NarutoxSakuraFan4Life

Okay, okay. if SP steps up makes an alternate ending for NaruSaku, I will be (even if it's a little) pleased. Then the nh/ss can have their cruddy ending and the NS/SK fans can have their ending. I may even re-watch the anime if they change the ending in the anime, forget the manga man. I'd only consider the anime canon. 

Here's a bigger question.... Why is this series even continuing? Why should Bolt end up with anyone? BUT if he does end up with anyone it should be with a girl that loves him,  even though he doesn't have romantic feelings for her. Then afterwords, they should make a movie about Bolt being put into a genjutsu to be guilt tripped into falling in love with her for she loves him sooooo much. Oh wait... that's been done already hasn't it? 

Honestly I dont think he sold out, i just think he gave up. Somewhere along the line he lost faith in his story or just lost faith in himself as a mangaka and threw in the towel. He let the studio and the company drive his story and we ended up with the atrocity we got.

 

 

Same as @catsi563. I don't think he sold out. Just gave up and stopped caring.

 

If this is true, that's pretty devastating. He should have taken a hiatus on Naruto and cleared his mind, instead of letting someone mess up 15 years of work. I don't know it's almost been a year and still can't get over how cruddy the ending was, not just because of NS, but because how Naruto drastically changed. How Sakura who was my role model (yeah I know she wasn't real, but still) turned into a fangirl once again. 

The problem is Sasuke actually started forgetting about revenge. Like 99% FORGOT. When Itachi showed up and beat some sense into Sasuke, he SUDDENLY realized: "Whoa, friends distract you from your true goal," and degressed back to his revenge-driven state.

 

If that never happened, and if factors that drove Sasuke into defected the village NEVER happened, he'd still have revenge on his mind but once Team 7 happens, he won't be AS revenge-driven (this was canon) and he would have continued being a more comrade-person if Itachi/Orochimaru didn't try to brainwash him.

 

If that happened, I can't imagine Sasuke remaining COLD like you claim. He's already begun opening up to Naruto (and inveratably Sakura.)

 

 

 

 

if THIS was the Sasuke that remained in Konoha, he's obviously going to open up to Naruto and Sakura. If this guy opens up, how can NaruSaku still happen?

Also with Sakura being the ONLY girl he's close to, and his plans to still restore the Uchiha, he's going to want Sakura. In that case how can Naruto stand a chance? 

 

Most of your posts are on Sakura realizing Sasuke doesn't recooperate her feelings at all but if he did, how can Sakura still choose Naruto?

 

Would Sakura have matured as she grows, and stopped being so clingy to Sasuke? Close to both Naruto and Sasuke, who finally acknowledges her since she's matured and he considers her a comrade (during the Gaara fight,) but Sakura would realize there are traits in Naruto she likes more than the traits in Sasuke. Ex: She thinks Sasuke is cool/hot, but she has more FUN with Naruto because Naruto pulls pranks and is goofy, she also finds herself interacting with Naruto more than Sasuke (since she scolds Naruto and Sasuke is always doing his own thing even though they're still close like Team 7.)  I was thinking along the lines of that.

 

BUT the truth about the forehead scene coming out is very important.

 

You have a point, there. He did briefly forget about revenge, I forgot he forgot about revenge honestly, it's been so long since I read the beginning. But, if we are following the same storyline, Itachi would eventually show up, and get into Sasuke's head and that would cause Sasuke to close everyone out again. Just saying. 

 

Okay, so what you're saying is that if Sasuke opens up with Naruto and Sakura (and stays that way) he can't JUST be friends with Sakura like he is with Naruto? I have many guy friends that have opened up to me, and I have been nothing more than friends/acquaintances with them. Opening up to someone does not mean they are bound to fall for you. Love is more complex then that. 

 

Yeah, Sakura is the only girl he's close to but, if Sasuke becomes more open (and remains to be open as you say) to Naruto and Sakura, wouldn't that mean that he becomes more open to everyone else? Or would he just shut everyone else out? Which would make no sense at all...? Does that mean does that mean Ino has zero chance with Sasuke, still? 

