21 replies to this topic

[Luna]

Like she's gone viral on twitter over that confession and maybe I forgot but I'm surprise people hate her for that when its one of her BEST moments. Like these same people HATE her for this but love Itachi who traumaitize and maniupulated Sasuke.... Its either they don't want to understand the reason for her confession or they just being hard headed because its Sakura...

[Phantom_999]

1. Because Naruto said he hates people who lie to themselves.
 
2. they misunderstood what Naruto meant when he said that, and assume that means she lied about loving Naruto.
 
3. Sakura is the exception to everything in Naruto in these fans' minds. They can love any other character in the series or even other fictional series for one reason for another but hate Sakura for those exact same reasons. Why? That's because she was not Naruto's childhood friend sweetheart, and in fact mocked him behind his back for being an orphan behind his back when he was socially and emotionally abused. So that makes her worse than the devil it seems ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Edited by Phantom_999, 10 March 2022 - 10:27 PM.

[RedFaction]

Well in canon both Naruto and Sakura were both lying to themselves about loving one another so that whole scene makes them both look awful in hindsight.

I imagine Sakura gets most of the hate in that scene just because she's a woman even though Naruto was more at fault there and acted like a total douchebag.

[Bail o' Lies]

How poorly worded/structured it was and people assuming the worse of her.

 

Also, remember this was after Hinata's confession that Naruto never responded to, if Naruto had accepted Sakura's. Then Hinata stood no chance. So, they were extremely feverous in their denouncement of it as well as proclaiming that it was a "False Confession."

 

The scene:469-470

Naruto and everyone reacts in surprise and shock at what she had just said. Naruto asks her to repeat it. She says shyly and a blush on her face that she loves him. Then says she is over Sasuke. 

 

The shock wears off for Naruto and he asks why all of a sudden and what brought this on?

 

Sakura says she just realized and she shouldn't be clinging/chasing after a criminal. And then she says there is no need for Naruto to keep his promise and then ask him to stop chasing Sasuke.

 

Naruto somewhat realizes what this is about, the promise. Asks Sakura again, if something happened and why was she confessing to him of all people. He then thinks of all the times she had shown her feeling towards Sasuke.

 

She decides to prove it by hugging him while listing all his positives qualities and Sasuke's negatives.

 

Naruto breaks the hug telling her to stop joking around.

 

Sakura tries to say she switched her feeling from Sasuke to Naruto using a Japanese proverb about women's changeable feelings.

 

Naruto declares she is lying to herself.

 

Sakura is upset about Naruto calling her a liar and if he doesn't want her; he should just say so by rejecting the confession outright.

 

He again states, he is confused why it is happening all of a sudden.

 

Then she expresses her concern for him. As well as, that Sasuke is a criminal now like she has been going on for the entire time as well as for Naruto to forget her promise.

 

Naruto says he has his own reasons for chasing after Sasuke. Kiba asks for more details but Kakashi cuts him off before he says anything.

 

Sakura had it and decides to go after Sasuke to kill him so Naruto wouldn't have to suffer.

 

Then later Sai comes in to muddy the waters.

 

The whole thing was a side effect of Sai's talk with Sakura earlier about how both She and Sasuke were emotional burdens weighing and wearing Naruto down.

 

The entire event from these scenes and the ones they connect with were about how much Sakura had grown to care about Naruto. She may have not been completely in love with Naruto or realized she was, but her concern & guilt for him outweigh her feelings toward Sasuke. To the point, she is throwing away her feelings towards Sasuke so Naruto doesn't suffer due to trying to keep his promise to her anymore. She also trying to convince herself she shouldn't love Sasuke because he is a criminal (who all her friends -except Naruto- have pretty much agreed to give up on.) And Naruto is mainly confused why it is happening all of a sudden, what brought this on, and doubting the she is really that over Sasuke.

Edited by Bail o' Lies, 15 March 2022 - 06:03 AM.

