19964 replies to this topic

[TouKen4Life3g]

One thing I noticed while reading the past couple of pages is how everyone thinks Hinata is either okay with NS or she is trying her hardest to fight it. Honestly, I think you are both right which leads me to show how inconsistent Kishi is with his characters at times. While Hinata is not the only one to change, she has been the one to change in ways more dramatically than any other character. This is weird as the other characters change was a more gradual. Why is that? I am not sure. As Inferno says, maybe he is trying to catch her up for neglecting her for so long. Personally, I still think that he can't really do it and so he has to diminish his other characters to do so. In short: Can't raise her bar, so we lower everyone else's to make hers look higher. it would explain why some character have been pretty quiet on the homefront.

I guess he does it to give the NH fans something or to try and misdirect, but it seems rather sloppy. Again, I am looking at this from a writer stand point, not a NS fan. It really is so rushed and out of nowhere. Not that it shouldn't have been done, but that it kind of came in from nowhere and came from nothing. It really is sloppy and I think Kishi should have handled it better. I know it just ain't me thinking this as many saw it as well. Whatever the reason for it, it is sloppy.

Maybe this is another reason why NH won't be canon, it is just too sloppy while NS was perfectly rounded with development and flow.

@striderC
I don't believe 615 is a pro-NH scene either. Simply because of how the scene turned out. It could have been, but Naruto didn't take it as romantic and so this is why I didn't see it as anything more than a Hinata to Naruto moment.

Random fact: My computer wants me to keep changing Hinata to "Pinata"



THERE IS NO PAIRING, THERE IS ONLY ZUUL.

ZUUUL MOTHERF!@#$, ZUUL

Yeah, I know what you mean. Kishi is like giving her developments at the last minute because really. she hasn't showcase until now. Actually, if it was spread more, it would have been easier to digest this, but it seems like it's happening so fast. It's not that he's trying make NH, but rather giving her developments but never set her or any other side characters as a top priority, so in here, he is going to close it with such small time. Actually, if it wasn't the fact that Kishi wants to show Team 10, Hinata, and others, this arc would have been short. The only real progress that happened in that day was getting those brothers to replace Bee/Naruto. So yeah, you can say sloppy mess if NH was the way to go, but oh well.

I gave 616 a chance to create a follow-up for 615 to be a true pairing moment, but it wasn't. Well, my phone corrects me from NH to NHL

[StriderC]

One thing I noticed while reading the past couple of pages is how everyone thinks Hinata is either okay with NS or she is trying her hardest to fight it. Honestly, I think you are both right which leads me to show how inconsistent Kishi is with his characters at times. While Hinata is not the only one to change, she has been the one to change in ways more dramatically than any other character. This is weird as the other characters change was a more gradual. Why is that? I am not sure. As Inferno says, maybe he is trying to catch her up for neglecting her for so long. Personally, I still think that he can't really do it and so he has to diminish his other characters to do so. In short: Can't raise her bar, so we lower everyone else's to make hers look higher. it would explain why some character have been pretty quiet on the homefront.

I guess he does it to give the NH fans something or to try and misdirect, but it seems rather sloppy. Again, I am looking at this from a writer stand point, not a NS fan. It really is so rushed and out of nowhere. Not that it shouldn't have been done, but that it kind of came in from nowhere and came from nothing. It really is sloppy and I think Kishi should have handled it better. I know it just ain't me thinking this as many saw it as well. Whatever the reason for it, it is sloppy.

Maybe this is another reason why NH won't be canon, it is just too sloppy while NS was perfectly rounded with development and flow.

@striderC
I don't believe 615 is a pro-NH scene either. Simply because of how the scene turned out. It could have been, but Naruto didn't take it as romantic and so this is why I didn't see it as anything more than a Hinata to Naruto moment.

Random fact: My computer wants me to keep changing Hinata to "Pinata"



THERE IS NO PAIRING, THERE IS ONLY ZUUL.

ZUUUL MOTHERF!@#$, ZUUL

LOL I'm not saying it's a mutual romantic moment. I'm saying it's a NH moment when it comes to their own personal relationship. I know some people consider the moment where Naruto protects Sakura with the kyuubi a moment or where Sakura thinks of Naruto as a NS moment even though that's not a romantic moment either.

[James S Cassidy]

LOL I'm not saying it's a mutual romantic moment. I'm saying it's a NH moment when it comes to their own personal relationship. I know some people consider the moment where Naruto protects Sakura with the kyuubi a moment or where Sakura thinks of Naruto as a NS moment even though that's not a romantic moment either.

