8493 replies to this topic

[tricksie]

Oh, and on Menma, don't know if it's outright stated in the movie, but apparently it was even in one of the promo articles that Menma "had no girlfriend". So yeah,apparently, yandere Hinata was fantasizing. Genjutsu Sakura didn't say anything negative about Naruto in "Road to Sakura" like she immediately did about Sasuke- she just immediately dismissed Sasuke as "a playboy". In fact, from what little she said, there was a kind of impression that genjutsu Sakura had some kind of bond to Menma.

And if you look at genjutsu Kiba's comment when he first sees Naruto and Sakura together and the violent raging jealousy of genjutsu Hinata I wouldn't call it out of the realm of possibility that Sakura and Menma weren't progressing to something beyond friendship before he left the village and gave into the dark Kyuubi and then started attacking villages.

Oh squee! I so want to write a fanfic about Menma/Sakura. The idea's been snowballing. If he was too weird or AU Hinata obsessed, then I probably wouldn't. But it sounds like he's still enough Naruto to make it doable! Yay!

[4000TMNT]

Lately a new possibility that can happen in the manga was Itachi's quote. This is new to me. People in here and in NF are saying that Itachi's quote about Naruto needed someone to make him stronger. I don't know what chapter is it, but I would like someone to link me to it. Anyway, Itachi say something about if there's someone close to a ninja, he/she will become stronger. The strange part is that he used Minato and Kushina as a best example. What does this means? I don't know, but if it holds something important, then I look forward to Naruto's answer.

Thank you for pointing out on what was I saying. You made it much clearer.

It's chapter 552

http://www.mangapanda.com/naruto/552/8

[ciardha]

Oh squee! I so want to write a fanfic about Menma/Sakura. The idea's been snowballing. If he was too weird or AU Hinata obsessed, then I probably wouldn't. But it sounds like he's still enough Naruto to make it doable! Yay!

Yeah, I wouldn't call it a crack pairing there's enough bits and pieces to think something was there, and if you want to play around with it post Naruto and Sakura's departure and the other Sakura's return I'd say go for it too.

I know the concept intrigues me as well so looking forward to your fanfic.

[4000TMNT]

I'm sorry but, I just read a funny post at Tumblr, saying that SasuSaku did not get trolled in the movie.


Road To Ninja Did Not Troll SasuSaku

Am I the only one who thinks RtN isn’t a hindrance to SasuSaku? I think the film helps our pairing because despite being filler with canon elements, it got included because Kishimoto was working on RtN. He decided to add moments for the couple. SasuSaku has not been featured in a movie since the very first one and that was the only Naruto film he had a hand in making until now.Don’t you think that says something? Aren’t you happy that we got a hint in a film (however brief or one-sided) after waiting for so long? Aren’t you grateful that he included a part for SasuSaku?

I’m fed up of seeing so much negativity from fellow SasuSaku fans toward this film. I can’t believe you have decided you hate it before you have even seen it. That’s just stupid. Watch the movie in Japan or when it comes out subbed and decide for yourself. Don’t just go on what other people say and regurgitate their experiences when talking about Road To Ninja, especially when you haven’t gone through the same thing whilst seeing the film.

So what if Sasuke gave a rose to the other girls (and perhaps repeated the same line he told Sakura)? So what? It doesn’t mean it wasn’t a SasuSaku moment when he presented the girl with the flower and flirted with her. She took it to be something romantic at the time.

Isn’t that enough?

It is for me.

Ugh. Some people are so hard to please.

Plus, haven’t you thought that the fact they were alone when he did it might imply something? Have you thought that perhaps the way he said the line (whether he uses it with other girls or not) might be different? Have you even entertained the notion that Sasuke’s advances on Sakura might actually be genuine and Sakura didn’t pick it up?

Let me guess.

You haven’t.

I thought as much.

These possibilities, along with the ones SasuSaku fans have taken to be set in stone when they aren’t, can only be confirmed when they see Road To Ninja themselves. Don’t let other people decide for you. Decide for yourself once you have seen the film.

So is it a troll? Not necessarily. See the movie first before you jump to conclusions.

However, if you want to keep on hating the film and believing there aren’t any SasuSaku moments - be my guest. You have ruined the movie and potentially enjoyable SasuSaku parts for yourself before you have even given it a chance. All I can say is that it’s your loss. It’s not my problem.

I for one will remain positive and excited about this film. I’m hoping to see it for myself, unlike the majority of SasuSaku fans.

[Don-kun]

^^ You posted that already here and in Naruto forums.

Lately a new possibility that can happen in the manga was Itachi's quote. This is new to me. People in here and in NF are saying that Itachi's quote about Naruto needed someone to make him stronger. I don't know what chapter is it, but I would like someone to link me to it. Anyway, Itachi say something about if there's someone close to a ninja, he/she will become stronger. The strange part is that he used Minato and Kushina as a best example. What does this means? I don't know, but if it holds something important, then I look forward to Naruto's answer.

Thank you for pointing out on what was I saying. You made it much clearer.

http://en.narutovers.../Naruto/552/06/
http://en.narutovers.../Naruto/552/07/
http://en.narutovers.../Naruto/552/08/
http://en.narutovers.../Naruto/552/09/
http://en.narutovers.../Naruto/552/10/


http://en.narutovers.../Naruto/573/13/


Now who was the first female that accepted that she was wrong about Minato?
Who was the first person that complemented Kushina?
Etc. etc.
We can mirror NaruSaku with the same even't

So in the end Sakura's words are very similar to Itachi's word, I'm pretty sure Kushina never wanted for Minato to shoulder everything by himself, we saw that in her flashback, and Sakura is the only girl that is always supporting Naruto while she also doesn't want Naruto to shoulder everything by himself, to the point where she say that no matter what he says they will be together she will fight with him until the end. While Hinata is thinking about her future husband, Sakura is saying that she will not allow Naruto to fight alone they will be together, fight together and not only she their friends will also fight together, she is more realistic and thinks about the moment and the danger of the war.

