814 replies to this topic

[Codus N]

Thank you.



I would like to know where people keep thinking that Hinata gets all the "shine" moments when really this is the first major shine moment since the Pein Arc.

Sakura has shined on several more occasions than Hinata has. A lot of times in Part 1. She has shined in the beginning of Shippudden. She has shined with the Sasori fight. She has shined with the Sakura confession and that lasted for a few chapters. (Hey, if Hinata's confession where she just gets knocked out by Pein so easily is Hinata "shining" then I am going to count Sakura's "failed" confession too.)

And Sakura has had her time to shine during the war albeit brief with her punching the Zetsu clone. I thought that was pretty shining and a lot more awesome than Hinata's scene of being a damsel in distress again.

Even the anime made it awesome:

SAKURA SMASH --Click here to view--

Also, I never said anything about Sakura being the main character or her professional role in the manga. I said that there is a time and place for everything and that Sakura's time to really shine is at a moment where it is most needed. The best time for her to "shine" would be with the Sasuke vs Naruto fight.

The war...I see it being the time when the side characters get the focus and most of the attention. Notice how Kakashi's development disappeared for long periods of time and we got that moment with Obito and then Kakashi fell back behind the curtain.

This is the first time Neji got attention in a long while. So I think he deserves it, but the problem is, as I mentioned waaaay back in chapter 602-603, if you want these characters to gain that development, then you are going to have to shift the focus. You will have to take the camera away from the main cast to give these characters a chance and that's how it has to work.

So like I said, Kishi is getting all this stuff out of the way and letting the other cast to have one last dance in the limelight.

Yet if you did bring Neji back to life then Neji's death gets underplayed and the entire point of Neji's speech loses it's meaning. So you have this paradox of you're either damned if you do or damned if you don't. Seeing how a lot of "unfairness" this manga has shown with the deaths of characters being underwhelmed because they are magically brought back to life, I have practically let logic go and say "anything goes by now."

Reminds me of the Matrix where Trinity is killed off in Reloaded only to be killed again in Revolution. Why?



While I guess it could work, I don't see how or why Sakura would start talking to Obito unless something initiates where he attempts to kill her or take her as hostage, but then you get backlash from here of people saying "Oh, Sakura is being diminished. She should be stronger."

*sigh and pinches the bridge of my nose* No one will ever be happy no matter what course Kishi takes. Someone is going to be pissed off. Might as well make the story as interesting a possible.

Yup, you're right. But really that's how fandom is nowadays. And it gets worse with the internet. I bet some authors must be envying the old-timers who probably didn't have to put up with this kitten.

As for Kishi shelving the main characters to give the side characters some spotlight, well it's a love/hate situation for me. But the one thing I'm extremely frustrated is Kishi's treatment with Sakura. He had better have something big otherwise, I will be extremely disappointed.

[kirabook]

dude i'm at the chan, there was about 70 comments about the chapter none of them talking about hinata u'all are just overthinking too much.

I don't really care about Hinata's part too much, I care about the absence of other characters and Hinata always taking the stage when I feel Kishi should at least invest some time into other characters. Why couldn't the rest of Neji's team be there along with Hinata? I think that would have made the scene all the more important (and sad)

[ramenanmitsu]

Let's face it, Kishi is not doing the best thing with her. If he would be, the majority's reaction wouldn't be like this, the fandom wouldn't hate her like this, interviewers wouldn't ask what about Sakura, etc.
Yes, it is trashed away because at this point in the manga, she should be able to dodge by her own. Hell, she was Tsunade's studen and we clearly got that idea implemented with medics dodging by their own attacks.
I am not trying to search negative details of Sakura, I am seeing them. She is my fav. character but I won't be crazy and in denial, pretend that everything is ok with her that Kishi is doing a great job when he doesn't.
Hell, if he'd do it, simply, there wouldn't be so much hate for her in the fandom.

The biggest problem is that even us Sakura fans, can't deny her lack of skills. If even her fans are disappointed, then this is saying something.

