31579 replies to this topic

[VanitasDS76491]

By the way, the guy that said Sakura didn't beat Sasori....I sent him 75 panels each with a description of every single panel what is going on. He has not replied back to me since.

So does that mean you won that

[VanitasDS76491]

You know as much as we all say that the ending can't get fixed and how Kishi and SP and the Hinata fans destroyed Naruto because they all wanted Hinata to get her happy ending. My friend and I were talking today on how or what would happen if Kishi came to our house and told us we could fix Naruto in any way we saw fit, but we knew that we wanted to challenge ourselves and not just have a rewrite of Naruto as that would be too easy.
 
So what we did is set it just after either the Pain arc or when Naruto has just met his mother.

I'd set it after he meets his mother. Though the pain arc might work better nip the war arc in the bud

[Bail o' Lies]

https://youtu.be/T5Hu4EAAVys
lol interesting results

I wish you'd explained what the video was. I don't want another "ballsdeep" in my recommend.

 

Sakura throughout the years of 2017-2018 was the second most popular waifu (I assume search results) after Rem from Re:zero until Darling in the FranX came out and Zero Two became the most popular.

 

Also, in other videos made by this youtube channel she remained one of the most popular Waifu even into 2020 and actually being more popular than Hinata for a long time till about June 2020. The most popular at the moment is that raccoon girl from shield hero.

Edited by Bail o' Lies, 14 October 2020 - 01:30 AM.

[totherpage95]

I wish you'd explained what the video was. I don't want another "ballsdeep" in my recommend.
 
Sakura throughout the years of 2017-2018 was the second most popular waifu (I assume search results) after Rem from Re:zero until Darling in the FranX came out and Zero Two became the most popular.
 
Also, in other videos made by this youtube channel she remained one of the most popular Waifu even into 2020 and actually being more popular than Hinata for a long time till about June 2020. The most popular at the moment is that raccoon girl from shield hero.

yes raphtalia
edit: looking at the other videos it's actually nezuko for the win ultimately
also https://youtu.be/8XtqB8eFbFc i guess sasunaru is the undisputed yaoi ship that dude who bumped naruto into sasuke made history
another edit: sorry about not being specific with the video I won't do it again
another edit: although sasunaru is consistently at the top almost the whole time narusaku was the most popular ship at the start of 2011 which is saying something and sasusaku is nowhere to be seen

Edited by totherpage95, 14 October 2020 - 07:27 PM.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

So does that mean you won that

 

I'd say it does myself.

[Riverkid]

You know as much as we all say that the ending can't get fixed and how Kishi and SP and the Hinata fans destroyed Naruto because they all wanted Hinata to get her happy ending. My friend and I were talking today on how or what would happen if Kishi came to our house and told us we could fix Naruto in any way we saw fit, but we knew that we wanted to challenge ourselves and not just have a rewrite of Naruto as that would be too easy.

 

So what we did is set it just after either the Pain arc or when Naruto has just met his mother.

 

To be honest, I would have reworked the whole Shippuden part from scratch.

 

In my opinion, the core problem is the persistent Shonen genre. Naruto (Manga) ran between 1999 and 2014, which means it has a time span of 15 years. Someone who started the manga at the age of 12 years would be at the age of 27 years at the end. So while one's own perspective develops over the years, the series remains constant in its demands and narrative depth. This leads to a descending view the further one has progressed in age. The focus on a younger audience is also reflected in the superficial principles the story is based on (good > evil, reason > violence, friendship > power etc.), especially when these principles are worked out again and again and again. It's the same themes that have stood on a pedestal for 15 years, preventing any potential alternatives - which might have given more depth and ground to the story.

