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#52081 James S Cassidy

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Posted 31 May 2020 - 04:36 PM

 

Sakura's birth story and that whole umblicial Karin drama has always been perplexing to me. Why write it? What was the goal? What was the message?

I think the reason was because they need Karin to come in and say "I am not your mom" despite looking alike in almost every way.
 


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#52082 tricksie

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Posted 31 May 2020 - 04:39 PM

 

"Babyish"? Please. All I see is soulless eyes, even when she show emotions. It's down right creepy.  For reason, it also ties to Neji and Hanabi but those two look way better.

Right. She's not babyish. She's the embodiment of passivity. Which is gross because her storyline revolves around how over-developed physically she is. 

 

Kishi created an objectified doll/princess strictly for male fantasy and used her as a plot device to distract the hero...and he wonders why his manga went down the shipping toilet. It's his own fault.

 

Even the sympathy her fans feel for her is misguided. It's the creator who wrecked her character potential and left her un-developed emotionally. No one else. And certainly not NS fans. 



#52083 tricksie

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Posted 31 May 2020 - 04:42 PM

I think the reason was because they need Karin to come in and say "I am not your mom" despite looking alike in almost every way.
 

Right!  - I would almost be tempted to think they were leaving themselves a back-door out in case they wanted to reboot the series and say it was just a dream or jutsu or something.... But I think that would be giving them too much credit. I just don't think they're that creative.



#52084 Nate River

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Posted 31 May 2020 - 07:55 PM

Right!  - I would almost be tempted to think they were leaving themselves a back-door out in case they wanted to reboot the series and say it was just a dream or jutsu or something.... But I think that would be giving them too much credit. I just don't think they're that creative.

 

The glasses make her look like Karin, but the hair line is a dead ringer for Sakura. The glasses would be one case where I’d actually believe a red herring. Ive always been a bit reluctant to ascribe hidden intents or subtle motives when I couldn’t prove them and for a story that really didnt have a lot of subtlety towards its end.

 

I have preferred to focus on the writing simply because he did what he did. Whatever he may have intended, the manga is what he wrote and if there is a disconnect then what is on the is what is one the page. 

 

My issue with the cultural theories is they rely on a number of assumptions, with an obvious one being that Kishimoto personally knows, cares, and observes them; something we don't know.

 

Its also hard to imagine that’d he go through the trouble of pissing off the NS, kick it on the way out the door, but then subtly crap on the pairing they did through stuff so minor the winning random either largely doesn’t notice or does not care it. Why? What’s the motive for doing this? Kishimoto giving a middle finger to his publisher or editors on the way out the door? I suppose, but they doing a sequel and published his other manga. And there is no evidence of this kind of rift and he has never shown himself to be the person to do this kind of thing. 

 

I mean I agree that Sakura Gaiden was a worthless waste of space that stepped on its own message. I think the cord is simple, it was trying to sell the audience that the mom could be Karin in order to make its central point: Bond over blood. However, in the end they confirmed it was Sakura's, which is why I thought it was so worthless. But they don't clear the air for the audience if its meant as a subtle dig toward or some kind of open door. The bento argument is much the same for me. I do not see it as any kind of hidden message or dig at their relationship. And even if it were what is the endgame for this?

 

Personally, I think its, at best, empty noise, so the story can have some drama. As much as I dislike Boruto, I cannot imagine it devolving into a daytime soap opera over the his parents relationship when the story is about him. How does using those as a reboot angles not end with either that or the exact kind of glossing over, bare bones story telling for which we have torched Kishomoto for years?

 

The collapse of NH/SS to shift to NS cannot be done without making a mess of the existing story or getting the empty calories stuff like the Last where the obvious problems get ignored. I cannot see them doing it, especially if their motive is $, which is some our fandom frequently attributes to them. Burn your remaining fanbase to chase the one that has already left? That is what they would be doing. 

 

If they are going to redo it, just do a genuine reboot when Boruto is done. 



