3333 replies to this topic

[Dalton.T.R]

I'll be honest. Naruto could have ended right after the Pain fight without trying to bring Sasuke back, and I would have been perfectly fine. The most dangerous villain at the time defeated, Naruto finally accepted by the village, maybe a short time skip of a few years, Tsunade steps down and Naruto takes the position. He and Sakura aren't actually married, but dating, and he eventually learns of Sasuke's whereabouts, goes after him and brings him back. Much better ending IMO

[TouKen4Life3g]

I think Kishi has spread out the good moments too far apart from its scenario that could have been impacting.

[Bail o' Lies]

"And last, after understanding Japanese culture a little better, and know that he's been writing this for f20 years, I honestly think that Kishimoto himself changed. And in the end, he wanted Naruto to have a traditional Japanese wife like Hinata. Very sweet, and very much focused on the family — something that is of large concern in Japanese society right now with the well-publicized downturn in population. Sakura was a role-breaker. As was Naruto originally. That's why they were both so perfect together. But in the end, neither of them broke out of their traditional roles. Naruto didn't usher in massive changes, instead returning to be a leader like his father. And Sakura returned to become a housewife, with no word of a career outside of housekeeping."

 

I must disagree with this part, for one thing simply because of which character he based off his wife. Naruto was based off him, and Sakura was at least original based off the type of girl he liked but eventually his wife once he met her. His problems with his family are from him not being around for so many years because of working on Naruto. Not a desire to find a big breasted submissive mistress to abscond with.

 

Also again you're thinking nH happening has to do with Japan's declining birth rate problem instead of what it really was; an appeal to the otaku and international parts of the fanbase (who as far as they knew all loved nH.) If it was to convince the Japanese population to get married and have children; then why did kishimoto never say that in his interviews? It would have been better then constantly stating he didn't understand why Hinata was so popular. Also if this was to convince them to have more children why do all the family except nH (because the daughter exist because they wanted to confirm in chapter 700 yes hinata and Naruto got together) have only one child each? A single child per family is still a declining population. From what I recall every family need to have at least 2.5 (some number like that) child per family to have a stable population.

Edited by Bail o' Lies, 14 September 2017 - 06:02 AM.

[BlackBird19]

 

Movies can actually be green lit, particularly successful franchises, and particularly if the prior movie is successful, without a script, and have. Considering that RtN and 615 came out the same year, and that we have no idea when the script was actually complete, I don't buy into the fact that the Anime Company influenced the manga ending. Further, the Anime company -only- knew that NH would have children, and none of the other pairings. It strongly gives to the credibility that the anime company didn't really push things. This is also what I mean by conspiracy theory, I.E., a theory that this big company, and the Editing Company, and ridiculously, sometimes a fanbase did things, pushed for things, ruining what was intended. The original script idea wasn't even about a romance, that came after Kishimoto insisted the story be focused on Naruto, according to the Last interviews. 

 

My question mark use here, FYI, is used as skepticism, here, further laying out that Kaguya's family was mentioned as well. 

 

Later material that builds on the Kaguya element works for more than just Kaguya trying to connect things roughly, I would strongly argue it's the inverse. Firstly, because you don't need a member of her clan as the villain, more so it was highlighted that because it was a member of the clan, it connected to the manga better. We could have picked a different clan altogether. Secondly, it helps give this very recent, remembered villain fresh in people's heads more detail that is missing, allowing expansion of a detail recently immersed in.

 

About the next paragraph, by the definition of facts, Kishimoto said they were intended, and as such, by his words alone that is fact. This does not make a second reading any more unbiased than a first. I read to understand what I missed, and the manga filled that in satisfactorily. There is no bias in this, this is reading to understand. -if- it was not there, how could I understand? There is no more bias involved in my own re-reading than would be your own re-reading, compared to our first reading. If anything, my first reading would be more biased, as I was really not paying attention much to the other pairings, nor, perhaps were some of us seriously, which perhaps was the blindfold over our eyes.

