488 replies to this topic

[BakeNeko-Chan]

Sorry, I'm going to have to comment again on Team Taka or as I like to call them, Team Not-Seven; accept they've even lost this association. Suigetsu just admitted he knows that Sasuke tried to kill Karin. It's one thing to make light of Karin's feelings for Sasuke, but for someone to make light of the fact the teammate tried to kill her? Naruto would never be like "Ohohoho Sakura remember those two times Sasuke tried to kill you and almost succeeded? Preeeetty weeak huh?"

 

If we're to believe that Team Taka has any semblance of care for each other beyond plot contrivance, how can they just casually accept a moment like that? These constant jokes around Karin are not funny; they undermine everything about the team--all of their moments. Even if Karin redeems herself and has a moment in the upcoming chapters, even if Team Taka is shown standing side by side and supporting Sasuke, the fact that he joked about Karin almost dying still remains. 

 

That punch this time was well deserved. I don't know why she bothers, but apparently her lust for Sasuke overshadows any development and common sense. At least Sakura smiles in a fake sort of way, and shows her conflict about his presence. Karin went from 'being done with him' and sometime between then and now forgets that she was ever done with him. Really; she has not had one serious moment since Sasuke tried to kill her.

 

Speaking of Sasuke, I haven't been convinced he's even on par with Madara. Orochimaru, you're forgetting that Madara doesn't need Juugo or a cursed seal in order to do what he does. It's true, a lot of power comes from the bijuu when it comes to Naruto's achievements, but unlike Sasuke we see Naruto unfolding. There was once a time Sasuke was a believable adversary, but as a reader I'm no longer convinced that he has a place here, too. 

 

On another note, I really do like the 2nd. At least he's consistent, realistic and feels like he has hokage potential rather than Naruto's infamous 'talk-no-jutsu' qualities which are essentially to be as cheesy and heartwarming as possible. Crying during a meeting, really? What is with Kishimoto and trying to inject humour in tense situations lately? I think there was a 'joke' for the last four chapters. Is he worried the audience is getting tired of the drama? This is the climax of the story! XD

 

So many good points. And some that hadn't occurred to me before, Kishi really is trying way too hard with his humor, and I don't find it welcome. As a reader, it truly makes me feels he is not taking his own material seriously.

And you're right, Sasuke is nowhere near Marada's level, and his out of the blue powerups are just, whatever. I can't bring myself to care. 

Suigetsu's 'joke' was so uncalled for and I really wish he had been able to actually feel that punch. Taka at this point serves absolutely no meaningful purpose, and I really can't express my disappointment for that. I was really excited when they were first introduced.

As for Sasuke's believably as an adversary, I'm waiting to see where this goes, but I feel much the same as you currently.

[Deej]

we dont even see ino doing her thing anymore.

I just noticed that. I assume she ran back to be with Shikamaru. So how were Hashirama's thoughts transfered? He wouldn't have needed to scream out at the end if he could speak to them at once. Are the Alliance now linked because of Naruto's feelings?

Edited by Deej, 25 September 2013 - 05:14 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

 

So many good points. And some that hadn't occurred to me before, Kishi really is trying way too hard with his humor, and I don't find it welcome. As a reader, it truly makes me feels he is not taking his own material seriously.

And you're right, Sasuke is nowhere near Marada's level, and his out of the blue powerups are just, whatever. I can't bring myself to care. 

Suigetsu's 'joke' was so uncalled for and I really wish he had been able to actually feel that punch. Taka at this point serves absolutely no meaningful purpose, and I really can't express my disappointment for that. I was really excited when they were first introduced.

As for Sasuke's believably as an adversary, I'm waiting to see where this goes, but I feel much the same as you currently.

Well, Orochimaru didn't say he has already, but the potential is there. If Orochimaru knows it, then Sasuke will have to come back for the maximum potential, which is why it's given that we will have one more arc. The only question is what is it.

 

Well, the theme isn't clear in this chapter but that's expected. Way too soon. I just hope by chapter 3-4 of the volume, we will know what's the theme here.

