244 replies to this topic

[TouKen4Life3g]

They still retconned Hinata's beginning of love. If you count anime, that's twice.

[rocci]

They still retconned Hinata's beginning of love. If you count anime, that's twice.

Why they need to do that?
Is it because it doesn't show in the manga.
I mean if kishi could show how obito fall in love with in a chapter, he sure could do that with the other character before the end.
Oh don't forget kushina love story.

[Nar123]

@nar123
When Hinata goes to hospital and faint.
It's not filler, but it doesn't show either. Only mention by kiba when kiba and shino goes to meet her in the hyuga house when neji and Hinata father train.

 

Ah, okay then I didn't really remember

 

I hoped Hinata could finally get out of her shell on her own one day, it proved futile in the end though

[rocci]

 
Ah, okay then I didn't really remember
 
I hoped Hinata could finally get out of her shell on her own one day, it proved futile in the end though

Do you know tamao from shaman king?
I always thought her character will become like that.
Coincidently she has the same voice actor with Hinata.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Why they need to do that?
Is it because it doesn't show in the manga.
I mean if kishi could show how obito fall in love with in a chapter, he sure could do that with the other character before the end.
Oh don't forget kushina love story.

To make it sweet, even though it already established that seeing him train is what made her love him. Instead, we have her seeing Naruto protecting her in two forms: one in the forest by taking the beating, and the other one taking a beating with a plot hole. Basically, Hinata needed that trope of one protecting her equal love, when the manga didn't need that to begin with. Naruto and Sakura didn't need that. A lot of canon and soon to be canon pairing didn't need that at all. It's actually more use on the secondary characters pairing, including Karin. So this is cliche and it's really sad that we had to resort to this.

Edited by NaruSaku4Life3g, 06 May 2015 - 02:03 PM.

[goldenarms]

 

 

You gave a legal definition of the US legal system...so does Naruto live in the US? 

I gave ou the dictionary the definition, a universal definition. Please, you really tried to make a point with that?

 

I will answer the rest later, have to sleep

 

...wut? Did you just seriously say that? Did you just seriously used a dictionary term that's taken from the US dictionary, coined by a US public in the 1991, to try and shut down that argument?

 

Are you so hard-up to be right? To somehow convince me that "Of course, Hinata is a stalker; are you blind?" that you'll grab for any shred of discord that goes against your system of belief?

 

I think you seriously need to re-examine this argument and decide if it's really about the facts or is your bias against Hinata getting the better of you. As of now, I do not feel the need to try and explain this any further; if you want to disavow the complexities of stalking, even when I've pointed such things out, that's on you.

 

 

 

Not really, after she rejects him he never actually forces himself into her. Insisting on them being an item is not a harassment situation, it was brough upon in one situation I can remeber and it wasn't even him who brought  it uo, it was Konohamaru anf then he got too embarassed to deny

 

 

Konohamaru asked Naruto if Sakura was his girlfriend. Naruto instantly chuckled and said, "Heh, you brats are pretty sharp." And Sakura megaton punched Naruto before she knew how to do it properly.

 

Naruto was not "too embarrassed." He was quite proud that someone else thought they were an item.

 

 

Really you don't even sound as a NS fan. calling Naruto's baheacior as harassment is the same thing as saying Sakura's attitude towards him later on was "abusive", as in makes completely no sense

 

 

Absurd, isn't it? Of course, seeing how you're so willing to live by the definition of stalking, I figure you're also willing to live by the definition of harass.

 

 

harass

verb ha·rass \hə-ˈras; ˈher-əs, ˈha-rəs\

: to annoy or bother (someone) in a constant or repeated way

 

And no matter how you spin it, Naruto has annoyed and bothered Sakura repeatedly with his "Hey, you wanna go on a date?" knowing full and well that she likes someone else. Even if said guy shoots her down when she does it to him. :)

 

 

Of course if we take that with the retcons of the last, those actions make Naruto a scumbag because he considered Sakura a prize ( makes 0 sense LOL) , but not a harasser

 

Huh, I didn't realize Naruto has such an intimate, dedicated romantic relationship that he only made with Sakura and then threw it all away because he was forever gaming her. "Oh, Sakura. If only there was someone out there who loved you."

 

Oh, wait, they never had that. Therefore, calling Naruto a scumbag because he didn't really love Sakura or something seems pretty farfetched to me when they weren't in some hot and heavy relationship, or on the verge of getting married or something. Put down the Haterade and drink some water to cleanse your system.

