31571 replies to this topic

[Bail o' Lies]

It's why they also cone after us like they do. They know their "win" is Pyrrhic so they need to attack us to feel better.

It also the only thing they both can agree on, anything else would devolve into a spat.

 

Though the France thing is nice it not really gonna change anything immediately. If the execs notice they will be happy about the profits and hope Boruto will also sell well there (especially with Kishi back) if it doesn't they will get annoyed and ask their analysts and market people why that's not the case. They'll wander around the real issue and make excuses. Some might remember it because they were convinced by some people to go with a certain ending. But you're putting faith that Executives would remember or admit to that or that their researchers would just tell them that.

Edited by Bail o' Lies, 23 January 2021 - 12:39 AM.

[Phantom_999]

In 2020 France bought 1.2 million copies of Naruto volumes (Not Boruto)

 

...They were buying them because they were bored during the lockdown. Also Jujutsu Kaisen is also doing well. This might have help kishi by showing their still a market for Naruto, just depends on how the exec take it.

 

From what I understand France's market is actually the largest international buyer of manga.

 

I believe so, since I see so many manga being translated in French before English on my e-reader actually

 

Good! In a way more people will know how the original content was told and more people will question the ending :)

 

Anyone that wasn't enamored with Hinata and her "mating wants" already questioned the ending when It first came out, but agreed.  The question is though, how many are going to be objective about it?

Edited by Phantom_999, 25 January 2021 - 05:18 PM.

[James S Cassidy]

The only problem is that we can say for sure that the NH and SS fans will call them salty pairing fans. That they read it wrong and NH was planned from the start.

Because to the pro-Enders facts will never matter to them, they will be happy with their own way of thinking about the ending. Only caring that Hinata is the one that gets the happy ending she needs.

My problem with this is how just totally wrong it is. Not just opinion, but factually wrong.

I have so many interviews where Kishimoto expressing how Hinata was never in his headlights; how surprised he was that Hinata was popular and tried to make Sakura more popular by way of making her....more pretty? Whatever. He even said he avoided writing any kind of romance cause he was bad at it.

Point is, all the interviews have him talking about how SAKURA was the love interest, was the main heroine, and more....how he tried to push her.

It was only recently when Naruto the Last was released did he start saying Hinata was the main heroine, how NH was planned from the beginning, and how he pushed them together. It is not a coincidence an d even now he is still on the fence in interviews. It is everyone ELSE putting words in his mouth while Kishimoto remains ambiguous. It is almost like he doesn't know anything. Almost like someone else had to write it.

[Illnevergiveup3]

My problem with this is how just totally wrong it is. Not just opinion, but factually wrong.

I have so many interviews where Kishimoto expressing how Hinata was never in his headlights; how surprised he was that Hinata was popular and tried to make Sakura more popular by way of making her....more pretty? Whatever. He even said he avoided writing any kind of romance cause he was bad at it.

Point is, all the interviews have him talking about how SAKURA was the love interest, was the main heroine, and more....how he tried to push her.

It was only recently when Naruto the Last was released did he start saying Hinata was the main heroine, how NH was planned from the beginning, and how he pushed them together. It is not a coincidence an d even now he is still on the fence in interviews. It is everyone ELSE putting words in his mouth while Kishimoto remains ambiguous. It is almost like he doesn't know anything. Almost like someone else had to write it.

can't imagine writing for something you never wanted in the first place. Would make sense that he doesn't know what's going on, or how SS got "married." If asked about how NS got married, I imagine he would have a whole segment dedicated to it, because his heart would actually be in it. I know he has the script for NS getting married in the epilogue just sitting in his drawer.

[BlueStarSaber]

Retrospect Greg has done a video putting together all his rise and fall of Naruto series

[TheFirstEvil100]

Retrospect Greg has done a video putting together all his rise and fall of Naruto series

Oh man, that will go on for a while.

[Phantom_999]

My problem with this is how just totally wrong it is. Not just opinion, but factually wrong.

I have so many interviews where Kishimoto expressing how Hinata was never in his headlights; how surprised he was that Hinata was popular and tried to make Sakura more popular by way of making her....more pretty? Whatever. He even said he avoided writing any kind of romance cause he was bad at it.

Point is, all the interviews have him talking about how SAKURA was the love interest, was the main heroine, and more....how he tried to push her.

