31581 replies to this topic

[Chatte]

I don't know about the anime but last I saw manga sales were 175k in week 4... That doesn't even scratch the surface of what Naruto used to make...

 

And it has a lot of time for traction for example, being a monthly one...

 

Now if you think it's okay, think about Jujutsu Kaisei - it's weekly, and it just broke the 10 million record as of these past two weeks (that's around the time I read the news).

 

So imo, I think it's very telling...

Edited by Chatte, 09 November 2020 - 11:53 AM.

[BlueStarSaber]

From what I have seen the Boruto manga on Wikipedia has said it has only sold a million copies. Granted it has also said this: 

 

The manga has been generally well-received in Japan; the compilations appeared as top sellers multiple times. In its release week, the first manga volume sold 183,413 copies.^[77][78][79] The series has one million copies in print as of January 2017.^[80] Between 2017 and 2018, it became the 8th best-selling manga from Shueisha.^[81] The manga's first volume also sold well in North America,^[82][83] while the series became the sixth-best-selling serialised manga in 2017 according to ICv2.^[84] In 2018's fall, Boruto remained as the fourth best-selling manga from North America.^[85]

 

Though it only seems to talk about the sales in the first few volumes and not the decline the series had latter down the line.

[ree]

From what I have seen the Boruto manga on Wikipedia has said it has only sold a million copies. Granted it has also said this: 
 
The manga has been generally well-received in Japan; the compilations appeared as top sellers multiple times. In its release week, the first manga volume sold 183,413 copies.^[77][78][79] The series has one million copies in print as of January 2017.^[80] Between 2017 and 2018, it became the 8th best-selling manga from Shueisha.^[81] The manga's first volume also sold well in North America,^[82][83] while the series became the sixth-best-selling serialised manga in 2017 according to ICv2.^[84] In 2018's fall, Boruto remained as the fourth best-selling manga from North America.^[85]
 
Though it only seems to talk about the sales in the first few volumes and not the decline the series had latter down the line.

It was pretty obvious, Boruto is the continuation of Naruto after all, but we need to know how is doing actually Boruto, once it has taken his own way. And Boruto making good in the USA is obvious too I mean the "gringos" are a really important market and I think was for them that's, Pierrot changed the end game, there are a lot of virgins otaku's who want to wank on Hinata.

[Illnevergiveup3]

Boruto is pure ass cheeks. If that kitten flopped any lower, it would literally be under Satan's feet.

[Nate River]

You're not wrong about that. But one edge SK had over SS is that SK at least showed Karin can be more mature even if she doesn't like it with how she let Sakura raise Sarada and lied about her not being the mom to Suigetsu for whatever reasons and just wanting Sasuke to be happy, something Sakura NEVER showed to want due to how she is written.
 
I'm not saying it's good what happened, that's for sure. It can be much worse a lot of times with SK in alot of areas for sure, don't get me wrong.

 
I actually think Sakura is the more mature between the two of them, but it's splitting hairs to me. If Sakura had been stabbed instead, Kishimoto almost certainly would have had Sakura just cast it aside like nothing the way Karin did. One of Sasuke's biggest flaw as a character was how the case reacted to him. There was no limit to the kitten that they would forgive.
 
That said, I disagree that Karin is lying about her being the mother. I've read Gaiden more than once and I do not share the interpretation that many people on this board do. I think (1) Sakura is Sarada's bio mother and (2) that nothing about Sakura Gaiden suggests trouble in paradise. They ending suggests a relatively happy family.  Gaiden is horribly written and ultimately pointless. I hate the who umbilical cord portion because it was a cheap attempt to up the drama and sell the possibility that Karin might be the mother only to confirm it was just a temporary red hearing so as to chicken out of more pairing wars. It's also ultimately beside the point, because theme was bonds over blood. But because of the cord stuff it comes across as...."our bonds make us family...but P.S. Sakura is the mom anyway." Either commit to the theme or don't do it.
 
 
 
 

I think, at least in my case, Karin knew what she was getting into and was 100% okay with it. She wouldn't let Sasuke ignore her. Sakura was quick to get depressed and sulk off. Sakura knew what she was getting into but hoped it would be better. Even now she hopes it'll get better and she's not satisfied with her 'marriage'. She just puts up with it because she's, as Kishimoto put it, addicted to Sasuke like a drug. But Karin made herself a part of his life and happened to be in a good position to do so.
I'm not going to say it's a healthy relationship by any means. I can't defend that. But I can say, with the same reasons as my last post, it would be way more happy than SS. Sasuke couldn't ditch her and his kid for 12 years if he were with Karin. They'd likely travel with him and even if he didn't want them to, Karin would probably have none of that.

