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#25241 BlackShirtGuy

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 05:36 PM

See the thing about Neji's death, is that it can be so easily replaced with almost anybody else:
-Have Lee appear, open all his inner gates and destroying most of the (I' can't get over this I swear xD) sticks of wood with his taijutsu and shield  the one who is going after Naruto with his own body, then have Neji give the peptalk to him.
-Have Kakashi die, he's popular enough to actually have an impact, and be him with his final words the one who teachs Naruto the final lesson of aceppting death and that this is something he will have to deal if he wanna be Hokage.
-Have Sakura die, (Hey, as I think better die young than become Sasuke's housewife) she was the one who was with Naruto from the start, so he would actually had a very good REASON to feel as crushed as he did and to consider joining Obito, but in the last moment refrain from doing it because Sakura wouldn't want that.
-Have Hinata die, just replace the situation, first is Neiji who goes to save Naruto and then Hinata saves him at the expense of her own life, in her deathbed she tells him that now he can break the Hyuuga clan curse and unite the two branches so that things like happened between him and her would never happen again.

I'm no writer but at the very least 2 or 3 of those ideas, I think HAVE to be better than what we got, I dunno, judge it yourselves.


“There are many types of monsters in this world, monsters who will not show themselves and who cause trouble. Monsters who abduct children, monsters who devour dreams, monsters who suck blood, and, monsters who always tell lies. Lying monsters are a real nuisance, they are much more cunning than other monsters. They pose as humans, even though they have no understanding of the human heart. They eat, even though they've never experienced hunger. They study even though the have no interest in academics. They seek friendship even though they do not know how to love. If I were to encounter such a monster, I would likely be eaten by it, because in truth, I am that monster.”   -L. Lawliet

 

#25242 ThroughWithLove

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 05:47 PM

 

NejixHinata was never really a thing though, I don't think the sacrifice was for that at all. More for narrative flow.

 

Neither was NarutoxHinata. And boom, it happens it in the 700th chapter. :lmao:


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#25243 Dalton.T.R

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 07:02 PM

 

I will say all of these -are- options though that he could have gone with, though, but we can see why, in that each of these characters had their own things and plans in mind for later, whether for the Guy part (Lee), Obito (Kakashi), or the Team 7 reunion (Sakura). Hinata could have worked, really. It just he had different plans, and really so could have all the others. I don't think it would make it better persay, certainly the Lee option wouldn't have the same impact, Naruto wasn't that close to him. Sakura and Kakashi though, would have been big picks, and those could have been more impactful, if that is what you mean by better.

 

 

Naruto x Hinata had development in fairness. Neji x Hinata on the other hand was always shown in the manga as brother and sisterly. 

Right. 15 whole slides out of the manga REALLY compares to the countless Naruto and Sakura had.



#25244 HalfDemonInuyasha

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 07:46 PM

Yeah, sibling incest in anime/manga still makes me incredibly uncomfortable and the sole exception I've made in that category is Kirino x Kousuke from "My Little Sister Can't be This Cute" but I've been desensitized from cousin x cousin couplings after several years of anime and have a few that I genuinely support and love.  

And they tend to get around the sibling bit by...

1.) Having one of them be adopted (IIRC, it's legal in Japan to marry an adopted sibling).

2.) Be from a different mother.

3.) Be "siblings" in name only while being cousins, friends, or something.


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#25245 TouKen4Life3g

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 08:56 PM

Yeah, sibling incest in anime/manga still makes me incredibly uncomfortable and the sole exception I've made in that category is Kirino x Kousuke from "My Little Sister Can't be This Cute" but I've been desensitized from cousin x cousin couplings after several years of anime and have a few that I genuinely support and love.  


I guess that's why the term "wincest" exist. Come to think of it, I always felt Elfin Lied appeared at a bad timing because it struck me to be the very first introduction to cousin pairing to USA market. Much like how Sailor Moon could have been first one for homosexual love if it wasn't changed.

