19964 replies to this topic

[Shadow1275]

Naru/hina can still happen, but until We get a panel where Naruto shows any kind of emotion towards Hinata hinting at love, then his feelings remain the same. As of now NaruxSaku has more evidence and more going for it than NaruxHina. This is a fact.

Now some people may exaggerate Hinata's bad traits which is wrong. But thats not because Hinata is a bad character, she is just underdeveloped. She has plot points such as her relationship with Neji and her father. However, these are not explored as much of her character revolves around Naruto. Sakura's character does revolve a lot around Naruto and Sasuke, but this is because the story revolves around team 7. She also has other plot points not involving Naruto such as her relationship with Chiyo. Hinata is in no way a bad character, she is just not developed fully which is the difference between Main and Side characters. As of now I would say that NaruxSaku still has the advantage. However, depending on what Kishi decides, this could change. My main point is that until we get a panel that shows otherwise, Naruto's feelings cannot be considered different.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Due to battery dying, I'll quick reply: one NS moment to end, Hinata never have a lot going for since in part 1, it resolves on its own, but part 2 extended her role alas stretch, and I think a lot of people may have misconception that she's a love interest. The answer is coming in the next volume.

Edited by NaruSaku4Life3g, 05 April 2013 - 11:48 PM.

[Baguette]

@Dkey
Due to the sheer amount of images used throughout the debate, I'm going to have to split it up into four consecutive posts. May the mods have mercy on my soul.

Oh, I should probably cite everybody whose work I plagiarized for my response :
-Sojobo: Dragon Quest/Naruto comparison (sorry I didn't ask beforehand)
-Slextrem : What makes Sakura tick; Hinata's Pain confession; Kurama's role in 615; EVERY SINGLE NS IMAGE;
-Inferno180: What does he think Naruto is doing about Sasuke this whole time?
-I probably forgot a few people.

Honestly, the only substantial content I contributed to my own responses are the parts regarding parallels.

Anyways...

[Baguette]

Then why write in Hinata's character and keep her alive?

For relationship drama in a shoen jump manga?

I would've thought that you'd know how common these types of romantic subplots and love triangles/squares are within the shonen genre. Even the general format of the subplot that exists within the Naruto series has already been done by past series. For just one example, look at Dragon Quest, the manga adaptation of Kishimoto's favorite video games series:

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Poppu/Naruto :


Pop begins as a coward who runs away from fights, but he later grows as a powerful character throughout the story and gains true courage. Pop falls in love with Maam as the story develops.
His desire to become a powerfull mage is boosted by his love for her, so he can protect her and his friends.
Like characters such as Naruto he often times acts like an idiot, can become quite rude, and acts like a pervert.
Maam's love for Hyunkel hurts him a lot, but he tries to hide that from her.


Maam/Sakura :


Maam has rose hair, great physical strenght and a talent for healing magic like Sakura in Naruto.
She's one of Aban student, and travels the world with Poppu and Dai. She is rather weak in battle at the outset, but her caracter as a woman isn't the easiest. She is quite temperamental and often times inflicts comedic violence on Pop.

She is in love with Hyunkel, and doesn't really like Poppu in the beginning, but she begins to care about him little by little as the story develops.
Later in the manga, she doesn't really understand the nature of her feelings for him, and she also doesn't see his feelings for her, which hurts Poppu a lot.


Hyunkel/Sasuke :

Hyunkel's parents were killed in a monster attack, but one of the monsters took him in and raised him like a son. Like Sasuke (whose personality he also shares), his path involves getting revenge. When Avan killed Hadlar and Hyunckel finds his adoptive father dead, he secretly holds a grudge against Avan, whom he believes killed his father. Hyunckel then becomes Avan's first pupil but, after graduating, unsuccessfully tried to kill his teacher with a technique he invented himself, Bloody Scraid. He was then taken in by Myst-Vearn who brought him up to be General of the Immortal Army, one of the six main armies under Hadlar and Vearn's control. Despite being a villain at the early part of the story, Hyunckel wasn't able to bring himself to constantly torture any female characters such as Maam. After discovering that Hadlar had killed his adopted father instead of Avan, he joins Dai's party.


