266 replies to this topic

[rocci]

 
I never sawit, , can you give a source? Either way Ros was filler character, it was expected she would be killed
 
 
 
 
I just think the shows try to amplify things due to extrea shock + gore factor
 
I don't think it has to do with mysoginy (blatant hate against women) but perharps has a little to do with sexism...maybe

I agree with you, it's the setting.
Low fantasy medieval setting.

[sushi.]

 

I never sawit, , can you give a source? Either way Ros was filler character, it was expected she would be killed

 

 

 

 

I just think the shows try to amplify things due to extrea shock + gore factor

 

I don't think it has to do with mysoginy (blatant hate against women) but perharps has a little to do with sexism...maybe

Tell me, what makes it sexist, yet not misogynistic? Where is the line?

[Nar123]

Tell me, what makes it sexist, yet not misogynistic? Where is the line?

 

Well misoginy is the plain hate of women, sexism is the disrespect of women be it intentional or unintentional

 

http://www.theguardi...sm-and-misogyny

Edited by Nar123, 12 May 2015 - 06:01 PM.

[Narufan85]

I'll look for those quotes from Ros's actress.

 

In the meantime, here is the tumblr post I found about sexism in GOT. I think it makes several good points, but this one jumps out at me regarding misogyny and sexism:

 

 

No, what 5x03 made abundantly clear to me is that D&D allow fundamentally sexist assumptions to color their understandings of the narrative, and with that understanding, canonize their misogyny.

There are two particular assumptions (or even tropes) that are especially troubling:

1. Empowered women must either be physically badass or sexually liberated manipulators, and
2. Nice guys “deserve” the affection of women.

 

Regarding point 1 from the post, that comes through so clearly with how they are handling Brienne, Sansa, and Margaery. 

[CloudMountainJuror]

 

im sorry i have to ask are u being ironic

if not, why?

 

Not at all. Pretty much everything and everyone in this episode shined.

 

Spoilers

Just about every scene was intense this episode, the most notable stuff easily being everything happening in Winterfell. Ramsay only continues to get more interesting. The scenes with Sansa and Theon were great. Everyone's acting ability was at their peak here, especially Ramsay's actor. They could not have gotten a better person to play him. The choice to have pretty much all of the Winterfell scenes back-to-back was a great one, as it made the whole situation that much more uncomfortable and intense.

 

If there was a weakest link this episode, it was Dany's story, but even that was still good and clearly heading somewhere. At any rate, it's infinitely more interesting than the "invade the city, free the slaves, repeat" storyline she had going through season 3 and the start of season 4. The sideplot with Grey Worm and Missandei is a welcome breath of relief as well.

Edited by CloudMountainJuror, 12 May 2015 - 11:10 PM.

[Nar123]

I'll look for those quotes from Ros's actress.

 

In the meantime, here is the tumblr post I found about sexism in GOT. I think it makes several good points, but this one jumps out at me regarding misogyny and sexism:

 

 

Regarding point 1 from the post, that comes through so clearly with how they are handling Brienne, Sansa, and Margaery. 

 

Sorry but...on the time GOT supposedly adapts ( middle age influence)  how would you want a women to not be free and independent if not by acting like that?

 

And yeah reading the entire post I can see she made some fair points but a part of them also fall under the issue of the fact that a adaptation will never truly be able to adaptate the material, for example her entire paragraph about Sansa can be put in this perpesctive. Book readers have a whole other interpretation of some characters because of their POV

Edited by Nar123, 13 May 2015 - 12:14 AM.

[CloudMountainJuror]

With episode 6, I can safely say there will probably never again be much common ground between book readers and non-book readers. This is going to be the final nudge, I can feel it.

 

Season 5 Episode 6 spoilers

I'll just skip straight to the elephant in the room: the rape scene. As soon as they got into the room, I felt it was coming. But I'm probably going to be one of the few who can say they were pleasantly surprised by how it was executed. Not to say it was at all enjoyable, god no. It was super disturbing and affecting. That's why it worked. The last shot was perfect. I've seen some people complaining that it took the emphasis off the rape to make it less horrifying than it was. I absolutely disagree. Only hearing what was going on while seeing Theon's pained expression worsen left it to the imagination, which is even more horrifying and affecting (and a better/more creative directorial choice) than just showing what was going on.

 

As for why it happened story-wise? None of us know for certain yet. But an easy educated guess can be made that it's going to absolutely feed into Theon's future material. He's been being further pushed to the edge as the series has progressed, and this visibly pushed him near a breaking point. Obviously, Sansa is not getting out of this clean, as she was experiencing the brunt of it, but how this might feed into her character is not as easy to predict, and I won't try to scrap some speculation together. The only near-guarantee so far is it getting Theon to come back into the fold.

 

I know there's likely going to be no one here who agrees with me. I just wanted to post my thoughts here (potentially one last time) before the storm rolls in.

