a traditional editor that focused on the story for ten years. Then having to go to this, a girl from marketing, likely always in a power suit talking about her various marketing degrees, that just comes in, probably doesn't ever look at the manga, just starts making changes to everything the second she comes in that she demand everyone conform to, constantly coming up with new ideas on her own that must be adopted while demanding no resistance, speaks using strange corporate buzz words, and constantly shows up with folders filled with spreadsheets, flowcharts, and data points. If you have ever worked at a company...it is no surprise Naruto became such a mess after Yahagi left.

 

Ok. After learning about her. We are taking a look at the other two editors, now that I can finally get info on them before continuing. So I, and therefore you, can see the exact damage they caused.

 

Hiroyuki "Yuki" Honda, is apparently known as a hit-chaser. He just constantly went for big hype moments to boost sales. Going from one hype moment to the next, the bigger the better. He is the reason Naruto lost its tactical fighting style and degraded to Dragon Ball Z rip offs. He was in charge of most of the War Arc. So the random battles that rarely seem to have a point beyond eating up a page is on him. That said he was probably the second best editor because during this time Hinata wasn't really being pushed into the Heroine role. Yes, she was given a bit more panel time but not much else. So he wasn't pushing the change the Heroine plan Takemiya started and Otsuki followed through on.

 

Jo Otsuki, is apparently the editor they bring in to finish a manga. So once Kishimoto said he wanted to end the manga he was brought in, so it would be finished in a way that wouldn't negatively affect the brand. So his job was to make sure Kishimoto ended the manga at Chapter 700, once Corporate decided it would end there, and get the story ready for the sequel Boruto. He is the one who ordered Kaguya's creation to tie the Corporate Planned Heroine to the plot and to the planned villains for the sequel. Also, he was the lead coordinator for The Last Naruto Movie; he may have even been the one to ordered it to be about nH. Granted, from everything I recall, it was the anime staff that wanted to make it a Hinata movie. So, even if it was ordered, which I don't think it was the case, its not like there was much pressure needed. He is the one that ordered Sakura not to be able to join the final battle on Naruto's side as she was suppose to be married to Sasuke in like five chapters and her joining Naruto's side during the fight would make the pairings seem even more absurd. Also he was the first editor of Boruto which means he approved the ten months recapping the Movie and likely the five chapters spent with the fire lord's son instead of one chapter like most shouen manga would have done.

 

Wait a minute...Otsuki...Otsutsuki. Was the Otsutsuki clan named after him!? The AI says, no. However, we are dealing with a mangaka whose planned undercover named for Obito was Otobi before Yahagi ordered him to drop the O to make it less obvious.

 

I think I preferred the 15 editors chaos to this, because its clear how Naruto fell. After Yahagi, an actual editor, left Kishimoto got some marketing girl focused more on charts, to a "make explosion even bigger" hype man, and finally Mr. "Wrap It Up How Corporate Wants It."

 

So Kishimoto resisted at first, even getting the other mangaka to help him, because it was obviously a bad idea to replace The Heroine that has been developing a bond with the Hero for ten years. For a minor character that barely got any screen time, at the last minute. But he was gradually worn down over the next 6 years. Also, if it was Corporate's desire because they been told by a data sheet that Hinata would give them more profits. Then, it doesn't really matter what Kishimoto wants. Kishimoto apparently said in interviews he held out ending NS for so long; he didn't even see The Last as The Love Story of nH but The Funeral of NS. Now, what worn him down beside the 6 years of harassment on a 15 year long manga was the death of his father, early in 2014, and the realization he wasn't spending enough time with his family. His wife had to raise their children on her own, while he was a stranger to them, and he could never take his wife out on their honeymoon or a vacation despite being married for 10 years by that point. So his desire to end it so he could spend more time with his family and justified it with, "it is what the fans wants, and if the anime staff, Otsuki, and Ikemoto were willing to do the work to make nH/SS work. Let them."