 

Further, some of these interviews are T.V. interviews. Some were done in the States. I don't buy a company outlook conspiracy theory. Frankly, there's zero harm in saying you changed your mind about a pairing half-way through because it didn't work, or that NH seemed the way to better please fans, or that his staff really wanted it, or his wife, or whatever. It doesn't hurt the company at all. Authors tend to be -more- honest and -more- open after their work is finished, because they have no more fear of spoiling anything. Writing also doesn't really work like: "End your story like this and get paid", and I'm sourcing this from experience from the publishing world. Editors suggest things, but there's never anything like that. Even if suggested to get rid of something, an insistent writer can keep it in. New writers tend to listen to their editors a lot more, because they want to keep getting published, but there is never a "End this" in your contract. 

 

Finally, nothing stops the series from continuing regardless of the children. We could have continued on from the Last, dealing with Naruto's adult days. We could have continued on from Naruto's Hokage days, with no children around. Nothing -stops- the franchise from continuing, kids are not a precursor to necessitate continuation. Within the work itself, they are an embellishment of a happy ending, as well as the passing of things from one generation to the next. 

 

 

 

I also think the "True End" chapter's title is being taken way too literally, but I digress. 

 

I don't buy that contract really gave anything if he ended it -specifically- this way. Then you have to question why he is lying about it (There's no reason to do this), why it is a good business decision, and why in the world they could not fit the script to accommodate what he wanted, and so many other holes to fill in, ala, you are making a conspiracy theory.  I personally believe it is far, far, easier to understand that the development to what became of 700 is in the manga, and it's more than just the last hundred chapters. Some started in the first hundred, in the roots. Whether or not the quality is good is completely up for debate. But it's there, objectively there, even. I think you just have to take the time to be open to seeing other possibilities. 

 

As for ending at the Pain Arc, if NS was the plan, and Sasuke did not exist, or was dead, or whatever, sure, you could end it just like that, to be honest. It does in and of itself work as a happy ending even. But there are still some unaddressed things introduced within the arc and before, so it could not just end there.

 

I'd be more inclined to think like you if the story was a novel. Written and completed and then licensed becoming a franchise later on. That's not the case here because an anime series like Naruto is created to draw more attention toward the manga. Therefore, anime can hold quite a bit of influence over a manga. 

 

Now I have never been one to state that SP should be the sole focus of the decision, because they are just an anime company. However TV Tokyo, who is highly invested in Naruto and fronts a great deal of the money for all the animations to be produced, does hold that kind of sway. I know this because TV Tokyo listed Naruto as it's top earner last year on the anime side of it's holdings. Even though Naruto anime sales were outdone by two of it's other anime series. What garnered Naruto so much money was it's video game and Chinese mobile app game. Profits which were posted to TV Tokyo and not just Shueisha, SP or Kishimoto.

 

You would have to be extremely naïve to believe a major national television and media company, who is thoroughly invested in a franchise does not have some serious pull in the way their investment is handled. Especially considering Kishimoto's television interviews were produced and/or aired on TV Tokyo. 

Edited by BlackBird19, 14 September 2017 - 03:14 AM.

[Bail o' Lies]

You know, for a person who claims to been taught the ins and outs of industry by a literary genius, She is painfully unaware how the industry actually works.

Edited by Bail o' Lies, 14 September 2017 - 05:40 AM.

[BlackBird19]

 

I've worked -in- the writing industry. As an aside, I currently work in the investment industry. I have a sister that works -in- the film industry. I don't know what your experience is, but I know what mine is. T.V. show makers -do- not have the level of say claimed at all in how a manga is written, or a book series, or a game series if its based on that. If anything, when you make something based off a series, you consult with the author to get it right. You don't ask the author to write something the way you want it, you are trying to emulate the author. You study his characters, the background, how he draws if you are animating, etc. If -anything-, it would be credible to say that Kishimoto would have pull in the anime. This is provably true with the Boruto anime, as he particularly gave advice into the first Arc. 

 

 

 

Same as above, really. It's far, far, far more credible, and believable to state that Kishimoto has pull on how his series is done, than the inverse.  

 

Plus you need to answer why. Why would they do it? How in the world it is profitable to end it as they did when spans and spans of manga have done so differently and end just as well? Where is your evidence of this information? It is only unprovable speculation, at most, and conspiracy creating at best. What stops them from making the film non-canon like all of their others, and why is it just this one? All of their other successful material has demonstrated displayed canon events (Games), or just told an unconnected story. 

 

I don't buy into this theory simply because it relies purely on speculation. It is -good- to doubt and question, but I strongly believe this angle of speculation is the wrong path, because you must call your author a liar to do so, and must paint the business bad for... ultimately, picking a pairing over another, which is kind of petty. It is an application of Occam's Razor, frankly, in believing the author over a conspiracy, simply because the former takes far less assumptions. 

