947 replies to this topic

[Kagomaru]

The current theory being discussed is that the shift to Unreality(aka "fantasy/fiction") means that later titles may have more of a focus on Final Fantasy characters and other SE franchises.

Edited by Kagomaru, 22 February 2021 - 11:15 PM.

[VanitasDS76491]

The current theory being discussed is that the shift to Unreality(aka "fantasy/fiction") means that later titles may have more of a focus on Final Fantasy characters and other SE franchises.

maybe they'll go to ff6 world that'd be cool

[Kagomaru]

That would be awesome if it happened since Sora would hit it off well with Terra. But then, he'd also likely run into Kefka..ew.

[VanitasDS76491]

That would be awesome if it happened since Sora would hit it off well with Terra. But then, he'd also likely run into Kefka..ew.

Yep and kefka would be a good fight

[VanitasDS76491]

That would be awesome if it happened since Sora would hit it off well with Terra. But then, he'd also likely run into Kefka..ew.

Yep and kefka would be a good fight

[NaruSaku fan in Kentucky]

Speaking of Sora, what would you say is Haley Joel's Osment best performance as Sora?

[NaruSaku fan in Kentucky]

I also think they should make a game similar to Final Fantasy X-2 where Kairi is Yuna finding Sora like Yuna found Tidus.

[VanitasDS76491]

Speaking of Sora, what would you say is Haley Joel's Osment best performance as Sora?

Hard to say 2 or 3

I also think they should make a game similar to Final Fantasy X-2 where Kairi is Yuna finding Sora like Yuna found Tidus.

That'd actually be better than actual x-2 though Kairi in Yuna gunner x-2 outfit would look hot

[Kagomaru]

I certainly hope that they bring back the spell system from Birth By Sleep and Dream Drop Distance and expand on Form/Style Changes. Maybe incorporate features from the Final Fantasy VII remake such as allowing us to switch between party members.

Edited by Kagomaru, 24 February 2021 - 05:47 PM.

[VanitasDS76491]

I certainly hope that they bring back the spell system from Birth By Sleep and Dream Drop Distance and expand on Form/Style Changes. Maybe incorporate features from the Final Fantasy VII remake such as allowing us to switch between party members.

That'd be cool switching to Kairi

[NaruSaku fan in Kentucky]

That'd be cool switching to Kairi

And she pulls An Aerith by saying "screw him."

[NaruSaku fan in Kentucky]

Today is Sakura's birthday but it's also Sora's birthday. Happy birthday Sora.

 

 

Edited by NaruSaku fan in Kentucky, 29 March 2021 - 02:38 AM.

[BlueStarSaber]

I didn't know Sora and Sakura had the same birthday, Happy Birthday to them.

[NaruSaku fan in Kentucky]

Next Wednesday at 1:00, I'm making a Kingdom Hearts podcast. We are gonna discuss Sokai, Kairi's role and the future of the series. It is based off of Luckychi7's NS anniversary. Anyway you are welcome to join.

[Nate River]

So the ending mobile game just dropped its ending on Wednesday, I can post if anyone wants. It actually has some significant revelations. 

[NaruSaku fan in Kentucky]

So the ending mobile game just dropped its ending on Wednesday, I can post if anyone wants. It actually has some significant revelations. 

Sure, go on ahead.

[Nate River]

Sure, go on ahead.

I’ll star in the morning and will try to include a clip.

[Nate River]

For this post I'm going to assume people have played all the KH console games but not the mobile ones and will try to provide as much context as I can. At the end, I will provided a link to youtube videos that have all the cutscenes if you want to watch it.

 

The mobile game ends service in like two weeks. The main one anyway. As part of it, there is a secondary game called Dark Road, which is about Xehanort and how he became what he was in the main games. Im not sure the intent on this one as it has not been around like. The rest of the plot with be dropped in September and will end service around that time. Once the games end service, I believe you will still be able to download the app and watch the plot in theatre mode. I think those who played it and saved there data will have far more customization options for the character than those who didn't, but otherwise I don't think there is much of a different. 

 

https://twitter.com/Roboloid

 

The pinned tweet at the top contains links to the full story. One has the Disney cutscenes one does not. Links to the final 3 quests are the end of the post.

 

Just so you know I'm going off memory, I apologize if I make any mistakes or miss anything, but I think its a pretty good summary of what happened. You should watch the full story when you can (i don't think you need the Disney parts but I'm not 100% sure(.