Merle/Hinata :

Shy, gentle, black hair, and admires and loves Poppu, the proud failure. She, like Hinata, would secretly watch Pop, and knew in the beginning he was courageous.
She confessed and sacrificed her life for Poppu before the final arc. She wanted to know before dying in Poppu's arms the name of the girl he loves (even if she already noticed for so long).
That's when Maam was aware about Poppu's feelings for her. They didn't speak about it after that before Poppu's confession.

Eimi/Karin :


She is part of "the Three Wises" of Papunika with Apolo and Navy, who are in charge of Princess Leona protection.

She falls madly in love Hyunkel. She even says to him that she will follow him even in hell.
Eimi confessed to Hyunkel without having an answer, but in the last chapter, we can see her following him in his journey.

The manner in which the Merle=>Pop=>Maarm triangle plays out is also akin to events in Naruto (albeit with different context & chronology, of course):

Merle jumps in and sacrifices herself for Pop before confessing.

Unfortunately for her, in the end:

Merle inspires and triggers Pop's development, as Hinata does with Naruto in 615, and he proceeds to power up:

...Before joining hands with the others to combine powers. Sounds oddly familiar.

Prior to the final battles, Pop finally confesses

Her response?

Note her similar guilt of causing him pain

And skipping to their exit

All that “romance drama” is indeed pretty common, and it's been done in a similar way multiple times before. Must be the Illuminati.

Because, in reality, she must love Naruto?

I think it's quite obvious. Sasuke makes her wet between the legs, and Naruto is the guy who is always there for her. Use your knowledge of human relationships to understand how this is going to go.

I think it’s quite obvious. Sakura makes Naruto’s wood hard, and Hinata is the girl who is always there for him. Use your knowledge of human relationships to understand how this is going to go.
Yeah, no.

What development? She is going to become a great medic ninja.

That leaves a lot of open territory. Plus... what makes her character tick? For Naruto, it's the gaining and defense of friends. He's a strong sense of justice and loyalty - that largely defines his character. Hinata is largely the feminine example of that and has a strong 'peace-bringer' mindset - that's what makes her tick.

What makes Sakura tick?

Goals, ambitions, and character mechanics are quite general for Sakura. It's like she's just kind of floating along and the whole medical ninja thing is just what she's been good at rather than a serious passion with focused or defined goals.

This argument made me scratch my head. Sakura's drive comes from her bonds. What "makes her tick" is trying to reach a future where her team can be happy together again, and she supports Naruto entirely in order to reach that goal. She even tried to take it upon herself so that he isn't shouldered with the burden of it all. The reason behind why she went to Tsunade for training was so that she could get stronger to support Naruto.

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[Baguette]

This is where you and I draw two completely different conclusions. She is quite concerned about them, and Naruto has been the catalyst for her to develop the courage to do something about it - reference pages (going as far back as the Hyuuga's introduction):

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... And what cynches the deal?

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That was her not giving up and utilizing talk-no-jutsu.

What this fails to show is any situation in which she gives focus or care to her teammates. It fails to show any examples of Hinata’s supposed sense of loyalty to her friends outside of Naruto, and in fact directly involves him in every instance.

And where is the evidence that Hinata has inspired change within her clan?

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While unlikely to have been -only- Hinata who affected this change - she was no doubt instrumental in it. As Neji said... she's 'too kind' and seeks harmony.

While I agree that her bettered relations with Neji after the Chuunin exams helped inspire change within her clan, my gripe with her, once again, is that she herself is not portrayed nor shown as giving thought or focus to any of those things.

The same thing that happens with Naruto's character when you remove Hinata.

He would possibly have been defeated by Neji (seeing Hinata stand up to Neji was an inspiration and catalyst for his contempt of Neji's attitude - while it's possible he would have developed it on his own, it's also quite possible that he would have given out one of the several times Neji beat the bejesus out of him).

Disregarding the fact that this statement is speculation... By the same standards, without Sakura, Naruto would not have had the drive to defeat Gaara. She was the source of his motivation.