 

During the timeskip Naruto really leaves Konoha for the first time. He leaves an environment of prejudice and aversion, and in theory he should now experiences an atmosphere where people see him for what he really is, just a growing child. Being in new surroundings should have a positive effect, because his background story (unknown to strangers) would no longer be an obstacle. You could highlight the psyche of Naruto more, where he is perhaps preoccupied with the question of wanting to return to Konoha (bad environment) at all - which is then also in confrontation with his goal of becoming Hokoage. One gives, especially to the protagonist, such an unnatural childhood, distorted by the normal form, but does not dare to work more precisely with this point of view. It is only used to create a compassion that has little relevance in the present as long as it is not about the Kyubi himself. The Author really doesn't dare to go into the details here in order to create completely new depths for the character, which might have kept him away from the one-dimensionality which we have in the end.

 

The general global world-setting is also not highlighted enough. There are so many nations, the possibility to conceive many different cultures and norms. Apparently it is better to draw a generic global antagonist (group or single persons) and take away any relevance of the outside as long as Konoha is somehow involved. There have been so many stories about past-wars, but what impact did they have? Who is enemy and ally? What is the role of politics or society? These are all important core issues that a leader has to deal with and take responsibility for - so why is Naruto's Hokage position based only on his strength and willpower? Should a position, so highly narrated by the story, be shaped by such few characteristics? The fact that Naruto became Hokage was less a meaningful cumulation of constant development and more a bleak act of defining a conclusion to the story. Atleast we were constantly reminded that he wants to become Hokage one day. In addition to this, there was this one question that Naruto should have answered - how he wants to stop the cycle of hatred - but he was busy chasing Sasuke. The author reduces everything here to banal points, konoha is the solely important object of the story and everything is answered when Naruto finally wins Sasuke back - because only then every question and every existing problem is supposedly solved.

 

The plot is also too much based on spontaneous and sporadic events. You never have the feeling that something builds up over longer stretches, everything is driven by flashbacks or resolutions. Sasuke has now killed Itachi? Tell him a story so that he will now attack Konoha. Pain was defeated, what now? Just let Sasuke attack Killerbee to push for a Kage summit. The story of the Uchiha has been retold three or four times, I think, just to steer Sasuke from left to right and right to left again. You can really skip 200 chapters without feeling like you're missing anything - since most of it is based on recent events anyway. The author simply lacks a narrative plan that is forward-looking and constructive. 

 

You cannot fix the story from a certain point on. The general concept and preparation are simply too inferior for a needed foundation to work with. From Shippuden on, the level should have been raised and an exact basic plan for the story should have been worked out. 

Edited by Riverkid, 14 October 2020 - 04:16 PM.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

 

To be honest, I would have reworked the whole Shippuden part from scratch.

 

In my opinion, the core problem is the persistent Shonen genre. Naruto (Manga) ran between 1999 and 2014, which means it has a time span of 15 years. Someone who started the manga at the age of 12 years would be at the age of 27 years at the end. So while one's own perspective develops over the years, the series remains constant in its demands and narrative depth. This leads to a descending view the further one has progressed in age. The focus on a younger audience is also reflected in the superficial principles the story is based on (good > evil, reason > violence, friendship > power etc.), especially when these principles are worked out again and again and again. It's the same themes that have stood on a pedestal for 15 years, preventing any potential alternatives - which might have given more depth and ground to the story.

 

During the timeskip Naruto really leaves Konoha for the first time. He leaves an environment of prejudice and aversion, and in theory he should now experiences an atmosphere where people see him for what he really is, just a growing child. Being in new surroundings should have a positive effect, because his background story (unknown to strangers) would no longer be an obstacle. You could highlight the psyche of Naruto more, where he is perhaps preoccupied with the question of wanting to return to Konoha (bad environment) at all - which is then also in confrontation with his goal of becoming Hokoage. One gives, especially to the protagonist, such an unnatural childhood, distorted by the normal form, but does not dare to work more precisely with this point of view. It is only used to create a compassion that has little relevance in the present as long as it is not about the Kyubi himself. The Author really doesn't dare to go into the details here in order to create completely new depths for the character, which might have kept him away from the one-dimensionality which we have in the end.

