4869 replies to this topic

[Nate River]

Selfish? Look, I know it's unlike him, but Naruto is anything but selfish. He could have told Sakura long ago that he loved her, but chose not to, because she supposedly loves Sasuke. And, on top of that, he made an impossible promise, put his life on the line several times, didn't hold a grudge against the village that hated him. And you're saying he's selfish because he didn't go "There, there, Sakura, it'll be okay" and pat her on the back?
Sorry, ceci, but Naruto is not selfish.

Though its not related to NaruSaku, he looked that way for a huge chunck of Part II. When Orochimaru died and prior to the Pain fight, Naruto looked incredibly selfish with respect to Sasuke. When he was Orochimaru, Naruto at least had the reason that he needed to "save" Sasuke from Orochimaru. When Sasuke was wandering around what reason did they have to bring him back, aside from personal desire?

To my knowledge, Naruto has never thought about or considered what Sasuke's actual wishes were. He and Sakura have wanted Sasuke back for their own sakes. This, among other reasons, it why its pretty much a must that Sasuke be directly antagonist toward Naruto and the village, and be so for a reason like revenge/vengence. If Sasuke is not causing problems for the village or starting down a "bad" path, they have no reason to force him back against his will. At least outside of traditional village protocal when it comes to missing-nin, but almost the entirety of Part 2 those do not apply to Sasuke.

[Whirlpool-Maelstrom]

Being selfish only show's that even after all that happpened Naruto is still human, unlike Sasuke who's becoming less and less human

[RedDelicious]

I read Sakura's inner monologue differently than some people. I didn't see it as a selfish request (ie. "Naruto should be comforting me because I'm hurting more"). I saw it as a moment of self-reflection and acknowledgement of her feelings for Naruto (ie. "even though I'm hurting more than Naruto right now, my first priority is trying to comfort him"). It is Sakura being a little surprised about how she is putting Naruto's needs ahead of her own (at that particular moment).

[Whirlpool-Maelstrom]

I read Sakura's inner monologue differently than some people. I didn't see it as a selfish request (ie. "Naruto should be comforting me because I'm hurting more"). I saw it as a moment of self-reflection and acknowledgement of her feelings for Naruto (ie. "even though I'm hurting more than Naruto right now, my first priority is trying to comfort him"). It is Sakura being a little surprised about how she is putting Naruto's needs ahead of her own (at that particular moment).

That another irrefutable proof of how Sakura feels for Naruto, another reason for liking that girl even more.

[Sherry]

hey guys, I was reading naruto ch 457 again and I found something that I didn't know...

At page 12, Naruto said: "I can't keep my promises...how could I?"

and the thing that confused me is the "promises" that Naruto said.

My question: did Naruto promise other things to Sakura except bringing Sasuke back?

what I know is...Naruto's promise to Sakura is only bringing Sasuke back.

[Cupcake-chan]

what I know is...Naruto's promise to Sakura is only bringing Sasuke back.

I think that's the only promise that Naruto made to Sakura. I mean, it's the only one we know of, so if wouldn't make sence if he was talking about something else.

[Hopestar]

Nate got it right guys...
Naruto is being a selfish little b*tch right now. Sasuke is beyond help at this point! I hate how Kishi is putting him up because when the boys fight Naruto will be crying his ass off while Sasuke is like "you dumbass leave me alone or you don't know kitten about me".
You know Naruto is becoming a sad character ... I mean seriously he 's so focus and depress on the friend he lost but what about the friends whose been by side? When the time comes will he sacrifice his friends for Sasuke?

At least point at least Sakura is starting to make some sense of reality and maybe the only one who can open Naruto's eyes. Hearing Sasuke is evil from enemies (and friends) are one thing but hearing hearing it from he woman you love is totally a different ball game.

[RyrineaHaruno]

I am sorry it ok to be selfish once in while..... It makes use more human and to think that anyone who thinks that being selfish makes you less of a human is stupid. Sorry, I got to disagree with Nate and Hopestar for this one.

[Hopestar]

I am sorry it ok to be selfish once in while..... It makes use more human and to think that anyone who thinks that being selfish makes you less of a human is stupid. Sorry, I got to disagree with Nate and Hopestar for this one.

