549 replies to this topic

[rocci]

@konoha
Sasuke is already popular since the beginning of manga.
He's consistent with the popularity.

@neon
I don't know about yahagi favorite is sasuke, but what I know is that sakura will never have the same importance with naruto.
Sakura doesn't get like because her back fort development.

[TouKen4Life3g]

It's not that Sakura should be on the same level of importance as those guys, but she never really gotten involved and when she does, she gets helped and become third wheel. She got involved in a wrong place, because those guys only care for each other and she has no say in there, rather be a spectator.

As for Yahagi, perhaps it is his idea on Sasuke, but what Kishi did is restating the obvious and start shoving in harder than ever before, which is saying a lot. I was ok by Search for Itachi Arc, but starting with Kage Summit Arc, it just got overbearing. That hyperventilating scene is the tip of the iceberg, it was just too much. One of the main problems is that Naruto has many overstaying its welcome elements, such as saving Sasuke. It was ok in the beginning of part 2, it's understandable in a way. But the more it progresses and the more Sasuke continue to do more bad deeds, it's like enough already and Naruto has to remain that trope that can only work for a short time.

It's the same for Itachi. While it was said that it was planned for him to be good, it didn't come across well written, but it was acceptable. Then he gets revived and all the sudden, he starts to feel like a messiah that he did no harm as well as treated as one by the main characters. That's why War Arc upsets me because everything is being forgiven when in real life, those chances should remain unforgivable. Now I expect everyone in afterlife who felt bad is cheery and joy. They even have to retcon more or less on Gaara's past. Why it can't be dark? Why?

God, I don't want to write another LAP...

[NeonRanger]

@konoha
Sasuke is already popular since the beginning of manga.
He's consistent with the popularity.

@neon
I don't know about yahagi favorite is sasuke, but what I know is that sakura will never have the same importance with naruto.
Sakura doesn't get like because her back fort development.

 

 

I know, but it's like how do you reach a conclusion in which your character is unpopular that you drop the backstory/ background? That's very stupid on his part considering that it might have help Sakura at least a little? A lot people complain about Sakura's backstory as well. I really don't know how he came to the conclusion of drawing her pretty....

Edited by NeonRanger, 20 January 2016 - 03:12 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Because female characters are made to be pretty and nothing else. Just like that parody video, "Just stand there and look pretty." Seriously, this is equivalent to fan service without the fan service.

[NeonRanger]

Because female characters are made to be pretty and nothing else. Just like that parody video, "Just stand there and look pretty." Seriously, this is equivalent to fan service without the fan service.

 

'tis sad indeed. .   

 

But we were shoved Hinata's backstory for The Last, she even took what was left of Sakura's. I'm just annoyed how when it comes to Sakura's lack of popularity, the conclusion is to remove/ regress ideas that would have made her popular (a backstory would have been a good way to understand her more) whereas for Hinata, SP is doing everything and more to increase it (even taking part's of Sakura). 

 

They think opposite of the two girls, and all because one of them is more submissive.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Hinata has that "create-a-character" character in the anime and that alone is irritating enough. It feels like for Sakura's case, he just thought drop all plans/developments and go back to chapter 3. That's a huge no-no.

[Yyubie]

It's not that Sakura should be on the same level of importance as those guys, but she never really gotten involved and when she does, she gets helped and become third wheel. She got involved in a wrong place, because those guys only care for each other and she has no say in there, rather be a spectator.

As for Yahagi, perhaps it is his idea on Sasuke, but what Kishi did is restating the obvious and start shoving in harder than ever before, which is saying a lot. I was ok by Search for Itachi Arc, but starting with Kage Summit Arc, it just got overbearing. That hyperventilating scene is the tip of the iceberg, it was just too much. One of the main problems is that Naruto has many overstaying its welcome elements, such as saving Sasuke. It was ok in the beginning of part 2, it's understandable in a way. But the more it progresses and the more Sasuke continue to do more bad deeds, it's like enough already and Naruto has to remain that trope that can only work for a short time.

