251 replies to this topic

[James S Cassidy]

 

something interesting i've read on tumblr

The face says it all.

Twenty years he has been struggling to achieve this one goal, this one dream. Twenty years he has resigned himself to an isolated life living as a world-class criminal solely so he could make himself a jinchuuriki capable of bringing about the new world of Tsuki no Mei. And in the span of several hours (I’m guessing that is about the time this part of the war has taken given that in the canon this fight seems to all have been taking during the night time) - his dream has come crumbling down. Quite literally, all of his abilities were ripped forcefully out of him. Imagine if you will, what that must be like. To have worked more than half of your lifetime towards a certain goal. To come so close to it that you could almost see it, almost feel it in the palm of your hand. Now imagine that very goal slipping like water through your fingers - imagine your entire purpose suddenly evaporating into thin air. How do you feel?

 

Say what you will about Naruto, but I am rather unimpressed with his TnJ up to this point mostly because Naruto has centered his discussion by persuading Obito to recall his former self. He sees Obito’s old dream of wanting to become Hokage and interprets that as an inner desire of Obito to maintain connections with the past. What he fails to see, however, is that this dream manifests as one that Obito gave up long ago precisely because of the despairing nature of reality. And Naruto…throughout this entire war he seems to have never been able to recognize Obito’s cause to change reality. He’s only focused on Obito’s lack of friendship, on his desire to reject his own identity. I suppose what I’m trying to say is that Naruto is going about trying to persuade Obito to “become good” in the wrong way. To a certain extent he almost seems manipulative in his manners of persuading Obito. 

 

I mean for goodness sake, he even forcefully took Obito’s hand without even trying to negotiate with him further. Are we ever going to see these two come eye to eye? (That being said I thoroughly enjoyed Obito going for Naruto’s neck and not just crumbling right away to TnJ - through and through he remains stubborn, just like how he was as a chuunin).

So what do I want next chapter? Some recognition for Obito’s efforts, for his cause. For all he has fought for, I wish there would be just the slightest bit of acknowledgement. This is not so much about being Hokage for Obito as it is about eliminating worldwide death and pain. And all I want is for someone to see that because it would certainly add to the tragedy if after twenty years no one (besides Madara) really understood Obito’s cause.

 

Actually, I don't really agree with this. If Naruto is only a manipulator, then what does that make Madara? A person who promised Obito everything, he promised to bring his life back in exchange for servitude only to want to betray him in the end for his own purpose and desires. It's always funny how some want to see how Naruto is manipulating people to become good, but never think that maybe people are manipulated to become evil.

If you think about it this way, Naruto merely freed him from a lie to begin with which is all it ever could be. I don't think Naruto is trying manipulate Obito into being good, but rather trying to show Obito to be himself. Instead of clinging to false promises or lies, he should look to reality and in himself. Who he used to be. That is the realy Obito. It's the idea that Obito wore masks for a long time and hid who he truly was because of his misery. Obito was the one who lived a lie a long time with a false dream given to him by Madara pretending to be this god of knowledge; saying he could bring people back from the dead simply by gaining great power. Even the Tsukiyomi world isn't really real and just another mask to hide you away from the truth.

That was basically the whole point of this argument and the fact that Obito's own subconcious and memories struggled in him even before Naruto did his TnJ means that obito was already in turmoil even before anything else.

 

And what of the life Obito had before Rin died? Doesn't that life mean anything? In fact, I could say that Obito's original dream of becoming Hokage was the real dream that was betrayed in place of this fake dream of making the world in this "perfection." obito betrayed himself a long time ago and abandoned his true self long before I could even think of the possibility of Naruto being manipulative. In fact, I am going to say that Madara was the manipulator and forced Obito to walk a path of darkness betrying who he really was and leading him to a place of lonliness.

Obito didn't need to turn good. He was already a good person. It was his mask that needed to go. The mask that Madara placed upon him.

 

His face....it's the face of a man who says to himself...."What have I been doing this whole time?" It reminds me of Kazuma from Kaze No Stigma when he became evil over his dead love. When he snapped out of it he says "Look how weak I am....what am I doing?"

Edited by James S Cassidy, 06 November 2013 - 07:53 AM.

[Fenris]

 

pls

Edited by Fenris, 06 November 2013 - 07:45 AM.

[morgaine4]

something interesting i've read on tumblr

The face says it all.

Twenty years he has been struggling to achieve this one goal, this one dream. Twenty years he has resigned himself to an isolated life living as a world-class criminal solely so he could make himself a jinchuuriki capable of bringing about the new world of Tsuki no Mei. And in the span of several hours (I’m guessing that is about the time this part of the war has taken given that in the canon this fight seems to all have been taking during the night time) - his dream has come crumbling down. Quite literally, all of his abilities were ripped forcefully out of him. Imagine if you will, what that must be like. To have worked more than half of your lifetime towards a certain goal. To come so close to it that you could almost see it, almost feel it in the palm of your hand. Now imagine that very goal slipping like water through your fingers - imagine your entire purpose suddenly evaporating into thin air. How do you feel?

