Jump to content

Close
Photo

The Last: Naruto the Movie: Thread 2 aka The Last retcon: Hinata-sama the movie


  • Please log in to reply
19441 replies to this topic

#11361 Khaleesi

Khaleesi

    Mother of dragons

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,237 posts
  • Gender:Not Telling
  • Location:Lima, PerĂº

Posted 12 November 2014 - 03:44 AM

 

Okay, that's good. But how can the other translation be so far off from yours? O-O

Because is from an NH shipper? :| Doesn't it seems too biased aka cheesy to be real? 

Look at the word "utsuwa" means "vessel". In their translation doesn't even have that word.

 

Anyway, we have translators here. 


dumbo-pink-elephants-on-parade1.gif?w=50

queen-harley.tumblr.com


#11362 unhskikrforever

unhskikrforever

    Summoning Master

  • Summoning Master
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,420 posts

Posted 12 November 2014 - 03:57 AM

Because is from an NH shipper? :| Doesn't it seems too biased aka cheesy to be real? 

Look at the word "utsuwa" means "vessel". In their translation doesn't even have that word.

 

Anyway, we have translators here. 

 

Yeah, it seems too cheesy. But the lyrics.. make sense too. I HOPE SOMEONE CAN TRANSLATE THIS.


15f62c4.png


#11363 Khaleesi

Khaleesi

    Mother of dragons

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,237 posts
  • Gender:Not Telling
  • Location:Lima, PerĂº

Posted 12 November 2014 - 04:04 AM

 

Yeah, it seems too cheesy. But the lyrics.. make sense too. I HOPE SOMEONE CAN TRANSLATE THIS.

Look at the word "utsuwa" means "vessel". In their translation doesn't even have that word.
 
I'll wait for them anyway. They were here when DarkRhadeon posted it, tho o.O

dumbo-pink-elephants-on-parade1.gif?w=50

queen-harley.tumblr.com


#11364 Konohakitten

Konohakitten

    I ship faster than FedEx

  • Summoning Master
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,313 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:New Mexico
  • Interests:Spending time with my husband and sons of course. Playing video games, drawing, writing fanfics, reading, watching crime shows, and paranormal shows.

Posted 12 November 2014 - 04:15 AM

And? That has nothing to do with what I said. I said she's overrated, which she is. Her fans invent things about her and then say she doesn't have enough credit or that she's more skilled than Sakura  :zaru:

I'm NS for like 3.5 months and I've always "hated" Hinata. She's the definition of everything that bothers me. 

Weeks ago I understood her character in part 1, and well I said "OKAY, FINE! She's okay there. I don't have any real complaints." But her self of part 2? I want to punch her in the face and break all her teeth.

 

This has nothing to with pairings. That would be ridiculous.

 

I never liked Hinata, just because I saw her as a waste of space. However I didn't have like hatred towards her in the first part of Naruto. Her fainting would get on my nerves, but I never really paid her much attention. Then in part 2 I tried to have the same kind of attitude towards her but I couldn't because she was exactly the same, she didn't grow as a character. Yet that didn't stop her from doing heroine things, and that really got to me. Her character was handled horribly by Kishi and what made things worse are her fans. They do indeed assume a lot of things about her. They blow things out of proportion when it comes to what she actually did in the manga. My distaste for her did indeed turn into hatred once I saw the ending and her personal movie The last.


tumblr_ooscnzcUtt1uz1wpso1_500.gif



 

#11365 unhskikrforever

unhskikrforever

    Summoning Master

  • Summoning Master
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,420 posts

Posted 12 November 2014 - 04:15 AM

 

Look at the word "utsuwa" means "vessel". In their translation doesn't even have that word.
 
I'll wait for them anyway. They were here when DarkRhadeon posted it, tho o.O

 

 

Yeah, okay. I get what you mean, woman. I'm just saying that the lyrics make sense too. LOL. Yeap, we should wait. Is it?