#52085 Bail o' Lies

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Posted 31 May 2020 - 09:40 PM

Its not passivity* that they like, its that Hinata is completely submissive. She is a woman that would never defy you no matter what. Never doubt that you are the greatest man to ever walk the Earth. Will never be disappointed in you be it job-wise, personal life, or in the bed room. Will never think of looking at another man because she has you. Will never bother you with things you don't care about, and will drop anything to please you. Her greatest joy in life is to please you. Will be happy with anything you do to her or give to her never wanting anything more than what you give or be disappointed by it. And so on.

 

The guys that are obsessed with her are obsessed with her because she easy to get, easy to please, easy to keep, and seems to exist to worship Naruto. These are the type of guys that never stop kittening about the friend-zone, and will complain that any that won't put out for them -as soon as they want it- is the ultimate kitten.

 

 

 

*Remember they despises Sakura and will point out any point where she doesn't do anything but cry, and praise anytime Hinata does anything. 


Edited by Bail o' Lies, Yesterday, 10:07 PM.


#52086 ree

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Posted Yesterday, 01:18 AM

 
The guys that are obsessed with her are obsessed with her because she easy to get, easy to please, easy to keep, and seems to exist to worship Naruto. These are the type of guys that never stop kittening about the friend-zone, and will complain that any that won't put out for them -as soon as they want it- is the ultimate kitten.
 

As I mentioned before, the Naruhina's fans are weirdos people, the girls are the typically shys ones who dream about the popular guy and the boys are the stupid who hasn't ever touch a woman and dreams about this voluptuous girls. They never got the real message of Naruto.

#52087 NaruSaku fan in Kentucky

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Posted Yesterday, 02:08 AM

NaruHina fans make Louisville fans look more sane.


Edited by NaruSaku fan in Kentucky, Yesterday, 02:08 AM.

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#52088 James S Cassidy

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Posted Yesterday, 03:33 AM

 

The glasses make her look like Karin, but the hair line is a dead ringer for Sakura. The glasses would be one case where I’d actually believe a red herring. Ive always been a bit reluctant to ascribe hidden intents or subtle motives when I couldn’t prove them and for a story that really didnt have a lot of subtlety towards its end.

The story has made so much drama that you can't tell what is supposed to be subtle vs what is blunt. The story did not play with subtlety towards the end, but the story does play with symbolism a lot.
 

I have preferred to focus on the writing simply because he did what he did. Whatever he may have intended, the manga is what he wrote and if there is a disconnect then what is on the page  is what is on the page.

 

That's the biggest question isn't it? What exactly did he want to do and what way did his story accomplish it? If we go by what the story, then what I'd argue is Kishimoto wanted to make NaruSaku canon, the studio wanted NaruHina canon...and since Kishimoto hate writing romance....it would only make sense he let someone else write it.

That's why the interviews are also strange. Hinata and NH was never HIS intention. His focus was the bond between Naruto and Sasuke. The bond of brothers. Go by the interviews and Kishimoto had no intentions to push Hinata to the forefront....ever. She was never meant to be special, but she was made special because the studio told him "this character is popular. Let's milk her for money."

So, SS and NH were never his intention at all. What about NS? Well, maybe, but I could give a few arguments why NS could have been the original intention.

1. Sakura was always meant to be the rival love interest:
Thanks to the Yahagi interview, we know that it was him that gave Kishimoto the idea that Naruto needed a rival and a love interest hence Sasuke and Sakura were created. Hinata was created to, but she has never really been labeled a "love interest." She was always just described as a "random village girl who has a crush on him." We see this happen a few times in other series and yet those never usually go anywhere.

2. Kishimoto actually tried to make Sakura beautiful and popular among the fans:
In several interviews, Kishimoto has expressed that he tried to make Sakura better as a character, but felt like a failure cause people still hated her. That means to me that those scenes of her caring for Naruto are genuine and not just "we are purposely making her a liar and a horrible woman."

 

My issue with the cultural theories is they rely on a number of assumptions, with an obvious one being that Kishimoto personally knows, cares, and observes them; something we don't know.

 

And yet he is aware of the red string of fate and scarfs? Hmmm....

