74 replies to this topic

[rocci]

@harry 4e
Spot on.
I agree with you. Burito and salad are mean to be a NS of future generation.
And somehow narusasu.
I don't like it and I don't need that kind of kitten. Enough with their milking.

They should just make salad as female version of sasuke aka mikoto.
Instead they make sakura mk.02 aka sakura uchiha aka sakura with black hair and black eye. Burito is naruto with Hinata hairstyle.

And himawari is Hinata without byakugan and whisker. She will put on new team 10 along with kiba son and shino son if not rock lee clone or new character.

[Suigetsu]

Salad it's a clone of Karin For gods sake... I cant take this "p3" seriously at all. This is just like Dragon Ball GT all over again.

[rocci]

Salad it's a clone of Karin For gods sake... I cant take this "p3" seriously at all. This is just like Dragon Ball GT all over again.

Salad is sakura clone. Karin is sakura uzumaki lol.
Dragon ball gt doesn't retcon manga. And that is a filler anime.

[Suigetsu]

Salad is sakura clone. Karin is sakura uzumaki lol.
Dragon ball gt doesn't retcon manga. And that is a filler anime.

You really think she looks more sakura than Karin?
If you really think that then you need some glasses.

 

Nardo part 3 resembles DBGT in which they where both made for the sole porpuse of profitability.

[rocci]

I already use glasses. ^^

I think that because salad use glasses thus remind you of Karin.
She's still sakura clone thought. Just like 90% of the manga cast is the clone of naruto, sasuke, and sakura.

[Atheck]

I already use glasses. ^^

I think that because salad use glasses thus remind you of Karin.
She's still sakura clone thought. Just like 90% of the manga cast is the clone of naruto, sasuke, and sakura.

 

Do you frequent the SS/NH clubs on NF by any chance, Rocci? I ask this because your comments give an impression that you would be very tolerant of the people and their harsh sentiments in those circles.

[rocci]

 
Do you frequent the SS/NH clubs on NF by any chance, Rocci? I ask this because your comments give an impression that you would be very tolerant of the people and their harsh sentiments in those circles.

No way, I could understand their way of thinking, but it doesn't mean I agree with them. Because for nh & ss to happen, it need big asspull. And they did.

If not for naruto love for sakura and sakura developement and how kishi portray them in the manga before he change his mind. I will not ship anything. To the point I will stop read naruto 3 or 4 years ago.

[Saku-chan]

I think it was a combination of Kishimoto wanting to end the manga and being pressured to write an end that would be profitable. I completely agree with Miyazaki's post about otaku only making things for other otaku who dislike real life people. Otaku are extremely vocal and spend tons of money on the things that they like, so they often get catered to. This is a shame because more moderate fans are driven away by these niche genres in my opinion. (I know I am most of the time.) When this happens, the story is more often than not, butchered. Look at Sword Art Online for crying out loud.

 

I think there is a lot of truth to what Miyazaki said. One of my mutuals on Tumblr who is a huge Hinata fanboy has admitted that he uses waifus to cope with his experiences of irl women treating him badly. I don't take issue with this method of coping as long as this sort of waifu moe archetype were confined to its own genre. I take issue with it in this case because Naruto is clearly not a story where that sort of thing would be expected. It's an action/drama shounen. Naruto isn't like any of the boring, self-inserty MC's that show up in moe anime. Naruto had an interesting setup, was plot driven, had important moral messages, and excellent character growth (for Sakura as well even though she did get sidelined on more than one occasion). But in order for a good story to be appreciated, it takes time for the audience to digest it and with time, the probability for impulse buying fan goods goes down. With fanservice, it takes two seconds to slap a moeblob together and otaku will empty their wallets. There was no economic incentive to have an ending with integrity that took careful consideration of canon when there was a profitable cop out to be had.

 

I won't generalize and say this is true for all NH fans, but in at least one instance Miyazaki's assertions were proven correct. I believe that done with care, NH could have been a great canon ship. Hinata clearly appreciates Naruto despite nearly the entire village looking down on him/hating him because she recognizes his worth. I think Naruto would be able to come to admire Hinata's ability to persevere. I think they could suit each other had Naruto gotten over Sakura in a way that doesn't retcon his feelings. But, they didn't. The manga has 698 chapters of Naruto still in love with Sakura. He admits to Sai that he still loves her and we get baby steps of development for Sakura's change in feelings. And all of this amounts to nothing? NH was planned a long time ago? Yeah right. I'd say 8 months tops this was decided. And even then, why keep having NS moments? CPR????? Naruto's girlfriend???????? I don't think this is the end Kishi intended. 

 

 

I've said it before and I'll say it again. I think Sakura has always suffered from not having meaningful introspection for her motivations until the chuunin exams. That's over a year of people seeing her as naive at best and a delusional bitch at worst. And when the anime started? Studio Pierro showed this facet again and at times added to it for filler. I had hope for Shippuden to correct this, but Hinata had already become a very popular secondary character especially with her Part 2 design.

