54175 replies to this topic

[DrK]

what happened in the Boruto Anime?

Sarada asks her about Naruto and she says that they were more than family. I think. Haven't actually seen it for myself.

[James S Cassidy]

I think when most people use the term "realistic", what they really mean is that it is RELATABLE to them/their life in some way. And that is an assertion that can't be disproven as you don't know what's going on in their head.

Uugggggggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhh

This is even worse because seriously, how relatable is it REALLY? People use this argument for why Batman is better than Superman. "He is more relatable hero"
Really? When did your parents get shot in the alley and you watched? When did you inherit billions of dollars and used it to be a superhero? When did you have time to master every martial arts, forensics, every language, and more in under 20 years? He also survives things that no normal human survives and makes gadgets that not even modern science has today. So realistic? Press X to doubt

But okay, let's say you mean relatable as in more philosophical sense. Batman went through tragedy, he experienced lose, and is fallible and can be injured. However, I feel Superman is more relatable in ways that an average person experiences.
Superman got bullied in high school and had his first crush that didn't work out. He got basically an every man's job that pays a decent salary, but he is not rich. He constantly deals with things on a level that money nor super strength can fix. He is an orphan who never knew his parents, spent his life in humble beginnings, and lost a step parent, and is always struggling with home versus heritage. He is an immigrant.

So I think people use these words too loosely. Can Hinata be relatable? Yes. Can Sakura be relatable? Absolutely, but what is NOT relatable is stagnation. This whole thing of "girls don't get over their first love" is complete and total BS. They may never forget their first love, but never get over it? That is a stretch far from the imagination...especially considering that this is even before you bring in the abusive nature of SS.

As for NH, well I believe someone else asked a question that I feel encompasses it.
How does KNOWING someone else loves you automatically make you have feelings for them? Naruto ignored her for 5 years, but now all of a sudden he loves her because he only realizes NOW that she loves him?

That is not only not relatable, it is not even remotely realistic. If that were true every guy, no matter how ugly or unwanted, would ever be alone.

And again, how do the guys' feelings not matter? It is all about "Naruto should be with Hinata cause he owes her for being loyal" kind of mindset. Love shouldn't be about who owes what and it should all be about what is mutual. Again, all these arguments can be applied to NS

Naruto loved Sakura, why didn't she just automatically be with him? If all it takes is for someone to be loyal, selfless, and loving...then NS should totally be canon.
If it more about realism and relatable, then you can't get more realistic and relatable than NS. They are always themselves around each other? Sakura would definitely get over Sasuke easily and realize she is happier with Naruto. Hinata probably would continue to be in love with Naruto, but would accept that she values his happiness above her own and get over it.

These excuses are delusional at best and downright denial at worst. There is nothing realistic or relatable about any of these ships and the fact that continue to persist when most other relationships have suffered under far less is just downright insulting.

There is only so far you can stretch the suspension of belief.
 

 

 

Double standards, as always. Never forget this mantra. Hinata does it? A-okay. Sakura does it? She is a USELESS THOT like I always KNEW she was!!!! And remember, this does not apply only to Hinata being a shy submissive sex doll that won't squeak no matter how much she is "penetrated into". Remember how in "Road to Ninja" she was "a possessive, jealous, temperamental Black Widow" (sorry for insulting Natasha Romanoff, that was the only man eater motif I can recall off the top of my head), and her fans STILL adored her for it? I bet if the Sakura of that universe was the shy submissive one they would be going all, "what a weak willed useless lump of meat. She should learn to be strong and confident like THIS HINATA!!!!" Trollolololololololololol. Really, the diarrhea- like drivel that comes out of these fans' mouths and you would SWEAR your brain is put in an endless swirly. Just saying.  

Which means that it is not about character tropes. It is not about Hinata's shyness o4r loyalty. It is NOTHING, but BS. It is only the lies they make to justify their obvious favoritism. Hinata can be any type of character and they will still love her. Kishimoto has exposed this bias when he made Road to Ninja switching the personalities and they still favored HInata over Sakura.

Hinata abused Naruto and threatens to kill Sakura while acting like a slut? "OMG, look how independent she is."

NH and SS did NOT deserve the victory they got and secretly, I think they know it too. They know that what they have is garbage and this is why they always repeat the same arguments.

Like I told that one Hinata fanboy
"13,728 pages and all you remember of Hinata 1 incident she had?"

 

 

Edited by James S Cassidy, 19 February 2020 - 09:50 PM.

