19964 replies to this topic

[tricksie]

She like all of Naruto's other allies, promises to by his side and support him. And yet, in Naruto's moment of wavering, Hinata is made to be the one to be by his side and help support him, with Sakura standing at the sidelines.

Actually, Sakura may have witnessed Hinata's proximity, but she is no longer "at the sidelines" — was actually don't know where she is. Hinata has always been focused on Naruto, while Sakura focuses on what Naruto's goal is.

It reminds me of the manga panels where they are facing Madara in the forest and Naruto gets knocked back into the water. Hinata worries for Naruto, but Sakura tells her not to take her eyes off Madara and that Naruto can take it. (I can't find the panel right now, but anyone else is welcome to put it up. I love Naruto's expression when he comes out of the pool — one of my favorite panels.)

So I don't see Sakura's lack of closeness as a tarnish on her character. Sakura's fighting and/or healing people about to die. She has a lot of people depending on her. She can't throw them off to run to Naruto. Hinata is in a place where she can, and she supports him. Kudos for her, but I don't see it as a detraction from Sakura.

Until Sakura actually begins to fulfill her potential and surpass her predecessors, she will be judged by her current abilities and feats as the heroine, which even in the opinion of Sakura fans here have been quite disappointing.

I'm not disappointed in her skills. I'm disappointed that Kishimoto is not showing them. We know Sakura is healing, leading troops and actively fighting...we've seen single manga panels of it. But that's all we get. For some reason, Kishimoto is not focusing on Sakura's efforts right now. But he is going to great lengths to show us where she is, even though it's not being developed. I think the underlying message is that Sakura hasn't been forgotten, just that her storyline is in a holding pattern to build suspense. We've seen it happen with many characters so far — Naruto, Sasuke, Sai, etc. Now it's happening to Sakura.

Again, I'm not disappointed in Sakura's skills, just in the amount of "screentime" she's getting. But that doesn't diminish anything she's accomplished for me.

The fact of the matter is that she did not have the resolve to follow through with it in the end. For comparison, I could resolve to take a 30ft dive into a pool. I climb up the ladder onto the diving board, walk all the way over to the edge, but due to my fear, I freeze on the spot and am unable to actually follow through with the dive. Apparently that is supposed to be viewed as "strength and courage?"
And like you said, her attempt to kill him came after her realization that he was not the same person she thought he was. She knew the gravity to situation, and that she could not falter. And yet...she still did.

The fact that Kishi would not have allowed Sakura to kill Sasuke anyway does not displace the fact that he placed her into a situation where she turned into the damsel in distress twice, once of her own accord.

But Kishimoto clarifies this by having Kakashi empathize with her, telling her that that's why the Third couldn't kill Orochimaru. Her strength and courage came from taking on something that would kill her own heart and ruin her relationship with Naruto, just to save him and the rest of Konoha. (Killing her own heart: this is not meant to be love, mind you, but officially giving up on her teammate and severing those ties of loyalty that are so important to her.)

Kakashi explains to her — and to us — that even the Third, an adult shinobi and the hokage, couldn't do it when confronted with the same situation. She has courage for even embarking to assasinate Sasuke, and sympathy when she couldn't go through with it, because greater shinobis than her couldn't do it.

While the pool analogy is striking, it doesn't accurately capture the weight of the what she faced. By killing Sasuke, she was forever sentencing Sasuke to pay for the crimes he committed, with no hope of ever being redeemed, and more importantly, she was killing her belief in Naruto and robbing him forever of the opportunity to save Sasuke. Naruto believes in Sasuke. If Sakura kills Sasuke, then she no longer believes in Naruto. So by killing Sasuke, she effectively loses them both. And she knows this.

So what was the greater persuasion for her in the end? Her bond to Sasuke...or her bond to Naruto? She loved Sasuke so she'll let him live? Or she loves Naruto so she'll continue to support him as he tries to achieve his goal?

In the end, Sakura says she'll believe in both of them. She'll believe in Sasuke because Naruto believes in him. Which echoes Nagato's feelings about Naruto - Nagato revives his belief in Jiraiya's hope for peace because Naruto still believes in it and lives by it.

You're judging the quality of her character based on the future prospects of her receiving development, whereas I am judging her based on the development that she actually has received. And in conclusion, I feel that this development has failed to portray her as a strong character and a proper heroine.

I have to disagree. I think she's been portrayed very much as a strong character and as a proper heroine. I think her development has been veiled for a while until it's time to blast back into the big picture. But I don't doubt that Kishimoto will return to her storyline again. First, because Kishi has been very specific that she is the heroine, and second, that Naruto, the story's hero, has never once waivered in his devotion to her.

[T XD]

You know, I forgot Bakuman has a kiss scene. Yosha! There's hope for Naruto then. The anime however must spend a million dollar budget on it. That's right I said it!

