31572 replies to this topic

[dl316bh]

Don't worry, most Gundam fans I know love G Gundam. It's only the diehard, "grrr. Gundam is a serious sci-fi military drama" blokes that crap on it. And those guys tend to be in the minority, often being shouted down for missing so much. Or completely butthurt after IBO's ending didn't give them what they wanted.

 

Wing is still garbage though.

 

I have fond memories of G, but it's one I've made a point to leave to memories. I watched some scenes on Youtube and they came across as silly. Plus, the animations pretty bleh. Which shoudln't bother me as much, because I like the original Mobile Suit Gundam, but there's something about it. The designs, maybe? I don't know. It sucks, because I still love the silly ass premise and it has the right amount of crazy nonsense I usually love.

 

Wing has aged so horribly, though, and was probably NEVER good if we're being honest. Style over substance. Operation Meteor is the rock stupidest plan I think I've ever seen in fiction. Wu-Fei is a top tier moron. I did love the Gundam designs, though - especially the Endless Waltz variants - and some of the other characters worked. The original show is pretty bad but I feel like you could probably make something really compelling out of it if you did a full remake of the series and cut out some of the unnecessary crap (Wing is about the same size as most long form Gundam anime, yet it feels like it has twice the chaff it could cut out of any other).

 

Anyway, I love the core Universal Century to bits, but I've also been a little leery of it these days; the series has been trying a little too hard to pull a "see it from the other side" in some of the UC entries and that makes me uncomfortable, honestly.

[RulesofNature]

I'm a UC guy myself, though I do love G/00/X (can tolerate AGE) and have some appreciation/Stockholm syndrome for IBO. That said, I really have reservations with what they've been doing lately. Like the Thunderbolt Manga is awesome, but the anime sacrifices the already thin story for action scenes. But my real problems go like this.

 

1) The cluttering of the OYW. Like they keep adding all these events and mobile suits to this period, almost afraid to move away from that. It doesn't really work the best for me, as it doesn't fit with original canon. Like the clothing styles and available tech is always based not on what they wore in the original series, but rather the time period in which it is made. Amuro works on newer computers and doesn't wear bell bottoms, and Origin just feels like straight up character-pandering fanfic.

 

Tomino himself has expressed his feelings on the matter. He wants Gundam to try new things, not rehash his works over and over. By recreating the tragedies of the UC in other timelines, it misses the mark (yeah, he's not the biggest fan of the 2000's era of Gundam). The point was the hope mankind could mature and not repeat the same mistakes.

 

2) The stuff they have made to expand the universe outside of the OYW... Unicorn in particular. Unicorn was alright, but it paled in comparison to Char's Counterattack imo. But the problem I really have is there's this deliberate attempt to specify how Newtypes works by Fukui in Uni and Narrative. They're taking away the mystery of the miracles, and the real kicker is that Newtypes don't matter. Even in Tomino's works, his later entries downplay their importance by focusing more on people communicating normally rather than sudden perfect understanding. And even in Zeta, there were times when that perfect understanding only served to make people hate each other more (Kamille and Haman, for instance). It misses the point of Newtypes to SEED-levels, and worse is that this is serving as the basis for the expansion.

 

I'm probably going to pick up Narrative if I see it at Walmart though, just to see. They did have Mazinger Z Infinity after all, so I have hope it will be stocked.

 

I'm pretty picking and choosing what I want to be canon at this point. To me, canon is the shows by Tomino, the 90's OVAs and G-Reco. Turn A is it's own timeline. Other than that, it's all alternate UC like the Zeta movies.

[HalfDemonInuyasha]

I'm a UC guy myself, though I do love G/00/X (can tolerate AGE) and have some appreciation/Stockholm syndrome for IBO. That said, I really have reservations with what they've been doing lately. Like the Thunderbolt Manga is awesome, but the anime sacrifices the already thin story for action scenes. But my real problems go like this.

 

1) The cluttering of the OYW. Like they keep adding all these events and mobile suits to this period, almost afraid to move away from that. It doesn't really work the best for me, as it doesn't fit with original canon. Like the clothing styles and available tech is always based not on what they wore in the original series, but rather the time period in which it is made. Amuro works on newer computers and doesn't wear bell bottoms, and Origin just feels like straight up character-pandering fanfic.