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Failing that - pain would have taken him away, the Kyuubi would have been extracted, and the show would be over and everyone would be under infinite tsukuyomi.

My problem with her during the Pain fight lies not in the fact that she interfered, but rather her intentions behind jumping in to interfere. She didn't do it to save Naruto; she did it to confess her feelings so that she wouldn't have any regrets.

Hinata knew that she was no match against Pain; she knew that jumping down there all by herself would be pointless, but she did it anyway. If she truly wanted to rescue Naruto, she could have tried at least gathering other people to assist her. No one else was going to just jump in after her because only the Hyuuga clan could actually see what was going on, and most of them were injured. Her guard, for example, was down with a broken leg. That's why he couldn't stop her from leaving. Everyone else was blind to what was happening to Naruto - that's why no one else was trying to save him (not considering the fact that he also told others to have faith in him and stay out of the fight). She knew that, but still she didn't try to round up a team of less injured shinobi to go down there with her. Sure, a group would still be nothing against Pain, but they could have at least caused enough of a distraction for her to get the rods out of Naruto's arms. That was all she needed to do, as he could have pulled the rest out himself.

That didn't happen, however, and we’re left with Hinata standing in front of Naruto with Pain, an enemy that was capable of completely crushing the village, staring her down. There were still other things that she could have done at this point to save Naruto in this situation, or at least tried to help him with. The anime team did a good job exploring the possibilities with their version of her confession. The first thing that filler Hinata does during her confession is attack the rods in Naruto. If saving Naruto was what she wanted to do, that would have been the obvious course of action. But canon Hinata doesn't do that.

Canon Hinata either wasn't trying to save Naruto, or thought that charging at Pain was going to do something to save Naruto, which clearly wasn't the case. I doubt that Hinata is very stupid at all, and so I believe in the first explanation. She wanted to confess to him so that she would have no regrets later on. She wasn't thinking about what she would do to help him after she confessed. She just wanted to get her feelings off of her chest as she thought that was her last opportunity to do so. That's what makes her confession selfish instead of selfless. She was acting for herself, not for Naruto. She didn't have his well-being in mind. If she did, she would have stopped to think about how witnessing a friend being murdered in front of him, while completely powerless to stop it, would have affected Naruto. Kyuubi or no Kyuubi, she had to have known that that wouldn't have affected him in a positive way, but she chooses to charge at Pain anyway.

Also, she had no way of knowing prior to jumping down there that Naruto was going to unleash the Kyuubi's power. This just proves that she had no intention of saving him. Her plan was to jump down there, confess, and attack Pain (all the while knowing that she stood no chance against him.), none of which had anything to do with actually helping Naruto out of his predicament. Had it not been for the Kyuubi, Naruto would have been left in the exact same position that he was in before Hinata chose to intervene, pinned to the ground with Pain standing over him.The only difference would be that Hinata's mangled body would be laying a few feet away from him. She's incredibly lucky that Naruto not only had the Kyuubi within him, but also that Minato had taken preventative measures to ensure that Naruto did not give in to the Kyuubi’s influene and release the seal. Again, this was all pure luck, Hinata had no idea that any of this was going to happen from her perspective, and yet she went ahead with her “rescue” anyways.

And if we're going to go by the logic of "the show would be over at this point" if she hadn't done what she did, we might want to go back a few hundred chapters:

... and failing that - he would have given into the temptation of putting everyone into a world where they lived in a dream-like fantasy free of discontent.

At this point we can agree.

And how can you be so sure that she fails to see this?

Because if she understood those aspects of his life, she would have known to speak up for Sasuke when the K11 decided to target him, knowing that Naruto wants to save him. She would have been there for him when he returned without Sasuke the first time, and the second time, and the time after that. She would have shown more of an interest in learning about Jinchuriki and how to support Naruto through his insecurities revolving around the Kyuubi.