 

The truth is that Kishimoto chose this ending, and that is sourced, and I see no reason to doubt that. Love Kishimoto for what he did well, and criticize what he did not. That's the respect I would want. 

 

First off, this is just a piece of advice, take it or leave it. You really should avoid absolutes. Just because you have some experiences in the industry does not mean that's the way it is across the board. You can only speak of your experiences, not necessarily for anyone else's. Countless stories and reports about the writing and T.V. industry have shown many people have had very different experiences from your own. Experiences that include the changing of stories to suit whoever is footing the bill.

 

As for the possible reason why. Many of us have given you several already. However, this is the biggest one. They viewed it as more profitable for the main characters of the continuation to be the children of a NH pairing and a SS pairing. That's it. No big conspiracy, just a simple business decision.    

 

Now to the last, my answer has been a simple one all along. I do not blindly believe what I'm told when my eyes and basic reading comprehension tell me different. If you have such faith in Kishimoto just because he says so, that's fine. I cannot nor will I ever tell you how to think or believe. I can only give you my viewpoint and the logical reasons that helped me form it. 

[tricksie]

 

Further, some of these interviews are T.V. interviews. Some were done in the States. I don't buy a company outlook conspiracy theory. Frankly, there's zero harm in saying you changed your mind about a pairing half-way through because it didn't work, or that NH seemed the way to better please fans, or that his staff really wanted it, or his wife, or whatever. It doesn't hurt the company at all. Authors tend to be -more- honest and -more- open after their work is finished, because they have no more fear of spoiling anything. Writing also doesn't really work like: "End your story like this and get paid", and I'm sourcing this from experience from the publishing world. Editors suggest things, but there's never anything like that. Even if suggested to get rid of something, an insistent writer can keep it in. New writers tend to listen to their editors a lot more, because they want to keep getting published, but there is never a "End this" in your contract. 

 

Finally, nothing stops the series from continuing regardless of the children. We could have continued on from the Last, dealing with Naruto's adult days. We could have continued on from Naruto's Hokage days, with no children around. Nothing -stops- the franchise from continuing, kids are not a precursor to necessitate continuation. Within the work itself, they are an embellishment of a happy ending, as well as the passing of things from one generation to the next. 

 

I also think the "True End" chapter's title is being taken way too literally, but I digress. 

 

I don't buy that contract really gave anything if he ended it -specifically- this way. Then you have to question why he is lying about it (There's no reason to do this), why it is a good business decision, and why in the world they could not fit the script to accommodate what he wanted, and so many other holes to fill in, ala, you are making a conspiracy theory.  I personally believe it is far, far, easier to understand that the development to what became of 700 is in the manga, and it's more than just the last hundred chapters. Some started in the first hundred, in the roots. Whether or not the quality is good is completely up for debate. But it's there, objectively there, even. I think you just have to take the time to be open to seeing other possibilities. 

 

As for ending at the Pain Arc, if NS was the plan, and Sasuke did not exist, or was dead, or whatever, sure, you could end it just like that, to be honest. It does in and of itself work as a happy ending even. But there are still some unaddressed things introduced within the arc and before, so it could not just end there.

Um... ok. WHAT???? That first exposes a romantic view of how creatives interact wtih the world. It's nothing as nice as that.

 

In most industries, as a creative you're hired to do a specific job. If you don't do it, then you don't get paid. Once you've done that work, it belongs to the company. This is how it goes. Photographer at a newspaper? That photo belongs to the paper. Artist for a rock band? That art belongs to the record label. It is now their intellectual property, not the original creators because s/he was already compensated for it.

 

Kishimoto is paid by fill-in-the-blank corporation. His work belongs to them. And it has from the very first moment he won that contest in 1998. He can no longer go back and change things, or reprint it with a different ending. And yes, he most definitely is contractually obligated to support whatever direction they ask him to go with it. Or he will be violating his contract. This is the deal that he signed to make money and become internationally famous, instead of having his manga copied at the corner shop and handing it out to his friends. 

 

Lastly, writers fight their editors all the time. Artists fight their art directors all the time. ALL THE TIME. And new writers are the frickin worst.