 

Its also hard to imagine that’d he go through the trouble of pissing off the NS, kick it on the way out the door, but then subtly crap on the pairing they did through stuff so minor the winning random either largely doesn’t notice or does not care it. Why? What’s the motive for doing this? Kishimoto giving a middle finger to his publisher or editors on the way out the door? I suppose, but they doing a sequel and published his other manga. And there is no evidence of this kind of rift and he has never shown himself to be the person to do this kind of thing.

 

On purpose? No. I think Kishimoto is basically saying "You want SS and NH to be together? Alright, but they are not exactly great together." Remember, all the positive NH and SS stuff doesn't come from Kishimoto, it came from someone else. Supported by the fact he even says that SS at least is more akin to a drug addiction and any reason for their relationship happening is contrived.

He only put NH and SS together because he was told that is what the fanbase wanted...and then when he did it he was surprised by the rift the fanbase created. I have to wonder if he is like "Why did they want NH and SS together if the hate these couples so much?" You begin to realize it is not the couple they loved, it was the character Hinata. Hinata wanted Naruto...that is why they want NH. They didn't love Naruto, or Sasuke or Sakura. They ll loved Hinata and that is all they cared about.

This is contrary to Kishimoto who cared about Sasuke and Naruto more.
 

I mean I agree that Sakura Gaiden was a worthless waste of space that stepped on its own message. I think the cord is simple, it was trying to sell the audience that the mom could be Karin in order to make its central point: Bond over blood. However, in the end they confirmed it was Sakura's, which is why I thought it was so worthless. But they don't clear the air for the audience if its meant as a subtle dig toward or some kind of open door. The bento argument is much the same for me. I do not see it as any kind of hidden message or dig at their relationship. And even if it were what is the endgame for this?

End game for who? Kishimoto or the studio? Cause it is a huge difference in this which is why I believe the bento boxes mean something more. Naruto cares about Sakura and her child over his own. This is the double edge sword. Why then have Naruto ignore the bento from Boruto, but act like it is a gift from god when Salad hands him it? Why have Naruto so surprised and give this speech about bonds if Salad is Sakura's child any way? Can't have it both ways otherwise you diminish the meaning like you said.

Why did Kishimoto make Naruto Gaiden at all? Who really wanted it to be done?
 

Personally, I think its, at best, empty noise, so the story can have some drama. As much as I dislike Boruto, I cannot imagine it devolving into a daytime soap opera over the his parents relationship when the story is about him. How does using those as a reboot angles not end with either that or the exact kind of glossing over, bare bones story telling for which we have torched Kishomoto for years?

Some people just like to watch franchises burn, I guess.
 

The collapse of NH/SS to shift to NS cannot be done without making a mess of the existing story or getting the empty calories stuff like the Last where the obvious problems get ignored. I cannot see them doing it, especially if their motive is $, which is some our fandom frequently attributes to them. Burn your remaining fanbase to chase the one that has already left? That is what they would be doing.

Why not? Toriyama has been doing it a lot lately especially with all the rules changes in Super. "Oh you like Future Trunks? You want an evil Goku? Let's make the Goku Black saga and bring in future Trunks for marketing."
 


If they are going to redo it, just do a genuine reboot when Boruto is done.

 

Honestly, I have to wonder if Road to Ninja was supposed to be the "soft reboot" we all should have got since it is "the movie he wanted to do."
 


Edited by James S Cassidy, Yesterday, 03:36 AM.

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#52089 Bryon_Konoha_Ninja

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Posted Yesterday, 08:31 AM

Right. She's not babyish. She's the embodiment of passivity. Which is gross because her storyline revolves around how over-developed physically she is. 

 

Kishi created an objectified doll/princess strictly for male fantasy and used her as a plot device to distract the hero...and he wonders why his manga went down the shipping toilet. It's his own fault.

 

Even the sympathy her fans feel for her is misguided. It's the creator who wrecked her character potential and left her un-developed emotionally. No one else. And certainly not NS fans. 

