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Advice to Masashi Kishimoto and His Next Manga


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#1 LuckyChi7

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Posted 06 November 2017 - 03:56 AM

We all know that Kishi has a new sci-fi manga series he's planning to unveil practically since the end of the Naruto manga series,  and 4 years have passed since then. We haven't really heard any news about yet, so I decided to take the time to just layout major mistakes within the story of Naruto, and what Kishi can do to avoid making those mistakes again with his next manga series. 

 

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1.  Keep The Story Grounded With Themes

 

 

- Naruto had a great story premise about the underdog working his butt in order to be acknowledged by everyone in the villages.  

 

- Coming of Age:  Showcasing character growth from youth to childhood, which in terms of beginning of Part 1 to the end of Part 1 that almost feels like that was going to be the case. Some could even say that is something that could be seen in Part 2 atleast until after The Pain Arc. 

 

-  Hope:  There would always be situations that the Naruto series had, and you would actually feel that the characters would be in some kinda danger atleast that was the case until the latter half of Part 2. 

 

 

2.  Character Consistencies & Development

 

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It's been stated time after time that the characters were developing throughout the story of Naruto. However, one of the biggest and probably most glaring issues with Naruto are the character inconsistencies. Naruto is a good example of this,  the character like I said was all about hardwork the underdog, but what happend? Child of Prophecy,  The Reincarnation of a Demigod,  Ashura... what??  Another example,   Sasuke The guy wanted revenge against Itachi, and then he wanted revenge after finding out the truth which okay fine. The issue is Sasuke after that point just keeps shifting back and forth he could've easily went to Konoha after we awakened the EMS, but no Itachi came and he went Why Why? I'm like dude you have your goals stick to them.. I wanna be hokage,... Oh wait I wanna execute the five Kage..oh wait Naruto you're right.  Don't even get me started on Sakura cause we already know her issues.  

 

 

At the same time there comes a point of character development, and from what I noticed once you establish them for what they are, that's all they become.   No that's not how writing a series goes Kishi, if a character starts developing continue to develop them. 

 

-  End of Part 1 and beginning of Part 2  you have Naruto and Sakura still with the goal of getting Sasuke back.  That's fine for an intial premise after a timeskip, but don't just leave the characters. If anything by the 5 Kage Summit, you could have Naruto begin to question whether its worth saving Sasuke or not because of what he experienced in the Pain Arc. I'm not saying that yeah let Sasuke die immediately, but let him wonder if what he's doing is the right thing after what Sasuke has done.  The confession scene too with Sakura, you're telling me Sakura is that much a satellite character that she has to lie to Naruto because of Sasuke.  Her wanting to kill Sasuke was honestly not a bad call, but what happened? You back pedaled again you made her  revert to part 1.. Not being able to move passed that? I'm sorry that's called growing up! 

 

That's what you need to do when it comes to you series,  When your characters develop CONTINUE TO DEVELOP THEM DON'T BACK AT THE LAST SECOND. 

 

 

3.  Make the Side Characters Relevant

 

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This is an issue I've seen from alot of fans of Naruto... You make alot of character spotlight in the story, and all of a sudden when Part 2 starts they get shafted, why? For only Naruto and Sasuke? I'm sorry what? The wide variety of character you introduce to potentially  be something great in the story stick to it.   Cause let's be honest aside from Team 10,  the rest of the Konoha 9 got shafted really easily, and the same thing can be said about Team Yamato, Team Taka, may I add more? 

 

Keep that in mind Kishi, make sure they important in some way to the story. Don't just put them in the background like they're just absolutely pointless until the very end? Make sure you show progression in them throughout the story. 

 

 

4.   Develop The Female Characters 

 

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Masashi Kishimoto this by far is probably one of the biggest things you're known for. You are terrible at writing female characters, and you've admitted to that too. Sakura, Hinata, Ino, Temari, etc.  They are so one dimensional you put no effort into giving them depth and progression as characters. The closest and I'm being honest, the closest thing you had to even remotely sprout a seed toward an alright female character was Sarada Uchiha, and again that's after the original story.  Though what you're assistant has done with her character as of the Boruto Manga  :sick:  Hell even the female character from the Mario One-shot  Saori even she had something, even if it was vey little. 

