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To What Degree IS Kakashi Responsible for Team 7's Neuroticism?

Kakashi Team 7 Sakura Naruto Sasuke

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#21 BlackShirtGuy

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Posted 20 November 2017 - 11:13 PM

In hindsight, all of the rookies teachers are guility of playing favorites, Kakashi did it with Sasuke that much is clear, Gai did it with Lee(to be fair, Neiji just like Sasuke had a lot of bloodthirst in him, so he probably did right not to train him much at least until he resolved those, but why neglect Ten-Ten?), Kurenai jeez I dunno but I think Hinata(maybe because she was a girl in "love" and she can relate to that? or because she saw her as the weakest of the group and thought she needed guideance the most, I dunno). Asuma was the only who actually tried to have his students on equal ground, but even  him spent more time with Shikamaru.

Kakashi was a pretty bad sensei that much is clear, instead of trying to make Sasuke change his mindset on vengance and the future, he just cared about making him stronger, which ultimately led to all of Sasuke's deeds post part 2, completely fuled by vengance and getting more powerful. Heck, the only time he actually talked to him about stop being a douche was just before he decided to leave for good, and he didn't even bother staying with him. He just left on a mission, sorry but shouldn't Jounin assigned to a gennin team should be excluded from missions until at least they graduate to chuunin, seems pretty irresponsible to left a couple of soldier kids IN-TRAINING alone.


“There are many types of monsters in this world, monsters who will not show themselves and who cause trouble. Monsters who abduct children, monsters who devour dreams, monsters who suck blood, and, monsters who always tell lies. Lying monsters are a real nuisance, they are much more cunning than other monsters. They pose as humans, even though they have no understanding of the human heart. They eat, even though they've never experienced hunger. They study even though the have no interest in academics. They seek friendship even though they do not know how to love. If I were to encounter such a monster, I would likely be eaten by it, because in truth, I am that monster.”   -L. Lawliet

 

#22 Tsuki Hoshino

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Posted 20 November 2017 - 11:15 PM

@BlackShirtGuy

You ninja'd me m8...


yea, but ignoring her makes it less creepy when they hook up VS lavishing attention on her as a kid.  :argh: But at least he never tries to kill her. 

I mentioned this before but holy hell Leesaku was such a missed opportunity on Kishi's part. The lolz it could have caused. 


Edited by Tsuki Hoshino, 20 November 2017 - 11:16 PM.

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#23 Tsuki Hoshino

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Posted 20 November 2017 - 11:19 PM

In hindsight, all of the rookies teachers are guility of playing favorites, Kakashi did it with Sasuke that much is clear, Gai did it with Lee(to be fair, Neiji just like Sasuke had a lot of bloodthirst in him, so he probably did right not to train him much at least until he resolved those, but why neglect Ten-Ten?), Kurenai jeez I dunno but I think Hinata(maybe because she was a girl in "love" and she can relate to that? or because she saw her as the weakest of the group and thought she needed guideance the most, I dunno). Asuma was the only who actually tried to have his students on equal ground, but even  him spent more time with Shikamaru.

Kakashi was a pretty bad sensei that much is clear, instead of trying to make Sasuke change his mindset on vengance and the future, he just cared about making him stronger, which ultimately led to all of Sasuke's deeds post part 2, completely fuled by vengance and getting more powerful. Heck, the only time he actually talked to him about stop being a douche was just before he decided to leave for good, and he didn't even bother staying with him. He just left on a mission, sorry but shouldn't Jounin assigned to a gennin team should be excluded from missions until at least they graduate to chuunin, seems pretty irresponsible to left a couple of soldier kids IN-TRAINING alone.

This is true. I understand from the stand point of a teacher, that when you have one student who is really "Excelling." you want to foster that, but at the same time dumping everyone else to focus on the genius isn't right. I think out of the teachers Asuma and Gai were the most successful ultimately. 

The thing about Kakashi is that he very clearly knows he sucked at his job and he's remorseful but also proud of what they managed to do without him. Its hard to hate him 


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#24 DrK

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Posted 20 November 2017 - 11:20 PM

LeeSaku doesn't work for me. I can't see her being amused by Lee's eccentricity in the way that she is with Naruto... It's too in your face and constant. Naruto is a goofball and makes her laugh, but he also has his moments of quiet care for her. Lee would be way too much. He'd want to carry her bridal style everywhere. Also I think she still has some of that Ino type shallowness where she wants a handsome guy, and Naruto did become that. Lee is never going to fit that ideal. I just don't think Sakura would ever come around to him, even if Sasuke and Naruto both died or something.