Edited by CloudMountainJuror, 18 May 2015 - 08:35 AM.

[sushi.]

Kill d&d 2k4ever.

[Nar123]

I knew this was going to happen the moment Sansa went to winterfell, I just hope she doesn't suffer as much as Jeyne Poole did 

[sushi.]

I knew this was going to happen the moment Sansa went to winterfell, I just hope she doesn't suffer as much as Jeyne Poole did 

I wish they'd let Sansa escape this time by herself tho, since so far she'd only been a pawn to be rescued, and they're speeding up her rise as a player of the game. But since they're morphing her story with Jeyne's, Theon will probably get her out. After that I think Brienne will have a hand in this too.

Edited by sushi., 18 May 2015 - 10:43 AM.

[Nar123]

I wish they'd let Sansa escape this time by herself tho, since so far she'd only been a pawn to be rescued, and they're speeding up her rise as a player of the game. But since they're morphing her story with Jeyne's, Theon will probably get her out. After that I think Brienne will have a hand in this too.

 

Yeah that''s what I've been thinking, and then they will meet up with 

books spoiler

 

Stannis

Just like Jeyne Poole did in the books, I guess

 

I just hope Sansa has an upcoming revenge against the boltons sometime in the future

Edited by Nar123, 18 May 2015 - 10:47 AM.

[Narufan85]

Terrible episode. Poor acting and bad writing. Last scene should not be about Theon.

Edited by Narufan85, 18 May 2015 - 10:58 AM.

[sushi.]

 

Yeah that''s what I've been thinking, and then they will meet up with 

books spoiler

 

Stannis

Just like Jeyne Poole did in the books, I guess

 

I just hope Sansa has an upcoming revenge against the boltons sometime in the future

Brienne's not gonna like that. x) I also want Sansa to get revenge, but I wondered what Littlefinger's plan was in the first place. Was she gonna kill him in his sleep? lol. And what the hell is he doing now with Cersei?

You are correct, no one will likely agree with you. To make that scene about Theon is disgusting. It also misses a big part of Theon's redemption in the text. But by now it is no surprise that D&D have no interest in trying to stay true to Martin's characterization.

The final scene aside, that was a terrible episode. I'm not even saying that from a "book reader" standpoint. Poorly acted and logically inconsistent. I will say more later, but this was just bad.

I also thought that was nasty, but they might have done it to make the scene less graphic. idk. Depends on how they deal with the aftermath. Sansa's pain after being raped, or Theon's after witnessing it?

[Nar123]

Terrible episode. Poor acting and bad writing. Last scene should not be about Theon.

 

What...you wanted to see the rape? I'm glad they focused on Theon

Besides Alfie Allen's acting is amazing

[Nar123]

Brienne's not gonna like that. x) I also want Sansa to get revenge, but I wondered what Littlefinger's plan was in the first place. Was she gonna kill him in his sleep? lol. And what the hell is he doing now with Cersei?

I also thought that was nasty, but they might have done it to make the scene less graphic. idk. Depends on how they deal with the aftermath. Sansa's pain after being raped, or Theon's after witnessing it?

 

I think Brienne will have to choose between her revenge and her duty to save Sansa, that will make a good conflic for her character in the show since  you know who from the books isn't appearing any time soon in the series

 

I think I got what LF (from the series) is doing. He is trying to come out as a winner in the north situation by any means necessary, if Cersei agreed in letting the vale handle the things in north, LF could basically determine who would win in the battle of Stannis vs the Boltons with his help.

Edited by Nar123, 18 May 2015 - 11:12 AM.

[Narufan85]

 
What...you wanted to see the rape? I'm glad they focused on Theon
Besides Alfie Allen's acting is amazing

No, I didn't want to see it. But I am uncomfortable with the interpretation I'm left with this morning: that the rape will end up being all about Theon's redemption as he saves Sansa. I'd rather a straight fade to black than focusing on Theon.

[Nar123]

No, I didn't want to see it. But I am uncomfortable with the interpretation I'm left with this morning: that the rape will end up being all about Theon's redemption as he saves Sansa. I'd rather a straight fade to black than focusing on Theon.

 

I think Theon played the audience surrogate on that scene, his face was an exact copy of mine

[sushi.]

Maisie Williams turned 18 last month. Pray for Arya in S6.

 

look at this article btw. It's about ST's reaction. jfc i think they're feeding her something.

Edited by sushi., 18 May 2015 - 12:43 PM.

[Narufan85]

Maisie Williams turned 18 last month. Pray for Arya in S6.

 

look at this article btw. It's about ST's reaction. jfc i think they're feeding her something.

 

She has given terrible interviews this year. I don't think she really understands her character.

[Nar123]

 

She has given terrible interviews this year. I don't think she really understands her character.

 

I just think that book Sansa =/= Show Sansa