It was only recently when Naruto the Last was released did he start saying Hinata was the main heroine, how NH was planned from the beginning, and how he pushed them together. It is not a coincidence an d even now he is still on the fence in interviews. It is everyone ELSE putting words in his mouth while Kishimoto remains ambiguous. It is almost like he doesn't know anything. Almost like someone else had to write it.

 

That has ALWAYS been the case with SS and NH though. Straight up facts are completely ignored because these crack pairings must happen, logic be damned.

 

That aside Kishi can claim all he wants about how he's bad at romance and never intended to write it,  but then you ask, "why all the moments between Naruto and Sakura then?" I've already stated, if you wanted a manga to not focus on romance then don't put in potential romantic moments then. It's not that hard, with all of the ripping off he does from other series, Dragon Ball prominently, which might I add would make it especially easy.

Edited by Phantom_999, 24 January 2021 - 02:01 AM.

[BlueStarSaber]

My problem with this is how just totally wrong it is. Not just opinion, but factually wrong.

I have so many interviews where Kishimoto expressing how Hinata was never in his headlights; how surprised he was that Hinata was popular and tried to make Sakura more popular by way of making her....more pretty? Whatever. He even said he avoided writing any kind of romance cause he was bad at it.

Point is, all the interviews have him talking about how SAKURA was the love interest, was the main heroine, and more....how he tried to push her.

It was only recently when Naruto the Last was released did he start saying Hinata was the main heroine, how NH was planned from the beginning, and how he pushed them together. It is not a coincidence an d even now he is still on the fence in interviews. It is everyone ELSE putting words in his mouth while Kishimoto remains ambiguous. It is almost like he doesn't know anything. Almost like someone else had to write it.

 

I never got the try to make Sakura more pretty to make her more liked by Kishimoto. Did he really not know why Sakura was disliked by certain fans and was misinformed why some disliked her by the editors and SP staff or does he really have that shallow view of women and what makes them popular? Because if he did know the reasons some fans disliked her was because:

1. Her feelings for Sasuke as shallow and don't get why she would still love him after everything that he has personally done to her.
2. She didn't much fighting or display of her abilities after her fight against Sasori and only got small action scenes afterwards, like when she took out pain's centipede summon.
3. After the New team 7 arc her role became rather small in the following arcs and didn't get a major part again until the kage summit arc
4. They are diehard NH shippers and view her as a threat to their ship, so they bash and hate her.

He could of solved these issues by:

1. Get her to move on from her feelings for Sasuke and clearly show it, by ether show her questioning why she would still be in with him ay this point given what he has done or show more clearly that she is falling in love with Naruto.
2. Give her more solo one on fights or even proper teams ups, like having her fight Sasuke in the Kage summit arc, take part in the battle against the seven swordsmen like in storm 3 rather than just heal wounded soldiers and play a more active role in Team 7's fights against Obito, Madara & Kaguya. Heck kishimoto wanted to make her more popular he should of looked at 3rd databook were it showed her fight against sasori was ranked 3rd best, only sasuke vs deidara and sasuke vs itachi was scored higher. This shows that enough would enjoy she her in action more.
3. Have her involved more in arcs like the first half in the war and possibly show her developing her abilities and learning a bit more about stuff in the plot such as the history of the senju, Uzumaki & Uchiha clans, the white zetsus, learn why sasuke joined the akatsuki and get more involed with the jinjurki plotline and how she can help naruto as examples.
4. If they hate her because she is a threat to their ship, there is no really helping them. He is just going to have to ignore them and focus on developing why Narusaku will happen and why NH & SS won't work and try to avoid any strong teases that these ships will happen at all.
    

I do wonder if one day Kishimoto will ever come clean of what happened with the ending of Naruto, though that may only happen if Boruto ever finishes and that it becomes clear to shonen jump that it's just not profitable to keep the NH/Boruto canon going

[Illnevergiveup3]

in my opinion, her feelings for Naruto is clear. She loves him, she straight up said it and her actions did the talking for her. She might not have come to terms with it yet, due to her having to sort out the crush on Sasuke between what she feels for Naruto. But, it is clearer than a shark fin in open water that she loves him. By end, something big would happen to make her finally come to terms with it. And I believe Naruto confessing to her is what will wash away all of the confusion.