 

Say what you will about Naruto, but I am rather unimpressed with his TnJ up to this point mostly because Naruto has centered his discussion by persuading Obito to recall his former self. He sees Obito’s old dream of wanting to become Hokage and interprets that as an inner desire of Obito to maintain connections with the past. What he fails to see, however, is that this dream manifests as one that Obito gave up long ago precisely because of the despairing nature of reality. And Naruto…throughout this entire war he seems to have never been able to recognize Obito’s cause to change reality. He’s only focused on Obito’s lack of friendship, on his desire to reject his own identity. I suppose what I’m trying to say is that Naruto is going about trying to persuade Obito to “become good” in the wrong way. To a certain extent he almost seems manipulative in his manners of persuading Obito. 

 

I mean for goodness sake, he even forcefully took Obito’s hand without even trying to negotiate with him further. Are we ever going to see these two come eye to eye? (That being said I thoroughly enjoyed Obito going for Naruto’s neck and not just crumbling right away to TnJ - through and through he remains stubborn, just like how he was as a chuunin).

So what do I want next chapter? Some recognition for Obito’s efforts, for his cause. For all he has fought for, I wish there would be just the slightest bit of acknowledgement. This is not so much about being Hokage for Obito as it is about eliminating worldwide death and pain. And all I want is for someone to see that because it would certainly add to the tragedy if after twenty years no one (besides Madara) really understood Obito’s cause.

 

 

Ehhh, what is Naruto supposed to say?  "You went through so much for your goal, you even orphaned me and Sasuke!  OMG, great for you, you're so awesome." 

[TouKen4Life3g]

So, this is beginning to beg the question: will there be another volume? Will Obito die here or save for one more volume to get the final conclusion along with the arc? Really hard to say. What's your thoughts? I'm going to review now.

[Chatte]

I know what you are all saying and in regards to Naruto, I don't agree with what the person said anyway, but if we think about Obito, indeed, to see everything you build until now lost in a matter of hours is tragic. It offers an interesting perspective over Obito, in a way, don't know exactly how to say it.

I'd say that at this point, he's most lost than he ever was before, because until now at least, he had a goal he constructed, but now, it's all gone, all his work and all his struggle to achieve that dream, everything, is gone.

I must say I like how Kishi dealt with this...

[Hokage Sennin]

I'm actually hoping that Rin and Obito talk one last time in the afterlife like the one between Kakashi and his father.

[Hanabi]

This is a interesting rant about rin and sakura

So, here is what is bothering me and it isn't just this chapter. It's been bugging me for a while now. It is about Rin and Sakura. I know I am not the only one who noticed (I literally know because other people pointed it out) that they are almost identical... What bothers me is that it is lazy and isn't working with the story given. Connections between Naruto and Obito and Sasuke and Kakashi are really done on multiple levels and are even noted in canon. They are complicated and mirror in many ways yet have their own thing going for them and those are parallels with a twist. Sakura and Rin are only paralleled by the romance stuff about which I couldn't care less and their appearance (oh and by being a medic, but all the girls are medics - Eff it, even The Last Airbender dealt with sexism concerning traditional female role as healers and not fighters unlike Naruto so I really have nothing to add there as Naruto is filled with sexist stuff anyway and this isn't a rant about that). There is nothing deep about that TBH.

The appearance part is what really bugs me. Okay, you made Rin and Sakura mirror images in appearance because you are too lazy to give them a connection in other aspects and you feel the need to parallel the entire team no matter how sloppily and you are always sloppy about the "main heroine", but GDI you can't get away with that level of appearance similarity (where even facial expressions are the same) never being noted by Rin's teammates. Kakashi never thought about it and he killed her and isn't feeling all that bright and sunny about that. Tobi met Sakura straight on, went even to comment on her, but he never thought that she is similar to Rin. Yeah, I know, secrets, suspense, blablabla yadayadayada, there is justification there, but point is the following. If you never had any of the closest people to Rin note it in any way upon meeting Sakura at any point in time, you should have drawn her differently. Their same appearance has no role but to parallel them. Sakura's similarity to Rin was never used for anything else but to connect the two in a lazy and sloppy manner. Had it been used to remind Obito or Kakashi of Rin in a crucial moment or whatever, I would be cool with that as it would have a purpose, but copy-pasting them just because of being too lazy to do it properly.... With that I'm not cool

Edited by Hanabi, 06 November 2013 - 08:02 AM.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

Looked like Naruto's TNJ wasnt complete, there's still something missing maybe he regret his own life i guess.