 

 

No, but If you kept doing that repeatedly and with the specific intention of seeing the same person train again and again , then yes you're a stalker, a relatively harmless one but a stalker nonetheless

 

Possibly, but without proof of multiple, intentional visitations, it's just dry conjecture.

 

Hinata was not relevant so that's why her life and actions isn't really showed in detail beyond her backstory and the fact she spent time observing Naruto during part 1. There is nothing wrong on relying on hints, they remain to be true to the story even if Kishimoto himself tries to recon then like he did to NS, I mean, NS development is still there for everybody to see, the fact that it was ultimately retconed makes no sense upon further analysis, it's basically the same thing on the hints to the fact that Hinata had stalker like actions while she was observing Naruto training

 

 

Hints aren't facts, though; they're interpretations we make based on what we see and hear. And because of that, sometimes we read too deeply into something that isn't necessarily a hint, seeking out a personal meaning to what was just a lazy offhand comment. The only time hints have to be good is in a murder-mystery story because we're seeking to figure out who is the criminal, and certain clues will inevitably give the suspect away. Of course, that also means being on the lookout for red herrings and misdirections.

 

So, yeah, sometimes, you need something a bit more concrete to work with because ultimately, everything is smoke and mirrors without proof of existence.

 

What is this hospital scene you speak of? This never happened...it's the one from the fillers?

 

It was brought up at the end of Part 1. Neji asks why isn't Hinata going to see Naruto off, since it was his last day in the village before his training trip with Jiraiya. Kiba and Shino show up to tell Neji that Hinata did try to visit Naruto in the hospital, only to faint seeing him so bandaged up, and as a result, could not bring herself to face him directly due to shame. It's also the only time we see Hinata hiding behind something to watch Naruto -- but, as it was explained, it was because she was still mortified for her actions at the hospital.

 

 

It's the same with Hinata, she had no ill intention towards Naruto ( even if she knew his pain and did nothing for him ), she just kept watching him because it gave her strenght, but tha's stalking nonetheless

 

Again, conjecture. Since you yourself pointed out that Hinata was not relevant, we don't know anything about her aside from her family problems. So we can't say with absolute conviction that Hinata was running off at every single opportunity to spy on Naruto; you can believe that, if you want to, but be aware that there is no proof of such stalker behavior. What we do know is, at worst, she would secretly sneak glimpses of Naruto in the classroom as Sakura stated, and one flashback panel that shows Hinata looking in on Naruto as he was doing push-ups. Because I was wondering how many flashback panels there were, I reread Chapter 437, and I discovered this.

 

There are only two panels: one of Hinata in the forest crying/being depressed, and the next has her looking in on Naruto in the forest as he's training. I don't know how they animated this scene, but without some other context in play, I read it as one scene: Hinata being this close to giving up altogether, and, on her way home, she happens upon Naruto, and out of curiosity (if she was spying on him, I would think she would be trying much harder to not be seen instead of leaning out so much) she keeps quiet and watches what he's doing, trying to figure out why is he working so hard, even when he's a known failure. There are no scenes or indications this was an every day thing for Hinata, and the panels shown suggest that, yes, this was entirely coincidental. Therefore, based on that, it's impossible for Hinata know anything about Naruto's life, how lonely he was and whatnot, because she didn't turn him into a hobby. She gained strength from his never give up attitude, but that didn't make him her sole reason for living.

 

Now I never said she was trying to score "brownie point", even because she went there knowing she would proibably die, so yeah it was a YOLO moment, she was afraid of the outcome of the fight being in Pein's favor and never getting the chance to ever confess, so she did it, it's not demeaning or disrespect in any manner. It's a fact

 

So, what page does Hinata, or anyone related to the situation, says or thinks, "Oh, man, this is bad. If I don't confess my true feelings to Naruto now, I'll never get to say them!"? Because I'm very interested in reading your copy of the manga and see how it's so damn different from my copy of the manga.

 

Until those pages come up, I'm just going to state that, again, huge disservice to Hinata's character. Part of the reason why I listed Hinata's confession as a holy kitten moment is because the shy girl normally doesn't break from her role. Even if the hero is like missing all his limbs, the shy girl will remain the shy girl, while the heroine comes out swinging for the fences to cement her feelings for the main hero, and Naruto is one of the very few series I can think of that openly defied this.

