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#15741 Tiller

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:05 AM

At least Naruto should have followed Minato's path and surpass him like it was foreshadowed *sign* :roll: .

Agreed.

 

Minato sacrificed everything important to him (his own life, his wife's life, the innocents of his son who had a demon placed in him, and the life that he and his wife wanted to have with their child) so he could save his country/village.

 

Naruto gambled on the freedom of the entire known world's population, that he was strong enough to "stop" Sasuke so long as he didn't have to kill him.

 

Minato gave up everything just so his people had a chance to live their lives in liberty and peace. Naruto gambled with the lives of every known person on the planet so long as he didn't have to kill his precious Sasuke.

 

As you said Naruto should have been even better then his father.... but he wasn't. Naruto came from two heroes who lived their lives heroically and unafraid, well Naruto would have rather died dooming the rest of mankind to constant slavery if it meet Sasuke could live. Canon Naruto is not a hero like his parents were. He selfishly put his own desires over the good of mankind, and risked the lives of everyone just so Sasuke could be "saved". What a joke.



 


#15742 TouKen4Life3g

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:08 AM

Oh man, fans are expecting something HUGE when it comes to One-Punch Man...

I'm expecting huge. The art is hard to beat for anime, so if MadHouse can please, that's a hell of a accomplishment.

#15743 RyohkiFan

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:13 AM

I heard Team Taka is appearing but as a Team together? Since I recall they form Team Taka wayyyy later than the Chunnin Exam...Ugh I hate their lame animation and how they draw Sakura's and Ino's hair like they put hairspray or something plus with how boyiah Sakura looks...just stop this anime...it's a waste...

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#15744 WhyDoIWatch

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:23 AM

Agreed.

 

Minato sacrificed everything important to him (his own life, his wife's life, the innocents of his son who had a demon placed in him, and the life that he and his wife wanted to have with their child) so he could save his country/village.

 

Naruto gambled on the freedom of the entire known world's population, that he was strong enough to "stop" Sasuke so long as he didn't have to kill him.

 

Minato gave up everything just so his people had a chance to live their lives in liberty and peace. Naruto gambled with the lives of every known person on the planet so long as he didn't have to kill his precious Sasuke.

 

As you said Naruto should have been even better then his father.... but he wasn't. Naruto came from two heroes who lived their lives heroically and unafraid, well Naruto would have rather died dooming the rest of mankind to constant slavery if it meet Sasuke could live. Canon Naruto is not a hero like his parents were. He selfishly put his own desires over the good of mankind, and risked the lives of everyone just so Sasuke could be "saved". What a joke.

Yeah, that's why I don't like the claim Naruto' selfless but I really don't blame him considering what Sasuke is to him.

 

And Minato would have done the same thing to Obito, just look at how he forgave him and wasn't even mad and the fact that he blames himself for it even though its Obito's fault.


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#15745 Nar123

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:25 AM

Agreed.

 

Minato sacrificed everything important to him (his own life, his wife's life, the innocents of his son who had a demon placed in him, and the life that he and his wife wanted to have with their child) so he could save his country/village.

 

Naruto gambled on the freedom of the entire known world's population, that he was strong enough to "stop" Sasuke so long as he didn't have to kill him.

 

Minato gave up everything just so his people had a chance to live their lives in liberty and peace. Naruto gambled with the lives of every known person on the planet so long as he didn't have to kill his precious Sasuke.

 

As you said Naruto should have been even better then his father.... but he wasn't. Naruto came from two heroes who lived their lives heroically and unafraid, well Naruto would have rather died dooming the rest of mankind to constant slavery if it meet Sasuke could live. Canon Naruto is not a hero like his parents were. He selfishly put his own desires over the good of mankind, and risked the lives of everyone just so Sasuke could be "saved". What a joke.

 

 

Putting the village in first place he would be no different from Danzo, who could do everything to make the leaf triumph in the end, including the planning of a massacre on a innocent (till proven wrong) clan 


Edited by Nar123, 10 April 2015 - 12:25 AM.

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#15746 Nar123

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:26 AM

Yeah, that's why I don't like the claim Naruto' selfless but I really don't blame him considering what Sasuke is to him.

 

And Minato would have done the same thing to Obito, just look at how he forgave him and wasn't even mad and the fact that he blames himself for it even though its Obito's fault.

 

Naruto is selfless, regarding his feelings

 

He is kinda selfish regarding other people he cares about.


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#15747 AHK

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:27 AM

I read the first two chapters of Black Clover, and honestly, I don't really understand how people can say it's similar to Naruto. The kid wants to become the Sorcery Emperor, so that by default makes it like Naruto because Naruto wanted to become Hokage? How is that any different from wanting to become the Pirate King, or the strongest Wizard, or the number one hero, or anything like that?

