31569 replies to this topic

[VanitasDS76491]

Here's something I commissioned on da with shinachiku https://www.devianta...nge-1-821118196
Think of it as my middle finger to the NH fans.

[tricksie]

 

 

It also fits into how messed up things are and how it all went too. Since it also shows Naruto didn't really change anything when he became Hokage, considering how he had so much he wanted to do, and yet, what did he really achieve? Jack and crap! And it also makes me think in the long run of how much of this crap is gonna be ignored in my fanfic, along with actually doing some things better, like not that Naruto is a chakra reincarnation of Hagoromo's youngest son, Ashura, but that he's actually an indirect descendant to Hagoromo through Ashura's family, but that won't take away from him being about hard work.

 

On the other side of that, Sasuke's gonna be the direct descendant of Indra, being Madara's great-grandson. Or great-great, I dunno yet since I'd have to figure it out all things considered with Hashirama and Tsunade.

Yep! The Naruto of the end is not the Naruto of about 90 percent of the story.

 

That's why it'd be so easy seeing this whole thing as part of Hinata's dream. Even the stuff about Sakura not really being Sarada's mom, and instead being her being Karin's child. It's like the whole thing was written to be an alternate universe.

 

Yes - I like your ideas on the reincarnation stuff. I wish they'd gone more into it - it could have been so interesting! Im really glad you are!!

[Derock]

This is the clan that Naruto married into. 

 

So again, not only is the ending completely whack from the standpoint of not loving HInata. But he singles their clan out as one that is absolutely against everything he supports. It's a major story point. For Naruto to marry into that clan with no definitive word whether it's been amended or if Hinata is still leader (and thus carrying on the bird seal) or if she has left her clan and shunned their backwards practices for her hubby, just shows how far Naruto has fallen from his original character.

 

The team whom are doing this BS will probably think is the latter, which I put in bold. As a matter of fact, the whole clan (from what I saw and heard) is freaking backwards. We still have Hiashi alive and acting like he's an ALL-LOVING Grandfather in Boruto. So the former won't work because of the common logic sense from Masashi before the nosedive of an ending.

 

My still ongoing EPIC which I have to start writing soon

Some tibbit but I have this idea that because somehow Naruto "changed" after The Last events and backing with his behavior in those stupid novels, I'm thinking the Hyuuga clan supported him in becoming Hokage and the "bargain" was to marry Hinata as soon as possible became the result.

[tricksie]

 

The team whom are doing this BS will probably think is the latter, which I put in bold. As a matter of fact, the whole clan (from what I saw and heard) is freaking backwards. We still have Hiashi alive and acting like he's an ALL-LOVING Grandfather in Boruto. So the former won't work because of the common logic sense from Masashi before the nosedive of an ending.

 

My still ongoing EPIC which I have to start writing soon

Some tibbit but I have this idea that because somehow Naruto "changed" after The Last events and backing with his behavior in those stupid novels, I'm thinking the Hyuuga clan supported him in becoming Hokage and the "bargain" was to marry Hinata as soon as possible became the result.

Right! He didn't marry Sakura, a so-called normal girl. He married a clan princess! WTH happened to her clan obligations?

 

And Hiashi acting like a doting grandfather? That's crazy! He was totally written as a distant, diffident clan head who had no problems doing the hard/cruel/heartless things that ensured the safety and prosperity of the clan and, more importantly, the head family of the clan. He was not a nice guy! 

 

I love your epic-yet-unwritten fic! Don't worry, I completely understand about the writing thing! It all takes time. Sometimes, a looong time!

 

more fic spoiler stuff

I think it makes complete sense to have Naruto be courted by the Hyuuga family! Hinata has always been a pawn type character, and this would be a way to make her father proud, elevate her usefulness in her family and make her position as 'princess' be meaningful if she can snag the future Kage. And they could offer Hinata as well as all their clan support behind him. It would be very tempting to a changed/weakened/alternate universe type of Naruto. Expecially if it came with a giant family, a pretty girl and a guarantee easy path to the Kage seat.