Further, do you think those things would really get in the way of a relationship? I've lost my parents at an early age, and had some other very traumatic experiences that affect my character. Does that mean that any girl who doesn't instantly know about those things can't be a suitable partner for me? Do I have to choose from the limited list of females in my age-group who were there when it happened or when I drifted chaotically between various mental states?

The problem with some of these arguments is that a lot of real world logic is being misapplied to the mechanics of a story. When two characters develop together in a story, they learn about each other’s pasts, conditions, goals, dreams, motivations, etc., and gradually come to an understanding of who the other person is as a whole by story’s end; the prospect of going back to learn some of these things only after the fact defeats the purpose and pacing of character development.

But regarding your past...I can't claim to know how it feels to be in your position. I may have gone through the loss of a few close friends and relatives in the past, but to lose both your parents...that's something I can't imagine myself coping with, not to mention all the financial complications such a situation would entail. For that you have my respect and condolences, for whatever it's worth.

[Baguette]

Since we're discussing why A is or is not a better option than B ... let me ask where the display of inherent understanding, compassion, and support from Sakura is.
If she knows and understands the challenges he's faced in his life and the things that still chew deep into his character... why does she seemingly keep him at an arm's length?

...Really?

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[Baguette]

I really don't think Hinata's admiration of Naruto is half as idealistic as you seem to think it is. And I think she understands him far, far more than you give her credit for:

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Which leads us to:

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Now, Itachi is somewhat of a hypocrite in that regard... but it's apparent that this issue is plaguing Naruto until:

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Sakura tried to address this issue in Naruto's character, and failed (because she -doesn't- understand what makes Naruto tick):

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Epic foreshadowing, that last panel with Sakura in it...

Anyway - that leads us to Sakura's attempt to get Naruto to see the same line of reasoning (that he shouldn't be doing everything on his own):

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Sakura tried. And failed. Because she does not understand Naruto.

Itachi tried to explain it to Naruto, and he 'got it' - but it didn't take hold.

Hinata knows how to speak Naruto's language, and cut straight through to the heart of it. I'm tired of posting manga pages, and I'm sure those are fresh enough in everyone's mind that I don't need to go back to them.

Like you said, Itachi and Neji spoke to him about the same issue. Hinata, sharing and understanding Naruto's nindo, is able to build off on what Neji says before his death, and present it to Naruto so that he could finally come to grasp the significance.

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"That's my ninja way too."

And if we're talking about who made the final cuts and got through to his heart, that would actually be Kurama:

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And how hasn't she done this? As I already stated - the consequence of develping toward Naruto is also a development of her independent character. She's not standing in his shadow - she's not really even idolizing him, anymore. She sees herself as an equally relevant person - that she has achieved parity with him (at least in terms of character).

Again, the issue here is that she never develops independently of him; every single instance of her character progression is of direct relation to Naruto. All of her development relies on Naruto, hence standing "hand in hand" rather than her standing on her own as a character.

Perhaps, but neither of those are likely to change.
What is Sakura going to be able to do that will make her feel deserving of Naruto?
What is Naruto going to do that is going to make him feel like he's made Sakura happy enough to be 'deserving' of her?

You speak as if their character development together will simply be left as it is from now until the end of the series. The whole point of having closing development for characters, as is currently happening, is for them to resolve their uncertainties and fulfill their convictions. That entails Sakura fulfilling her wish of aiding Naruto in a significant way, and Naruto resolving his guilt regarding his feelings. We are, however, both speaking speculatively regarding this issue, as neither of us can predict exact future events within the manga.

It's quite obvious, from the beginning, that Hinata and Naruto's characters were designed to inspire and complement each other. It's been that way since the beginning (see above). That's not a writer-forced love triangle. It's what we call "theming."

On the topic of "theming," refer to the end of this post.

You're running off on a non-issue.

Most people marry individuals relatively new to them. They may take a few years to get to know each other - but the two start as relatively fresh acquaintances and build the foundation.

Again, real life logic cannot simply be applied to this type of story writing. By the end of the tale, the two characters leave with an understanding of not only one another's beliefs, but who they are as a whole person- their quirks, flaws, etc. There does not exist, unfortunately, "a few years" for them to get to know each other after the series has ended. The "foundation" of the relationship exists as on-screen development within the actual story.