And it's not our fault for seeing things this way. Kishi is doing a poor job of writing a heroine. Does he think that Tsunade's explanation of byakugou is enough to make us fans satisfied that Sakura is not fighting because she is following the "medics don't fight" rule? Does Kishi think that making Sakura beat one Zetsu up is enough to make us satisfied that Sakura is indeed a great fighter like all the other rookies out there(while the rookies fight much stronger Edo Tensei's)? He's putting these little excuses here and there when it comes to Sakura, and this makes me angry. It's like he's giving an indirect message, "Hey I forgot developing
Sakura so I'll just use some panels to write down the excuse. Please bare with it and stop bragging that Sakura is not the heroine. I already wrote my excuses to why she doesn't fight. Oops! Now, I need to make a small panel explaining why she can't dodge simple objects!" This style of writing reeks of arrogance. It's like reading a fanfic, where the explanation of the character's actions are written in the Authors Notes and you cannot find it in the story but as a reader you just have to accept it unwillingly.

Edited by ramenanmitsu, 18 December 2012 - 04:56 PM.

[Slextrem]

I'm pretty sure it involves Naruto giving chakra to the Ino-Shika-Cho group to amplify their jutsu.

That would be really cool! I hope that his plan incorporates more than just the Kyuubi. It would be nice seeing some of Konoha 11 10 involved in the main fight against the Jyuubi.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

everyone is thinks that there will have a "nagatization" of obito, because both inoichi and shikaku died with no flashbacks, even Neji(neji got a resolution of his character)

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 18 December 2012 - 04:59 PM.

[Canadian_DJ]

Just imagine...
Shino: IM BUGMAN

Lol man your killing me!!!!! first "he's the one the one they need...but not the one they deserve" and now this oh man lool!!!

Look guys just because kishi is giving hinata some closure doesn't mean its the end of thr worl or, or shes the herione, what about naruto yeah? when kishi goes and developes shikamaru in whole, count it ONE whole arc, you dont go hearing people saying "oh what ever happened to naruto, ooh i thought he was the hero of the story not shikamaru......oh great now kishi's playing games with us" no guys no.Just NO.Look at thr manga as a whole, sakura had alotta appearances, and thr second we even see hinatas face in a panel gor two chapter you guys lose it and go corrupt! guys seriously gimme a break

[Codus N]

The biggest problem is that even us Sakura fans, can't deny her lack of skills. If even her fans are disappointed, then this is saying something.

And it's not our fault for seeing things this way. Kishi is doing a poor job of writing a heroine. Does he think that Tsunade's explanation of byakugou is enough to make us fans satisfied that Sakura is not fighting because she is following the "medics don't fight" rule? Does Kishi think that making Sakura beat one Zetsu up is enough to make us satisfied that Sakura is indeed a great fighter like all the other rookies out there(while the rookies fight much stronger Edo Tensei's)? He's putting these little excuses here and there when it comes to Sakura, and this makes me angry. It's like he's giving an indirect message, "Hey I forgot developing
Sakura so I'll just use some panels to write down the excuse. Please bare with it and stop bragging that Sakura is not the heroine. I already wrote my excuses to why she doesn't fight. Oops! Now, I need to make a small panel explaining why she can't dodge simple objects!" This style of writing reeks of arrogance. It's like reading a fanfic, where the explanation of the character's actions are written in the Authors Notes and you cannot find it in the story but as a reader you just have to accept it unwillingly.

QFT.

[Zatheko]

Just read the chapter, and poor neji

And where the heck is sakura!? Everyone is getting more screen time then her and its really irking me, and I hope HOPE this helps wake hinata up, I hope that is the reason this happened for hinata to finally wake up and stop chasing naruto.

Knew that there was another transformation for Jubi, some people didn't think so in the discussion for 613 well HAH!

[RedDelicious]

Just had another look at the Sakura/Kakashi frame. I didn't notice that his arm was around her. I thought she was behind him, and that her left arm was actually Kakashi's right arm. My bad... That is disappointing. Would be better if there was one frame showing that Sakura was so intent on healing Kakashi, that she was oblivious to the danger.

This just comes to show that if ANY of narutos friends jump in to save him, although neji also saved hinata but whatever, naruto'll take it really deep, its not something romantic heck naruto looked deeply moved and ticked when neji saved him...

Maybe this chapter is really for the Nejaruto shippers. In that last frame on the last page, Neji's face on Naruto's shoulder looks similar to Sakura holding Naruto in chapter 450, after the Pein battle. (Except Sakura wasn't bleeding from the mouth.)

[Tsubaki]

OMFG! a lot of people whine because kishi does not give enough development to the other characters on K11 when he do this you guys complain kishi is showing sakura and where she are to remind the readers that he did not forget about her.