 

Tomino himself has expressed his feelings on the matter. He wants Gundam to try new things, not rehash his works over and over. By recreating the tragedies of the UC in other timelines, it misses the mark (yeah, he's not the biggest fan of the 2000's era of Gundam). The point was the hope mankind could mature and not repeat the same mistakes.

 

2) The stuff they have made to expand the universe outside of the OYW... Unicorn in particular. Unicorn was alright, but it paled in comparison to Char's Counterattack imo. But the problem I really have is there's this deliberate attempt to specify how Newtypes works by Fukui in Uni and Narrative. They're taking away the mystery of the miracles, and the real kicker is that Newtypes don't matter. Even in Tomino's works, his later entries downplay their importance by focusing more on people communicating normally rather than sudden perfect understanding. And even in Zeta, there were times when that perfect understanding only served to make people hate each other more (Kamille and Haman, for instance). It misses the point of Newtypes to SEED-levels, and worse is that this is serving as the basis for the expansion.

 

I'm probably going to pick up Narrative if I see it at Walmart though, just to see. They did have Mazinger Z Infinity after all, so I have hope it will be stocked.

 

I'm pretty picking and choosing what I want to be canon at this point. To me, canon is the shows by Tomino, the 90's OVAs and G-Reco. Turn A is it's own timeline. Other than that, it's all alternate UC like the Zeta movies.

I think it's said that Thunderbolt is it's own canon and not truly connected to Mobile Suit Gundam; probably because even they knew how messy it was and how it doesn't really fit, but I guess the manga and some of the concepts / designs were popular like the RX-78 Full Armor Gundam and the MS-06R Zaku II High Mobility Type "Psycho Zaku".

The earlier tie-ins were great, but the later stuff from, again, 2000s and such a bit less so.

They even gave a reasonable explanation for alternate designs of mobile suits in things. Like Mobile Suit Gundam 0080: War in the Pocket. Aside from the RX-78NT-1 Gundam "ALEX" and the MS-18E Kampfer - both original designs - pretty much every other mobile suit was originally just a redesign of existing mobile suits ala Gundam Wing: Endless Waltz to Gundam Wing. Soon after, the GMs became the GM Command / Command Space Type, GM Sniper Custom became the GM Sniper II, the Guncannons became the Guncannon Mass Production Type, the Gogg became the Hy-gogg, the Z'Gok became the Z'Gok-E, the Zaku II became the Zaku II Kai, the Rick Dom became the Rick Dom II, and the Gelgoog became the Gelgoog Jager, with the Federation onest being upgrades or variants while the Zeon stuff was turned into Zeon finally making sense in their designs and production with the United Maintenance Plan in order to upgrade and streamline designs for ease of production and pilot transitioning (WAY too late, of course)..

But if you just put in new stuff and say "it's just connected to (insert mobile suit here)", then it doesn't work nearly as well. SEED Destiny is especially infamous in my book.

With Unicorn, I also like it overall, but my biggest gripe with it really is that it still doesn't give any more of an explanation to the Psyco-frame or the phenomenon it can cause, even though it's far more center-stage there and is responsible for some of the most out-there Newtype magic since Zeta / ZZ with the bio-sensor (which itself STILL has no real explanation either). And yeah, Newtypes reached a high with ZZ and then just dropped in presence, with Victory only having a handful and only ever having one psycommu-equipped mobile suit with the Gengaozo late in the series.

With Gundam's 40th anniversary this year, there's also a few projects in the works, but I'm not sure what to think. The first one we'll be getting, IIRC, being an anime adaptation of the Mobile Suit Gundam: Hathaway's Flash novel. On one hand, I look forward to seeing the mobile suits in it animated, but on the other hand, Hathaway's Flash is completely non-canon as it only follows the novel version of Char's Counterattack, Beltorchika's Children, so it technically isn't going to add anything...

[RulesofNature]

The mangaka said Thunderbolt was an alternate UC because of some of his redesigns (like the GM having a core fighter), but I know people who will fight you tooth and nail if you say it's not canon. The old saying of "if it's animated, it's canon" is really being stretched nowadays through stuff like Origin though and it's retcons.