15f62c4.png


#11366 ThroughWithLove

ThroughWithLove

    Illustrious Tap Dancer

  • Elite Teacher
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,172 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 12 November 2014 - 04:47 AM

I suspect Kishi originally intended to kill off Hinata during the Pein arc. It explains why her confession does not get addressed and why she would even be given the spotlight to confess in the first place. Honestly, if he had kept her and everyone else in the village dead(except Kakashi), that arc would have been that much more powerful.


Posted Image

 

Behold! Akame ga Kill's True Canon Pairing!


#11367 Elicit

Elicit

    Academy Teacher

  • Academy Teacher
  • PipPipPip
  • 647 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Interests:Mainly Video Games (mostly RPGs/Platformers/retro stuff), Music, Anime/Manga, Debating

Posted 12 November 2014 - 04:51 AM

I suspect Kishi originally intended to kill off Hinata during the Pein arc. It explains why her confession does not get addressed and why she would even be given the spotlight to confess in the first place. Honestly, if he had kept her and everyone else in the village dead(except Kakashi), that arc would have been that much more powerful.

She would have been revived by rinne tensei anyway.



#11368 MangaReader

MangaReader

    I'm the Greatest Ever!!

  • Legendary Ninja
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,416 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Mitten Michigan
  • Interests:Drawing
    Animating
    Watching TV

Posted 12 November 2014 - 04:53 AM

Please tell me this isn't gonna be a kittening musical?... That would make it x1000 worst then it already is as a story killer


sad_naruto_sig_by_mangafreak17-d81c8fy.p

Even if I'm not the one to make you happy

 


#11369 ThroughWithLove

ThroughWithLove

    Illustrious Tap Dancer

  • Elite Teacher
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,172 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 12 November 2014 - 04:53 AM

She would have been revived by rinne tensei anyway.

 

I dunno. I don't think the rinne tensei was the original plan either. Kakashi's death, for example, seemed permanent at the time given that we saw him meeting his father.


Posted Image

 

Behold! Akame ga Kill's True Canon Pairing!


#11370 Atheck

Atheck

    Ally of NaruSaku

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,050 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:North America

Posted 12 November 2014 - 05:02 AM

I suspect Kishi originally intended to kill off Hinata during the Pein arc. It explains why her confession does not get addressed and why she would even be given the spotlight to confess in the first place. Honestly, if he had kept her and everyone else in the village dead(except Kakashi), that arc would have been that much more powerful.

 

Two deaths within the Hyuga family coupled with internal strife between divided branch lines, multiple attempted kidnappings of their young by foreign shinobi specifically targeting them, and a deluded clan head that overplays the worth of his people to anyone who will listen. Now there's talk of a tragic destiny that can be traced back to the Sage's lineage. The Hyuga just can't catch a break.  



#11371 MangaReader

MangaReader

    I'm the Greatest Ever!!

  • Legendary Ninja
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,416 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Mitten Michigan
  • Interests:Drawing
    Animating
    Watching TV

Posted 12 November 2014 - 05:06 AM

 

Two deaths within the Hyuga family coupled with internal strife between divided branch lines, multiple attempted kidnappings of their young by foreign shinobi specifically targeting them, and a deluded clan head that overplays the worth of his people to anyone who will listen. Now there's talk of a tragic destiny that can be traced back to the Sage's lineage. The Hyuga just can't catch a break.  

I smell love story *yuck 


sad_naruto_sig_by_mangafreak17-d81c8fy.p

Even if I'm not the one to make you happy

 


#11372 Atheck

Atheck

    Ally of NaruSaku

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,050 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:North America

Posted 12 November 2014 - 05:20 AM

I smell love story *yuck 

 

That fatal destiny could entail the Hyuga being exterminated like the Uchiha, and do you know what my reaction would be? Apathy. I wouldn't feel anything at all. The Hyuga have become a plague almost as bad as the Uchiha with the events of this movie. Not just for their antiquated belief systems and magnetic attraction for dangerous riff raff to attack the village, but also for their unwanted interference within the lives of so many people. My distaste for those people has grown to the brink of outright hating them. 