 

Well that makes sense, she copied Naruto's nindo after all. However this doesn't change that it was a selfish and a YOLO moment, her main reason to go there was confessing because she was afraid of never being able to do so because of the supposed outcome. 

You can also spin this to the fact that she never really trusted Naruto's own abilities, specially his new ones, this becoms evident during the Sasuke hunt arc during the part 2, so she was understandably afraid of what would and could happen .

 

Somehow, I don't understand your line of thinking.  Trust in Naruto's abilities and let him be taken away and killed, and acting against that trust means she has no faith in Naruto's abilities? What happened to things like, being concerned, standing up for your friends, and all that other stuff we do that marks us as human beings?

 

In case you hadn't realized it at the time, Naruto had no more moves left to play. That was made abundantly clear the first moment Pain put Naruto down with the chakra stake through his hands. His sticking more chakra stakes into various points of his body to render him totally immobile was him just being a prick to show his total dominance over Naruto. That's about as game over as you can get. If you're still chanting "have faith in him!" you're as dumb as Goku when he was letting his own son suffer against Cell. At some point, you have to use your brain and determine the situation instead of blindly relying on faith alone to pull you through.

 

And speaking of which, what is it with this "Hinata only jumped out because she wanted to confess" stuff? Sure, she said she was being selfish, but damn, I think you're taking it way too far. Is there something wrong with her standing up for Naruto in his darkest hour? Is it somehow possible for Hinata to step up to a guy she realistically can't be expected to beat for reasons like, oh, I dunno, to actually save Naruto's life if at all possible? Sure, if Hinata thinks protecting Naruto with her life is selfish, well, damn I guess Naruto will have to live with her selfishness. If Sakura were to have done it, would you be saying, "Oh, she only stepped up to Pain because she just wanted to confess to Naruto"? Because somehow, I highly doubt we would be having this conversation.

 

 

 

I think it's pretty obvious she didn't really had the time to keep up her old stalking schedule after they graduated to genin. However not only Sakura, but flashbacks and Hinata herself have hints that point to the fact that Hinata stalked Naruto during their time at the academy, and as I said even if retconed such hints can't be dismissed or changed,
 

 

Again, I think you're a little too invested over this concept of Hinata "stalking" Naruto. Re-reading the relevant parts, at best, you can only presume the possibility of Hinata spying on Naruto. From what's shown, though, there's nothing to give that theory any weight.

[ichigo500]

Bewbz+ more fighting scenes. 

[Kurama]

I think she was popular till the naruhina became cannon. Considering the fact that she was alongside naruto in all the advertisements and posters. I think she still is more popular. But the way the anime is going now, after naruhina got cannon in the manga and now studio p. is removing scenes from the anime, not making it like the manga, removing all the narusaku scenes (the CPR). If this goes on, people watching the anime only will surely like hinata more than sakura in the future.

[Nar123]

Well that's rich 

 

 

 

...wut? Did you just seriously say that? Did you just seriously used a dictionary term that's taken from the US dictionary, coined by a US public in the 1991, to try and shut down that argument?

 

Are you so hard-up to be right? To somehow convince me that "Of course, Hinata is a stalker; are you blind?" that you'll grab for any shred of discord that goes against your system of belief?

 

I think you seriously need to re-examine this argument and decide if it's really about the facts or is your bias against Hinata getting the better of you. As of now, I do not feel the need to try and explain this any further; if you want to disavow the complexities of stalking, even when I've pointed such things out, that's on you.

 

I don't know, IMO the one being affected by bias here is most likely you...please, "stalk" as a word has a universal definition and it is written on the dictionary, no matter the english one, spanish one, portuguese one, japanese one, the same thing will be there...however you are talking about a country legal system, that is particular of said country, it isn't the exact same thing in every one of them you understand now?

That's why it made no sense for you to bring a definition of stalking from the US legal system, it's pointless and makes no sense

 

 

Konohamaru asked Naruto if Sakura was his girlfriend. Naruto instantly chuckled and said, "Heh, you brats are pretty sharp." And Sakura megaton punched Naruto before she knew how to do it properly.

 

Naruto was not "too embarrassed." He was quite proud that someone else thought they were an item.

 

Please I advise you to read the chapter 34 again, he is clearly embarassed, even says so in the previous page, trying to change manga facts won't take you anywhere

 

http://www.mangaread...chapter-34.html

 

 

 

 

 

Absurd, isn't it? Of course, seeing how you're so willing to live by the definition of stalking, I figure you're also willing to live by the definition of harass.

