19964 replies to this topic

[StriderC]

I don't think dumb is strong enough to define how bad..just sheer terrible writing and asspulling SS would be.

Agreed. I can't even picture Sasuke being all sweet to her at all. It's so OOC. It's actually sickening to think about considering he's tried to kill her...

[TouKen4Life3g]

Bolded: if you are refering to SS then i'm right there with you. I'd drop Naruto so kittening fast and forget i ever read it.

I'll forget Naruto period. Ok not really, but I don't want to own anything related to it. eBay will be my best friend if it really happens.

[Qia]

Wait, so what do you expect her to do with this battle between Naruto and Sasuke. She's likely not gonna be fighting given she said she's gonna leave it to Naruto to handle... I don't want her to become relevant when Sasuke comes back. I'd be so annoyed...

I'm hoping that she would at least help out emotionally, since it doesn't actually look like she'll be fighting against Sasuke with Naruto (You never know though....).For instance, if Naruto tried to do something like what Hashirama almost did for Madara in the recent chapter, I want her to be the one to make him see his life is important too.

Edited by Qia, 30 March 2013 - 10:00 PM.

[catsi563]

Why isn't Sakura there at Naruto's most needed time? Isn't she his teammate? His friend? Shouldn't she be the one who knows him best atm? Why must she be saved until Sasuke comes?

Just answered your own question. This isnt Narutos most needed time. Just as the Battle against Pein wasnt his most needed time.

The Battle against Sasuke will be his most needed time, and the time he will most need her.

Sasuke is the one who will represent the opposite mind set the need for vengance, and cycle of hatred.

it is then that he will need Sakura more then ever to help him break that cycle.

[MoonStar]

100% agree his treatment of Sakura as a ..... *ahem* "Heroine" has been and still is appauling since the 5 kage arc. However you seem to be throwing in the towel far too early.

That may very well be the case but I can't see a way for Kishi to pull a good NS ending out after this, nor do I have the faith that he can.

Confession, Naruto saving Sakura, Sakura smilling at Naruto when he was uncouncious, Sakura smilling at Naruto showing her happiness when they came back to the village.

She was always at Naruto's side the entire manga when she's not on 615...
It's the same thinking when 615 came and the NH "ROFL KISHIMOTO IS A NARUHINA FAN".

I only agree with the fact that she's not being showed as an heroine but i think it's part of her development, also i hold on because Naruto's battle against Sasuke is way more important thant this battle against Obito/Madara, if she does an huge stuff on the fight of Naruto vs Sasuke it's more enough.

Confession - Caused a huge character regression for Sakura.
Naruto saving Sakura - Assuming you mean when they met Sasuke, I did like this one.
Sakura smiling at unsconcious Naruto - Far too miner to be a "moment" in my eyes.

I don't understand what you mean by "She was always at Naruto's side the entire manga when she's not on 615... It's the same thinking when 615 came and the NH "ROFL KISHIMOTO IS A NARUHINA FAN"." Care to clarify?

That's not good development, and certainly not one befitting of a character who is supposed to be strong and independent. No matter what it always comes down to Sasuke-kun and I can't stand that.

[Shadow1275]

Who's that guy with long silver hair and a 10 ft long Katana who really, REALLY misses his mummy? And goes insane....

A cookie to the first to tell me that Badass's name




Bolded: I don't want her TOO clingy but definatly there for him.

Or better yet him supporting her while she takes on someone. I like the idea of her supporting Naruto, but We need a Sakura moment where she is the focus and Naruto supports or admires her so she seems stronger. This Would also reinforce who Naruto's feelings lie with.

[Turson]

I'm mad. I cannot believe you guys still hold this much faith in Kishimoto after what he's done. Regardless of whether or not it's blatant, the fact of the matter is, NaruHina has been consecutively supported with every chapter Hinata has appeared in since her confession. Subsequently, NaruSaku has been on the receiving end of a pummeling ever since the Pain arc. Can anyone find a good pro-NaruSaku moment since they sat on they sat on the bench in before Inari showed up? I doubt it. Kishimoto sold out to the NaruHina fans. Not only did he completely demolish Sakura's character with these past few arcs, he also made Hinata way more of a herioine than she's been since the start of Part 2. When was the last time we even saw Sakura? AND HE PROMISED THAT SHE WOULD BE MORE HEROINE-LIKE. If that isn't the most insulting thing he could do to the main female, I don't know what is.