[Phantom_999]

Exactly. Again many fans misunderstood the complications and emotional mistakes of that scene and just took Naruto's words of hating people who lie to them selves at face value and assume he is rejecting Sakura's confession and also assumed the worst that Sakura was playing with his feelings like a fiddle when looking at it logically, she was doing it for the opposite reasons. You only need to look look at how she broke down crying to the thought of hurting Naruto with unknowingly shackling him to a promise he intends on keeping even if it kills him and he did it out of love for her, to understand that manipulating Naruto was farthest thing from her mind.

Edited by Phantom_999, 12 March 2022 - 02:22 PM.

[James S Cassidy]

There are many reasons we can theorize, but Occam's razor...they just don't want Sakura to be happy....ever.
They hate her if she stays with Sasuke
They hate her if she moved on and fell for Naruto

They hate her if she tries and fails.

They hate her if she does nothing.

 

They just hate her, Sakura and Hinata are the unwanted child and the Golden child
No matter what Hinata does...whether she succeeds, fails, saves the day, or even nearly causes everyone to die including herself....she is praised, lifted up, and seen as a goddess.
Meanwhile...Sakura can literally cure poisons that noone can, fighting a villian on her own, and even save people's lives including the main characters...and she is seen as a piece of crap.

Sasuke and Naruto are somewhat the same in this perspective.
If Naruto doesn't forgive and such...he is seen as a bad guy.
If Sasuke kills or even attempts to kill even his own family members...then he is seen as a "lost soul that needs to be saved."

It is amazing how the main character and his main love interest are treated WORSE than the people who make either no impact or are the antithesis to their very existence.

And all of it based on only ONE scene.

That is why I continue to say that someone made a deal with the devil to make this happen.

Literally any and every other series that tried pulling what Naruto did...is seen as a trash series.

Rising of the Shield Hero is seen as a subpar series compared to Naruto to these people.

Edited by James S Cassidy, 13 March 2022 - 05:22 AM.

[Phantom_999]

Actually when she married Sasuke they didn't make a peep about her anymore, and in fact she was voted as the most popular character in Boruto. Sure, take it with a grain of salt but this completely contrasts with how she was treated by the fandom before the end of Naruto. Again, she is not hated UNLESS it has the implication to do with being Naruto's love interest if you ask me, and any denouncement of her and her accomplishments adheres to that fact and that fact alone. If there is no discussion about her being Naruto's girlfriend or wife she is ignored at worst or discussions are marginally more civil. But that's just what I've experienced, I don't know about you, or anyone else for that matter

Edited by Phantom_999, 12 March 2022 - 02:29 PM.

[James S Cassidy]

Actually when she married Sasuke they didn't make a peep about her anymore, and in fact she was voted as the most popular character in Boruto. Sure, take it with a grain of salt but this completely contrasts with how she was treated by the fandom before the end of Naruto. Again, she is not hated UNLESS it has the implication to do with being Naruto's love interest if you ask me, and any denouncement of her and her accomplishments adheres to that fact and that fact alone. If there is no discussion about her being Naruto's girlfriend or wife she is ignored at worst or discussions are marginally more civil. But that's just what I've experienced, I don't know about you, or anyone else for that matter

They still hate how obsessive she is over Sasuke though. I remember them saying how pathetic she is to keep desiring a kiss from Sasuke. 

Yet, they want me to believe they had sex....

Can someone explain this one to me?

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

They still hate how obsessive she is over Sasuke though. I remember them saying how pathetic she is to keep desiring a kiss from Sasuke. 
Yet, they want me to believe they had sex....
Can someone explain this one to me?

I don't get it either, and also irritating how they don't WANT Sakura to move on from Sasuke st the same time!

Edited by Bryon_Konoha_Ninja, 13 March 2022 - 12:40 AM.

[Bail o' Lies]

They still hate how obsessive she is over Sasuke though. I remember them saying how pathetic she is to keep desiring a kiss from Sasuke. 

Yet, they want me to believe they had sex....

Can someone explain this one to me?

Because if SS is erased from the story how long till they erase nH? The ending is built on nH happening for the Western fans, and SS as a back up in hopes to keep some of the Japanese. When the Western didn't produce as expected the franchise relies more on SS. If SS is erased and replaced with SK how long till they replace nH with NS?