 

Say what you will about my opinion being a generalisation of the Hyuga for their girl's unjust place next to Naruto, but it still stands. I never cared much for the Hyuga or their petty issues. Neji's death failed to sir any emotion from me because his ultimate fate was never an issue beyond the influence he held as a potential spouse for Hinata and as a member of the K12. 


Edited by Atheck, 12 November 2014 - 05:22 AM.


#11373 NaruSaku fan in Kentucky

NaruSaku fan in Kentucky

    Kyuubi

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,032 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Interests:Likes Kentucky Basketball, NaruSaku and Godzilla.

    Dislikes Sasuke SasuSaku NaruHina and the Louisville Cardnials.

Posted 12 November 2014 - 06:38 AM

I find Hinata to be the most poorly written character since Jar Jar Binks.

509356167_759751.gif?4


#11374 KnS

KnS

    感じの作家

  • ANBU
  • 1,660 posts
  • Gender:Not Telling
  • Location:Oregon
  • Interests:Writing

Posted 12 November 2014 - 06:41 AM

In your honest opinion, do you think Kishi sold out and gave in to NH/SS? Cause now that you mentioned the fact that it was a strategic move by Kishi for Sakura to have thought of Sasuke when questioned by her fodder admirer, it seems to me he didn't sell out and that this was the course of action he had in mind all along. 

 

Here's what I can't get past.

 

Let's assume that as NS shippers we totally misinterpreted a number of Sakura's moments as regards Naruto.  

 

+ The fact that Naruto instinctively knew what Sakura wanted to hear about her forehead meant nothing.

 

+ Although Naruto was nearly killed by Gaara while fighting to save Sakura's life, Gaara found it a life-changing experience but Sakura was left unmoved and unimpressed.

 

+ Yamato didn't mean that Sakura felt true love for Naruto.

 

+ Despite her vow to not make anymore mistakes or keep getting things wrong, Sakura's confession to Naruto was nothing more than a manipulative half-truth to coax him out of danger.

 

+ Sakura wasn't talking about Naruto when she told the Lover-nin that she already had someone.

 

+ Instead of showing any concern or indication that Naruto was misleading himself thinking she was his girlfriend, Sakura hits him in the head in a comedic way -- even though she knows from Sai and her own observation during the confession that Naruto loved her.

 

+ The fact that Naruto acknowledged her strength and desire to fight as Team 7 while Sasuke offered nothing, Naruto's support of her achievement didn't really matter to her.

 

+ Despite Sakura's passionate identification with Naruto and his dream, she did not see herself as part of what he loved or what made him strong.

 

+ Despite indicating to Sai that she didn't trust Sasuke's motives when he returned, and admitting that her feelings for Sasuke were pathetic, Sakura did not hesitate to abandon Naruto's feelings for her when Sasuke made a sudden reversal at the end.

 

 

Okay.  So we were wrong about all of that.  Got it.  Likewise:

 

 

+ Although we never knew it, Sasuke was in love with or interested in Sakura all along.

 

+ When he originally left Konoha, saying she was annoying and then saying "thank you" really meant he loved her.

 

+ The times Sasuke tried to kill Sakura or was not interested in saving her because he deemed her inconsequential, it really meant that he loved her so much that he preferred she died so he could be hated.

 

+ When Sasuke was trying to kill Naruto as his "only friend," he wasn't mentioning Sakura because she meant so much more to him than a friend because he was in love with her.

 

+ At the end, Sasuke instinctively knew to focus his attention on Sakura's forehead after all, and reveal that he always loved her.  

 

So our interpretations of SS were completely wrong the whole time.  Okay.  I suppose it is technically arguable that all of those moments were misread by NS fans, and actually supported SS and we simply didn't see it because of our shipping blinders.

 

Okay.

 

But I submit that NS fans were persuaded by the main theme of the story to view NS as likely to succeed.  It wasn't so much that we ignored the possibility of SS, but why on Earth would we expect that at the end of the story Naruto's feelings and nindo would actually not mean anything?  That in the end, the hero's reward for his hard work, determination, and selfless love for his friend and girl would be rejection and heartbreak?

