54175 replies to this topic

[Luna]

Seeing this kills me.

 

[jak123]

Seeing this kills me.

 

Yet the Last claims he only loved her because rivalry. Seriously, kitten Studio Pierrot. 

[tricksie]

 

I know that I wanted to do something like that, but I also don't want to do it like what the war arc did. The idea I had thought about with that is after Orochimaru gets a HUGE power boost at the cost of his humanity basically, he uses the Summoning Jutsu: Reanimation, along with the powers of the demon god he has gained, and brings back some people, but mostly big powerhouses from the Leaf instead of a massive army, and that it is done to also allow some interactions since I am ditching the whole Fourth Ninja World War arc and all of that, since I am doing Madara differently to where it is him all along without needing it to have Obito be back to be his Darth Vader to his Emperor Palpatine or his Kylo Ren to his Supreme Leader Snoke.

As for stuff like Rasa telling Gaara the truth, I wanted to do it in that Gaara finds a letter sometime after he becomes Kazekage, and that he reads it, with Rasa explaining his failures as a father and how he knows Gaara was loved, and that he hopes he has been able to find something of peace, and that he will forgive him in the next world.

 

As for what I was getting at with Madara, without using Obito, the idea of it in The Demon Within is that rather than Black Zetsu being some random creation of Kaguya's, Madara has created him when he made White Zetsu as yin and yang, and that after his battle with Hashirama, he was weakened more considerably after he used Izanagi, and that while he did his work, he had been dying, and refusing to die, he ended up using what he had learned to make himself a new body, BUT it wasn't strong enough to withstand his full power, so he's needed other Sharingan to supplant his inability to use his original Sharingan, complete with Rinnegan.

 

The idea I also had is Madara wouldn't be sympathetic, but that he basically slowly, deeply became evil itself after he had awakened the Mangekyo Sharingan, and feeling he was a god among men. But when Izuna was wounded by Tobirama, and wanted Madara to reach an olive branch to the Senju, Madara snapped at how his brother could say that after what the Senju did to their family, and so he killed him, taking his eyes and awakening the Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan, driven to basically become the god of a new world of his own making.

 

I would compare what I am gonna do with Madara in The Demon Within to Wesker from Resident Evil; he basically thinks himself as a god due to his powers and adding to his being a direct descendant of Indra's in the process, that he will do whatever it takes to achieve his goals, even if it means making others bow before him by force. He basically is just getting a lot of his ideas from comic books and his own madness due to his lust of power, but he owns all of what he does. He also would be only using the Akatsuki until their usefulness ends, and thus brings forth his true followers, kind of like what history has said about Hitler when he started with the SA, then replaced them with the SS.

 

I also explain story-wise that the Rinnegan is only awakened in a small amount of people who have blood tied to Hagoromo or Hamura (mostly Hagoromo), and that it is due to extreme emotion such as rage and fear that trigger it, but even then someone with it may not be able to completely control its powers since it is essentially becoming one with all of ninjutsu/ninshu. It also would be how Nagato has the Rinnegan as well, that as a part of the Uzumaki clan, his chakra allowed him to awaken it from the stress, fear, and rage of seeing his parents die awoke the Rinnegan in him.

 

I'm still hashing the deets out, but I got some good ideas for sure.

I love your ideas - so much more plot to explore, especially around madara and zetsu and obito. It shows just how much was skimmed over or not developed in the original story. Yeah, the Forth NInja War seems like just a holdover from the beginning of the story. Like they just didn't feel like changing that part of the ending. But it doesn't have to be there. And if you did Madara as a Snoke or Palpatine, that would totally work. And I love that Madara is not redeemable - why would he be!?! He's come this far in his quest for power, why would he change his personality now? (I always hated that about the original series - the never ending redemption of baddies.) And I agree with your idea of Orochimaru - he's such an underused character. Very much a double-agent type. It would be so cool to see him bringing back just some select Leaf ninja. And the background of the rinnegan — and really all the weird chakra abilities that fall outside named clan justus — need so much more explanation.  And tying those into how Nagato and the Uzumakis are connected (and, by extension, Naruto) was very much skipped over in the story. Cool to see how it develops!