 

Actually when she married Sasuke they didn't make a peep about her anymore, and in fact she was voted as the most popular character in Boruto. Sure, take it with a grain of salt but this completely contrasts with how she was treated by the fandom before the end of Naruto. Again, she is not hated UNLESS it has the implication to do with being Naruto's love interest if you ask me, and any denouncement of her and her accomplishments adheres to that fact and that fact alone. If there is no discussion about her being Naruto's girlfriend or wife she is ignored at worst or discussions are marginally more civil. But that's just what I've experienced, I don't know about you, or anyone else for that matter

She was the most popular in JAPAN. She was never hated over there. It was the internet fanbase in the West that hated her.

 

They were content for a bit because she was rewarded for not interfering with Hinata anymore/punished for not being with Naruto. Then the problems with the pairings were shown in Boruto. Now they feud over which of the two is better.

 

There are some people that watch anime that always hate the heroine that abuses the main character despite it being a standard in shounen and is treated as comedic. Sakura was the one shown to the mainstream audience so she got the most hate for that. Then you had the fact that she never "dated" Naruto. In shounen stories, it is normal for the couple to hint at feelings towards each other but only get together at the end with maybe a big kiss before the final battle. In the West, they get together much sooner but fall in and out of love for "Drama."

[James S Cassidy]

Oh I want to add.

I think one reason why they really hate Sakura....especially for some of these modern girls....is because she is them. She perfectly represents them and they hate the mirror.

THEY fall in love with the bad guy who is abusive and make excuses.
THEY treat the actual nice guy like crap and friendzone him
THEY try to make the nice guy be with another girl because they want him to go with someone else to get of their way.
THEY refuse to make the f-boi responsible

And what happens? They are left by the F-boi to raise his kid on her own with no money, debt, and ultimate stress and still have the nerve to make excuses for it.

The only way this could be MORE realistic is if Naruto became successful and Sakura tried to hit on him again because she is penniless and homeless and needs his money and success to "save her." 

And that is just sad. Sakura is TOO realistic for them so they hate her,

 

Because if SS is erased from the story how long till they erase nH? The ending is built on nH happening for the Western fans, and SS as a back up in hopes to keep some of the Japanese. When the Western didn't produce as expected the franchise relies more on SS. If SS is erased and replaced with SK how long till they replace nH with NS?

 

Yeah, but why though? Why do they hold this...feeling, viewpoint, moral decisions...whatever they want to call it. What is so wrong with Sakura moving on to Naruto? What is so wrong with Hinata not ending up with Naruto? They can't say it is because they don't want to see them suffer because they didn't care how Naruto suffered with everything. 

And speaking of Naruto...all that suffering...meant NOTHING...he suffered for NOTHING. What a waste and a joke. Naruto is the ultimate nice guy alright.

That's why they called it Naruto the Last because Nice guys finish last

Edited by James S Cassidy, 13 March 2022 - 05:34 AM.

[Bail o' Lies]

Yeah, but why though? Why do they hold this...feeling, viewpoint, moral decisions...whatever they want to call it. What is so wrong with Sakura moving on to Naruto? What is so wrong with Hinata not ending up with Naruto? They can't say it is because they don't want to see them suffer because they didn't care how Naruto suffered with everything. 

And speaking of Naruto...all that suffering...meant NOTHING...he suffered for NOTHING. What a waste and a joke. Naruto is the ultimate nice guy alright.

That's why they called it Naruto the Last because Nice guys finish last

You ever know a person you just hate no matter what they do? That's Sakura to them. She had a really bad first impression that made them hate her. Most don't see the point of Naruto liking her and think he should just get with Hinata because, she is easier. The others, the fanatics, hate her because of the dreaded friend-zone which Sakura reminds them of girl putting them in that position for guys, and for girls she the girl that is preventing them from getting their crush.

 

The first could have been fix/mitigated by focusing more on Sakura (have a plot line more then just 'who will she end up with Naruto or Sasuke') or getting her together with Naruto before the ending. The second will always hate her no matter what and will always find flaws with her, and they are very vocal about finding them as well as shutting down differing opinions.