But to point where he would side with a traitor than his village? Sorry dude but both Naruto & Sakura never thought of what Sasuke wants. If they did then they would've leave him the hell alone and move with their lives. Now while Sakura is starting to take that step Naruto isn't and is content of being in denial hell he may even refute against Sakura in order to stay faithful to Sasuke. You all say Naruto is selfless that was true in part 1 but not part 2 and we see he allows his falling bond with Sasuke killing him.

Naruto: Sasuke I don't understand you anymore
Sasuke: What about you leave me alone or else I make you feel my hatred
Naruto: Sasuke, don't do this!
Sasuke: Dobe, you have no idea god you're such a idiot

That's basely how it is...

Watching his behavior towards his enemies, teachers, & teammate (Sai) went they bash or explain Sasuke's dark path just wait until he gets stiff from his love of killing Sasuke! He will be livid and hopefully he won't fight Sakura over Sasuke's wellbeing.

[RyrineaHaruno]

So, it is his best friend and bother. Hey, I would do the same thing and try to get him back from the darkness and other things. I am just saying that, if I wear Naruto I would do the same thing. It makes us human to try and get or friends better than they were . He was one of his first bonds serouilly, I would do the same thing, if I didn't have that many bonds to being with.


My very first friend, I still keep in touch. I was just like Naruto to I clanged tightly to my bonds, because I didn't have that many friends to begin with. So, in a sense I would do the same thing that he is doing and try to bring him or her back from what making all crazy and stuff.

Edited by RyrineaHaruno, 05 September 2009 - 08:21 PM.

[Froot]

Naruto's at least admitted that he doesn't understand Sasuke anymore. And who knows? He may just be doing it for Sakura's sake at this point. And soon Sakura will be confronting Naruto about the promise.

She's being the sensible one, and hopefully, she'll be the one to tell Naruto to stop - because she's pretty much the only one he'll listen to at this point.

Either way, my NaruSaku Moment Senses are tingling.

[RyrineaHaruno]

I agree, that at least he admit that he doesn't understand him anymore, but still its not selfish to want to bring his friend back to normal.

[True]

Nate got it right guys...
Naruto is being a selfish little b*tch right now. Sasuke is beyond help at this point! I hate how Kishi is putting him up because when the boys fight Naruto will be crying his ass off while Sasuke is like "you dumbass leave me alone or you don't know kitten about me".
You know Naruto is becoming a sad character ... I mean seriously he 's so focus and depress on the friend he lost but what about the friends whose been by side? When the time comes will he sacrifice his friends for Sasuke?

At least point at least Sakura is starting to make some sense of reality and maybe the only one who can open Naruto's eyes. Hearing Sasuke is evil from enemies (and friends) are one thing but hearing hearing it from he woman you love is totally a different ball game.

There is an explanation for why Naruto showcases an "obsession" with Sasuke. It all has to do with Kishimoto's editors and appealing to the yaoi market to increase sales on the manga and merchandise. There is no hiding the fact that SasuNaru is an insanely popular shounen-ai pairing in Japan and it just doesn't spur from them sharing a bond and being friends. Is Luffy/Zoro a really popular pairing just because they are nakamas? Is Ichigo/Grimmjow a really popular pairing because they are rivals? Why is it that SasuNaru is so popular if it isn't for the subtle hints that Kishimoto puts in the manga. Naruto's constant thoughts about Sasuke where he is seen thinking about him, crying over him, and even begging for forgiveness on his behalf. This grows to the point of unhealthy obsession from most peoples perspective, but those who are yaoi fans see this as romantic clinging about two people who are separated by opposing themes and to see them finally "unite" would showcase the powerful bond of love--or as it supposed to seem as friendship.

I constantly see this talking about the "bond" they shared and friendship but when I really look at it where are the examples to show this? Naruto was an orphan and by himself when he was young so he had no friends. It wasn't until the formation of Team 7 and during the Wave Arc with the Haku fight did we see a sign of growing friendship between the two. But after that...where are the examples of friendship and bond? As soon as Itachi shows up Sasuke is hellbent on revenge and breaks the bonds he was starting to form. Sasuke gets jealous after Naruto showcases his ability during the fight against Gaara and from then on they fought on the hospital rooftop right before Sasuke makes his exit. Then we have the eventual first retrieve Sasuke arc which lead to Sasuke/Naruto fighting and Sasuke making his eventual departure and separation for three years. So..in all this time where does this unbreakable bond form? Where excluding the Haku fight do they suddenly become best friends and go through trials and tribulations together? What articulates Naruto having such a strong obsession with saving Sasuke when they spent so little time together?