[Hanabi]

Sorry, I'm going to have to comment again on Team Taka or as I like to call them, Team Not-Seven; accept they've even lost this association. Suigetsu just admitted he knows that Sasuke tried to kill Karin. It's one thing to make light of Karin's feelings for Sasuke, but for someone to make light of the fact the teammate tried to kill her? Naruto would never be like "Ohohoho Sakura remember those two times Sasuke tried to kill you and almost succeeded? Preeeetty weeak huh?"

LOL so true. kishi's sense of humor is weird anyway.

I just noticed that. I assume she ran back to be with Shikamaru. So how were Hashirama's thoughts transfered? He wouldn't have needed to scream out at the end if he could speak to them at once. Are the Alliance now linked because of Naruto's feelings?

narutoverse never make sense anyway. like that time everybody from the alliance learnt the earth jutsu so quickly i facepalmed.

Edited by Hanabi, 25 September 2013 - 05:32 PM.

[luffyq1]

Yet another power-up for Sasuke...

 

So surprising. 

[Atheck]

3 magic places from which 2 of them have Sage Mode. And another Team 7 member uses Senjutsu. Come on, Atheck, it's not that hard.

The senjutsu he's using isn't a product of his own meditation or understanding of how to gather natural energy. He's exploiting Juugo as a chakra fountain in order to achieve the effect that we saw in this chapter - i.e. he isn't acting as the conduit for natural energy and the Curse Seal hasn't been re-implanted.

You haven't exactly given any further credence to the idea that Sakura is somehow intrinsically linked to sages besides the reused statement of Shikkotsu being the habitat of the slugs. If a summon's natural habitat was the sole determinant in who would become a sage then Minato would be a frog senjutsu practitioner. And I already explained this before but I'll reiterate that Tsunade, the person who Sakura is following in the footsteps of technically and behaviourally, has never been stated to have any knowledge or use of sage arts.

Naruto and Sasuke have professed in a completely different venture than Sakura. The reason for their ability to use senjutsu is directly related to their battle oriented mindsets. Sakura, on the other hand, is a medical ninja first and foremost. Fighting is only a secondary profession for her and she mostly fights with protecting herself and defence in mind. Because that was part of the medical ninja's code which Tsunade instilled into her. And just because two members of a team are using a similar skill does not mean that third will receive it as well. The fact that only Naruto and Sasuke are fighting in their enormous chakra transformations should be a good indication of this. There will always be certain aspects or techniques that are exclusive to just one or few teammates. Senjutsu appears to be one of them. There's nothing that implies or correlates to Sakura developing SM besides summoning location (which I addressed). To our knowledge, her teacher has never once used or dabbled in the sage arts. Why would Sakura do so when her main function is to play as the white mage of her team like what her teacher is doing? It's just an inessential power up with questionable (at best) reasons for developing for a character who hasn't fought since #270.
 

In any case , I was also under the impression that the feudal lord is the highest authority in his respective country , while the kage has authority  in matters concerning the village only . But , then again , as we have seen in the Kage summit arc , they did inform their respective feudal lords of their intentions before the meeting , so it can be assumed that the 1st kages have done the same . And whatever they decided in that meeting  , would have then been passed to their feudal lords for approval .

Like you said, feudal lords seem to have administrative control over the entire country which a shinobi village happens to be situated in. Even though a Kage is the top military commander for the main army of said country, they would still need to acquire the approval of the feudal lord in order to make a formal declaration of war since it's not just the village but the entire country itself that would become a warring state if a conflict were to erupt.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Well I should get going with the review. Pretty slow week once more. Lol. Sigh.

[BakeNeko-Chan]

Yet another power-up for Sasuke...

 

So surprising. 

 

Can't say I blame you. But what else is new anyway? Sasuke's powers are always just handed to him, and that's part of the reason I find his character so dull.

[TouKen4Life3g]

 
Can't say I blame you. But what else is new anyway? Sasuke's powers are always just handed to him, and that's part of the reason I find his character so dull.

Yeah, that's why I won't be surprised he will get curse seal rather than going for actual sage mode. That and he will get a shortcut powerup from Orochimaru after this arc. After all, he's always about shortcut. Probably the only shortcut Naruto would get which is not really shortcut is to get the rest of Kuruma's chakra by Minato in the end.