When you remenber MinaKushi, you think about NaruSaku, when you remember Itashi's words you think about Sakura been Naruto's main support and to eliminate any doubt Kishi made Sakura say those word that are similar to what Itashi said about MK. MinaKushi's bond = NaruSaku bond and the rest of the Villagers acknowledgment = the Rookies acknowledgment.

The problem with others and the reason why they get trolled so hard, is the fact that the refuse to see the meaning behind things Kishimoto normally do.
Examples:

NS- The bench scene.
S- What is this feelings? Is this Naruto?
N- How can I become Hokage if I cannot save a friend?
N- How can I tell her If I'm not even able to keep a promise?
K- Find a girl like me.
S- I trust you completely.
N- I will do anything to keep that smile.

These are some example of some heavy hint Kishimoto is dropping now and again.
But people just refuses to get the meaning and just focus on the cover, example Road to ninja covers and his advertisements.



Do not judge a book only by his cover.

Edited by NS means logic, 09 August 2012 - 01:38 AM.

[Gravenimage]

I'm sorry but, I just read a funny post at Tumblr, saying that SasuSaku did not get trolled in the movie.


Road To Ninja Did Not Troll SasuSaku

Am I the only one who thinks RtN isn’t a hindrance to SasuSaku? I think the film helps our pairing because despite being filler with canon elements, it got included because Kishimoto was working on RtN. He decided to add moments for the couple. SasuSaku has not been featured in a movie since the very first one and that was the only Naruto film he had a hand in making until now.Don’t you think that says something? Aren’t you happy that we got a hint in a film (however brief or one-sided) after waiting for so long? Aren’t you grateful that he included a part for SasuSaku?

I’m fed up of seeing so much negativity from fellow SasuSaku fans toward this film. I can’t believe you have decided you hate it before you have even seen it. That’s just stupid. Watch the movie in Japan or when it comes out subbed and decide for yourself. Don’t just go on what other people say and regurgitate their experiences when talking about Road To Ninja, especially when you haven’t gone through the same thing whilst seeing the film.

So what if Sasuke gave a rose to the other girls (and perhaps repeated the same line he told Sakura)? So what? It doesn’t mean it wasn’t a SasuSaku moment when he presented the girl with the flower and flirted with her. She took it to be something romantic at the time.

Isn’t that enough?

It is for me.

Ugh. Some people are so hard to please.

Plus, haven’t you thought that the fact they were alone when he did it might imply something? Have you thought that perhaps the way he said the line (whether he uses it with other girls or not) might be different? Have you even entertained the notion that Sasuke’s advances on Sakura might actually be genuine and Sakura didn’t pick it up?

Let me guess.

You haven’t.

I thought as much.

These possibilities, along with the ones SasuSaku fans have taken to be set in stone when they aren’t, can only be confirmed when they see Road To Ninja themselves. Don’t let other people decide for you. Decide for yourself once you have seen the film.

So is it a troll? Not necessarily. See the movie first before you jump to conclusions.

However, if you want to keep on hating the film and believing there aren’t any SasuSaku moments - be my guest. You have ruined the movie and potentially enjoyable SasuSaku parts for yourself before you have even given it a chance. All I can say is that it’s your loss. It’s not my problem.

I for one will remain positive and excited about this film. I’m hoping to see it for myself, unlike the majority of SasuSaku fans.

This quote was already posted and debated.

[TouKen4Life3g]

I'm sorry but, I just read a funny post at Tumblr, saying that SasuSaku did not get trolled in the movie.


Road To Ninja Did Not Troll SasuSaku

Am I the only one who thinks RtN isn’t a hindrance to SasuSaku? I think the film helps our pairing because despite being filler with canon elements, it got included because Kishimoto was working on RtN. He decided to add moments for the couple. SasuSaku has not been featured in a movie since the very first one and that was the only Naruto film he had a hand in making until now.Don’t you think that says something? Aren’t you happy that we got a hint in a film (however brief or one-sided) after waiting for so long? Aren’t you grateful that he included a part for SasuSaku?

I’m fed up of seeing so much negativity from fellow SasuSaku fans toward this film. I can’t believe you have decided you hate it before you have even seen it. That’s just stupid. Watch the movie in Japan or when it comes out subbed and decide for yourself. Don’t just go on what other people say and regurgitate their experiences when talking about Road To Ninja, especially when you haven’t gone through the same thing whilst seeing the film.

So what if Sasuke gave a rose to the other girls (and perhaps repeated the same line he told Sakura)? So what? It doesn’t mean it wasn’t a SasuSaku moment when he presented the girl with the flower and flirted with her. She took it to be something romantic at the time.

Isn’t that enough?

It is for me.

Ugh. Some people are so hard to please.

Plus, haven’t you thought that the fact they were alone when he did it might imply something? Have you thought that perhaps the way he said the line (whether he uses it with other girls or not) might be different? Have you even entertained the notion that Sasuke’s advances on Sakura might actually be genuine and Sakura didn’t pick it up?

Let me guess.

You haven’t.

I thought as much.