 

In one of my fics (also loooong running), I have added in some aspects of the Hyuuga in Konoha that could have been in the manga: that they would have benefitted from the demise of the Uchiha clan. Extra land, extra power, etc. If the Uchiha were the most powerful clan, then overnight - literally - the Hyuuga became the most powerful clan. It would even make sense if they courted Sasuke instead of Naruto, to fully take over the the rest of the Uchiha holdings by way of a new son-in-law.

 

In another fic, I've taken the same view as you - that the Hyuuga would have absolutely courted Naruto. Not just Hinata. But the whole clan would have thrown their weight behind getting Naruto and separating him from Sakura.

 

I just realized that in no fic do the Hyuugas come out okay! hahaha! They're always sort of power hungry or snobbish in some way.

[Derock]

Right! He didn't marry Sakura, a so-called normal girl. He married a clan princess! WTH happened to her clan obligations?

 

And Hiashi acting like a doting grandfather? That's crazy! He was totally written as a distant, diffident clan head who had no problems doing the hard/cruel/heartless things that ensured the safety and prosperity of the clan and, more importantly, the head family of the clan. He was not a nice guy! 

 

I love your epic-yet-unwritten fic! Don't worry, I completely understand about the writing thing! It all takes time. Sometimes, a looong time!

 

more fic spoiler stuff

I think it makes complete sense to have Naruto be courted by the Hyuuga family! Hinata has always been a pawn type character, and this would be a way to make her father proud, elevate her usefulness in her family and make her position as 'princess' be meaningful if she can snag the future Kage. And they could offer Hinata as well as all their clan support behind him. It would be very tempting to a changed/weakened/alternate universe type of Naruto. Expecially if it came with a giant family, a pretty girl and a guarantee easy path to the Kage seat.

 

In one of my fics (also loooong running), I have added in some aspects of the Hyuuga in Konoha that could have been in the manga: that they would have benefitted from the demise of the Uchiha clan. Extra land, extra power, etc. If the Uchiha were the most powerful clan, then overnight - literally - the Hyuuga became the most powerful clan. It would even make sense if they courted Sasuke instead of Naruto, to fully take over the the rest of the Uchiha holdings by way of a new son-in-law.

 

In another fic, I've taken the same view as you - that the Hyuuga would have absolutely courted Naruto. Not just Hinata. But the whole clan would have thrown their weight behind getting Naruto and separating him from Sakura.

 

I just realized that in no fic do the Hyuugas come out okay! hahaha! They're always sort of power hungry or snobbish in some way.

 

Ooooh I love your ideas! I should make you as my beta readers when I'm in writing phase.

 

I'm going to start a discussion thread about it in the Fic thread. I'm welcome to some suggestions.

[Qia]

God speaking of new fics I'm really in need of some suggestions cus a lot of the fics I've already read/haven't been updated in years :( sigh 

[tricksie]

God speaking of new fics I'm really in need of some suggestions cus a lot of the fics I've already read/haven't been updated in years :( sigh 

*ducks* uh...sorry if you read mine. it's awful how long it's been between updates. but I'm still at it, updating when I can!!! 

 

I don't know what's new, except for some from writers from here. But I'd love to see some suggestions too if anyone's read good stuff lately!

[Derock]

For those who want to see the project and status, link is here: http://www.narusaku....showtopic=16538

[NarutoUzumaki01]

Remember that epic 15 years in production shonen with an underdog orphan mc who strived to change the world but had nobody to raise him depsite him being a son of mayor and inheritor to the one of most important bloodlines in whole village, with nuclear weapon sealed in him, by a lucky chance taught how to use it by a legendary warrior who once were a teacher to his father... oh yeah, almost forgot that to change the world was his fate somewere along the road it turned out that he just needs to not job a fight with some other dude who's fate is...? To just fight this mc? Excellent logic.