 

Please note. That he already was planning on ending the series, which is why Otsuki became his last editor on Naruto. It was a mixture of Corporate Desires, his own desire to end the manga, his issues in his personal life, 6 years being told that "this is what the fans want" by the anime staff his editors & some of his assistants, and Mikio Ikemoto supporting nH/SS because he was the one that would be doing the sequel. All of that was what decided the end pairing as well as convince a reluctant Kishimoto to go along with it. He still did chapter 693 where Sasuke laid out why the character doesn't like the pairing.

 

Corporate didn't want Naruto to end. Even 12 years later after it ended, it is still the biggest anime IP for Tv Tokyo due to licensing. The Naruto Ninja Storm games were the Crown Jewels of Bandai Namco before Elden Ring took off. And once Naruto is gone, what manga could Shueisha replace it with internationally at the time? It was the King of International Sales and walking money printing cash chow. They did not want it to end and if it ended they wanted a sequel that would make them the same money. If they are told they will make the most money with nH/SS. Then, that is what they want.

 

Of course, before Kishimoto left he did write the Start of Boruto. As Corporate needed to show he was involved in its making and wasn't completely detached from the sequel. Which is why he was also made a supervisor on the manga. How he wrote the Start of Boruto brought problems that damaged the IP, even if he didn't intend it. The appeal of nH/SS is that they are suppose to be the perfect parings. Sasuke is the perfect dreamy bad boy only I can fix, with Sakura being an insert into that fantasy for its supporters. Hinata was suppose to be the perfect dream girl for guys who wanted revenge against girls that friend-zoned them. Now granted, he likely just wrote them, as how he logically saw them, and how they would act within the story. But, because they were last minute pairings that don't have any real connection or bond in the story. Well that means they are logically, not perfect.  He made Sasuke leave the village to wander around, never visit his family for 12 years, and while he might care about Sarada because she is his daughter. He cares more about his student Boruto than them. Naruto is utterly miserable married to Hinata and his brats are spoiled rotten. This destroyed the primary appeal of those pairings. Corporate couldn't stop it before the damage was done because all they knew is, they had to have these pairings for them to make money. They didn't really understand the appeal and by the time they realized that the damage was happening, it was too late. Those issues became the foundation of Boruto.

 

Not helped that the pairings were only allies because their goals aligned. If NS happened than neither of their pairings could happen. But if either nH or SS than it was likely the other could happen as well. But they don't like each other for a fundamental reason. SS self insert into Sakura, nH fans hated Sakura for her being a friend-zoner, they see Hinata as a better woman than Sakura therefore a better woman than a fan that see herself in Sakura, and that she is lesser than their dream girl. So of course, they now fight over which of them is better and that chases off the fans that want a good manga. That hadn't already left due to the ending.

 

Now, we can finally get to Boruto and Ikemoto. Ikemoto clearly took the job because he thought, it would be easy. There was zero risk of it being cancelled, because it was just suppose to continue on for years, so they could milk the IP. Kishimoto to make sure Ikemoto wasn't overworked, made it a monthly manga instead of a weekly. However, there is clearly part of Ikemoto, that despite taking on Boruto for a safe paycheck, wants to do his own manga. Also he clearly sees Kishimoto as just lucky, that he is better than Kishi, and he can do better than him. That smug arrogant slothfulness could only work if the IP is healthy enough for one to coast off the brand. Even then, that's not a good idea. Naruto however, had structural issues that needed addressing that the ending made worse.

 

Not helped that this slow approach that just assumed Boruto would be successful ignored up and comers like My Hero Academia. Around 2016, streaming anime really took off and restored international interest in anime. Allowing anime that normally wouldn't be even known to dedicated anime fans, to hit the mainstream. Look at One Piece. Which in an interview around the time of the ending of Naruto, in 2015, Oda admitted that he had long accepted that his story didn't seem to have international appeal compared to Kishimoto's Naruto. It was finally able to achieve international success, that it was denied a decade before, allowing it to surpass Naruto because of streaming, global theatrical releases of its movies, and the Live Action adaptation. So, by the time Boruto anime even started, in 2017, it was already replaced. Worse Boruto was facing something Naruto never faced, competition. 