 

Exactly. And that's why I feel Hinata is pointless as a "love interest" type, because oif how underdeveloped she is emotionally. Like the fact she just keeps seeing Naruto as the "proud failure" even with them married due to her NEEDING him to be that so it can make HER feel better about herself and her crappy situations, and how she never really believed in Naruto; his fight with Neji when he got his tenketsu sealed by the 8 Trigrams 64 Palms and how even if she was still hurting from her own fight with Neji that she mentally wanted Naruto to stop fighting after he took the attack, how she was reacting in Naruto's fight with Kiba, not believing in Naruto when Obito stopped Team Kurenai and Team Kakashi in their pursuit of Itachi with Sakura scolding her a bit to focus on Obito (showing us how Sakura knows what Naruto can do after realizing what kind of person he is)...

 

And most infamously in his fight with Pain, when everyone else held back (even Shikamaru reluctantly, and he only wanted to be involved because of how I feel after Asuma's death, his guilt makes him want to "replace" his sensei and becoming more reckless in some cases) due to Naruto knowing that if they got in the midst of everything, Nagato would take advantage of that, which he did to Hinata when she dived in just because she felt suicidal and selfish by assuming Naruto was going to die when only Sakura really knew what Nagato's plans for him were.

 

I feel a lot of characters in Naruto got short changed for development, and Hinata is one of the worst offenders. That's something I keep reminding myself for The Demon Within that I do not want to repeat since I want to show a Hinata who has become more confident without losing her way like her father had lost his way due to his arrogance as leader of the Hyuga clan and the guilt he felt over his brother's decision to protect him, etc., and that someone who isn't reliant on Naruto to make herself feel good about herself.



#52090 Nate River

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Posted Yesterday, 02:53 PM

The story has made so much drama that you can't tell what is supposed to be subtle vs what is blunt. The story did not play with subtlety towards the end, but the story does play with symbolism a lot.


I don't disagree with his use of symbolism, but nothing post pain came across as subtle. I don't know if you ever saw Looney Tunes's spoof on the Scarlet Pimpernell, The Scarlet PUmpernickle. At the end Daffy runs out of script and just makes up a bunch of stuff as the other guy just keeps saying "and then what happened..."

Everything post-Pain has that feel to it. The Last, the Gaiden's, it all feels this way. So I'm relunctant to say those things are meant subtle digs to NH/SS and, in the case of the cord, more likely to attribute it to lazy and crappy writing. We are now 6 six years away from the end and nothing has born fruit.  
 

That's the biggest question isn't it? What exactly did he want to do and what way did his story accomplish it? If we go by what the story, then what I'd argue is Kishimoto wanted to make NaruSaku canon, the studio wanted NaruHina canon...and since Kishimoto hate writing romance....it would only make sense he let someone else write it.


For me, it is not. My point with that is that I just don't care about the "why" of NH/SS. That he chose it and its poorly written schlock is it . If he came out tomorrow and said my editors or anime study made me do it...okay? You still did it and its still poorly written schlock. I suppose I might be more sympathetic to him as I do not know the power balance between publisher and author, except to know that it doesn't all belong to him. If he farmed it out to the studio, its the same.

The other thing is what is on the page is more concrete. Many of the arguments about the "why" involve divining intent from very limited interviews. In short, the ending sucks. It's on the page. Nothing he says will change it, so I don't care if it was his idea or not or what is trying to accomplish.

I mean I guess it might make the NH/SS fandom mad? I don't care enough about them to worry about it.
 

That's why the interviews are also strange. Hinata and NH was never HIS intention. His focus was the bond between Naruto and Sasuke. The bond of brothers. Go by the interviews and Kishimoto had no intentions to push Hinata to the forefront....ever. She was never meant to be special, but she was made special because the studio told him "this character is popular. Let's milk her for money."


At least in Naruto, she never was pushed to the forefront. She's s special only if you define "getting with Naruto" as being special. That's part of the problem. While I'm not sad that he didn't repeatedly bring a character that bored me to the forefront, the whole problem is that he does nothing with her. The Last is a testament to just how weak the development was.
 