 

There was also the Narrative movie, which is a sorta spinoff of Unicorn featuring the third model (the Phenex). And it supposedly has a midoclorians-tier definition of how Newtypes work. Supposedly Fukui is linking it back to some old non-canon manga that says UC is the world after the Ideon rebooted humanity, though I haven't seen anything confirming this except Fukui spends a lot of time thinking about what Newtypes are. Then there's the Hathaway's Flash trilogy, Origin is being cut up into a TV series a la Unicorn 0093, G-Reco is getting a theatrical release, there's some shorts connecting different universes (Origin/G-Reco, IBO/00, Wing/Zeta, Unicorn/0073), another Build Divers series (ugh. As good as the first Build series was, let it die. It's all been downhill) and there's an IBO spinoff game app. Plus they're talking about doing more works to bridge the gap between Narrative and F91, as well as a Hollywood movie. And there's some 00 stage-thing with real live actors, as well as a new SD series.

 

.https://www.youtube....h?v=KjI8sOUeRNI

 

Except for maybe Hathaway, none of this really interests me (even though I love Reconguista and 00). And Hathaway is mostly because hopefully they'll release a MG Xi Gundam. Hell, I'd settle for a HG. It just feels like they're spinning their wheels right now, repeating what was already successful for it... and Build Divers for some reason.

Edited by RulesofNature, 24 February 2019 - 01:41 AM.

[Phantom_999]

I liked Wing personally (admittedly I did not see too many others) But when I rewatched it again I realized it was just... slow paced and the parts I liked most about it did not happen til the end which was all five pilots working together. And that was only for what, five episodes? Anyway don't mind me, Just saying I like Wing

Edited by Phantom_999, 24 February 2019 - 07:02 AM.

[HalfDemonInuyasha]

The mangaka said Thunderbolt was an alternate UC because of some of his redesigns (like the GM having a core fighter), but I know people who will fight you tooth and nail if you say it's not canon. The old saying of "if it's animated, it's canon" is really being stretched nowadays through stuff like Origin though and it's retcons.

 

There was also the Narrative movie, which is a sorta spinoff of Unicorn featuring the third model (the Phenex). And it supposedly has a midoclorians-tier definition of how Newtypes work. Supposedly Fukui is linking it back to some old non-canon manga that says UC is the world after the Ideon rebooted humanity, though I haven't seen anything confirming this except Fukui spends a lot of time thinking about what Newtypes are. Then there's the Hathaway's Flash trilogy, Origin is being cut up into a TV series a la Unicorn 0093, G-Reco is getting a theatrical release, there's some shorts connecting different universes (Origin/G-Reco, IBO/00, Wing/Zeta, Unicorn/0073), another Build Divers series (ugh. As good as the first Build series was, let it die. It's all been downhill) and there's an IBO spinoff game app. Plus they're talking about doing more works to bridge the gap between Narrative and F91, as well as a Hollywood movie. And there's some 00 stage-thing with real live actors, as well as a new SD series.

 

.https://www.youtube....h?v=KjI8sOUeRNI

 

Except for maybe Hathaway, none of this really interests me (even though I love Reconguista and 00). And Hathaway is mostly because hopefully they'll release a MG Xi Gundam. Hell, I'd settle for a HG. It just feels like they're spinning their wheels right now, repeating what was already successful for it... and Build Divers for some reason.

Yeah, and the Unicorn Gundam 03 Phenex being a more direct connection from the Universal Century to G-Reco, with the summary on MAHQ being...

"Long before the start of the Regild Century, Anaheim Electronics develops three full psychoframe mobile suits for the Earth Federation Forces in the Universal Century era. One of these suits is the RX-0 Unicorn Gundam 03 Phenex, which goes missing during combat in UC 0095. The RX-0 units employ psychoframes throughout their entire frame and the Newtype Destroyer (NT-D) System for increased performance against Newtypes. In RC 1014, the Capital Army discovers the plans for the Phenex within the technical archives of the Rose of Hermes blueprints. They construct a replica of the Phenex, designated as the CAMS-RX0 Unicorn Gundam 03 Phenex type RC. Whereas the original Phenex is colored gold with a glowing blue psychoframe, the type RC is colored metallic gray with a glowing red psychoframe. The type RC is assigned to Mask (aka Luin Lee), who attacks Bellri Zenam's YG-111+BPAM-02 Gundam G-Self (Space Backpack) and Aida Surugan's MSAM-033 Gundam G-Arcane. After a tough battle in the area outside the space colony Towasanga, Bellri is able to defeat Mask."