#25246 Kagomaru

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 09:12 PM

I guess that's why the term "wincest" exist. Come to think of it, I always felt Elfin Lied appeared at a bad timing because it struck me to be the very first introduction to cousin pairing to USA market. Much like how Sailor Moon could have been first one for homosexual love if it wasn't changed.

Ugh, please don't remind me of Yuka.  Her character always vexed me and only gave me more reason to side with Kouta x Lucy/Nyu.  :pinch:

 

Actually, I think Tenchi Muyo was the first anime to introduce incest to the USA Market back in the early to mid 90's.  I mean, two of Tenchi's love interests were his great aunts and the entire culture of Jurai has zero problems with siblings marrying one of another.


Edited by Kagomaru, 16 September 2017 - 09:15 PM.

Light and Shadow are the only static creations of this universe. 


#25247 TouKen4Life3g

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 09:17 PM

Ugh, please don't remind me of Yuka.  Her character always vexed me.  :pinch:
 
Actually, I think Tenchi Muyo was the first anime to introduce incest to the USA Market back in the early to mid 90's.  I mean, two of Tenchi's love interests were his great aunts and the entire culture of Jurai has zero problems with siblings marrying one of another.

My memory is fuzzy since it's a long time ago but why do you not like her? Think as this as my research.

Hm. Trying to remember what came first. I still feel like the series I said is the first mainly because well, it actually happened. Canon and all, rather than harem bickering. But I guess it's just me.

#25248 Kagomaru

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 09:59 PM

My memory is fuzzy since it's a long time ago but why do you not like her? Think as this as my research.

Hm. Trying to remember what came first. I still feel like the series I said is the first mainly because well, it actually happened. Canon and all, rather than harem bickering. But I guess it's just me.

From my memory, it was mostly because it felt like she was trying to force her feelings on Kouta most of the time and her violent responses toward him when he didn't reciprocate or just plainly didn't understand what she wanted from him because he was worried about someone else (mostly Lucy) rubbed me the wrong way. I was like "Look girl, you haven't seen him since you were nine years old and he spent a good number of years in a mental institution because he was traumatized by his father and sister's gruesome and violent deaths, cut him some slack!" To me, their relationship was like a textbook example of "how NOT to write a good romance between a male MC and a tsundere character".  Plus, in a dark series filled with characters that have been psychologically broken due to mistreatment, murder, prejudice, sexual deviance, etc. Yuka's antics just did not seem appropriate in a setting as grisly as Elfen Lied's. 

 

She had her good points, particularly when it came to her parental role in regards to Nyu, Mayu and Nana.  But when it comes to her interactions with Kouta...It didn't sit well with me.   I always said that if Elfen Lied were a simple rom-com anime, I'd be fine with it. But as it was, it just bothered me. Mileage may vary.

 

 

As for Tenchi Muyo, the series' creator revealed in an interview that he "solved" the harem situation by having Tenchi marry all of his prospects since Juraian laws allows polygamy.  


Edited by Kagomaru, 16 September 2017 - 10:02 PM.

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#25249 TouKen4Life3g

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 10:02 PM

From my memory, it was mostly because it felt like she was trying to force her feelings on Kouta most of the time and her violent responses toward him when he didn't reciprocate or just plainly didn't understand what she wanted from him because he was worried about someone else (mostly Lucy) rubbed me the wrong way. I was like "Look girl, you haven't seen him since you were nine years old and he spent a good number of years in a mental institution because of his father and sister's gruesome and traumatic deaths, cut him some slack!" To me, their relationship was like a textbook example of "how NOT to write a good romance between a male MC and a tsundere character".  Plus, in a dark series filled with characters that have been psychologically broken due to mistreatment, murder, prejudice, sexual deviance, etc. Yuka's antics just did not seem appropriate in a setting as grisly as Elfen Lied's. 