 

Why wrtie about Uzumaki if in previous 500 chapters there was not even 1 mentioning of how unique was this clan? Never went further than 1 scene with "strong chakra" explanation why mother didn't die right where she was.

Why make Karin lone survivor of this clan if she never even had a direct contact with Naruto, no discussion between them at all, why reveal Karin being Uzumaki?

Why introduce Kushina as plot driving character who suggest which person Naruto should look as his companion in life? Coudn't that be just a note written by a name/surname mother with her photo in mail, like that naruto would find it in his old house at some point of manga?

 

Oh right, Kushina perfectly fits into many of deliberately written levels of the most kittening logical "red herring" part of manga that consisted of like ~50% of all interactions of cast in one way or another.

 

And I'll be glad to be mad at hinata or sasuke, but in the end it's author who wrote them this way, or didn't care enought to even write them this way and just approved anything he was suggested to picture, this story just a one big failure overall.

Edited by NarutoUzumaki01, 24 November 2019 - 04:40 AM.

[Bail o' Lies]

The problem is that Kishimoto probably never saw it as anything more than a way to tie up some loose ends...mainly what ties the Uzumaki into the Senju-Uchiha conflict? Ie the BS cycle of hatred he trying to make a major plot point by that point to justify the final fight between Naruto and Sasuke. Answer, they are an related to the Senju, who are a cousin clan, and they both descend from the younger son of the Six path Sage. Beyond that. It gave him an excuse to expand upon Kushina's character and make her more important, to please his wife. As well as justify why Pain had the eyes. And later why Karin has those healing abilities as well as more powers later on.

 

Though as you point out it bring in some questions. Why is a child from a well respected ancient and powerful clan abandon and not taught anything about his family? The child of a gifted ninja that rose through the rank to the top because of skill and talent sure, but someone that descend from the village's oldest allies that married the founder of their village? Even if he did skip class how did no one bring it up before?

[RulesofNature]

I always assumed that in their desire to milk the franchise, SP and the editors had Kishi add stuff that could be expanded on in filler episodes.

[Bail o' Lies]

I always assumed that in their desire to milk the franchise, SP and the editors had Kishi add stuff that could be expanded on in filler episodes.

From how I understand it Kishi never cared about the anime, he like live action, rarely worked with them, as well as often working more with the video game company, and was often annoyed with it as well as them. They normally had to presented it as the fans want X to even attempt to convince him.

 

Under Yahagi he had the three month gap between the valley of the end and Naruto leaving on his training trip to give filler time so the anime wouldn't over pass the manga again.

 

After Hinata was made the love interest Kaguya was given the Byakugan to tie the hyuuga to the plot.

Edited by Bail o' Lies, 25 November 2019 - 01:40 AM.

[NarutoUzumaki01]

The problem is that Kishimoto probably never saw it as anything more than a way to tie up some loose ends...mainly what ties the Uzumaki into the Senju-Uchiha conflict? Ie the BS cycle of hatred he trying to make a major plot point by that point to justify the final fight between Naruto and Sasuke. Answer, they are an related to the Senju, who are a cousin clan, and they both descend from the younger son of the Six path Sage. Beyond that. It gave him an excuse to expand upon Kushina's character and make her more important, to please his wife. As well as justify why Pain had the eyes. And later why Karin has those healing abilities as well as more powers later on.

 

Though as you point out it bring in some questions. Why is a child from a well respected ancient and powerful clan abandon and not taught anything about his family? The child of a gifted ninja that rose through the rank to the top because of skill and talent sure, but someone that descend from the village's oldest allies that married the founder of their village? Even if he did skip class how did no one bring it up before?

Nah, see, there is difference between altering a plot (addeding a prophecy about a person that will either stop wars or fail in a fight vs person with god eyes) which was brought up first around Pain's arc, that was a decent move (yeah a bit of loosing an "underdog" trope, but still.) cause Sasuke was heading back to Konoha at the same time Pain was there so it was a fork as who Naruto will fight. Second example is how this plotline goes apekitten, first Naruto fights Madara to stop war, then Kaguya to stop her (what was her motivation?), then Sasuke (why? Cause he assaulted Sakura? Cause he threatened to kill Kages? Cause he promised Sakura to get him back? Cause Sauce suddenly wanted to become Hokage? Cause of prophency? Which one is it?) Who exactly was this "person with strong eyes"?