 

 

And no matter how you spin it, Naruto has annoyed and bothered Sakura repeatedly with his "Hey, you wanna go on a date?" knowing full and well that she likes someone else. Even if said guy shoots her down when she does it to him. :)

 

 

If you're using this defintion of harass I take it you're ready to accept the definition of stalking from the dictionary and the obvious fact that Hinata's character falls within them? 

 

I'd say though that your use of the word harass relating Naruto is awfully exaggerated at least in the canon manga, because there Naruto actually asks Sakura out only a few times, two times she ends up accepting even, her annoyance of him is mostly due to his remarks and overall stupidity specially during early part 1.

In fact he one relationship that would be most likely related to harassment in team 7 is the relationship between Sakura (and the rest of Sasuke's fangirls) and Sasuke himself,  I mean he cares for her specifically as a teammate during some point but unlike Naruto and Sakura relationship where there had a gradual change in their dynamics, Sasuke always regarded Sakura as an annyance during whole part 1

 

 

Huh, I didn't realize Naruto has such an intimate, dedicated romantic relationship that he only made with Sakura and then threw it all away because he was forever gaming her. "Oh, Sakura. If only there was someone out there who loved you."

 

Oh, wait, they never had that. Therefore, calling Naruto a scumbag because he didn't really love Sakura or something seems pretty farfetched to me when they weren't in some hot and heavy relationship, or on the verge of getting married or something. Put down the Haterade and drink some water to cleanse your system.

 

 

 

You got it wrong 

 

 

 

 

 

Kishimoto retcons in the last makes Sakura selfish words during chapter 3 ring true and her words during the POAL make 0 sense. If Naruto never had any special feelings for Sakura, he just wanted her as a prize to scorn Sasuke then this falls into defintion of "annoying Naruto disrupting my love life " that Sakura gave us early on and destroys the "He understands..." thoughts she had on the POAL chapter 

 

Futhermore, Naruto himself calls Sakura out as a liar during the Kage Summit arc, he said she was lying to herself, well that's ironic if we take the last retcons in consideration because then the one lying to himslef would be Naruto and this makes him a hypocrite. 

 

Kishimoto could resolve NS in other manners without trying to retcon the already estabilished feelings Naruto had for Sakura, making him move on or something, put a heartwarming moment between the two to show they still conisder each other best friends and go from there, instead he completely retconned Naruto's character into a selfish, hypocritical prick that wanted Sakura just for his rivalry with Sasuke, this together with the whole lot of retcons of that movie thing made the japanese fans themselves to call Naruto "the ultimate scumbag"

 

 

 

Possibly, but without proof of multiple, intentional visitations, it's just dry conjecture.

 

"Proof"...wow this is a stretch   

There is no need for proof here, we are not in police or detective investigation m8. You gave me a situation where said person goes constantly to a certain place with the exact objective of watching another perston train or exercise...that's stalking

 

simple as that

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hints aren't facts, though; they're interpretations we make based on what we see and hear. And because of that, sometimes we read too deeply into something that isn't necessarily a hint, seeking out a personal meaning to what was just a lazy offhand comment. The only time hints have to be good is in a murder-mystery story because we're seeking to figure out who is the criminal, and certain clues will inevitably give the suspect away. Of course, that also means being on the lookout for red herrings and misdirections.

 

So, yeah, sometimes, you need something a bit more concrete to work with because ultimately, everything is smoke and mirrors without proof of existence.

 

 

 

And yet, we only have hints that lead to the fact that she was stalking and not to the fact that she wasn't...c'mon really?

You're trying to change the goalpost because the canon story hints through and through that Hinata used to specially observe Naruto during the academy time, going as far as to watch him training, you can't deny that so now you're trying ( and failing) to discredit such hints.