[DrK]

Uugggggggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhh

This is even worse because seriously, how relatable is it REALLY? People use this argument for why Batman is better than Superman. "He is more relatable hero"
Really? When did your parents get shot in the alley and you watched? When did you inherit billions of dollars and used it to be a superhero? When did you have time to master every martial arts, forensics, every language, and more in under 20 years? He also survives things that no normal human survives and makes gadgets that not even modern science has today. So realistic? Press X to doubt

But even if you're correct about those things having nothing in common with whoever said it was relatable, that would just be ad hominem. You can't attack a subjective claim.

 

If you do, then at best you're just letting the other person define ALL the parameters of what they find relatable so you can try to tear it down. And even if you succeed at that, you're completely reliant on them eventually saying "Yeah I guess you're right, I can't relate to him as much as I thought"... Which they might never say.

 

It's kittening hopeless.

[VanitasDS76491]

Uugggggggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhh
This is even worse because seriously, how relatable is it REALLY? People use this argument for why Batman is better than Superman. "He is more relatable hero"
Really? When did your parents get shot in the alley and you watched? When did you inherit billions of dollars and used it to be a superhero? When did you have time to master every martial arts, forensics, every language, and more in under 20 years? He also survives things that no normal human survives and makes gadgets that not even modern science has today. So realistic? Press X to doubt
But okay, let's say you mean relatable as in more philosophical sense. Batman went through tragedy, he experienced lose, and is fallible and can be injured. However, I feel Superman is more relatable in ways that an average person experiences.
Superman got bullied in high school and had his first crush that didn't work out. He got basically an every man's job that pays a decent salary, but he is not rich. He constantly deals with things on a level that money nor super strength can fix. He is an orphan who never knew his parents, spent his life in humble beginnings, and lost a step parent, and is always struggling with home versus heritage. He is an immigrant.
So I think people use these words too loosely. Can Hinata be relatable? Yes. Can Sakura be relatable? Absolutely, but what is NOT relatable is stagnation. This whole thing of "girls don't get over their first love" is complete and total BS. They may never forget their first love, but never get over it? That is a stretch far from the imagination...especially considering that this is even before you bring in the abusive nature of SS.
As for NH, well I believe someone else asked a question that I feel encompasses it.
How does KNOWING someone else loves you automatically make you have feelings for them? Naruto ignored her for 5 years, but now all of a sudden he loves her because he only realizes NOW that she loves him?
That is not only not relatable, it is not even remotely realistic. If that were true every guy, no matter how ugly or unwanted, would ever be alone.
And again, how do the guys' feelings not matter? It is all about "Naruto should be with Hinata cause he owes her for being loyal" kind of mindset. Love shouldn't be about who owes what and it should all be about what is mutual. Again, all these arguments can be applied to NS
Naruto loved Sakura, why didn't she just automatically be with him? If all it takes is for someone to be loyal, selfless, and loving...then NS should totally be canon.
If it more about realism and relatable, then you can't get more realistic and relatable than NS. They are always themselves around each other? Sakura would definitely get over Sasuke easily and realize she is happier with Naruto. Hinata probably would continue to be in love with Naruto, but would accept that she values his happiness above her own and get over it.
These excuses are delusional at best and downright denial at worst. There is nothing realistic or relatable about any of these ships and the fact that continue to persist when most other relationships have suffered under far less is just downright insulting.
There is only so far you can stretch the suspension of belief.
 
 


Which means that it is not about character tropes. It is not about Hinata's shyness our loyalty. It is NOTHING, but BS. It is only the lies they make to justify their obvious favoritism. Hinata can be any type of character and they will still love her. Kishimoto has exposedthis bias when he made Road to Ninja switching the personalities and they still favored HInata over Sakura.
Hinata abused Naruto and threatens to kill Sakura while acting like a slut? "OMG, look how independent she is."
NH and SS did NOT deserve the victory they got and secretly, I think they know it too. They know that what they have is garbage and this is why they always repeat the same arguments.
Like I told that one Hinata fanboy
"13,728 pages and all you remember of Hinata 1 incident she had?"

well said James.
Heck hinata could murder a bunch of innocent people and they'd still praise her for it.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

Which means that it is not about character tropes. It is not about Hinata's shyness our loyalty. It is NOTHING, but BS. It is only the lies they make to justify their obvious favoritism. Hinata can be any type of character and they will still love her. Kishimoto has exposedthis bias when he made Road to Ninja switching the personalities and they still favored HInata over Sakura.

Hinata abused Naruto and threatens to kill Sakura while acting like a slut? "OMG, look how independent she is."

NH and SS did NOT deserve the victory they got and secretly, I think they know it too. They know that what they have is garbage and this is why they always repeat the same arguments.

