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#41 Bryon_Konoha_Ninja

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Posted 05 February 2018 - 04:32 PM

Wait. So Sakura did feel things for Naruto but it would have been cruel to Hinata if she acted on them? Wow.

 

Yeah, which shows that Kishimoto only put Naruto and Hinata together because he pitied her, and that he claimed Sakura would be a horrible woman if she acted on her feelings for Naruto just because it'd be bad for Hinata? I call it a bit of a lame duck excuse really.



#42 winter-serenade

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Posted 05 February 2018 - 05:49 PM

Wait. So Sakura did feel things for Naruto but it would have been cruel to Hinata if she acted on them? Wow.

 

If I remember correctly, Kishimoto also said that if she moved on from Sasuke, it would make her a terrible woman to Sasuke. It's really horrific. One interview he said Sakura's love was like a poison/venom/drug/addiction, one of those four, however correct me if I'm wrong. It's sad, really. And her love for Sasuke wouldn't even be so bad if Shippuden didn't happen. It had potential in Part 1, but quickly went down the drain seemingly never to return in Shippuden because of Sakura's developing feelings for Naruto, NaruSaku interactions in general, and Sasuke's downfall into revenge. 


Edited by winter-serenade, 05 February 2018 - 05:49 PM.


#43 jak123

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Posted 05 February 2018 - 07:12 PM

Wait. So Sakura did feel things for Naruto but it would have been cruel to Hinata if she acted on them? Wow.

Which makes no sense. Now, if Hinata did that for Sakura, it would make sense.



#44 DrK

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Posted 05 February 2018 - 07:18 PM

Which makes no sense. Now, if Hinata did that for Sakura, it would make sense.

Well, it's clear that what did happen with the story was terribly cruel to Sakura!


Edited by DrK, 05 February 2018 - 07:18 PM.


#45 catsi563

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Posted 05 February 2018 - 07:19 PM

I basically maintain that what we got was editorial interference at its worst and a mangaka who basically lost control of his story and finally thew his hands in the air and said kitten it do what you want with the story I'm done. 

 

For most of the story given the evidence I believe he worked pretty well hand in hand with his original editor to craft a good foundational story. Naruto hard working loser shinobi of the leaf with the 9 tailed demon inside him. Sakura his love interest and well intentioned but completely average kunoichi who showed remarkable potential as she began a slow arc away from her crush sasuke. and lastly Sasuke the friend and rival with a soul darkened by vengeance and tragedy that would be redeemed in the end by Naruto and the power of friendship as all shonen tend to do.

 

Shippuden hit and for the most part the story continued on this arc with Sakura showing that she had grown tremendously and Naruto as well. We also saw the hints and baby steps of their burgeoning relationship as Sakura says yes to a date and learns about his burdens making her feelings more real, and getting hints from outside characters that she really does love him.

 

We also see many Parallels between Naruto and Sakura confirmed and backed up by flashback parallels of Minato and Kushina.

 

We see Saskue falling further into Darkness as said characters are want to do  and the leaf village destroyed by the god like Pein. we get the moe characters confession/sacrifice barely surviving thanks to Sakura. We also see the introduction of Taka and Karin as new team/family and Love interest respectively.

 

we see the war beginning and we see the slight stumble as Sakura and Narutos relationship advances in the Iron country arc.

 

and finally during the war we see all three characters make large strides in their respective stories before we hit the True ending chapter where we get Parallels between Sasuke and Karin and Naruto and Sakura.

 

all told up to that point we had a fairly solid if not spectacular Shonen story with a few twists to the basic formula. 

 

Then the new editors came into play. they had a different goal for the story and it didn't include Naruto and Sakuras romance which began to rapidly fall by the way side so minor and irrelevant side character Hinata could be pushed. Suddenly her crush became this full blown OMG romantic love that was destined in the stars and was crowbarred in with a terrible movie that only made the whole situation worse with glaring plot holes, ridiculous fan fiction tropes and worse outright character assassination.

 

In the end I honestly believe Kishimoto Sensei just gave up the fight, it wasn't his story anymore and he let them take it with little resistance. HIs big middle finger and FU to them was in the True End chapter where he literaly says it in the title THIS IS HOW ITS SUPPOSED TO END.


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#46 Bryon_Konoha_Ninja

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Posted 05 February 2018 - 08:49 PM

If I remember correctly, Kishimoto also said that if she moved on from Sasuke, it would make her a terrible woman to Sasuke. It's really horrific. One interview he said Sakura's love was like a poison/venom/drug/addiction, one of those four, however correct me if I'm wrong. It's sad, really. And her love for Sasuke wouldn't even be so bad if Shippuden didn't happen. It had potential in Part 1, but quickly went down the drain seemingly never to return in Shippuden because of Sakura's developing feelings for Naruto, NaruSaku interactions in general, and Sasuke's downfall into revenge. 