 

Mind you, while Naruto never faced competition internationally, it was still number 2 in Japan behind only its rival One Piece. So, even if it was released into the Era of Anime Streaming or had competition when it originally aired. It would have been able to hold its own. It wouldn't be the biggest anime ever, but it would have held its own. Boruto cannot. Hell, the changes to seasonal anime probably would have helped it as that would have given SP less time to focus on Hinata, no weekly anime putting stress on the manga, and not being the sole international money maker would remove a lot of demand from it.

 

Despite the Corporate's disappointment in Boruto for a time new successful IPs that were able to surpass it constantly with little effort manage to distract and appease them. So, they were content to leave Boruto on the backburner while they profited from their new money makers. Of course that only lasted as long as one of those IP were running. A change from the Big Three era to the current era is, that mangaka don't want to spent over a decade on a constantly expanding story. So, they often single out the big bad that needs to be defeated to end the story early on and work their story towards that fight. So, they could end the story logically when they wanted it. When that happened Corporate would return their gaze to Boruto and find only disappointment. An IP that used to produce a hit movie every year. Hasn't made one in over a decade because its biggest hit wouldn't even register as a success now a days. An anime that is more filler, about 75%, than plot; that even makes Naruto's infamous filler arcs, about 41%, seem modest. No major games in over a decade. Naruto that used to average 3.1 million per volume, while part one of Boruto average around 100,000, and then its part two 50,000.

 

Kishimoto was brought back after Samurai 8 flopped. However, he grew to hate other people interfering with a mangaka due to his own experience. Apparently, after the manga ended he finally looked into the fanbase to see why they wanted the ending the way they did; instead of just relying on the people around him. He was not happy with what he found. He already understood SS was, "the dreamy bad boy only I can fix," which he found cliche and always hated the pairing. But, he finally realize that people wanted Hinata, if for nothing else her big breast. As in an interview he asked someone who their favorite was, they said Hinata, and he immediately went "oh you like big breast." When before that he constantly for years said he didn't know why people like Hinata 'when she didn't do anything in his story.' Sacrificing his health, his mind, his time with his family, his story, and his reputation for that would not make anyone happy. Just put yourself in his shoes for a moment. You have been working on a manga for ten years (1 year pre production 9 writing and drawing) as far as you know its a huge international success and everyone loves your characters. A new editor comes in and says you have to change out your heroine because she is too hated and replace her with a side character you forget about most of the time because she is so minor in the story. As she is apparently too popular to be a side character. You ask, "how Sakura is hated and how is Hinata so popular?" They can't give you a straight answer. You spend 6 years trying to fix the apparent flaw your heroine apparently has, so you don't have to upend your story. Every time you try something, the people around you simply say, "it won't work". You ask, "what makes her hated by the fans and how can you fix it?" They reply vaguely, at best they show you foreign Youtubers. As everyone knows Sakura wasn't hated domestically or you would have heard it before. So you listen to these guys videos, to try to figure out why they hate Sakura. You watch tens, dozens hundreds maybe even thousands of these videos about why your heroine is hated and why they like this side character, but you can never figure it out. That's because if they said the truth on one of their online videos, they would be called a pig. They rely on audience presumptions, that the viewer already knows the issues before they even think about watching the video. So, they never have to say it, as people watching should already just know. Which doesn't help trying to fix the issue when you still have churn out a chapter every week. So when the manga finally ends with the pairings they forced you to have. You go online to see why people liked Hinata and hated Sakura. You find what the people around you wouldn't tell you, it was the size of their breasts. Sakura was so hated because her bust was modest while Hinata was popular because hers were large. It a bit more complicated and nuanced than that, fans didn't like that she didn't get into fights often enough, she didn't seem to do anything, that she hit Naruto, that she was still pining after Sasuke instead of moving on to Naruto, but when you boil it down. It really just comes to how big their chest are. So he couldn't fix the "real problem" by the time his new editors were bringing it up. To fix it, he would had to have known before the start of part two. So he could to make Sakura's breast so large, that she'd knocked Naruto out with them instead of her fist. And all he needed to do to make sure Hinata remained a side character, was make her flat chested; to the point when people looked at her, they thought of a cutting board. Granted maybe not that extreme, but at least enough that when the anime animated Sakura they don't remove her figure entirely and treat her body like it is a straight line. Remember that when Ikemoto drew Hinata with a modest bust in the Boruto manga, her fans went apoplectic. Could you bring yourself to care afterwards beyond getting your paycheck? 