These possibilities, along with the ones SasuSaku fans have taken to be set in stone when they aren’t, can only be confirmed when they see Road To Ninja themselves. Don’t let other people decide for you. Decide for yourself once you have seen the film.

So is it a troll? Not necessarily. See the movie first before you jump to conclusions.

However, if you want to keep on hating the film and believing there aren’t any SasuSaku moments - be my guest. You have ruined the movie and potentially enjoyable SasuSaku parts for yourself before you have even given it a chance. All I can say is that it’s your loss. It’s not my problem.

I for one will remain positive and excited about this film. I’m hoping to see it for myself, unlike the majority of SasuSaku fans.

The only part that he/she is right is about don't hate the movie because it didn't have SasuSaku moments, watch it and have fun. Other than that, um, no. That's why I couldn't call NaruHina in the movie a troll because there was nothing to begin with, only she was used to backup NaruSaku (ironic) and comedy moments. SasuSaku was trolled and that's why till this day, I am like "Ouch..." to that. I always thought the rose scene was the last scene for Sasuke and Sakura could be all happy to see a rose, leaving her hope that he will come back and they will be together. When I read spoiler, at first I laughed, then shocked that there's no more of Sasuke after that, leaving the situation of SasuSaku pretty bad.

NaruHina got hurt that Naruto wasn't interested in her regardless of her attitude changed and there's no moments between them. SasuSaku fans saw it sweet for Sakura to get a rose. If it was left like that, then I can call it SasuSaku regardless that's not real Sasuke. But the later scene destroys that scene completely because it turns out that she was played by Sasuke as he only sees her another girl on the block. That's something no matured girls want from a man. This happens in the middle of the movie too, so it goes to show what's more priority to Kishi.


Kishi left NaruSaku open with many possibility and he did so in full force. Act 1 is about them seeing each other as "What if I was him/her?" and them exploring around together to see what's going on. Act 2 is the beginning of Naruto's delusion and fallen to Tobi's trap. Act 3 is about leaving and lessons they learn from each other. This is the reason why people saw NaruSaku coming off strong than all the pairing because the development they gone through together in AU and how they have to help each other in process. I guess the parallel scenes really boost it more for people to understand the new generation. If Kishi didn't put the last date request, it wouldn't come off too strong, rather it will be just good for them to have moments and now, it's over. Now that he actually did put it, it ends in a strong note. Why include it? Because he wants us to know that these two have a high chance to be a couple. There's more to it. It also shows that Naruto is actually winning her heart, slowly but surely. Lastly, the date request proves that NaruSaku bonds is one of the main theme. If it's just parental love theme, Sakura's last scene should have ended with her hugging her parents and that will be it, but no, Kishi put in a date request only to get the audience reaction of "WHAT!" and that will bring more people interested between them, not to mention it brings comedy with Naruto being off-guarded and didn't think they were in a date for the longest, though I bet Naruto expected a kiss. Next time, Naruto.

Now I can see why people keeps mentioning that this movie is also about their bonds and comes off strong. If you have a SasuSaku fan saying bad things to Sasuke for breaking her heart and acknowledges NaruSaku being at top and cute, then you know Kishi is doing something right.

@NS means logic: This. I will respond later. Need rest.

[Verilance]

Before the movie came out when I dropped by, there would be pages and pages of panic from various people about the littlest rumour, of course now it is all sweetness and light once that the movie is out but it was frustrating for me to have to read that day after day.

I can't speak for Ciardha but to my mind that is where she is coming from...

Edited by Verilance, 09 August 2012 - 02:17 AM.

[Paptala]

Lately a new possibility that can happen in the manga was Itachi's quote. This is new to me. People in here and in NF are saying that Itachi's quote about Naruto needed someone to make him stronger. I don't know what chapter is it, but I would like someone to link me to it. Anyway, Itachi say something about if there's someone close to a ninja, he/she will become stronger. The strange part is that he used Minato and Kushina as a best example. What does this means? I don't know, but if it holds something important, then I look forward to Naruto's answer.

"No matter how powerful you become, never try to shoulder everything alone. Otherwise you will undoubtedly fail. Your father Minato could be Hokage because he had your mother Kushina and all the others. Your dream is the same as your father's isn't it?"

This is the same message that Kishi has been trying to push since the bell test in part one - Naruto still hasn't learned to fully rely on others; he still thinks that he has to do everything on his own.

Sakura has already tried to take that burden from his shoulders many times. The most noticeable is Sakura's promise that they would bring back Sasuke together at the end of part one - that promise is referenced to multiple times; heck even Naruto comments on how happy it makes him that they are working towards that goal together. The promise is alluded to in Sakura's last speech, and I think that this time, since she's determined to not let Naruto shoulder the burden on his own as he's always done before, it will stick. Naruto will recall Itachi's words and finally accept Sakura's help, shouldering the burden equally with her as he should have been doing from the get go.

Hinata save Naruto's life in chapter 437 right? Now many beliefs that Naruto need to end with Hinata because of that event.

Sakura saves Naruto's life against Zabuza when she saves him from getting hit with Zabuza's sword.
Sakura .... ..... ..................... Orochimaru, she saves him from a fatal fall.
Sakura protected Naruto and Sasuke's life against the sound ninjas.
Sakura also helps Naruto from some fatal injuries when he went on 4 tail mode.
Sakura Save Naruto's life in the Movie.