I actually don't. I have to look at what each character is feeling and how the scene plays out before I judge whether it was a scene or not. Like the Pein arc confession I saw as a NH moment because Naruto reacted in such a way.

[StriderC]

I actually don't. I have to look at what each character is feeling and how the scene plays out before I judge whether it was a scene or not. Like the Pein arc confession I saw as a NH moment because Naruto reacted in such a way.

Well then good sir. We're just gonna have a difference in opinion on that matter I suppose but tis all good.

What do you think's gonna happen next chapter btw?

[T XD]

I think that Kishi founded that this arc is the right time for side characters, especially for Hinata. I think he founded that he should do more screen time for Hinata and saw that this battle is the right time for her. If he wanted to do some development for other side characters in other arcs, or even in a bunch of chapters, it just won't fit with the story line of the plot or there isn't room for them.

If we thought of the past arcs, there isn't any good place or time for them. So, he got the chance to go for them especially Hinata.

Lol. Seems that technology isn't updated for anything that includes Hinata . I know, harsh XD

Well then good sir. We're just gonna have a difference in opinion on that matter I suppose but tis all good.

What do you think's gonna happen next chapter btw?

Obito and Kakashi talking more or beginning to fight. If they won't fight, maybe at the end of the chapter, it will shift to the battlefield.

Edited by T XD, 14 May 2013 - 04:47 PM.

[StriderC]

I think that Kishi founded that this arc is the right time for side characters, especially for Hinata. I think he founded that he should do more screen time for Hinata and saw that this battle is the right time for her. If he wanted to do some development for other side characters in other arcs, or even in a bunch of chapters, it just won't fit with the story line of the plot or there isn't room for them.

If we thought of the past arcs, there isn't any good place or time for them. So, he got the chance to go for them especially Hinata.

Lol. Seems that technology isn't updated for anything that includes Hinata . I know, harsh XD


Obito and Kakashi talking more or beginning to fight. If they won't fight, maybe at the end of the chapter, it will shift to the battlefield.

Yeah, I think they're gonna exchange some blows. What I find crazy is how Obito was considered the main villain and now he's fighting against Kakashi... I never would of thought Kakashi could take this guy down by himself and I actually don't think he can to be honest but we shall see. Hopefully Kishi divides the chapter a little.

Edited by StriderC, 14 May 2013 - 04:50 PM.

[T XD]

Yeah, I think they're gonna exchange some blows. What I find crazy is how Obito was considered the main villain and now he's fighting against Kakashi... I never would of thought Kakashi could take this guy down by himself and I actually don't think he can to be honest but we shall see. Hopefully Kishi divides the chapter a little.

I don't think he'll take him down fully either cause if he would in the place that they are in now and let's say that Obito died, Naruto won't have a role to tell something to Obito. I think Naruto will say something to Obito that will change his view on the world or, at least, have a turn in that.

Now if Kakashi defeated him and, well, Obito is in control of this parallel universe, and by defeating him, they can return automatically to the battlefield. I'm not sure if that can happen considering how Obito control it though.

Edited by T XD, 14 May 2013 - 05:00 PM.

[Don-kun]

LOL I'm not saying it's a mutual romantic moment. I'm saying it's a NH moment when it comes to their own personal relationship. I know some people consider the moment where Naruto protects Sakura with the kyuubi a moment or where Sakura thinks of Naruto as a NS moment even though that's not a romantic moment either.

I believe you meant Naruto and Hinata development with some implication of Hinata>>>Naruto, not NH moment.

Anyway I do have the same mentality as you do, I see all the effort to completely dismiss any development between Naruto and Hinata as the same fail attempt from the SS fans when it comes to NS, like dimming any hint Sakura shows towards Naruto irrelevant because Sakura still has feelings for Sasuke ignoring the fact that in almost three occasions she tried to give up on Sasuke, ignoring all Naruto and Sakura development by saying that it was only about Sasuke, ignoring the whole part two of the Manga while praising part one, ignoring part 3 of the data but because part 2 said something they like despite the last book not saying anything about her at all or even stated that ending his bond with Naruto was like losing and harm, etc.

The reason why I cannot see NH is because Hinata is missing some many key element about Naruto character that Sakura already haves.
The only reason I might have doubt with SS is because of Kishimoto huge favoritism towards his character, but focusing on the story and the story only, it's cover with NS all over the place.

That's why I don't need to dismiss any interaction between Naruto and Hinata or Sasuke character or involvement.

Edited by Don-kun, 14 May 2013 - 05:05 PM.