 

I really hope this makes it to console one day. It's really a good story.  Needless to say: SPOILERS ABOUND BELOW. 

 

Watching the story and reading the summary aren't even close to the same, but if you don't want to be spoiled stop reading now.

 

Okay, so here goes:

 

KH Chi

 

The mobile game actually has existed as three games.

 

All three games take place in Daybreak town. You can actually seen the ruins of it underneath in Scala Ad Caelum in KH3 (I think).

 

There is the KH Chi which was a browser game released in Japan only. It details the events up to the keyblade war (and its conclusion). Back Cover basically summarizes this game, but stops just before the war. In that version, the player character is invited to join the dandelions, but declines and ultimately participates in the Keyblade war. The Keyblade war begins when Ava confronts Luxu and he tells her something along the lines of that the master wasn't worried about this world, but what comes after and something in regards to the traitor. When still have no idea what he says only that it prompts Ava attack him and set of the war.

 

In the war, the player fights 4 of the 5 foretellers (the exception being that the don't fight the one who leads there union). I was in Anguis, so I fought everyone but Invi. At the end the player collapses and is approached by Ephemer (who you see in Back Cover and Kh3) and Skuld: Two friends of the player and whom the player has been looking for (especially Ephemer, who had failed to show up at a meeting with the player and isn't seen until the end). Both Ephemer and Skuld are dandelions and Ephemer's recruitment into them is why he "goes missing" so to speak. What happens here is not explicit. If Chi were the only game in this set, the reasonable conclusion is that you die, but it's not so that not what happens. This is where Chi end. A side event allowing you to play the Keyblade war is included in the mobile games and (I think) may be accessible as part of theatre mode. 

 

KH Unchained and KH Union Cross (KHUX):

 

These two are the mobile games and for all intents and purposes are the same game. KH Unchained was released as KHUX and there is no plot different that I am aware of. There is an ingame mention of it and I think it added a new game mode.

 

For a significant chunk of KHUX the plot appears to be the same as Chi. There may be hints that its not the same before, but the first time I recall the game hinting that its not  the same story is when you fight Aced for the first time in Daybreak town. At that point, your Chirinthy and another Chirinthy are speaking, indicating that the player character is starting to remember. As noted, this is the first time I remember there being a suggestions that KHUX takes place after the war. 

 

Much later they story is explicit that it takes place after the war. Eventually in the Keyblade graveyard (post keyblade war) five Dandelions meet (as instructed) and note that they were chose to become the new Union leaders by Ava. These five are: Ephemer, Skuld, Ventus, Brain, and Lauriam. Lauriam is the original version of Marluxia. Much of the plot is them trying to figure out what they are to do as Union leaders. A significant subplot that runs through this involves Lauriam.

 

I can't recall when its introduced versus when you learn about the Union leaders (i.e. the order the game presents it in), but the short version is that just before the Keyblade war a girl named Strelitzia is introduced. She is from a different union than the player, but sees them around a lot and wants to make friends. This desire is made more urgent when she is recruited by Ava to be a union leaders of the dandelions. She wants player to join the dandelions in order to save them. Strelitizia eventually sees the player walk into a abandoned house and follows them in. She is attacked and killed by an unknown entity. Strelitizia is later revealed to be Lauriams' sister. 

 

When the Union leaders meet, Lauriam has no idea what has happened to his sister and a good chuck of what he does is looks for her. As part of this he turns to a member of his sister's old party named Elrena (the original version of Larxene). She doesn't play a huge role in this game, but shows up a couple of times in regards to Lauriam's sister. Something Elerna says also hints at them being the data world (i.e. she has not memory of the keyblade war actually happening).

 

Eventually the Union leaders learn of a data version of daybreak town. They initially think they are in the real one, but turns out in the Data version. I don't recall if the game outright says it, but if it does not, it is heavily implied that this is where the Dandelions went when the war occurred. Much of what comes next involves their trying to find to their escape from data world as long with the resolution of the Strelitizia murder plot, which are intertwined. Within the data world, the Union leaders find pods that would allow them to escape.

 

Toward the end, you learn who Strelitizia's murderer is: Ventus. This explanation of why is KH level convoluted. The short version is that Ventus was possessed by Darkness. That is its only name. It cast aside its physical form and began to infect peoples hearts. It possessed Ventus and killed Strelitzia in part because he wanted to be stronger and because, in esssence, that is how it had to be. Turns out its pure Darkness and Ventus is pure light.