Isn't that, I do want their get their development but since the alliance arrived Hinata is getting too much painel time, people will compare and bash Sakura for it. I know that I shouldn't give a f*** about what the fandom thinks, but its so sad see Sakura being bashed... and it's all Kishi falts that didn't development her very well, because if he had done that, don't matter how much painel time or good scenes Hinata received, no one would deny that Sakura is the heroine.

I guess I expect too much of Sakura because she has so much potential, but when I see such a potential not being used .. it's so frustrating. sorry for that!

[Canadian_DJ]

Luckily i dont care about the fandom, thats also why i dont give a kitten to what they say.
So i also dont have a problem that hinata is getting more screentime then sakura in this arc, because im sure its there to finally resolve her character. Till now theres nothing to worry for me.

Finally someone friggin' agrees with me!

Btw nope theres no manga next week, not because its christmas but because whenever they release the manga on tuesdays they delay the manga, rust me, im always right lol not to be bragging, but i've realised this pattern thr mamga goes by.

Edited by Canadian_DJ, 18 December 2012 - 05:12 PM.

[candycane-chan]

It would really be nice if the sakura talk would stop
Because really now, complaining isn't going to do anything. If you say "sakura isn't doing enough" then kishi won't make her do something special the next chapter.
kishi gave sakura those little panels so that the fans will know that she's still there and he still hasn't forotten about her. And I thought we already established the fact that sakura wasn't hit by the rock and everyone was blown, even naruto.

I think this might be it for neji, since the mark on his forhead disappeared and he got to understand his father. Acually, now that I think about, his death is the most logical out of the rookies. Kishi did the mistake that a lot of writers do when they want to take out a character, he didn't show us much ( or rather anything) from his POV, not even when the alliance was heading to naruto.

I was lurking around some other forums and you'll be surprised that some had quit the manga because of neji's "death"

I'm sad but I'm not feeling it. Neji's death was just soooooo fast. he fought and had character development and saved 2 lives and died all in one chapter!

and also, sakura was fine this chapter, since naruto was even worse, he kept stumbling and neading saving and..all to make the hyuugas shine. I'm totally fine with it though neji was cool

And I'm really curious where the relation between madara and obito is heading, looks like they need a living body.
oh and there's still tsunade and the kages....And yamato

Edited by candycane-chan, 18 December 2012 - 05:13 PM.

[Phantom_999]

Jesus.

Ok, I know I said I wanted people to die. Neji dying...ok. I can accept that. As much as I loved him.

But, man, Kishi is shoving this NH crap down our throats out of absolutely nowhere. And it's aggravating me.

Either he's trying to appeal to everyone no matter how much it damages the quality of the manga, or he's just losing his head.

Same here but I'm willing to cry too. Sakura not getting any development. I scratch my head at this.

Hey, hey Kishi, I get it now! People die in war, mkay, no more. I get it. D:

But why did you kill an awesome character to develop the not so awesome character of Hinata.
I thought no one in K11 would die, and I thought NejiHina would produce many babies..

AROEHROQIEHR MY FEEEELS NEJI JUST DIED WAAT
2 weeks to next chapter, was it?

If this makes her a better character and stops the fan-girl obsession with Naruto okay. If this is to say we've been schmuck baited about Sakura's character, I shoot someone.

no next week we got chapter they did not make any anouncement that we will have a break next week so it's ok.

confirmed next week's the last chapter for the year.

Yeah like I said. With Neji's death Hinata will think things through in a serious matter. Realizing this war is more than just protecting Naruto but everyone, her friends, her village, her clan, and the fate of the world lies in winning this war. His death is a rude wake up call for her to finally mature and stop being that lovey dovey obsessed girl who likes Naruto, to realize he's not the center of the universe. To care for everyone in the same light. This war is about protecting the entire shinobi world not just Naruto.

I HOPE this is the case.

Funny, I'm on the opposite side of things. All of the love I used to feel for Tobi is being transferred to Madara.

