1649 replies to this topic

[ramenanmitsu]

want to see the moment as anti-SS, so of course we would support anything that would suggest that. It is that bias that makes weary to trust any translation from any fan that has shown any favoritism to any ship, including NS.
 
Why wouldn't I trust the opinion of fans of my own ship, because I feel like we are being to closed-minded by this. A lot of us saw it as anti-SS, so we rejected anything that may say otherwise, even if it is true. In the see of fake raws and spoilers, every time something is posted online that even seems to support it as pro-SS, we just call the poster a bias SS shipper and ignore it. Remember when we realized that an SS fan did have the real raws and had translated them? We quickly discard his translation as "another bias SS fan mistranslating the manga to match their own opinions". We then had members on our own site translate the raw, which, coincidently, matched what we wanted to hear. How is having our own guys translate a raw more trustworthy that other fans of opposing ships?
 
I just want to make sure everyone knows that I am not trying to discredit any of our members that attempted to translate the raw themselves. Some of our members do have credibility to them, and several even went the extra mile to explain why certain phrases mean something different in Japanese. However that doesn't excuse the fact that they are still bias to NS. so when they translate the raw as something that benefits us, I feel like I need to be skeptical. Not due to the fact that I don't trust them, yet to be fair. If SS fans are known to eskew translations to benefit their ship, than NS fans have that same possibilities. 

I understand that you didn't mean to offend anyone but can I have a say here? You are right that the people who translated the chapter in this site are NS fans.

Usually, I don't translate the raw, but this time was an exception because someone posted their own translation and said that it's SS when it was totally inaccurate. That is why I came to butt in, because if I hadn't, then the people in this thread would have been depressed for absolutely no reason. Otherwise, after checking the raw, I would just say that I would go with MP translation instead of taking the time to translate myself.

I would also like to say that when I translate, I try my hardest to be neutral as possible by posting the meanings behind the words which are questioned as much as possible. The reason why I'm posting the meanings of words, and what makes them past tenses, is so that it will be easier for the non-Japanese users to search in their own in case they have any doubts.

Also the SS mezzo guy who translated the raw is not Japanese so I do think that I'm more credible but that is only my own opinion. And when I checked NF, a Japanese named TakL who isn't a pairing fan translated the same way I did.

With that said, I know you meant no offense but it is offending when you are telling the whole heaven x earth site that you are wary of the translations made by the translators of this site. It's offending because you're making this statement based on the fact that we are NS fans, and not from the quality of work itself or the time and effort we used. It's also offending because the person who is saying this haven't gone through the extra trouble of translating, but only reading the completed work and then commenting.

I know you meant no harm but I just wanted you to know that it is quite disheartening for people who translated to read that post because I feel like my effort has been absolutely wasted if my work is based on my beliefs instead of the quality(It comes to the point that
I feel why should I put an extra effort to make it a better quality as possible). However, if you feel that there are any discrepancy or mistakes in the translation itself, do feel free to point them out. As I've done in the previous pages, I did a whole lot of editing to make it clear and neutral as possible :)

Anyways, this time it was a special case. I do think I should probably steer clear from translating things for a while and base my opinions on mangapanda like other western fans since then I will be on equal ground with all the other people. Also, this post isn't an attack on you.

Edited by ramenanmitsu, 13 May 2014 - 07:56 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

@arian_rad
 
I don't pay much attention to what opposing pairing have to say about this chapter mainly because the only reason Kakashi made that observation was because:
1- I believe this is the first time he is seeing SakuNaruSasu together in OK terms.
 
2- In the past Sakura will always speak in Sasukes behalf while putting Naruto down, but this time not only did she ask both of the to stop fighting her focus was on Naruto and not on Sasuke as it always was, that definitely draw Kakashi's attention.
 
3- Lastly before the team  7 got apart everyone had a dream so he went over all off them dreams and notice that Naruto got his dream, Sakura no longer seems to be chasing her dream (Sasuke), he notice her affection on desire to save him was still there she loved him so isn't that obvious, but when you think about it if she wants to save him because she loves him them Kakashi's statement about her feelings being different makes no sense at all, so what people should be thinking is how Sakura feels about Ssuke when it comes to romance?
And Sasuke something that in my view is another factor against SS is the fact that not even when Sakura and Kakashi asked him about his new goal he gave them and answer so if we look back on chapter 635 we know Sakura don't trust him, wouldn't this make things even worst for that pairing.
 