On purpose? No. I think Kishimoto is basically saying "You want SS and NH to be together? Alright, but they are not exactly great together." Remember, all the positive NH and SS stuff doesn't come from Kishimoto, it came from someone else. Supported by the fact he even says that SS at least is more akin to a drug addiction and any reason for their relationship happening is contrived.

He only put NH and SS together because he was told that is what the fanbase wanted...and then when he did it he was surprised by the rift the fanbase created. I have to wonder if he is like "Why did they want NH and SS together if the hate these couples so much?" You begin to realize it is not the couple they loved, it was the character Hinata. Hinata wanted Naruto...that is why they want NH. They didn't love Naruto, or Sasuke or Sakura. They ll loved Hinata and that is all they cared about.

This is contrary to Kishimoto who cared about Sasuke and Naruto more.
 
End game for who? Kishimoto or the studio? Cause it is a huge difference in this which is why I believe the bento boxes mean something more. Naruto cares about Sakura and her child over his own. This is the double edge sword. Why then have Naruto ignore the bento from Boruto, but act like it is a gift from god when Salad hands him it? Why have Naruto so surprised and give this speech about bonds if Salad is Sakura's child any way? Can't have it both ways otherwise you diminish the meaning like you said.

Why did Kishimoto make Naruto Gaiden at all? Who really wanted it to be done?


My main point is that the theories being floated don't make any sense in terms of underlying motivations from either the publisher's or author's point of view. At least the idea that this is all a shameless cash grab makes sense in that its a rational motive.

But putting them together and making them unhappy is a middle-finger. Doing such things in a by-the-book hero's journey story is doing exactly that. Naruto isn't a story where tropes regarding that journey (including rommance) are being intentionally subverted or critiqued.

It's one where he saves the world and overcomes his obstacles. An ending where the main characters are trapped in unhappy romances? That would so utterly tone deaf. And I don't mean in terms of reading the audience. The ending is a happy one, doing that is so totally at odds with that tone.

Sakura Gaiden is the same. It ends with the three of them being happy together, but then his sending subtle message in the same story (cord) and in another gaiden that everyone is unhappy despite the tone of all those endings?

If he's behaving how you say, then its impossible to believe he's not intentionally flipping someone off on his way out.

As for Boruto, I could see it as cheap character drama, but then you should expect a happily ever after resolution to it all.
 

Some people just like to watch franchises burn, I guess.


I agree. But Shonen Jump isn't Lucas Film. I haven't seen anything that suggest they or Kishomoto are some of those people.
 

Why not? Toriyama has been doing it a lot lately especially with all the rules changes in Super. "Oh you like Future Trunks? You want an evil Goku? Let's make the Goku Black saga and bring in future Trunks for marketing."
 
Honestly, I have to wonder if Road to Ninja was supposed to be the "soft reboot" we all should have got since it is "the movie he wanted to do."


The Future Trunks Saga didn't turn a shonen series into Days of Our Lives. That is what trying to switch pairings at this point would do.



#52091 Bryon_Konoha_Ninja

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Posted Yesterday, 05:40 PM

The Future Trunks Saga didn't turn a shonen series into Days of Our Lives. That is what trying to switch pairings at this point would do.

 

What I think James was talking about in terms of rules and such in Super was how we has Future Trunks pop up again, and how it also led to more divergent timelines thanks to Zamasu becoming Goku Black and such... unless I'm wrong.



#52092 TheFirstEvil100

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Posted Yesterday, 08:00 PM

 

What I think James was talking about in terms of rules and such in Super was how we has Future Trunks pop up again, and how it also led to more divergent timelines thanks to Zamasu becoming Goku Black and such... unless I'm wrong.

Time travel in Dragonball has always been well, messed up, I mean, they could have just used Doctor Who logic which would have helped a great deal.

 

But I will give it to Super they showed how good a father Vegeta is, and just how cute Pan is, yeah I would take Pan over the Naruto kids, and who knows later they might use her as a fighter and not someone that Goku needs to save all the god damn time.



#52093 Phantom_999

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Posted Yesterday, 08:29 PM

Yes indeed. Let's not forget the umbilical cord fiasco.