 
I don't know that not letting Sasuke ignore her speaks well of her. The idea that she possessed an unhealthy addiction could work if that was what Kishimoto wrote. But Taka's formation and later reunification does not convey that message at all. If her relationship with were meant to viewed this way, then Taka's reunification should have had a much different, much more tragic feel to it, but I think it was played straight and the audience was supposed to accept it was all water under the bridge. 
 
 

Kind of like how we believe Sakura would not have put up with current Naruto's behavior of never being home and refusing to be a part of the family.

 
 

That's something I've noticed. In SS/NH, Sakura and Hinata just let their 'husbands' walk all over them brutally and without complaint. NS/SK, neither Sakura or Karin would have put up with that. I feel like Karin coming back to Sasuke despite what he did is an example of that.

Those are just my thoughts. I don't think SK is worse than SS. It's the other way around because Karin never started getting sad or depressed over Sasuke's rejection of her advances, like Sakura.

For me, Sakura's sadness and depression over him are minor compared to what Sasuke did to Karin. There is simply nothing in SS that compares to stabbing Karin and leaving her to die as a deliberate act of cruelty.  The writing of SS is probably worse in that 693 might be the worst use of a parallel I've ever seen, but in terms of the relationship itself...SK will always be on worse because of that scene and how it gets handled later on. 
 
 
 

 

Two other things of note. Sasuke SOUGHT KARIN as part of his team when going on his hunt for Itachi. Even if it was merely interest in her tracking power, that is more than he ever showed for Sakura since they weren't paired by their own choice or decision. (even though Sakura wanted it) Also, Sasuke saved Karin in the forest of death in Karin's flashback and he gave her a pretty warm if not cocky and cool smile, WHICH AGAIN was more than he ever showed Sakura. Just being objective about this, though I DO AGREE that if you want to Say SasuSaku is toxic then SasuKarin does show that unheathy mess almost completely too. It has to be a two way street, guys and gal

 
Of course, she doesn't actually get used for that purpose as Itachi eventually seeks him out. Much like Suigetsu and Juugo were supposed to make sure that no one interfered, but Kisame never tried to get in the way. Just another in the long list of reasons why Taka sucks. Karin at least chronicled his descent into darkness, not that we really needed her to spell it out, but she did fulfill that purpose. If he actually potrayed it as an unhealthy mess and a rather tragic relationship, I'd buy into that more. However, the apology scene and what follows rips that idea to pieces. 

[Bail o' Lies]

From what I have seen the Boruto manga on Wikipedia has said it has only sold a million copies. Granted it has also said this: 

 

The manga has been generally well-received in Japan; the compilations appeared as top sellers multiple times. In its release week, the first manga volume sold 183,413 copies.^[77][78][79] The series has one million copies in print as of January 2017.^[80] Between 2017 and 2018, it became the 8th best-selling manga from Shueisha.^[81] The manga's first volume also sold well in North America,^[82][83] while the series became the sixth-best-selling serialised manga in 2017 according to ICv2.^[84] In 2018's fall, Boruto remained as the fourth best-selling manga from North America.^[85]

 

Though it only seems to talk about the sales in the first few volumes and not the decline the series had latter down the line.

That because its a wiki article. I could put in the God article that "He is (me)," and it would stay there until someone clean it up, Here, in this case, the person who wrote it wants Boruto to be seen as a success. Despite the fact that the first volume sales is barely a tenth what Naruto volume used to sell in their prime, and they only time I hear Boruto mention now a days is they stop watching/reading because it isn't as good as Naruto used to be. Also, despite the fact, that manga is surging in sales again in the U.S.

 

I actually think Sakura is the more mature between the two of them, but it's splitting hairs to me. If Sakura had been stabbed instead, Kishimoto almost certainly would have had Sakura just cast it aside like nothing the way Karin did. One of Sasuke's biggest flaw as a character was how the case reacted to him. There was no limit to the kitten that they would forgive.