Or maybe it's the presence of a rival? What about Ashter and Yuno is representative of Naruto and Sasuke? Sorry, but from the very start, Yuno respects Ashter, something that no amount of retcons in the manga can prove that Sasuke ever did. The relationship between Ashter and Yuno is already leagues better than Sasuke and Naruto's ever was. Hell, they even have a foundation for their relationship, unlike Naruto and Sasuke.

Honestly, you could probably say hat Black clover is a little more resemblance of One Piece, as Yami's freshly borne relationship with Ashter is reminiscent of Luffy and Shanks.

Putting the village in first place he would be no different from Danzo, who could do everything to make the leaf triumph in the end, including the planning of a massacre on a innocent (till proven wrong) clan

The Uchiha weren't innocent...

Edited by AHK, 10 April 2015 - 12:28 AM.

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#15748 LuckyChi7

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:31 AM

I read the first two chapters of Black Clover, and honestly, I don't really understand how people can say it's similar to Naruto. The kid wants to become the Sorcery Emperor, so that by default makes it like Naruto because Naruto wanted to become Hokage? How is that any different from wanting to become the Pirate King, or the strongest Wizard, or the number one hero, or anything like that?

Or maybe it's the presence of a rival? What about Ashter and Yuno is representative of Naruto and Sasuke? Sorry, but from the very start, Yuno respects Ashter, something that no amount of retcons in the manga can prove that Sasuke ever did. The relationship between Ashter and Yuno is already leagues better than Sasuke and Naruto's ever was. Hell, they even have a foundation for their relationship, unlike Naruto and Sasuke.

Honestly, you could probably say hat Black clover is a little more resemblance of One Piece, as Yami's freshly borne relationship with Ashter is reminiscent of Luffy and Shanks.
The Uchiha weren't innocent...

 

 

The series is really interesting so far, I'm not gonna say its jaw-dropping amazing like BnHA, AOT, One Piece, or Fairy Tail,  but it is something I will keep up with to see just how far it will go.  I do agree though Aster and Yuno's relationship is alot better than Naruto and Sasuke's that's for sure.  


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THAT'S WHAT HEROES DO, THEY SAVE PEOPLE!!


#15749 Nar123

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:31 AM

 

Most shonen manga seems to fall into generic tropes which makes it predictable and boring. I want something thats a little more refreshing story telling. I don't mind some cilche's being used but tone it down a bit.

 

AoT is the best shonen there is nowadays along with OP, however AoT breaks some cliches

 

The manga takes a month to uptade tho and the art isn't that great

If you don't click with the manga just wait for the anime to continue in 2016


Edited by Nar123, 10 April 2015 - 12:32 AM.

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#15750 Tiller

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:33 AM

 

 

Putting the village in first place he would be no different from Danzo, who could do everything to make the leaf triumph in the end, including the planning of a massacre on a innocent (till proven wrong) clan 

The Uhchiha weren't an innocent clan. They knowingly started a coup against the village. Itachi is the one who informed on them and stopped their plan from happening because he understood it would cause more suffering for innocent villagers. Itachi choose to end the lives of all of his family save Sasuke if it meant saving the rest of his village.

 

Why? Because the Uchiha were being selfish asshats, who choose to take power by force of arms when their standing started to slip because of the actions of Obitio. The Third tried to calm the situation down, by giving the Uchiha different powers, hoping that with time they would show to the rest of the clans that they were peaceful and for the village, instead though they turned their back on the Third and instead tried to take power away from the Hokages no matter how many died.

 

Minato put the whole of the village above his own happiness. The Third put the whole of the village above his own happiness. So did the first, second, Jiraya, and the forth.

 

It's only when we get to Naruto that we get a "hero" who risked the free will of all of known mankind, just so Sasuke wouldn't have to die and could be "saved". Naruto put is own selfish desires in front of the good of all of mankind.


Edited by Tiller, 10 April 2015 - 12:35 AM.


 


#15751 Nar123

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:34 AM

The Uchiha weren't innocent...

 

They were

 

Follow the events

 

> Kyuubi attack

> Uchiha accused without proof other than the fact a sharingan could control the kyuubi

> Uchiha ended up closed off in a district to further observation

> Revolution sparks among the clan thanks to Konoha's harsh treatment


Edited by Nar123, 10 April 2015 - 12:40 AM.

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#15752 FireFox

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:34 AM

Agreed.

 

Minato sacrificed everything important to him (his own life, his wife's life, the innocents of his son who had a demon placed in him, and the life that he and his wife wanted to have with their child) so he could save his country/village.

 

Naruto gambled on the freedom of the entire known world's population, that he was strong enough to "stop" Sasuke so long as he didn't have to kill him.