 

So please Kishi, make sure that your female characters go through legit and I mean legit development, and not shaft them like you did in Naruto and leave them as one dimensional characters that aren't worth much.  

 

 

5. The Flashbacks!!

 

 

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It is no secret that Naruto for the most part kinda become a joke when it comes to 85% flashbacks cause they felt kinda pointless, and just reinforcing stuff that we already knew. Due to these redundant flashbacks it really affected the quality of of your story by  ten fold it's not even funny.   

  

 

My advice to you on that is  Only do the flashbacks when they are necessary key examples,   Kushina Flashback,  or even The Truth about Itachi.  

 

 

6.  The Villains 

 

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 It's no stranger that the villains in Part 1 were very and I mean very ruthless I mean there's a reason why Zabuza is someone I consider to be one of the best villains in Naruto. Hell, even Orochimaru himself was considered to be one of the best villains of all time.   What happened? In Part 2 you gave them tragic backstories which I don't particularly mind, but the issue is you revert them from the villainous ways through the simple means of Talk no Jutsu.  I mean come on now Kishi you can do better than that.  Sure Zabuza was the first to get that treatment, but we went out like a boss to take down Gato.   Straight up.  Another issue with Naruto's villains is the main antagonist.   Originally it was made out to be Pain, and then Tobi which okay that works.  Then it was Madara Uchiha.  That should've been the pinnacle cause it only made sense. What happened?  Instead of Madara you trade out what everyone considered to be the best final villain   for Kaguya... I'm sorry Black Zetsu. Ya no I don't even consider Kaguya a final villain, and Black Zetsu of all people? Really? 

 

 

So My advice is this,  once someone is established as a villain they should remain a villain. #2 don't keep changing the main antagonist of the series. Stick to one Central main antagonist and leave it at that.  

 

 

7.  The Romance 

 

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I'm sorry Kishi,  the romance subplot in Naruto has to be one of the worst romantic subplots i've seen not just in  Shounen Manga, but in storytelling period. NaruHina and SasuSaku apparently according to you, were planned right? It was done horribly.  You must ask why? Simple, you were messing with the fans okay let me just say you were messing with the fans. As a fellow writer myself that's one of the most idiotic moves I've ever seen from a writer. The other thing is the pairings that you were going for severely lacked in development. That's the key thing I wanna bring up. NaruSaku was a red herring right? Well, IT'S FUNNY HOW YOUR RED HERRING PAIRING HAD MORE DEVELOPMENT than what you intended the canon pairings to be.  That is just wow utterly disappointing.  

 

Look I understand that romance is not the important aspect in a shounen series. Many series have done this before like Yu-Yu Hakusho, Rave Master, Assassination Classroom, Psyrin, even your brother Seishi's series, O-Parts Hunter. The romance wasn't important, but each of these manga managed to make it believable. That's the thing Kishi, if you decide to add a romantic sideplot in your next series. Just go straight to the point.  Don't do what you did in Naruto do pull the oh who's going to win NaruSaku or NaruHina?  No!  Avoid that SH IT  just establish that these two characters have something going on, and let it become a reoccurring thing.  Again you want good examples?  Jio Freed x Ruby Crescent.  Yusuke x Keiko.  Haru x Ellie.  That's what you should do, and again look at your own Mario One Shot,   Mario x Saori that relationship was done pretty well for the most part.  