 

The general global world-setting is also not highlighted enough. There are so many nations, the possibility to conceive many different cultures and norms. Apparently it is better to draw a generic global antagonist (group or single persons) and take away any relevance of the outside as long as Konoha is somehow involved. There have been so many stories about past-wars, but what impact did they have? Who is enemy and ally? What is the role of politics or society? These are all important core issues that a leader has to deal with and take responsibility for - so why is Naruto's Hokage position based only on his strength and willpower? Should a position, so highly narrated by the story, be shaped by such few characteristics? The fact that Naruto became Hokage was less a meaningful cumulation of constant development and more a bleak act of defining a conclusion to the story. Atleast we were constantly reminded that he wants to become Hokage one day. In addition to this, there was this one question that Naruto should have answered - how he wants to stop the cycle of hatred - but he was busy chasing Sasuke. The author reduces everything here to banal points, konoha is the solely important object of the story and everything is answered when Naruto finally wins Sasuke back - because only then every question and every existing problem is supposedly solved.

 

The plot is also too much based on spontaneous and sporadic events. You never have the feeling that something builds up over longer stretches, everything is driven by flashbacks or resolutions. Sasuke has now killed Itachi? Tell him a story so that he will now attack Konoha. Pain was defeated, what now? Just let Sasuke attack Killerbee to push for a Kage summit. The story of the Uchiha has been retold three or four times, I think, just to steer Sasuke from left to right and right to left again. You can really skip 200 chapters without feeling like you're missing anything - since most of it is based on recent events anyway. The author simply lacks a narrative plan that is forward-looking and constructive. 

 

You cannot fix the story from a certain point on. The general concept and preparation are simply too inferior for a needed foundation to work with. From Shippuden on, the level should have been raised and an exact basic plan for the story should have been worked out. 

 

Very wise words for sure, man. And some of it really just feels so weird to have it occur now and then, like how Obito's words to Sasuke about Itachi just instantly make him want to shift the source of his anger to the Leaf, while in the same case, being about his jealousy towards Itachi and how he could never surpass him, so he's going to destroy what Itachi cared about just to make himself feel better, like so much of Sasuke's motivation seemed to be when he went to Orochimaru-- the jealousy and hate he felt for his brother's successes, while using the massacre partially as an excuse to masquerade the real agenda for it.

 

Not to mention that the lack of backstory being done so much as well as what growth is done isn't as good as it could be, like Shikamaru not seeing the flaws in a system that got his sensei killed as well as left his sensei's daughter without a father to love and raise her, or to have him learn to trust his heart more than his head alone, since intelligence can get you only so far sometimes.

 

Plus we get characters shafted a lot, so as you said, at some point, the story of Naruto as a series cannot be fixed. It's funny because as I work on my fanfic, I don't see it as a "fix" persay, but its own entity to be able to work to tell a better story than what Kishimoto failed to do, and how Studio Pierrot ****ed it all up because of their wanting a side character to get a happy eneding.

[Riverkid]

 

Very wise words for sure, man. And some of it really just feels so weird to have it occur now and then, like how Obito's words to Sasuke about Itachi just instantly make him want to shift the source of his anger to the Leaf, while in the same case, being about his jealousy towards Itachi and how he could never surpass him, so he's going to destroy what Itachi cared about just to make himself feel better, like so much of Sasuke's motivation seemed to be when he went to Orochimaru-- the jealousy and hate he felt for his brother's successes, while using the massacre partially as an excuse to masquerade the real agenda for it.

 

 

We have the following scenario:

 

Obito has successfully manipulated Sasuke and brought him into the ranks of Akatsuki, based on the fact that he managed to put him against Konoha - to share a common goal. After all, this common goal is the main reason why Sasuke gets himself involved with Akatasuki in the first place.

 

In Chapter 404 Obito announces that Akatsuki will take care of Naruto (Pain vs. Konoha) while Sasuke (Taka) will hunt Killerbee. But this raises the question why Sasuke should deal with Killerbee in the first place. He joins Akatsuki because of a common goal (Konoha), which he won't even participate in in the end. Pain is actually the one dealing the damage to Konoha that Sasuke actually longed for himself.