*chuckles* Ironic, huh. I remember that you favored Obito before because Madara was an op battle god. Not complaining about it but just recalling you saying something that

Let's face it, Kishi is not doing the best thing with her. If he would be, the majority's reaction wouldn't be like this, the fandom wouldn't hate her like this, interviewers wouldn't ask what about Sakura, etc.
Yes, it is trashed away because at this point in the manga, she should be able to dodge by her own. Hell, she was Tsunade's studen and we clearly got that idea implemented with medics dodging by their own attacks.
I am not trying to search negative details of Sakura, I am seeing them. She is my fav. character but I won't be crazy and in denial, pretend that everything is ok with her that Kishi is doing a great job when he doesn't.
Hell, if he'd do it, simply, there wouldn't be so much hate for her in the fandom.

No she has hatedom cause she's a tsundere. but yeah She is one of my FAVORITE characters but I cry inside because she is not getting the development she deserves honestly. Sakura NEEDS screen time and action scenes. I would lover her character either way but I don't like her staying back and reserved when she is capable of SO MUCH MORE

Edited by Phantom_999, 18 December 2012 - 05:17 PM.

[Canadian_DJ]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO NEJI. WHY?! WHY COULDN'T IT HAVE BEEN HINATA?!

Okay jokes aside.

Yeah, Neji's death has basically confirmed my theory on Naruto's obsession. Neji didn't say "take care of Hinata," but pointed out how everyone is trying to fight for his life. To throw his life away for Sasuke is....pointless and every death that occurs in the war would be a waste if Naruto just let Sasuke kill him.

It is almost like everyone from Itachi to Neji are trying to say to him: "Look, we know you want to save Sasuke, but dying doesn't make the world better. Everyone here is fighting for you and even dying for your sake. Don't throw away their sacrifice." This is very important in Naruto's growth. More or less, he basically told Naruto "stop being selfish and pretend it all is up to you."

I think this obsession also means something to Hinata too. Hinata is so willing to die for Naruto that she does stupid things too. She is also obsessed. Neji's death and the fact he said that you can't be obsessed with one thing when the world is so much bigger maybe has an effect on her showing her that while she can still love Naruto, Naruto is not the only thing in her life. After his death, after what she has lost, it is time for her to open her eyes to the world and not just on Naruto.

You know, I was worried that Hinata was getting all this attention, but I realized I was expecting this. I knew Hinata was going to have a focus for a while not for shipping wars, but for her own development. I wouldn't be surprised if Kishi was getting this all out of the way now so that Sakura can have her light to shine. This way it satisfies the NH fans for Hinata getting some time. So yes, let them "have this," but I have a feeling we are going to get our time to shine towards the end. Even in other manga, the other love interests got their time to shine before the main character was like "I'm sorry, but I can't be with you. I love another."

Thinking about it like this, while yes it is crap that Sakura is being pushed aside, but I have a good feeling Sakura will regain focus. No one is closer to Naruto than Sakura is and when the war dies down and the bodies have been buried I know Sakura will be right there for him to comfort him in a way that Hinata can not. Sakura still have demons in her closet too, but those demons cannot be touched upon until Sasuke shows back up in the picture.

If that is what Kishi is doing then let's get it over with. Let the NH fans have their little fun and pretend everything is going their way. I rather keep reading the manga.

Also, I am going to continue to stand by my original prediction with Obito getting redemption through self sacrifice. Obito's resolves is very....shaky. He looks as though he is about to go against Madara and Madara looks like he is about to betray Obito some how. I like the idea someone mentioned (sorry I forgot) of Sakura dying and Obito resurrecting her because Obito sees Rin in her. That is a good idea of a fanfic too.

That would reinforce NaruSaku more especially if Naruto gets super emotional with Sakura's death.

I am going to hold out and say that Obito can still be the good guy we used to know and love. It won't change what he has done, but doesn't mean he couldn't change himself.

As i'd expect from the best guy EVER with these posts, kudos to you man awsome post, im just glad this guy thinks the same way i do man kudos!

True Words Of Wisdom

[Gravenimage]

The biggest problem is that even us Sakura fans, can't deny her lack of skills. If even her fans are disappointed, then this is saying something.