 
That said, I disagree that Karin is lying about her being the mother. I've read Gaiden more than once and I do not share the interpretation that many people on this board do. I think (1) Sakura is Sarada's bio mother and (2) that nothing about Sakura Gaiden suggests trouble in paradise. They ending suggests a relatively happy family.  Gaiden is horribly written and ultimately pointless. I hate the who umbilical cord portion because it was a cheap attempt to up the drama and sell the possibility that Karin might be the mother only to confirm it was just a temporary red hearing so as to chicken out of more pairing wars. It's also ultimately beside the point, because theme was bonds over blood. But because of the cord stuff it comes across as...."our bonds make us family...but P.S. Sakura is the mom anyway." Either commit to the theme or don't do it.

Sasuke is forgiven so much because kishimoto had a set storyline in mind for him and people resenting him for being an ass would have interfered with that. 

 

Really? People seem to still constantly question on this board and this site if Karin is the mother, and no one -other then maybe you- seem to think that the Uchihas are a happy family with no troubles. The gaiden seem to be Kishimoto setting that up or at least playing with the idea...until they got a huge load of letters telling them that if Sakura isn't the mother then they would stop buying the manga.

Edited by Bail o' Lies, 11 November 2020 - 10:01 AM.

[Phantom_999]

Of course, she doesn't actually get used for that purpose as Itachi eventually seeks him out. Much like Suigetsu and Juugo were supposed to make sure that no one interfered, but Kisame never tried to get in the way. Just another in the long list of reasons why Taka sucks. Karin at least chronicled his descent into darkness, not that we really needed her to spell it out, but she did fulfill that purpose. If he actually potrayed it as an unhealthy mess and a rather tragic relationship, I'd buy into that more. However, the apology scene and what follows rips that idea to pieces. 

 

 

Well obviouslly the resolution for that in Sasuke just giving a half -kittend Sorry doesn't cut it. But the fact remains that if you put things into context BEFORE Sasuke hit rock bottom and and kittend on both Karin and Sakura, It was Karin that got the preferential treatment no matter how slight it was. While I agree completely that any romance is completely off set by Sasuke's sociopathic actions and lack of empathy OR concern for either Sakura and Karin, again the context to be considered before that is where I'm looking at personally. That said I don't see any functional relationship between Sasuke and Karin because I already have established that Sakura and Ino only had crushes on Sasuke and there was no emotional bonding beyond that, so that would extend to Karin as well. She didn't love Sasuke she loved the idea of hims just like any of his other fan girls, except she was more aggressive in her advances, but the fact remains that to consider a relationship between them for me, anyway is that there HAS to be some semblence of emotional bonding and true acceptance of eachother like NAruto and Sakura had gone through. Sure Karin did save Sasuke life but since when did saving one's life meant that they are your true love?

 

Really? People seem to still constantly question on this board and this site if Karin is the mother, and no one -other then maybe you- seem to think that the Uchihas are a happy family with no troubles. The gaiden seem to be Kishimoto setting that up or at least playing with the idea...until they got a huge load of letters telling them that if Sakura isn't the mother then they would stop buying the manga.

 

You CAN accept what the story concluded of course and accept the word of mouth of the last chapter that Sakura is Sarada's biologiclal mother. But the questionable part is the context of the story LEADING to the last chapter, and it sound like "tongue in cheek" if you think things through. It had suspicions laid across the gaiden right from the beginning that Sakura's claims that she and Sasuke were married and Sarada is her biological daughter is called into question, from her actually lacking a couple's photo with Sasuke to dodging even the simplest of questions Sarada was asking about the father she never met before (how can Sakura say "who knows?" on whether Sasuke wore glasses for instance) and on that point, Sarada was wearing glasses when neither parent ever did. But I suppose that can be excused since biology has no hold on asthetic differentiation in animated stories, as you many of which where either parent or child wears glasses but not both.  Then you get into the heavy implications with the DNA test etc. etc. and while the umbilical cord apsect is a bit blown out of proportion, maybe, one MUST QUESTION, is giving the umbilical cord of YOUR OWN CHILD to the midwife, especially one that was barely aqquainted with you, a reasonable behaviour or gesture of any mother? No matter how close you feel to someone even if they helped you give birth, I don't think any mother would casually give way anything of true significance that represents the bond between her and her child, especially if she swears to herself to raise and love that child. Can any mother here tell me different?  

 

Point being, Sakura IS the biological mother, the story says, but you look at how the ployt was built up to that point and you notice the blatant contradictions, that's all I'm saying.

Edited by Phantom_999, 17 November 2020 - 11:59 AM.