#25 Tsuki Hoshino

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Posted 20 November 2017 - 11:24 PM

LeeSaku doesn't work for me. I can't see her being amused by Lee's eccentricity in the way that she is with Naruto... It's too in your face and constant. Naruto is a goofball and makes her laugh, but he also has his moments of quiet care for her. Lee would be way too much. He'd want to carry her bridal style everywhere. Also I think she still has some of that Ino type shallowness where she wants a handsome guy, and Naruto did become that. Lee is never going to fit that ideal. I just don't think Sakura would ever come around to him, even if Sasuke and Naruto both died or something.

Yea but at least Lee is genuinely nice to her, and shows that he likes her. and part of her falling for him would be showing she really HAD grown all the way up. He's not handsome, he's not the biggest hero, but he's constant and honest. He'd always be home for dinner, he'd always be happy with the kids, he'd never give her the could shoulder. Coulda been a happy ended. IDK something about it...


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#26 DrK

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Posted 20 November 2017 - 11:34 PM

Yea but at least Lee is genuinely nice to her, and shows that he likes her. and part of her falling for him would be showing she really HAD grown all the way up. He's not handsome, he's not the biggest hero, but he's constant and honest. He'd always be home for dinner, he'd always be happy with the kids, he'd never give her the could shoulder. Coulda been a happy ended. IDK something about it...

I do like that aspect, but it's the only thing that works for me about it. Like one thing about NaruSaku is that they're very different outwardly, but deep down they have a lot in common. I don't see what her and Lee really have in common.

 

It doesn't help that he fell for her based on her appearance... Like the thing I find irresistible about NS is the idea that Naruto sees something in Sakura that he can't get anywhere else. He's completely addicted to the fiery tsundere spirit that is burning inside her. This is why the ending is so tragic. Hinata is the exact opposite of everything Naruto wanted.

 

I dunno what Lee saw in her. Maybe he liked a lot of the same things. But at first it was just cosmetic, and it's unclear how his interest in her progressed from there. But yeah I don't want to bash LS when I could be bashing SS, so I'll stop.


Edited by DrK, 20 November 2017 - 11:35 PM.


#27 Tsuki Hoshino

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Posted 20 November 2017 - 11:37 PM

 

I do like that aspect, but it's the only thing that works for me about it. Like one thing about NaruSaku is that they're very different outwardly, but deep down they have a lot in common. I don't see what her and Lee really have in common.

 

It doesn't help that he fell for her based on her appearance... Like the thing I find irresistible about NS is the idea that Naruto sees something in Sakura that he can't get anywhere else. He's completely addicted to the fiery tsundere spirit that is burning inside her. This is why the ending is so tragic. Hinata is the exact opposite of everything Naruto wanted.

 

I dunno what Lee saw in her. Maybe he liked a lot of the same things. But at first it was just cosmetic, and it's unclear how his interest in her progressed from there. But yeah I don't want to bash LS when I could be bashing SS, so I'll stop.

 

Hey its not bashing! its thoughtful discussion  :chuckle: Its not like I'm a hardcore Leesaku shipper. Its just that over time i've grown to appreciate it more then i used too. I think what he saw was how great they would be as a coordinated couple He'll be the leaves, she'll be the flowers. Together they make a tree  :woot: 

Omg I crack myself up....


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#28 BlackShirtGuy

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Posted 20 November 2017 - 11:48 PM

Hey its not bashing! its thoughtful discussion  :chuckle: Its not like I'm a hardcore Leesaku shipper. Its just that over time i've grown to appreciate it more then i used too. I think what he saw was how great they would be as a coordinated couple He'll be the leaves, she'll be the flowers. Together they make a tree  :woot: 

Omg I crack myself up....

 

Yeah, NS beats LeexSakura in everything, but that's mostly beause Lee isn't a part of the main cast or even a very popular character (like Shikamaru), however if is between LS and SS , LS all the way god, at the very least Lee always cared for Sakura and helped her when she was in a pinch and to a certain degree she cared for him too, and he unlike Sasuke at least would be there for his flipping wife  :zaru:


“There are many types of monsters in this world, monsters who will not show themselves and who cause trouble. Monsters who abduct children, monsters who devour dreams, monsters who suck blood, and, monsters who always tell lies. Lying monsters are a real nuisance, they are much more cunning than other monsters. They pose as humans, even though they have no understanding of the human heart. They eat, even though they've never experienced hunger. They study even though the have no interest in academics. They seek friendship even though they do not know how to love. If I were to encounter such a monster, I would likely be eaten by it, because in truth, I am that monster.”   -L. Lawliet

 

#29 DrK

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Posted 21 November 2017 - 12:01 AM

You have to wonder why LeeSaku was ever given any attention at all if SasuSaku was going to win. Do we really need two rival ships for one character? It's okay if NS ends up winning because in that case SS wasn't ever even an option, as Sasuke never liked Sakura to begin with. So Lee ends up being Sakura's Hinata. But instead we live in bizarro world.