So, for those who aren't familiar with Japanese culture; umbilical cord is normally kept securely by Japanese Mothers.

I know my Japanese friends keep their children's umbilical cord as part of the tradition (to be given to the children when they grow up, or when they leave the house to be independent, e.g. married).

Keeping it securely shows how much the mother appreciate their children (hence their husband to the extent) as they keep reminded about the cord that 'connects' the two. Literally.

Now, we were shown that Sarada's umbilical cord is not in Sakura's custody. And the manga explained that it's a symbol of connection between Sakura and Karin. In which Sakura gave to Karin as a symbol of friendship. lol. What a load of BS.

"Hey Karin, Sasuke is mine now, thanks for helping me deliver his daughter. Here, you can have my baby's umbilical cord as a memento of our friendship. Oh, btw, Sasuke is not around." Note: He's never around during my pregnancy and he's not going to be around in the next decade or so. We also found out he doesn't even recognised his daughter nor aware of her existence.

So, Karin is going to be the one giving the umbilical cord when Sarada get married one day? Can you imagine how Sarada would feel, when everyone else is getting their umbilical cord upon growing up or upon marriage, yet her mom won't give it to her because she gave it to someone else. That's how much value Sarada have in front of her parents.

A friendship memento can be anything, but definitely not umbilical cord.

The manga tried hard to emphasis that connection/bond transcend biological relationship. But there's an elephant in the room: Sakura and Sasuke don't care about their daughter.

We were shown caring parents through Kushina and Minato in this franchise. You dont see it with NH/SS.

I'd question the sanity of a husband who don't want to see his wife in over a decade. Let alone aware that he has a daughter. Let alone support his family financially.

I'd question the sanity of a wife who let such kind of relationship to carry on and make the daughter to be the victim of the situation.

This isnt tough love. This isnt bond.

This is outright a sad couple who can't accept the truth that they dont belong with each other. And the repetitive theme of "I don't belong here" also applies with Naruto & Hinata. They don't see each other. They don't think of one another, as far as the manga goes.

 

Like I said, Japan must be eating up the the wonderful marriage that is SS!! :lmao:

 

But seriously, from what even I understand about "Japanese values" the current Uchiha family embodies NOTHING about their ideals involving the "nuclear family". Like you stated Sasuke is self vagabonding so that contributes NOTHING to his community nor is he sacrificing his time and efforts to help the greater cause which again I believe is the "Japanese spirit and ideal", and not to mention he is not even providing finances for his family and I AM SURE even Far East Asian cultures would find that laughable. OF COURSE any father that exists in their minds must provide for their family that is the biggest obligation that they have family-wise. Even if that obligation doesn't involve emotional support, they must at least make sure their house and everyone living in it is not lost and their wife and kids being ended up on the streets and homeless.

 

And hey the Dynamic between Sasuke and Sakura has something I am sure divorced/single mothers see in themselves, especially in the West. Guy knocks up girl, then bails when the girl is pregnant and the girl is stuck struggling to provide for their child all on their own, and have to provide an EXTREMELY difficult balance between getting food on the table and other necessities for their kids, and showing their emotional support and love for the kids at the same time because they are killing and exhausting themselves doing the former because giving home, safety, and meals ALL falls  on them. Anyone care to prove me wrong? Even in chapter one of the "gaiden manga" in question, Sakura have a huge mortgage for her house hanging over her head. The anime tries to downplay this with Sakura's frustrations removed and the emotional exhaustion she seems to be having, but the fact remains she is a single mother trying to do her best to raise her daughter by her self AND NO SASUKE IN SIGHT with A SINGLE YEN to give her to keep their home stable.