Despite that people are saying that SS are celebrating this chapter, why? Are they reading the same Manga or my reading comprehension is that terrible plus none of them is asking why Kakashi never mention anything about Naruto and Sakura's development together and how things when from Naruto being the one she hate the most to what he means to her now.

The sad thing is if their version was right, it only makes this series going to an open ending for pairing wise. That's how bad it has gotten.

I'm sure the upcoming chapters should make things clearer.

[narusaku256]

What does open ending precisely mean? Does it mean that each fandom is allowed to anticipate the endings on their own pairings or does it mean that none of the said pairing becomes canon?

Edited by narusaku256, 13 May 2014 - 07:36 PM.

[harry4e]

Yugao

 

 

I maintain that SS never existed save as a fan created pairing. It was never meant to be more than that.

 

Naruto, Sakura, and Sasuke were meant to represent 3 people moving along parallel lines with each other. Sakura started closer to Sasuke and away from Naruto.

 

But as the story progresses we see Sakura move on a line away from Sasuke and towards Naruto, but also we see her move closer to the center of the triumvirate of the characters.

 

She moves more to being her own character not bound by her realtionships but in balance with team 7 itself She also by default moves closer to Naruto as the relationship blossoms and grows.

 

The key point where she crosses the mid line is for me at least around the POAL, and when Naruto returns. At this stage she has fully crossed the midline and is on Narutos side of the equation and moving even further towards him.

 

As for 540 I still maintain to this day that, that chapter is one of the most misread chapters ever posted. Its clearly meant to be a negative moment referencing her past realtionships and a deconstruction of the SS relationship not a reinforcement of it.

 

 

I agree with you, Chapter 540 can be translated two different ways, One as showing the person she loves as SS fans saw it, or one to contradict what the person who confessed to her said. If it's someone Sakura likes then he must be a great person, Cue showing the first person she liked who is now hellbent on destroying the world, So essentially telling the viewers, no matter how smart and kind you are it doesn't mean you won't make mistakes.

 

Besides Sasuke has not shown he actually cares for Sakura as a friend let alone romantically, unless I'm wrong and only one persons feelings matter, in which case he has himself a Harem. Sakura loved or I still maintain was infactuated with the 13 year old Sasuke, he was everything she wasn't, Infact Road To ninja was a perfect example of what she liked about Sasuke, she wanted the fame, independance, the aknowledgement of being a member of a strong and famous family, now that I think about it, Road to Ninja might actually have been Kishi's way of telling eveyone why Sasusaku would never happen.

 

She hasn't shown she likes the person he has grown up to be,  only Karin likes the current Sasuke, because she's a bit wierd and gets turned on when she is talked down to...would also explain her loyalty to Ocichimaru. All this SasuSaku fight but I've yet to see any person show Sasuke actually likes Sakura at all...he's been prepared to kill her on two occasions, yet he's always hesitated with Naruto, doesn't that mean he loves Naruto? Wait I'm walking a dangerous path here.

[TouKen4Life3g]

What does open ending precisely mean? Does it mean that each fandom is allowed to anticipate the endings on their own pairings or does it mean that none of the said pairing becomes canon?

No pairings will happen at the end and the battle of who will end up with is forever debate.

[Don-kun]

ramenanmitsu
You are so wrong, people here appreciate the effort you put in translating this manga to clear some doubt so is no fear to condemn everyone because of one person. I spend almost 8 months on 15 days without being able to reply the way I wanted to other users mainly because I was away from my home and with an expensive access to the internet so believe when I say that is not the first time I notice some users trying to bring down the fandom believe me is not the first time.
So again don't make the ungratefulness of a few derail or put in question the appropriation of hundreds.

Edited by Don-kun, 13 May 2014 - 11:17 PM.

[Don-kun]

The sad thing is if their version was right, it only makes this series going to an open ending for pairing wise. That's how bad it has gotten.

I'm sure the upcoming chapters should make things clearer.

Am not Kishi but the though of an open ending does not cross my mind at all despite what the anti big three try to say.

I mean why waste so much time asking questions about feelings in the Manga if at the end you will throw it out the window, that's st**id to me.

Edited by Don-kun, 13 May 2014 - 07:47 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Am not Kishi but the though of an open ending does not cross my mind at all despite what the anti big three try to say.
I mean why waste so much time asking questions about feelings in the Manga if at the end you will throw it out the window, that's st**id to me.

It is dumb but it has more harm if you managed to have Sasuke fallen in love with Sakura on the spot. So the lesser of two evil is open ending. Sometimes, you just have to leave it open to avoid the bs.