 

As a side note, the Union leaders at least had some idea something wasn't right because all there meetings with Ava were the same, except for Ventus's. It turns out the Ava Ventus met was Darkness impersonating her (And likely the player when Strelitizia followed them). Ventus confronts Darkness, absorbs it (this Darkness would later be extracted and be given form as Vanitas). While much of this going on, the player is in the Wreck it Ralph world deadline with issues there. The discovery of that word coincides with the discovery that there is a data daybreak town. At the same time, the real Daybreak town is beginning to collapse and, as a result, so is the data world. 

 

Anyway, Ventus's battle with Darkness puts him to sleep and he is placed into an escape pod. Elrena shows back and and so does the player.  

 

Lauriam, Elrena, and Sleeping Ventus eventually leave. The player, and Skuld, and Ephemer are the data world and Brain is in the real world trying to help them get out.  Unfortunately 4 more darkness show up and demand they open a gate. Ephemer tells them no. At the point the player attacks and defeats Ephemer and Skuld. They say they have been possessed by Darkness and player cannot hear Ephemer and Skuld. Just as player is about to attack them again, Ephemer fires a light from his keyblade through players heart and opens a gate. Player and the four darknesses are sucked in. Ephemer seals the gate shut while apologizing to the player. 

 

On the other side, player relevels they were just acting. The plan was to convince Ephemer and Skuld (and the Darknesses) that the player had been corrupted to convince Ephemer open the gate and seal them in. After laughing at the Darkness' gullibility, the player seals the other end of the gate, which traps all 5. Meanwhile, Ephemer and Skuld are look at Daybreak town as its collapsing and then get in their pods and leave. Unfortunately, Brain has no control over when and where they will end up (which he told Lauriam and Elrena before they left).

 

Meanwhile Luxu confronts Brain (who is in the real world). Brain had planned to stay behind in an attempt to help the other Dandelions trapped there.  Luxu tell him that when the world ends so does the data world (through a wrench into Brain's plan the his plans). The have a conversation, but what happens next is unknown. 

 

The world then ends. Player does not escape.

 

As to what happens to everyone:

 

(1) Ephemer ends up in a ruined Daybreak town at some point after its destruction. He founds a new city called Scala Ad Caelum. 

(2) Lauriam ends up in the Woodlands (Snow White's world) laying in a bed of flowers. What happens next (beyond him losing his heart and become Marluxia at some point is not known).

(3) Elrena ends up in Enchanted Dominion.(What happens to her outside of become Larxene is not known). 

(4) Ventus (who is still asleep) is found in the world where the keyblade graveyard is and a mysterious figure is seen approaching him (probably Xehanort).

(5) Skuld's fate is unknown, but I will detail the current theories.

(6) Brain's fate is a bit of a mess. Basically you see two things on him: One is you see Luxu dropping his hood to reveal Brain's face. However, you also see Brain show up in Scala sometime in the future. Brain sees a statute of Ephemer, implying that he arrives much later and that Ephemer has already died. 

(7) The Dandelions all die (well go to sleep as the game puts it) and, in some way (I will explain later), become dream eaters.

(8) The player dies, but does not go sleep. Their heart migrants and the player is reincarnated as Xehanort. I am not making this up, that really happens.

 

As to why, I suspect it's a way to make the player a part of the main story line without screwing it up. It also serves to help the Xehanort rehab tour. Normally, you might reincarnate them as Sora, Riku or Kairi, but the BBS trio complicates that. They already exist as the explanation as to why Sora, Riku, and Kairi are wielders. The alternatives are killing the player or having them share the fate of the dandelions. The story makes them seem to special too share that kind of generic fate. 

 

 

Info that doesn't neatly fit into a plot Summary:

 

The Master of Master's plan is revealed. He's not evil, but, damn, this game does him no favors. 

 

So, it turns out this keyblade war is not the first. It has happened many times before and the master has had to watch his friends die in the past. He has fought darkness many times. Just as he says in Back Cover his, overall goal is set the stage for the world after the keyblade war, i.e. he wants to set the board in terms favorable to light. 

 

He seems unconcerned about the fate of the current word even going so far as telling Luxu that he can't be sentimental. His plan involves creating vessels for the strongest Darkness (of which there are in total 13). He and the foretellers were to be some of those vessels. I think the new Union leaders were intended to be as well. The players stunt at the end prevents that from happening. 

 

As far the traitor: In the most literal sense, he calls Luxu this. But Luxu is not one in the sense that there is any indication he intentionally betrays what hes been asked to do. The big "but" to this is we have no idea what happened with him and Brain and what the deal with him having Brains face is. 