 

NH is not much better in in the fact that Nardo seems to actively avoid his family as much as possible. This is coming from THE premier kage bunshin user that can maintain clones for days to weeks on end without them dissipating and is MORE than capable in being in two or more laces at once, can't bother to be in his kids' lives such as being at their birthdays or attending events that would mean the world to them Boruto and Himawari. While I won't get into the debate of "Japanese family values" on this one since this seems more normal it is BLATANT hypocrisy on the character that was a straight orphan for his whole life and desperately wanted a family to return to, now becoming a neglectful husband and father when he FINALLY HAS ONE, and in turn has time to fuss over another orphan that reminds him of his "$E# toy boyfriend" instead of spending more time with his son and daughter. These families are the definition of dysfunctional, and anyone NOT in denial of the quality and hypocritical messages of this series can see that, clear as day.


Edited by Phantom_999, Yesterday, 10:33 PM.

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#52094 Nate River

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Posted Yesterday, 09:50 PM

 

What I think James was talking about in terms of rules and such in Super was how we has Future Trunks pop up again, and how it also led to more divergent timelines thanks to Zamasu becoming Goku Black and such... unless I'm wrong.

Ah. If so, then we may taking last each other on that, Internal consistency is important, but the series said Screw it long ago. I’d actually agree in not worrying about rules, why care now after all theyve done. My concern is not that. I just don’t see who you can change pairings without derailing the plot because this story is about the adventures of a burrito and his buddy who accidental  stuck his head into a blender and not Naruto’s romantic life. Switching pairing turns it from the former into the latter.

 

All the timeline stuff with future trucks didn’t stop it from being Goku and Vegeta fighting people to save the world, so the basic core remained the same.



#52095 Dalton.T.R

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Posted Yesterday, 11:30 PM

Honestly, someone just needs to write a fanfiction where the Flood from Halo infect the Naruto universe and force everyone to die a very violent and agonizing death.

 

I'd read that in a heartbeat. 



#52096 HalfDemonInuyasha

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Posted Today, 12:54 AM

Right. She's not babyish. She's the embodiment of passivity. Which is gross because her storyline revolves around how over-developed physically she is. 

 

Kishi created an objectified doll/princess strictly for male fantasy and used her as a plot device to distract the hero...and he wonders why his manga went down the shipping toilet. It's his own fault.

 

Even the sympathy her fans feel for her is misguided. It's the creator who wrecked her character potential and left her un-developed emotionally. No one else. And certainly not NS fans. 

Not only undeveloped, but she REGRESSED in character from part one to part two. At least part one gave some sort of "hope" that she would have her own goals (the fixing of the Hyuga Clan), but part two and beyond? Yeah...


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#52097 Bryon_Konoha_Ninja

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Posted Today, 01:18 AM

Not only undeveloped, but she REGRESSED in character from part one to part two. At least part one gave some sort of "hope" that she would have her own goals (the fixing of the Hyuga Clan), but part two and beyond? Yeah...


Dude, I know, right???

#52098 Nostradamus

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Posted Today, 01:59 AM

Its not passivity* that they like, its that Hinata is completely submissive. She is a woman that would never defy you no matter what. Never doubt that you are the greatest man to ever walk the Earth. Will never be disappointed in you be it job-wise, personal life, or in the bed room. Will never think of looking at another man because she has you. Will never bother you with things you don't care about, and will drop anything to please you. Her greatest joy in life is to please you. Will be happy with anything you do to her or give to her never wanting anything more than what you give or be disappointed by it. And so on.

 

The guys that are obsessed with her are obsessed with her because she easy to get, easy to please, easy to keep, and seems to exist to worship Naruto. These are the type of guys that never stop kittening about the friend-zone, and will complain that any that won't put out for them -as soon as they want it- is the ultimate kitten.

 

 

 

*Remember they despises Sakura and will point out any point where she doesn't do anything but cry, and praise anytime Hinata does anything. 

And this is why I call Hinata, a sex doll. Because that's really what she is. Or at least what she is in the minds of her horny fans.

A sex doll with a pulse.


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Which I've told you - time and time again - is dangerous! There will never be consensus, son, among those you have helped to ascend. They will all differ in their views of what it means to be free. The peace you so desperately seek does not exist.
 
These men are united now by a common cause. But when this battle is finished they will fall to fighting amongst themselves about how best to ensure control. In time it will lead to war. You will see.





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