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#18001 Nar123

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 06:22 PM

And you know that how exactly? I simply take what's shown in the manga and build a hypothesis out of these facts. Accusing me of replacing facts with so called 'headcanon' is simply another way of calling me biased or even a liar and i really don't think that i, as a scientist/engineer, can actually afford to be one :no: . Unemployment sucks...

 

Don't you guys learn how to read and interpret literature in school anymore? I mean what i did was a basic method of interpreting certain scenes/information and build a logical hypothesis that would be able to explain other, less clear, points. And i say hypothesis, not theory because there is a difference....

 

A good example would be you saying that Kushina not using Kyuubis chakra is unlikely as she was a shinobi during war time. You never tried to strengthen your position with facts. You just said it was 'unlikely' without explaining why...

 

Noone in Konoha had an idea on how to try to train a Jinchuuriki (seen on Jiraiyas extemely hazardous training method) or that during war time Jinchuurikis would logically be prime targets and would therefore be held back for most of the war (Koharu and Homura tried to get Tsunade to keep Naruto in the village, it is therefore logical that they would have done the same with Kushina and the Sandaime. Danzo would most likely hold the opposite stance during war time but we have no evidence of that).

Or that Kushina was never known for beeing the Jinchuuriki no Kyuubi but for 'her beauty and unique Ninjutsu' making. Beeing a Jinchuuriki, especially when well known, would be something important to mention, wouldn't it.

All those pieces make it rather unlikely that Kushina and Mito's identity as Jinchuuriki were known to the general populace.

 

And regardinh these feelingg Gaara: As i said, there were Jinchuuriki before him that lost control so Gaara had to live under the stigma of beeing a 'moster in disguise' or 'a lit exploding tag'. I re-read the parts and i couldn't find any evidence of him beeing hated. From the beginnning they were afraid of him. True hate can only come when you know that your actions wouldn't have dire consequences aka death. You seem to confuse actions made out of bots.

When Gaara tried to connect with people they would rather stutter and try to get away from him as they were afraid. If they would truly hate him they would simply shout at him to piss off or even get physical.

 

That's also the difference between Gaara and Naruto. Naruto could be safely hated as they never knew something like an insane Jinchuuriki or had to fear Naruto becoming violent/murderous. You could say that fear and hatred were existing as seperate entities.

Gaara on the other hand was known to kill, even if it was accidentally, and they already had previous experience with Jinchuuriki so they only feared him. The hatred came through their fear of him so the hatred was attached to fear instead of beeing seperate as with Naruto.

 

Can't you just consider Kishimoto didn't planned in making Kushina a jinchuuriki or even make her at all in the beginning and then every prejudice against jinchuurikis he estabilished early on just slipped his mind later in the story when he decided to create/ introduce her?   :confused:

 

It seems more likely to me than your "logical deductions" that Kishimoto thought of everything beforehand and made everything fall perfectly into place

 

I mean, its simple:

 

-We have no CANON indication the village in general knew or didnt knew about Kushina therefore your argument that they didn't knew because it wasnt mentioned falls flat

-You even said your entire point a hypothesis, and as you might know the hypothesis isn't a fact it isn't confirmed... futhermore just the FACT that you had to make a hypothesis on this concluded matter shows kishimoto failed to clear something in this story. in this case Kushina and Mito relations as a jinchuuriki of the leaf

- You can say that its unlikely that Kushina and Mito place as jinchuuriki were known to the general populace, but really, you have almost no grounds to say that considering Kishi's known story of asspulls and horrible writing, he might just as well let the whole estabilished aspect of the jinchuuriki pass through his mind 

- Headcanon is exaclty what you did, I'm not offending you or anything like that but you really used your own interpretation of something and tried to pass that as a fact. But no...the only fact there is , is that Kishimoto failed to clear this whole matter in the story  :sweat:

 

in sum my main point is: why we are having a discussion like this in first place?

 

KIshi didn't clear enough how or if Mito and Kushina were known as jinchuurikis, exactly like he didn't clear up some matters about the uchiha involvement in the kyuubi attack  

 

 

Now about Gaara, well we know by Lady Chiyo how the sand used to treat jinchuurikis and such, they were a war weapon for them. Gaara's case was exceptional because if I'm not mistaken he was the first jinchuuriki to stay inside the village, I have no problem in agreeing on the whole matter of "fear leading to hate" with you

Now about Naruto, I think it's pretty clear that he was hated, it's very clear that this hate came because of the kyuubi attack, the villagers of course, blamed Naruto for it, this fear they had of the fox they caused them to hate. So I disagree with you on the fear and hate in Naruto's case being separate. 


Edited by Nar123, 20 April 2015 - 06:32 PM.

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#18002 NaruSaku fan in Kentucky

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 06:23 PM

Since the part 3 will be coming out,it is time for me for leave.
 