 

The lost page given to Gula was done explicitly to sow the seeds of doubt within the Foretellers and lead to the war. I'm not sure he even needed that as they way there roles were setup invites the conflict that erupted. Regardless, they were setup to fail from the beginning and in this respect the "traitor" is the Master. He used their unwavering faith in them to use them as tools and scarified them without their knowledge. He led countless to their deaths in the keyblade war and left the remainder to die. 

 

It's all for the greater good, but man, is it easy to say that when its not your life being sacrificed. Nevertheless, based on this and on the ending to KH3 (the chessboard and meeting with luxu) strongly hits that they will be the new antagonists except possibly Ava. We have no idea why she isnt there at the end of KH3.

 

As for Ava, as I said, she ignites the war when she attacks Luxu. We have no idea what he said except that it dealt with the traitor. She appears to have misgivings even before that as she defies the master in one respect. The master designated the 5 new union leaders and one was to recieve the book of prophecies. The one who was supposed to get it was Ephemer. She gives it to Brain instead with the express purpose of trying to fight fate.

 

What we don't know is how much this deviated from what the Master knew (if it did at all). Did he know about Ava giving the book to someone else? Did he know about Player's involvement and that they would sealing four of the darkness's up? Brain talks about becoming a virus in the plan at one point, suggesting he planned to defy fate, did the Master know?

 

Did the master know Xehanort as the player reincarnated when he met Young Xehanort?

 

Remaining Plot Threads:

 

Brain:

 
As noted, he ends up in Scala and Luxu has his face. Some ideas floating around are:

 

(1) Brain and Luxu are one in the same. Brain makes it to Scala and then later travels back in time as Luxu.

 

(2) Luxu possess Brain's body either willingly or unwillingly, while Brain's heart makes it to Scala and his body is reconstituted. This would have allowed Brain to escape the data world. 

 

(3) Brain, at least temporarily, takes on Luxu's role and is actually the one to hide the box, which explains why Xigbar didn't know where it was. This method (as well as 1) would fit with one of Luxu's secret notes where he says he gave one of the 5 union leaders the No Name Keyblade. Brain is not ever shown having it, but process of elimination suggests its him (i.e. you can eliminate Ephemer, Ventus, and Lauriam pretty easily).

 

Brain and Ephemer: 

 

Brain's original keyblade is the Master Defender (i.e. Eraqus's blade). Because of this, he is thought to be an ancestor of Eraqus. That is still the current theory, but there is a big "but" now.

 

Brain gives the Master Defender to to Ephemer near the end of KHUX. When Brain arrives in Scala and sees the statute of Ephemer, Empher is holding that keyblade, which shows he still had it. Though Brain is in a position to get it back by being in Scala. Brains presence also potentially explains how No Name ends up there as well. That said we don't know at this point.

 

Skuld: 

 

Her fate is unknown. However, you do see what Xehanort's mother looks like and she looks similar to Skuld. The hair style and color in particular are the same, but the eyes are not. It also begs the question of why show her face and not her fate if they are the same person. Unfortunately, mom is not with him for long and he is given to a robed figure in Scala. 

 

We know from Dark Road that he is schooled and trained in Scala, but what happens to Xehanort there has not been reveled yet. That's also where he meets Eraqus. 

 

Skuld is also thought to be Subject X: the girl Isa and Lea were looking for. 

 

Lauriam and Elrena:

 

We know they become Larxene and Marluxia, but the stuff Lauriam and Ephemer say at the end of KHUX gives the impression that the games not done with them.  The words involves promises of future action, which would amount to nothing if it was done. We don't know how or when they become Marluxia and Larxene or things like how did Xemnas know they were connected to the ancient Keyblade War or why he even cared. 

 

Although, the player is Xehanort there is no evidence he recalls that or that he has any memories of his past life (otherwise I can't imagine him doing what he does to Ventus). 

 

If feels very much like its been left for later, so don't be surprised to see more of them. 

 

That said, despite the words from Xemnas: Luxord and Demyx do not show up at all. So we don't know their connection to the keyblade war, though a popular theory is that Demyx is the Master (based on their odd mannerisms). 

 

Ventus:

 

Ventus likely ends up in a time just before the beginning of BBS. There really isn't any mystery to his fate.