 

This confusing constellation is justified by the act of Obito who offers the 8-tailed-beast to Sasuke - that would give him more strength (reasonable), which he however simply rejects in Chapter 417. So he managed to deal with something that is not even in his interest from begin with and he doesn't want anything in return to compensate for the wasted time, effort and risk. To top this insanity, Sasuke announce his seperation from Akatsuki in Chapter 453 because he can't seem to get any advantage out of it (bright spark).

 

We have an illogical sequence of actions which simply plays against all rules of the respective character motivation. It makes no sense from front to back. The only thing that becomes obvious here is to project Sasuke not as a rival but as an antagonist in the story (building up for the dramatic end-run). His unnecessary hunt on Killerbee triggered the Kage summit and the decleration of him as a missing-nin. Not sure why the summit not already happened after Jiraiya's death - but who knows, maybe it was fine because it wasn't Sasukes fault yet to drive the plot further ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 

 

And many readers don't even realize this problem. It is simply taken for granted and sometimes even praised.

[TheFirstEvil100]

 

To be honest, I would have reworked the whole Shippuden part from scratch.

 

In my opinion, the core problem is the persistent Shonen genre. Naruto (Manga) ran between 1999 and 2014, which means it has a time span of 15 years. Someone who started the manga at the age of 12 years would be at the age of 27 years at the end. So while one's own perspective develops over the years, the series remains constant in its demands and narrative depth. This leads to a descending view the further one has progressed in age. The focus on a younger audience is also reflected in the superficial principles the story is based on (good > evil, reason > violence, friendship > power etc.), especially when these principles are worked out again and again and again. It's the same themes that have stood on a pedestal for 15 years, preventing any potential alternatives - which might have given more depth and ground to the story.

 

During the timeskip Naruto really leaves Konoha for the first time. He leaves an environment of prejudice and aversion, and in theory he should now experiences an atmosphere where people see him for what he really is, just a growing child. Being in new surroundings should have a positive effect, because his background story (unknown to strangers) would no longer be an obstacle. You could highlight the psyche of Naruto more, where he is perhaps preoccupied with the question of wanting to return to Konoha (bad environment) at all - which is then also in confrontation with his goal of becoming Hokoage. One gives, especially to the protagonist, such an unnatural childhood, distorted by the normal form, but does not dare to work more precisely with this point of view. It is only used to create a compassion that has little relevance in the present as long as it is not about the Kyubi himself. The Author really doesn't dare to go into the details here in order to create completely new depths for the character, which might have kept him away from the one-dimensionality which we have in the end.

 

The general global world-setting is also not highlighted enough. There are so many nations, the possibility to conceive many different cultures and norms. Apparently it is better to draw a generic global antagonist (group or single persons) and take away any relevance of the outside as long as Konoha is somehow involved. There have been so many stories about past-wars, but what impact did they have? Who is enemy and ally? What is the role of politics or society? These are all important core issues that a leader has to deal with and take responsibility for - so why is Naruto's Hokage position based only on his strength and willpower? Should a position, so highly narrated by the story, be shaped by such few characteristics? The fact that Naruto became Hokage was less a meaningful cumulation of constant development and more a bleak act of defining a conclusion to the story. Atleast we were constantly reminded that he wants to become Hokage one day. In addition to this, there was this one question that Naruto should have answered - how he wants to stop the cycle of hatred - but he was busy chasing Sasuke. The author reduces everything here to banal points, konoha is the solely important object of the story and everything is answered when Naruto finally wins Sasuke back - because only then every question and every existing problem is supposedly solved.

 

The plot is also too much based on spontaneous and sporadic events. You never have the feeling that something builds up over longer stretches, everything is driven by flashbacks or resolutions. Sasuke has now killed Itachi? Tell him a story so that he will now attack Konoha. Pain was defeated, what now? Just let Sasuke attack Killerbee to push for a Kage summit. The story of the Uchiha has been retold three or four times, I think, just to steer Sasuke from left to right and right to left again. You can really skip 200 chapters without feeling like you're missing anything - since most of it is based on recent events anyway. The author simply lacks a narrative plan that is forward-looking and constructive. 