And it's not our fault for seeing things this way. Kishi is doing a poor job of writing a heroine. Does he think that Tsunade's explanation of byakugou is enough to make us fans satisfied that Sakura is not fighting because she is following the "medics don't fight" rule? Does Kishi think that making Sakura beat one Zetsu up is enough to make us satisfied that Sakura is indeed a great fighter like all the other rookies out there(while the rookies fight much stronger Edo Tensei's)? He's putting these little excuses here and there when it comes to Sakura, and this makes me angry. It's like he's giving an indirect message, "Hey I forgot developing
Sakura so I'll just use some panels to write down the excuse. Please bare with it and stop bragging that Sakura is not the heroine. I already wrote my excuses to why she doesn't fight. Oops! Now, I need to make a small panel explaining why she can't dodge simple objects!" This style of writing reeks of arrogance. It's like reading a fanfic, where the explanation of the character's actions are written in the Authors Notes and you cannot find it in the story but as a reader you just have to accept it unwillingly.

Sadly this is true and I have to agree.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

Of course, this whole thing has been nuts, and as I said to my friend before elsewhere, with Shikamaru not taking any more moments to mourn even if in a battle, it shows he's once again trying too hard to be Asuma and not his own kind of ninja in the long haul, y'know?

Though Neji's sacrifice was pretty powerful for sure. Risking it all to protect Naruto and Hinata. Of course, I was kinda disappointed with Hinata jumping in front of the attack, which made me think she underestimates Naruto once again, given she doesn't understand him well enough to know, even when he was weakened, he can handle himself pretty well, even if he's being a space case due to what happened to Shikaku and Inoichi.

[CloudMountainJuror]

*chuckles* Ironic, huh. I remember that you favored Obito before because Madara was an op battle god. Not complaining about it but just recalling you saying something that

It totally is ironic. Even with Madara being an OP battle god, though, he's been getting more personality. I love his sassiness. Whereas lately Obito's just been...bland.

But yeah, I see what you mean. Their roles just reversed in my head lately. It's like all of Tobi's menace vanished as soon as he lost the mask.

--------------------------------------------------------------

Also, I just noticed that I have little reason to keep reading now. Why? Well, let's see... I don't care about the main character anymore. That's not a good thing. I really don't care at all about Uzumaki Naruto. The only character I really was excited about seeing again is now dead, and the only villain I loved is in a genjutsu for god knows how long.

Not to mention the Hinata/NH fanservice he's been cramming down our throats lately. Right now, I really don't care about anything going on now that Neji's dead. Don't get me wrong, I care about Shikamaru, Chouji, etc., but I'm just really discouraged now. Most interesting villain disabled by an asspull, arguably best member of the K11 killed in the same chapter he returned in after an enormous time span of not contributing to the plot (good job, Kishi ), Sakura getting sidelined yet again, and NH getting teased like crazy to the point where it degrades the writing in general?

I might take a break.

Edited by zacrathedemon5, 18 December 2012 - 05:57 PM.

[tricksie]

Just a quick note about the conflicting idea that Sakura is the heroine and yet she's not being given much panel time/development.

Any major Sakura development is not going to come until near the end.

Period.

Hinata is not the heroine, and she's not Naruto's love interest. But all this panel time (now and in the future) is to sharpen the tension.

Sakura may get some big power up, or she may not. She may just prove instrumental when no one else can (through her chakra control). But Sakura's skills are being saved until the end.

Kishimoto has never a lot to fan the flames of shipping (sure both sides have had development, but the hero has always been single-minded in his focus). There's no jealousy, no dating, no nothing. But it may be that now we are entering the end game, Kishimoto is pulling out all the stops and upping the suspense every way he can. It may be that he is pushing the shipping stuff to forward in a way he hasn't done so far.

At any rate, Hinata having some limelight doesn't have any impact on Sakura at all. If Sakura has a big role in the climax of the story, then this is where Hinata gets her shine, before the biggest events.

I've also said many times we should expect some SS as well before it's through. There is some point where it will seem that all is lost — for Naruto and for Sakura. That's part of the plot. And I think that the relationship issues will not be resolved until the last chapter of the whole story.

So this is definitely the time for Hinata to make an appearance. Just keep your fingers crossed there's no SS around the corner.

I feel certain Sakura will get her time to shine, but it's not now. As the main heroine, it's going to come at the end. That's what we're building up for (along with the Naruto/Sasuke fight). And Hinata is just a part of that build up.

[sardns]

let us take a moment of silence to mourn the loss of NejiTen...

[candycane-chan]

triksie Thank you! \0/
Really though, SS has been really neglected. The scene with the lover nin isn't really a SS moment or development since it was one-sided as usual. But just like you mentioned I think they'll have some interactions/moments that will appeal to the fans.