31566 replies to this topic

[rocci]

Sasuke is never and will never be a hero. The word sasuke and hero should never said in the same sentence.

Hero in this case is "shonen protagonist". Shonen protagonist usually synonym with hero.

[T XD]

Sasuke isn't a villain nor an antagonist.

 

Not a villain cause Sasuke's actions weren't important to the plot. He was in the plot, but his motives weren't important to the plot.

 

He was an antagonist when he opposed Naruto's path at some point in the war. It lived for a short time, but didn't last long cause his opposition of Naruto's beliefs wasn't talked about anymore.

 

A lot of switches was done to Sasuke till it ended up with : " I'm going to make him good again and bring him back by battling ".

 

Everything that was told about Sasuke and what was talked between Naruto and Sasuke were thrown in trash. No clan, no system, no beliefs. Just make the final fight that Naruto told Sasuke about.

[VanitasDS76491]

Hero in this case is "shonen protagonist". Shonen protagonist usually synonym with hero.

Still he is the worse ever, even if you call him a Shonen protagonist, he is very generic and just a lame version of vegeta and hiei.

[Catra]

hated the little dirt bag since the beginning back in 05. what a arrogant self centered pretentious teeny bopper. there are some former naruto fans who dropped him and the series all together simply because it ended and moved on to the next cool thing because, yes there are people like that.

[VanitasDS76491]

hated the little dirt bag since the beginning back in 05. what a arrogant self centered pretentious teeny bopper. there are some former naruto fans who dropped him and the series all together simply because it ended and moved on to the next cool thing because, yes there are people like that.

I tolerated him in the beginning but that changed when he and naruto fought at the hospital and it got worse from like Kakashi's poor attempt to make him give up on revenge and he hit awful during the end fight in pt.1 with him freaking out that naruto had no one from the beginning so he doesn't know about what sasuke has gone through even though naruto suffered more than sasuke,especially after kushina telling naruto the truth about naruto's birth. And i've hated this asswipe since then and I hoped he died back it the valley of the end when Naruto when one tailed cloak that punch should have killed him, after that I hoped he died to deidara but no he ass pulls his way to escape and then the final straw was the kage summit he should have died from the raikages liartat.

[Catra]

don't forget his smug line "I'm more special than you!"

[VanitasDS76491]

don't forget his smug line "I'm more special than you!"

Thank you I try to forget that but Ya that line made me want break his kittening neck. Plus his smug face and actions didn't help as well especially he's smug laugh. He is not that special compared to Naruto.

[Aevrum]

A bit off-topic, it came up to me just now and I seriously can't remember it:

Why was Jiraiya again not able to do something against Sasuke's curse mark?
I'm too lazy to look it up myself^^

[VanitasDS76491]

A bit off-topic, it came up to me just now and I seriously can't remember it:
Why was Jiraiya again not able to do something against Sasuke's curse mark?
I'm too lazy to look it up myself^^

I think they assumed that it was under control once Kakashi sealed it and left it alone. Though that would be the smart thing have jiraya deal with the curse mark and get rid of it instead of sealing it away.

[sushi.]

don't forget his smug line "I'm more special than you!"

lol when did he say that? Can't recall.

[Nostradamus]

 

I definitely recall that he tried to murder his friends like a lot... I mean a lot.

 

He treats Sakura like garbage during part 2 while Naruto selflessly goes through hell to bring him back for her and the jerk is the one gets her.

 

He makes megalomaniacal speeches about screwing the world around, innocent people, and talking about revolution.

 

He's neither a villain or an antagonist... He is just an kitten that thinks only about himself and that the world resolves around him and nothing more. He is no different than Kira except that the creators were aware that he was as they said in Bakuman while creating a manga that is clearly similar to death note "heartless, crazy, insane, intelligent but ignorant, and uses his powers for evil"

You are 100% correct. He did indeed tried to murder his "friends" (Kishi really doesn't know a friend is), but he never did it because that's what he wanted to do. This is hard to explain, because Sasuke is a mess of a character. In the beginning he just wants to do his own stuff, then Naruto becomes obsessed with him for no reason (a recurring theme in this manga, people being obsessed over one another for no freaking reason), then Sasuke still wants to be left alone, then Naruto can't accept that (the time they had their fight at the end of part 1), so Sasuke becomes sort of a villain, then he goes back to wanting to left alone.

 

Then once again Naruto chases after him, which causes Sasuke to engage villain mode, then he turns it off. He's finally able to do what he wants, then decides one his own to become a villain.

Then plot on jutsu happens and he meets Itachi, so he sort of becomes an anti-hero, then he meets Naruto again and he turns into the antagonist in the very end. And then turns into whatever the bloody hell he turns into in the end.

He can be categorized in all those descriptions, while being none of them.

 

What I'm getting at is that he's such a mess of a character that it makes it impossible for us fit him in either a villain, or anti-hero, or antagonist. He's just a flip-flop character that changes based on what's happening in that moment. Basically he's whatever the plot needs him to do.

[VanitasDS76491]

lol when did he say that? Can't recall.

When he first when stage 2 curse mark.

[VanitasDS76491]

You are 100% correct. He did indeed tried to murder his "friends" (Kishi really doesn't know a friend is), but he never did it because that's what he wanted to do. This is hard to explain, because Sasuke is a mess of a character. In the beginning he just wants to do his own stuff, then Naruto becomes obsessed with him for no reason (a recurring theme in this manga, people being obsessed over one another for no freaking reason), then Sasuke still wants to be left alone, then Naruto can't accept that (the time they had their fight at the end of part 1), so Sasuke becomes sort of a villain, then he goes back to wanting to left alone.
 