 

Epitome of bs of this manga is not even pairings, yeah it's a dissaster on it's own, but what was the goal of jorney? MC getting recognition, achiving a tittle he was dreaming of since early childhood, where was this moment, a culmination of all the hardwork he did put in? Ch.699? Where he silently gets cucked by a dude who chapter ago was threating him and a whole world with a tyrany of "nuclear weapons" in his hands. Ch. 700? That is basicly a promoution to another manga, we get a glimpse of him wearing a hokage outfit, a mountain with his face on it, but whats the difference? We basicly get a suggestion that he got what he wanted. But was it satisfying for you? Whats the difference if he was showed in a jonin or anbu outfit or even his gravestone and still having a face on mountain meaning that he was hokage at one point? Difference is that there was no reaction from MC himself or those that surrounded him on his journey, and if that's not a lazy writting, I don't know what is. 

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

Yep! The Naruto of the end is not the Naruto of about 90 percent of the story.

 

That's why it'd be so easy seeing this whole thing as part of Hinata's dream. Even the stuff about Sakura not really being Sarada's mom, and instead being her being Karin's child. It's like the whole thing was written to be an alternate universe.

 

Yes - I like your ideas on the reincarnation stuff. I wish they'd gone more into it - it could have been so interesting! Im really glad you are!!

 

Exactly what I was thinking, as if it also shows too how Hinata is jealous of Sakura, and wants her to be miserable deep down inside.

 

Thanks for that I felt it'd be a great idea to do that, especially considering it can tie things without making it that Naruto and Sasuke instantly can gain power from Hagoromo. And that way I could still keep Naruto as an underdog.

 

Even with the stuff of the Shadow Clone training, people forget Naruto still had to work at learning the basics of the manipulation of Wind-Style chakra, as well as Kakashi underestimating him, but I wish he learned a lot more than just the Wind-Style Rasengan and the Rasenshuriken. Something else I'm gonna need to tackle in The Demon Within.

 

Also had this wild idea in my head of Sasuke having some leftover natural energy infused into his chakra from his having his Curse Mark and his use of it, that would give him a different Sharingan in place of the Mangekyo Sharingan, or rather a supplement to it. Still in the works though.

[Phantom_999]

Nah, see, there is difference between altering a plot (addeding a prophecy about a person that will either stop wars or fail in a fight vs person with god eyes) which was brought up first around Pain's arc, that was a decent move (yeah a bit of loosing an "underdog" trope, but still.) cause Sasuke was heading back to Konoha at the same time Pain was there so it was a fork as who Naruto will fight. Second example is how this plotline goes apekitten, first Naruto fights Madara to stop war, then Kaguya to stop her (what was her motivation?), then Sasuke (why? Cause he assaulted Sakura? Cause he threatened to kill Kages? Cause he promised Sakura to get him back? Cause Sauce suddenly wanted to become Hokage? Cause of prophency? Which one is it?) Who exactly was this "person with strong eyes"?

 

Epitome of bs of this manga is not even pairings, yeah it's a dissaster on it's own, but what was the goal of jorney? MC getting recognition, achiving a tittle he was dreaming of since early childhood, where was this moment, a culmination of all the hardwork he did put in? Ch.699? Where he silently gets cucked by a dude who chapter ago was threating him and a whole world with a tyrany of "nuclear weapons" in his hands. Ch. 700? That is basicly a promoution to another manga, we get a glimpse of him wearing a hokage outfit, a mountain with his face on it, but whats the difference? We basicly get a suggestion that he got what he wanted. But was it satisfying for you? Whats the difference if he was showed in a jonin or anbu outfit or even his gravestone and still having a face on mountain meaning that he was hokage at one point? Difference is that there was no reaction from MC himself or those that surrounded him on his journey, and if that's not a lazy writting, I don't know what is. 