So, out of all of those, one was actually a pairing. The others were a running gag or formed the catalyst for a war that cost the lives of tens of thousands.

Every single time Hinata has been shown in the manga, it has been to draw a parallel between her character and Naruto's.

Kishimoto doesn't even bother putting her in the series unless it is to say: "These two, right here, are made of the same stuff."

You're missing the point of the Obito/Naruto parallel. The themes of the story are that whereas Obito did not achieve his original dream of becoming Hokage and getting the girl, and goes to the point of abandoning his ideals, Naruto will succeed and will not become another Obito.
It feels as if you're disregarding the subplot surrounding Jiraiya and Tsunade altogether. Just a running gag?

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We're allowing movies into canon, now?

So, you're basically saying that Naruto needs another hot-headed personality to pair with his own?

That's not, in the slightest, the relationship between Minato and Kushina. Minato was the level-headed, 'cool cat' while Kushina served as the blitzing berzerker.

The plot of the movie is of course not considered canon. What it does prove is Kishimoto's intent on establishing a parallel between MinaKushi/NaruSaku. The thing is, we shouldn't even have to use the movie as evidence of the NaruSaku/MinaKushi parallel, as it was clearly established within the canon manga itself. But despite the fact that being part of this parallel does not automatically have to mean that NaruSaku will become canon, some fans considered it important enough to try and twist it into a NaruHina/MinaKushi parallel.

With the movie (which I have in the past stated should not be used as evidence of the likelihood of a pairing itself), NaruHina fans can no longer make such an assertion, as here Kishimoto makes it abundantly clear that he intended to establish this parallel between NaruSaku/MinaKushi from the beginning.

Sakura kidnapped by Tobi and chained up in the exact same manner Kushina was, Naruto putting on the kage cloak in the exact same manner Minato did his final night, Naruto saving Sakura bridal style the same way Minato did Kushina, Naruto beating Tobi with the exact same move Minato did Tobi. And then Naruto says that a kids job is to surpass his parents? Then Kishi flashbacks MinaKushi’s final night at the same time.
Why does he put these painfully obvious parallels into the movie?

Again, proof of a specific pairing being canon within the manga? No.
Proof of the author having intended a specific parallel within the manga? Yes.


You seem to be of the philosophy that opposites complement one another in a relationship. If we are to apply real world logic into this, as you are so inclined to do, then I should mention that multiple studies exist to prove such assumptions wrong. Psychologically, people prefer to look for others who are of similar personalities and attitudes to be in a relationship with.
Even in the fictional NarutoVerse, opposites don't necessarily attract.
-Asuma and Kurenai were both level-headed, confident, and intelligent individuals. That did not prevent them from being part of a stable relationship that ultimately resulted in a child.
-A fan favorite pairing, Shikamaru and Temari, consists of two highly intelligent and serious individuals fit for leadership roles.

But let's say we're looking only personality roles within relationships. During Minato and Kushina's normal interactions with one another, Kushina was said to have always been the dominant one, having won almost every single argument between the two of them. Naruto and Sakura's normal interactions with one another run along the same vein, with Sakura displaying the dominant attitudes and Naruto taking on the more submissive role (whining, conceding, etc.) in the occasional conflict between the two. It is only during the most serious of situations that Naruto/Minato actually take on an assertive attitude in speaking with Sakura/Kushina.

By that metric, Ino is in the running.

This argument misses the forest for the trees. It's taking one statement out of something meant to be taken as a whole and grasping at comparisons with it.

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Deep insecurities about her nature....

He complmented her on her nature....

True, it's not a -physical- trait... but I really think you're trying to decode hidden messages in the ingredients list on your cereal box, here.

Rather, I'm taking it as the author has intentionally presented it. (See above)

So, you're telling me that because two characters resemble each other... it's strong evidence that two relatively dissimilar characters (Naruto and Minato) are going to be paired with the respective member of the similar pair?