The last panel says it all.

 

Funny that on his hand on the hand, there's two parts that is missing from the "life line" of his hand, probably represents two deaths.

One when he supposedly died saving Rin and the second probably will be soon.

He will either use edo rinne tensei to mass revival or will sacrifice his life to stop the Console Cheater.

[morgaine4]

I know what you are all saying and in regards to Naruto, I don't agree with what the person said anyway, but if we think about Obito, indeed, to see everything you build until now lost in a matter of hours is tragic. It offers an interesting perspective over Obito, in a way, don't know exactly how to say it.

I'd say that at this point, he's most lost than he ever was before, because until now at least, he had a goal he constructed, but now, it's all gone, all his work and all his struggle to achieve that dream, everything, is gone.

I must say I like how Kishi dealt with this...

 

That aspect is interesting, and it really is fitting that he who was willing to destroy anything for the sake of his goals has to face the fact that his goals will not become a reality so close to realizing his goals.

[James S Cassidy]

I know what you are all saying and in regards to Naruto, I don't agree with what the person said anyway, but if we think about Obito, indeed, to see everything you build until now lost in a matter of hours is tragic. It offers an interesting perspective over Obito, in a way, don't know exactly how to say it.

I'd say that at this point, he's most lost than he ever was before, because until now at least, he had a goal he constructed, but now, it's all gone, all his work and all his struggle to achieve that dream, everything, is gone.

I must say I like how Kishi dealt with this...

 

I don't think he is lost so much he is questioning his existence. If you come to realization that everything you have done betrayed the very person you loved; the very person who was the reason you lived, the reason you did what you did, and the reason why life was worth living...would you think you deserved a second chance?

He betrayed the very person he was doing all of this for...and he now knows that even if he brought her back somehow, she would not be happy with him. She may even lose faith in him entirely.

 

I know how he feels. It's so hard to explain, but it's like....living a nightmatre only to wake up and realize that everything you did was real. You had control, but it felt like you weren't in control and was being controlled by an outside force. All that is left is wondering if you can ever make up for it and not be the monster you think you are.

[Chatte]

 

That aspect is interesting, and it really is fitting that he who was willing to destroy anything for the sake of his goals has to face the fact that his goals will not become a reality so close to realizing his goals.

Exactly. That's the part that intrigued me in what that person said. On the other stuff I don't agree as it's all Obito's fault, he did it to himself. But in regards to his perspective over things and his lost face, I must say I like the psychological matter behind it.

[Jake]

This chapter was really interesting, I loved every minute of it but by far my favorite part of the chapter has to be...

 

My Favorite Part of the Chapter!

 

Any way I can't wait til next week.

 

 

pls

 

Are you asking who that is, because that's the Oonoki

[Chatte]

Anyway... seeing how things work and some other things haven't been touched upon, I feel that the matter of love will be ultimately adressed. You know, there's one point that they both haven't addressed... Their love for Rin/Sakura respectively. I am waiting for some soon action in regards to that...

[morgaine4]

Anyway... seeing how things work and some other things haven't been touched upon, I feel that the matter of love will be ultimately adressed. You know, there's one point that they both haven't addressed... Their love for Rin/Sakura respectively. I am waiting for some soon action in regards to that...

 

 

It's still all about Rin

[BlueStarSaber]

That talk was quicker than I excepted, but oh well. When Obito grabbed Naruto's neck, he reminded me a bit off when he had the mask on. Anyway now I wonder if the tailed beasts will destroy the tree.

[James S Cassidy]

Obito was good turned evil....now we can say he is turning back to good....It works and I actually like it like this.

 

Now my question to you guys....do we really want the same ending for Sasuke like this?

[rocci]

@chatte
If sakura getting hurt than the rin sakura parallel will adress, if not happen then in the next arc, maybe before narusasu final fight.

@ns4life
I agree that kishi strong point is drama and drawing emotion.
And I believe in the next volume this war will finish with maybe 3 or 4 transition chapter.

[Chatte]

Obito was good turned evil....now we can say he is turning back to good....It works and I actually like it like this.

 

Now my question to you guys....do we really want the same ending for Sasuke like this?

Hmm, I don't want it to be like this, to be honest. Though we all know somehow Naruto will TNJ him too. But at least, if he does, I hope Kishi does it in a right way...

[rocci]

@james
There are two option for sasuke when he got tnj by naruto:
1. He will become good again and live in konoha beside his dear naruto.
2. He will become wanderer along with his taka team, become the shadow and naruto will become the light. Both will protect the world.

I will choose number 2.

[James S Cassidy]

I still want Sasuke to die. XD