It's the same for Itachi. While it was said that it was planned for him to be good, it didn't come across well written, but it was acceptable. Then he gets revived and all the sudden, he starts to feel like a messiah that he did no harm as well as treated as one by the main characters. That's why War Arc upsets me because everything is being forgiven when in real life, those chances should remain unforgivable. Now I expect everyone in afterlife who felt bad is cheery and joy. They even have to retcon more or less on Gaara's past. Why it can't be dark? Why?

God, I don't want to write another LAP...

Naruto's voice is like whisper of the god himself you know ... if Naruto exist in real world he will make a good priest, just throw every bad guy/terrorist in this world and have him talk to them and they will become good guy with his TNJ.

 

Because female characters are made to be pretty and nothing else. Just like that parody video, "Just stand there and look pretty." Seriously, this is equivalent to fan service without the fan service.

Female character is just accessories/trinket/decorations in this manga to make things even more attractive. They have no back story and have little to no development. It's the same when you enter a car showroom there is always a pretty girl in sexy outfit beside every car, they just stand there to attract people.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Naruto's voice is like whisper of the god himself you know ... if Naruto exist in real world he will make a good priest, just throw every bad guy/terrorist in this world and have him talk to them and they will become good guy with his TNJ.
 
Female character is just accessories/trinket/decorations in this manga to make things even more attractive. They have no back story and have little to no development. It's the same when you enter a car showroom there is always a pretty girl in sexy outfit beside every car, they just stand there to attract people.

While that's true, the point is how many established darkness becomes a misunderstanding, forgiven, and retcon in the War Arc. Most notably to me, Gaara.

Yes, that's a best way to put it.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

While that's true, the point is how many established darkness becomes a misunderstanding, forgiven, and retcon in the War Arc. Most notably to me, Gaara.

Yes, that's a best way to put it.

 

Honestly, I could see how that stuff with Gaara's past could make sense, but the feelings still lingered before he learned the truth, Sparda. Considering that Gaara still hated Rasa for how he was treated by him, and also detrimentally affected by what Yashamaru was ordered to do. And let's face it, BS as it was, it was good to see Gaara get that kind of closure if you ask me.

[TouKen4Life3g]

 
Honestly, I could see how that stuff with Gaara's past could make sense, but the feelings still lingered before he learned the truth, Sparda. Considering that Gaara still hated Rasa for how he was treated by him, and also detrimentally affected by what Yashamaru was ordered to do. And let's face it, BS as it was, it was good to see Gaara get that kind of closure if you ask me.

I always feel like a mixed bag on it. On one hand, what you said is true. On the other hand, every backstory starts to feel the same or tamed that it doesn't have that sense of horribleness surrounding them. It's like why change it now, it was established already. It's like every grittiness is slowly removing itself and honestly, that's what made Naruto captivating in the first place.

Stuff like this is blinding me to think Shounen is soft when they can actually be brutal to certain extent.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

I always feel like a mixed bag on it. On one hand, what you said is true. On the other hand, every backstory starts to feel the same or tamed that it doesn't have that sense of horribleness surrounding them. It's like why change it now, it was established already. It's like every grittiness is slowly removing itself and honestly, that's what made Naruto captivating in the first place.

Stuff like this is blinding me to think Shounen is soft when they can actually be brutal to certain extent.

 

Yeah, I know how you feel, man. Honestly, what Rasa said does take away the extremity of what happened to Gaara by a ton. There's few shonen series I see that hit that kind of brutality in terms of backstory. I feel that a balance is necessary. You can't have your stories be too dark unless that's your goal, and they can't be too lighthearted either.

[Bail o' Lies]

I think Yahagi regretted. I can personally tell by that interview that he was indirectly make fun of Kishi and put him on the spot (that's just my opinion). Yahagi was right. Naruto popularity did spiked that even in its prime it did bump OP to rank no 2. However, with the success they had with Sasuke. For an example. Sasuke is just like steroids for users. It achieve miraculous results but on short term. This is what happen with this manga. Sasuke made it popular and destroyed the franchise along with its protagonist and original heroine. There is no doubt that Yahagi knew that he should have continue with Sakura instead of investing on Sasuke's character. And that comes with that he should have never stalled on Sakura from moving on and requited  Naruto's feelings from the beginning of PT2.

 

I'm 100% positive that and wager all my money that if Yahagi has the chance to redo Pt2. This approach will mostly likely be his.