In the past i couldn't leave here completely becoz of community here and what was left of attachments for this manga as well as NS.
 
Now any feelings i had left for this series was completely erased disgustingly by it's creator kikitten itself in the last few months.
 
My 9 years time is wasted.
 
Now i don't care about this filth anymore,i cannot laugh at all this like others because there are things that are simply too disgusting to even laugh at.
 
As for everyone here i have nothing to say,it was nice meeting u all.This is the only forum with a great atmosphere and community,other forums are hell,i've seen that very well.
 
I'll never forget any of u,the world is round,we will meet somewhere again.

Please stay. We love you.

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#18003 Nar123

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 06:23 PM

Since the part 3 will be coming out,it is time for me for leave.

 

In the past i couldn't leave here completely becoz of community here and what was left of attachments for this manga as well as NS.

 

Now any feelings i had left for this series was completely erased disgustingly by it's creator kikitten itself in the last few months.

 

My 9 years time is wasted.

 

Now i don't care about this filth anymore,i cannot laugh at all this like others because there are things that are simply too disgusting to even laugh at.

 

As for everyone here i have nothing to say,it was nice meeting u all.This is the only forum with a great atmosphere and community,other forums are hell,i've seen that very well.

 

I'll never forget any of u,the world is round,we will meet somewhere again.

 

Too bad, we will miss you man

 

Be sure to appear sometime though,can't you just ignore Naruto related posts and stay on the other parts of the forum?


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#18004 trang95

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 06:24 PM

Since the part 3 will be coming out,it is time for me for leave.

 

In the past i couldn't leave here completely becoz of community here and what was left of attachments for this manga as well as NS.

 

Now any feelings i had left for this series was completely erased disgustingly by it's creator kikitten itself in the last few months.

 

My 9 years time is wasted.

 

Now i don't care about this filth anymore,i cannot laugh at all this like others because there are things that are simply too disgusting to even laugh at.

 

As for everyone here i have nothing to say,it was nice meeting u all.This is the only forum with a great atmosphere and community,other forums are hell,i've seen that very well.

 

I'll never forget any of u,the world is round,we will meet somewhere again.

:(

Do you fear Part 3 becoming a frequent discussion topic on here?


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#18005 Nar123

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 06:27 PM

 

 

 

 

So, on the topic of Jinchurikis, I've always assumed that Mito and Kushina were treated okay (we assume) because they were Uzumakis and therefore able to seal better than anyone else. It's implied espcially with the Kushina that that's why she was chosen. 

 

So much is just speculation. Unforunately, Kishi didn't expand on that area. 

 

We know Bee was selected after many people in his village died trying to contain the demon. We can only speculate that it was the same in other villages. We don't know if Kushina and Mito were happy in Konoha, or if they were only just tolerated. And we know next to nothing about the other jinchurikis.

 

My feeling is that all jinchurikis are disliked, no matter where they are from. They are a necessary evil. Military and politicians understand and tolerate them, even befriend them, but the general populace wants nothing to do with them. I think of jinchurikis as a nuclear weapons base. Everybody wants that protection, but no one wants it in their backyard.

 

If the treatment of jinchurikis were ever explained more (such as, yes they are almost exclusively hated), then the population of Konoha seeing Naruto as a hero would be even more remarkable. He would absolutely be the chosen one, with the power to change people that no one else had seen yet.

 

Along the same lines, I also wish Naruto had lost control of the kyuubi, and had to deal with the outcome just like all the other jinchurikis. He would have experienced the pain of both his mother and father, as jinchuriki and village savior. Then his triumph over his own biju — through friendship rather than control — would have been so much more poignant for him. But again, something we didn't see.

 

 

This is exactly what I mean :D

 

This whole jinchuuriki issue was never explained that deeply by kishimoto, even in konoha,the home place of the protagonist ,we didn't get that much of a explanation on how was the general policy of jinchuurikis there

 

So really, when the manga doesn't explain something there is no use in making logical explanations on your own and try to pass them as something that was solidly explained in the manga


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#18006 Namikaze Clan

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 06:29 PM

@Advaith. As others have pointed out, any discussion of part 3 won't be in this thread. We already have a discussion thread for it

#18007 ichigo500

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 06:34 PM

BDh41.jpg

  

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Hahahahaha you guys are killing me !!!

  

http://www.mangapand...eventh-hokage/0
God give me strenght to endure and see this through. :argh:

Oh God, it's coming.... In two days right? Can't wait !

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#18008 Nar123

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 06:37 PM


   Oh God, it's coming.... In two days right? Can't wait !

:hm:


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#18009 ichigo500

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 06:42 PM

Since the part 3 will be coming out,it is time for me for leave.
 
In the past i couldn't leave here completely becoz of community here and what was left of attachments for this manga as well as NS.
 