 

Hmm I recall the toad grand sage (or elder, whatever it was) Said it was "a young man with great power in his eyes" So that practically spelled it out, but I could remember wrong so correct me if that is the case. Other than that agreed. The biggest problem was not even the inconsistent writing but the fact that everything was undone and rendered pointless in lazy cop out just to milk the series even further when there is really no plot to expand on anymore. Because let's be honest, to expand and extend the story, Naruto would have to fail at what he was prophesied to do which is EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENED. So what is the series now, if not a BIG FAT EFF YOU to the MC and the story revolved around him?

Edited by Phantom_999, 26 November 2019 - 06:28 PM.

[totherpage95]

I can't believe there are people so obsessed with akatsuki kitten that I see arguments that jiraiya would lose one on one with Kisame or Itachi ... So that's why both of them said jiraiya would drag their reputations through the mud? That's why jiraiya was able to fight against pain who's stronger than itachi and kisame (yes itachi does have abilities like susanoo but it causes blindness) and might have stood a good chance if he knew their secret?

[VanitasDS76491]

I can't believe there are people so obsessed with akatsuki kitten that I see arguments that jiraiya would lose one on one with Kisame or Itachi ... So that's why both of them said jiraiya would drag their reputations through the mud? That's why jiraiya was able to fight against pain who's stronger than itachi and kisame (yes itachi does have abilities like susanoo but it causes blindness) and might have stood a good chance if he knew their secret?

Bigger question is why the Uchiha aren't hated given what itachi, madara and obito did I mean there names are already dragged through the mud.

[Nostradamus]

Bigger question is why the Uchiha aren't hated given what itachi, madara and obito did I mean there names are already dragged through the mud.

Because they are hooooooot. XD

[Nate River]

Epitome of bs of this manga is not even pairings, yeah it's a dissaster on it's own, but what was the goal of jorney? MC getting recognition, achiving a tittle he was dreaming of since early childhood, where was this moment, a culmination of all the hardwork he did put in? Ch.699? Where he silently gets cucked by a dude who chapter ago was threating him and a whole world with a tyrany of "nuclear weapons" in his hands. Ch. 700? That is basicly a promoution to another manga, we get a glimpse of him wearing a hokage outfit, a mountain with his face on it, but whats the difference? We basicly get a suggestion that he got what he wanted. But was it satisfying for you? Whats the difference if he was showed in a jonin or anbu outfit or even his gravestone and still having a face on mountain meaning that he was hokage at one point? Difference is that there was no reaction from MC himself or those that surrounded him on his journey, and if that's not a lazy writting, I don't know what is.

I agree that the pairings are a mess, but far from the primary issue. Naruto got his recognition from the village at the end of the Pain arc. He got it from the onscreen cast much earlier than that. The formal resolution of this plot thread is what left him a character without direction. Other than get Sasuke back, there wasn’t a whole lot for him to do. I think tricksie made a very compelling case several years ago that the the original ending of the manga was much closer to the Pain arc.

I think we get the world peace stuff from him because he needed something to do while Sasuke’s motivations got retrofitted. His primary goals had largely been met. No, he was not Hokage yet, but he I think he had earned it by that point. It was tied to his recognition goals as that was part of the reason he wanted to be it in the first place.

[HalfDemonInuyasha]

I can't believe there are people so obsessed with akatsuki kitten that I see arguments that jiraiya would lose one on one with Kisame or Itachi ... So that's why both of them said jiraiya would drag their reputations through the mud? That's why jiraiya was able to fight against pain who's stronger than itachi and kisame (yes itachi does have abilities like susanoo but it causes blindness) and might have stood a good chance if he knew their secret?

Kisame himself said that he would lose to Jiraiya and that the two of them together could only hope to take Jiraiya down with them (as in all three of them dying), and they outright ran away after Jiraiya got involved when they attacked Naruto.