Which interview are you getting this from? I swear, why don't we have a topic so people can post up various Naruto interviews yet?

 

Sasuke was a character that really help boost the rating. But it was controlled enough that he didn't become over used until Yahagi left then the war arc basically made Sasuke the main character to the point it sometime harder for figure out what Naruto was thinking at certain point.

[Bail o' Lies]

It's not that Sakura should be on the same level of importance as those guys, but she never really gotten involved and when she does, she gets helped and become third wheel. She got involved in a wrong place, because those guys only care for each other and she has no say in there, rather be a spectator.

As for Yahagi, perhaps it is his idea on Sasuke, but what Kishi did is restating the obvious and start shoving in harder than ever before, which is saying a lot. I was ok by Search for Itachi Arc, but starting with Kage Summit Arc, it just got overbearing. That hyperventilating scene is the tip of the iceberg, it was just too much. One of the main problems is that Naruto has many overstaying its welcome elements, such as saving Sasuke. It was ok in the beginning of part 2, it's understandable in a way. But the more it progresses and the more Sasuke continue to do more bad deeds, it's like enough already and Naruto has to remain that trope that can only work for a short time.

It's the same for Itachi. While it was said that it was planned for him to be good, it didn't come across well written, but it was acceptable. Then he gets revived and all the sudden, he starts to feel like a messiah that he did no harm as well as treated as one by the main characters. That's why War Arc upsets me because everything is being forgiven when in real life, those chances should remain unforgivable. Now I expect everyone in afterlife who felt bad is cheery and joy. They even have to retcon more or less on Gaara's past. Why it can't be dark? Why?

God, I don't want to write another LAP...

Actually from what i recall in one of his interview he basically admitted he didn't know how  to handle Sasuke's character arc by the end. He was trying to come of as humble and explain how difficult it is to be a mangaka but instead he just admitted he didn't know what he was doing with Sasuke.

Edited by Bail o' Lies, 21 January 2016 - 04:49 AM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Actually from what i recall in one of his interview he basically admitted he didn't know how  to handle Sasuke's character arc by the end. He was trying to come of as humble and explain how difficult it is to be a mangaka but instead he just admitted he didn't know what he was doing with Sasuke.

He called it frustrating. He should have just ended at Itachi Arc. That or just have him bad from the point he said he wants to destroy Konoha and do nothing else until they fight. But instead, we got a flip flop switch every arc and just keep going circle.

[Bail o' Lies]

He called it frustrating. He should have just ended at Itachi Arc. That or just have him bad from the point he said he wants to destroy Konoha and do nothing else until they fight. But instead, we got a flip flop switch every arc and just keep going circle.

Every arc!? We were lucky if Sasuke stay consistent for a single appearance/scene!

 

Edit: Also the fact he called it frustrating despite the fact Sasuke story is not that complex. Is him admitting he didn't know what he was doing with him.

Edited by Bail o' Lies, 22 January 2016 - 06:01 AM.

[HalfDemonInuyasha]

Every arc!? We were lucky if Sasuke stay consistent for a single appearance/scene!

 

Edit: Also the fact he called it frustrating despite the fact Sasuke story is not the complex. Is him admitting he didn't know what he was doing with him.

Yeah, they only tried to make Sasuke's story look complex with all the Uchiha wanking "history" lessons and such, but all it did was make it that much more of a mess.

[db84x]

@ TouKen4Life3g

Money and glory, despite Naruto rarely surpass One Piece it still sell well until the end.  Pairing war just way too keep adult fans attached so Naruto not sink like Bleach.

[rocci]

@ TouKen4Life3g
Money and glory, despite Naruto rarely surpass One Piece it still sell well until the end.  Pairing war just way too keep adult fans attached so Naruto not sink like Bleach.

Naruto never surpass op in the last six years.
It still a million seller but there are many title out there who out sell it.
Meh, what a kitten writing.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Naruto only surpass in certain regions outside of Japan. In Japan, Naruto can't top it at all.

Edited by TouKen4Life3g, 22 January 2016 - 11:38 AM.

[db84x]

But we can't deny fact that Naruto is Shuheisa cash cow. It have merchandise, anime, movies, sequel etc.

Edited by db84x, 23 January 2016 - 04:37 AM.