 

I have this theory that Sakura is actually from the Uzumaki clan but extremely distantly related. Only thing have to go on is Sakura learning Tsunade moveset faster than average and her hair. Her father's hair is almost kinda red but darker. I wonder if it's something they had planned for her.

YES - what's up with her hair?! I have wondered that the whole time, if there was some forgotten storyline where Sakura's pink hair meant she was a distant descendant of the Uzumaki clan. And that, just like Kushina chakra control, Sakura's was extraordinary. That it's an Uzumaki trait. Which would explain why she is the only one at the level of Tsunade at such a young age. Every other person with red hair — Nagato, Karin — has uniquely amazing skills. So it makes sense that Sakura would too.

 

Sadly im not a writer, otherwise there would be a fanfic with that scenario.

I would start my Story around the time where Naruto is 18 years old and is heading back to Konoha for the first time, after Jiraiya took him out of the village to a better/hidden place, providing him a healthy/safe development regarding his status as a jinchuriki (i dislike the idea of Naruto being kept in the village after the destruction of the tailed beast, it just builds up tension from the villagers - and i think Jiraiya is the best Person to do that -> he knows his father, he is one of the strongest shinobis who can protect him and knows stuff about seals/jinchurikis). The reason of him heading back is because of the deal he made with Jiraiya, that he hast to go back if Jiraiya has fallen in the battle or manages to dies. (he can't walk around alone with the treath of akatsuki out there, and the gap of 18 years should have calmed the villagers a bit down) he would arrive in Konoha, basically as a stranger.. maybe due to the fact that only the 3rd Hokage knew the location of them, and after tsunade took over they both were suspected to be missed/dead. Slowly and surely he would try to integrate himself in the village, and meet the other konoha-nins for the first time. While he build up new relationships to give himself a new purpose in life after the death of jiraiya, some people slowy suspect him to be the lost jinchuriki which will open up old scars. ... and so on... 

Yep - right there with ya. Though in the manga, Part One Naruto and company were great for getting people acquainted with the village and the rules of their world, they quickly seem to young to be fighting people to the death. If Naruto's out of the village for his upbringing, I don't think he should return until he's more mature. 18 or older. That way he sidesteps all the youthful hijinks and has to relate to the Leaf nins when the stakes are so much higher. And having him come back also goes around the problem of why the village treated him so badly and how he could possibly love it as much as he did. It just becomes a non issue. And the whole tone of the story levels up. The rivalries become more pointed, the love interests become more real, the losses become much greater, etc. 

[Phantom_999]

Seeing this kills me.
 

Yet the Last claims he only loved her because rivalry. Seriously, kitten Studio Pierrot.

 
that is why if I ever speak with them, I will SHOVE THAT LOGIC DOWN THEIR THROATS and say why is Boruto X Sarada so heavily hinted at because Nardo and Sakura are not even friends then!!!!!!!! Boruto should just "get it on" with Suminata!!!

Edited by Phantom_999, 22 October 2018 - 04:57 PM.

[Illnevergiveup3]

I have this theory that Sakura is actually from the Uzumaki clan but extremely distantly related. Only thing have to go on is Sakura learning Tsunade moveset faster than average and her hair. Her father's hair is almost kinda red but darker. I wonder if it's something they had planned for her.

 

if that was true, would that mean that they would be family to each other, which would mean if they got married, that it would be disgusting? Which makes me hope that the theory isn't true.

[RulesofNature]

I'm really starting to think they should have rethought Minato's personality. Like, what I think they should have done is have him be a more cold character. Someone skilled, feared, put the good of the village ahead of the lives of it's individual members and a warmonger. It would really say something about the system if this was the actual person Naruto idolized, and part of Naruto's growth would have been him coming to realize the reality of who the Fourth was. Hell, you don't even need to make him Naruto's father, just have Naruto coming to terms with Minato was everything wrong with the ninja system.