Edited by Bail o' Lies, 16 March 2022 - 12:15 AM.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

Yeah, but why though? Why do they hold this...feeling, viewpoint, moral decisions...whatever they want to call it. What is so wrong with Sakura moving on to Naruto? What is so wrong with Hinata not ending up with Naruto? They can't say it is because they don't want to see them suffer because they didn't care how Naruto suffered with everything. 

And speaking of Naruto...all that suffering...meant NOTHING...he suffered for NOTHING. What a waste and a joke. Naruto is the ultimate nice guy alright.

That's why they called it Naruto the Last because Nice guys finish last.

 

Nicely said, James!

[Moon_Girl]

Actually when she married Sasuke they didn't make a peep about her anymore, and in fact she was voted as the most popular character in Boruto. Sure, take it with a grain of salt but this completely contrasts with how she was treated by the fandom before the end of Naruto. 

Something important to keep in mind; Japan adores Sakura. It was the Western fandom that had all the haters. Hinata wasn't nearly as popular as Sakura is in Japan. 
You also didn't hear much of a peep from the haters when SS happened because she was no longer a threat to their precious Hinatatas.

Granted, if you dare look into the shipping fandom, NH and SS are at each other's throats. It's still Sakura vs Hinata with them. They were only friends until Kishi caved and gave them their steaming piles of crap that is their ships.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

Something important to keep in mind; Japan adores Sakura. It was the Western fandom that had all the haters. Hinata wasn't nearly as popular as Sakura is in Japan. 
You also didn't hear much of a peep from the haters when SS happened because she was no longer a threat to their precious Hinatatas.
Granted, if you dare look into the shipping fandom, NH and SS are at each other's throats. It's still Sakura vs Hinata with them. They were only friends until Kishi caved and gave them their steaming piles of crap that is their ships.

No kidding, and I also can see it as they know we don't care so they have no one to argue with on top of how they likely KNOW their ships "won" out of pity, but they don't give a damn because it's seen as a validation in their eyes that they were right.

[BlueStarSaber]

Something important to keep in mind; Japan adores Sakura. It was the Western fandom that had all the haters. Hinata wasn't nearly as popular as Sakura is in Japan. 
You also didn't hear much of a peep from the haters when SS happened because she was no longer a threat to their precious Hinatatas.

Granted, if you dare look into the shipping fandom, NH and SS are at each other's throats. It's still Sakura vs Hinata with them. They were only friends until Kishi caved and gave them their steaming piles of crap that is their ships.

Say I gotta ask how was it that Japan fans remained very patient with kishimoto not having sakura show up in fights for a very long time or with the negative interactions with sasuke? Since its cause those two things sakuta got hated in the west mainly America?

[Phantom_999]

The Western fans SAY THAT, but it isn't actually true. Hinata less EVEN LESS presence that and only has a few fights to her name too, no to mention lost to any named character she fought against yet she is is sung nothing but praises. No, Sakura is hated because she was supposed to be that sweet childhood friend that loves and supports Naruto but she actually had gave a very negative first impression with her orphan shaming him behind his back on top of being a Sasuke fangirl. the negative interactions with Sasuke is a secondary reason to this mind set, and again it probably wouldn't have been used as ammunition to hate on her if she was again the childhood friend that always loved Naruto. Hinata supposedly fulfilled that role which is why she is so loved by the fans. That is a double standard, through and through. Another comparison, compare Sakura and Sasuke's interactions to Hinata and Neji's first interaction, and you see some striking similarity in it and in fact it is worse because Neji had outright hostile and murderous intent to Hinata but Sakura is victim blamed for how Sasuke treats and fans say "serves her right" if they don't think Sasuke is being a tsundere to her. Again the attitude for both girls stems from how they viewed and treated with Naruto, but irony is Hinata was never there for Naruto either according to the back story no matter what fans say, but again she had a crush on him so that is good enough. Sakura didn't. 

Edited by Phantom_999, 23 March 2022 - 08:59 PM.

[Bail o' Lies]

Say I gotta ask how was it that Japan fans remained very patient with kishimoto not having sakura show up in fights for a very long time or with the negative interactions with sasuke? Since its cause those two things sakuta got hated in the west mainly America?

Well before I start if any other forum members that still have contacts in Japan want to chime in and correct this feel free.