[StriderC]

I don't think he'll take him down fully either cause if he would in the place that they are in now and let's say that Obito died, Naruto won't have a role to tell something to Obito. I think Naruto will say something to Obito that will change his view on the world or, at least, have a turn in that.

Now if Kakashi defeated him and, well, Obito is in control of this parallel universe, and by defeating him, they can return automatically to the battlefield. I'm not sure if that can happen considering how Obito control it though.

Agreed. Hopefully they give us a good show while things unfold. Also, I'm sort of on the fence on who I want to push Obito to redemption. I mean, Kakashi has known this guy since they were kids, and they have a stronger relationship than Obito does toward Naruto. Sure, the two have their similarities but in what way could Naruto push Obito to the "redeemed" side? I'm not sure at the moment.

I also wonder if Minato will get to see his old student again and if so, how he'll react to him, and finding out that it wasn't Madara that played a part in his death but his own student.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

I believe you meant Naruto and Hinata development with some implication of Hinata>>>Naruto, not NH moment.

Anyway I do have the same mentality as you do, I see all the effort to completely dismiss any development between Naruto and Hinata as the same fail attempt from the SS fans when it comes to NS, like dimming any hint Sakura shows towards Naruto irrelevant because Sakura still has feelings for Sasuke ignoring the fact that in almost three occasions she tried to give up on Sasuke, ignoring all Naruto and Sakura development by saying that it was only about Sasuke, ignoring the whole part two of the Manga while praising part one, ignoring part 3 of the data but because part 2 said something they like despite the last book not saying anything about her at all or even stated that ending his bond with Naruto was like losing and harm, etc.

The reason why I cannot see NH is because Hinata is missing some many key element about Naruto character that Sakura already haves.
The only reason I might have doubt with SS is because of Kishimoto huge favoritism towards his character, but focusing on the story and the story only, it's cover with NS all over the place.

Thar's why I don't need to dismiss any interaction between Naruto and Hinata or Sasuke character or involvement.

I agree with you the difference is between NH and NS is that NS comes from Sakura it's Sakura who has to give hinst, shows doubts and have a development of showing her moving on and we all have it, but with NH we dont need panels that express Hinata loving Naruto because we already know that, we dont see Naruto having doubts of his feelings when it comes to Sakura, it never happened not even on flashbacks and when it only one that appears was naruto confirming he still loves her, so how can we see NH if Naruto doesnt express that, it's Naruto that needs development to move on, not moments where Hinata express her selfish love.
We have 0 development in terms of Naruto thinking "i should move on", "i should love someome better".
The only hint was his mindset about not deserving Sakura just because he cant keep his promise but it has nothing to do with moving on, it's not a rejection, but more to enforce his will to continue working harder.

People just see Hinata getting development = NH being canon, Hinata is getting develpment, Hinata that, Hinata this but forgot that it's Naruto who needs development asspulls for NH to happen not Hinata.

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 14 May 2013 - 05:12 PM.

[T XD]

Agreed. Hopefully they give us a good show while things unfold. Also, I'm sort of on the fence on who I want to push Obito to redemption. I mean, Kakashi has known this guy since they were kids, and they have a stronger relationship than Obito does toward Naruto. Sure, the two have their similarities but in what way could Naruto push Obito to the "redeemed" side? I'm not sure at the moment.

I also wonder if Minato will get to see his old student again and if so, how he'll react to him, and finding out that it wasn't Madara that played a part in his death but his own student.

Well, you know that Naruto's Tnj can change people XD. Kakashi, as well, may say something to him that will make something click in his mind. I think both will have a turn in this. Maybe just Naruto.

I think that Minato coming to the battle and him may very well see Obito that he'll get to see him. Plus, I think that Minato knows that it was Obito who killed him. When they fought for a bit, I remember that Minato made a surprised reaction when he saw Obito's gold kunai if I'm not mistaken.

By the way, who's the character on your signature or is it a character that you created ? It's nice and very cool XD

Edited by T XD, 14 May 2013 - 05:25 PM.

[HauntedCake]

Not long now guys

[StriderC]

Well, you know that Naruto's Tnj can change people XD. Kakashi, as well, may say something to him that will make something click in his mind. I think both will have a turn in this. Maybe just Naruto.

I think that Minato coming to the battle and him may very well see Obito that he'll get to see him. Plus, I think that Minato knows that it was Obito who killed him. When they fought for a bit, I remember that Minato made a surprised reaction when he saw Obito's gold kunai if I'm not mistaken.