Hints aren't only relevant in murder-mystery stories, it's a common narrative piece any author can put there just to hint something without fully giving everything or to lead readers to a conclusion

The conclusion relating to hints of "Hinata being a stalker" is obvious: Hinata observed Naruto during academy time, she watched him while hidden and his nindo gave her strenght.  The fact that she constantly watched/observed him makes her fall within the definition of stalker during those few years

 

I don't know why even are you trying to deny that Hinata is a stalker...I mean the definition of the word doesn't have that huge of a negative meaning, it's just says it's refers to a person who constantly watches/follow other person for a reason, depending on the reason however(...). Hinata's reason was because watching Naruto gave her strenght, really it's not like I'm trying to paint her as an obssessive freak 

 

 

 

 

It was brought up at the end of Part 1. Neji asks why isn't Hinata going to see Naruto off, since it was his last day in the village before his training trip with Jiraiya. Kiba and Shino show up to tell Neji that Hinata did try to visit Naruto in the hospital, only to faint seeing him so bandaged up, and as a result, could not bring herself to face him directly due to shame. It's also the only time we see Hinata hiding behind something to watch Naruto -- but, as it was explained, it was because she was still mortified for her actions at the hospital.

 

 

I remember, and no we got her flashback where she was watching him train and then we also got Sakura remark that she was alwasy watching him/ observing him during academy time; it adds up

 

 

 

 

 

 

Again, conjecture. Since you yourself pointed out that Hinata was not relevant, we don't know anything about her aside from her family problems. So we can't say with absolute conviction that Hinata was running off at every single opportunity to spy on Naruto; you can believe that, if you want to, but be aware that there is no proof of such stalker behavior. What we do know is, at worst, she would secretly sneak glimpses of Naruto in the classroom as Sakura stated, and one flashback panel that shows Hinata looking in on Naruto as he was doing push-ups. Because I was wondering how many flashback panels there were, I reread Chapter 437, and I discovered this.

 

 

There are only two panels: one of Hinata in the forest crying/being depressed, and the next has her looking in on Naruto in the forest as he's training. I don't know how they animated this scene, but without some other context in play, I read it as one scene: Hinata being this close to giving up altogether, and, on her way home, she happens upon Naruto, and out of curiosity (if she was spying on him, I would think she would be trying much harder to not be seen instead of leaning out so much) she keeps quiet and watches what he's doing, trying to figure out why is he working so hard, even when he's a known failure. There are no scenes or indications this was an every day thing for Hinata, and the panels shown suggest that, yes, this was entirely coincidental. Therefore, based on that, it's impossible for Hinata know anything about Naruto's life, how lonely he was and whatnot, because she didn't turn him into a hobby. She gained strength from his never give up attitude, but that didn't make him her sole reason for living.

 

 

 

Not really a conjecture, by the fact that she is/was not relevant makes sense for us to not to dive deep in her storyline, but at the same type we are given hints,  thoughts and statements. We know that hInata observed Naruto constantly, and that watching him gave her strenght during the academy time, but how did she managed to watch his never give up attitude if she didn't saw him train constantly to back up his boisterious boasts from te class?

 

The fact that you read the scene that way shows how much bias you have...that' can be interpreted in a more believable way than the speculation that "she was going home" that  you're trying to do, it's relatively simple, look, Hinata before seeing Naruto was weak and always used to give up, after watching him ( constantly as it was hinted) she adopted his nindo. It's simple, there is nothing in the text and subtext that hints to this "she was going home and happened to find him", your bias is trying to find ways to deny the obvious, look at how much conjecture you made based on two simple panels, how much conjecture you had to do to try to show that Hinata wasn't stalking ...completely unnecessary. You're also wrong, because we have hints from before that shows us that Hinata used to constantly observe him, so it makes no sense to try to put that scene as a "only once" event.

It' was also pretty funny to see you trying to argue that Hinata wasn't hiding behind the tree when she clearly was.

 

Besides if we go by the last your claim also makes even more 0 sense because by the last the first time Hinata saw Naruto was after she defended her from some bullies (LOL copypaste backstory/ 0 creativity  ) and gained her admiration there, so she knew him and did not think he was just "a failure from her class"

 

 

And no, Hinata in part 2 at least was flanderized with Naruto as her sole reason for living, just read or skim through again the war arc chapters again, or hell all of her apperences in part 2 are Naruto centered, the Last thing just makes it all worse.

I will repeat again , during part 1 Hinata's character showed potential but during part 2 she was just but a flanderized version of her part 1 self, because as you see part 1 Hinata had adopted Naruto's nindo and was training to become strong, she had her whole complex situatuon of the "next heir" and she also had problems within her clan that she hoped to change, however in part 2 the only aspect we got of her was her love for naruto, and this love goes from  the simple adoration /admiration she showed she had to something that would ultimately made pairing fodder out of her

 

 

 

 

So, what page does Hinata, or anyone related to the situation, says or thinks, "Oh, man, this is bad. If I don't confess my true feelings to Naruto now, I'll never get to say them!"? Because I'm very interested in reading your copy of the manga and see how it's so damn different from my copy of the manga.