 

 

8.  The Hero's Journey 

 

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The entirety of Part 1 I think for the most part everyone can agree that the story of Naruto was practically about Naruto, and what he wanted to accomplish. To become Hokage and be acknowledged by the villagers, and ofcourse the underdog story.  So what exactly happened? Part 2 was all about Sasuke.... Um... I could've sworn I signed up for the story of Naruto, not Sasuke... But the story was about Naruto. No the story of Part 2 was about saving Sasuke... Like look Naruto put aside his own goal okay HIS LIFELONG GOAL TO BECOME HOKAGE  JUST TO SAVE SASUKE, and the funny thing is Sasuke points that out to him when they reunite, and you would think Naruto would contemplate about that,  but nope. He's still wanting to go after Sasuke.. and by this point Naruto already has friends.. Naruto's story in Part 2 honestly should've been him changing like sure you can start off with him wanting to save Sasuke, but throughout the story he grows and matures realizing that not everyone can be saved. One could say that's out of character, but no it isn't that again just shows growth in terms of character.  It's like I've been saying Sasuke was put on a pedestal after Part 1 like he was the most important figure over the main protagonist that we grew up seeing. 

 

 

So Kishi the only thing I can say about that is,   Let the story in your next manga series only be about the main character, don't deviate away to the point where the secondary main character becomes far more important that your protagonist.  That should solely be again for your Main Protagonist,  and that's what you should stick by because like I said before it's the story about a Hero's Journey. 

 

 

 

 

That's honestly all I have to say when it comes to the advice I have to give Kishi towards his next series whenever he decides to unveil it to the audience. Now does this mean I trust Kishi after Naruto? No ofcourse not, these are just tips and points I'm listing out for what Kishi could do for his next series to be great.. am I hoping that it will be good?  At this point I'm just very optimistic with the situation.  


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PROTECTING EACH OTHER TILL THE END!!


#2 TouKen4Life3g

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Posted 06 November 2017 - 05:56 AM

Kill everyone. American audience loves deaths for no reason.

#3 Konoha'sCrimsonFox

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Posted 06 November 2017 - 11:13 AM

Kill everyone. American audience loves deaths for no reason.

 

No kidding. With all this mass shooting going all around in the states.



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#4 Nate River

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Posted 06 November 2017 - 12:54 PM

No kidding. With all this mass shooting going all around in the states.


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#5 tricksie

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Posted 06 November 2017 - 01:37 PM

Good thread!!!

 

Honestly, if he had just kept the hero's journey intact, I could have forgiven him for all the other inconsistencies (theme, characters, romance, villains, etc.). If it had been focused on Naruto, and his story was completely developed through till the end with some sort of resolution that satisfied Naruto's journey, then it would have been such a better all the way around. 



#6 TouKen4Life3g

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Posted 06 November 2017 - 02:14 PM

 

No kidding. With all this mass shooting going all around in the states.

I wasn't going that deep for the record. I was establishing from my pov from every communities I lurked. Death is money and even Mashima acknowledged it despite not going with it.



#7 Namaenash

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Posted 06 November 2017 - 03:05 PM

Only one advice: finish what you started in a consistent manner.

 

There's no value to bring up plot point only to leave it hanging in the air without conclusion. So long as an author is consistent throughout his/her literature product, he/she will get loyal fans throughout the journey.


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#8 NaruSaku fan in Kentucky

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Posted 06 November 2017 - 04:35 PM

Here's another suggestion, Kishi. Try not to copy Dragon Ball Z. You did that with Naruto and it failed big time.

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#9 Nate River

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Posted 06 November 2017 - 05:45 PM

Here's another suggestion, Kishi. Try not to copy Dragon Ball Z. You did that with Naruto and it failed big time.

 

I know Kishimoto won't read this and its user discussion and all. But if we are going to have a thread like this can you at least try to approach this in good faith?

 

There is little point to this thread if people are just going to morph it into a debate thread, whine and complain, or post things that don't functionally say much more than "it sucks." How about offering serious advice and explain why?



#10 Analyzer

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Posted 06 November 2017 - 07:15 PM

I disagree with the OP and some other posters on multiple things, so I am going to defend Kishimoto at some points, but also offer some criticisms here and there too, marking as D for Defense, and C for Criticism. 