By the way, who's the character on your signature or is it a character that you created ? It's nice and very cool XD

Haha. Yeah, but I don't want Naruto to change every single person. LOL It'd be nice if someone else had a chance to. We'll see how it all pans out though.

I need to reread that bit again. What chapter was that? It's possible he knows it was Obito but given how he was when he met Naruto in the Pein arc, I'm not entirely sure. Hmmmmmm...


Oh, that's Rukia. LOL I drew that sometime last year. It's more recognizable in bigger form. Here you go.

Bigger Rukia pic --Click here to view--

And glad you like it!

[TouKen4Life3g]

Somewhat off-topic, but apparently, tumblr is going to have a NaruSaku week starting May 18-25. Interesting...

[T XD]

Haha. Yeah, but I don't want Naruto to change every single person. LOL It'd be nice if someone else had a chance to. We'll see how it all pans out though.

I need to reread that bit again. What chapter was that? It's possible he knows it was Obito but given how he was when he met Naruto in the Pein arc, I'm not entirely sure. Hmmmmmm...


Oh, that's Rukia. LOL I drew that sometime last year. It's more recognizable in bigger form. Here you go.

Bigger Rukia pic --Click here to view--

And glad you like it!

I don't remember what chapter was it. Sorry XD. I don't memorize the chapters numbers usually except the most important ones... and impact ones XD. Hope anyone here will tell.

So it's Rukia. My second favorite character in Bleach XD. She looks awesome especially how her Zanpakuto is looking.

Edited by T XD, 14 May 2013 - 05:51 PM.

[Gravenimage]

One thing that continues to amaze me to no end is the claims that NaruSaku is dead or its just a red herring. Are these people honestly serious?

Lets look at it like this:

1. If NaruSaku really did die in 469, then why do we get the notion of Kushina being practically the past generation Sakura after Tsunade? Why is there a freaking filler that even explains why he fell in love with her and still does? We even have openings after the 5 kage summit showing him interested in Sakura, we even have RtN showing a lot of their friendship. Seriously, we have stuff like the filler taking place after the 5 kage summit saying he still loves her, its not canon but then why keep giving notions of him loving her then? I mean why bother if NaruSaku really did die? There are tons of reasons for Naruto to still love Sakura, mainly the aspect of not giving up and we know his merits for loving Sakura even in the manga, because of the promise and both ways from both the manga and non-canon ep 235, what is canon is what Naruto stated about her happiness being all that matters. Simply, he puts Sakura before himself most of the time (and don't forget Sakura has put Naruto above everything a few times too). Naruto giving up or no longer loving Sakura would simply just be a contradiction to Naruto himself as he once said, "I never give up or go back on my word, if I did I wouldn't be true to myself." This quote yes, from another filler ep 188, but guess what? It still falls in line with his canon outlook, he made that vow ever since the ambush by the demon brothers all the way back in the land of waves arc. It still makes no sense for Naruto to give up or not love Sakura simply due to his own character design (like part of his personality is based on real Japanese kitsune folklore, this includes never breaking a promise, pulling pranks, taking the form of a beautiful woman via sexy jutsu) and just for other general story reasons, namely the promise is part of his own desire to bring Sasuke back and it makes no sense either for him to merely not forgive Sakura when she told him herself she was worried, Sai told him himself about how Sakura felt it was all for Naruto's sake and Sai himself said he felt partly guilty. Naruto knows why Sakura did it and understood the pain of why she did it, with Sai saying its also my fault she came to do what she did, so why would Naruto not forgive her? Why would he stop loving her after learning why she did it for him? Suffered in a similar way like him? That just makes no sense by this claim. Others say he forgave her but no longer loves her, this argument is even harder to present! He no longer loves her but just wants to remain friends? Seriously? After all this? Please explain how Naruto has to suddenly love Hinata then, give a merit of why he realizes he should love her, we learn why he struggles with Sakura, its all due to his love for her, please explain this for Hinata. Seriously this first claim is just too ridiculous when there are logical reasons to serve as an answer to this until we get a direct one. Otherwise, right now it can be assumed canonwise that Naruto still loves Sakura, there is just too much for it. I mean I still just laugh when its all this other stuff is to let us down easy for NH to become canon, this brings me to my next point.