5 vs 1

Regardless of the number of times, I feel that Sakura being one of the people to save Naruto from the hell of loneliness and then the one to most consistently be by his side supporting him however she can is worth way more than Hinata's desperate life or death save and selfish confession. Not to knock Hinata's actions, necessarily, but its one thing to risk something in the heat of battle, and another to stick by someone's side for years through both good and bad times, and to be willing to push aside your own feelings and prioritize their happiness over your own.

Hinata has not done that -- her own feelings have always taken priority, whether it be her shyness overcoming Naruto's clear need for companionship/acknowledgment pre-Team 7, or her feelings of love and desire for acknowledgment overcoming the inevitable pain Naruto would feel at watching a friend who just confessed her love "die" in front of him, or her feelings of love and desire for acknowledgment over riding any thought she may have had for Naruto's position or struggles as the rookies headed for the battlefield.

The only difference between Hinata and Sakura is that Hinata has a crush on Naruto while Sakura is really concerned about Naruto's life. I wonder if Kishi also feel worried that he try to paint Sakura in a good light but people still try to find a way to bash her.

I imagine Kishi probably just gets exasperated that what he's shown of Sakura isn't satisfactory and baffled at how a minor character like Hinata is outshining his heroine. I don't think that he'll allow the fan's opinions dictate how he writes his story though ultimately. He's always had the end game in mind, its just a matter of getting there.

It's chapter 552

http://www.mangapanda.com/naruto/552/8

Thanks so much for the link! I was looking for this myself!

So in the end Sakura's words are very similar to Itachi's word, I'm pretty sure Kushina never wanted for Minato to shoulder everything by himself, we saw that in her flashback, and Sakura is the only girl that is always supporting Naruto while she also doesn't want Naruto to shoulder everything by himself, to the point where she say that no matter what he says they will be together she will fight with him until the end. While Hinata is thinking about her future husband, Sakura is saying that she will not allow Naruto to fight alone they will be together, fight together and not only she their friends will also fight together, she is more realistic and thinks about the moment and the danger of the war.

When you remenber MinaKushi, you think about NaruSaku, when you remember Itashi's words you think about Sakura been Naruto's main support and to eliminate any doubt Kishi made Sakura say those word that are similar to what Itashi said about MK. MinaKushi's bond = NaruSaku bond and the rest of the Villagers acknowledgment = the Rookies acknowledgment.

Exactly - I think Sakura's determination to support Naruto this time no matter what he says, that it won't be just her but everyone is very reminiscent of "he had your mother and all of the others" -- Hinata wants to be by his side, but not for Naruto's benefit. She is not thinking of how to support him, but only about herself.

Sakura is the one who has actively been by Naruto's side through the good and bad, trying to help him and easing his burdens. I honestly think that when Naruto and Sakura meet up next, Sakura is going to do or say something about not leaving his side, about him needing to let her shoulder his burdens with him, and he'll recall Itachi's words, and finally accept the help she's been trying to give him for so long. In doing so, hopefully it will also finally ease Sakura's own self doubts about her ability to help.

[Don-kun]

"No matter how powerful you become, never try to shoulder everything alone. Otherwise you will undoubtedly fail. Your father Minato could be Hokage because he had your mother Kushina and all the others. Your dream is the same as your father's isn't it?"

This is the same message that Kishi has been trying to push since the bell test in part one - Naruto still hasn't learned to fully rely on others; he still thinks that he has to do everything on his own.

Sakura has already tried to take that burden from his shoulders many times. The most noticeable is Sakura's promise that they would bring back Sasuke together at the end of part one - that promise is referenced to multiple times; heck even Naruto comments on how happy it makes him that they are working towards that goal together. The promise is alluded to in Sakura's last speech, and I think that this time, since she's determined to not let Naruto shoulder the burden on his own as he's always done before, it will stick. Naruto will recall Itachi's words and finally accept Sakura's help, shouldering the burden equally with her as he should have been doing from the get go.

Regardless of the number of times, I feel that Sakura being one of the people to save Naruto from the hell of loneliness and then the one to most consistently be by his side supporting him however she can is worth way more than Hinata's desperate life or death save and selfish confession. Not to knock Hinata's actions, necessarily, but its one thing to risk something in the heat of battle, and another to stick by someone's side for years through both good and bad times, and to be willing to push aside your own feelings and prioritize their happiness over your own.

Hinata has not done that -- her own feelings have always taken priority, whether it be her shyness overcoming Naruto's clear need for companionship/acknowledgment pre-Team 7, or her feelings of love and desire for acknowledgment overcoming the inevitable pain Naruto would feel at watching a friend who just confessed her love "die" in front of him, or her feelings of love and desire for acknowledgment over riding any thought she may have had for Naruto's position or struggles as the rookies headed for the battlefield.

I imagine Kishi probably just gets exasperated that what he's shown of Sakura isn't satisfactory and baffled at how a minor character like Hinata is outshining his heroine. I don't think that he'll allow the fan's opinions dictate how he writes his story though ultimately. He's always had the end game in mind, its just a matter of getting there.

Thanks so much for the link! I was looking for this myself!

Exactly - I think Sakura's determination to support Naruto this time no matter what he says, that it won't be just her but everyone is very reminiscent of "he had your mother and all of the others" -- Hinata wants to be by his side, but not for Naruto's benefit. She is not thinking of how to support him, but only about herself.

Sakura is the one who has actively been by Naruto's side through the good and bad, trying to help him and easing his burdens. I honestly think that when Naruto and Sakura meet up next, Sakura is going to do or say something about not leaving his side, about him needing to let her shoulder his burdens with him, and he'll recall Itachi's words, and finally accept the help she's been trying to give him for so long. In doing so, hopefully it will also finally ease Sakura's own self doubts about her ability to help.