[Illnevergiveup3]

I personally don't believe that Sarada is Sakura-Chan's child and I do believe that Karin is the biological mother. And Kishi wanted to tell us that, but as usual. He became too pussified and scary to write what HE wanted to write and got scared of What the SS fan might say again.

Edited by Illnevergiveup3, 11 November 2020 - 06:45 PM.

[Nate River]

That because its a wiki article. I could put in the God article that "He is (me)," and it would stay there until someone clean it up, Here, in this case, the person who wrote it wants Boruto to be seen as a success. Despite the fact that the first volume sales is barely a tenth what Naruto volume used to sell in their prime, and they only time I hear Boruto mention now a days is they stop watching/reading because it isn't as good as Naruto used to be. Also, despite the fact, that manga is surging in sales again in the U.S.

 

Sasuke is forgiven so much because kishimoto had a set storyline in mind for him and people resenting him for being an ass would have interfered with that. 

 

Really? People seem to still constantly question on this board and this site if Karin is the mother, and no one -other then maybe you- seem to think that the Uchihas are a happy family with no troubles. The gaiden seem to be Kishimoto setting that up or at least playing with the idea...until they got a huge load of letters telling them that if Sakura isn't the mother then they would stop buying the manga.

 

I apologize if I wasn't clear, but that is correct...I believe Sakura is Sarada's biological mother and that Gaiden largely resolved the family issues it set up. I am also aware that I am an outlier in thinking so. Whether that was the original intent or a response to fan backlash does not matter. Based on what I read, my interpretation is that the family issued raised by Gaiden  were resolved by Gaiden. 

[Phantom_999]

I personally don't believe that Sarada is Sakura-Chan's child and I do believe that Karin is the biological mother. And Kishi wanted to tell us that, but as usual. He became too pussified and scary to write what HE wanted to write and got scared of What the SS fan might say again.

 

Regardless, He said sakura is the biological mother. Even if his intention was to paint Sarada as Karin's biological daughter, He switcharooed it and It is Sakura that gave birth to Sarada as badly written as it was. Not only does it mess up the story build up to that point, but also it spits on the message it was trying to portray anyway; that Sakura is Sarada's mother because she raised and loved Sarada all of the latters life, so blood ties come second to that, but lo and behold they ARE blood related and Sarada was "stupid for ever doubting it".

 

Like I said Sakura is written as the biological mother, it is the writing and messages building up to the last chapter that is questionable, but again, what's done is done. Does Sarada not being related to Sakura change anything though, I ask? SasuSaku's relationship is still trash, regardless of whether or not he actually knocked up Sakura.

Edited by Phantom_999, 15 November 2020 - 12:52 PM.

[NarutoUzumaki01]

I think, at least in my case, Karin knew what she was getting into and was 100% okay with it. She wouldn't let Sasuke ignore her. Sakura was quick to get depressed and sulk off. Sakura knew what she was getting into but hoped it would be better. Even now she hopes it'll get better and she's not satisfied with her 'marriage'. She just puts up with it because she's, as Kishimoto put it, addicted to Sasuke like a drug. But Karin made herself a part of his life and happened to be in a good position to do so.
I'm not going to say it's a healthy relationship by any means. I can't defend that. But I can say, with the same reasons as my last post, it would be way more happy than SS. Sasuke couldn't ditch her and his kid for 12 years if he were with Karin. They'd likely travel with him and even if he didn't want them to, Karin would probably have none of that.

Kind of like how we believe Sakura would not have put up with current Naruto's behavior of never being home and refusing to be a part of the family.
That's something I've noticed. In SS/NH, Sakura and Hinata just let their 'husbands' walk all over them brutally and without complaint. NS/SK, neither Sakura or Karin would have put up with that. I feel like Karin coming back to Sasuke despite what he did is an example of that.
Those are just my thoughts. I don't think SK is worse than SS. It's the other way around because Karin never started getting sad or depressed over Sasuke's rejection of her advances, like Sakura.

There is more to SK than meets the eye on first glance. Outside of obvious much closer relationship between them than Sasuke and Sakura. Karin was a clever story set up for ending of conflict between 2 bloodlines. She was Uzumaki and her eventually ending up with Sasuke would've lead to ending of cycle of hatred between clans of Senju/Uchiha.

 

Granted you can make any characters hook up as long as it's your story, which Kishimoto did with MC, that literally never saw Hinata as romantic partner untill his character was retconed into dumb imbecil who can't undestand love.