 

Minato gave up everything just so his people had a chance to live their lives in liberty and peace. Naruto gambled with the lives of every known person on the planet so long as he didn't have to kill his precious Sasuke.

 

As you said Naruto should have been even better then his father.... but he wasn't. Naruto came from two heroes who lived their lives heroically and unafraid, well Naruto would have rather died dooming the rest of mankind to constant slavery if it meet Sasuke could live. Canon Naruto is not a hero like his parents were. He selfishly put his own desires over the good of mankind, and risked the lives of everyone just so Sasuke could be "saved". What a joke.

QFT !!! . You know how it is Tiller when it comes to Sasuke everybody just have to lick his ass and every character that comes into contact  goes OOC in a matter of seconds  :zaru: . Heck Naruto was easily able to judge all of the Villains and stand up to them for their kitten but when its Sasuke there were always some excuses it wasn't his fault bc Kikitten couldn't let the pretty boy bare the consequences of his actions :facepalm:


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#15753 TouKen4Life3g

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:39 AM

I think people believe it's similar to Naruto is because the first chapter, which I don't blame them. You got a demon. You got the savior. You got the protagonist who can be annoying and hard to control. The goal is to be number 1 title (?). Never giving up is the motto. So yeah, it's pretty similar at first glance, don't you think. I don't blame them.

#15754 Nar123

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:39 AM

The Uhchiha weren't an innocent clan. They knowingly started a coup against the village. Itachi is the one who informed on them and stopped their plan from happening because he understood it would cause more suffering for innocent villagers. Itachi choose to end the lives of all of his family save Sasuke if it meant saving the rest of his village.

 

Why? Because the Uchiha were being selfish asshats, who choose to take power by force of arms when their standing started to slip because of the actions of Obitio. The Third tried to calm the situation down, by giving the Uchiha different powers, hoping that with time they would show to the rest of the clans that they were peaceful and for the village, instead though they turned their back on the Third and instead tried to take power away from the Hokages no matter how many died.

 

Minato put the whole of the village above his own happiness. The Third put the whole of the village above his own happiness. So did the first, second, Jiraya, and the forth.

 

It's only when we get to Naruto that we get a "hero" who risked the free will of all of known mankind, just so Sasuke wouldn't have to die and could be "saved". Naruto put is own selfish desires in front of the good of all of mankind.

 

Why they started a coup in first place?

Konoha accused them without proof and closed them off in a part of the village for investigation 

They started it

 

Itachi was konoha's spy in first place, that's why he became a anbu so fast so he could be closer to the higher up without alerting anyone

 

Giving the uchiha different powers? LOL 

They were closed off in a district so they could be further observed

 

The Uchiha's are a prideful clan, of course the fact that they were suspected and distrusted would make them revolt and start something. 

 

In sum, what I want to say the massacre is both Konoha's and Uchiha's fault

 

Minato did what he should have done as Hokage, however Naruto's not the exact copy of Minato, KIshi failed on his development on the later stages of the story. In my opinion Naruto should have found his own manner of being hokage, without so much bloodshed and acts in favor of the village but more centered around keeping the safety of the populace in general


Edited by Nar123, 10 April 2015 - 12:47 AM.

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#15755 AHK

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:40 AM

They were
 
Follow the events
 
> Kyuubi attack
> Uchiha acused without proof other than the fact a sharingan could control the kyuubi
> Uchiha ended up closed off in a district to further observation
> Revolution sparks among the clan for Konoha's treatment


You forgot to add how they innocently plotted a revolution while innocently rejecting any and all offers to calm the situation, which would have innocently resulted in the deaths of millions upon millions of innocent civilians, as the competing powers would have innocently attacked the land of fire, consequently killing the aforementioned innocent civilians, all due to the Uchiha's innocent civil war, which was predicated on the innocent thought that the Uchiha were entitled to rule the leaf because their blood was worth more than everyone else's, including their comrades, and the innocent civilians that they were going to sacrifice.

Did I mention that all of that was innocent? :zaru:

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#15756 TouKen4Life3g

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:41 AM

 
AoT is the best shonen there is nowadays along with OP, however AoT breaks some cliches
 
The manga takes a month to uptade tho and the art isn't that great
If you don't click with the manga just wait for the anime to continue in 2016

I do wonder what would have happen if WSJ got the series.

#15757 Nar123

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:43 AM

You forgot to add how they innocently plotted a revolution while innocently rejecting any and all offers to calm the situation, which would have innocently resulted in the deaths of millions upon millions of innocent civilians, as the competing powers would have innocently attacked the land of fire, consequently killing the aforementioned innocent civilians, all due to the Uchiha's innocent civil war, which was predicated on the innocent thought that the Uchiha were entitled to rule the leaf because their blood was worth more than everyone else's, including their comrades, and the innocent civilians that they were going to sacrifice.