[tricksie]

 

if that was true, would that mean that they would be family to each other, which would mean if they got married, that it would be disgusting? Which makes me hope that the theory isn't true.

yeah....I think of it more of if they were in the same clan then it'd be like they were from the same village or country (Whirlpool) waaaaaay back. And you married into it or within this large group. Like Ino's clan or Shikamaru's or the Hyuugas, etc. Those have got to be a big extended group of people. Naruto marrying a distantly related Sakura is way less creepy to me than Neji crushing on Hinata, and the long running hint that that they might be paired. (Even though cousins-marrying-cousins was not uncommon in feudal Japan.)

 

I'm really starting to think they should have rethought Minato's personality. Like, what I think they should have done is have him be a more cold character. Someone skilled, feared, put the good of the village ahead of the lives of it's individual members and a warmonger. It would really say something about the system if this was the actual person Naruto idolized, and part of Naruto's growth would have been him coming to realize the reality of who the Fourth was. Hell, you don't even need to make him Naruto's father, just have Naruto coming to terms with Minato was everything wrong with the ninja system.

Naruto was so much like Kushina, but it's really hard to see Minato's personality in him. Minato was quiet and calm and tremendously lethal. Sooooo not like Naruto. It would have been interesting to have had an arc where Naruto confronted what Minato must have been like, and what it took to be the type of Hokage Minato was (quiet and firm and not afraid to use his speed to wipe out whole battalions of nins). Then Naruto could make a decision that he wanted to do things differently, his own way. 

 

We know so little about Minato, so he may have actually been very cold and calculating, just like you said. Every other leader they've has been shown to be willing to do whatever it took to protect the village, even some pretty unscrupulous things. So there's no way Minato could have come out squeaky clean. It would have been interesting for Naruto to have to come to terms with this. 

[Riverkid]

Yep - right there with ya. Though in the manga, Part One Naruto and company were great for getting people acquainted with the village and the rules of their world, they quickly seem to young to be fighting people to the death. If Naruto's out of the village for his upbringing, I don't think he should return until he's more mature. 18 or older. That way he sidesteps all the youthful hijinks and has to relate to the Leaf nins when the stakes are so much higher. And having him come back also goes around the problem of why the village treated him so badly and how he could possibly love it as much as he did. It just becomes a non issue. And the whole tone of the story levels up. The rivalries become more pointed, the love interests become more real, the losses become much greater, etc. 

I can only aprove your point. They are not living in the wild, where a killing-survival-mentality would be beneficial, even in such a young age (like Naruto in your Fanfic: a voice in the wind). They are living a safe place, trying to become shinobis. To be a shinobi you need a right mindset, so you are able to execute orders/task in a strong point of view. A 12 year old, or even a 16 year old, human shouldn't be near having the developed experience to understand his responsilbities at the full extent and 'how' the best execution, given the task, should be handled.

The first Problem is having a 16 year old guy as your 'hero'. He is 16! how can a 16 year old guy be able to carry the world ? How can a 16 year old guy discuss a mature topic with Nagato who was like 35 year old and even convince him ? A 20-25 old guy could 'maybe' perform something like that, but not 16. Just compare to it to Kakashi who already carried a war in his experience-list, and still had much less influence than his student before any of them turned 18. 

The second Problem is what you mentioned. just a non-issue. he acts like konoha is his big family, ignoring the fact what they did to him. he acts like that chasing sasuke is a zero-threat, ignoring the fact how many of his friends (including sakura) died nearly because of that. Even when they praised him as a hero, there were 0 thoughts of him questioning the double-faced villagers who now seek to him for protection because he got stronger. He just accept it, plain and static.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

I love your ideas - so much more plot to explore, especially around madara and zetsu and obito. It shows just how much was skimmed over or not developed in the original story. Yeah, the Forth NInja War seems like just a holdover from the beginning of the story. Like they just didn't feel like changing that part of the ending. But it doesn't have to be there. And if you did Madara as a Snoke or Palpatine, that would totally work. And I love that Madara is not redeemable - why would he be!?! He's come this far in his quest for power, why would he change his personality now? (I always hated that about the original series - the never ending redemption of baddies.) And I agree with your idea of Orochimaru - he's such an underused character. Very much a double-agent type. It would be so cool to see him bringing back just some select Leaf ninja. And the background of the rinnegan — and really all the weird chakra abilities that fall outside named clan justus — need so much more explanation.  And tying those into how Nagato and the Uzumakis are connected (and, by extension, Naruto) was very much skipped over in the story. Cool to see how it develops!