 

Now also think of this. While he was searching online to figure out why they hated Sakura and love Hinata. What was happening to the Naruto-Boruto IP? It was suffering a backlash due to the pairing changes. Almost immediately after chapter 700 large portions of the audience spoke up wondering why did Naruto ended that way it did and made clear. They didn't like the Ending. They asked questions and the answers they got did not please them. They made their displeasure known, and it became clear most of the audience did not hate Sakura. Some loved her, most liked or were fine with her; at worse she was tolerated. They only people that hated her were the Anime Staff and the international fans that have been pirating the story for years. They were always really anime watcher that follow the story how anime told it, and only read the manga for spoilers. They openly bragged that they pirate your story and even though you made the ending for them. They feel no inclination nor obligation to start financially supporting it. Also, it becomes pretty clear that the people that are leaving because they were unsatisfied with the ending were the fans that actually paid for it. As quickly sales go down. The Naruto volumes average 3.1 million, on their first week it was rare for a volume not to sell a million copies. The last volume 72 sold about 800,000 on its first week despite being the last volume, and pretty much volume sales have been declining ever since. Would you be working yourself to death to fix something for corporate when it was their fault, and if they had just left you alone in the first place they would have gotten what they really wanted? Also, he felt he owned Ikemoto for taking over the sequel. So he supports and gives advice if Ikemoto ask, but did not take control to turn it around. So him being brought in changed very little.

 

They ended the anime as the staff were sick of making endless filler. The irony is that it was their fault they were in such a situation.

 

So they ordered the end of part one and moved the manga into part two to shake up the story. It didn't help. As there is nothing that can really turn Boruto around.




#991608 Boruto: Two Blue Vortex Chapter (8)1

Posted by Bail o' Lies on 20 November 2025 - 01:22 AM

China seem to be making a lot of popular games recently. Where Winds Meet seems to be a well received mmo.

 

Apparently, it been so long since there has been a standard male romance in the West. That when the video game Dispatch had one, people assumed it was influence by Japanese harem stories.

 

Summary Time: Chapter 28. New Powers...where we will see the unearned powers that Ikemoto will try to convince the readers are cool. Likely he will fail.

 

Cover page is the Clone caressing Bolt's sword...obvious innuendo.

 

Chapter starts off showing Blond Sai has nearly mastered the jutsu CJ taught him in under a day...remember when the Naruto franchise used to go on about hard work? Well, clearly Ikemoto doesn't. Bolt compliments him and he is rebuffed by Blond Sai that he isn't his teammate...well he wasn't on your genin team translator probably should have used "comrade." Bolt acts the protective older brother due to Blond Sai's feelings towards the daughter. He makes a joke about shaving off Blond Sai awful mop haircut...Ikemoto it is your fault for making that character have that haircut due to your giving the characters "realistic haircuts." He is suppose to have hair like Sai. Is he trying to make the anime, if it comes back, actually have the characters have his haircuts? Because they were ignoring them before and just making look like Kishimoto's style.