 

C/D: 1: I'm not sure what the OP is arguing for or against in 1 with "Keep Naruto grounded in themes", and I think on the OP's part they need to elaborate. From what I can make out:  -Underdog "Theme": Not really a theme, but more a status, really. Naruto's underdog status created empathy and connected people to him. I agree with the OP in its effectiveness. It is not necessary to have an underdog character every time, and I challenge Kishimoto to not use an underdog and achieve the same result.. Simply, by making the stakes important enough for us to care, with a character that has relatable elements. 

 

D: -Coming of Age: The Entirety of the manga is a coming of age story, Naruto is learning lessons that will do him well as a full fleged adult. Examples post pain Arc are not to shoulder everything or be selfish, cooperation, and the like. 

 

D: -Hope: I don't really see how this stopped. There's a functional part in the Pain Arc, and the War Arc, that pulls Naruto to the brink of despair and pulls him out, usually with the help of another person.

 

C: That said, I think Kishimoto should not repeat any of these themes, and my suggestion is to utilize new themes that relate to whatever his target audience is, with messages perhaps relevant to their modern obstacles. 

 

2: Characters and Inconsistencies. 

 

D: -In regards to the OP, I have to say these are not characteristics that are being pointed out. Sasuke's focus is shifted because there is new information or relevance that is causing it to shift, Naruto's focus is shifting much for the same reason. It has nothing to do with character. I'm also going to defend Sakura -slightly-, in that part of Kishimoto's failing is that he was a young author, which when you compare to Sarada in her ten page gaiden, you see a much stronger growth in characterization.

 

C: To lead into this, Sakura really needed a point of relation and sympathy. I think Kishimoto has learned this though, but still, a fair criticism. 

 

3: Side Characters

 

C: Absolutely agree with the OP, with a caveat: -Not- all side characters need attention, but certainly more needed it. Kishimoto has a ton of good ideas you can tell but no time for all of them. While an awesome team, team Taka probably would have been better off not-existing, which would reduce the too much Sasuke focus as well. Another example is I would not have put in the five kage in the war arc at all, and given that portion to the K 11 instead. 

 

4: Female Characters

 

D: So I completely disagree with the OP here. Despite my words with Sakura earlier, they aren't in any way "one-dimensional". They -do- get legit development, and progression, despite some being only side characters, who typically never get much of that. Konan for example? Very awesome character whose development ending in death was great, doing a heel turn and trying to stop her former master. And while in contrast Tenten got very little, I have to reinforce my above point that not all side characters -should- get such focus on, but she suffers no more than Shino does, and thus the focus on sex here I find is irrelevant.  I could add another C and elaborate why Sakura had issues, but Sakura's issues largely don't stem from her gender, rather, they stem from the ability for readers to empathize and like her. 

 

5:

 

C/D: I disagree with the flashback advice here. You -don't- always want to show new things in flashbacks. In fact, an issue with the Naruto and Sasuke bond is this new information makes it contrived, and kind of spins into that extra Sasuke focus that wasn't needed. The point of the flashback that you used for the pic here, is to actually appeal to emotion, which can be a very effective use of flashback on really amping up the dramatic moment. Don't do it too much, that's good advice, but I don't think he did it too much, I think he did the new information part of flashbacks too much.

 

6:

 

D/C: Defense first, largely Pain is thought to be one of the best Villains, and the other Akatsuki dealt with in Part 2 were certainly ruthless, and not TNJ'd either. (Kisame killed himself, Hidan lost his head, etc). While TNJ is certainly not appealable for everyone, I think the better advice is to mix up villians, which he kind of did though, given Madara and Kaguya don't get it either, so I can't find myself agreeing with the OP on this at all.

 

I also disagree with the main villain thing. It's not uncommon for there to be another person pulling the strings, or competitor, and the like. My advice would be to simply make sure your final, final villain (Kaguya) gets plenty of foreshadowing. 

 

7: 

 

C: If the OP is saying no Love Triangles, yes please, but I will add with a caveat that this is entirely personal preference, and love triangles can be a very effective (And honestly in Naruto they were) way to just draw people in to things, that may not be drawn in otherwise. SS also had issues in that, well, Sasuke was away the whole time, and to connect with my complaints about the Team 7 foundation, my advice would be to really spend time with your core characters, fleshing them out, and their bonds and the like.