 

Thanks, Trickster. :) The idea I figure was to try to make things make more sense with what I am aiming and all of that, especially with how much the canon skipped over.

[gamma]

The second Problem is what you mentioned. just a non-issue. he acts like konoha is his big family, ignoring the fact what they did to him. he acts like that chasing sasuke is a zero-threat, ignoring the fact how many of his friends (including sakura) died nearly because of that. Even when they praised him as a hero, there were 0 thoughts of him questioning the double-faced villagers who now seek to him for protection because he got stronger. He just accept it, plain and static.

 

Yes. It makes him look ignorant and childish if he wasn't hinted to have at least an ounce of cynicism in him at one point after the war. They did Naruto an injustice by making him accept Konoha's praise without letting him see the though the irony behind it.

 

Like the moment in the movie where girls were all over Naruto, giving him presents and swooning over him. Should that not have offed him, at all? Made him go "hmm this is great... but if I wasn't the hero that you needed, how would you all have treated me then?"

 

I'm really starting to think they should have rethought Minato's personality. Like, what I think they should have done is have him be a more cold character. Someone skilled, feared, put the good of the village ahead of the lives of it's individual members and a warmonger. It would really say something about the system if this was the actual person Naruto idolized, and part of Naruto's growth would have been him coming to realize the reality of who the Fourth was. Hell, you don't even need to make him Naruto's father, just have Naruto coming to terms with Minato was everything wrong with the ninja system.

 

Yeah, he seems too perfect. Like a rosebush without any thorns.   It would have added much more depth to him too if he was shown to be aware of Konoha's deep dark secrets, missions and deeds but actively choosing to ignoring it and their consequences. I do like his personality, calm and kind, but there is just no edge or aggression behind it that you usually associate leaders with. It makes him look rather submissive imo.

 

Does anyone recall Schneizel, from Code Geass? Minato and him are very similar in respect to character and intelligence as leaders.

 

But Schneizel was much more deceptive with his kindness and charm. He used it as a ruse to gain the loyalty and respect of his subordinates and siblings, showing care for them one moment, but was willing to throw them aside had they got in his way of ambition in the next. He reassured his blind sister he wouldn't intentionally murder thousands of innocent lives, but he did it anyways.

 

This is the kind of edge I'm referring to (not as crazy though!) where he used his charm and white lies as a means for control and support, a weapon of sorts. Sincere on the outside, not so much underneath. I believe his could have been applied to Minato as well.

[Bail o' Lies]

Minato was describe by everyone that talked about him as mister perfect, which also made him Mr. Bland when you finally start having him appear. He did have the picture we first saw that made him looks strict, also somewhat with Kakashi's gaiden. So, kishimoto may have thought of making him strict/serious, but probably changed that when he identified him as "himself married to his wife."

Edited by Bail o' Lies, 23 October 2018 - 12:35 PM.

[Hanabi]

[jak123]

Marketing never made sense for Naruto if Sakura was supposedly not the main heroine. 

[gamma]

Minato was describe by everyone that talked about him as mister perfect, which also made him Mr. Bland when you finally start having him appear. He did have the picture we first saw that made him looks strict, also somewhat with Kakashi's gaiden. So, kishimoto may have thought of making him strict/serious, but probably changed that when he identified him as "himself married to his wife."