 

Now then, have you read any manga/anime published/produced before 2000 AD? I'm not trying to be rude or facetious. The farther you go back, the easier it is to understand.

 

For the longest time in shounen, heroine were docile polite traditional innocent maidens of purity who mainly just clap their hands together during a fight and say in a worried tone, "oh main character-kun." Its the reason 'love interest' and 'heroine' are synonymous in Japan because they didn't fight or get in on the action, they existed to be the main characters' girlfriends after the adventure was over.

 

This changed somewhat with DragonBall and Bulma (who despite having a good heart was greedy cowardly selfish vain spoiled girl) who inspired a change into what we now see as the common shounen heroine personality, that was very popular in the 90's; a more modern spunky girl that would argue, berate, often even hit the Hero and sometimes gets into combat as a last resort.

 

In comes Sakura who as a character starts out mainly existing to berate the main character. However, she quickly realize she was failing behind which was dragging her team down putting them all in danger and she had to get stronger. She struggled to find her way at first but eventually found a teacher and came into her own. Japanese loved that story as much as they loved her modern personality.

 

So since the 2000's shounen heroine have been getting more and more involved in actually fighting. In fact, to the point when Kishimoto did his Samurai 8 manga and the heroine was a creative take on the traditional shounen heroine where, "her prayers towards her "main character-kun," actually did impower him," was seen as archaic and sexist by the Japanese. From what I understand.

 

Also, they love the romance, since it was as close to an actual romance a shounen manga would do. Most shounen romances are pretty much done from the start. Either they are the childhood best friend that has always loved him just won't admit it or guy doesn't realize (the standard default,) the girl that he saves in the first chapter to show off which makes her fall in love with her savoir(common in sports and similar genres,) or the manic pixie dream girl that drags the boring main character on an adventure (common in harem and comedies.) Sakura had a crush on another guy at the start and Naruto had to win her heart to make her fall in love with him.

 

So, to make sure I answer your questions. They were fine with her not fighting much because before her heroines rarely, if ever, fought at all. After her, a bit different. As for Sasuke obsession, the ones who liked the dreamy bad boy liked doing that same thing they do in the west building their own story in their head. The ones who supported NS knew that it would happen at the end like most Shounen romances, so they just had to wait and enjoy the build up which was more then most shounen stories did. Then, it didn't happen.

Edited by Bail o' Lies, 25 March 2022 - 03:01 PM.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

Well before I start if any other forum members that still have contacts in Japan want to chime in and correct this feel free.
 
Now then. Have you read any manga/anime published/produced before 2000? I'm not trying to be rude or facetious. The farther you go back the easier it is to understand.
 
For the longest time in shounen heroine were docile polite traditional innocent maidens of purity who mainly just clap their hands together during a fight and say in a worried tone, "oh main character-kun." Its the reason 'love interest' and 'heroine' were synonymous in Japan because they didn't fight or get in on the action, they existed to be the main characters girlfriends after the adventure was over.
 
This changed somewhat with DragonBall and Bulma (who despite having a good heart was greedy cowardly selfish vain spoiled girl) who inspired a change into what we now see as the common shounen heroine personality that was very popular in the 90's; a more modern spunky girl that would argue, berate, often even hit the Hero and sometimes gets into combat as a last resort.
 
In comes Sakura who starts out mainly existing to berate the main character. However, she quickly realize she was failing behind which was dragging her team down putting them all in danger and she had to get stronger. She struggled to find her way at first but eventually found a teacher and came into her own. Japanese loved that story as much as they loved her modern personality.
 
So since the 2000's shounen heroine have been getting more and more involved in actually fighting. In fact, to the point when Kishimoto did his Samurai 8 and the heroine was a creative take on the traditional shounen heroine where, "her prayers towards her "main character-kun," actually did impower him," was seen as archaic and sexist by the Japanese. From what I understand.
 
Also, they love the romance since it was as close to an actual romance a shounen manga would do. Most shounen romances are pretty much done from the start. Either they are the childhood best friend that has always loved him just won't admit it or guy doesn't realize (the standard default,) the girl that he saves in the first chapter to show off which makes her fall in love with her savoir(common in sports and similar genres,) or the manic pixie dream girl that drags the boring main character on an adventure (common in harem and comedies.) Sakura had a crush on another guy at the start and Naruto had to win her heart to make her fall in love with him.
 