You're telling me that the -pages- (even entire chapters) dedicated to showing an intrinsic, common character element between Naruto and Hinata - the multiple points in the plot utilized to bring her out of her shell and closer to being an active part of Naruto's life....

are less convincing than a few panels that show some similar poses?

It seems as if you are taking the panels in disconnect to the many statements preceding it, along with the evidence of the author having intended such a parallel within his supplementary works.

And once again, when a mangaka makes it a point to draw such panels repeatedly placing two characters in direct parallels with one another, he gives such parallels even more significance.

Beware of false signs of the illuminati.

Despite being a stab at humor, I still feel inclined to correct it. Not only is the comparison is being made with the anime adaptation of Naruto, but the Cowboy Bebop and Naruto scenes are also both intentional tributes to Bruce Lee movies.

Not really.

This is a "Naruto is in tsukuyomi" thought process where he gets the self-centered idealistic rewards.

Naruto doesn't need to succeed in making another person love him. That's just not a realistic goal, is horribly self-centered, and destroys the idea that Naruto is the one to help bring peace and harmony to the world (since he just becomes another Obito/Madara).

In the same way that Hinata doesn't need to succeed in making someone such as Naruto fall in love with her? Is that not just as unrealistic a goal, not to mention horribly self-centered and contradictory to your view of her as the female counterpart to Naruto's ideals and her attitudes as a "peace-bringer?"
Both arguments here are horribly flawed.

The true success is finding peace and happiness in the relationship he -does- have with Sakura. He doesn't -fail- if another person makes the voluntary choice to not fall in love with him. He fails if he never overcomes that hurdle to find peace and happiness in another arrangement.

Perhaps that is the final lesson for Naruto to learn. No matter how hard you work. No matter what you endure... you cannot make another person appreciate those efforts in the way you might like.

The true success is finding peace and happiness in the relationship she -does- have with Naruto. Hinata doesn't -fail- if another person makes the voluntary choice to not fall in love with her. She fails if she never overcomes that hurdle to find peace and happiness in another arrangement.
Disregarding that double standard...

Bolded: What do you think Naruto is trying to do with Sasuke through this entire story? Is he going to have to learn that, no matter what he endures, he cannot make Sasuke come to appreciate his efforts and turn away from his dark path? That statement goes against the themes of the story entirely.

Again, unless Kishi plans to suddenly teach a realistic lesson with the ending, Naruto is destined not to repeat the failures of his predecessors and the past generations. He will be able to attain the title of Hokage (or whatever status will exist within the future Shinobi Alliance), he will be able to get the girl that he has always loved, he will be able to rescue his friend from the path of darkness, and he will be able to finally break the cycle of hatred that exists within the Shinobi world.

[TouKen4Life3g]

After the latest flashback, I'm convinced that Kishi is making Naruto the successor to all.

[Qia]

Excellent reply. Too bad he won't see it. . Unless you continue the debate through messages.

Edited by Qia, 06 April 2013 - 12:25 AM.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

ry entirely.

Again, unless Kishi plans to suddenly teach a realistic lesson with the ending, Naruto is destined not to repeat the failures of his predecessors and the past generations. He will be able to attain the title of Hokage (or whatever status will exist within the future Shinobi Alliance), he will be able to get the girl that he has always loved, he will be able to rescue his friend from the path of darkness, and he will be able to finally break the cycle of hatred that exists within the Shinobi world.

Surpassing Jiraiya and Obito-emo.
Super wall of text i'm tired maybe i'll read the rest tomorrow.

[Slextrem]

Baguette: That was an awesome combined effort!
I found the arguments that you provided for the parallels the most interesting to read. You had nothing to worry about at all.

[Shadow1275]

@Baguette
Seems like you did a good job. The main point though is that most of his argument seems like it is based on speculation and opinion. For example, When he said that "Goals, ambitions, and character mechanics are quite general for Sakura. It's like she's just kind of floating along and the whole medical ninja thing is just what she's been good at rather than a serious passion with focused or defined goals." The problem is Sakura has always been vocal about her goals, for example the first Team 7 meeting, the hospital scene with Naruto, the panel you put up. The other thing is that he seemed to discount a lot of important things such as the parallel between Naruto and Minato. The main thing is that you countered speculation with facts.