 

Cups goes into the interrogation room for his questioning...wait, I thought we flashed forward a week to the battle; did the story backtrack and decided to cover what they could have skip?! Sai contacts the sensory division and ask for their records for any communication Konohamaru had...god I hate the telepathic hotline stuff. The story feels like it both skipped the week for Bolt's sword to be repaired and yet it didn't for the interrogation and Blond Sai's training. This might actually be the worse structured chapter in the entire manga so far. As I am actually confused on what is happening and when events are happening. Dear God. Ikemoto can't even handle something as simple as a time skip/jump ahead. 

 

When Ikemoto did the time skip to the battle at the end of the last chapter. That means the interrogations should have been over, and Sai should've address his suspicions after the battle. Or was Konohamaru really interrogated for 7 straight days? But even then he asked for transmissions Konohamaru received a "few minutes ago" which would have been a week ago. 

 

Bolt gets his upgraded sword from the Clone who explains how it was improved...wait it can now activate the mana sword by just him gripping it? How? OK I do want that explained. Other than the sword is absorbing some of his chakra to do this they don't. Unless the Hagoromo is just pour chakra into the blade there should be more to it. Also, she was somehow able to add a safety feature where only she, Bolt and Sasuke can use the sword anyone else and it will drain more chakra than necessary...How? And How was she able to registered Sasuke's signature? Stupid Scientific Ninja Tool Bull-Shit.

 

Shikamaru talks with his son about the upcoming attack and they are working with Bolt...it is more of the same "we got to work with Bolt"/"but we hate him due to the perspective flip" that I feel everyone should be sick of at this point. Like if a conversation is had between to people in the village assume this is brought up and I generally won't cover because I am sick of reading those conversation, as they don't go anywhere.

 

Blond Sai talks with CJ about his prediction powers and CJ explains why he can't give people more details. The more people know that future the more it can change outside his control and he is working with narrow margins due to how overpowered Ikemoto makes his villains. A page where Hime is trapped in a tree and the daughter is dead.

 

Shikamaru gives an announcement to the cast through Blond Sai. Thank god none of the Kishimoto characters shall be used or be useful. Even though this battle is taking place in the village.

 

Tree-bug enters the village and the battle starts.




#991602 Did NaruSaku only have a chance because Sasuke was away?

Posted by Bail o' Lies on 05 October 2025 - 10:52 AM

Had a stray thought relevant to this topic so wanted to write this down. So Therece clearly has views of the main cast that differ from the manga and even the Last interpretation of them. Which honestly is a reflection on her character.

 

So before continuing that line of thought lets first go into the different views the manga, the anime through the last, and Therece have of the main cast relationships.

 

Naruto:

Manga: He was in love with Sakura. It probably like MK, JT, and OR started out in the academy, likely due to some action Sakura took like helping him once when no one else would, and blossomed throughout the years. While he loves Sakura deeply he wants her happiness more than he wants her. So at the end, when it was clear Sakura would not let go of her feelings for Sasuke and Sasuke was willing to be with her; he backs down for his two friends happiness. So he married Hinata to honor Neji's sacrifice.

The Last: He never had any feelings for Sakura or anyone else for that matter as he is incapable of understanding or experiencing love. He only pretended to love Sakura because he understood Sasuke had feelings for her, somehow, so decided to be a third wheel to screw with their relationship. The worst scumbag. Only gets with Hinata because everyone tells him to.

Therece: His feelings don't matter, though he doesn't love Sakura because he isn't worthy of loving her. Men like him exist to do Therece I mean Sakura's bidding. Which is bringing her boytoy Sasuke back to her and if he dies trying to do so? Who cares.

 

Sasuke:

Manga: He doesn't have feelings for Sakura but feels guilty for constantly rejecting her when she has been so devoted to him. So ends up with her as part of his atonement. Did he ever fall in love with her? Well...he loves his daughter, Sarada.

The Last: Surprisingly. Actually did love Sakura all along and may have gotten together with her sooner if Naruto wasn't acting like a third wheel anytime they could have bonded.

Therece: His feelings don't matter. He is pretty much a sextoy. He must love Sakura because she loves him.