An example of a valid obsession with one person I can understand is between Guts and Griffith from Berserk. Griffith was someone Guts idolized and looked up to for many years. When the eventual Eclipse takes place and Griffith destroys everything that is precious to Gutts, by brutally killing all his close friends, raping the woman he loves right in front of him, and branding him with a mark that have demons chase him until they drag him to the depths of Hell. This strong development makes me understand and reasonably believe Gutts obsession with Griffith and hunting him down since it portrays the many years they spent together and the severe toll it takes on Gutts both physically and emotionally. But with Naruto and Sasuke I look and see nothing that comes close to giving a reasonable reason as to why Naruto must save Sasuke so badly when he left on his own accord and cut off his bonds. The only reason for why Naruto is seen as mulling over Sasuke is so badly is because of the subtle yaoi hints that appease to a particular fanbase.

Now don't get me wrong, I have no problem with this at all. Kishimoto and WSJ don't make this manga just for fun but to make money. So if they decide to appeal to a certain fanbase so they can increase sales and Naruto related merchandise what's so bad about that? It is just a type of fan service that is no different than having females with looming physiques as well as bishie-type males as seen in Bleach or Negima?! where the mangakas put it in for the pleasure of their readers. I know I'll get the "this is a shounen manga and yaoi is not going to be canon" but I've never claimed that. It's seemly subtle hints that are cleverly placed in and up to the readers to interpret--some of us who will just call it friendship while others who will call it romance-- for us to identify and form our own opinions. This is just my explanation as for why Kishimoto has constantly shown Naruto mulling over Sasuke and his "obsession" with him ever since part 2 started and why it doesn't bother me anymore.

[Nate River]

I am sorry it ok to be selfish once in while..... It makes use more human and to think that anyone who thinks that being selfish makes you less of a human is stupid. Sorry, I got to disagree with Nate and Hopestar for this one.

Who said anything about not being human?

This is why I said Sasuke must be seen as going down an improper path and as antagonist toward Naruto and the village. Otherwise, what right does Naruto have to haul Sasuke back to Konoha against his will?

For much of Part II neither of those existed. The deeper Sasuke goes down the "revenge" path (and the more the path involves Konoha) the more basis he has to "save" his friend as opposed to simply dragging Sasuke back just because Naruto and Sakura want him there.

To me, one of the saddest things about Part II, is that it takes a near war with Cloud (and three years worth of time) for people to start asking questions about the path Naruto and Sakura have choosen with respect to Sasuke. And even then, they aren't exactly going very deep with it. Shikamaru's declaration is a painfully obvious choice to make and something he should have realized the last time Sasuke was wanderin around with a village enemy.

There is an explanation for why Naruto showcases an "obsession" with Sasuke. It all has to do with Kishimoto's editors and appealing to the yaoi market to increase sales on the manga and merchandise. There is no hiding the fact that SasuNaru is an insanely popular shounen-ai pairing in Japan and it just doesn't spur from them sharing a bond and being friends. Is Luffy/Zoro a really popular pairing just because they are nakamas? Is Ichigo/Grimmjow a really popular pairing because they are rivals? Why is it that SasuNaru is so popular if it isn't for the subtle hints that Kishimoto puts in the manga. Naruto's constant thoughts about Sasuke where he is seen thinking about him, crying over him, and even begging for forgiveness on his behalf. This grows to the point of unhealthy obsession from most peoples perspective, but those who are yaoi fans see this as romantic clinging about two people who are separated by opposing themes and to see them finally "unite" would showcase the powerful bond of love--or as it supposed to seem as friendship.

Yep, because we all know rivalry is nothing but a gigantic subterfuge for a raging sexual relationship.

[RyrineaHaruno]

To me, one of the saddest things about Part II, is that it takes a near war with Cloud (and three years worth of time) for people to start asking questions about the path Naruto and Sakura have choosen with respect to Sasuke. And even then, they aren't exactly going very deep with it. Shikamaru's declaration is a painfully obvious choice to make and something he should have realized the last time Sasuke was wanderin around with a village enemy.

They saw him as a lost comrade. I mean seriously, team bonds are what binds them together as a team and as a Ninja. Just look at, how Jiraiya and Tsunade acted when they learned of Orochimaru death. They were sadden, and Jiraiya did the same thing for a time, we don't what age he stop going after him.