 

As for Sasuke "choosing to be" with Sakura because he's "close to her and needs to revive his clan"? That would be pretty dang shallow and selfish. I can't even imagine how hurt Sakura would be if Sasuke flat out told her, "I'm only going to sleep with you because I want to restore my clan. It's not because I love you."  (Also if Sasuke is open, wouldn't he let Naruto know this? Do you think Naruto would stand by and let it happen? Sasuke is his best friend, but he loves Sakura. He would not let Sasuke just use Sakura like that, especially since he knows how she feels about him.) 

 

So honestly, if Sasuke wanted to get with Sakura just to restore his clan, that gives Naruto an even better shot. It not only makes Naruto look better, it would make Sakura realize a few things. (Or maybe not, because here she is with Sasuke today and she has a kid with him, but yet they haven't kissed.... and Sasuke isn't even there with them... what even...?) 

 

Well if he did feel the same way, then ss would be canon (again) but much healthier. I would probably tolerate it more personally if Sasuke reciprocated Sakura's feelings. I don't imagine she would choose Naruto then. I mean. unless if Sasuke and Sakura dated and found out they weren't as right for each other as they thought.  I don't know. Why would you ask that question if you pretty much know the answer? 

 

I noticed that she isn't as clingy to Sasuke as time went on. Like at the chunin exams (after Orochimaru attacked and she vowed to get stronger) she wasn't constantly up in his face, like she as. She showed her concern but she was constantly fangirling and trying to get his attention. She was also warming up to Naruto so Sasuke wasn't the only person she thought of 24/7. So, there is a 75% to 80% chance she would have still matured. Especially since she would still meet Tsunade and would train with her. 

 

But yeah, the bench/forehead scene and the truth coming out is what it all boils down to. As I said before, I think that one moment in Sakura's life was what triggered off how she fell for Sasuke. 

nH was never easy to swallow in the first place. It was a ship that was constantly forced down my throat at least...

 

But anyway, if The Last aka The Hinata movie, hadn't come out there would have been a HUGE plot hole. And Kishimoto didn't want that, I mean after all he wanted his mess of the an ending make some sort of sense. Not to mention, nH would have been known as the most underdeveloped pairing in the history of underdeveloped pairings. 

Alright, I figure... if Sasuke hadn't left, Naruto would still have a chance, even if it were a slim chance. 
 
Here's how I figure, Sasuke has never had a speck of romantic interest in Sakura; He didn't want to learn anything about her, he didn't really want to spend time with her - he didn't go chasing after her when they were home off of missions, and he didn't display any signs of liking her. (Except the bench scene which was actually Naruto as we all know.) Even when Sakura shows Sasuke kindness, he disowns it and is cold towards her. 
 
As for Sakura, she knows absolutely nothing about Sasuke (and still doesn't know a thing about him might I add), other than his clan was killed, he's out to avenge his clan, he wants to kill his brother, and he wants to get stronger to kill his brother. That's it. Sasuke had zero interest in telling her about himself any further. So that made me wonder,how does she love him even? It went a simple, fangirl crush to love in the matter of months. I think what really evolved Sakura's crush into "love" was the bench/forehead. It was the first time Sasuke (which again was Naruto) had shown any interest in her. 
 
......
 
But you know, now, really thinking about it, if Sasuke hadn't left, it may have given Naruto more than just a slim chance. 
 
I figure, Sakura would be around Sasuke more (probably not A LOT but still) if he had stayed in the village. She would really learn what kind of person he exactly. Within those two years, I imagine she would have taken off her rose colored glasses, and get the message (okay, maybe) that Sasuke is not interested her romantically, (unless if Sasuke changed dramatically). That or Sasuke would finally just tell her straight out that he's not interested. 
 
She would probably ask him about the bench moment too, (which I believe is her primary source of her love for him) but of course Sasuke wouldn't know what in the world she's talking about. 
 
Just extra tidbit - If you want to go further with it - distance makes the heart grow fonder - Naruto would still leave to train with Jiraya, right? She wouldn't see him for 2 years, so I imagine she would think about Naruto more often because he's gone. I imagine she would miss him too, because when Naruto left, Sakura didn't not like him. Taking this another step further, even if Sasuke was there, I doubt he and Sakura would spend a tremendous amount of time together (if any at all), because as I said before, Sasuke never pursued in seeing Sakura outside of missions. Even if Sakura did pursue in seeing Sasuke, he would run off somewhere, leaving her alone. 
 