 

Until those pages come up, I'm just going to state that, again, huge disservice to Hinata's character. Part of the reason why I listed Hinata's confession as a holy kitten moment is because the shy girl normally doesn't break from her role. Even if the hero is like missing all his limbs, the shy girl will remain the shy girl, while the heroine comes out swinging for the fences to cement her feelings for the main hero, and Naruto is one of the very few series I can think of that openly defied this.

 

 

 

It's obvious, she herself says that it's a selfish moments and she goes there mainly just to confess because she knew she was no match for Pein and she would probably die.

 

Unless you're wanting to tell me that Hinata went there because she had confidence in trying to defeat Pein? Because if so you'll just be arguing that she was dumb as well too 

The anime series tried to paint that situation in a better way but in the manga what happened was, confess ---> KO'ed by Pein

 

It's not that much of a holy kitten moment, in multiple manga, shy characters already  standed up for something and had a moments,having a shy character leaving their shell for a moment is not really that uncommon in japanese manga

 

 

 

Somehow, I don't understand your line of thinking.  Trust in Naruto's abilities and let him be taken away and killed, and acting against that trust means she has no faith in Naruto's abilities? What happened to things like, being concerned, standing up for your friends, and all that other stuff we do that marks us as human beings?

 

 

 

 

 

It's simple really, she really had little faith in Naruto's abilities as it was showed before during the Sasuke rescue arc in part 2, it makes sense and its nothing against her it's just that she never got to see Naruto's power before the war arc so of course she would worry more about him.

Naruto clearly didn't want anyone to involve themselves in the fight because he knew it would most likely lead to death and  frankly if not for Minato's Deus ex machina thing with the seal then the kyuubi would get out and destroy everything in konoha

 

 

 

In case you hadn't realized it at the time, Naruto had no more moves left to play. That was made abundantly clear the first moment Pain put Naruto down with the chakra stake through his hands. His sticking more chakra stakes into various points of his body to render him totally immobile was him just being a prick to show his total dominance over Naruto. That's about as game over as you can get. If you're still chanting "have faith in him!" you're as dumb as Goku when he was letting his own son suffer against Cell. At some point, you have to use your brain and determine the situation instead of blindly relying on faith alone to pull you through.

 

 

 

And we all know how that Goku-Gohan situation resolved itself in Cell don't we   ?Jokes aside though, talking seriously here

I'm not fighting against Hinata's involvement over there, you got me wrong, I'm just saying that it made sense for her to go there because fo her own fear pf not confessing ever and her lack of faith in Naruto's abilities, this lack of faith turned out to be quite a good thing this time...or not ...depending in your POV, because we could also argue that thanks to her intervention Konoha was almost destroyed by the Kyuubi  itself and Naruto's existence was almost completely erased if not for a Deus ex machina

 

Funny you talking about "brains", that situation in 437 had nothing to do with brains, it was a pure emotional moment and reaction. Hinata didn't thought that through, she just acted based on her own perceptions

 

 

 

And speaking of which, what is it with this "Hinata only jumped out because she wanted to confess" stuff? Sure, she said she was being selfish, but damn, I think you're taking it way too far. Is there something wrong with her standing up for Naruto in his darkest hour? Is it somehow possible for Hinata to step up to a guy she realistically can't be expected to beat for reasons like, oh, I dunno, to actually save Naruto's life if at all possible? Sure, if Hinata thinks protecting Naruto with her life is selfish, well, damn I guess Naruto will have to live with her selfishness. If Sakura were to have done it, would you be saying, "Oh, she only stepped up to Pain because she just wanted to confess to Naruto"? Because somehow, I highly doubt we would be having this conversation.

 

 

 

Not really    I mean unless you're trying to argue that Hinata was dumb and actually though she had  a chance to save Naruto and defeat Pein then the fact that she went there to confess is the only option and also falls perfectly into the line with her talk about being selfish

Besides if she went there to save him, why confess in first place? She clearly knew that was a useless attack but wanted to try it anyway 

If it was Sakura well, I don't really see Sakura doing that at that time, but no I would  have no problem shredding my bias (unlike you) and analysing her if she was the Hinata of that situation. 