True I am going to disagree with you on the Yoai thing. I for one think, he doesn't give a flying flip about, what the fans want are we would have had NaruHina and SasuSaku and or NaruSasu along time ago.

Edited by RyrineaHaruno, 06 September 2009 - 02:22 AM.

[Cloud]

True I am going to disagree with you you on the Yoai thing. I for one think, he doesn't give a flying flip about, what the fans want are we would have had NaruHina and SasuSaku and or NaruSasu along time ago.

LOLWUT?

He's actually doing some fanservice by giving subtle hints of NaruSasu. But there's no way if he gave in to fan demands that he'd make a SJ manga yaoi-canon.

K thx. I don't think the male fanbase would be pleased.

[RyrineaHaruno]

LOLWUT?

He's actually doing some fanservice by giving subtle hints of NaruSasu. But there's no way if he gave in to fan demands that he'd make a SJ manga yaoi-canon.

K thx. I don't think the male fanbase would be pleased.

Meh, I don't see it as NaruSasu fan service, but it's up for interpretation. Sure, he could easily do that, if he wanted to it's his story after all. So, yeah he could easily do something like that.

[Cloud]

Meh, I don't see it as NaruSasu fan service, but it's up for interpretation. Sure, he could easily do that, if he wanted to it's his story after all. So, yeah he could easily do something like that.

And what? Get fired by his editors?

It's SJ, FFS. No way they'd let a Yaoi canon manga sit there, since they cater to the Japanese teenage masses. (Male masses, no doubt)

Maybe if this was a Shoujo manga, yes.

You know what? FFS. It doesn't matter. Go with your opinion that Kishi would draw NaruSasu.

[RyrineaHaruno]

And what? Get fired by his editors?

It's SJ, FFS. No way they'd let a Yaoi canon manga sit there, since they cater to the Japanese teenage masses. (Male masses, no doubt)

Maybe if this was a Shoujo manga, yes.

You know what? FFS. It doesn't matter. Go with your opinion that Kishi would draw NaruSasu.

He already did the kiss Imo xD.

It Shoene AI THAT is hugging and stuff. Yoai is basically porn

Edited by RyrineaHaruno, 06 September 2009 - 02:46 AM.

[Miss Soupy]

I don't think you can just write off Naruto's 'obsession' with Sasuke as fanservice, True. Sure, there may be some fanservice littered within the manga, for example the kiss scene was blatantly fanservice, but you can't say the whole plot, which focuses heavily on the Naruto/Sasuke friendship bond, is forced upon kishi by his editors. Naruto is far too popular as a manga for kishi to be forced to write this connection (which began clearly from the start of the manga) for mere fanservice. From the first chapters Naruto was drawn to Sasuke, it was clearly showed that he was jealous and yet interested in him. More than calling it fanservice, I would blame kishi for his poor choice of order for events in part II. Much of what we felt in part I was sort of left at the wayside during part II. A lot of the character development was stopped completely. It has been a long time since we felt for ourselves the bond between the two boys, and yet kishi brings it back, almost seemingly out of place.

And I don't believe he is writing it as romantic love at all, tho the narusasu fans will be quick to call it that. Naruto loves Sasuke, surely, but it is the love of a brother. The same way Sasuke was obsessed with Itachi, his true brother, Naruto is obsessed with Sasuke. More than anything, I think Sasuke wanted answers from Itachi, part of his reason for chasing him. The same goes with Naruto. Sasuke was one of Naruto's first friends, and it goes against Naruto's character to ever forget him. The impact having a 'family' had on Naruto is far too strong, and you can bet he would fight for them til death. His obsession is also caused by his desperation. He doesn't understand Sasuke, and yet he cannot give up his hope of saving him. It's like a battle between the mind (reason) and the heart (love). It does weaken Naruto's character right now, because he is so desperate. Also, you can bet he has to see the truth for his own eyes, so he still will strive to confront Sasuke.

I'm not at all saying I like where Naruto is going, in fact most of part II I have been unhappy with the story. I also would rather Naruto forget about Sasuke, go make out with Sakura, and become hokage. All I'm doing is pointing out that I believe kishi is making a point and that it isn't that hard to believe that Naruto is acting the way he is. You don't have to like it, but at least it can be acknowledged as something that has substance.