So, in a word what I'm trying to say is, Naruto would still have a chance (if not a better chance) even with Sasuke there, because: 
 
A. Sasuke started with no romantic interest in Sakura, he was WAY too focused on revenge and getting stronger. Because this obsession was so strong, I can't/couldn't see Sasuke gaining feelings for Sakura even though she's right there in front of him. So, he was pretty much in love with revenge. - SO basically Sasuke's character and personality would have to do a 180 turn around. Which probably wouldn't happen... because the story is staying the same, just Sasuke is not the villain. 
 
Now a lot of people would say Sakura could make him forget about revenge, and teach Sasuke how to love with her love, but I digress. After all, you can lead to horse to water but you can't make him drink it. 
 
and, 
 
B. Because Sasuke would gain no romantic interest in her, Sakura would eventually just let Sasuke go and start taking an interest in other guys aka Naruto who actually cared a lot about her, admired her, liked her so much it developed into love, wanted to be around her, wanted to get to know her more, etc. etc. "not a big deal" stuff. 
 

So there's my two cents - hope it made some sense.

That also tells us why NH/SS Fans hate so many strong females who stick up for them self and don't want to get walked over, it shows that they see woman as nothing but being a slave to their needs and not what a real relationship is like, I mean I see people who even hate Videl from DBZ why why said she is not like a woman should be a woman should be like 'Hinata' that is what I got,

 

So James was right on his podcast the NH/SS fans don't know what love is.

 

Oh yeah, NH/SS fans definitely don't know what love is.

 

You also have to remember that the NH/SS (mainly NH) fanbase is not only full of fanboys that want a nice, submissive doormat, but also full and I mean FULL of young kids. There are kids 12-years-old and even younger that are NH and SS fans. (And unfortunately my 12-year-old sister is an SS fan. I've tried to explain how toxic SS is but she slams the door in my face, literally.) There is a lot kids can understand, but they are too young to know what true love is. They just ship them because they're "cute" together (this image of "cute" they speak of, is usually just fanarts they find and in poorly written, ooc fanfictions they read) and ignore the facts.

 

They think Sakura is alright, that her character wasn't ruined. She's with Sasuke and they have a happy, sunshine, rainbow family. That's all that matters.

 

They think Naruto is alright, that his character wasn't ruined. He finally fell in love with Hinata, a girl who's loved him forever and ever and they too have a happy sunshine, rainbow family now! That's all that matters.

 

So yeah, just wanted to throw that out there too. 

 

Her true objective was to reclaim her place as heiress of the clan, prove that a loser can win with determination and practice, and resolve the clan's issues and free Neji from his curse... which none of that happened in part 2. There are Hinatards that actually think that zombie Neji's dad talking to his brother that the clan is fighting the war united in two freaking panels is a good closure to their story... This has to be the stupidest and laziest plot resolution ever for something that was build up and implied to be important to Naruto's character. They even try to justify Neji's death that was terribly executed, tried to copy Ace's death in One piece with no character development and no build up, and an absolute contradiction of Naruto's promise. Its the epitome of contrived writing.

 

Naruto was more the inspiration for her to change than her love interest. I actually think it was more a feeling of admiration than love.

 

I felt the same about Hinata's "love" for Naruto. I always felt like Hinata would possibly finally realize in the manga that her love for him was just admiration, but I guess not. 

When did you stop liking Hinata? I did during the last when she rather knit a scarf than save her sister from a creepy villain. 

 

I stopped liking her in part 2 when her whole world revolved around Naruto-kun, Naruto-kun, Naruto-kun. She wasn't thinking about bettering herself or becoming the head of the Hyuga (in which the end it seems she didn't) she was always thinking about Naruto. Even when her cousin died, it was about Naruto in end. This attitude of Hinata was not cute, like many claimed, it was annoying and a little creepy. 

Yeah, SP pretty much made her popular, they made her more important than she really was. I mean you can see Kishimoto at first (again, I say at first.) doesn't give a crap about her. For one, she looked more like a boy than Sakura does when Sakura first appears. Even in later chapters Hinata still isn't that well drawn, she actually looks pretty dang creepy. For two, Kishimoto doesn't have her appear in the manga till closer to the chunin exams (I believe, correct me if I'm wrong), and finally, he barely develops her character at all. Heck, she's barely even in the manga! Kiba's dog appears more times then she does. 