 

The franchise launched a next phase with NH. It was the best decision for a lot of reasons — which I've named in previous posts — and if i had been in the room I'd have made the same choice. But what's best for a multi-million dollar franchise isn't always what the artist wants, and that's why I said that artists — being the sneaky little control freaks that they are — will always try to slip in some item, some input, some whisper of what they really intended. Thus, the chaper entitled "The True End." 

 

"And last, after understanding Japanese culture a little better, and know that he's been writing this for f20 years, I honestly think that Kishimoto himself changed. And in the end, he wanted Naruto to have a traditional Japanese wife like Hinata. Very sweet, and very much focused on the family — something that is of large concern in Japanese society right now with the well-publicized downturn in population. Sakura was a role-breaker. As was Naruto originally. That's why they were both so perfect together. But in the end, neither of them broke out of their traditional roles. Naruto didn't usher in massive changes, instead returning to be a leader like his father. And Sakura returned to become a housewife, with no word of a career outside of housekeeping."

 

I must disagree with this part, for one thing simply because of which character he based off his wife. Naruto was based off him, and Sakura was at least original based off the type of girl he liked but eventually his wife once he met her. His problems with his family are from him not being around for so many years because of working on Naruto. Not a desire to find a big breasted submissive mistress to abscond with.

 

Also again you're thinking nH happening has to do with Japan's declining birth rate problem instead of what it really was; an appeal to the otaku and international parts of the fanbase (who as far as they knew all loved nH.) If it was to convince the Japanese population to get married and have children; then why did kishimoto never say that in his interviews? It would have been better then constantly stating he didn't understand why Hinata was so popular. Also if this was to convince them to have more children why do all the family except nH (because the daughter exist because they wanted to confirm in chapter 700 yes hinata and Naruto got together) have only one child each? A single child per family is still a declining population. From what I recall every family need to have at least 2.5 (some number like that) child per family to have a stable population.

I get what your saying. But I'm thinking more along the lines of Kishimoto was 20 when he started, unmarried, young and didn't care about families, even as he wrote about them. There's a big difference between him then and now — 40s with kids and taking the long view of life. Couple that with some social mores and the fact that Hinata is very much represents a popular Japanese ideal that is scattered all over anime and manga, then I can see why Kishimoto may have just shrugged and said 'eh, either one.' I don't think he ever cared about shipping, Hinata seemed just as good as Sakura (and didn't make waves as much as Sakura did), and an NH ending is 'going out with a surprise' that then launched the new era with the kids. I think that the part where he based Sakura off his wife was nice and probably true. But in the end, NH was better for the extending of the series and more well-received by those around him and in Japan. 

 

I just think that — with some distance from the ending — there are more reasons for him to turn to NH than I originally realized. 

[tricksie]

 

What stories and reports? You see stories about scripts being rejected, but I have -never-, -ever-, read minute details such as a ship having such company input,. I have seen censorship of extremes, and filter on what gets published, but no one is going to give you a contract for this couple being canon. It is frankly, an illogical conclusion. The business does -not- work that way. This doesn't mean it is an absolute persay, I can buy into that an exceptional circumstance may exist, but if we are going to name an exception, a narrated example would be appreciated. 

 

It is right of course that the property is in company hands, else, the writer could just go somewhere else and be offered more money to write. Editors and publishers help things along and give input. You work together, you listen to each other. That's how it works when it goes well. I disagree strongly with the new writers being the worst, as I have worked extensively with new writers specifically, as an editor. Some have not yet learned the needed humility, and can be frustrating, but most serious new writers will listen to every piece of input.

 

Sometimes there is "fighting", and Kishimoto has actually mentioned a few times when he's disagreed with assistants and editors, or when plots were suggested by them, such as the Chuunin Exams.

 

For the second part: Where is the evidence? I can, and many have easily illustrated alone by what is within the manga points to the ending. Even if this is your narrated exceptional circumstance of a business interceding on what was supposed to happen, how does that explain the development pointing to it? The weak part of this argument is nothing can be sourced really to this being a business decision, only speculated. The second weak part is it does not explain the development that many point out exists already pointing to 700 happening as it did. For the theory to work, we must disregard the development, and call it non-existant, we must also insist on business meddling, and we must also call the interviews a lie. This is a lot of assumptions, and Occam's Razor very strongly comes in play. I don't need to make -any- assumptions on my own thoughts, because I can point to how what is there connects with everything. 