 

D: I disagree with the OP though on everything else. NaruHina for example was not only fairly well developed but I'd say the most developed, and suffers from lack of utilization (See point on side characters), while it is NS that  trulydoesn't have the development the OP claims., though as friends I think it was fine but could have really used an early arch like SS to help with Sakura's issues of likeability or somesuch, maybe. Since NH and SS were his intention, I won't really address it much but say  that one was done well, and the other has a shaky foundation, but it's got a foundation. 

 

8:

 

D (Sort of): In that, Naruto is about Naruto. Uchiha stuff -does- bog down the plot, but Part 2 is about Naruto, and does focus on him. I would actually argue the advice kind of clashes with the side-character advice. This also has nothing to do with the Hero's journey, largely, Naruto in every arch can be fit into it without issues, and deviating from it is not even necessarily bad (And can even be good). Naruto's panel time I think was perfectly fine. 

 

C: The Criticism I would instead offer is to avoid too much focus on the villain. Balance his place better with the side cast. Giving the villain rotating characters (Team Taka) while a neat idea, made it be that more time was needed to focus on them to develop them a little, and the like, which can start to bog things. 


Edited by Analyzer, 06 November 2017 - 07:19 PM.


#11 Nate River

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Posted 06 November 2017 - 10:09 PM

1. Foregiveness and Redemption: Scope

 

The first advice I'd offer on this is that his chosen theme is scope. 

 

First, his theme works more effectively on a mirco/personal level. I think the decision to move it from an interpersonal conflict to a worldwide led to a number of problems that surfaced in the war arc. 

 

It's one thing to forgive wrongs committed against yourself even if they are pretty heinous. It's not unheard of for people to forgive murder, but the wider the scope of people afflicted the harder this becomes. So it's one thing for Naruto to do it for wrongs against himself. It'd be easy to add Sakura and Kakashi since they generally share his ideals. I think you get to Rookie 9  without too much work. But the wider it goes and the weaker the personal stakes become, the less effective it becomes. The turning point became when he effectively did it on behalf of Konoha. In this particular instance, I think there might be a point about whether they "owe" him for treating him like crap and because without him they'd be dead, but he never faces his question because of Yamato and Gedo Mazo. I think this is point where Kishimoto could have really added depth to Naruto's beliefs and started building an answer to the objections and problems that come with his position. 

 

Moreover, when Sasuke commits international incidents, Naruto really has neither the authority nor the right to offer redemption for acts he is not responsible for and that were not committed against him, but that's the natural consequence of what he does when he starts trying to redeem Sasuke and later Obito. Nobody who would complain here's him call Obito a cool guy. Imagine the war weary who have lost loved ones hearing him say that?

 

So, I would advise don't shy away from this stuff and don't protect Naruto's character from it.  

 

The other problem with moving the theme outside of Naruto and Sasuke was it was a contributor to the bloated cast that probably could have been trimmed somewhat. We learned nothing about Stone/Mist. They had no personal involvement on any level and didn't really contribute anything. They did eat up some panel space that I think could have been better spent else where. 

 

2. Redemption and Forgiveness: Degree

 

I think it goes without saying the worse the act the harder it is to forgive. This series has people do some really awful things and are redeemed anyway. Obito, Itachi, and Kabuto are probably the glaring examples. Itachi's problem was his rational, Obito's is his scale, and pretty much everything on Kabuto. I felt their redemptions didn't keep in mind the nature and degree of their crimes. Seeing uncorrupted Obito with Rin really bugged me. I had felt that Obito's sacrifice should be the beginning and not the end. Kabuto's wasn't addressed at all, and Itachi's was part character protection and one part selfish rational. I was never clear how I was supposed to feel about that, but I felt Itachi came across terribly. I felt like kishimoto felt to completely and fully redeem everyone regardless of how awful they were. I suggest pulling back on the bad acts or having their redemptions being less clean. Maybe presented a fuller view of redemption as a concept? What does it take when you do the things they did? Can it ever be done? 