If Yahiko and Konan were about to shown kissing, then an actual kiss scene can be done XD

Though, Kishi can do the same as Yahiko's and Konan's one

Edited by T XD, 14 April 2013 - 07:22 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

If Yahiko and Konan were about to shown kissing, then an actual kiss scene can be done XD

Though, Kishi can do the same as Yahiko and Konan

No no no. Unacceptable anymore from me. I think Kishi is just saving for one pairing and only one pairing. No more, no less.

[Dkey]

No no no. Unacceptable anymore from me. I think Kishi is just saving for one pairing and only one pairing. No more, no less.

Well he did get close to kissing her but eh bad milk. Thou in a way he deserved it for trying to trick her. He deserves at least a kiss thou

[bthug]

Their has to be a kiss, it would mean so much, BUT I don't think their will be one, its just not the way the Japanese roll, especially in Shonen. Didn't everyone expect one in FMA:B, but you know...

But I really really really want one, to the point where I NEED IT.

[T XD]

Naruto and Sasuke kissed, so why not for Naruto and Sakura XD

It's very possible.

Edited by T XD, 14 April 2013 - 07:50 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Well he did get close to kissing her but eh bad milk. Thou in a way he deserved it for trying to trick her. He deserves at least a kiss thou

Yeah, he did deserve it. I'm just saying it must be on-screen. Go all magical! No excuses.

Their has to be a kiss, it would mean so much, BUT I don't think their will be one, its just not the way the Japanese roll, especially in Shonen. Didn't everyone expect one in FMA:B, but you know...

But I really really really want one, to the point where I NEED IT.

But Bakuman got one. In the end no less. There's hope.

Yeah...I was bummed out with FMA. Granted I like the fact they're together but...come on, man. We got age 7 and up shows in USA and we still get a kiss scene. Hell, every movies, tv shows, etc. usually has one. Why else every movie trailers spoil the kissing scene?...Yeah, why do they do that? That's stupid...

[catsi563]

Does anybody know which chapter Minato glanced back in?

looked like this --Click here to view--

There is something else about this particular parallel that bears repeating. The Minato Kushina part of the parallel happened AFTER the NaruSaku part. This is a reinforcing tactic by an author to support a particlar image or parallel.

[Inferno180]

Actually, Sakura may have witnessed Hinata's proximity, but she is no longer "at the sidelines" — was actually don't know where she is. Hinata has always been focused on Naruto, while Sakura focuses on what Naruto's goal is.

It reminds me of the manga panels where they are facing Madara in the forest and Naruto gets knocked back into the water. Hinata worries for Naruto, but Sakura tells her not to take her eyes off Madara and that Naruto can take it. (I can't find the panel right now, but anyone else is welcome to put it up. I love Naruto's expression when he comes out of the pool — one of my favorite panels.)

So I don't see Sakura's lack of closeness as a tarnish on her character. Sakura's fighting and/or healing people about to die. She has a lot of people depending on her. She can't throw them off to run to Naruto. Hinata is in a place where she can, and she supports him. Kudos for her, but I don't see it as a detraction from Sakura.


I'm not disappointed in her skills. I'm disappointed that Kishimoto is not showing them. We know Sakura is healing, leading troops and actively fighting...we've seen single manga panels of it. But that's all we get. For some reason, Kishimoto is not focusing on Sakura's efforts right now. But he is going to great lengths to show us where she is, even though it's not being developed. I think the underlying message is that Sakura hasn't been forgotten, just that her storyline is in a holding pattern to build suspense. We've seen it happen with many characters so far — Naruto, Sasuke, Sai, etc. Now it's happening to Sakura.

Again, I'm not disappointed in Sakura's skills, just in the amount of "screentime" she's getting. But that doesn't diminish anything she's accomplished for me.


But Kishimoto clarifies this by having Kakashi empathize with her, telling her that that's why the Third couldn't kill Orochimaru. Her strength and courage came from taking on something that would kill her own heart and ruin her relationship with Naruto, just to save him and the rest of Konoha. (Killing her own heart: this is not meant to be love, mind you, but officially giving up on her teammate and severing those ties of loyalty that are so important to her.)

Kakashi explains to her — and to us — that even the Third, an adult shinobi and the hokage, couldn't do it when confronted with the same situation. She has courage for even embarking to assasinate Sasuke, and sympathy when she couldn't go through with it, because greater shinobis than her couldn't do it.

While the pool analogy is striking, it doesn't accurately capture the weight of the what she faced. By killing Sasuke, she was forever sentencing Sasuke to pay for the crimes he committed, with no hope of ever being redeemed, and more importantly, she was killing her belief in Naruto and robbing him forever of the opportunity to save Sasuke. Naruto believes in Sasuke. If Sakura kills Sasuke, then she no longer believes in Naruto. So by killing Sasuke, she effectively loses them both. And she knows this.