 

I think she was created as a character for two reasons. The most important was to show that Konoha has a dark side and that powerful ninja clans pay a price to keep their power. The second reason was to show an example of someone who has watched Naruto and come to admire him and let the reader know that yes, this is a character that is making a good impression on those who bother to observe him. Hinata gives Naruto a break on the romance front which was looking pretty abysmal by the time Hinata was introduced. For the record I really like Hinata's canon characterization. I don't think she's weird or 'obsessed' any more than Sakura, Naruto, or Lee (Jiraiya, Obito, etc.) are for the people they crush on. However, her fanon personality is bordering on ridiculous with how flawless she is made out to be.

 

Another thing to consider which ciardha brought up just after 699-700 came out was that Kishimoto's father passed away earlier this year. Yet, he only took one week of hiatus. I have no idea if he wanted to come back so soon in order to take his mind off of things or if that was imposed upon him by JUMP, but perhaps that made him lose interest in continuing Naruto further. 

 

tl;dr

I completely agree with tricksie's post and Miyazaki's opinions about anime and how the quality suffers because of catering to otaku. But, that's hardly the only reason why I think we got the ending that we got.

[Suigetsu]

I already use glasses. ^^

I think that because salad use glasses thus remind you of Karin.
She's still sakura clone thought. Just like 90% of the manga cast is the clone of naruto, sasuke, and sakura.

It's not just the appearance but the manerisms as well.
http://i.imgur.com/wBdakYW.jpg
How can you see sakura in that is beyond me, what similarities do Salad and Sakura have according to you? Other than being mother and child according to kitten canon.

Edited by Suigetsu, 03 December 2014 - 02:02 AM.

[narusaku256]

Know what? Uchihas aren't supposed to have specs. How the f does Sarada havr specs!

[tricksie]

Know what? Uchihas aren't supposed to have specs. How the f does Sarada havr specs!

 

You're totally right! Instead of some crazy power eye jutsu, she has a flaw. Must make papa Sasuke veeerrrry proud. Maybe that's why he's on the run. His genes are bad. He's repopulating his clan with wonky sharingans.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

 

You're totally right! Instead of some crazy power eye jutsu, she has a flaw. Must make papa Sasuke veeerrrry proud. Maybe that's why he's on the run. His genes are bad. He's repopulating his clan with wonky sharingans.

 

X-D HA!!! That'd be hysterical! Unless Salad is like Obito and needs time for her eyes to adjust, like Obito did when he wore his goggles.

[sushi.]

Well aside from him basically admitting that he was swayed by popularity, it is like he's intentionally pissing fans off in interviews. When he spouted out the news about Neji, he knew people would get mad. He should've been careful with his words, but he outright called him "nh cupid". When he revealed that NS and its parallels were misleading, he said "dare I say, that the Kushi-Saku parallel was a red herring?".

 

Like even if it isn't on purpose, he must know that no one'll like these revelations. I feel like if they were true, he would keep them to himself. That is why yes, I have a nagging feeling that he couldn't write the ending he wanted.

[Suigetsu]

The ending of a manga is supposed to bring closure and conclusion to everything. Therefore, this cant be called an ending because it didnt bring any of it at all. Kishi just wanted to get out and finish it on 699.
If he wanted a way out maybe he shouldnt had done Kaguya at all nor should had wanked all those chapters with Obito the Jubbi master nor with OP Madara.

I often wonder, where the hell was his editor during those times? It's their job to keep people in check and keep revising this kinds of things.

[Konohakitten]

Naruto.....the DBGT of the anime industry

My husband and I are huge Dragon Ball fans and we have said the same thing about Bolt and his whole "new adventure"

 

It would be nice if Naruto were to be remembered for the manga, which is of better quality, but in all likelihood it'll be remembered through the anime. And, by extension, HInata. She and what she represents is what's arguably done the most damage to the story in the end, and she's going to be the last focus of the franchise. Not Team 7. Not even a different supporting character with more relevance and depth. Nope. kittening Hinata Hyuga. She's going to be Naruto's legacy.

 

The character that no one ever paid any attention to, the one that had so little panel time, will now be the one character that everyone thinks about when they think about the ending, and that's horrible.

 

Why are people still believing that Naruto can end up with Sakura in canon? They have already given their epilogue and it has clearly stated what happened. I don't see any reason they will change it now. Can you imagine the fallout that will occur after they change canon pairings now? The amount of flak all the staff will get from the NH and SS fanbase. They will literally set fire to the studio if their pairings are withdrawn after being made canon.

 

They can't tell you about the story because they will get penalized for breaking confidentiality. Even if it is something as obvious as the end pairing.

 

Not to mention that they have pretty much destroyed NS in these two chapters as much as they destroyed the other pairings in the whole series. That's why every body lost in the end except for the producers and those pairing fans who just wanted the bragging rights.

 

Well I personally don't think they'll become canon,  the fact that NH kids exsits stops that from happening, but I do believe we can have some sort of closure along with NaruSaku moments in the future. There is one anime that has done this before. It's added extra moments between characters, which leaves big hints on their relationship, the one anime that has done is Evangelion with it's installment Evangelion 2.22

 

Spoliers ahead :3

Rei and Shinji didn't have much memorable interactions between each other especially since since Rei was so robotic with everyone, but in the original series she and Shinji did get closer once he saved her. His doing so reminder her of when his father saved her and burned his hands in the process. Rei then smiled at Shinji and we get to see her warm up a little but soon afterwards this version of Rei dies.