 

And I haven't forgotten Sasuke, but I I have other things to add and I think Sasuke is a bit more complicated.

 

3. Redemption and Forgivness: Risk

 

A risk inherent in forgiving and redeeming these people is that they burn you. The Third's sentimentality and hesitation burned him badly. I think the theme would have been better had Naruto had seen its negative side. Officer redemption and forgiveness and then the person betrays that.

 

So my advise would be to test Naruto's belief system on this front. Would he stand by it in the face of being screwed?

 

4. Character Death:

 

I don't think he needed to kill many more than he did. The real issue was so many characters (from Naruto's generation) suffer fatal/near fatal injuries or meeting conditions said to cause death and then not dying or being revived. It happened so many times, that I just assumed Neji would live or be revived. Killing one or two means being less predictable and showing the audience that you have it in you to kill them. It would increase tension and decrease cynicism.

 

5. Pairings:

 

I wouldn't offer a specific piece of advice because what I'd say is pairing specific. 

 

For NaruHIna: Have Hinata a little bit more involved in the story. Show her doing more things that don't get tied to the romance or get roped into it. Explore who she is beyond her crush (I think the only scene that does this is her fight with Neji) on Naruto a bit more. Allow her to be less of satellite character. And most importantly, have Naruto start shifting towards her well, well before the Last with an explanation as to why. I think that should have been done in the manga and not foisted into a movie. If the only thing you read is the primary source material there is not indication he likes her romantically and if he did why that was. I strong believe that this should have not been left for supplemental material. 

 

For NaruSaku: The foundation was there. I don't have anything to add as all he would have to do is write a few scenes differently. Kishimoto, whatever else you may say about his writing, was very good at writing scenes that left him with flexibility to move between the pairings had he wanted to. 

 

SasuSaku: It needed something like the bench scene was for NS and by that I mean something that defined why she loved him beyond his looks. Its fine she started this way, but it's not clear when it became genuine or why. He treats her terribly and its the hardest of these three pairings to swallow because of how he treats her (and thats assuming they are happy as protrayed in Boruto) and she continues to stick by him anyway. I can think of specific reasons why Naruto would stand by him no matter what, but Sakura? Dunno. A explanation may help and showing it would naturally do the follow....

 

6. The Bonds:

 

The manga gets into Sasuke's fall to early. I think all three characters needed more time acting together as a team before it all went to hell. the Naruto Sasuke friendship would make more sense and we ight get a better idea what Sakura sees in him because its not abundantly clear what that is. 



#12 James S Cassidy

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Posted 06 November 2017 - 10:31 PM

The one very big improtant advice that I have is one that Miyazaki said himself.

If you want to make stories that people can invest in, you need to have characters that are based in realism. Go out and see the real world as it is. Ask questions, look at the way people behave, and then use that as a jumping off point. You can do or make your characters do whatever, but you have to have some kind of realistic approach to what a real person would do if a situation got to them. This is especially true when it comes to something as complicated as romance. If you don't do it right, best not to do it at all.

Men and boys have their own behavior pattern. At younger ages they may be egotistical, quiet and reserved, or even just down right shy. However, they also row. Eventually they lose those traits in favor or something else when life throws wrenches in their idealogy. If someone is quiet and they face a sitaution that may threaten their life or the lives of others...then they will be open and gunho. If they are egotistical, they may be brought down to their knees and their whole idea of themselves shatters when they face someone who knows the difference between truth and interpretation. Even villains can be egotistical and think they are unbeatable which leads to their guard being down.

Females also go through a wide range of emotions and life changing events. Not the same way men do, but still the same style. Cause and effect. If someone treats them like crap, they are not going to think of them as "cool" or "loving" and wanting to be with them. More often than not, they will leave and want to leave as soon as possible. This is not just in romance roles, but in friends roles too.

Keeping characters at the same stand point of years on end is boring and show how lack of characterization you give them.