Did I mention that all of that was innocent? :zaru:

 

I never excused them of anything

 

The Uchiha have their blame too for trying to start a revolution, however Konoha's at fault too 

 

And are you... trying to justify genocide ? :sick:

I'm sorry but this is the impression I'm getting

 

I know you guys hate the Uchiha but at least acknowledge Konoha has huge part of the blame for the massacre


Edited by Nar123, 10 April 2015 - 12:44 AM.

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#15758 Swagkura

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:51 AM

Black Clover doesn't sound as bad as I thought it would be. Guess I'll give it a try after getting done with the dozen other manga I need to read :P
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#15759 Tiller

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:52 AM



 

They were

 

Follow the events

 

> Kyuubi attack

> Uchiha acused without proof other than the fact a sharingan could control the kyuubi

> Uchiha ended up closed off in a district to further observation

> Revolution sparks among the clan thanks to Konoha's harsh treatment

Harsh treatment? They were given police power and given the opportunity to show to the world that they really weren't a bunch of blood thirst tyrants like the other clans thought of them. They had the perfect opportunity to place the good the village above their own ambitions, well also clearing their name.

 

Fact: Only an Uchiha could control the 9  tails the way it was, which is exactly what happened with Obito.

 

Fact: The other villagers feared the Uchiha were trying to start a coup and take power once again, like their ideal Madara Uchiha had a few generations prior.

 

Fact: The Third not wanting to risk blood shed towards the Uchiha or a civil war choose to diplomatically turn the heat down, and give the Uchiha the opportunity to prove the goodness that HE believed was in them. He gave them police power and allowed them to show to the world that they weren't traitors, instead of simply turning the full might of the village against them.

 

Fact: Because of their stupid pride later retconned to ahem love the Uchiha choose to prove the worst fears of the others clans as a fact, and instead of striving for peace took up arms with the intention of dragging the entire village into a civil war and put the Uchiha clan on the top of the hierarchical order again because they believed they deserved to be the most powerful.

 

Fact: One of their own, in fact canon wise the only selfless Uchiha in the story, Itachi, choose the greater good over blind pride and executes his own people so the civil war would never happen and therefor the majority of innocent people would not be caught up in a selfish political power struggle.

 

Fact: Sasuke was spared by Itachi because A. He loved him, and B. He believed that Sasuke would redeem to the world that the Uchiha weren't blood thirsty selfish terrorist who put their wants above others. Which is also why Itachi choose to play the role of a criminal. He wanted to free Sasuke from the taint of his parents generation and show the world that the Uchiha weren't blood thirst monsters... but in the end.....

 

Fact: As soon as Sasuke didn't get his way, he abandoned the village and became a terrorist, and eventually tried to take over the entire world with himself as a iron fisted dictator, who controlled the free will of every man, woman, and child on the planet. Just like Madara Uchiha.

 

Who started the rebellion against the leaf instead of prove themselves to the other clans? The Uchiha. Why? Because they were too good to be simple police men and women, they deserved better. Who choose war instead of peace? The Uchiha. Who betrayed the village? The Uchiha. Who caused their own destruction because they put their own pride above other people, and thought they were better then them? The Uchiha. Nothing would have happened to them had they simply worked to prove themselves to the rest of the village that they had no interest in taking power away from the Hokages... instead of doing that though the decided to start a coup and try to take power away from the hokages.

 

Innocent? Hardly. Guilty as charged. The verdict: Death.


Edited by Tiller, 10 April 2015 - 12:53 AM.


 


#15760 AHK

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Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:53 AM

I never excused them of anything
 
The Uchiha have their blame too for trying to start a revolution, however Konoha's at fault too 
 
And are you... trying to justify genocide ? :sick:
I'm sorry but this is the impression I'm getting
 
I know you guys hate the Uchiha but at least acknowledge Konoha has huge part of the blame for the massacre

No, I have not, nor have I ever in this thread regarding the massacre, justified genocide. As a matter of fact, as hopefully others could attest on my behalf, I have always maintained that what happened regarding the Uchiha was the worst outcome of an extremely kitten situation. What Konoha did was deplorable, yes, but the situation was also just as equally the fault of the Uchiha, who determined that their blood was worth more than millions of innocent civilians, and chose to sacrifice the lives of millions to obtain more political power that they were not entitled to, contrary to how they felt.

Konoha was wrong, yes, but you damn sure won't catch me sympathizing with the Uchiha when they were just as bad. And for the record, I don't hate the Uchiha, I happen to like Itachi, Obito, and Shisui. Most of them were scum though, no different from Danzo, and just a shade under Hiruzen.

Edited by AHK, 10 April 2015 - 01:02 AM.

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