Like I told that one Hinata fanboy
"13,728 pages and all you remember of Hinata 1 incident she had?"

 

The bolded part is SO dead on, James! It's why they keep doing it because they know they just got their "win" out of pity. And that they just want us to feel defeated when we feel invigorated in a lot of ways 'cause I believe we know we were meant to win, and because of their "win", they're more desperate, which is why you gotta go for the blows that matter.

[Phantom_999]

Uugggggggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhh

This is even worse because seriously, how relatable is it REALLY? People use this argument for why Batman is better than Superman. "He is more relatable hero"
Really? When did your parents get shot in the alley and you watched? When did you inherit billions of dollars and used it to be a superhero? When did you have time to master every martial arts, forensics, every language, and more in under 20 years? He also survives things that no normal human survives and makes gadgets that not even modern science has today. So realistic? Press X to doubt

But okay, let's say you mean relatable as in more philosophical sense. Batman went through tragedy, he experienced lose, and is fallible and can be injured. However, I feel Superman is more relatable in ways that an average person experiences.
Superman got bullied in high school and had his first crush that didn't work out. He got basically an every man's job that pays a decent salary, but he is not rich. He constantly deals with things on a level that money nor super strength can fix. He is an orphan who never knew his parents, spent his life in humble beginnings, and lost a step parent, and is always struggling with home versus heritage. He is an immigrant.

So I think people use these words too loosely. Can Hinata be relatable? Yes. Can Sakura be relatable? Absolutely, but what is NOT relatable is stagnation. This whole thing of "girls don't get over their first love" is complete and total BS. They may never forget their first love, but never get over it? That is a stretch far from the imagination...especially considering that this is even before you bring in the abusive nature of SS.

As for NH, well I believe someone else asked a question that I feel encompasses it.
How does KNOWING someone else loves you automatically make you have feelings for them? Naruto ignored her for 5 years, but now all of a sudden he loves her because he only realizes NOW that she loves him?

That is not only not relatable, it is not even remotely realistic. If that were true every guy, no matter how ugly or unwanted, would ever be alone.

And again, how do the guys' feelings not matter? It is all about "Naruto should be with Hinata cause he owes her for being loyal" kind of mindset. Love shouldn't be about who owes what and it should all be about what is mutual. Again, all these arguments can be applied to NS

Naruto loved Sakura, why didn't she just automatically be with him? If all it takes is for someone to be loyal, selfless, and loving...then NS should totally be canon.
If it more about realism and relatable, then you can't get more realistic and relatable than NS. They are always themselves around each other? Sakura would definitely get over Sasuke easily and realize she is happier with Naruto. Hinata probably would continue to be in love with Naruto, but would accept that she values his happiness above her own and get over it.

These excuses are delusional at best and downright denial at worst. There is nothing realistic or relatable about any of these ships and the fact that continue to persist when most other relationships have suffered under far less is just downright insulting.

There is only so far you can stretch the suspension of belief.
 

 

Which means that it is not about character tropes. It is not about Hinata's shyness our loyalty. It is NOTHING, but BS. It is only the lies they make to justify their obvious favoritism. Hinata can be any type of character and they will still love her. Kishimoto has exposedthis bias when he made Road to Ninja switching the personalities and they still favored HInata over Sakura.

Hinata abused Naruto and threatens to kill Sakura while acting like a slut? "OMG, look how independent she is."

NH and SS did NOT deserve the victory they got and secretly, I think they know it too. They know that what they have is garbage and this is why they always repeat the same arguments.

Like I told that one Hinata fanboy
"13,728 pages and all you remember of Hinata 1 incident she had?"

 

 

 

Exactly there is nothing more to it. If there was there would actually be reasons to favor Hinata over Sakura and when pressed with questions they wouldn't be making new excuses to defend their answers every 5 seconds. It has nothing to do with Liking Hinata has a character, they just feel she desrves to win and Sakura should lose. That is all. look at their reasoning and it is clear as day. Not to mention that if you apply any reason for them ti hate sakura on another character they would defend it sloppily and say how that character is different or circumstances are different. i.e. So Sakura is a heartless icy biatch for not liking Naruto and was never there for him, but apparently no other nameless character or anyone that has ever shown hate for Naruto get even a fraction of the hate Sakura was getting. Not even other fan girls of Sasuke get that treatment and notice one reason to hate Sakura was that she was an obsessed Sasuke fan girl and only had him on the brain. I'll get back to this later but you get my point

Edited by Phantom_999, 22 February 2020 - 01:25 PM.