Enough. Again. Enough. 

 

First you're in 'the industry,' then you're in investment and now you're an editor? Ok, please stop.

 

You don't know what anyone else here does, yet you still tell people they are wrong.

 

You ask to be convinced, you demand proof.... yet you only boast about your greater knowledge when someone tells you something you don't want to hear. 

 

No one here is a Naruto expert. But there are some of us who can make educated guesses. First based on what we've all read as a group, and second based on what each person has experienced in the world. Those personal experiences, when shared, can broaden someone else's horizon or shed light on certain aspects of Naruto, the art or the business. Ultimately it's all just conversation and opinion.

 

That being said, it is no one's job to convince you — of Naruto, of Kishimoto's thoughts, or of how a corporate marketing machine works. And especially when you demand proof in the same sentence that you dismiss others comments as being absolutely wrong. It only makes carrying on discussion very very frustrating.

 

Blackbird's post is spot on, and a good place to end this. I shouldn't have been drawn in either, as now we are completely off topic. In yet another thread!

 

Back to comments on Boruto the Anime.

[Nostradamus]

Always remember the creed.

Nothing Is True.

Edited by Nostradamus, 14 September 2017 - 05:05 PM.

[Kagomaru]

Of course, as we now know, such a business decision was all for nothing in the long run. A majority of the japanese/western fandom moved on, causing Boruto's sales to dry out and the ratings for the anime series to continue their disastrous free-fall.  Hell, the Editor-in-Chief at Shueisha raised a death flag for Boruto in a recent article by saying he is hoping that Black Clover will be the "Next Naruto" . Now, why would you want a spiritual successor to become "The Next Naruto" when the sequel to said-series has been in serialization for three years and recently received its own anime? 

 

That is an ominous sign when a supposed "copycat" series is considered more worthy to be Naruto than its actual canonical continuation, and believe that the former title will be as popular as its spiritual predecessor(while implying that other title has failed in that goal).

 

I am almost certain that this series will be dead by the end of this year or during the next. Either way, Boruto's future as a MSJ title and SP horror fanfiction is not looking bright.

Edited by Kagomaru, 14 September 2017 - 05:41 PM.

[Bail o' Lies]

I get what your saying. But I'm thinking more along the lines of Kishimoto was 20 when he started, unmarried, young and didn't care about families, even as he wrote about them. There's a big difference between him then and now — 40s with kids and taking the long view of life. Couple that with some social mores and the fact that Hinata is very much represents a popular Japanese ideal that is scattered all over anime and manga, then I can see why Kishimoto may have just shrugged and said 'eh, either one.' I don't think he ever cared about shipping, Hinata seemed just as good as Sakura (and didn't make waves as much as Sakura did), and an NH ending is 'going out with a surprise' that then launched the new era with the kids. I think that the part where he based Sakura off his wife was nice and probably true. But in the end, NH was better for the extending of the series and more well-received by those around him and in Japan. 

 

I just think that — with some distance from the ending — there are more reasons for him to turn to NH than I originally realized. 

I don't disagree that Kishimoto is a different man after 15 years. For example, in part one we had things like infants used to store demons, mutations, crushing people with sand, people using their spines as whips, and so on. While in part two the most frequent new power was variations of magnetic powers by the end.

 

But like I said it is unlikely he did it for that birth rate problem, and even in his interviews where he was suppose to talk up and go on about how great Hinata was all he could really say was either he didn't get why she was so popular or people like her because she supported Naruto since the being (or her breast). But him stating he didn't understand Hinata's appeal was by far the more frequent response when asked. His shrug was more "well that's what the fans want", then "I can see why the fans would like her." 

 

As for the people around him the people that supported nH considered it brilliant, while the people that thought NS was going to happen were at least very surprised, but the most important reaction was always going to be from the fans since they're justification for the switch; because they believe that is what the fans wanted. At the very least the reaction they got was not what they were hoping.

Edited by Bail o' Lies, 14 September 2017 - 05:58 PM.