 

Yeah, you nailed it right, Winter, so don't sweat it.



#47 jak123

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 04:42 AM

 

If I remember correctly, Kishimoto also said that if she moved on from Sasuke, it would make her a terrible woman to Sasuke. It's really horrific. One interview he said Sakura's love was like a poison/venom/drug/addiction, one of those four, however correct me if I'm wrong. It's sad, really. And her love for Sasuke wouldn't even be so bad if Shippuden didn't happen. It had potential in Part 1, but quickly went down the drain seemingly never to return in Shippuden because of Sakura's developing feelings for Naruto, NaruSaku interactions in general, and Sasuke's downfall into revenge. 

Sasuke wouldn't have cared because Sasuke didn't care about her. 



#48 DrK

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 04:58 AM

Sasuke wouldn't have cared because Sasuke didn't care about her. 

Also if he had to pick someone, it would have been Karin. And Karin would have been extremely receptive. There was no need for Sakura. It's just a hollow justification that he offered.

 

You really aren't doing well when the weak justification that you offer, besides being weak, manages to make you look horrible for an entirely different, unrelated reason.


Edited by DrK, 06 February 2018 - 05:00 AM.


#49 jak123

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 05:08 AM

Also if he had to pick someone, it would have been Karin. And Karin would have been extremely receptive. There was no need for Sakura. It's just a hollow justification that he offered.

 

You really aren't doing well when the weak justification that you offer, besides being weak, manages to make you look horrible for an entirely different, unrelated reason.

So true. So true.



#50 Bryon_Konoha_Ninja

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 06:19 AM

Sasuke wouldn't have cared because Sasuke didn't care about her. 

 

Exactly, a statement he made clear to Kakashi when Kakashi was trying to force him to love Sakura back (yet Kakashi the hypocrite couldn't love Rin back when she loved him! XP)

 

Also if he had to pick someone, it would have been Karin. And Karin would have been extremely receptive. There was no need for Sakura. It's just a hollow justification that he offered.

 

You really aren't doing well when the weak justification that you offer, besides being weak, manages to make you look horrible for an entirely different, unrelated reason.

 

Exactly, since Sasuke had recognized Karin as the strongest kunoichi when he recruited her, and when he was beginning to turn around a bit after Itachi's sacrifice to stop Kabuto, he was genuinely sorry for what he did to her, considering she'd know as a sensor-type ninja, while his "apology" to Sakura is basically forced BS.



#51 DrK

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 08:00 AM

Exactly, since Sasuke had recognized Karin as the strongest kunoichi when he recruited her, and when he was beginning to turn around a bit after Itachi's sacrifice to stop Kabuto, he was genuinely sorry for what he did to her, considering she'd know as a sensor-type ninja, while his "apology" to Sakura is basically forced BS.

I know you've said this sensor thing a bunch of times, and it's a really good point, but I find it so hard to believe that Kishi even cared enough to think about something like that at that point. He was just going through the motions. Although, you do have to consider something. Kishi is always trying to push this completely BS idea that someone in darkness isn't accountable after they get redeemed. Like they should be treated as if a completely different person did those things. Bascially with the end goal of kittenriding Sasuke.

 

But when he apologized to Karin, he was still in the darkness, he was still a bad person. Yet even in this delusional, probably psychotic state, he cared enough about Karin to bother to apologize to her. While with Sakura, he's redeemed into a great, noble hero who can do no wrong, before offering a complete garbage blanket apology for everything that Sakura accepts despite the fact that he just traumatized her for life via an illusion of her own death at his hands.

 

So yeah. The Karin apology has more weight and legitimacy regardless.



#52 Bryon_Konoha_Ninja

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 09:13 AM

I know you've said this sensor thing a bunch of times, and it's a really good point, but I find it so hard to believe that Kishi even cared enough to think about something like that at that point. He was just going through the motions. Although, you do have to consider something. Kishi is always trying to push this completely BS idea that someone in darkness isn't accountable after they get redeemed. Like they should be treated as if a completely different person did those things. Bascially with the end goal of kittenriding Sasuke.

 

But when he apologized to Karin, he was still in the darkness, he was still a bad person. Yet even in this delusional, probably psychotic state, he cared enough about Karin to bother to apologize to her. While with Sakura, he's redeemed into a great, noble hero who can do no wrong, before offering a complete garbage blanket apology for everything that Sakura accepts despite the fact that he just traumatized her for life via an illusion of her own death at his hands.

 

So yeah. The Karin apology has more weight and legitimacy regardless.

 

Oh, yeah, I know whatcah mean,a nd let's really face it, he was basically going through the motions.






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