 

The Dandelions:

 

They are shown in a white void hugging their Chirinthy's before their body fades out. The Chirinthy slowly does as well and a dream eater shows up. Its a little murky as to whether they Chrinithy becomes the dream eater to watch over the sleeping wielder or whether they merge together to become the dream eater. It was also thought that the wielder became one, but I don't think that's the case. 

 

In summary:

 

1) The foretellers are being setup as antagonists. Probably the master as well. As a side note, I wouldn't blame the foretellers for being SUPER bitter about all this. They got completely screwed over.

 

2) I suspect this isn't the last we've seen of the union leaders. Brain's fate is messy and Skuld's is unknown. The other issue is that the KHUX suggests they the group of 7 friends (leaders + elrena + player) are scattered so far apart that in most cases they never see each other again and in the few exceptions, they don't know it. I don't think any of them know the fate or any of the others. The only exception is Brain learning about Ephemer and possible Elrena and Lauriam. 

 

3) Where they "meet" is basically Xehanort and Ventus and Xehanort with Marluxia and Larxene, though none have any knowledge of each other from their former life and their interactions with each other are largely very negative. Well technically Ventus sees Marluxia and Larxene during he war, but they don't interact. 

 

4) This is KH and a truism is that this eventually work out. It may take many games and many years (both in game and out), but it happens eventually. This ending is a sad one and I can't imagine it being left that way.

 

That's why I think we'll see the union leaders are part of future arcs (unless Dark Road deals with it) and why we probably haven't seen the last of Xehanort. We probably have as a villan, but I wouldn't be surprised if he learns who he really was and is allowed to "reunite" with his union leader friends in some form (where they also learned about him). They will probably also learn of each other's fate (as they largely don't know what happened to the others (except for Brain).

 

5) I don't hate these attempts to help rehab Xehanort, but boy did they wait way to long to start doing this. The player's noble and self-sacrificng personality does not mesh well with many of the things he does (though Dark Road will tell us why he does them). Really, hints that he might not be totally evil should have started appearing probably as far back as BBS if they wanted to do this. 

 

I forgot how to place videos so here it is: It's in 3 parts 

 

Quest 977: Story Finale Part 1/3: Quest 977 - Darkness Looms ~ KH Union χ [Cross] - YouTube

 

Question 978: Story Finale Part 2/3: Quest 978 - What Comes After ~ KH Union χ [Cross] - YouTube

 

Question 979 (the ending): Story Finale Part 3/3: Quest 979 - The Final Battle ~ KH Union χ [Cross] - YouTube

 

EDIT: Made some edits because I got who was in the data world vs. who was in the real world at the time the four darkness's attack backwards.

[Kagomaru]

It seems that Player and Xehanort's relationship is similar to that of Ventus and Sora's arrangement in BBS, as it's explained that Player would be "a part" of a new heart, rather than just straight up reincarnated. Both Ventus and Xehanort have mentioned (in KH3 and Dark Road respectively) that they have memories of people and places that they don't recognize (from Sora and Player), and Xehanort even ranted in BBS that he lived through the Keyblade War(which is obviously Player's memory influencing him).

[Nate River]

It seems that Player and Xehanort's relationship is similar to that of Ventus and Sora's arrangement in BBS, as it's explained that Player would be "a part" of a new heart, rather than just straight up reincarnated. Both Ventus and Xehanort have mentioned (in KH3 and Dark Road respectively) that they have memories of people and places that they don't recognize (from Sora and Player), and Xehanort even ranted in BBS that he lived through the Keyblade War(which is obviously Player's memory influencing him).

 

I recalled the visuals, but didn't remember the exact words from the ending and its been 2 years since I played KH3 (even longer for BBS). But now that you mention it, I do recall Xehanort saying that. I'd been fine either way as it doesn't change my opinion of anything. I still think if they wanted the rehab tour they should have started sooner and at some point Player will reunite with the leaders in some form. 

 

"A part" is a bit vague, but given everything, I suspect your right in that its there but remains distinct as opposed to combining with it.

 

KHUX's story is one of my favorites of the series and its near criminal that it had to be confined to a mobile gatcha game. 

 

EDIT: As for Luxu and Brain, I have no pet theory and am open to all three being wrong. About the only thing I have any confidence in is that Luxu probably offers him a way out and is how Brain ends up in Scala. As a result, I don't think he forcibly possessed Brain. If any possession took place, it was likely agreed to by Brain. I also haven't written off the idea that they are one in the same despite the obvious paradox it creates.

 

EDIT 2: One other thing, Brain's arrival in Scala is known all the way down to the timing and I can think of only two people person who'd been able to pass that information on.