Paptala you never cease to amaze with your post.


Same goes for you Malverstation AKA AmaNS I haven't seen anyone who tops you on Deviantart.


On topic:

I really don't know if Kishi was any way offended by the Sakura hate mails and Hinata fans been so loud, but if we remember after Hinata's confession Kishi and the Anime Team has poorly described Hinata's character Episode 232 rock Lee show and her selfish desire in chapter 573 (they are romantic, but also selfish because she has never consider Naruto haven feelings for someone else when she knows that he does like someone Sakura since she always stalked him).

When a character never focus on what she can do to make a person happy (Naruto) but always focus and what she wants (hold his hand with out knowing how he feels about her), is a sign of how selfish a character can be.
We have seen so many things that really bothers Naruto, but we have never seen Hinata thinking about his problems (Kyuubi), dream (Hokage), desires (Village Acknowledgment, Sakura's love, save Sasuke), or more importantly, the decision to kill Sasuke.

Edited by NS means logic, 09 August 2012 - 03:12 AM.

[Orenji]

You know when a character never focus on what she can do to make a person happy but always focus and what she wants, is a sign of how selfish a character can be.
We have seen so many things that really bother Naruto, but we have never seen Hinata thinking about his problems (Kyuubi), dream (Hokage), desires (Village Acknowledgment, Sakura's love, save Sasuke), or more importantly, the decision to kill Sasuke.

I won't go so far as to say Hinata is completely selfish, because she does think about what Naruto wants in a sense because it is also what she wants as well (i.e. acknowledgement). I feel that even though she likes him very much, I don't think she would ever be so selfish to try and stop Naruto and Sakura being together in any other way than just trying to get Naruto to notice her in a more than platonic way. Which she has.. and nothing came from it. I think other than the little "Naruto-kun..."s, Hinata is pretty much done in the whole NH department.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Hey, thanks for the link. I got myself some rest.

Now then, time to express my POV:

Thank you for the link to that chapter. It's funny, but I somewhat missed that or rather, I didn't remember because this arc has been going on for a while. Anyway, it is pretty convenient that Sakura said something that match to Itachi's quote. I don't know if Kishi did this intentional, but I can see it to be important to Naruto's character as well as Sakura. Remember, Yamato told Sakura that the most important support is her strong feelings for Naruto, which is why he chuckled a bit because he read her feelings and it points out to much more than friends, which is the only one option: love. This arc could be when Sakura starts questioning herself about her feelings for Naruto and Sasuke.

Now that I went back to that chapter, I decided to go back to Team 7 reunion. I realized that she really did it for Naruto. There's a lot of thoughts of her saying about Naruto this, Naruto that. Not to be confused with Hinata, because this is something that would have effect her forever. She wants to take all the burden for Naruto, and if Naruto have to hate someone, it will be her. She did it because she felt that everything that caused Naruto pain was her doing. At that point, she felt like she don't deserve to be his lover, but he still loves her after all this. When the reunion happen, he back up Naruto all the way. He talked back at Sasuke for insulting him and Naruto didn't even say anything. She took it to the heart. When he clashed with Sasuke, she only yelled for Naruto because she thought he would get hurt bad.

Now this is the interesting part to me. Naruto told Sasuke that he read his heart and it said that they will die together. Kakashi got the "What!" reaction, Zetsu got the "What the hell is he talking about?" reaction, Tobi got the "Hm..." reaction, and Sakura got the "What!? What do you mean!?" reaction. She keeps bringing the "We will die together" quote in her head often. Now read the part when they went back home and talk to Konoha 11. The interesting part is this:

http://www.mangahere...52/c488/13.html

He told them everyone that only he can fight Sasuke. One thing that's bothering her is his quote to Sasuke. Why Naruto didn't say the same thing that he told Sasuke? What is Naruto's plan? Will she be comfortable with his plan? Why Naruto must do it alone? Why end your life to end all burdens? This is the problem that hasn't been address yet and Sakura, out of Konoha 11, only knows about it. She will address this to Naruto. I know that Naruto will go alone against Sasuke, but there's no doubt that Sakura will be the last person to talk before he fights Sasuke. Sakura doesn't want Naruto end his life. I think that's clear for a most likely conversation between Naruto and Sakura. It amazes me to think people think Hinata knows Naruto most of all. BS.

Edited by NaruSaku4Life3g, 09 August 2012 - 03:51 AM.

[Don-kun]

I won't go so far as to say Hinata is completely selfish, because she does think about what Naruto wants in a sense because it is also what she wants as well (i.e. acknowledgement). I feel that even though she likes him very much, I don't think she would ever be so selfish to try and stop Naruto and Sakura being together in any other way than just trying to get Naruto to notice her in a more than platonic way. Which she has.. and nothing came from it. I think other than the little "Naruto-kun..."s, Hinata is pretty much done in the whole NH department.

Well everyone has their own opinions. I do remember how Sakura use to think about Sasuke and wanted Sasuke no matter what he felt towards her, she was categorized the worst possible way and in the end she only ends up hurting herself, Hinata copy Naruto's Nindo but until before Kakashi toll her and the war started Hinata didn't know why Naruto was hated by the Villagers now that she knows she has never thought about his suffering it never concerned her.
Hinata most know how deep Naruto cares about Sasuke but she was ready to kill him without thinking about Naruto's feeling and how hurt he would be, Hinata knows Naruto's likes Sakura but has never wished that if she is the only one who would make Naruto happy then she will wish him luck. Naruto on the panel, has never given Hinata a sign that he feels any romantic affection for her, but she admitted that she wanted to overtake him in the past and after the war they will hold hands because she says so, not because they agree.