 

Sakura:

Manga: Her crush turned into love due to the forehead comment. She never learned the truth so she never stopped loving Sasuke. She has feelings for Naruto, but they could never make that final push into a love that surpasses her feelings for Sasuke as long as the truth about the forehead comment remained hidden.

The Last: At some point, she realized that Sasuke did always love her. It was just Naruto acting like a third wheel that prevented them from getting together sooner and could have prevented some of the damage Sasuke leaving the village caused. Instead of hating Naruto for it, she rises above it, and decides to help Hinata get together with him. In hopes, that her eternal love might actually reach the heart of that emotionless scumbag.

Therece: Sakura is entitled to Sasuke because his sexy dreamy bad boy she can fix. His feelings on the matter are unimportant, he must love her. She is willing to use, abuse, and finally discard Naruto once she gets wants because she doesn't care for him in the slightest. She only willing to amuse herself with the notion of ending up with him if Sasuke isn't around.

 

Right, incase no one has ever talk to someone about the Naruto franchise in their entire life. The last interpretation of Sakura is generally one that people that utterly hate her have of her. For example that V-Tuber Ouro Kronii, sees Sakura as an utterly vile kitten for using and abusing Naruto when he is so devoted toward her, pathetic for her obsession towards Sasuke despite him making it as clear as day he doesn't have feelings for her, and useless because all she does is cry while refusing to fight. Most of it is misunderstanding or exaggeration of her flaws. Therece on the other hand thinks this interpretation makes Sakura the perfect woman. Now does that not reflect on Therece's character?  




#991588 The Great Naruto Discussion Thread

Posted by Bail o' Lies on 02 September 2025 - 01:49 PM

Yet they had no problems when the last did this to Naruto for Sakura.  :lmao:

In Japan, that pretty much destroyed Naruto's reputation and made him a scumbag in their eyes. To the point, I do think that it did eventually went from being completely canon to semi-canon.

 

In the West, as long as Naruto only loves Hinata they do not care how bad it makes him look, because the worst is apparently not loving only Hinata and him caring about anything else.




#991586 The Great Naruto Discussion Thread

Posted by Bail o' Lies on 01 September 2025 - 07:48 PM

At one point they will because Naruto became a brand. It transcended beyond just being a manga. It's a brand and they will use that.

The question now is when? And also will they learn their lesson? There would be no point in making something new if they just do the same thing.

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing and expecting a different result.

Whenever Boruto is over/Ikemoto's contract is up/when they need a IP that can make them money.

 

Again, SJ isn't lacking in IP at the moment that are making them money. Likely, why Part one was ended, was that Boruto's peers were all ending at the point and it was making them look at it. To realize, Ikemoto was wasting time and his story was in a rut that could have part one last for 15 years on its own. Which would be nice if it was profitable, though everyone knows, that wasn't the case. So if we wait for the current batch to end, as Ikemoto is failling back into bad habits, they will look at part two again see waste and order it to finish. Which can be about 5 years. Granted shounen manga aren't going on for as long as during Naruto's time. Kill Blue that just ended finished before the first episode of its anime aired.

 

I think Ikemoto is in a 60 chapter contract as that's around the time Kodaichi was "let go" as his contract is up. 120 of Boruto in total chapters is 40 of part two which is 15 chapters/months from now. If they changed it to 60 chapters for part two 35 Chapters/Months from now.

 

Boruto is pretty much designed to go on forever due to its abysmal pace. From the start of part two Bolt has had three goals: defeat Punk, defeat the Tree people, Defeat Nail to release his parents. Now those could all be resolved in a single fight or he can make it go on forever.

 

It really is just how long until the company gets sick of the situation and just ends it.

 

As for will they change it? If they do continue it, they have no choice. Boruto is seen as such a black mark even by Pro-ending fans that keeping it canon only hurts the IP. Kishimoto was always a reluctant supporter of nH/SS, he only had them because he was told they would be profitable...which they clearly haven't.