...though I think only the MSG / UC, and The Origin / G-Reco make the most sense. For the others, I'd see F91 or Victory make more sense with Wing, and SEED / SEED Destiny with 00, lol.

[RulesofNature]

...though I think only the MSG / UC, and The Origin / G-Reco make the most sense. For the others, I'd see F91 or Victory make more sense with Wing, and SEED / SEED Destiny with 00, lol.

 

MSG/UC = Unicorn is pretty popular among casuals, so it makes sense to try and link them together. Kinda like how they tried to push  "Kira is just like Amuro" before the backlash against Destiny set in, with Kira being called out on being a naive, selt-righteous, hypocritical and a war monger in his own right in crossovers. Origin/G-Reco = Alpha and Omega of the UC timeline before the Moonlight Butterfly. Also, Char and Bellri can have a long debate about lolis vs. older sisters. Wing/Zeta =  Kamille is a terrorist who learns to keep his emotions in check, Heero is a terrorist who regains his emotions. 00/IBO = It's post Awakening Setsuna offering Mika, the flower that represents peace in his timeline. But Mika, in the 4th opening, is represented by the Japanese spider lily, a poisonous flower used to protect the dead from animals that is sometimes referred to as the hell flower.\

 

If anything MSG/UC is the weakest link in my opinion. But there is something interesting here, something that should give the pro-enders cause for concern. See the lack of SEED in all this stuff about the 40th? You know, despite SEED being incredibly popular back in it's heyday? Well, here's the deal. SEED wasn't beloved by the hardcore Gundam fanbase back then. and the Kira-wanking in Destiny only made matters worse. Gunpla, the franchise's main source of income, dropped 36% for Destiny because Gundam fans weren't supporting SEED while SEED fans didn't buy Gunpla. This is why they killed the Cosmic Era, and 00 was meant to win back Gundam fans as well as find non-SEED fans. 00 managed to outsell the Cosmic Era in terms of HG model kits according to old marketing materials for AGE.

 

Throw in the fact that Unicorn is now the Gundam for casuals, and you get why SEED isn't present.

 

Boruto has to compete against the likes of Black Clover and My Hero Academia in order to be one of the big shonen titles now, because those are the ones casual audiences are going for now. And the fan backlash has undoubtedly hurt Naruto's sales. I mean, the manga is the main source of the franchise's income and it has plummeted. What was it, 2 million copies of a volume sold their first week at the series' peak vs selling under 100k now? The name means nothing if future stories retroactively taint the old ones. It happened to something as big as SEED, so just because people are supporting the ending doesn't mean that the execs are happy with how things have played out.

[TheFirstEvil100]

 

MSG/UC = Unicorn is pretty popular among casuals, so it makes sense to try and link them together. Kinda like how they tried to push  "Kira is just like Amuro" before the backlash against Destiny set in, with Kira being called out on being a naive, selt-righteous, hypocritical and a war monger in his own right in crossovers. Origin/G-Reco = Alpha and Omega of the UC timeline before the Moonlight Butterfly. Also, Char and Bellri can have a long debate about lolis vs. older sisters. Wing/Zeta =  Kamille is a terrorist who learns to keep his emotions in check, Heero is a terrorist who regains his emotions. 00/IBO = It's post Awakening Setsuna offering Mika, the flower that represents peace in his timeline. But Mika, in the 4th opening, is represented by the Japanese spider lily, a poisonous flower used to protect the dead from animals that is sometimes referred to as the hell flower.\

 

If anything MSG/UC is the weakest link in my opinion. But there is something interesting here, something that should give the pro-enders cause for concern. See the lack of SEED in all this stuff about the 40th? You know, despite SEED being incredibly popular back in it's heyday? Well, here's the deal. SEED wasn't beloved by the hardcore Gundam fanbase back then. and the Kira-wanking in Destiny only made matters worse. Gunpla, the franchise's main source of income, dropped 36% for Destiny because Gundam fans weren't supporting SEED while SEED fans didn't buy Gunpla. This is why they killed the Cosmic Era, and 00 was meant to win back Gundam fans as well as find non-SEED fans. 00 managed to outsell the Cosmic Era in terms of HG model kits according to old marketing materials for AGE.