In Evangelion 2.22 the ending is so much more meaningful, it's simply beautiful and in my eyes these versions of the two are those of Shinji and Rei from the original anime. I was so happy to see them have a moment since I've shipped them for years. This moment didn't make them canon but it was great getting to see such a heart filled moment between the two of them and I do have hope that this is will happen with NS in one way or another.

 

Salad is sakura clone. Karin is sakura uzumaki lol.
Dragon ball gt doesn't retcon manga. And that is a filler anime.

 GT didn't retcon the manga but dear sweet god did they stretch Dragon Ball Logic a little too thin. This is why GT sticks out like a sore thumb. For example the way Goku turns into SSJ4 is mind boggling. He looks upon the Earth while he's dying and for whatever reason it has the same effects on him like the full moon would. He turns into an ape comes to his senses before killing Pan and then he condenses all that power into  adult form, because his younger body wouldn't be able to handle it. So Goku is able to turn into an ape with the Earth, and he's able to control his age, but while only in SSJ4 because "reasons." Now I'm sorry but even though Dragon Ball had some crazy logic GT went above and beyond in that department. I compare it to this new Naruto because it's being made solely for money, I mean for the fans, and that's what GT did.

 

 

You're totally right! Instead of some crazy power eye jutsu, she has a flaw. Must make papa Sasuke veeerrrry proud. Maybe that's why he's on the run. His genes are bad. He's repopulating his clan with wonky sharingans.

 

I gave little miss Salad the benefit of the doubt by comparing her with Obito, but even he didn't actually have eye problems as in vision defects. Instead he had sensitive eyes that teared up whenever he would run. So yeah it makes more sense to have Salad with glasses if it came from her mother, which Sakura doesn't have, but Karin does.....hmmm

 

 

 

Now I personally do think that Kishi was influenced into creating the mess we saw at the end of Naruto. At first I blamed it all on him but has time has gone on more and more info has been leaked out and now things are making more sense. I don't think he ever saw what was going to happen within the fandom. He probably thought that people would be shocked and surprised, but I don't think he really saw how many people would be hurt, disappointed, and flat out enraged. SP basically told him that their choices would be wiser and honestly I think Kishi was tired of Naruto, so he was like sure why the hell not I just want it to end.

Edited by Konohakitten, 18 December 2014 - 06:11 PM.

[catsi563]

I also agree with the analysis. I do believe he caved to pressure from the studio and outside reps for the voice actress in question. In the end, he just didn't have the courage to stand up to them and reclaim his story.

[narusaku256]

 
You're totally right! Instead of some crazy power eye jutsu, she has a flaw. Must make papa Sasuke veeerrrry proud. Maybe that's why he's on the run. His genes are bad. He's repopulating his clan with wonky sharingans.

Actually....that's better than giving her some ass crazy power. Remember....she has Sasuke's genes. To express her love to Sakura....she might pierce through her heart. Oh! And Sakura being more like Kushina...I can imagine her being a strict mom at times. Sarada having Sasuke's genes, she might be a walking time bomb as well! One wrong move on Sakura's part and.....CHIDORI!!! Its really really good she doesn't inherit power from Sasuke Poor Sakura chan would suffer all her life As it is, Sasuke is waaayyyy more than enough for her....and if Sarada goes that way.....god forbid Sakura chan

Edited by narusaku256, 18 December 2014 - 07:54 AM.

[Aizen-Sama]

Actually....that's better than giving her some ass crazy power. Remember....she has Sasuke's genes. To express her love to Sakura....she might pierce through her heart. Oh! And Sakura being more like Kushina...I can imagine her being a strict mom at times. Sarada having Sasuke's genes, she might be a walking time bomb as well! One wrong move on Sakura's part and.....CHIDORI!!! Its really really good she doesn't inherit power from Sasuke Poor Sakura chan would suffer all her life As it is, Sasuke is waaayyyy more than enough for her....and if Sarada goes that way.....god forbid Sakura chan

So much for Sakura being like Kushina. I can't imagine her being hot-tempered around Sasuke and putting him in his place. XD The moment she smacked him with a spatula he'd probably chidori her in the gut lol.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

So much for Sakura being like Kushina. I can't imagine her being hot-tempered around Sasuke and putting him in his place. XD The moment she smacked him with a spatula he'd probably chidori her in the gut lol.

 

Sadly that's true. :(

[Gravenimage]

Well this confirms one of my theories to be true. That Kishimoto was pressured by his editors in making NH/SS canon. I think the've been pressuring him by a long time convincing him to make the pairings that are popular worldwide. But in this case I agreed its pretty much true Hinata got what she wanted simply because she's cute and has big boobs, and the otakus love that. Who knows how many of them "relief" themselves with pictures and doujins of her. Yeah that post is true and I wonder if deep inside Kishimoto regrets creating Hinata, guess we'll never know.