Now any feelings i had left for this series was completely erased disgustingly by it's creator kikitten itself in the last few months.
 
My 9 years time is wasted.
 
Now i don't care about this filth anymore,i cannot laugh at all this like others because there are things that are simply too disgusting to even laugh at.
 
As for everyone here i have nothing to say,it was nice meeting u all.This is the only forum with a great atmosphere and community,other forums are hell,i've seen that very well.
 
I'll never forget any of u,the world is round,we will meet somewhere again.


Do you really have to leave ?? We can avoid talking about part three here since we have a special thread for it !!!
If you really leave then it's gonna be sad to lose another member our fandom :/

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#18010 AHK

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 06:47 PM

Since the part 3 will be coming out,it is time for me for leave.
 
In the past i couldn't leave here completely becoz of community here and what was left of attachments for this manga as well as NS.
 
Now any feelings i had left for this series was completely erased disgustingly by it's creator kikitten itself in the last few months.
 
My 9 years time is wasted.
 
Now i don't care about this filth anymore,i cannot laugh at all this like others because there are things that are simply too disgusting to even laugh at.
 
As for everyone here i have nothing to say,it was nice meeting u all.This is the only forum with a great atmosphere and community,other forums are hell,i've seen that very well.
 
I'll never forget any of u,the world is round,we will meet somewhere again.


:/

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#18011 luffyq1

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 06:53 PM

please don't leave, part 3 is where the real fun begins. you'll be missing out  :sad:

 


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#18012 trang95

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 06:55 PM

please don't leave, part 3 is where the real fun begins. you'll be missing out  :sad:

 

You're literally driving him away with your 24 h sarcastic nature XD


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#18013 Nar123

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 06:57 PM

please don't leave, part 3 is where the real fun begins. you'll be missing out  :sad:

 

 

the real fun begins once Kishi sets his sights in overtaking OP from Oda  :chuckle:


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#18014 luffyq1

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 06:59 PM

You're literally driving him away with your 24 h sarcastic nature XD


:umm: 
 

the real fun begins once Kishi sets his sights in overtaking OP from Oda  :chuckle:

why?!
 
:sad:


Edited by luffyq1, 20 April 2015 - 07:00 PM.

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#18015 ultranx

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 07:00 PM

 

Then why Kushina and Miko were treated well enough?

Both became wife of hokages 

that's exactly the reason why, because they were related to the kages, there's probably the few that liked her for who she is but then the rest of the village only liked her for her fame, if it wasn't for the fame kushina would still be hated like I'm pretty she was as a kid, think about it do you honestly think she wasn't hated like naruto along with  being bullied? pretty sure that it was stated that she was hated like naruto. also think about it do you think the namikaze clan wouldn't be looked up to for their fame like the uchiha clan? you know how crazy those villagers can be xD


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#18016 Nar123

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 07:02 PM

why?!

 

:sad:

because kishi's an ambitious man! He won't give up till he get what he desires  :argh: , his main desire being leading

one of the most  popular manga series since evah  :argh:  :argh:

 

But hey we know he is a good writer, he totally won't screw up  :th_yeah:


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#18017 Nar123

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 07:05 PM

that's exactly the reason why, because they were related to the kages, there's probably the few that liked her for who she is but then the rest of the village only liked her for her fame, if it wasn't for the fame kushina would still be hated like I'm pretty she was as a kid, think about it do you honestly think she wasn't hated like naruto along with  being bullied? pretty sure that it was stated that she was hated like naruto. also think about it do you think the namikaze clan wouldn't be looked up to for their fame like the uchiha clan? you know how crazy those villagers can be xD

 

No it isn't stated she was hated anywhere

Naruto is related to a kage too and was still hated 

Namikaze isn't a big family name though

 

 

Seriously, it's easier to accept Kishi just screwed ( once gain) up regarding jinchuuriki's and how they were treated


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#18018 ultranx

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 07:05 PM

 

If this follows, a sequel is almost guaranteed even with all of those bad reviews

honestly though, alot of people complained about how dragon ball-like battle of gods was and not enough action, so there really is no pleasing these fans, sooner or later dbz will die because of these fanboys  :cry:


Edited by ultranx, 20 April 2015 - 07:06 PM.

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#18019 LuckyChi7

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 07:08 PM

please don't leave, part 3 is where the real fun begins. you'll be missing out  :sad:

 

 

 

 

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IN The words of Master Chief, You're ON!!


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THAT'S WHAT HEROES DO, THEY SAVE PEOPLE!!


#18020 rocci

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Posted 20 April 2015 - 07:09 PM

@tricstie
Naruto already lose control, two times.

@ultranx
Naruto still get hate eventought he is son of hokage and the village still hate him even after 4th hokage told them that to treat naruto as a hero.





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