 

Throw in the fact that Unicorn is now the Gundam for casuals, and you get why SEED isn't present.

 

Boruto has to compete against the likes of Black Clover and My Hero Academia in order to be one of the big shonen titles now, because those are the ones casual audiences are going for now. And the fan backlash has undoubtedly hurt Naruto's sales. I mean, the manga is the main source of the franchise's income and it has plummeted. What was it, 2 million copies of a volume sold their first week at the series' peak vs selling under 100k now? The name means nothing if future stories retroactively taint the old ones. It happened to something as big as SEED, so just because people are supporting the ending doesn't mean that the execs are happy with how things have played out.

The thing is they will never change anything they will keep going on with Boruto because it means they have to admit they kittened up and pushed NH and SS because of them being biased towards Hinata, and we know that's not going to happen.

 

With SEED, I enjoyed it more than SEED Destiny as I saw big problems with it, I think this was all because of the creator hating America hence why ZAFT were portrayed more, as the good guys and the side the cheer for too.

[RulesofNature]

The thing is they will never change anything they will keep going on with Boruto because it means they have to admit they kittened up and pushed NH and SS because of them being biased towards Hinata, and we know that's not going to happen.

 

With SEED, I enjoyed it more than SEED Destiny as I saw big problems with it, I think this was all because of the creator hating America hence why ZAFT were portrayed more, as the good guys and the side the cheer for too.

 

I'm feeling bad because of how I ended up derailing this thread with Gundam talk, but I can bring this back around to being on topic.

 

With the Cosmic Era, it wasn't the creator hating America. That wasn't the issue, as there are parallels to Kira and the Bush administration. Gets attack, goes off and provokes people they believe are in the wrong, talks about defending their country and spreading it's ideals to the world after overthrowing Durandal, and invoking the names of Freedom and Justice. Hell, they use Infinite Justice which is a very loaded political term that Bush got international criticism over his administrations early designs on naming the war on terror after it (basically, it means "we can do whatever we want in the name of justice, as the enemies are that evil." Islamic scholars accuse it of putting oneself on the same level as God). So it is just kinda iffy that Fukuda was trying to be anti-Bush, and if he was it's just one more case of Destiny being hypocritical.

 

The problem is Fukuda is an idiot. This is a guy who said that SEED wasn't about being anti-war, it was just an anime. This is a guy who flat out admits to doing stuff he thinks is cool no matter the rhyme or reason. As a producer for Cross Ange, he pushed for his nonsensical revivals and justified it on twitter with "the audience doesn't care how people survive, just that they do." And then there was his talks about how SEED was meant to bring Gundam back to it's roots, but then listed off older super robot shows as inspiration with the claim that kids think those are the coolest. Not to mention how he would make changes based on what Bandai and the producers wanted. It wasn't his idea to have pacifistic themes or genetic engineering, and Dearka changed sides because the Buster wasn't selling.

 

The problem is with old Super Robot shows, there was a patriotic subtext. Japan is this wonderous country, and the youth end up defending it in a giant robot against evil invaders. Considering how Japan lost WWII and it's attitude afterwards, playing the victim all the while, it's not hard to see how this attitude became problematic. So we have Kira, whose family name reflects the dominant Japanese ethnicity, piloting super powerful machines in the name of Orb. Orb is Fukuda's idealized version of Japan, said so himself. And Kira is given the Freedom to do so in such a way that calls to mind the scientist grandpa entrusting the super robot. And of course, he saves the world and is awesome doing it.

 

So this is why I don't believe SEED intentionally anti-American, it's just the creator doesn't understand the subtext of what he was emulating and how Gundam was a challenge to it. And it was this stupidity that ultimately killed the Cosmic Era, despite the talks of it being the new UC, as well as the careers of him and his wife.

 

Who, btw, did not have brain cancer. That was just an excuse people made up. She died of a leaking heart valve, and around the time of Destiny had cysts on her ovaries which are treatable with surgery.