[BakeNeko-Chan]

Yeah, that's why I won't be surprised he will get curse seal rather than going for actual sage mode. That and he will get a shortcut powerup from Orochimaru after this arc. After all, he's always about shortcut. Probably the only shortcut Naruto would get which is not really shortcut is to get the rest of Kuruma's chakra by Minato in the end.

 

That's probably most likely, that's why I was thinking of something along the lines of a 'dark sage mode' that he will achieve through Orochimaru's aid.

[Dkey]

So about the bijuu part. 

It's said that hashirama had all the bijuus minus one, then as to pressure hashirama to give them one bijuu otherwise they would declare war 4v1 when hashirama has 8 bijuus on his possession and could easily win the war against them and unite all the countires under the fire country but instead he decided to comply to avoid wars even accepted to give part of the wealthy land of the fire to the sand when the authority is the feudal lord but the hokage can give land?

I mean can the hokage give land that belongs to the feudal lord to others?

 

Who has more authority the hokage or the feudal lord?

I hope someome can clarify this to me.

 

probably because he wanted peace. He didn't care if all the people were living on other banners than the fire countries one so he was willing to share the bijuus. I wonder thou how did he gather  them ( Mito?)

If he would unite the entire countries ( like the god emperor did in warhammer 40k) then there would have been rebellions and the status quo had to be kept using power ( something an Uchiha like Madara would think of).

As for the fire lord. He was either given power to handle the entire thing and the hokage and fire lord are like the roman consuls of the senate but one of them could be voted in to handle a treaty or something.

I think thou that the fire lord get's his way because Kishi wanted the hokage to just focus on the shinobi population and not try to establish a coup detat.

[TouKen4Life3g]

 
That's probably most likely, that's why I was thinking of something along the lines of a 'dark sage mode' that he will achieve through Orochimaru's aid.

I can see Sasuke asking for curse seal again just to catch up to Naruto and then Orochimaru will present him the last power-up that will guarantee him to be stronger than Madara and maybe Naruto. That's one way to hype the final fight and making Naruto struggle to beat Sasuke. I do like this and again, Sasuke is always shortcut man so whatever.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

 

probably because he wanted peace. He didn't care if all the people were living on other banners than the fire countries one so he was willing to share the bijuus. I wonder thou how did he gather  them ( Mito?)

If he would unite the entire countries ( like the god emperor did in warhammer 40k) then there would have been rebellions and the status quo had to be kept using power ( something an Uchiha like Madara would think of).

As for the fire lord. He was either given power to handle the entire thing and the hokage and fire lord are like the roman consuls of the senate but one of them could be voted in to handle a treaty or something.

I think thou that the fire lord get's his way because Kishi wanted the hokage to just focus on the shinobi population and not try to establish a coup detat.

 

But the problem is that literally all the countires have the same culture and even speak the same language also there's no sense of nationalism on Naruto, moslty people think about Konoha and the villages but not a sense of nation or cultural heritage.(exception to the samurais but still they have similar culture to the shinobis and language and seemed to be more like an knighthood order)

They are there mostly like to defend their lives instead of fighting for their country.

 

Naruto's world is just like the daimyio's era but without a central figure the "emperor".

Probably Naruto might become this emperor and i feel that this sage of six paths or whatever was some sort of "emperor" since they lived in peace which is hinted on the god tree thing.

 

Anyway the Naruto's verse is really messed up, there's countries on Naruto but any sense of nationalism or national heritage.

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 25 September 2013 - 07:08 PM.

[rikakim94]

When skimming though the chapter i just realized that one of the gokage in hashiramas memory looks like bushido brown from the boondocks or that character from black dynamite?

[TouKen4Life3g]

Chapter 648 Review

I realized I talked about the problem and the future more than the chapter itself. Lol. Oh well. Not much to say. Well, on to finish off Walking Dead game.

[Dkey]

But the problem is that literally all the countires have the same culture and even speak the same language also there's no sense of nationalism on Naruto, moslty people think about Konoha and the villages but not a sense of nation or cultural heritage.(exception to the samurais but still they have similar culture to the shinobis and language and seemed to be more like an knighthood order)

They are there mostly like to defend their lives instead of fighting for their country.