 

Naruto was in love with Sakura for the entire manga.  Hinata may have loved him, but he never returned her feelings.  He never even thought of her in a potentially romantic light once.  We as NS fans weren't blind to Naruto's feelings for Hinata; such feelings were never there.  

 

As I said on the other thread, the existence of this upcoming movie is a cheap, insulting retcon to explain how he falls in love with Hinata.  If it's necessary to show him falling in love with Hinata in a movie, it means he was never interested in her in the manga.  It means his love for Sakura existed until the last chapter, and was not only rejected in a disgusting manner but was never even addressed again.

 

I don't accept that NS fans were idiots with poor reading comprehension skills.  In a story bearing the hero's name as its title, and the hero therein is consistently characterized by his difficult past, his need to be loved and accepted, his determination, dedication to righteousness, his devotion to saving Sasuke, and his love for Sakura, it wasn't crazy to think Naruto would be the one to succeed in love.

 

Instead, Naruto is the only one who lost and ends up settling.  It makes me sick.



#11375 trang95

trang95

    ♣Yorozuya Member♣

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 13,048 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Georgia, USA
  • Interests:Mariah Carey, Super Junior, Ailee, Shinee, and Mariah Carey

    Cardcaptor Sakura, Gintama, HxH, Magi, Neon Genesis Evangelion, Noragami, Princess Mononoke, Tokyo Ghoul ETC.

    AkittenakaxSen, NaruSaku, SakuraxShaoran, SomaxErina, TouKen, YonaxHak

Posted 12 November 2014 - 07:13 AM

 

 

Instead, Naruto is the only one who lost and ends up settling.  It makes me sick.

To think that our greatest hero never even fought for Sakura despite having kept the promise just hurts.

I can't blame Naruto nor Sakura for this, I just can't. The last two chapters portrayed two characters who have mutated into other beings that I can't recognize anymore. Should I blame Kishi for this? I don't know. I can't hate him b/c he's the one who also made me fall in love with NaruSaku in the first place. 


G . I . N . T . A . M .A

tumblr_nd8f3hq6MN1qawpjto1_r2_500.gif

 
“The country? The skies? You can have them! I'm busy enough protecting what's in front of me. I don't know how many times I failed to protect what I wanted. I have nothing left, so at least if something has fallen at my feet, I'll pick it up."
- Sakata Gintoki, Gintama

 


#11376 Atheck

Atheck

    Ally of NaruSaku

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,050 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:North America

Posted 12 November 2014 - 07:22 AM

*claps*

 

An amazing post, KNS. It's concise with the summary listings, yet expressive at the same time. I wish people like you could send a letter to Kishi with the grievances you mentioned. 



#11377 Win-chan

Win-chan

    Eternal NaruSaku Warrior

  • Chakra Water Walker
  • PipPip
  • 324 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Earth
  • Interests:Music, Piano, Violin, Composing, Writing, Reading, Enneagram, Psychology, Ancient History

    Favorite anime/manga: Naruto, Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood, Death Note

    Favorite TV shows: Supernatural and Sherlock

    Favorite ships: NARUSAKU!, MinaKushi, ShikaTema, IchiRuki, MustangxHawkeye, SayaxHaji

    Favorite Naruto characters (in no particular order): Naruto, Kakashi, Yamato, Shikamaru, Sakura, Minato, Deidara, Gaara

Posted 12 November 2014 - 08:05 AM

standing-ovation.gif

 

I think that's how all of us feel about your post right now, KNS. It beautifully sums up how all the rest of us are feeling. I think that, more than anything, the thing that makes me the most upset about the ending is the fact that the NaruHina and SasuSaku shippers now feel like they were right all along, and they feel justified in calling us stupid and telling us that we don't have 'read comprehension skills.' I'm fine hanging out in my cute NaruSaku tag on tumblr, coming up with headcanons for Shinachiku, writing fanfic, and rewatching NaruSaku moments (because in my opinion, those last two chapters lose all credibility since the characters are all 100% different and are therefore extremely easy to ignore), but the moment I see a NaruHina or SasuSaku fan going "OOH! IN YOUR FACE! WE WERE SO RIGHT! YOU GUYS ARE A BUNCH OF LOSERS! TAKE THAT!" it just frustrates me to no end. 