 

Now, Fukuda did supposedly once say that Kira and co. strayed from the path of Justice with how they force people to follow what they say. If he truly meant that, one would have assumed that there would have been some minor changes to the HD remaster to address it. But alas, instead we got more retcons to the Strike Freedom (now it can separate it's DRAGOONS so it can use it's super wings in the atmosphere, and those wings were already a retcon of it's propulsion system) and the scene with him in the Strike being redone to be more impressive (whereas before, a common complaint about Kira is he relies on the power of his machine and isn't that good of a pilot). It's almost SP-like in it's worship of this character. And again, Gundam did address Kira's behavior in crossover games where he was called out but alas very few nowadays want to touch Destiny's plot.

 

But really, this is pretty much the same as Kishi. Kishi said that he didn't put thought into how Naruto should act, and just wrote him as how a typical shonen hero would act. Meanwhile, he put a lot more effort into giving the antagonists a reason to do what they did. This has led to massive cries of tone-deafness in light of the ending, as Kishi failed to see how much of a problem the ninja system actually was and how scummy Naruto became for championing it. Not to mention how he changed stuff at editor's/SP's requests.

[KClaws_2]

Eh, feels refreshing to talk about something else (though I suppose we COULD make a Gundam thread).

 

I really can't hate Wing, if ONLY because it was the one show that opened me to the world of anime (I was already into DragonballZ, but I didn't have the urge to explore; what can I say, I was 15 at the time). At first, Wing BLEW MY MIND. So you can imagine my surprise when exploring Gundam fansites, Wing was CONSISTENTLY named as the worst series (at this time the latest one was Turn A).

 

Anyway, I eventually explored other Gundam series, and upon watching some of Wing again...it really doesn't hold up. Inconsistent damage (grunt pilots a Mobile Suit, it gets blown to smithereens. Gundam pilot uses same mobile suit, can take a beating for a bit), sometimes overly philosophical, quite a few plotholes, vague origin of the Gundams, and even then I thought Wufei was a complete kitten.

I'd say it definitely picks up in the 2nd half, but then again I think most Gundam series' really shine in their second halves.

The exception being Seed Destiny. I personally thought the first half was awesome, but by the 2nd half it CRASHED AND BURNED.

 

In fact, with Seed Destiny, my experience with that series is eerily similar to mine with Naruto. Both started out promising, if you're invested you're convinced all the plot points are going somewhere, but by the end they just fall flat on their faces and betray what they were promising in the first place. I and many other fans never wanted to see another Gundam series at the time, but I think 00 brought many back ( I still remember the Jesus Yamato vs Allah F Seiei memes). Whether the Naruto franchise can do such a thing for me, well, I'm waiting. Not getting my hopes up though.

 

As Rules mentioned, both Fudaka and Kishimoto didn't have a strong sense of where they wanted to take their respective series and only added in certain elements because they thought they were popular genre tropes without understanding how to properly use them. The similarities are really astonishing. I also heard because his wife was the chief writer, Fudaka often gave her breaks and that's why the Cosmic Era has so many clip show episodes (on MAHQ he's called "Clip'em All" Fudaka as opposed to "Kill'em All" Tomino). If the illness was the factor that got in the way, then I do sympathize with them, but at that point Fudaka should have gotten a writer in better health. Also heard his wife was a big fan of KiraXLacus, and that's why they became a GaryStuXMarySue couple as time went on.

 

If only Kishimoto's wife had that same power over him.

 

Lesson that should be taken from both of these is that you NEVER create a story based on popular tropes; you make what you think is a good story THEN you add any tropes that you think will suit your needs. Do it like the two above and in the end it's going to derail everything.

[RulesofNature]

Destiny's infamous use of clip shows, recycling of animation and stock footage comes from the fact that it was far behind schedule. See, this is how TV in Japan works. You're effectively renting the timeslot in order to air your show from the broadcaster, and have a requirement to fill it up. If you fail to do so for whatever reason, you lose it. Since episodes are completed only a couple of weeks before airing., they'll do whatever they can to not fall behind schedule. Not to mention, it looks bad on the part of the director for failing to properly manage the show. This may be a reason why we don't see shows air 50 episodes continuously anymore, alongside changing business models and Japan's economy.