To me that selfishness is all about her, if you don't see it that way them we will agree to disagree.

[Orenji]

Well everyone has their own opinions. I do remember how Sakura use to think about Sasuke and wanted Sasuke no matter what he felt towards her, she was categorized the worst possible way and in the end she only ends up hurting herself, Hinata copy Naruto's Nindo but until before Kakashi toll her and the war started Hinata didn't know why Naruto was hated by the Villagers now that she knows she has never thought about his suffering it never concerned her.
Hinata most know how deep Naruto cares about Sasuke but she was ready to kill him without thinking about Naruto's feeling and how hurt he would be, Hinata knows Naruto's likes Sakura but has never wished that if she is the only one who would make Naruto happy then she will wish him luck. Naruto on the panel, has never given Hinata a sign that he feels any romantic affection for her, but she admitted that she wanted to overtake him in the past and after the war they will hold hands because she says so, not because they agree.

To me that selfishness is all about her, if you don't see it that way them we will agree to disagree.

And I totally respect that (:

I will be the first one to say that I am not a Hinata fan in anyway. I don't hate her, but I don't really like much about her either. I think what I wanted to say was that yes, it's selfish, but that's a good thing in a way. She's doing what she wanted to do, and that's taking control and trying to make what she wants to happen, happen. And I'm not saying that is what you said, but why is that a bad thing? Isn't that what we all do? Sure, its selfish, but she should be selfish when it comes to her happiness. When we want to be happy, we tend to do all that we want to do to be happy. Yes, I agree that she never really thought about Naruto's misery, only of her love for him, but even if she did think of everything, she still would be selfish. Everyone is selfish, and has every right to be when it comes to their own happiness (I believe its how they deal with it when the dont get what they want truly defines someones character). Like Naruto's feelings for Sakura, he definitely knows Sakura likes Sasuke, yet he continues to pursue her (thank God!), which is selfish (even though we all know he is the most selfless person in the manga, he would sacrifice his happiness for her if she did want to chose Sasuke over him in the end).

[Don-kun]

And I totally respect that (:

I will be the first one to say that I am not a Hinata fan in anyway. I don't hate her, but I don't really like much about her either. I think what I wanted to say was that yes, it's selfish, but that's a good thing in a way. She's doing what she wanted to do, and that's taking control and trying to make what she wants to happen, happen. And I'm not saying that is what you said, but why is that a bad thing? Isn't that what we all do? Sure, its selfish, but she should be selfish when it comes to her happiness. When we want to be happy, we tend to do all that we want to do to be happy. Yes, I agree that she never really thought about Naruto's misery, only of her love for him, but even if she did think of everything, she still would be selfish. Everyone is selfish, and has every right to be when it comes to their own happiness (I believe its how they deal with it when the dont get what they want truly defines someones character). Like Naruto's feelings for Sakura, he definitely knows Sakura likes Sasuke, yet he continues to pursue her (thank God!), which is selfish (even though we all know he is the most selfless person in the manga, he would sacrifice his happiness for her if she did want to chose Sasuke over him in the end).

Well I do care about her character and wish she would focus more on her friends, the ones who always by her side.
Every Rookie has been shown to care a lot about their Teammates but for some reason that isn't the case when it comes to her character, I also wish she finds another love intteres in the Manga that isn't Naruto.
To be honest I really care about KibaHina in fanfic stories.
A Soul's Salvation Lady Kogawolf and some AMV stories on YouTube
that is how I start liking KH.
The only time I really dislike Hinata is when I focus to much on her FC.

Edited by NS means logic, 09 August 2012 - 04:44 AM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Well I do care about her character and wish she would focus more on her friends, the ones who always by her side.
Every Rookie has been shown to care a lot about their Teammates but for some reason that isn't the case when it comes to her character, I also wish she finds another love intteres in the Manga that isn't Naruto.
To be honest I really care about KibaHina in fanfic stories.
A Soul's Salvation Lady Kogawolf and some AMV stories on YouTube
that is how I start liking KH.
The only time I really dislike Hinata is when I focus to much on her FC.

I wonder if Kishi decided to make her into a selfish character with a light heart. It could be an act of revenge to her fans. I could be joking when I say this.

[Nefertieh]

Bad traits are bad traits, at least in my book. I'm not going to put Naruto on a pedestal, because while a characters bad traits may not always overshadow their good traits, the opposite is also true.

Other characters, maybe, but Naruto, definitely not.

This is true. When Naruto made that promise to never be useless again, he stuck to it and has done so ever since. On the other hand, it took Sakura all of part 1 to find her own path.

And unfortunately, Kishimoto has given Sakura only one battle so far, and it seems like she's been stuck with healing yet again. In the Kage Summit her own plan failed and she had to be saved, which again makes her look bad compared to Naruto.

Naruto's childhood was undoubtedly very tragic and lonely, but the same can also be said of Sakura's childhood. She was bullied by the other kids and had next to no confidence. Then Ino showed up and showed Sakura how to be more confident in herself. She also believed that Sakura had great potential, so much in fact, that she might even become a better kunoichi than her. This was shown in the flashback where Ino referred to Sakura as a bud that hasn't bloomed yet and herself as a cosmos flower.

Yes, but most of the fandom would consider being bullied relatively normal, especially being compared to Naruto, who was hated by everyone for doing nothing. I'm sure if we brought some statistics over we can probably see that a lot of real kids aren't being bullied for simply being 'ugly' anymore.