[NaruSaku fan in Kentucky]

Is it wrong for me to say I don't care if there's NaruSaku in Boruto?

[James S Cassidy]

But even if you're correct about those things having nothing in common with whoever said it was relatable, that would just be ad hominem. You can't attack a subjective claim.

You can totally attack a subjective claim if you can objectively prove why they are wrong. Opinions are one thing, facts are another. These people push their opinions as fact.

Their claims are always pushed as this is the ultimate truth
"Kishimoto planned NH from the beginning"
"Hinata was always there for Naruto"
"Sakura is abusive."

In the court of law these are called "questions of fact." What makes them all say this? What is the basis of it? They are not "I think Hinata is better because she cared for Naruto more." THere is never a subjective opinion when it comes to matter-of-fact claims. So when people say "They are relatable" then what makes them relatable? What makes them realistic? I cannot get an answer. I can only assume what they are thinking.

And with that being said....what about Kishimoto's opinion? The creator himself says the opposite.
"Hinata is so great and always there for Naruto"
Kishimoto: "Hinata doesn't do anything and she is always in the shadows."
"Sasuke and Sakura are happy together and a wonderful couple."
Kishimoto: "Sakura is kind of a drug addicting girl and Sasuke deals with it by not being home. I am not sure why they are still together."

This is a prime example of "Death of the Author.

Their subjective view is based on falsified thoughts of their own bias favoritism. That is what I am attacking. Personal preference is one thing, but to make false claims about something that either doesn't exist or highly exaggerated. That's my issues with this entirely.

You can't claim an objective fact using a subjective view. As powerful as subjective views are, this is one thing that can't be.

 

Edited by James S Cassidy, 19 February 2020 - 10:36 PM.

[VanitasDS76491]

Is it wrong for me to say I don't care if there's NaruSaku in Boruto?

No your not cause really it means nothing anymore. There's not heart to anymore.

[VanitasDS76491]

You can totally attack a subjective claim if you can objectively prove why they are wrong. Opinions are one thing, facts are another. These people push their opinions as fact.
Their claims are always pushed as this is the ultimate truth
"Kishimoto planned NH from the beginning"
"Hinata was always there for Naruto"
"Sakura is abusive."
In the court of law these are called "questions of fact." What makes them all say this? What is the basis of it? They are not "I think Hinata is better because she cared for Naruto more." THere is never a subjective opinion when it comes to matter-of-fact claims. So when people say "They are relatable" then what makes them relatable? What makes them realistic? I cannot get an answer. I can only assume what they are thinking.
And with that being said....what about Kishimoto's opinion? The creator himself says the opposite.
"Hinata is so great and always there for Naruto"Kishimoto: "Hinata doesn't do anything and she is always in the shadows."
"Sasuke and Sakura are happy together and a wonderful couple."Kishimoto: "Sakura is kind of a drug addicting girl and Sasuke deals with it by not being home. I am not sure why they are still together."
This is a prime example of "Death of the Author.
Their subjective view is based on falsified thoughts of their own bias favoritism. That is what I am attacking. Personal preference is one thing, but to make false claims about something that either doesn't exist or highly exaggerated.

Has he really said that.
Really comparing Sakura to a junkie really up yours kishi that's just as bad as how frank miller writes women.

[James S Cassidy]

Has he really said that.
Really comparing Sakura to a junkie really up yours kishi that's just as bad as how frank miller writes women.

Yeah...it was in an interview back in 2015-2016. We have a post of it.
http://www.narusaku....showtopic=15280
 

 

Interviewer: “Who is your favourite character in Naruto?”

>Taniguchi: “It’s Hinata.”

>Kishimoto: “Eh, you like big-breasted girls?” (laugh)

>Taniguchi: “It’s not that.” (laugh) “I like the fact that at the beginning she was a weakling, but due to Naruto’s influence she steadily became strong.”

>Kishimoto: “That’s because Hinata doesn’t stand at the main character’s side like normal heroines*… she’s the type that watches him from the shadows.”

>Interviewer: “I thought the heroine was Sakura?”

>Kishimoto: “That’s right. But Sakura is addicted to Sasuke.” (laugh) “The reason why Hinata came to like Naruto is clear, but I’ve deliberately avoided writing down the reason why Sakura came to like Sasuke.” (laugh) “That’s because somehow, I had the feeling that it would conversely end up sounding contrived.”

(source)

BWAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA ok I hate this mofo but this made me laugh, at least he admits that Sakura is criminally insane and that Hinata has nothing but her big boobs.

 

[Kagomaru]

Is it wrong for me to say I don't care if there's NaruSaku in Boruto?