 

Destiny abused this and even in Japan it was considered a joke before the HD Remaster (but is still considered a joke, especially Athrun memes). Fukuda talked about this on twitter after his wife died, saying that he often butted heads with producers. One side wanted the show to stay on schedule, the other was fighting for better quality. Granted, Fukuda never specified which side he was on but either way he didn't realize how bad it looks on his part. If he was arguing for quality, than he failed and caused the show to go behind schedule. If he was arguing for schedule, than he didn't care about the quality of his show. He also defended his wife's writing, saying she could get a script out in a single day when properly inspired and that at times her scripts were accepted without revision. For those who don't know, most episode scripts go through 3-4 versions to iron out the details.

 

Not to mention some members of staff weren't happy with the scripts. One animation director posted on his blog (said post was removed, but it was something referenced on Morosawa's wikipedia page) said that while he liked Fukuda's "pitiful" production, that if Morosawa couldn't write than she shouldn't. That the story wasn't drawing people in, people did not get the feelings behind the love story, that she couldn't maintain tone or atmosphere, and that scripts were written to reuse scenes. We have Kenichi Suzumura, Shinn's VA, saying that Shinn's development was derailed and he did not end up the way he was originally supposed to. Shinn in early promos was called the hero, but then he was turned into the villain because he opposed Kira.

 

Destiny, like Naruto, shows that it doesn't matter how big you were. If you screw up big enough, fans will take offense. The worst SEED haters I know were, once upon a time, diehard SEED fans before Destiny. Now, SEED has an anti-fandom.

 

PS: I really get the impression 00 was meant to tackle Destiny's views by proxy. S1 is showing a far less idealized version of Kira and co.'s actions, the fact it's often called a deconstruction of Gundam shows how off they were from the rest of the franchise. S2 has the subtext of taking control of Gundam away from the genetically engineered clone of E.A. Ray and returning Gundam to the ideals of it's bald creator. The movie is a CCA-level Newtype miracle, completing 00's attempt to reconstruct Gundam for the modern age.

[James S Cassidy]

This is a guy who flat out admits to doing stuff he thinks is cool no matter the rhyme or reason. As a producer for Cross Ange, he pushed for his nonsensical revivals and justified it on twitter with "the audience doesn't care how people survive, just that they do."

This part struck a cord with me because it seems like this is all what anyone does in their stories nowadays. Instead of writing a story that makes sense from cause to effect, they instead just do things that they think will give them browning points with the fandoms.

This is what it feels like with RWBY nowadays. They just keep changing stuff and ruining characters for the sake of "because the fans wanted it that way." "The audience doesn't care how Blake and Yang end up together so long as they do. Hell, we will change Yang's entire personality and retcon her story if we need to."

Naruto, RWBY, Gundam series, Dragonball Super, and more....it is less about telling a story and more about showing an agenda, get fan praise, and making it look pretty. Now even Marvel and DC are doing it.

Where the hell did these writers come from?

[HalfDemonInuyasha]

Went and made a Gundam topic to continue...

http://www.narusaku....showtopic=16489

[NaruSaku fan in Kentucky]

You know what's a better ninja anime than Burruto? That South Park anime parody episode because one it's actually funny and two the characters are better and three Cartman>>>>Bolt.

[James S Cassidy]

You know what's a better ninja anime than Burruto? That South Park anime parody episode because one it's actually funny and two the characters are better and three Cartman>>>>Bolt.

LET'S FIGHTING LOVE!!!


 

[NaruSaku fan in Kentucky]

LET'S FIGHTING LOVE!!!


 

I would love to see what Cartman would do to Bolt.

[Yyubie]

You know what's a better ninja anime than Burruto? That South Park anime parody episode because one it's actually funny and two the characters are better and three Cartman>>>>Bolt.

 

Still better than boruto.

[Derock]

LET'S FIGHTING LOVE!!!


 

 

WTF? They didn't kill Kenny?!

[James S Cassidy]

 

WTF? They didn't kill Kenny?!

It was one of those seasons where killing Kenny was getting old hat so they left him alone for a while.

[Derock]

It was one of those seasons where killing Kenny was getting old hat so they left him alone for a while.

 

It surprised me. The joke was getting old anyway because they kept reviving him every, single episode.