2. NaruSaku is just a red herring, I sereiously crack up at this notion, okay so all this stuff in the series is just a red herring, to get us so focused and so set on it for NaruSaku to not happen? Okay imagine for a second it was like this, you realize how much worse that makes NH? Kishi had all this time over the past few years, plenty of opportunities to develop NaruHina yet he did it with NaruSaku, so what would really be the point of it? NH is still minor now isn't it? It has been sitting there in the background with pracitically nothing done, so my key quesiton to this cliam would be this Why the hell even bother? What the heck was the whole purpose of this just to serve as a red herring? Even if NaruSaku was a red herring, it still does not help NaruHina, to be a troll? This makes NH look as bad as it could possibly be, no matter what is argued, any of these results still limit Hinata to have been nothing but a fodder paring character and NaruHina is just a fodder pairing because it just sat around in the back waiting to be used, seriously there no conflict or enduring struggle between Naruto and Hinata, just Hinata for NaruHina, Kishi could have used Hinata or developed NH more but did not. No matter what NH argues, it cannot get over this, its far too late for it to have a lasting quality, too late to have a consistent development, too late to have any major impact on the story. NaruSaku has a conflict between Naruto and Sakura, it has them both struggling and worried about each other alongside all the good and bad they grow and experience together, yet they still come out as friends. Together Naruto and Sakura have an unbreakable friendship and care a lot for each other, this much is true and already canonwise proven. In other words, NaruSaku exists as one of the closest relationships but it can become more. NaruSaku works just like a real relationship, they have experienced a lot together, always try to do their best for the other, they have inspired and helped each other, they have hurt and confused on another. Naruto and Sakura have practically gone to hell and back with the 5 kage summit, yet they still have a great feeling of respect and devotion to each other. NaruSaku is the only relation to show this stuff, all the good and bad yet they still come back as the best of friends. It just baffles me to think that all this development, interaction, and the emotion it brings would just be sidelined for NH which has practically none of it and the 2 moments which do exist just go away quickly afterwards. Its literally a joke to think this, why would kishi have put all this development and interaction just to shove another in our face which has nothing? Its like NS would be a house built only to be destroyed while NH was the other house which could have been built, but the deadline for it to be finished is closing fast and it took 3 or so years to build the NS house, but cause they destroyed it, they are left with only tape and mud to create the NH house, in other words all that time building NS only to be a red herring could have been spent better to build NH, its seriously the question defeating it in itself, kishi could have just put more NH than just ax NS. All this time building NS just to break it is literally pointless, NH would look even worse.

These claims are just funny and ridiculous at times, this make me wonder for some anti-NS fans, woundn;t it be better for them to try to find reasons for their pairing, rather than making claims? Its easy for us in the NS to camp to argue because we have such a big amount of content. The only one still lacking a direct answer are Naruto's real feelings, yet we are able to answer these in the time being in other ways such as it would contradict Naruto to give up on Sakura, of all people her, to stop loving or not forgive her would be an insult to other parts of the story, he cannot forgive her for trying to do something for his sake, yet he forgave Nagato who murdered Jiraya and blew up his village. Even kishi basically said that the love triangle if anything is still on (someone care to elaborate from that sakura confession?) for now its best assumed that Naruto still loves Sakura, there are just too many reasons saying why he does.

Epic post Inferno I bow down to you master.

[Chatte]

Have you noticed how Hinata and Rock Lee have similar hair shape more or less. And one is in love with Sakura and one with Naruto, heh...

[StriderC]

I don't remember what chapter was it. Sorry XD. I don't memorize the chapters numbers usually except the most important ones... and impact ones XD. Hope anyone here will tell.

So it's Rukia. My second favorite character in Bleach XD. She looks awesome especially how her Zanpakuto is looking.

LOL I barely even remember the impacting ones. I try to keep them in my head though as far as what happened, and what I thought of whatever moment happens/happened. But, I'll try to find it sometime when I'm free. Seems pretty interesting.

Yup! One thing I love about Bleach is the relationship between the two main females and the male, though I enjoy Orihime's relationship with Ichigo much more. They're built up perfectly to the point where either would be legitimate, and no asspull IMO. I like her timeskip design given her hair doesn't look restricted like it did before. More free, and more fun to draw.

LOL Here's a treat. I just drew this. I know it's not much but I think you all will probably like it. I did this completely off the head. I was gonna reference what someone posted here before but I didn't feel like browsing for it. ENJOY this small fanart!

Edited by StriderC, 14 May 2013 - 07:51 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Man, Inferno180, you can seriously make a great post. Great job!

[redragon88]

Have you noticed how Hinata and Rock Lee have similar hair shape more or less. And one is in love with Sakura and one with Naruto, heh...

I also remember that in a Rock Lee chapter the fact that they had similar hairstyles was pointed out causing Hinata to go into a state of depression. Well, I supposed it's understandable. A young maiden wouldn't want someone to tell them that they're similar in appearance to Bushy Brows.