[BlackShirtGuy]

See, here is my main grip with all of this: NH is a plot driven relationship(the worst kind of one, if you ask me), never, not even once, the characters interact by their own will or at the very least, NEVER from Naruto's side. Think back to all the times theese two interacted in the manga, it was always because some external force or higher power that forced them to interact (Naruto formerlly met Hinata while he was taking an exam, he interacted again with her because luckily they sat next to each other, then becuase Kurenai prompted Hinata into giving the medicine that was never touched upon or referenced again until the Last retcon. again thanks to hinata getting almost killed by Neji, then because Naruto run into her by chance at the training grounds, he ran into her by chance again at the begin of shippuden, during the pein battle, again, because she didn't respect his wish of not interfering and decided to go "save" him and confess, and the last time again, it was just to give Naruto a pep talk, something practically anyone can do it was merely Hinata who did it because it was Neji the one to die) Hell, even in their own movie Naruto falls in love, excuse me I meant "realize his longtime hidden feelings for her" via an external force, it's the worst kind of romance I've ever seen written xD  . Don't you see a patern here? It always is Hinata -> Naruto and NEVER Naruto -> Hinata . It is merely a plot driven romace and that's why it needed a movie that retconned the crap outta the series and that's why it sucks as a pairing. In order to write a believable relationship and romance, you need to make the characters interact but not only during work (or battle in this case) otherwise something like this is BOUND to happen, I mean if you are a really good at writing romance you MIGHT be able to actually pull it off but Kishi himself said he can't write it to save his life and this wasn't even supposed to be  a romance series. 

 

According to what tricksie said, if they wanted Hinata with Naruto k fine,but  why SS? I mean if they have mad SK canon, Sarada would be a goddamn powerhouse, not even boruto could compare(I mean he doesn't even had the byakugan they had to add mor bs eyes powers, we can't get enough of those right?) . Was it because it was a pain in the ass to search for an excuse that SK would send their daughter to Konoha or something else? Or perhaps it was so Naruto could "chose" Hinata over Sakura?

 

In the end, I'll always look to what they did to this series as ship pandering NH and SS had a decently big fanbase which had to influence their decision in some way, however it was the worst kind of pandering you could've made, I mean there is nothing bad with fanservice here and there (as long as it doesn't completely throw the history out the window), hell, one of my favorite franchises (Ace Attorney) has lots of fanservice and ship pandering, but they don't put that over the story is just mere filler or a little nod, Naruto decided fanservice and profit over history and that's when it all went downhill.

Edited by BlackShirtGuy, 14 September 2017 - 11:25 PM.

[Dalton.T.R]

 

Well, Naruto is very plot driven. So...technically I can set up quite a few things to never happen if the plot did not make it so: I.E., Sasuke and Sakura on Naruto's team. Things happen and characters react to the situation, and within these situations, characters change their thoughts of each other. 

 

Also, pre-615, when Naruto meets up with the Alliance and saves Hinata, he reassures her, to supply a Naruto->Hinata talk. And the Chuunin Exams's stuff is mutual arrows here. The Last also has Naruto->Hinata. (The Last also doesn't retcon anything. It has a continuity error, but I've yet to see anything else pointed out that retcons something). 

 

The rest I discussed at length already and will not digress a second time, I just wanted to point out that NH is not solely Hinata->Naruto.

 

To turn things on point, Karin was always a very minor character. If SK did happen I don't think either would be in Konoha, and if they had a child, you'd see them much less. Granted, SK would need some work for it to make sense with 700.

 

 

Okay, let's be honest here, Sasuke did NOT deserve the ending he got. As far as i'm concerned, that guy only deserved to be buried six feet under at the end. The amount of BS he put Naruto and everyone else through...there is no way that would be forgiven in real life. The idea of bringing Sasuke back was always kind of silly to say the least, at least for me anyway.

 

And this is kind of what annoyed me with Sakura's character. Naruto risked his very own life to bring Sasuke back, and came back with severe injuries. Did she ever pause and think, "You know...I kind of push Naruto a little too hard sometimes. Maybe I should ease up on him."? No, she didn't. That's one of he few annoyances I had with her character. I mean, she quietly thanked Naruto and trained under Tsunade for a while to try and help him. But heavens forbid you spend a little more one on one time with the guy. I mean, all he does is risk his life for you time and time again. would it kill ya to have lunch with him every once in a while at least? You don't want Ramen? Fine. Tell him you'll agree to a date if he takes you somewhere else. 

 

I get she's a fictional character and all, but even in the most fictional stories, it's important to have a bit of realism. 