 

You cannot fix the story from a certain point on. The general concept and preparation are simply too inferior for a needed foundation to work with. From Shippuden on, the level should have been raised and an exact basic plan for the story should have been worked out. 

True, but this was mainly for fun, and it was a challenge only to pick a certain point; neither of us could make it easy as we could easily do all of part two.

 

One idea my friend said he would do is Naruto training in becoming the Hokage to learn that it is not an easy job, hell he told me that Naruto would go up a Rank after the whole Pain deal, then deal with Naruto and who his clan is and finding more about them about. He said Naruto and Sakura would become a couple then and there. None of this will they won't they bull crap.

[NaruSaku fan in Kentucky]

https://youtu.be/liotuj4dArU

[Nostradamus]

 
My web novel male protagonist. And an American like Naruto Uzumaki. Original art by Pume.
 

Sketches

 

Part 1 Eddie Ages 10-12

 

 

Part 2 Eddie Age 15 

 

 

 

 

 

 

May I have a link to it?

 

 

I am not sure as of now. I'll have to decide later that year when I'll buy it. However, its build will be around the fact that I wanna make videos with it, record stuff and whatnot. So I'll have to have a strong one for rending. Also for gaming cuz I have some games I really do wanna play.

Well good luck then. If you need some suggestions or help let me know and I'll help.

Edited by Nostradamus, 15 October 2020 - 02:10 AM.

[Phantom_999]

 

To be honest, I would have reworked the whole Shippuden part from scratch.

 

In my opinion, the core problem is the persistent Shonen genre. Naruto (Manga) ran between 1999 and 2014, which means it has a time span of 15 years. Someone who started the manga at the age of 12 years would be at the age of 27 years at the end. So while one's own perspective develops over the years, the series remains constant in its demands and narrative depth. This leads to a descending view the further one has progressed in age. The focus on a younger audience is also reflected in the superficial principles the story is based on (good > evil, reason > violence, friendship > power etc.), especially when these principles are worked out again and again and again. It's the same themes that have stood on a pedestal for 15 years, preventing any potential alternatives - which might have given more depth and ground to the story.

 

During the timeskip Naruto really leaves Konoha for the first time. He leaves an environment of prejudice and aversion, and in theory he should now experiences an atmosphere where people see him for what he really is, just a growing child. Being in new surroundings should have a positive effect, because his background story (unknown to strangers) would no longer be an obstacle. You could highlight the psyche of Naruto more, where he is perhaps preoccupied with the question of wanting to return to Konoha (bad environment) at all - which is then also in confrontation with his goal of becoming Hokoage. One gives, especially to the protagonist, such an unnatural childhood, distorted by the normal form, but does not dare to work more precisely with this point of view. It is only used to create a compassion that has little relevance in the present as long as it is not about the Kyubi himself. The Author really doesn't dare to go into the details here in order to create completely new depths for the character, which might have kept him away from the one-dimensionality which we have in the end.

 

The general global world-setting is also not highlighted enough. There are so many nations, the possibility to conceive many different cultures and norms. Apparently it is better to draw a generic global antagonist (group or single persons) and take away any relevance of the outside as long as Konoha is somehow involved. There have been so many stories about past-wars, but what impact did they have? Who is enemy and ally? What is the role of politics or society? These are all important core issues that a leader has to deal with and take responsibility for - so why is Naruto's Hokage position based only on his strength and willpower? Should a position, so highly narrated by the story, be shaped by such few characteristics? The fact that Naruto became Hokage was less a meaningful cumulation of constant development and more a bleak act of defining a conclusion to the story. Atleast we were constantly reminded that he wants to become Hokage one day. In addition to this, there was this one question that Naruto should have answered - how he wants to stop the cycle of hatred - but he was busy chasing Sasuke. The author reduces everything here to banal points, konoha is the solely important object of the story and everything is answered when Naruto finally wins Sasuke back - because only then every question and every existing problem is supposedly solved.