Her loving him is a given. Its more so about the journey of her REALIZING that she actually loves him. Narutos feelings is clear. No need to expand on it, we know he loves her, we know Naruto is a dude that is unchanging and is permanently firm in what he wants. The romance subplot should mainly focus on Sakura-Chans journey of pushing the crush on Sasuke out, while the love she has for Naruto slowly but surely makes it way to the surface.

Edited by Illnevergiveup3, 24 January 2021 - 11:21 AM.

[Phantom_999]

Exactly. Sakura's ACTIONS, not her words speak louder about he she feels about Naruto. She never goes that far for anyone else, Not even Sasuke or Ino. I voiced that opinion myself, a LOOOONG time ago that Sakura's behavior around Naruto is more of what you expect of a love interest than her squealing fangirl self with Sasuke, with bending her back over for him and telling him only what she think he wants to hear.

Edited by Phantom_999, 25 January 2021 - 05:17 PM.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

Exactly. Sakura's ACTIONS, not her words speak louder about he she feels about Naruto. She never goes that far for anyone else, Not even Sasuke or Ino. I voiced that opinion myself, a LOOOONG time ago that Sakura's behavior around Naruto is more of what you expect of a love interest than her squealing fangirl self with Sasuke, with bending her back over for him and telling him only what she think he wants to hear.

Exactly!

[Bail o' Lies]

 

I never got the try to make Sakura more pretty to make her more liked by Kishimoto. Did he really not know why Sakura was disliked by certain fans and was misinformed why some disliked her by the editors and SP staff or does he really have that shallow view of women and what makes them popular? Because if he did know the reasons some fans disliked her was because:

1. Her feelings for Sasuke as shallow and don't get why she would still love him after everything that he has personally done to her.
2. She didn't much fighting or display of her abilities after her fight against Sasori and only got small action scenes afterwards, like when she took out pain's centipede summon.
3. After the New team 7 arc her role became rather small in the following arcs and didn't get a major part again until the kage summit arc
4. They are diehard NH shippers and view her as a threat to their ship, so they bash and hate her.

He could of solved these issues by:

1. Get her to move on from her feelings for Sasuke and clearly show it, by ether show her questioning why she would still be in with him ay this point given what he has done or show more clearly that she is falling in love with Naruto.
2. Give her more solo one on fights or even proper teams ups, like having her fight Sasuke in the Kage summit arc, take part in the battle against the seven swordsmen like in storm 3 rather than just heal wounded soldiers and play a more active role in Team 7's fights against Obito, Madara & Kaguya. Heck kishimoto wanted to make her more popular he should of looked at 3rd databook were it showed her fight against sasori was ranked 3rd best, only sasuke vs deidara and sasuke vs itachi was scored higher. This shows that enough would enjoy she her in action more.
3. Have her involved more in arcs like the first half in the war and possibly show her developing her abilities and learning a bit more about stuff in the plot such as the history of the senju, Uzumaki & Uchiha clans, the white zetsus, learn why sasuke joined the akatsuki and get more involed with the jinjurki plotline and how she can help naruto as examples.
4. If they hate her because she is a threat to their ship, there is no really helping them. He is just going to have to ignore them and focus on developing why Narusaku will happen and why NH & SS won't work and try to avoid any strong teases that these ships will happen at all.
    

I do wonder if one day Kishimoto will ever come clean of what happened with the ending of Naruto, though that may only happen if Boruto ever finishes and that it becomes clear to shonen jump that it's just not profitable to keep the NH/Boruto canon going

It wasn't trying to make her more pretty to make her more liked by Kishimoto. It was Kishimoto was told Sakura wasn't liked because she wasn't pretty like Hinata. So, he tried constantly to make her better looking during the War arc in hopes fans would like her so he wouldn't have to replace her like his editors were demanding he do.

 

He wasn't told why she wasn't liked by the fans because the editors would have to explain why Hinata beyond she was cute and liked Naruto the longest. He likely didn't find out until he went looking after the ending.

 

Like I said Salad is pretty much Sakura 2.0 in the manga:

 

Sakura hits Naruto. Salad never hits Bolt. Though this is damaging to Bolt because it allows him to be obnoxious without the release valve that hitting does to make sure he doesn't become dislike by the fans.