[Hiraishin]

What does open ending precisely mean? Does it mean that each fandom is allowed to anticipate the endings on their own pairings or does it mean that none of the said pairing becomes canon?

The latter.

[narusaku256]

No pairings will happen at the end and the battle of who will end up with is forever debate.

Oh alright! Thanks! But what really makes you think, things are tending to be open ended, given the latest chapter and the developments we've got!

@Hiraishin: Thanks to you too

Edited by narusaku256, 13 May 2014 - 07:54 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Oh alright! Thanks! But what really makes you think, things are tending to be open ended, given the latest chapter and the developments we've got!

I'm only saying if Sakura remains the same forever.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

Am not Kishi but the though of an open ending does not cross my mind at all despite what the anti big three try to say.
I mean why waste so much time asking questions about feelings in the Manga if at the end you will throw it out the window, that's st**id to me.

NaruSasu has a lot of development he cant just throw it out of the window.

[narusaku256]

I'm only saying if Sakura remains the same forever.

Oh alright! I see remote possibilities of open ending, to be honest. Because we have seen NS development, so the chances of open ending seem to be low.

[megi]

I keep seeing translations from people who aren't even Japanese or a native Japanese speaker or don't have any credentials to do Japanese translations and it is a great discomfort to me. I don't care whether you are in the "NS fandom" or the "SS fandom". I see it in the NS fandom because I am a part of it. It makes me uncomfortable to see people with ~a few years of Japanese or went to Japan for a bit and suddenly they're all experts of the nuances of the language. How the Japanese are treated by the Western fandom is terrible. People have to stop it with the language and culture claiming over one conversation in one chapter of one manga.

 

I can't believe people are second guessing ramen, someone whose native tongue is Japanese, are guessing that his translation is biased to NS? Someone thinks that he would twist his own language for something like this? It is ridiculous, and I'm really sorry that ramen has to go through that.

 

My allegiance is always to translation and the script above even NS. The fandom is crazy. I was literally called a delusional Japanese because I said that 彼女 meant girlfriend. People also have to stop bringing up "SS script" or whatever. If the script is wrong, say it is wrong and let it go. There is one script, and that script is not biased. Stop bringing in incorrect translations if they are incorrect. And Japanese people are not tools for your fandom battles.

[Don-kun]

NaruSasu has a lot of development he cant just throw it out of the window.

I believe he gave and answer saying that this pairing might not be well revived by the audience or something like that if am not mistaking plus in many chapter he made it clear that they are just friends and don't forget the chapter where Naruto almost puke when he was reminded of his passionate kiss with Sasuke so there you have it.

[Verilance]

That is just sad, anyone who doesn't know the word means girlfriend has not read enough Shojo lol. Seriously though as someone who has struggled to learn Japanese I am grateful that some of you (Megi Ramen and others) would take the time to come to our little corner of the internet to help us with some of the nuances of the language.

Edited by Verilance, 13 May 2014 - 08:18 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Seriously, it's wrong for people to accuse on native language users in here or anywhere. I feel bad because it feels like they are not respected well and always should be equal ground, not something like "oh you're weak in this. Let's ask this person. His is probably 30% more accurate." Ramen did it justice and I don't see why dwell on more translations. That's why I described this situation as a South Park because one seem can't to accept the result.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

Russian prediction of 576 from german Krautchan int board.

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 13 May 2014 - 08:24 PM.

[Hiraishin]

I agree with megi. It's ridiculous that native speakers of Japanese are accused of intentionally mistranslating their own language. I'm sure they get frustrated by the way words are mistranslated and/or misinterpreted, so I highly doubt they would do something like that just for the sake of a pairing. I trust the Japanese speakers here. People should appreciate the fact that they graciously do translations at all, and I'm sure they take the time to make their translations as true to the source as possible, so I don't doubt them, especially when they take the time and effort (like ramenanmitsu did) to explain the words and nuances for those of us who don't speak Japanese. I just feel bad that you guys have to deal with those accusations.

Oh alright! Thanks! But what really makes you think, things are tending to be open ended, given the latest chapter and the developments we've got!

@Hiraishin: Thanks to you too

Sure!

Edited by Hiraishin, 13 May 2014 - 08:40 PM.

[Gojira]

NH fans are pretty desperate in terms of argument

NH fan : "They're canon because they held hands"

Me: "The hand holding was to give her chakra, that was the whole point"

NH Fan: "No it wasn't look at the volume cover do you see him giving her chakra there?"