 

The plot is also too much based on spontaneous and sporadic events. You never have the feeling that something builds up over longer stretches, everything is driven by flashbacks or resolutions. Sasuke has now killed Itachi? Tell him a story so that he will now attack Konoha. Pain was defeated, what now? Just let Sasuke attack Killerbee to push for a Kage summit. The story of the Uchiha has been retold three or four times, I think, just to steer Sasuke from left to right and right to left again. You can really skip 200 chapters without feeling like you're missing anything - since most of it is based on recent events anyway. The author simply lacks a narrative plan that is forward-looking and constructive. 

 

You cannot fix the story from a certain point on. The general concept and preparation are simply too inferior for a needed foundation to work with. From Shippuden on, the level should have been raised and an exact basic plan for the story should have been worked out. 

 

What's Ironic about that ist ath he WANTED TO do more world building, around the time of the Chuunin exam arc, but was convinced to do a tournament arc because all popular fighting shonen manga in the magazine were doing it. I believe some here have mentioned that in one of his interviews. Now with that out of the way

 

Now objectively speaking, the story it self was heavily flawed in a lot of areas from the beginning. it wasn't just part II/ Shippuden. Naruto was a carbon copy of  Son Goku because Kishi loved Dragon Ball, But I think that those of us that want to be logical will agree that being an idiot is NOT a good thing for a ninja. How is being loud, hyperactive, super obvious and visible with the inability to plan ahead contribute to a ninja's job? That is, spying, infiltration, assassination etc. etc. In fact I would say that for the nth time that ninjas was a very LOOSE term when you think about it because it was at it's core a shonen fighting manga involving supernatural powers and flashy bang bang attacks, which again has nothing to do with ninjas. It sounded more along the lines off being spouted around for the "sake of being cool."

 

The main message, according to Kishimoto, was suppose to be about bonds, But there was not much focus on that if anything. In fact as metioned for world building, It would have made a more lasting impression if there actually was visiting other countries and establish different values and cultural systems and the like and having Naruto build friendships all over the world and not just in his village or core group of aquaintences and friends. At the end of the day I feel the message is cheap and ungratifying because there is actually little focus on it.

 

Naruto also was heavily flawed in his goal of being "Hokage" because being Hokage was more than just being strong. That position is being a leader to one's people and the decisions being made affects everyone around you, and it is not a good message by saying you can achieve that goal by being a short term oriented simpleton. It was tolerable that Naruto was an idiot at the beginning, but it became less so that he was not improving his intelligence, overall understanding of politics or even social awareness to actually work towards being Hokage when that is exaclty what came out of his mouth when he spoke to Konohamaru in Chapter 2. So that lesson ended up being INCREDIBLEY hypocritical, looking back on it.

 

One of the very banes of the series overall is Naruto's obsession with Sasuke Uchiha. Forget friendship, the two showed that despite the story saying different, they did not communicate on a basic level and that has a lasting negative impact on their relationship. Sasuke was acting just as much of a bratty outcast as Naruto at his core and did not want to be understood by anyone because he shoots down all empathy and attempts to reach out to him. Not to mention, despite preaching to Sakura about how she did not understand true lonileness and not having a family, he HAD THE GALL to say Naruto can not understand his pain because the latter never had one to begin with. This so called bond of theirs is one of the most illogical, ineffectual, LAZY pieces of writing I have ever witnessed and trust me that is saying something, and I believe that it is part of the problem with them that roots itself in my next issue.

