54175 replies to this topic

[TheFirstEvil100]

Like NarutoUzumaki01 said,  it's fruitless to argue with this person on the matter.   She claims to be a N/S fan  but her callous  attitude and arguments against it, in spite of evidence that they were the intended pairing and their obvious compatibility, more than accentuate her distaste for them as a couple. 

Cause she is not one she can keep saying she is one, her job may be to show true facts but its to try and turn us all on each other,

[NarutoUzumaki01]

Here we go again©

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

Here we go again©

 

*sigh* I'll go get the snacks and coffee and other drinks, we're gonna be here a while...

Edited by Bryon_Konoha_Ninja, 05 October 2017 - 07:22 PM.

[NarutoUzumaki01]

First, yes I am.

Second: This makes no sense. Turning everyone against eachother by showing true facts? Now we're making up conspiracies. 

You can keep writing all the general phrases about NS (that you are clearly not a fan of), and have your own opinion, people have their own opinion about your actions, you have no need to justify any of your actions. This discussion speaks volumes. Truth being said, maybe you consider finding forum that supports your opinion much more? There is plenty of people who fill appreciate your pov, and little to no one here. 

[Yojeveka]

You can keep writing all the general phrases about NS (that you are clearly not a fan of), and have your own opinion, people have their own opinion about your actions, you have no need to justify any of your actions. This discussion speaks volumes. Truth being said, maybe you consider finding forum that supports your opinion much more? There is plenty of people who fill appreciate your pov, and little to no one here. 

 

She said she likes to be the "lone wolf", that's her excuse to keep posting here. 

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

You can keep writing all the general phrases about NS (that you are clearly not a fan of), and have your own opinion, people have their own opinion about your actions, you have no need to justify any of your actions. This discussion speaks volumes. Truth being said, maybe you consider finding forum that supports your opinion much more? There is plenty of people who fill appreciate your pov, and little to no one here. 

 

Agreed, considering that in the long run, Analyzer, we're NOT trying to turn against anyone, we're just trying to point out we have given you details, but you just keep ignoring them and replace them with what you wanna believe is legitimate and true, so it makes it really difficult for us to believe you are truly a NaruSaku fan if you keep thinking it was just a crush or one-sided when the story before it got retconned by Kishimoto thanks to his editors at the time, and NH fans on YouTube and such changing his mind had shown it wasn't infatuation or a crush, it was love.

Edited by Bryon_Konoha_Ninja, 05 October 2017 - 07:28 PM.

[TheFirstEvil100]

 

Agreed, considering that in the long run, Analyzer, we're NOT trying to turn against anyone, we're just trying to point out we have given you details, but you just keep ignoring them and replace them with what you wanna believe is legitimate and true, so it makes it really difficult for us to believe you are truly a NaruSaku fan if you keep thinking it was just a crush or one-sided when the story before it got retconned by Kishimoto thanks to his editors at the time, and NH fans on YouTube and such changing his mind had shown it wasn't infatuation or a crush, it was love.

 

Yep we all know Naruto loved Sakura, and she was growing to love him it was slow and I know Sakura was faling in love with Naruto, no if or buts or even maybe she was slowly falling in love with Naruto. This was until Kishi and SP retconed everything to best suite Hinata and her fans, and because Kishi loved the Uchiha and his narrow minded view on women as well, that still make me stick that he said Sakura would be a bad women for moving on but that is for another topic all together.

 

I mean I brought this up before did other manga pairings need a flim on how two people got together, again they didn't and yet  'she' keeps on bring up that it was needed to show why, no if it was in the manga they it would not be needed, and if so why don't we get ones with how Ino and Sai got together and the others as well?

 

Why cause this was all to change and make NS look bad and for the NH fans all happy cause the kittened so much, while we had stupid faith in Kishi that he would do what was right, and cause Kishi watched NH youtubers as well.

 

Face it no matter how much she tries we all know Naruto was kittened up just to make Hinata and her fans all happy yeah that have a kitten son who acts like and even worse version than Sasuke.

[lupina]

 

She said she likes to be the "lone wolf", that's her excuse to keep posting here. 

 

That explains a lot. 

[Shadow Wolf]

If Naruto did not love Sakura, then I wonder why he commented about being strong when you protect someone important to you...



I also wonder why he made the promise of a lifetime.... Oh wait, it was dismissed because he wanted to save Sasuke too... Oh, than I wonder why he didn't want to confess his feelings to Sakura because he has not kept this promise yet... Nope... He didn't love Sakura at all /sarcasm

By the way, nowhere in the manga Naruto said that he loved Hinata either... Heck, we needed a movie for him to say that apparently, and at the cost of him mistaking love to someone with love for food. Then he became stronger for food I guess...