 

Same with Naruto and Sakura it's not about them just looking good together, it's about narrative way of plot. There was generations that didn't succed before Naruto, obvious parallels to Yahiki/Konan/Nagato, Jiraiya and Tsunade, Minato and Kushina, Obito and Rin, all of them haven't seen happy ending. Remember how Naruto wanted family and didn't want to be alone? All that to just grow up and never be at home because of work... yeah thats a quality of writting right there.

Edited by NarutoUzumaki01, 18 November 2020 - 12:16 AM.

[Moon_Girl]

 Karin was a clever story set up for ending of conflict between 2 bloodlines. She was Uzumaki and her eventually ending up with Sasuke would've lead to ending of cycle of hatred between clans of Senju/Uchiha.

That's true. It would have been a great way to unite the clans. I really wouldn't be surprised if that was seriously Karin's purpose. Was there ever any other reason to randomly make her an Uzumaki other than for laughs?
A shame that never came to fruition. Would have wrapped that up nicely. But I guess it wasn't required since the Naruto and Sasuke brotherhood helps. Kishimoto could have done something really awesome with a SasuKarin kid.
But ya know.  Instead we got milk toast Salad and the abominations that is Burrito and mop girl. Considering Kishimoto 'forgot' about the byakugan in Hinata's womb goblins...maybe that's a good thing. They would be even more horrible to look at.  

[NarutoUzumaki01]

That's true. It would have been a great way to unite the clans. I really wouldn't be surprised if that was seriously Karin's purpose. Was there ever any other reason to randomly make her an Uzumaki other than for laughs?
A shame that never came to fruition. Would have wrapped that up nicely. But I guess it wasn't required since the Naruto and Sasuke brotherhood helps. Kishimoto could have done something really awesome with a SasuKarin kid.
But ya know.  Instead we got milk toast Salad and the abominations that is Burrito and mop girl. Considering Kishimoto 'forgot' about the byakugan in Hinata's womb goblins...maybe that's a good thing. They would be even more horrible to look at.  

Karin's purpose wasn't stated clearly, the only time she saw Naruto was on that time Sakura healed her, they never spoke to each other, even one time. So her being Uzumaki is just dead end plotline that went nowhere.

Also that brotherhood doesn't make sense at all. Through whole story of Naruto we've been told multiple times that kicking ass of Uchiha doesn't mean they became good, that was the case with Madara, that was the case with Obito (vs Minato) but suddenly Sasuke after declaring that he will kill 5 kages, and will singlehandedly rule over world got his ass whooped he became peaceful.

Edited by NarutoUzumaki01, 18 November 2020 - 12:08 AM.

[totherpage95]

😔 my grand uncle passed from cancer today, I didnt say much about it things were happening so quickly

[NarutoUzumaki01]

my grand uncle passed from cancer today, I didnt say much about it things were happening so quickly

My condolences to you and your family.

[Nostradamus]

my grand uncle passed from cancer today, I didnt say much about it things were happening so quickly

So sorry to hear that.

Condolences.

[Tiller]

my grand uncle passed from cancer today, I didnt say much about it things were happening so quickly

Sorry for your loss.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

my grand uncle passed from cancer today, I didnt say much about it things were happening so quickly

 

That sucks :(

[Luna]

Wow. Its been a long time since I posted on this site. Hi everyone c:

 

That being said, I just want to say I fell out of love for NS tbh. That doesn't mean I wouldn't read a FF about the pairing but I'm just not into like I used to. I just like Sakura only. Still don't like NH and SS but I'm tolerant towards SS because of Sakura tbh. In terms of pairings, I would just about any FF with Sakura paired with anyone but Sasuke. I tired reading one but I couldn't make it through the story. 

 

Plus, I fear for Sakura now that ********** is back and writing again. Poor girl might get killed off this time. 

[LuckyChi7]

Wow. Its been a long time since I posted on this site. Hi everyone c:

 

That being said, I just want to say I fell out of love for NS tbh. That doesn't mean I wouldn't read a FF about the pairing but I'm just not into like I used to. I just like Sakura only. Still don't like NH and SS but I'm tolerant towards SS because of Sakura tbh. In terms of pairings, I would just about any FF with Sakura paired with anyone but Sasuke. I tired reading one but I couldn't make it through the story. 

 

Plus, I fear for Sakura now that ********** is back and writing again. Poor girl might get killed off this time. 

 

 

 

 

 

LUNAA IT'S BEEN SO LONG!!!!!!          

Edited by LuckyChi7, 21 November 2020 - 12:12 AM.