 

Sasuke has this STRANGE AND UNORTHODOX positon in the story in that the plot CAN NOT settle on whether he is an antagonist or close friend/rival of the main character. You see how it flip flops on him doing outright heinous acts to fuel this antagonism between him and Naruto, and yet Kishi insists they are best friends despite the inferiority-superiority complex the two have towards each other and the definitive lack of mutual understanding. I've said this before, Sasuke was being an immature brat that thinks no one understands him and wants to be left alone emotionally, and Naruto's desire to bring him back has a very unhealthy level of self satisfaction and ego stroking involved, all things considered. So the story flits between calling Sasuke an outright villain deuteragonist or a misunderstood "sob story" that has to be cuddled and kissed, with the entire Uchiha clan kitten storm justifying his actions thruough the most demented mental gymnastics I've ever seen. You would SERIOUSLY need to "turn of your brain" to even accept this one. Just saying.

 

Lastly the the two main couples and their dysfunctional and insulting dynamics. I am sure that even those that show outright disinterest in coupling anyone with anyone else would agree that there is nothing romantic or functional about what Naru/Hina and SasuSaku bring to the table. As we've seen, Naruto has become a "workaholic" that avoids his family and won't give them the time of day more or less and Sasuke is not involved in Sakura and Sarada's lives depite the story claiming he and Sakura are in a committed relationship. Even pairing neutral fans that don't care about the romance at all, I believe, would find these marriages pathetic and undesirable because it is the very deffiniton of a "broken home life" that many do not care for or have bad memories about. But defenders will insist these two couples are the epitome of romance. I think I've made my point here so I will not delve further into it.

 

But all of this aside, you can criticize and pick apart the flaws of the story all you want but as you have stated in a previous post, the idea was to invoke a certain reaction from the audience, and that is a sympathetic underdog story where the audience is wishing for the main character to succeed in his endeavors. If that very simple thing was achieved then at least alll of these literary flaws would be tolerated on some level at the very least. but as shown, there was no effort put into any success of his and things were dealt with in an anticlimatic cop out that left us all with empty dissatisfaction. The End.     

Edited by Phantom_999, 14 December 2020 - 11:58 PM.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

 

What's Ironic about that ist ath he WANTED TO do more world building, around the time of the Chuunin exam arc, but was convinced to do a tournament arc because all popular fighting shonen shonen manga in the magazine were doing it. I believe some here have mentioned that in one of his interviews. Now wotht that out of the way

 

Now objectively speaking, the story it self was heavily flawed in alot of areas from the beginning. it wasn't just part II/ Shippuden. Naruto was a carbon copy of  Son Goku because Kishi loved Dragon Ball, But I think that those of us that want to be logical will agree that being an idiot is NOT a good thing for a ninja. How is being loud, hyperactive, super obvious and visible with the inability to plan ahead contribute to a ninja's job? That is spying, infiltration, assassination etc. etc. In fact I would say that for the nth time that ninjas was a very LOOSE term when you think about it because it was at it's core a shonen fighting manga involving supernatural powers and flashy bang bang attacks, which again has nothing to do with ninjas. It sounded more along the lines off being spouted around for the "sake of being cool."

 

The main message accordingly was suppose to be about bonds, But there was not much focus on that if anything. In fact as metioned for would building, It would have made a more last impression if there actually was visiting other countries and establish different values and cultural systems and the like and having Naruto build friendships all over the place and not just in his village or core group of aquaintences and friends. At the end of the day I feel the message is cheap and ungratifying because there is actually little focus on it.

 

Naruto also was heavily flawed in his goal of being "Hokage" becasue being Hokage was more than just being strong. That position is being a leader to one's people and the decisions being made affects everyone around you, and it is not a good message by saying you can achieve that goal by being a short term oriented simpleton. It was tolerable that Naruto was an idiot at the beginning, but it became less so that he was not improving his intelligence or understanding of things or social awareness to actually work towards being Hokage when that is exaclty what came out of his mouth when he spoke to Konohamaru in Chapter 2. So that lesson ended up being INCREDIBLEY hypocritical, looking back on it.