Seriously, this is not difficult to grasp. He loved Sakura, for he we above and beyond to protect her and make her happy. Many people realized that he loves Sakura, and even if Shizune made the remark of Naruto saving Sasuke for himself TOO...



...Not even Shizune denied Naruto's feelings either. So if anyone wants to go against the argument of Naruto not loving Sakura throughout the course of the whole manga (excluding pretty much chapters 699,700, which by the way never state that Naruto gave up on her anyway. At best if could imply that he sacrificed himself because of Sakura's obsession with Sasuke, as seen in chapter 699), then hey, it means that almost EVERY character (Shino, Kiba, Sai, Shizune, Yamato, Kakashi, Ino, Chouji, TenTen, Rock Lee, Shikamaru, and even Hinata herself, who was outside the tent when all of this was happening) was wrong. And I restate this again: No one, absolutely no one, mentioned throughout the whole manga that Naruto did not love Sakura. On the contrary, pretty much every character in the manga knows this.

Edited by Shadow Wolf, 05 October 2017 - 07:58 PM.

[sushi.]

I'm sorry, I hope this isn't rude, but there are parts of this debate that are pointless.

I'm sorry but none of the ships made sense in the end. This includes NaruSaku.

If NaruSaku had remotely made sense, why is the fandom so split then? Why are are we so widely divided between NaruSaku vs. NaruHina and SasuSaku?

I agree with Analyzer, in a sense.

For me, Kishi's biggest mistake was the love triangle. It was prolonged to the point where every ship had a chance for credible endgame.

At the top of my head, I can recall three points where NaruSaku had the opportunity to be "endgame" without actually being endgame.

Both NaruHina and SasuSaku aren't some loud minority; there is a reason why the NaruHina fandom suddenly grew in size after 436 and 615, and why SasuSaku remained dominate even with Part 2. Kishi gave them ammo just like he gave us ammo with NaruSaku.

Because the fandom doesn't disagree on what ship got the best development, but which girl is the best. Not necessarily for Naruto, just the best.

Edited by sushi., 05 October 2017 - 08:54 PM.

[My Living Curse]

 

Where in the manga does Naruto say he loves Sakura though?

 

Would like to see it. I'd concede all of my points and agree that it was a retcon -if- that is proven true, because the depth of Naruto's feelings are never quantified that way. I am happy to concede, I really am. There's absolutely nothing wrong with an imperfect manga, and it would be a point I would bring forward myself on the manga flaws.

 

Before the ending, we could -speculate- it was love. But with 700, we cannot. That's the issue with the theory I'm debating against, it can never rise beyond at most speculation. Speculation isn't fact. New Information confirming something isn't a retcon. This is why I am arguing that this information is not being reconciled as a critical flaw of the debater's argument.  But if there is a chapter with that moment of Naruto saying he loves Sakura, give the chapter number and I'll read it. 

 

 

Did...Did..I..I read that right? DId she just ask if/when Naruto ever loved Sakura? 

 

I mean I know you've got your opinions and preferences, but did you actually just ask that?

 

And I'm most likely just taking the obvious troll bait. SIlly me. But still. Dear Lord. 

[Phantom_999]

 

Where in the manga does Naruto say he loves Sakura though?

 

Would like to see it. I'd concede all of my points and agree that it was a retcon -if- that is proven true, because the depth of Naruto's feelings are never quantified that way. I am happy to concede, I really am. There's absolutely nothing wrong with an imperfect manga, and it would be a point I would bring forward myself on the manga flaws.

 

Before the ending, we could -speculate- it was love. But with 700, we cannot. That's the issue with the theory I'm debating against, it can never rise beyond at most speculation. Speculation isn't fact. New Information confirming something isn't a retcon. This is why I am arguing that this information is not being reconciled as a critical flaw of the debater's argument.  But if there is a chapter with that moment of Naruto saying he loves Sakura, give the chapter number and I'll read it. 

 

Well, I redirect that question at you. WHERE IN THE MANGA did Naruto say that he loved Hinata? Or better yet, where in the manga did another character state unambiguously that Naruto loved Hinata? In a story, it makes sense if one or more characters can see that a particular character has romantic feelings for someone else. You want to deny Naruto loved Sakura? Fine, by all means. But we ask you to at least SHOW ONE PANEL where Naruto explicitly states on a way that can not be debated that he loves HInata. I'm not talking about "The Last" movie, only manga.

 

And don't try and weasel your way out of this question by stating  his actions have done so, because that is not what "analyzing" is, that is just lazy and vague. if there is no context to say why Naruto does anything for Hinata, why can't we throw your argument back at you and state he was only doing anything for Her out of platonic affection then? 

Edited by Phantom_999, 07 October 2017 - 03:11 AM.

[Illnevergiveup3]

 

Have you asked people why they like SS?