So what was the greater persuasion for her in the end? Her bond to Sasuke...or her bond to Naruto? She loved Sasuke so she'll let him live? Or she loves Naruto so she'll continue to support him as he tries to achieve his goal?

In the end, Sakura says she'll believe in both of them. She'll believe in Sasuke because Naruto believes in him. Which echoes Nagato's feelings about Naruto - Nagato revives his belief in Jiraiya's hope for peace because Naruto still believes in it and lives by it.


I have to disagree. I think she's been portrayed very much as a strong character and as a proper heroine. I think her development has been veiled for a while until it's time to blast back into the big picture. But I don't doubt that Kishimoto will return to her storyline again. First, because Kishi has been very specific that she is the heroine, and second, that Naruto, the story's hero, has never once waivered in his devotion to her.

There have been others with hard situations many times in the series, remember Choji? He had to face it when his team plus kakashi was killed (later revived) by pain, he also had the hardest time facing Asuma. Now imagine if Naruto was forced to fight Minato, that would be earth shattering for him but Orochimaru is letting the Hokages off the edo leash and letting them do what they must. Basically when anyone has to face a friend or former friend in this series, its not going to be easy.

Think about saying how Sakura had a hard time against Sasuke? Well what about Third with Orochimaru, Jiriaya with Orochimaru, Jiriaya with Nagato, Kakashi and Sasuke. Just think how this will come to effect Kakashi as he is fighting Obito and finally the same way Sakura felt about facing Sasuke, it may have more impact on Naruto. This Obi-wan-Anakin type relation is seen so many times in the series, Sakura is not somehow weak by it, it she is then all the other guys here too are, even Hashirama towards Madara in that case, and Hashirama must have felt saddened by what he had to to do Madara for the rest of his life till he died in the first war.

Bottom line here: Its not easy to kill a former friend otherwise that just makes the character an emotionless weapon, what many of them strive not to be in this universe.

[Gravenimage]

There have been others with hard situations many times in the series, remember Choji? He had to face it when his team plus kakashi was killed (later revived) by pain, he also had the hardest time facing Asuma. Now imagine if Naruto was forced to fight Minato, that would be earth shattering for him but Orochimaru is letting the Hokages off the edo leash and letting them do what they must. Basically when anyone has to face a friend or former friend in this series, its not going to be easy.

Think about saying how Sakura had a hard time against Sasuke? Well what about Third with Orochimaru, Jiriaya with Orochimaru, Jiriaya with Nagato, Kakashi and Sasuke. Just think how this will come to effect Kakashi as he is fighting Obito and finally the same way Sakura felt about facing Sasuke, it may have more impact on Naruto. This Obi-wan-Anakin type relation is seen so many times in the series, Sakura is not somehow weak by it, it she is then all the other guys here too are, even Hashirama towards Madara in that case, and Hashirama must have felt saddened by what he had to to do Madara for the rest of his life till he died in the first war.

Bottom line here: Its not easy to kill a former friend otherwise that just makes the character an emotionless weapon, what many of them strive not to be in this universe.

This^ and this too to tricksie's post. Just because Sakura couldn't kill Sasuke it doesn't mean it's because she loves him romantically. It's hard for even shinobi to try and kill a close friend or student (Sarutobi-Orochimaru, Kakashi-Sasuke and of course Naruto-Sasuke). She couldn't kill him out that he's close as a member of team seven and also because he was her first crush even with all the bad things he did.

[Baguette]

This^ and this too to tricksie's post. Just because Sakura couldn't kill Sasuke it doesn't mean it's because she loves him romantically. It's hard for even shinobi to try and kill a close friend or student (Sarutobi-Orochimaru, Kakashi-Sasuke and of course Naruto-Sasuke). She couldn't kill him out that he's close as a member of team seven and also because he was her first crush even with all the bad things he did.

You forget that we were given insight into her mind during the attempted killing:

show --Click here to view--

It was all about her love for him in that moment.


We also know that she loved him at the time of the reunion because of 540:

show --Click here to view--

Edited by Baguette, 14 April 2013 - 08:28 PM.

[Inferno180]

You forget that we were given insight into her mind during the attempted killing:

show --Click here to view--

It was all about her love for him in that moment.


We also know that she loved him at the time of the reunion because of 540:

show --Click here to view--

Can't 540 also be a possible foreshadow that she may move away from Sasuke? She still knows what he became despite loving him, and we all know the reasons why she would leave her crush on him.

[HauntedCake]

Can't 540 also be a possible foreshadow that she may move away from Sasuke? She still knows what he became despite loving him, and we all know the reasons why she would leave her crush on him.