 

Naruto's world is just like the daimyio's era but without a central figure the "emperor".

Probably Naruto might become this emperor and i feel that this sage of six paths or whatever was some sort of "emperor" since they lived in peace which is hinted on the god tree thing.

 

Anyway the Naruto's verse is really messed up, there's countries on Naruto but any sense of nationalism or national heritage.

 

There is still a sense of inequality. Let's take wind countries request. They wanted fertile grounds to ensure food production independence and not rely on trade. the 30% thing was a bit of a kitten move but let's say it didn't went in arming but agriculture and land development because the people living there were dessert people.

Culture was never a issue or identity or even ideology but pragmatism. I think it's called realpolitik.

 

As for Naruto he could become emperor so that all nations because his vassals but it won't bring peace. Later disputes will arise. But who knows maybe Naruto brings peace and it's the future's generation job to maintain it.

[Atheck]

If anyone is curious about how Sasuke's senjutsu came to be then I would recommend reading this topic from NB. http://narutobase.ne...ad.php?t=439363

 

It goes into detail about Sasuke's compatibility with Juugo's chakra and how this nature infused Susanoo isn't a sage transformation that he can use by himself. This could also explain the reason for those who survived the rigours of the Curse Seal's selection process being able to gather natural energy and properly configure it into usable chakra even if their own developmental capacity is small.

 

Juugo's KG is like a circumvention for anyone who wants to use senjutsu but doesn't meet the physical prerequisties necessary to undergo the training; even if it's just a haphazard pretension trick the benefits are enormous to the user. Instead of needing large chakra reserves your chakra has to prove to be compatible with Juugo's. It basically devolves into a game of chance for the prospective sage user. 

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

 

There is still a sense of inequality. Let's take wind countries request. They wanted fertile grounds to ensure food production independence and not rely on trade. the 30% thing was a bit of a kitten move but let's say it didn't went in arming but agriculture and land development because the people living there were dessert people.

Culture was never a issue or identity or even ideology but pragmatism. I think it's called realpolitik.

 

As for Naruto he could become emperor so that all nations because his vassals but it won't bring peace. Later disputes will arise. But who knows maybe Naruto brings peace and it's the future's generation job to maintain it.

Jiraiya's dream about people understanding each other is perfectly on sense with the nationalism idea.

Ofc they would need a central figure which fits on Naruto perfectly, but the fact that those nations like "fire, wind water" etc.. wont exist anymore, and the fact they are fighting together and enjoyed a lasting peace, create the nationalism and cultural identification, which is the same "i believe one day people will understand each other".

[Nostradamus]

Really boring chapter. Also Sasuke has the potential to surpass Madara, yeah right.   So the guy who got humiliated by Bee, ended the fight between him and Deidara with a draw but Deidara decided to blow himself up and Sasuke only managed to survive because well he is an Uchiha therefore he always wins. Then barely survived the fight he had with Itachi even though Itachi was sick not to mention the fact that Itachi controlled the entire fight. Then at the Kage summit Sasuke got his ass owned by the Kages. So yeah Sasuke really has the potential to surpass even the Rikudou Sennin even the God Tree.

So get ready Ladies and Gentlemen for some major asspulls in the future because they're coming.

[Dkey]

Jiraiya's dream about people understanding each other is perfectly on sense with the nationalism idea.

Ofc they would need a central figure which fits on Naruto perfectly, but the fact that those nations like "fire, wind water" etc.. wont exist anymore, and the fact they are fighting together and enjoyed a lasting peace, create the nationalism and cultural identification, which is the same "i believe one day people will understand each other".

 

Maybe nationalism can be used as a glue to unite the society and avoid conflicts. If this one nation identity would arise the only threat would be small leaders trying to gain more power.

And eventually it could lead to that. That would be Naruto's solution.

But it couldn't be a solution for Hashirama. Even if they had 8 bijuu even Tobirama who was a pragmatist seemed to try to get rid of them because they were very hard to control. Considering Mito was Hashirama's wife I don't think anyway would have pressured her to subdue Kyuubi's chakra and win wars.

Also if Hashirama would have went to war to conquer the other nations his oposition would oppose this cultural assimilation.