I feel like he’s kind of a fan service-y character? You mostly see him in what if scenarios with Kushina and baby Naruto as an ideal father, like the products above. I mean he really does remind me of Hinata in that way, cause they’re both perfect and boring but ambiguous enough for fans to fill in the holes for themselves and have fun with it. I don’t think they’d ever want to stain him as a two faced person because it would ruin his image.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

 

Marketing never made sense for Naruto if Sakura was supposedly not the main heroine. 

 

Yeah. And it's just to lure back others like us who've told Studio Pierrot, Shueisha, and Kishimoto to &$^% right off for what they did to us!!

[LuckyChi7]

I hate to be the buzzkill here guys, but the Sakura in that pin really pisses me off.. I mean  I know hair length shouldn't matter but it's a very big deal when it comes to Sakura's character because the hair cut is suppose to represent growth.  Every time I see Part II Sakura with her long hair it only reminds of that scene in 699 as regression in Sakura's character! and I will always stand by that no matter what. 

 

 

 

 

This was and will always be the Sakura I support till the end of time no matter what! 

 

Whoever that kitten in the pin is nothing more than an empty shell of who she was! 

 

 

 

Sorry to come off as negative guys, it's just something that's always bugged me since the ending of the series. 

[Phantom_999]

Nah don't think of it like that. Her character regression happened at 693, not 699. She still had short hair there. And remember her character regression had to happen because Naruto HAD to be a pity prize to Hinata, or else it wouldn't make sense. Sasuke had done nothing but break her heart in part II all the way up to the end and she was STILL pining for him which makes it look down right unsympathetic at this point. If she really wanted to be happy her love for Naruto would have been confirmed long ago. BUT NOOOOOOOOO............... All stupid, greedy authorities wanted to effing milk this damn love triangle for as long as possible even though it is NOT A LOVE TRIANGLE at this point, sensibly speaking.

 

P.S. I'd like to comment on something regarding the planning stages for "The Last" at a later date becasue I just realized something

Edited by Phantom_999, 20 November 2018 - 07:26 PM.

[gamma]

Sakura’s bangs is what’s killing me. I’m here for that forehead and so was Naruto smh

[tricksie]

The first Problem is having a 16 year old guy as your 'hero'. He is 16! how can a 16 year old guy be able to carry the world ? How can a 16 year old guy discuss a mature topic with Nagato who was like 35 year old and even convince him ? A 20-25 old guy could 'maybe' perform something like that, but not 16. Just compare to it to Kakashi who already carried a war in his experience-list, and still had much less influence than his student before any of them turned 18. 

The second Problem is what you mentioned. just a non-issue. he acts like konoha is his big family, ignoring the fact what they did to him. he acts like that chasing sasuke is a zero-threat, ignoring the fact how many of his friends (including sakura) died nearly because of that. Even when they praised him as a hero, there were 0 thoughts of him questioning the double-faced villagers who now seek to him for protection because he got stronger. He just accept it, plain and static.

Maybe Naruto could have spoken to Nagato if there had been real trials and tribulations that separated him from the group in the manga. Like if his happy smile really hid a dark-Sasuke-like interior, where he was seriously in trouble of falling into that dark role. But...at no point is he ever in danger of becoming like Sasuke. Sure he says he understands him, but how can he really? At no point in the manga was he like Sasuke and going to leave, throw over his whole life for some personal goal. So yeah, how can he relate to Nagato, Konan, Obito, Sasuke or anyone else...and then be expected to change the ninja world as the chosen one? He's 16 with very limited life experiences.

 

That might have been different if he'd taken a closer look at the situations around him and people who were supposed to care for him in Konoha. If he'd questioned or even seriously rebelled, outside of some juvenile graffiti. But he never does. And yeah, he chasing Sasuke (at the peril of everyone he knows) to force him to come home to a place Sasuke should rightfully hate is veeerrrry different than Naruto have a parallel life experience then understanding him because he lived through his own hell. But by the time the manga starts, we are told to believe that the worst part of Naruto's life is behind him in his childhood. But this is always that part he draws on when he tries to relate to every other bad guy in the series! wtf?