I understand Kishimoto wanted Sakura and Ino to develop a mutual respect like Sasuke and Naruto, but a lot of the fandom missed that part and hated Sakura for 'betraying' her savior, and so they don't feel sympathetic to her at all.

Sasuke's childhood was indeed pretty messed up, in fact, I'd say that it was way more messed up than Naruto's childhood. Still, Sasuke had it pretty good. Pretty much everyone in the village greatly respected him, he could pretty much pick any girl he wanted and most importantly, he had team 7. Even if you discount the first two as simply being superficial, his bonds with Naruto, Sakura and Kakashi were anything but superficial. They all loved him and only wanted what was best for him, even if their resoning was slighty selfish. If Sasuke had been able to let go of his hatred, he might have been able to understand that sometimes, sharing you pain with others is far better than doing everything by yourself. Still, I understand why Sasuke is acting the way he is and I don't really blame him, although I will say that comitting genocide on Konoha is going to far. Punishing the elders who were responsible. A-okay. Wanting to kill every man, woman and child in the village. Not so okay.

Exactly. A lot of the Sakura hate doesn't just stem from her fangirl or tsundere tendencies, it's because a lot of people would consider her privileged.

Oh, and on Menma, don't know if it's outright stated in the movie, but apparently it was even in one of the promo articles that Menma "had no girlfriend". So yeah,apparently, yandere Hinata was fantasizing. Genjutsu Sakura didn't say anything negative about Naruto in "Road to Sakura" like she immediately did about Sasuke- she just immediately dismissed Sasuke as "a playboy". In fact, from what little she said, there was a kind of impression that genjutsu Sakura had some kind of bond to Menma.

The promo said "Naruto, who has no parents or a girlfriend..."

Edited by Smiter, 11 August 2012 - 06:55 PM.

[Nefertieh]

Well, I don't see it that way. It Naruto makes a mistake, I'll judge him just as harshly as I would any other character.

That if great on your part, but the vocal part of the fandom, not so much.

Yeah, the Kage summit arc wasn't exactly kind to Sakua's character. Hopefully Kishi will rectify that at some point.

Exactly. I would like to see some closure.

Well, Sakura was also hated for doing nothing. It's not her fault that she was born with an oversized forehead and yet it seems that pretty much all the other kids tormented her daily because of this. My point was just that, even though some people might not find Sakura's background particularly sympathetic, I do and sure I'm not the only one. As for the statistivs part, I wouldn't know. All I know is that kids can be really cruel sometimes.

I haven't seen a lot of people who consider Sakura's background sympathetic because Ino rescued her quite early on, not to mention it really seems like a drop in the ocean compared to people like Gaara.

Kids are usually bullied for what they do, but something they can't change -- which gives the bullies power. When I went to school kids were just bullied for their clothes or their race, but it was contained to school. But thanks to cellphones and the internet, a lot of kids can't escape it at all.

Well, that's their own fault. Who knows, perhaps Kishi didn't do a good enough job of showing that there was more to Ino and Sakura's situation than simply just being "rivals for love", but I did and for me, that is one of my personal greatest Naruto moments of all time.

It would be nice to see more Ino.

And why is that? Is it because she spent a great deal of part 1 not truly understanding Naurot and Sasuke's situation or is it because of that comment she made in chapter 3? If it's the former, then I can totally see where they're coming from. In fact, I somewhat agree myself. If it's the latter, all I have to say is that she already learned her lesson for that. Sasuke told her off and from then on she never acted that mean ever again. She basically apologised through her actions. Besides, that was in part 1. People change and that holds true for Sakura as well.

I think it's not her comments, but the fact that she had a normal upbringing with parents. I'm not saying she's inconsiderate, I'm saying the fandom is harsher to her because she doesn't have a tragedy.

Personally, I don't think a tragic background makes for a better or more interesting character. For example, I find Sakura to be a way more interesting character than Sasuke and sometimes even Naruto. Still, this is just my opinon. Also, as I mentioned earlier, I have a great deal of respect for Sakura's character. I think she's come a long way and has achieved a lot of things since part 1. I can understand being angry or frustrated by how a character is handled (because I sometimes feel that way myself), but that has more to do with Kishi than it has to do with her. Also, I'm not saying that everyone who hates Sakura hates her simply because she's female. That would be ridiculous and incredibly sexist. I'm just saying that female characters being judged way harsher than male characters happens and that it is a stupid double standard.

I don't think tragic characters are necessarily more interesting either, but it does make them more forgivable through the perspective of the fans. Let's not forget in Naruto's world, half of all the characters introduced have incredibly sad backgrounds.

I think women are judged more harshly by some vocal fans, but I agree with you, it probably corrolates to the fact from the fact that writers stick them in the weaker, female tropes. Not the hero, but always the one being saved.

[TerrorKing]

That if great on your part, but the vocal part of the fandom, not so much.

Yup.

Exactly. I would like to see some closure.

Me too and I think Kishi will deliver. Like I mentioned in another post, judging from the info we've gotten on this movie so far, I'd say it's pretty resonable to expect that she will get at least some major panel time before the series is over.

I haven't seen a lot of people who consider Sakura's background sympathetic because Ino rescued her quite early on, not to mention it really seems like a drop in the ocean compared to people like Gaara.

This is true. I suppose that just makes us a minority. And no, compared to what Gaara had to go through, Sakura's past isn't all that sad or tragic, but it wasn't exactly all sunshine and rainbows either. All in all, it's good enough for me.