 

Kishimoto built NaruSaku. He hinted at it, he made parallels for it, he made them really love each other. I just can't believe that in the end, he would completely disregard that. I personally think he was made to (I can't think of any other explanation) but even so, we all just got screwed over in the deal. *sigh* It depresses me that those other fandoms will never be forced to see NaruSaku as anything other than crack, even though it was canon up until sometime after 663 (I think the switch happened after that chapter).


SHINACHIKU

 

tumblr_inline_ngnhtp3KQk1sy20ab.jpg

 

The strong-willed, intelligent and powerful yet loving, tender, and sensitive heartthrob of Konoha.


#11378 James S Cassidy

James S Cassidy

    Heaven and Earth Deity

  • Banned
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,831 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 12 November 2014 - 08:09 AM

 

Here's what I can't get past.

 

Let's assume that as NS shippers we totally misinterpreted a number of Sakura's moments as regards Naruto.  

 

+ The fact that Naruto instinctively knew what Sakura wanted to hear about her forehead meant nothing.

 

+ Although Naruto was nearly killed by Gaara while fighting to save Sakura's life, Gaara found it a life-changing experience but Sakura was left unmoved and unimpressed.

 

+ Yamato didn't mean that Sakura felt true love for Naruto.

 

+ Despite her vow to not make anymore mistakes or keep getting things wrong, Sakura's confession to Naruto was nothing more than a manipulative half-truth to coax him out of danger.

 

+ Sakura wasn't talking about Naruto when she told the Lover-nin that she already had someone.

 

+ Instead of showing any concern or indication that Naruto was misleading himself thinking she was his girlfriend, Sakura hits him in the head in a comedic way -- even though she knows from Sai and her own observation during the confession that Naruto loved her.

 

+ The fact that Naruto acknowledged her strength and desire to fight as Team 7 while Sasuke offered nothing, Naruto's support of her achievement didn't really matter to her.

 

+ Despite Sakura's passionate identification with Naruto and his dream, she did not see herself as part of what he loved or what made him strong.

 

+ Despite indicating to Sai that she didn't trust Sasuke's motives when he returned, and admitting that her feelings for Sasuke were pathetic, Sakura did not hesitate to abandon Naruto's feelings for her when Sasuke made a sudden reversal at the end.

 

 

Okay.  So we were wrong about all of that.  Got it.  Likewise:

 

 

+ Although we never knew it, Sasuke was in love with or interested in Sakura all along.

 

+ When he originally left Konoha, saying she was annoying and then saying "thank you" really meant he loved her.

 

+ The times Sasuke tried to kill Sakura or was not interested in saving her because he deemed her inconsequential, it really meant that he loved her so much that he preferred she died so he could be hated.

 

+ When Sasuke was trying to kill Naruto as his "only friend," he wasn't mentioning Sakura because she meant so much more to him than a friend because he was in love with her.

 

+ At the end, Sasuke instinctively knew to focus his attention on Sakura's forehead after all, and reveal that he always loved her.  

 

So our interpretations of SS were completely wrong the whole time.  Okay.  I suppose it is technically arguable that all of those moments were misread by NS fans, and actually supported SS and we simply didn't see it because of our shipping blinders.

 

Okay.

 

But I submit that NS fans were persuaded by the main theme of the story to view NS as likely to succeed.  It wasn't so much that we ignored the possibility of SS, but why on Earth would we expect that at the end of the story Naruto's feelings and nindo would actually not mean anything?  That in the end, the hero's reward for his hard work, determination, and selfless love for his friend and girl would be rejection and heartbreak?