 

 

If I didn't know any better, it seems as though I sort of offended you by saying this. Then again, not surprised considering your credentials on this site so far. Quite frankly, I don't give a kitten why they like it. It was a pairing with little development, with Sasuke attempting to kill her more than twice, and with him abusing her both emotionally, mentally, and might I say physically.

 

 

 

 Because it's not the reason you put forward.

 

 

lol, why does it seem as though you're talking from experience? Once again, not surprised considering your resume and career on this site. Lol, you actually have a lot of confidence behind this statement. Go on... tell us you're an SS/NH agent and get it off your chest, I won't make fun of you, I'll laugh a lot, but I won't make fun of you.
 

 

 

 I've never really seen it put forward as a reason. 

 

 

Nooooo, don't retract your confidence from the previous statement as if you know from the heart the reasons why they(YOU) likes SS, I guess you realized you was exposing yourself as the SS/NH fan that I know you are, and then attempted to cover it up with this next statement.

 

 

 

 

Naruto also never loved Sakura. He had a crush, it faded, he moved on. He didn't move on to Hinata just because Sakura was "out of the way", or that he had no choice. (This fails to reconcile with the fact he had many fans post-699). 

 

 

you state that as if it's fact lol, even though the Manga clearly shows otherwise. Him making the Promise of a Lifetime, him telling Sai he couldn't confess because the promise, him putting Sakura-Chan's happiness over his own, someone even as emotionally inept as Sai noticing that Naruto loves her, Sakura-Chan acknowledging that Naruto loves her based on the flashbacks she had about the promise he made to her, her getting labeled as his important person to protect as Shadow Wolf showed above ALL clearly shows he loves her, but you dismiss them conveniently since they don't fit into your NH/SS narrative, which doesn't surprise me in the least. Remember, he called Sakura-Chan his girlfriend in front of Hinata? Or was that page conveniently missing in your version of the Manga?

 

 

 

Main character status is rather irrelevant to this point as well.

 

 

the story is literally about NARUTO'S dreams lol and him achieving them, and by that definition, Sakura-Chan was his dream girl and that's who he was supposed to be with, she was the girl he loves, and nothing in the story shows otherwise, even up to Chapter 699. 

Edited by Illnevergiveup3, 06 October 2017 - 07:15 AM.

[My Living Curse]

The story is literally about becoming Hinata's husband and saving Sasuke, and by that definition, Hinata-sama was his dream girl and that's who he was supposed to be with, she was the girl he loves, and nothing in the story shows otherwise, even up to Chapter 699. 

 

Fixed that for you. Apparently this is what the story was really all about. We've been reading it wrong all along folks! 

[thelordofspace72]

Naruto and Sakura belong to each other. But the writer is not confident in himself. Why made Hinata one of the main characters in the end while she was a secondary character since the beginning of the manga? What about lee why he did not have the chance to get his love? You tell me that Hinata paid a bribe to get what she wants?

[lupina]

Lol, not even "Narutos Actions" have shown that he "loves" or "could have loved" Hinata pre 699/700, because she barely appears there.

Supposedly, Naruto had Feelings he didn't know he had -> Naruto had Feelings for her, but at the same time, he didnt had them, what is a contradiction in itself -> Illogical because it is impossible

 

When you have Feelings for someone, you know it. You might not be sure about their nature (Like Sakura), but YOU KNOW you have them (constantly thinking about them, wanting to be near the Person etc.). It was never indicated nor shown that Naruto had feelings for Hinata that went beyond friendship/comeradeship. He never thought about her besides her character arc in part 1. He never pursued her. He never made an effort to spend time with her.

 

How are we supposed to know he had Feelings for her? We can't. It is/was spure speculation and wishful thinking, at best.

[sushi.]

 
No, if you have feelings for someone, you do not necessarily know, Lupina. That is not a fact. You are right that  it was never indicated that Naruto's feelings for Hinata went beyond friendship/comradeship, but it was also never shown that they didn't do this, which is -required- for it to be a retcon. 
 
And it's not a contradiction because that's not what it is. It's Naruto didn't know he had feelings, not that he didn't have them

Put this on a wall everyone. Silly~ analyzer is not only admitting the writing is horsekitten and that NH came out of nowehere, she's also contradicting herself because she says she saw NH coming. You can't do that.., if romantic feelings were never indicated for N>H.

Edited by sushi., 06 October 2017 - 02:40 PM.

[lupina]

And there, the bending starts again.

[Kagomaru]

And there, the bending starts again.

Do you think she'll ever give up the ghost or is that about as hopeless as Naruto redeeming Sasuke and Sasuke actually loving Sakura?

Edited by Kagomaru, 06 October 2017 - 05:40 PM.

[lupina]

Do you think she'll ever give up the ghost or is that about as hopeless as Naruto redeeming Sasuke and Sasuke actually Sakura?

 

As long as she finds pleasure in this - for whatever reason - I don't think so.