If course not since the damage is already done and there's no way to fix it sans rendering the last chapters of Naruto into a dream or alternate reality. Any content resembling NaruSaku in Boruto is simply a pathetic attempt to lure us in after SP realized that the NH fanbase wasn't profitable.

[DrK]

You can totally attack a subjective claim if you can objectively prove why they are wrong. Opinions are one thing, facts are another. These people push their opinions as fact.

Their claims are always pushed as this is the ultimate truth
"Kishimoto planned NH from the beginning"
"Hinata was always there for Naruto"
"Sakura is abusive."

In the court of law these are called "questions of fact." What makes them all say this? What is the basis of it? They are not "I think Hinata is better because she cared for Naruto more." THere is never a subjective opinion when it comes to matter-of-fact claims. So when people say "They are relatable" then what makes them relatable? What makes them realistic? I cannot get an answer. I can only assume what they are thinking.

Those claims aren't really comparable in terms of being subjective though. And they are fairly weak. But "(I find that) X is relatable" is just how someone feels about something. Which is unassailable.

 

vs.

"I find that Kishimoto planned NH from the beginning" / "I find that Hinata was always there for Naruto"... In those cases, the other person could not fall back on "Well I just feel that way!" in response to your argument. These are concrete ideas. They have to be justifoed or supported by facts when challenged or they fall apart.

 

They could with Sakura being abusive... You could try to educate them on tsunderes or whatever... Though I would prefer trying to make that person think about WHY Sakura was portrayed that way...

 

But afterwards they can still say "Too bad, I still think she is abusive.", and there is NOTHING you can do about it.

 

Even a court of law couldn't declare that Sakura is NOT abusive... Simply that her abuse wasn't established beyond a reasonable doubt. Which would be a better approach to take I think. Just introduce doubt and then let them stew on it.

 

I'm not attacking your stance or motives James. But you shouldn't allow imbeciles to drag you into discourse where they can waste your time. There was a reason why Analyzer always fell back on "That's subjective!" If something ACTUALLY IS subjective, then saying so becomes the perfect offense and defense. And that will steal attention and importance away from anything you said that was actually valid.

 

I would sooner MOCK someone's subjective view than try to logically attack it. It's almost guaranteed to be more effective.

Edited by DrK, 19 February 2020 - 11:14 PM.

[VanitasDS76491]

Yeah...it was in an interview back in 2015-2016. We have a post of it.
http://www.narusaku....showtopic=15280

I'm disgusted by this prick.

[NaruSaku fan in Kentucky]

If course not since the damage is already done and there's no way to fix it sans rendering the last chapters of Naruto into a dream or alternate reality. Any content resembling NaruSaku in Boruto is simply a pathetic attempt to lure us in after SP realized that the NH fanbase wasn't profitable.

Thankfully Tetsuya Nomura has integrity and went with a couple that was right rather than appease to the more popular fanbase...

[VanitasDS76491]

Thankfully Tetsuya Nomura has integrity and went with a couple that was right rather than appease to the more popular fanbase...

Amen to that dude writes better couples than that hack kishi comparing Sakura to a junkie.

[NaruSaku fan in Kentucky]

I seriously hope they interview why He put SoKai canon he takes a jab at Kishi.

 

Kishi:I could have paired Sora with Aqua because of the size of her breasts but I see them like a Obi-Wan to Luke relationship so I went with the logical pairing.

Seriously SoAqua makes much more sense compared to NH.

[VanitasDS76491]

I seriously hope they interview why He put SoKai canon he takes a jab at Kishi.
 
Kishi:I could have paired Sora with Aqua because of the size of her breasts but I see them like a Obi-Wan to Luke relationship so I went with the logical pairing.

Seriously SoAqua makes much more sense compared to NH.

Don't you nomura.
Sadly yes soaqua does make more sense despite 10 to 20 year gap between sora and aqua.

[LuckyChi7]

Thankfully Tetsuya Nomura has integrity and went with a couple that was right rather than appease to the more popular fanbase...

 

 

There's a reason I picked that for my sig haha, the feels!!

 

Amen to that dude writes better couples than that hack kishi comparing Sakura to a junkie.

 

 

One of my first ships before NaruSaku, and it was beautiful!

 

 

man I can't wait for what's to come for the future especially for Kairi.

[VanitasDS76491]

There's a reason I picked that for my sig haha, the feels!!
 

 
 
One of my first ships before NaruSaku, and it was beautiful!
 
 
man I can't wait for what's to come for the future especially for Kairi.

Same even back in 2002 when I didn't even know what ships were or before I got into naruto.