 

Naruto was in love with Sakura for the entire manga.  Hinata may have loved him, but he never returned her feelings.  He never even thought of her in a potentially romantic light once.  We as NS fans weren't blind to Naruto's feelings for Hinata; such feelings were never there.  

 

As I said on the other thread, the existence of this upcoming movie is a cheap, insulting retcon to explain how he falls in love with Hinata.  If it's necessary to show him falling in love with Hinata in a movie, it means he was never interested in her in the manga.  It means his love for Sakura existed until the last chapter, and was not only rejected in a disgusting manner but was never even addressed again.

 

I don't accept that NS fans were idiots with poor reading comprehension skills.  In a story bearing the hero's name as its title, and the hero therein is consistently characterized by his difficult past, his need to be loved and accepted, his determination, dedication to righteousness, his devotion to saving Sasuke, and his love for Sakura, it wasn't crazy to think Naruto would be the one to succeed in love.

 

Instead, Naruto is the only one who lost and ends up settling.  It makes me sick.

I would make you president if I could right now.

It is an even bigger insult when you are now telling your fans "Well, I didn't write it right, but that is your fault for not reading it right, because I can't write romance for squat. So I decided to just change everything I was doing because I had no idea what I was doing and that's your fault as the reader."

No matter how you look at it the entire story needs a redux even more than one movie can fulfill and all around makes Kishimoto look like a bad writer. ("Well, he is a bad writer." Not the point.) 

If you look at it one way, the ending looks rushed. If you look at it the other way, the movie looks rushed. If you look at it this way, 698 chapters mean kitten and all that development might as well not have occurred. Look at it that way and it looks like Kishi is just a terrible writer who really didn't know what the hell he was doing until the last two years. Hell, no pairing was canon up until the last two years and by then the damage was already too late and he dug himself deeper into a hole.

There is no way for Kishi to actually fix every thing and have it make sense WITHOUT reducing all development, characters, and even his entire manga down to nothing.

The worst part about all of this? The most hilarious part about all of this is? If you made NS and SK canon, none of this would be happening. You wouldn't need to have to re-adjust the story or try to explain it farther just to "make it work." it was already there, nothing needed to be fixed, but they instead decided to go the worst route and over complicate things and really beat down every character just to suit the fancy of one pairing.



 


Edited by James S Cassidy, 12 November 2014 - 08:16 AM.

My gofundme
https://www.gofundme...c-designer-fund

Δικός σου για να κρατάτε
Σ'αγαπώ

#11379 ultranx

ultranx

    Missing-nin

  • Missing Nin
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1,884 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Fayetteville, NC
  • Interests:DBZ, naruto, pokemon, digimon, one piece, megaman, sonic, legend of zelda, yugioh,gurren lagann, transformers, kingdom hearts, yuyu hakusho, sword art online, tmnt, gundam.

Posted 12 November 2014 - 08:09 AM

I'll go ahead and post this comment here too:

 

guys don't give up hope, have you seen  this yet? I also posted it in the amv section:

 

  

this was made by a chinese fan who is even a fan of ladygt's, see even they saw naruto x sakura and think it should have happened, so probably even japan sees it if china sees it xD so there could possibly be an anime alternate ending or something, don't give up hope everyone ^_^


Edited by ultranx, 12 November 2014 - 08:17 AM.

tumblr_mba4mg4Ip61ryf7dio1_r1_500.gif


#11380 Namikaze Clan

Namikaze Clan

    Jounin

  • Jounin
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1,684 posts

Posted 12 November 2014 - 08:37 AM

I'll go ahead and post this comment here too:
 
guys don't give up hope, have you seen  this yet? I also posted it in the amv section:

 

  https://www.youtube....h?v=0IV1kMxDHso

this was made by a chinese fan who is even a fan of ladygt's, see even they saw naruto x sakura and think it should have happened, so probably even japan sees it if china sees it xD so there could possibly be an anime alternate ending or something, don't give up hope everyone ^_^


How can there be an anime alternate ending if there is a spin off coming out focusing on the kids?




2 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 2 guests, 0 anonymous users