For Naruto, one of the biggest problem was obsessions. Every character pratically had an obsession. Some good (Rock Lee and his training;) most not so good (Naruto and Sakura's obsession with Sasuke to point of being blind to everyone and everything else.)

Humans can be obsessive, but when that obsession starts to take them over...show how self-destructive that is. Don't just keep going with it like "This is a good thing." It is ESPECIALLY unrealistic how obsessive they are one minute and then have them forget all about the existence of that obsession not 1 page later. (Naruto was obsessed with saving Sasuke. After Sasuke was saved, he couldn't care less about him.)

We humans are complicated creatures, but we are also moldable. We change, we evolve. To have characters stuck in one mindset their whole life when everything else is so painfully obvious that they shouldn't be is such an unrealistic mindset. Poking at Sakura and her "love" for Sasuke. No real person would be THAT obsessed with a person and in real life, even if they were, people would question and even push that maybe they need therapy. Why not have Ino be that kind of "girl friend" that makes her aware of this unhealthy way of thinking? It happens and eventually the person would get over it realizing a truth. That's life.

To continue to live a life based on a lie would eventually lead to massive misery. I have seen it happen. Some even take their own lives off of it. In Sakura's case, I have seen people end their own lives over less. So you can't just make something happen without some kind of consequence that comes with it. If you don't feel like writing about that consequence, then you need to stop pushing the topic to the front.

Again, you can do whatever you want with the story, but if you want your readers to follow you can't keep saying "You just have to accept it that way" especially when you write confusing things like the SS relationship. They love each other, but he can't stand to be around her? That is how divorce happens. I bringing the pairings into this because it is one of the biggest problems in the story. You can't convince me that these characters are happy when you keep showing them reluctant to be around each other, never smiling ever again, and just down right looking miserable. If it is not their jobs, then it has to be their home life.

And speaking, I want to say, it is okay to have people miserable with their relationship. It happens. We sometimes marry the wrong people under wrong pretenenses. Show them being miserable and then breaking free from that prison. It is okay.

There is so much to fix, but I think this one is the most important.

Your characters need to be "real." They are not mindless puppets even though they are fictional.


 


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#13 NarutoUzumaki01

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 03:06 AM

I'd suggest on colaborating with somebody in story, so Kishimoto can be only on art side. He's easly pushed around it seems by editors, so it would be nice to have somebody more expirienced to write story.



#14 HalfDemonInuyasha

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 07:16 AM

Make the story how YOU want it to go, not how a loud, minority fan base wants you to or even how the majority wants you to.

It's one thing if readers have actual, thoughtful criticism; it's another for them to simply dislike it because the ones they want to screw aren't doing so..


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#15 Yyubie

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 10:29 AM

Bit off , but for me it's hard to give advice to someone that basically said "Hahaha , F-you NS fan, NS just red herring , can't believe how stupid you are"

But if i really like to give him 1 that really disturb me.

 

Stick to the core/theme of the manga which is Ninja battle , Ninja is all about stealthy , assassination , basically clean work , clean kill. Don't say that "The basic of shinobi is to conceal their presence" if you going to abandon that anyway in the end. If it ninja stick to it , don't go Dragon Ball , Call of Duty , Shingeki no Kyojin all of sudden , single attack suddenly can wipe out the entire nation in blink of an eye , some can even fly ?? :lmao:  breath in space , flashy battle explosion everywhere basically saying why the need to hide?? , ninja theme throw out of window and everyone goes titan Kyubii mode perfect susanoo mode :down: , too much eye power :down: . Listen to your fan but don't blind and become their slave , if your editor starting to overstep their authority be a man and say it. Don't make character like Sasuke or Hinata , if a male character going to be handsome with dark past/background lightning / fire power and love by women cool/silent or a female character with perfect body big boobs shy mode submissive it has potential to destroy your own story because this is what people want , people want to be perfect like them , you need to give them slap in reality and teach them that not everything is perfect but they can be happy. Be consistent with your interview , don't contradict your own interview with another.