Edited by Shadow1275, 06 April 2013 - 12:39 AM.

[Baguette]

Baguette: That was an awesome combined effort!
I found the arguments that you provided for the parallels the most interesting to read. You had nothing to worry about at all.

Thanks!
And yep, after getting through a debate with someone of his caliber, I honestly don't think anyone can make me lose confidence in this pairing anymore.

This forum really helped pull me out of that temporary state of uncertainty. You guys are like the Hinata to my Naruto

@Baguette
Seems like you did a good job. The main point though is that most of his argument seems like it is based on speculation and opinion. For example, When he said that "Goals, ambitions, and character mechanics are quite general for Sakura. It's like she's just kind of floating along and the whole medical ninja thing is just what she's been good at rather than a serious passion with focused or defined goals." The problem is Sakura has always been vocal about her goals, for example the first Team 7 meeting, the hospital scene with Naruto, the panel you put up. The other thing is that he seemed to discount a lot of important things such as the parallel between Naruto and Minato. The main thing is that you countered speculation with facts.

To be fair, my responses delve slightly into speculation in a few instances such as whether Sakura and Naruto could both get over their guilt of "I don't deserve," though it is backed up with story-writing logic.

Edited by Baguette, 06 April 2013 - 12:47 AM.

[FoolishYoungling]

@Baguette: Good Job! Wasn't that the guy who was calling himself undefeated in debating pairings?

Edited by FoolishYoungling , 06 April 2013 - 12:44 AM.

[redragon88]

Thanks!
And yep, after getting through a debate with someone of his caliber, I honestly don't think anyone can make me lose confidence in this pairing anymore.

This forum really helped pull me out of that temporary state of uncertainty. You guys are like the Hinata to my Naruto

What? We stalk you? That's completely ridiculous. That's most definitely not me looking at you through your window.

[Slextrem]

@Baguette: Good Job! Wasn't that the guy who was calling himself undefeated in debating pairings?

That, my friends, is why you should never proclaim yourself to be better than everyone else.

[Baguette]

@Baguette: Good Job! Wasn't that the guy who was calling himself undefeated in debating pairings?

Actually, I deemed him to be undefeatable after reading some of his past debates where he basically followed one post with another, extending his previous contentions or drawing out a new argument from the previous one. Essentially, he'll never concede, and once you run out of fuel to respond to him, you've pretty much lost. Maybe it's a good thing that he hasn't replied to me

[Shadow1275]

Thanks!
And yep, after getting through a debate with someone of his caliber, I honestly don't think anyone can make me lose confidence in this pairing anymore.

This forum really helped pull me out of that temporary state of uncertainty. You guys are like the Hinata to my Naruto


To be fair, my responses delve slightly into speculation in a few instances such as whether Sakura and Naruto could both get over their guilt of "I don't deserve," though it is backed up with story-writing logic.

True, but that is all you can do with events that haven't happened yet. However, your logic is pretty solid. As for the whole us being Hinata thing, if you don't want any help then we could always let you go through that six pages by yourself.

[HauntedCake]

The similarities that Naruto shares with Dragon Quest is shockingly similar. If NS is to turn out similar to how PM turned out then i'll be dissapointed. She seems to only emotionally love him and is still physically attacted to the bad guy. I personally hate this and would hate Sakura doing this.

"I love you Naruto, but i might still love Sasuke"

Anyway look at baguttes pictures of Dragon Quest above to see what i'm talking about.

@Bageutte Awesome post dude

[redragon88]

That, my friends, is why you should never proclaim yourself to be better than everyone else.

Hey, seeing your new sig of Naruto hugging Kushina make me think: Who is Naruto more likely to have a big emotional hug with, Sakura or Hinata? I think the answer is obvious.

I'm not counting the hug in 450 because that was only from Sakura's side. I refer to who is Naruto more likely to end up hugging with the same amount of love that he showed while doing so with his mother. Apart from Sasuke of course. That brokeback love.