 

On the other hand SP made her "cuter" and more feminine like, they over sexualized her, (starting at 12 flippin years old with the naked waterfall dance in a filler episode) and make her small scenes from the manga, bigger and longer. They go as far as to add scenes into these moments that never even happened in the manga. They even make her animation look better than everyone else's, including Naruto's, who is the main character.... They even allowed her to appear in early stages of the Naruto anime, (pretty sure) the third episode, to have her say one line, "I guess I won't be on the same team as Naruto." 

 

So, yeah, all SP's doing and fans just fell for her. 

to be honest I think even amy rose from sonic could be considered a tsundere, I mean sure she doesn't hit sonic often but when she does its usually for him doing something stupid, especially for example in that one sonic riders game where he blew her away with eggman in the whirlwind when he was supposed to be saving her, and sonic x makes her seem even more like a tsundere.

 

heck even misty from pokemon is one, and she gets hate too, why the flip do people hate tsunderes so bad for the hitting, why can they seriously not understand its a joke and a form of slapstick?!!

 

People see what they want to see, if they see someone hit someone for comedy, they think it's abuse. I'm going to throw in a Naruto example: 

Sakura hits Naruto when he's being pervy or stupid, he's not hurt in end, he just looks really goofy with his face messed up or whatever. The chick that Chouji is now married to beats the crap out of Naruto when he's defending Sasuke.... THAT'S ABUSE. Naruto was bloody, bruised, and Sai had to get her to stop. Does anyone ever stop Sakura? No, because it's not even meant to be harm.... 

 

It seems all the tsunderes get hate from every show because they are "abusive" and don't take crap. That or they got a flat chest and act like too much of a tomboy. I believe the majority of the hate comes from fanboys that want some sweet, submissive woman with the main character, because they (the fanboys) usually view themselves as that character or want to be that character.

 

I seriously wonder if they think real life Japanese girls are like that, like they are all just a bunch of  big boobed, (sometimes) scattered brained, walking doormats. 

Why hinata is more popular than sakura?
Hinata is likeable who love naruto and she's the only one who do that.
Sakura is unlikeable who hate naruto (intially) and love sasuke, while loved by naruto.

Hinata will not be the popular girl if kishi create another fangirl. Especially if that said fangirl is tsundere.

I don't understand why people a large fraction of the time hate tsunderes. Tsunderes make the anime world go round. I absolutely adore them. It's characters like Hinata I can't stand. The only exception is Yamato from My Love Story!!.

(Okay maybe this isn't a rant, more like an observation. This is by no means trying to justify what Kishimoto has done or anything like that. Also, not trying to insult pairings, I'm just calling it as I see it.)
 
So, this has been on my mind for a while and it may or may not have been discussed, but I'm going to go ahead and write this out anyway. 
 
To my understanding and stand point, Kishimoto hates the canon pairings, this is why I think so.
 
Let's begin with SasuSaku:
 
I know Sakura kinda of wasn't supposed to exist but, Kishimoto couldn't dislike Sakura that much to make her marriage with Sasuke suffer and be that miserable. Sasuke being gone for twelve years with ZERO communication with Sakura or Sarada I mean come on. If he could communicate with his old pal Naruto, why not his "wife" and child? He hadn't even seen or met Sarada which was mind blowing, like how could you not go and see your kid? And if Sakura is your wife, why didn't you go and see her?
 
Fans claimed that Sasuke had a perfectly good reason for being away that long, but there wasn't in the end. There was no explanation of why Sasuke was gone that long, and from the looks of it if Sarada hadn't wanted to meet and confront Sasuke, Sasuke wouldn't have been around for another twelve (or more) years. It's even claimed by Sasuke himself that pretty much the only reason that he's with Sakura is because of Sarada. 
 
Then there's the pretty in stone fact that Sasuke hasn't ever kissed Sakura. The most romantic thing that Sakura can recall that Sasuke has done is poke her on the forehead. WTH? Fans found Sasuke rejecting Sakura, when she pretty much is begging (yes begging, that's how I viewed that) for a kiss, cute. That's not cute.... that's messed up. How can they "do the deed" but not even have kissed once? 
 