I think when we get to Sakura+sai arriving to tsunade she will talk to Sakura about Naruto(refering to her mistakes with jaraiya)

Edit: if this is what happens ofc

Edited by HauntedCake, 14 April 2013 - 08:49 PM.

[六道仙人]

You forget that we were given insight into her mind during the attempted killing:

show --Click here to view--

It was all about her love for him in that moment.


We also know that she loved him at the time of the reunion because of 540:

show --Click here to view--

So Sakura, once she seen that Sasuke-kun has turned the good side, acknowledged that he's finally a great guy and then she could love so without any shame... This is should be the great development that Kishimoto promised years ago? A matured woman? If so, nothing has changed in respect to when she used to be in 1st part/her childhood.

[Gravenimage]

So Sakura, once she seen that Sasuke-kun has turned the good side, acknowledged that he's finally a great guy and then she could love so without any shame... This is should be the great development that Kishimoto promised years ago? A matured woman? If so, nothing has changed in respect to when she used to be in 1st part/her childhood.

Kishi can throw Karin's development out of the window because she's a minor character but throwing Sakura's character is out of the question. He has spent so many chapters (years) developing her just to make her go fan girl again when she see Sasuke good. Also I still don't believe Sasuke is good yet.

[Dkey]

Can't 540 also be a possible foreshadow that she may move away from Sasuke? She still knows what he became despite loving him, and we all know the reasons why she would leave her crush on him.

It can. But I'm not gonna think too much about it, because when the time will come to see where Sakura's feelings are it will be after a kitten of back and forth between NS and SS. I'm just preparing for the worst.

[Akashi]

Since we all know Kishi's habit of jumping storylines at the start of new volume, does anyone else has a feeling we might see Sakura in the next chapter?

[HauntedCake]

It can. But I'm not gonna think too much about it, because when the time will come to see where Sakura's feelings are it will be after a kitten of back and forth between NS and SS. I'm just preparing for the worst.

Same, i think i'm prepared in the case where Kishi trolls us with SS canon.

I ofc will immediatly drop Naruto manga and start reading one piece, seems really recommended and maybe bleach too.

[Akashi]

Same, i think i'm prepared in the case where Kishi trolls us with SS canon.

I ofc will immediatly drop Naruto manga and start reading one piece, seems really recommended and maybe bleach too.

I used to love Bleach... until I the arc with nazi!quincies.

[Inferno180]

I think when we get to Sakura+sai arriving to tsunade she will talk to Sakura about Naruto(refering to her mistakes with jaraiya)

Well I spoke about that a while back, I said that with the whole parallels between the Sannin and Team Minato, the results of these team referenced something the came for team 7.

The Sannin basically is the result of team 7 failing to reunite, its referencing the same events team 7 took at part 1 and became in part 2, but ultimately their results are failed in the end. Jiriaya loved Tsunade and wanted to save Orochimaru, he failed, he could only monitor Orochimaru to protect the leaf and Tsunade to ensure her happiness. Tusnade hated Jiriaya and loved someone else (Dan), became a talented medical ninja, ultimately lost her loves (brother and Dan died), Orochimaru wanted power cause his family died, he left for power. Team 7 faced these practically the same way, Sakura and Tsunade's 'lost' loves were both in the fact that they were no longer present with them, Sasuke leaving is how Sakura's left, Tsunade's left due to Dan dying. Even by the anime there were times when Tsunade considered Jiriaya (such as the second war in the short past arc with Jiriayas perspectives on the Ame orphans.

Team Minato has the basic outline when team 7 began but ultimately represents the fates of what team 7 could face, its just these events have their fates running perpendicular. Kakashi was like Sasuke but Obito changed him for the better, he felt unworthy of Rin and would not return those feelings mainly because he thought of abandoning her. Ultimately Kakashi had to kill rin who he vowed to protect and also the one who loved him. Obito became twisted because of this and plotted to destroy the world. Rin well, she died. Obito and Rin suffered dark fates, only Kakashi made it to have some redemption. Team 7 can ultimately turn theirs around opposite to this, Naruto saves the work opposite obito, Sakura well lives and goes for Naruto, Sasuke became worse opposite of what kakashi began as but can turn his fate around as he begun to recently.

For Tsunade and Sakura, well Tsunade dying would be a big impact on Sakura, she can give her the don't make the same mistakes I did speech, this could also be the moment she surpasses her too. This type of moment would also be the theorized power up moment for Sakura (if she gets one) I suspect it would be the Yin seal on Sakura, and yes this would be the one asspull I would accept, it would be a shame for the strength of 100 technique to just go away as soon as it was revealed, we thought for years Tsunade;s super mode was the milotic regeneration only to see this hold off madara for a limited time, it would suck if it just goes away.