Kids are usually bullied for what they do, but something they can't change -- which gives the bullies power. When I went to school kids were just bullied for their clothes or their race, but it was contained to school. But thanks to cellphones and the internet, a lot of kids can't escape it at all.

True, but I've also seen kids being bullied because of their physical features, like having a certain hair colour or something, so I wouldn't say that Sakura beign bullied because of her forehead is completely unrealistic.

It would be nice to see more Ino.

Indeed. Ino is awesome. That's why I'm looking forward to todays episode, becuase this is we finally get to see her in action again.

I think it's not her comments, but the fact that she had a normal upbringing with parents. I'm not saying she's inconsiderate, I'm saying the fandom is harsher to her because she doesn't have a tragedy.

But that's just it. She never brings up her upbringing vs. Naruto and Sasukes upbringing. I could understand it if she was always complaining about her parents or if she was always comparing her background to Naruto and Sasuke's, but she never does. It's totally irrelevant. The idea that, just because a character doesn't have a sad past, somehow means that that character now has to work harder to be acknowledged by the fanbase is just dumb in my opinion.

I don't think tragic characters are necessarily more interesting either, but it does make them more forgivable through the perspective of the fans. Let's not forget in Naruto's world, half of all the characters introduced have incredibly sad backgrounds.

Indeed. Still, even though Sakura's past may not be all that tragic compared to Naruto or Sasuke's or Gaara's , it still provides a perfect freudian excuse for why Sakura acts the way she does. Like you said, it's not like Sakura is the only character with a relatively normal background. Look at Tenten. No tragic background there, in fact, we don't even really know anything about her background. Look at Ino. No tragic background there. What about Shikamaru? At the beginning of the series, he was pretty much a sexist a**hole. Why? Because of his domineering mother. But so what? It's not like she ever abused him or anything, not that we off at least, so what's his excuse? Or Choji. His tragic past is largely the same as Sakura's. He was bullied, but then he found a friend. I guess the major difference here is that, unlike Sakura, Choji never had a rivalry with Shikamaru, but in my opinon that only makes Sakura a more complex character than Choji.

I think women are judged more harshly by some vocal fans, but I agree with you, it probably corrolates to the fact from the fact that writers stick them in the weaker, female tropes. Not the hero, but always the one being saved.

Yeah and it really frustrates me, especially because Kishi has already proven that he knows how to write Sakura as a badass heroine, i.e. the rescue Gaara arc as well as the Sasori fight. That's why, when the Five Kage summit arc happened, I became so indredibly disillusioned with Kishi. I hated what he did to Sakura, especially the "All that's left for me is to believe in them". That made me think that Kishi just simply didn't care about Sakura at all, but now thanks to the info on this new movie, my hopes have been somewhat restored.

[Nefertieh]

But that's just it. She never brings up her upbringing vs. Naruto and Sasukes upbringing. I could understand it if she was always complaining about her parents or if she was always comparing her background to Naruto and Sasuke's, but she never does. It's totally irrelevant. The idea that, just because a character doesn't have a sad past, somehow means that that character now has to work harder to be acknowledged by the fanbase is just dumb in my opinion.

It doesn't really matter whether she complained about her parents or not, at the end of the day, the people don't feel any remorse for hating a character who is not tragic. People are far more willing to forgive Gaara for nearly killing Sakura and Sasuke, or Neji over Hinata, regardless if they talked about their past. The same goes for a court case -- if the accused had a terrible upbringing, the jury will be far more likely to sympathize and deliver a more favourable verdict.

Indeed. Still, even though Sakura's past may not be all that tragic compared to Naruto or Sasuke's or Gaara's , it still provides a perfect freudian excuse for why Sakura acts the way she does.

Think of it this way: If you whole family was murdered by your brother, people will forgive you for anything.

If you were made fun of like every other kid while half of the world had their families murdered, people will forgive you for nothing.

Sakura is 'normal' if you compare her to our world standards, but in the ninja world, she is relatively fortunate.

Like you said, it's not like Sakura is the only character with a relatively normal background. Look at Tenten. No tragic background there, in fact, we don't even really know anything about her background. Look at Ino. No tragic background there. What about Shikamaru? At the beginning of the series, he was pretty much a sexist a**hole. Why? Because of his domineering mother. But so what? It's not like she ever abused him or anything, not that we off at least, so what's his excuse? Or Choji. His tragic past is largely the same as Sakura's. He was bullied, but then he found a friend. I guess the major difference here is that, unlike Sakura, Choji never had a rivalry with Shikamaru, but in my opinon that only makes Sakura a more complex character than Choji.

Obviously you can't compare Sakura to Chouji or Shikamaru. They only have about a fraction of the screentime. During that fraction however, Chouji and Shikamaru has some wonderful development, they served their purpose in the story and were quickly set aside, giving the readers a good impression about them.

I'm sure even Akamaru has more screentime than Tenten. Sure, she might not be as flawed or tragic, but is anyone interested?

Yeah and it really frustrates me, especially because Kishi has already proven that he knows how to write Sakura as a badass heroine, i.e. the rescue Gaara arc as well as the Sasori fight. That's why, when the Five Kage summit arc happened, I became so indredibly disillusioned with Kishi. I hated what he did to Sakura, especially the "All that's left for me is to believe in them". That made me think that Kishi just simply didn't care about Sakura at all, but now thanks to the info on this new movie, my hopes have been somewhat restored.

She did mention in he thoughts at the beginning of the war arc that she will be fighting alongside Naruto with everyone else, whether Kishimoto writes anything on that remains to be seen.