 

She had her good points, particularly when it came to her parental role in regards to Nyu, Mayu and Nana.  But when it comes to her interactions with Kouta...It didn't sit well with me.   I always said that if Elfen Lied were a simple rom-com anime, I'd be fine with it. But as it was, it just bothered me. Mileage may vary.

 

 

As for Tenchi Muyo, the series' creator revealed in an interview that he "solved" the harem situation by having Tenchi marry all of his prospects.  

Ah, that make sense. Though Tsundere and incest sounds like a "bad" combo for USA ignorant. No offense.

 

Well, I feel people were more blinded by the fact the guy is a "lucky man." That would have been my first impression as a guy. Like the cops from South Park would say, "....NIce!"



#25250 ThroughWithLove

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 10:04 PM

Naruto x Hinata had development in fairness. Neji x Hinata on the other hand was always shown in the manga as brother and sisterly. 

 

And Naruto was also shown as not being in love with Hinata, so it's pretty even in my eyes. :P


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#25251 T XD

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 10:40 PM

Analyzer when looking for NH in the manga :

 

man-looking-through-binoculars-600x360.j



#25252 VanitasDS76491

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 10:49 PM


And the Pluto Nash day skit from robot chicken is what think was the resuits of the last here and in Japan especially critical response with everyone killing each other and themselves and the head jumping out the window and landing on kishi car scaring his family.

#25253 VanitasDS76491

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 10:53 PM

See the thing about Neji's death, is that it can be so easily replaced with almost anybody else:
-Have Lee appear, open all his inner gates and destroying most of the (I' can't get over this I swear xD) sticks of wood with his taijutsu and shield  the one who is going after Naruto with his own body, then have Neji give the peptalk to him.
-Have Kakashi die, he's popular enough to actually have an impact, and be him with his final words the one who teachs Naruto the final lesson of aceppting death and that this is something he will have to deal if he wanna be Hokage.
-Have Sakura die, (Hey, as I think better die young than become Sasuke's housewife) she was the one who was with Naruto from the start, so he would actually had a very good REASON to feel as crushed as he did and to consider joining Obito, but in the last moment refrain from doing it because Sakura wouldn't want that.
-Have Hinata die, just replace the situation, first is Neiji who goes to save Naruto and then Hinata saves him at the expense of her own life, in her deathbed she tells him that now he can break the Hyuuga clan curse and unite the two branches so that things like happened between him and her would never happen again.
I'm no writer but at the very least 2 or 3 of those ideas, I think HAVE to be better than what we got, I dunno, judge it yourselves.

All those sound better and smarter than what kishi did especially Kakashi dying and having Naruto accept death something he did do with hirzuen and jiraya, hinata can have a more powerful moment with neji as she dies and kisses naruto at last but he go with Sakura. Ya if sakura had to die have her go out fighting and better than being sasuke's baby momma.

#25254 gamma

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 10:56 PM

I seriously would not have minded if Neji and Hinata got together. Their personalities work so well together, traditional and calm.

 

Don't @ me, LOL.



#25255 sushi.

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 11:04 PM

Analyzer when looking for NH in the manga :
 
man-looking-through-binoculars-600x360.j

man-with-a-magnifying-glass-looking-at-a

ナルサク


#25256 BlackShirtGuy

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 11:05 PM

All those sound better and smarter than what kishi did especially Kakashi dying and having Naruto accept death something he did do with hirzuen and jiraya, hinata can have a more powerful moment with neji as she dies and kisses naruto at last but he go with Sakura. Ya if sakura had to die have her go out fighting and better than being sasuke's baby momma.