Let's not get started with Sarada looking just like Karin and Sarada thinking that Karin was her biological mom. 
 
Fans claimed that Naruto Gaiden was a cute SasuSaku family adventure, I would have found that as a big slap in the face. The love that they imagined Sakura and Sasuke would have in the end, is pretty much fanon. If I were a SasuSaku fan I would be pretty angry with how Gaiden was. 
 
Now let's move on to the Sunshine couple, NaruHina....
 
Let's begin with the most interaction the couple got, and that's from the movie, The Last.  
 
This movie too was a slap in the face. For one, Kishimoto had no hand in writing it. Yeah, I guess it's because he "doesn't know how to write romance" (yet he was doing a pretty great job with Naruto and Sakura's relationship imo.) but, it's just the fact Kishimoto had little to no hand in creating Naruto and Hinata's romance. So that sort of tells you something. 
 
Two, their relationship had to be explained in a movie, I repeat in a movie. Why not in the manga? Well, that's probably because he was too busy developing Naruto and Sakura's relationship, (and other relevant, important relationships.) which he so called claims was formed because it was to deceive fans. (I call that BS.) 
 
Three, Naruto didn't respond to Hinata's confession, or Hinata in general for two years. TWO YEARS. It's like he forgot her confession and her existence for two years. That's just absolutely mind blowing. 
 
Four, the genjutsu. It literally took a genjutsu to bring them together. I would have thought that Hinata's actual love would impact Naruto, not a genjutsu that made him pity her. Let's not get into how Sakura had to get involved to play cupid for them.
 
(Just a extra tidbit, now that I thought about Sakura playing cupid in this movie. I LOVE how Naruto is apparently ignorant to love so suddenly. Like he was yelling at Zabuza, a grown man, about how Haku loved and cared about him at the age of twelve.... so does that knowledge about love go away at nineteen or...??)
 
Kishimoto, as I said had little hand in this movie, but he was okay with it. 
 
Then the little things I've heard about Gaiden and Boruto: 
 
Apparently Naruto spends little to no time with his wife and family. (In Gaiden: Apparently Naruto is following Sasuke's footsteps.) This results in his son hating him, Hinata? She's to busy knitting scarves to be concerned on the fact her husband who she wanted to be with for years doesn't spend time with her.)
 
Apparently Naruto and Hinata don't even sleep in the same bed. (Boruto movie, how the heck did they have kids then?)
 
The conclusion on both pairings: FORCED. Very forced. 
 
It just seems like if Kishimoto really wanted these pairings to come to be he would have just written them out properly from the beginning with a healthy start. Well NaruHina was more healthy than SasuSaku, I can give it that, just how they came to be was messed up. 
 
Maybe he upset he couldn't make the ending his way, because of pressure from his editors? And so maybe he was trying to maybe make a point with these two pairings? Like he was saying: "Okay you want Sakura and Sasuke together, this is how their marriage would be." and: "Alright Naruto and Hinata will be together, *SP writes story that is pretty much insulting, Kishimoto looks over it* yep this is how Naruto would fall for Hinata! Put it on the big screen!" 
 
Maybe he was trying to have the whole fandom turn against him so he could take a break and drop Naruto for good?
 
I don't know, I guess that may be two of four reasons why he ended Naruto on a bad note. What do you guys think? 

my theory is the manga ended ib 698 as an open ending, then SP/SJ took over and from 699 on it was a whole new series, and a ooc fanfiction

 

This is how I feel about it too. Not sure if I would actually go back and re-read the manga, but I would maybe like play the video games for the nostalgia. 

I’ll tell you guys something, I still like Naruto, I don’t love it like I used to, but I like it. Mind you I’m completely COMPLETELY and utterly against the horrible ending that we got. (This is not just about pairings, though a part of it is about pairings. This is also about the sudden change of the characters, development going down the tubes, and just how everything was so rushed and thrown together pretty much.) 

Anything that’s past chapter 698 is not even real to me. It will never be relevant to me. And I can’t and won’t be happy with the ending and never will be. It’s just not possible. 

Anyway, does anyone else that feels this way? Or is just me?