So, to make sure I answer your questions. They were fine with her not fighting much because before her heroines rarely fought at all. After her, a bit different. As for Sasuke obsession, the ones who liked the dreamy bad boy liked doing that same thing they do in the west building their own story in their head. The ones who supported NS knew that when it would happen was in the ending like most Shounen romances, so they just had to wait and enjoy the build up which was more then most shounen stories did. Then, it didn't happen.

Well said, Bail!

[catsi563]

Well before I start if any other forum members that still have contacts in Japan want to chime in and correct this feel free.

 

Now then, have you read any manga/anime published/produced before 2000 AD? I'm not trying to be rude or facetious. The farther you go back, the easier it is to understand.

 

For the longest time in shounen, heroine were docile polite traditional innocent maidens of purity who mainly just clap their hands together during a fight and say in a worried tone, "oh main character-kun." Its the reason 'love interest' and 'heroine' are synonymous in Japan because they didn't fight or get in on the action, they existed to be the main characters' girlfriends after the adventure was over.

 

This changed somewhat with DragonBall and Bulma (who despite having a good heart was greedy cowardly selfish vain spoiled girl) who inspired a change into what we now see as the common shounen heroine personality, that was very popular in the 90's; a more modern spunky girl that would argue, berate, often even hit the Hero and sometimes gets into combat as a last resort.

 

In comes Sakura who as a character starts out mainly existing to berate the main character. However, she quickly realize she was failing behind which was dragging her team down putting them all in danger and she had to get stronger. She struggled to find her way at first but eventually found a teacher and came into her own. Japanese loved that story as much as they loved her modern personality.

 

So since the 2000's shounen heroine have been getting more and more involved in actually fighting. In fact, to the point when Kishimoto did his Samurai 8 manga and the heroine was a creative take on the traditional shounen heroine where, "her prayers towards her "main character-kun," actually did impower him," was seen as archaic and sexist by the Japanese. From what I understand.

 

Also, they love the romance, since it was as close to an actual romance a shounen manga would do. Most shounen romances are pretty much done from the start. Either they are the childhood best friend that has always loved him just won't admit it or guy doesn't realize (the standard default,) the girl that he saves in the first chapter to show off which makes her fall in love with her savoir(common in sports and similar genres,) or the manic pixie dream girl that drags the boring main character on an adventure (common in harem and comedies.) Sakura had a crush on another guy at the start and Naruto had to win her heart to make her fall in love with him.

 

So, to make sure I answer your questions. They were fine with her not fighting much because before her heroines rarely, if ever, fought at all. After her, a bit different. As for Sasuke obsession, the ones who liked the dreamy bad boy liked doing that same thing they do in the west building their own story in their head. The ones who supported NS knew that it would happen at the end like most Shounen romances, so they just had to wait and enjoy the build up which was more then most shounen stories did. Then, it didn't happen.

Theres another aspect as well to add. Which is Anime studio interference and preference. Pierot is well known for hinata fanboing to the point where they exaggerated Sakuras tsundere tendencies to quite frankly ridiculous degrees. While making Hinata this objectified  princess who adiored the MC from afar for all her lonely life. they never added any depth just expanded how often she showed up

 

Sakura meanwhile was made out to be this mad dog firecracker who went off at the drop of a hat or if Naruto so much as farted in her general direction in a manner she found offensive which was EVERY time. And when she wasnt being that she was basically being a doormat for ""Sasuke-kun"" which meant she simped for him at every opportuinity
 

this led to the character seeming to be a split personality where one minute shes about to use Narutos skull to crack the world open and the next shes about to fall into depressed ruin because Sasuke spit on her toes

 

this inconsistency of characterization by the anime studio basically left a lot of sour taste in peoples mouths and left her character tarnished in many ways worse then other shonen heroines. Sakura if you follow the manga barely ever hit Naruto the comedic aspect was never pushed in the story beyond 2-3 times where it was used

Edited by catsi563, 25 March 2022 - 05:37 PM.