[BlueStarSaber]

Check this out http://fandom.wikia....dium=wikia-rail

[VanitasDS76491]

Check this out http://fandom.wikia....dium=wikia-rail

I say cash grab and a failing one at that.

[TouKen4Life3g]

The novel 3 is already out. The sale is more or less the same as the previous one. Not sure if it's the last one.

[Dalton.T.R]

Cash grab. Easily. 

[BlackBird19]

Of course this a cash grab. It's why we've always stated that the direction the franchise took was a business decision.

 

Now, please forgive me for this @Tricksie. I must say that I'm not surprised by Analyzer's responses to my last posts, but I now have a genuine dislike for this person. I've been nothing but cordial and respectful of her opinions and even went out of my way to make sure I addressed her by her correct gender. I'm a 39 year old man, by the way, with a healthy amount of life experience.

 

So, it was so nice to take quick peek at my favorite forum when I got to work tonight after a long day in the hospital with my mother, to find I've been thoroughly insulted by someone who doesn't personally know me simply because I have a differing opinion from hers.

 

Apparently, according to her, I post haphazardly and offer nothing but conjecture. That I don't have informed opinions, just wild ideas and conspiracies. 

 

Apparently, I also did not excel at reading and writing during all my years of schooling so my interpretation of the entirety of the manga must be wholly wrong.

 

However, what has truly put me out is that according to her I am a liar. Since I didn't source something for her in a timely manner, then I must be lying. That is an insult I do not overlook. 

 

You know Analyzer I never personally doubted who you say you are or the credentials you've given. I never stated you were absolutely wrong in our debates. But for you to think that everyone who has ever been in the industries you initially were in, have shared the same types of experiences you had, and all over the world mind you. Just goes to show how close minded and limited your thinking truly is. It is narcissistic, naïve and to be honest just plain ignorant. 

 

If you feel insulted, I don't care. You certainly didn't spare my feelings. This will be the last time I'll acknowledge you, let alone respond to you. Have a nice life. 

 

To the mods, I'll completely accept any form punishment you deem worthy for this post. I also apologize for once again taking us off topic. Goodnight.

[Dalton.T.R]

Of course this a cash grab. It's why we've always stated that the direction the franchise took was a business decision.

 

Now, please forgive me for this @Tricksie. I must say that I'm not surprised by Analyzer's responses to my last posts, but I now have a genuine dislike for this person. I've been nothing but cordial and respectful of her opinions and even went out of my way to make sure I addressed her by her correct gender. I'm a 39 year old man, by the way, with a healthy amount of life experience.

 

So, it was so nice to take quick peek at my favorite forum when I got to work tonight after a long day in the hospital with my mother, to find I've been thoroughly insulted by someone who doesn't personally know me simply because I have a differing opinion from hers.

 

Apparently, according to her, I post haphazardly and offer nothing but conjecture. That I don't have informed opinions, just wild ideas and conspiracies. 

 

Apparently, I also did not excel at reading and writing during all my years of schooling so my interpretation of the entirety of the manga must be wholly wrong.

 

However, what has truly put me out is that according to her I am a liar. Since I didn't source something for her in a timely manner, then I must be lying. That is an insult I do not overlook. 

 

You know Analyzer I never personally doubted who you say you are or the credentials you've given. I never stated you were absolutely wrong in our debates. But for you to think that everyone who has ever been in the industries you initially were in, have shared the same types of experiences you had, and all over the world mind you. Just goes to show how close minded and limited your thinking truly is. It is narcissistic, naïve and to be honest just plain ignorant. 

 

If you feel insulted, I don't care. You certainly didn't spare my feelings. This will be the last time I'll acknowledge you, let alone respond to you. Have a nice life. 

 

To the mods, I'll completely accept any form punishment you deem worthy for this post. I also apologize for once again taking us off topic. Goodnight.

Also, I'm going to take a guess you served or are currently serving in the United States Marine Corps based on your interests. If so, thank you for your service, sir. 

 

That alone deserves little more respect as far as I'm concerned, but I'm old fashioned in a world that's overrun with selfishness. 

[tricksie]

Nah you're ok BlackBird. This site is a refuge for NS fans. Definitely somewhere you can check in and know you're among friends. I feel the same as you. The level of arguing is definitely getting out of hand, but the mods are working on it. I'm sorry about your mom in the hospital. That's so hard. Sending good thoughts to you both....