#30 Tsuki Hoshino

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Posted 21 November 2017 - 12:20 AM

I think it was supposed to be a joke, or a subtle hint to people who thought Sakura wasn't cute "Oh hey look this guy besides Naruto finds her fancy!" 


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#31 DrK

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Posted 21 November 2017 - 12:23 AM

I don't really like how she looks in Part 1, either. But most of the kunoichi look weird then. Probably because of the art style. Tenten is the only one who looked similar to her Part 2 incarnation. Part 2 Sakura is the nicest looking, though.

 

Part 3 is Ino, and it's not even close. What the hell happened to everyone else?


Edited by DrK, 21 November 2017 - 12:26 AM.


#32 Tsuki Hoshino

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Posted 21 November 2017 - 12:28 AM

:lmao:  I don't know...We know Kishi can draw pretty women, but it seems he has trouble drawing girls, and teens...Sakura is still pretty good looking in part 3 imo, but she lacks attitude in her style. 


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#33 rocci

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Posted 21 November 2017 - 08:38 AM

Part 1 sakura is good. She's the most beautiful with long hair. That's why I like her the last kishi design.

Kakashi is the problem of kishi in ability to write toughtful backstory. He just simply make it on the way which make a big glaring issue. He can get away with it if he can combine it smoothly.

Kakashi is bad teacher because he doesn't teach his student what they should know. He doesn't teach sasuke other elemental jutsu when he capable to do that cause sharingan, he doesn't teach naruto and sakura what's their elemental ninjutsu, he doesn't teach sakura genjutsu. He doesn't do any of that especially to naruto and sakura. This make them in action department, bland and uninteresting.

At least for sakura, he can give her how to perform a genjutsu and a elemental ninjutsu, if she can't do that then it's not his fault.


He should support NS if he saw obito in naruto.

#34 milan kyuubi

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Posted 21 November 2017 - 01:33 PM

Yeah, I can totally imagine a story where Kakashi resented Kushina taking time away from someone who he saw as a surrogate father. The young Kakashi isn't really someone to be admired. Even Sasuke is better than him, honestly. The young Kakashi would never have respected Naruto as Sasuke ultimately did before his fall.

I think more of the resentment would come from the tailed beast issue. I mean on one hand he could KNOW its not Kushina's fault she is what she is, but also hate the fact that she's the embodiment of why he lost so many friends, compounding onto the fact that now His teacher is too busy, and then ultimately the both of them are ALSO killed because Kurama even exists and gets to continue existing inside Naruto when both have died. 

On one level there can be the knowledge that none of it is Naruto's fault, and on another grief, resentment, ect. 

Looking at Kakashi likes this makes me like him more  :lmao:

 

About Kakashi resenting Kushina. I don't think it's that, at least not because of a tailed  beast. Since Kakashi did not know what Kushina was.


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#35 Wubbzy

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 04:58 PM

You know, a part of me thinks it's not because Sasuke reminds him of himself, but because Naruto and Sakura remind of Obito and Rin, that he had trouble.

He probably saw them in Naruto and Sakura and probably made it difficult for him since they got killed off and he may feel a bit responsible for that.

And he may see himself as Sasuke, so he's trying to give Sasuke the necessary tools to protect both of them, something he couldn't do himself with Obito and Rin.

Of course, this is just my best guess that doesn't completely crap on him. Idk man. Still sucks tho that he didnt help Naruto and Sakura as much.

Edited by Wubbzy, 22 November 2017 - 04:59 PM.

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#36 T XD

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 05:20 PM

Kishimoto spent much time focusing on Sasuke which is why Kakashi is seen neglectful towards Naruto and Sakura in many instances. It would have been better if the protagonist was Sasuke.


Edited by T XD, 22 November 2017 - 05:20 PM.


#37 Tsuki Hoshino

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 05:29 PM

I honestly don't know why Kishi just didn't kill Naruto and focus on Sasuke since he wanted to so badly.

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#38 T XD

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 05:35 PM

I honestly don't know why Kishi just didn't kill Naruto and focus on Sasuke since he wanted to so badly.

Cause he already made Naruto the protagonist talking about his story as much as he can and he named the manga ' Naruto '.



#39 Tsuki Hoshino

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 05:37 PM

Yeah but it can still be called Naruto and be about Sasuke. It could be like, Sasuke completing Naruto's dreams for him :zaru: easy.

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#40 T XD

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 05:41 PM

Yeah but it can still be called Naruto and be about Sasuke. It could be like, Sasuke completing Naruto's dreams for him :zaru: easy.

That's too, but it seems he embraced the first option which his intentions were the contrary of his choice from what he writes in the story.


Edited by T XD, 22 November 2017 - 05:41 PM.






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