 

 

Yeah, he seems too perfect. Like a rosebush without any thorns.   It would have added much more depth to him too if he was shown to be aware of Konoha's deep dark secrets, missions and deeds but actively choosing to ignoring it and their consequences. I do like his personality, calm and kind, but there is just no edge or aggression behind it that you usually associate leaders with. It makes him look rather submissive imo.

 

Does anyone recall Schneizel, from Code Geass? Minato and him are very similar in respect to character and intelligence as leaders.

 

But Schneizel was much more deceptive with his kindness and charm. He used it as a ruse to gain the loyalty and respect of his subordinates and siblings, showing care for them one moment, but was willing to throw them aside had they got in his way of ambition in the next. He reassured his blind sister he wouldn't intentionally murder thousands of innocent lives, but he did it anyways.

 

This is the kind of edge I'm referring to (not as crazy though!) where he used his charm and white lies as a means for control and support, a weapon of sorts. Sincere on the outside, not so much underneath. I believe his could have been applied to Minato as well.

Yes!! Minato MUST have known the bad stuff the Konoha was up to. There's no way he couldn't have. The growing unrest in the Uchiha clan, Danzo, etc. etc. It's the same with Itachi — people may want to think he's some kind of good guy, but he was still a mass murderer. He got in to Akatsuki on his own merits, as a monster just like the rest of them. And his killing spree didn't stop there, he killed and killed again for Akatsuki after he'd wiped out his own family. Including jinchuriki. They wouldn't have let him in to the group if he wasn't ready and willing to commit heinous crimes. Same for Minato — he wasn't able to become Hokage because he was such a nice guy. He became Kage because he was such an efficient killer and was willing to do whatever it took — good or bad — to keep Konoha on top. There is no way he's as squeaky clean as the flashbacks make him. In reality, he was probably much more calculating and cold.

 

Minato was describe by everyone that talked about him as mister perfect, which also made him Mr. Bland when you finally start having him appear. He did have the picture we first saw that made him looks strict, also somewhat with Kakashi's gaiden. So, kishimoto may have thought of making him strict/serious, but probably changed that when he identified him as "himself married to his wife."

Yes and wouldn't it be nice if we saw a flashback or gaiden story where Minato was in fact cold, hard, unforgiving and married to his job, before falling in love with someone and having someone to save broke him out of that, at least a little bit. And that changed his perspective on Konoha. If we saw Minato have to change and find a reason to live or protect, then it could cut to Naruto having to learn the same lesson, through teammates and love interests, in the same village. It would connect their stories together nicely. 

 

I feel like he’s kind of a fan service-y character? You mostly see him in what if scenarios with Kushina and baby Naruto as an ideal father, like the products above. I mean he really does remind me of Hinata in that way, cause they’re both perfect and boring but ambiguous enough for fans to fill in the holes for themselves and have fun with it. I don’t think they’d ever want to stain him as a two faced person because it would ruin his image.

Yes absolutely. Both are cardboard props — nice to look at from the front, but don't get to close cause there's nothing behind them.

 

Minato, the kindly leader...yet who couldn't have gotten to that position without being willing to kill whole armies of men in a single go. And implants a demon in his hours-old son in an effort to keep the power within Konoha, instead of trying to save his child and his wife.

 

And Hinata, the sweet, shy, beautiful clan princess...yet who stands by while all other promising nins in her family are robbed of their full power so she can move forward, only to throw away her position by giving up her role as clan head to marry Naruto and never fight again. 

 

I think both characters have a lot of deep, deep flaws. And it would have been much more gratifying if the story had Naruto recognize come to terms with those flaws, make peace with it, then turn to Sakura who has only ever given him unconditional support.

[rikakim94]

 

The anime studio is deperate they already pushed the naruto fanbase away why try to bring narusaku back? Damage is loooong done. Nothing about naruto was great, I even think all the pairings including narusaku wasn't fully developed. Naruto himself was childish, ignorant, naive,selfish for sasuke and dumb as hell. Im okay with him having a terrible ending. 

Edited by rikakim94, 24 October 2018 - 06:15 PM.