 

Sakura didn't fight enough and cried too much. While Salad is barely in the manga she does something in every fight so far, and hasn't really cried outside her gaiden.

 

Sakura had a shallow goal of getting Sasuke and didn't do much especially in part one. Salad admires Naruto as a father figure, wants to become hokage, and works hard to reach her goal.

 

Sakura wasn't considered cute... They have certainly tired to make sure everyone considers Salad...sexy. ugh.

 

Sakura friendzone Naruto. Salad has been in love with Bolt since the chunin exam she just won't admit it, and most don't mind since she is everyone's' favorite character.

Edited by Bail o' Lies, 27 January 2021 - 03:30 AM.

[VanitasDS76491]

So I'm on the final episode of Naruto with the wedding and the first 5 episodes weren't that bad they were asuming but I don't like the last two episodes also I love they Naruto and hinata aren't in til the last two episodes
and it's done I'm finished with the Naruto anime and what the hell happened
Surprisingly Lee's episode in the wedding arc was the most assuming. And oddly I could see the weeding arc happening but with Sakura in hinata place.

Edited by VanitasDS76491, 26 January 2021 - 04:53 PM.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

It wasn't trying to make her more pretty to make her more liked by Kishimoto. It was Kishimoto was told Sakura wasn't liked because she wasn't pretty like Hinata. So, he tried constantly to make her better looking during the War arc in hopes fans would like her so he wouldn't have to replace her like his editors were demanding he do.
 
He wasn't told why she wasn't liked by the fans because the editors would have to explain why Hinata beyond she was cute and liked Naruto the longest. He likely didn't find out until he went looking after the ending.
 
Like I said Salad is pretty much Sakura 2.0 in the manga:
 
Sakura hits Naruto. Salad never hits Bolt. Though this is damaging to Bolt because it allows him to be obnoxious without the release valve that hitting does to make sure he doesn't become dislike by the fans.
 
Sakura didn't fight enough and cried too much. While Salad is barely in the manga she does something in ever fight so far, and hasn't really cried outside her gaiden.
 
Sakura had a shallow goal of getting Sasuke and didn't do much especially in part one. Salad admires Naruto as a father figure, wants to become hokage, and works hard to reach her goal.
 
Sakura wasn't considered cute... They have certainly tired to made sure to make everyone considers Salad...sexy. ugh.
 
Sakura friendzone Naruto. Salad has been in love with Bolt since the chunin exam she just won't admit it, and most don't mind since she is everyone's' favorite character.

Goes to show what double standards are being done with Boruto in terms of how Sarada is done, even given the irony she's technically Karin's daughter. And that makes me want to continue to avoid this nightmarish sequel and all it ruined abiut the franchise with its reverse Midas Touch effect....

[Phantom_999]

If Sarada is ever actually confirmed as Karins daughter I will drop another hypocrisy bomb. Karin haters LOVE kittening on Karin for acting like a libido crazed loonie for Sasuke. So I suppose how Sarada dresses in the manga and her introductory(?) lines make sense then. but again I don't necessarily care who the mother is, the family is dysfunction incarnate either way. But at least Sakura is a good mother, the start of the Gaiden aside

Edited by Phantom_999, 27 January 2021 - 06:34 PM.

[BlueStarSaber]

I have been asking grounding but does anyone know what tweet these guys are on about in regards to someone defending sakura and attacking people reasons why they dislike her? The video contains standard sakura bashing for a heads up https://youtu.be/gn0B7Ee7ZQU

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

I have been asking grounding but does anyone know what tweet these guys are on about in regards to someone defending sakura and attacking people reasons why they dislike her? The video contains standard sakura bashing for a heads up https://youtu.be/gn0B7Ee7ZQU

Not sure myself, but I can imagine these guys are full of it as an excuse to attack Sakura fans.

[Phantom_999]

Not even just Sakura fans, anyone ISINUATING that Sakura makes more sense to be the love interest rather than Hinata will have these "Hinata enforcers" rain holy hell down on them

[NaruSaku fan in Kentucky]

You know what's one thing that really bothers me? Naruto three away his mother's scarf and Hinata's fanboys don't give a damn.

[Nostradamus]

You know what's one thing that really bothers me? Naruto three away his mother's scarf and Hinata's fanboys don't give a damn.

Why would they?

They never cared about Naruto.