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#16 Illnevergiveup3

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 12:19 PM

I wouldn't give him a lick of advice until he fixes what he destroyed. The ending to Naruto will hurt me for the rest of my life honestly.


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#17 Analyzer

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 01:38 PM

I wouldn't give him a lick of advice until he fixes what he destroyed. The ending to Naruto will hurt me for the rest of my life honestly.

 

Maybe offer advice on how to fix it, then?

 

I think Nate's advice is the most sound. I may not agree with all of it, but its rather well put, and I'd put it forward as an example to make a framework off of.

 

Nate's best input was the challenging of Naruto's ideals. While they were challenged, they were never really challenged in the way of betrayal after trust was given (Mainly because we were either at the end (Sasuke), or the villain died, so we're stuck with option Gaara or Neji off the top of my head. Post 700 could use this idea though, with Orochimaru and the like. 

 

I'd suggest on colaborating with somebody in story, so Kishimoto can be only on art side. He's easly pushed around it seems by editors, so it would be nice to have somebody more expirienced to write story.

 
Editors are pretty much your collaborators. They don't write the story for you but they do advise heavily and offer suggestions. I really don't agree with this push around stuff, mostly because it's not very provable but also because it gives this inherit idea that it's good to ignore editors, which I think is kind of a romantic fabrication. Be stubborn on the things you want to be stubborn, but listen to them otherwise, and I think Kishimoto did do that much.
 
 

Make the story how YOU want it to go, not how a loud, minority fan base wants you to or even how the majority wants you to.

It's one thing if readers have actual, thoughtful criticism; it's another for them to simply dislike it because the ones they want to screw aren't doing so..

 
Kishimoto didn't have this issue by his own words, he did what he wanted to do in this particular department you're highlighting. 
 
His frustration and where I do think its sourced he was sometimes disappointed by feedback were in certain characters, Sai, for example, who he wanted to be popular, and Sakura, which I really feel was one of his great writing shames.

Edited by Analyzer, 07 November 2017 - 01:49 PM.


#18 trang95

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Posted 08 November 2017 - 07:37 AM

!!! The following refers solely to the manga content and not the anime as I am aware the anime has added addifional episodes to rectify this problem (I think)!!!


Hmmm, I personally would advise him to stick to only ONE major THOROUGHLY developed antagonist in the very final arc (excluding Sasuke b/c we all knew it would end with a Naruto vs Sasuke fight). Yes, Kagura was alluded to 200 chapters or so before, but her actual entrance into the story just came too late, and was quite frankly also very comical, though not intended by Kishimoto. While given a short but eye-opening backstory, Kagura's personality could have been fleshed out better. She was honestly one of the most boring and forced villains I've ever seen. All this combined just created a very unexciting villain in my eyes.

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#19 Analyzer

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Posted 08 November 2017 - 05:09 PM

!!! The following refers solely to the manga content and not the anime as I am aware the anime has added addifional episodes to rectify this problem (I think)!!!


Hmmm, I personally would advise him to stick to only ONE major THOROUGHLY developed antagonist in the very final arc (excluding Sasuke b/c we all knew it would end with a Naruto vs Sasuke fight). Yes, Kagura was alluded to 200 chapters or so before, but her actual entrance into the story just came too late, and was quite frankly also very comical, though not intended by Kishimoto. While given a short but eye-opening backstory, Kagura's personality could have been fleshed out better. She was honestly one of the most boring and forced villains I've ever seen. All this combined just created a very unexciting villain in my eyes.

 

Agreed with the gist of this, though I do like Kaguya and don't find her boring. I just wish her entrance was better crafted. 



#20 ThroughWithLove

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Posted 08 November 2017 - 05:55 PM

Yeah, one piece of advice: Stick to artwork and leave the writing to someone else. Maybe have your brother do the writing and you do the designs. At bare minimum, stay away from 15 year commitments like Naruto. It takes a lot of self-discipline to do this kind of story right and if you're the type that can be swayed by fan/editorial pressure, someone else needs to be in charge.


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