 

One of the very banes of the series overall is Naruto's obsession with Sasuke Uchiha. Forget friendship, the two showed that despite the story saying different, they did not communicate on a basic level and that has a lasting negative impact on their relationship. Sasuke was acting just as much of a bratty outcast as Naruto at his core and did not want to be understood by anyone because he shuts them all out. Not to mention, despite preaching to Sakura about how she did not underatand true lonileness and not having a family, he HAD THE GALL to say Naruto will never understand his pain because the latter never had one to begin with. This so called bond of theirs is one of the most illogical, ineffectual, LAZY pieces of writing I have ever witnessed and trust me that is saying something, and I believe that it is part of the problen with them that roots itself in my next issue.

 

Sasuke has this STRANGE AND UNORTHODOX posiiton in the story in that the plot CAN NOT settle on whether he is an antagonist or close friend/friendly rival of the main character. You see how the it flip flops on him doing outright heinous acts to fuel this antagonism between him and Naruto, and yet Kishi insists they are best friends despite the inferiority-superiority complex the two have towards each other anhd the definitive lack of mutual understanding. I've said this before, Sasuke was being an immature brat that thinks no one understands him and wants to be left alone emotionally, and Naruto's desire to bring him back has a very unhealthy level of self satisfaction and ego stroking involved, all things considered. So the story flits between calling Sasuke an outright villain protagonist or a misunderstood "sob story" that has to be cuddled and kissed, with the entire Uchiha clan kitten storm justifying his actions thruough the most demented mental gymnastics I've ever seen. You would SERIOUSLY need to "turn of your brain" to even accept this one. Just saying.

 

Lastly the the two main couples and their dysfunctional and insulting dynamics. I am sure that even those that show outright disinterest in coupling anyone with anyone else would agree that there is nothing romantic or functional about what Naru/Hina and SasuSaku bring to the table. As we've seen Naruto has become a workaholic that avoids his family and won't give them the time of day and Sasuke is not involved in Sakura and Sarada's lives depite the story claiming he and Sakura are in a committed relationship. Pairing neutral fans hat don't care about the romance at all, I believe, would find these marriages pathetic and undesirable because it is the very deffiniton of a broken home life that many do not care for or have bad memories about. but defenders will insist these two couples are the epitome of romance. I think I've made my point here so I will not delve further into it.

 

But all of this aside, you can criticize and pick apart the flaws of the story all you want but as you have stated, the idea was to invoke a certain reaction from the audience, and that is a symnpathetic underdog story where the audience is wishing for the main character to succeed in his endeavors. If that very simple thing was achieved then at least alll of these literary flaws would be tolerated at the very least. but as shown, there was no effort put into any success of his and things were dealt with in an anticlimatic cop out that left us all with empty dissatisfaction. The End.     

 

I would simply call this a mic drop, dude.

[luans7]

kishimoto should copy chimera ant arc...

Naruto would need hate the death of his two masters and Iruka should have died instead of the Hinata to be darker

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

 

kishimoto should copy chimera ant arc...

Naruto would need hate the death of his two masters and Iruka should have died instead of the Hinata to be darker

 

 

I admit, Iruka dying would have been pretty nuts. I know that I had been thinking about Iruka being the one to protect Naruto from Pain in my fanfic, though I wouldn't kill him in the long run, but the fact Naruto would be on edge as is, plus seeing the first person to accept him as he is, and not just as Kurama reborn, nearly dead would make him explode with rage.

[NaruSaku fan in Kentucky]

Remember when I said Hinata would make a lousy Disney princess? Well Teneri would make a lousy Disney villain. He would make the bad guy from Lone on the range look like Jafar.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

Remember when I said Hinata would make a lousy Disney princess? Well Teneri would make a lousy Disney villain. He would make the bad guy from Lone on the range look like Jafar.

 

Dude, Toneri was just poorly written. I could have done a better job, and I'm an amateur by comparison really! XD

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

Now the big question is who are some other villains that aren't written as well as they could be?

[Illnevergiveup3]

Hinata should have died just for kicks.

[TheFirstEvil100]

Hinata should have died just for kicks.

Its what I do in my Naruto stories.