 

But really, If it was Sakura in Hinata's place what would most of the fandom think ? "Whoa what a dumb kitten, she knew she couldn't do it but she still went there just to confess..."

 ...don't try to deny that's really what they would think since most of the fandom is heavily Sakura hater, you see how would the perception of one scene change due to a change of character even if most of the things remained the same? 

My opinion of such a scene wouldn't change though, that scene in 437 is basically a girl being selfish and going there to confess even if she knew trying saving the guy was useless, the meaning that she went there to save him, to fight against Pein and to try to defeat him (like the anime tried to put it) makes no sense unless you consider Hinata dumb

 

 

 

Again, I think you're a little too invested over this concept of Hinata "stalking" Naruto. Re-reading the relevant parts, at best, you can only presume the possibility of Hinata spying on Naruto. From what's shown, though, there's nothing to give that theory any weight.

 

 

 

I think you're a little too defensive about recognizing  that Academy!Hinata was a stalker ( which she was). Since we don't have a clear insight on her backstory because she was never revelant and was never intended to be we are only left ewwith hints, some flashbacks and statements, all of them contribute to the fact that Hinata stalked Naruto during the academy time for her own reasons. Saying otherwise would be denying canon evidence and that would be selective reading, which is just the thing some NH/SS people do with the story 

 

I will just repeat what I said early on this post

 

"I don't know why even are you trying to deny that Hinata is a stalker...I mean the definition of the word doesn't have that huge of a negative meaning, it's just says it's refers to a person who constantly watches/follow other person for a reason. Hinata's reasoin was because watching Naruto gave her strenght, really it's not like I'm trying to paint her as an obssessive freak "

 

 

 

 

Edited by Nar123, 08 May 2015 - 04:03 PM.

[Ryriena]

Hinata is a Obsessive love stalker these people misplaced view is that they are meant to be with the person that they stalk. In fact, she had probably an attachment disorder this is shown, when she showed more concern over knitting the scarf than her own sister. I mean once you look at things from this perspective she is a clasfied stalker.

I dismiss chapter 699-700 that Kishimoto put out just because it is garbage that he supports this type of pairing.

Edited by Ryriena, 08 May 2015 - 05:02 PM.

[Gravenimage]

-make her boobs bigger.

-make her love Naruto in the beginning (no crush on Sasuke).

-make her selfless instead of selfish.

-make her strong.

-make her independent.

-make her with an objective of her own.

-And the most important of them all "that Hinata never existed".

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

A lot of NH fans also hate Tsunade. I notice this but don't really know why they do.

 

It's because she's Sakura's sensei most likely, as well as the fact she's a bit of a tsundere too. It's such a double standard in my opinion that they'll worship Hinata for her weaknesses, yet when Sakura does something cool, like she's done by helping take down Sasori as well as punching freakin' Kaguya to help Naruto and Sasuke seal her... they just say she's useless. XP

[Aizen-Sama]

 
It's because she's Sakura's sensei most likely, as well as the fact she's a bit of a tsundere too. It's such a double standard in my opinion that they'll worship Hinata for her weaknesses, yet when Sakura does something cool, like she's done by helping take down Sasori as well as punching freakin' Kaguya to help Naruto and Sasuke seal her... they just say she's useless. XP

When Hinata acts tough; she's a goddess.
When Sakura acts tough; she's a lame b*tch.
Gotta love those double standards! XD

[rocci]

-make her boobs bigger.
-make her love Naruto in the beginning (no crush on Sasuke).
-make her selfless instead of selfish.
-make her strong.
-make her independent.
-make her with an objective of her own.
-And the most important of them all "that Hinata never existed".

You just make sakura as Hinata.

[TouKen4Life3g]

For west, just remove crush on Sasuke and kick more ass.

[rocci]

For west, just remove crush on Sasuke and kick more ass.

What about east?

[TouKen4Life3g]

What about east?

No clue. Ask Kishi.

Seriously, I don't know. Kishi was vague on it.

[Konoha'sCrimsonFox]

I don't think sakura is a tsundere.

she would have been if she was paired up with Naruto.

[rocci]

she would have been if she was paired up with Naruto.

Possible

[TouKen4Life3g]

she would have been if she was paired up with Naruto.

To me, Kishi has to force these characters to lose their traits to make a pairing work. When they're alone, that's when they show more or less old self. Basically, if Sasuke was there, Sakura would not be like what we see before or even now. It's not even maturity. It's character change.