The point of having a character dying in a story is either because their character arc has finished or for creating a GREAT impact on other characters around him/her. However, Neji's death only impact is for NH and everyone knows that, that's why HE specifically have  to be the one to die, but his death makes his character arc meaningless, the point of this series (at least for some time) was moving forward and create a new future where we don't commit the mistakes from the past, but his death shat on all of it, he dies the same effing way as his father did. Negating, all he learned about how destiny is not written and that the future is what you make of it, only for him to die the same way he said he was going to at the begining of his character introduction, rendering his whole arc and his new viewpoint of life completely meaningless. Also Naruto said he was gonna change the clan Hyuuga Clan once, remember? He married the oh so powerful "Hyuuga Princess" but appernetly he didn't solve shiet or at least I'm left to assume he didn't solved shiet because we are NEVER shown what he did as Kage. All he does is doing effing paperwork!!

The worst part about this, Neji died to create a pairing that contributed greatly to ruining the series, so his death wasn't even a sacrifice, it was just a tragedy with severe consequences.

#NejiWasRight...Initially


Edited by BlackShirtGuy, 16 September 2017 - 11:13 PM.

“There are many types of monsters in this world, monsters who will not show themselves and who cause trouble. Monsters who abduct children, monsters who devour dreams, monsters who suck blood, and, monsters who always tell lies. Lying monsters are a real nuisance, they are much more cunning than other monsters. They pose as humans, even though they have no understanding of the human heart. They eat, even though they've never experienced hunger. They study even though the have no interest in academics. They seek friendship even though they do not know how to love. If I were to encounter such a monster, I would likely be eaten by it, because in truth, I am that monster.”   -L. Lawliet

 

#25257 ThroughWithLove

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 11:06 PM

 

I'd argue as per the canon reasoning, he was in love with her (at some point in the manga, where is up to debate), but as per the established explanation, he did not understand it. 

 

Anything could've been made canon, including Naruto/Akamaru, so observation-after-the-fact reasoning doesn't apply. So nope, NaruHina was never really a thing until it poofed into existence in chapter 700.


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Behold! Akame ga Kill's True Canon Pairing!


#25258 T XD

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 11:36 PM

man-with-a-magnifying-glass-looking-at-a

This definitely works too. Good one. * High Fiving *



#25259 James S Cassidy

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 11:46 PM

man-with-a-magnifying-glass-looking-at-a

I see what you did there:

2j0b6tj.jpg
 

 

Ah, that make sense. Though Tsundere and incest sounds like a "bad" combo for USA ignorant. No offense.

 

Well, I feel people were more blinded by the fact the guy is a "lucky man." That would have been my first impression as a guy. Like the cops from South Park would say, "....NIce!"

 

As for Tenchi Muyo, the series' creator revealed in an interview that he "solved" the harem situation by having Tenchi marry all of his prospects since Juraian laws allows polygamy.  

Reminds me of Strike the Blood.


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#25260 James S Cassidy

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Posted 17 September 2017 - 03:27 AM

I do find one small solace in all of this.

NS/SK and so many others can write whatever fan fiction they want. Because their/our pairings are non-canon and as such don't know what would happen if they did get married we are basically free to take any liberty we want even if our morals want us to stay true to the characters.

It's fan fiction.

NH and SS can no longer write any real fan fiction of any kind they want because at this point, since they are canon, they will continue to write the characters OoC and betray the story itself for their own blindness. ex. maybe in their fan fiction...Sasuke is always home, always a good father, and Sakura makes him lunches and he kisses her every time he goes to work....which is contrary to the actual canon.

Yeah they can make it up all they want, but at the same time...it just shows even more how blind they are when their writing doesn't even correspond to the canon material. They lost fan fiction privileges.

In essence, the only way for them to write a real fan fiction story is by staying true to the plot...otherwise they show just how narrow minded they are about everything.

You can't paint SS or NH in a good light when the canon story says otherwise. No amount of "disagreeing" or "opinions" will ever change the fact that Sasuke just doesn't care about his family or that Naruto doesn't spend time with his family either.

Especially with this:
2it1zps.jpg

Sasuke, Sakura, Salad, and even Naruto say he is never home. Why do SS fans and even NH fans continue to insists that he does? Rhetorical questions mind you. We all know the answer.


Edited by James S Cassidy, 17 September 2017 - 03:36 AM.

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