Then once again Naruto chases after him, which causes Sasuke to engage villain mode, then he turns it off. He's finally able to do what he wants, then decides one his own to become a villain.
Then plot on jutsu happens and he meets Itachi, so he sort of becomes an anti-hero, then he meets Naruto again and he turns into the antagonist in the very end. And then turns into whatever the bloody hell he turns into in the end.
He can be categorized in all those descriptions, while being none of them.
 
What I'm getting at is that he's such a mess of a character that it makes it impossible for us fit him in either a villain, or anti-hero, or antagonist. He's just a flip-flop character that changes based on what's happening in that moment. Basically he's whatever the plot needs him to do.

Can we even call him a character at this point. Plus it seems naruto just made everything worse when it came to sasuke which he totally did. So sasuke is a can of worms character.

[totherpage95]

don't forget his smug line "I'm more special than you!"

well if you watch the lego movie we are all the special

[Bail o' Lies]

A bit off-topic, it came up to me just now and I seriously can't remember it:

Why was Jiraiya again not able to do something against Sasuke's curse mark?
I'm too lazy to look it up myself^^

Jiraiya was never asked.

 

Kakashi set up a seal after the second exam that was suppose to block it, so he can continue to participate in the third round so he could be shown off to all those big wigs. So for the time they just needed a quick patch job that kept the curse seal from activating. After the end of the third exam The Third once he had time probably would have checked on it like he did with Anko.

 

Also Jiraiya wanted to keep on the down low during the exam as seen with asking closest pervert not to tell anyone, and Ibiki surprise at his appearance. Then after the Third's death he set off to find Tsunade, while both Kakashi and Sasuke were knocked out. When he came back Sasuke was already going off the deep end, but Kakashi asked to let him handle it while Jiraiya took care of Naruto.

Edited by Bail o' Lies, 17 April 2017 - 12:57 AM.

[Aevrum]

Jiraiya was never asked.
 
Kakashi set up a seal after the second exam that was suppose to block it, so he can continue to participate in the third round so he could be shown off to all those big wigs. So for the time they just needed a quick patch job that kept the curse seal from activating. After the end of the third exam The Third once he had time probably would have checked on it like he did with Anko.
 
Also Jiraiya wanted to keep on the down low during the exam as seen with asking closest pervert not to tell anyone, and Ibiki surprise at his appearance. Then after the Third's death he set off to find Tsunade, while both Kakashi and Sasuke were knocked out. When he came back Sasuke was already going off the deep end, but Kakashi asked to let him handle it while Jiraiya took care of Naruto.

Okay, thanks, then I actually DID remember correctly that Jiraiya wasn't really bothered by the mark.

Honestly, I think Jiraiya's and the other's behaviour makes no sense.

He knows pretty early on about Sasuke's seal, has this backstory with Orochimaru AND knows about Itachi, it's ridiculous that he ignores it and let's the others handle it.

He had several times the possibility to do something and with his seal skills he would have been able to counter it, but it looks like they just needed Sasuke to keep the mark :(

Then after his defection that talk with Naruto, to make him give up on Sasuke? That just makes him look hypocritical.
Ignoring the writer's influence, it looks like the characters always wanted to manipulate Sasuke and Naruto into everything that happened.

Edited by Aevrum, 17 April 2017 - 01:21 AM.

[VanitasDS76491]

Okay, thanks, then I actually DID remember correctly that Jiraiya wasn't really bothered by the mark.
Honestly, I think Jiraiya's and the other's behaviour makes no sense.
He knows pretty early on about Sasuke's seal, has this backstory with Orochimaru AND knows about Itachi, it's ridiculous that he ignores it and let's the others handle it.
He had several times the possibility to do something and with his seal skills he would have been able to counter it, but it looks like they just needed Sasuke to keep the mark :(
Then after his defection that talk with Naruto, to make him give up on Sasuke? That just makes him look hypocritical.
Ignoring the writer's influence, it looks like the characters always wanted to manipulate Sasuke and Naruto into everything that happened.

Like I said everyone in naruto is an idiot. It's stuff like this that make me appreciate the characters in John carpenter's the thing movie from 1982 cause this might shock you guys, no one was stupid in that movie.

[sushi.]

well if you watch the lego movie we are all the special

[BlueStarSaber]

how can sakura even add a "-kun" after sasuke's name after that? habbit or just kishi keeping the hook on the fans?

 

I think its just her being polite as I don't think kun is often used in romantic terms 

[Bail o' Lies]

Okay, thanks, then I actually DID remember correctly that Jiraiya wasn't really bothered by the mark.

Honestly, I think Jiraiya's and the other's behaviour makes no sense.

He knows pretty early on about Sasuke's seal, has this backstory with Orochimaru AND knows about Itachi, it's ridiculous that he ignores it and let's the others handle it.

He had several times the possibility to do something and with his seal skills he would have been able to counter it, but it looks like they just needed Sasuke to keep the mark :(

Then after his defection that talk with Naruto, to make him give up on Sasuke? That just makes him look hypocritical.
Ignoring the writer's influence, it looks like the characters always wanted to manipulate Sasuke and Naruto into everything that happened.

No. He didn't meet Sasuke until the fight with Itachi at the hotel. During which he was already on mission to find Tsunade. By the time he returned Sasuke was already going off the deep end. Even if he decided that Orochimaru's curse seal was a danger and he should put  his own seal on it. Putting a better seal on wouldn't have help by that point other then making the odd in the battle between Naruto and Sasuke more in Naruto's favor. Which he couldn't have known at the time. Sasuke was Kakashi's student Jiraiya felt it was Kakashi's job to take care of him. Which is why he informed Kakashi that he was taking on Naruto as his disciple and then after the time skip told Kakashi that Naruto was his again. It's also why he was the one to have a talk with Naruto about giving up on Sasuke because at the time Naruto was his student and he was giving the advice he felt his student should hear.