Many of you are probably already typing your responses of anger by this point about how "it's all being shown from Hinata's perspective" and "Sakura is being saved for when Sasuke comes", but tell me this. Why isn't Sakura there at Naruto's most needed time? Isn't she his teammate? His friend? Shouldn't she be the one who knows him best atm? Why must she be saved until Sasuke comes? Why can't she be utilized whenever Naruto needs to be consoled? Why can't she ever be there for Naruto and Naruto only? Why only when Sasuke is involved in some way? Kishimoto has outright betrayed and abandoned Sakura's character. I mean Neji's death was contrived for the sole purpose of supporting NaruHina. Hinata was more concerned with cheering Naruto up and holding his "big and strong" hands than her dead cousin lying by their feet. Seriously, Neji's head is in the shot when she's talking about Naruto's hands!

But I digress. If you didn't get it the first time round, I'm mad. He did more damage than good to Sakura's character both storywise and in the eyes of the fans, and he subsequently battered and bruised NaruSaku in every way. Just don't be shocked when Sasuke does a 180 and embraces Sakura saying she's always been by his side or something. Just like Naruto saying Hinata was always by his side even though she wasn't. Lord knows Kishi is probably forcing NaruHina to be canon so abruptly so as to not make it look like a rebound from Sakura.

I'm sure to garner a bunch of hate but I don't really care. This is how I've been feeling since Sakura's fake confession to Naruto.

Great post. It wasnt so long ago... before chapter 540 I was certain that NS is gonna happen. The spirits on this forums were so high back then, we were just looking for final confrimation. Currently... I believe that NS still has a chance and I would love to see that happen, but my mind is telling me that its highly unlikely. Kishimoto has focused on Hinata way too much, he even killed Neji in order to bring Naruto and Hinata closer. Yeah... things arent looking so good.

[swagosaurus]

That's not good development, and certainly not one befitting of a character who is supposed to be strong and independent. No matter what it always comes down to Sasuke-kun and I can't stand that.

About this; the whole reason she went after Sasuke in the Kage summit arc was because of Naruto, and Naruto alone.

I've made too many LAPs about the confession and everything that follows, that I don't really want to talk about it anymore, but the fact of the matter is that it's a point for NS and not against it.

If you look at it with an optimistic perspective, and given the information we've received, Kishi's perspective, for the confession, it's a pretty fantastic moment for Sakura as a heroine and as a character.

And about Neji dying to bring Naruto and Hinata closer; there was no difference in their relationship from 615 compared to the rest of their moments. I think we all need to realize that Kishi knows how popular a character Hinata is; she needs some decent closure if Kishi wants to keep his manga as popular and successful as it is. Sure, it's just a simple side character, but she's RIDICULOUSLY popular, both inside Japan and outside.

Funny enough, the only times Naruto and Hinata get a decent moment together is when something extreme happens; Neji's death, her own almost-death, the destruction of Konoha.

Edited by swagosaurus, 30 March 2013 - 10:18 PM.

[StriderC]

Great post. It wasnt so long ago... before chapter 540 I was certain that NS is gonna happen. The spirits on this forums were so high back then, we were just looking for final confrimation. Currently... I believe that NS still has a chance and I would love to see that happen, but my mind is telling me that its highly unlikely. Kishimoto has focused on Hinata way too much, he even killed Neji in order to bring Naruto and Hinata closer. Yeah... things arent looking so good.

For me personally, I still feel that NS is the endgame couple, but given the focus he has given on NH, and the lack of NS, I've come to care a little less about pairings because he's crippled the NS bond IMO. They've barely interacted in this war, and Sakura as a character hasn't done a whole lot either. It's actually saddening to be honest, and he gives Hinata the pleasure of giving Naruto a pep talk, being the first to receive chakra from him, and he spouts unbelievable lines like "You've always been there". : It's a bunch of BS fanservice and what's more, you knock the focus Sakura does have on him right out the park right along with Naruto's. I'm sure this is only temporary, but again, he's basically crippled their bond IMO. It's not as awesome as it used to be... That's the frustrating part about it all.

[StrikerTheNoble]

Great post. It wasnt so long ago... before chapter 540 I was certain that NS is gonna happen. The spirits on this forums were so high back then, we were just looking for final confrimation. Currently... I believe that NS still has a chance and I would love to see that happen, but my mind is telling me that its highly unlikely. Kishimoto has focused on Hinata way too much, he even killed Neji in order to bring Naruto and Hinata closer. Yeah... things arent looking so good.

Come on. This is rediculus. I said it once and I will say it a thousand times. I gave Hinata more screen time and development in the dialogs than Kishi did in the manga. Her moments were the confession and 615. That is not developing. Naruto in both times for lack of a better phrase didn`t give kitten. He loves Sakura and that who is important to him. Hinata is a friend. He killed Neji because... well I don`t know. But it was certanly not for NH to develop. One of the rookies needed to die and I think Neji was the reasonable choice. The Hyuugas still have a spare.

Things are still the same as they were. Naruto loves Sakura and she is falling in love with him. And Hinata is not going to change that.

Edited by StrikerTheNoble, 30 March 2013 - 10:19 PM.

[Awes9]

That may very well be the case but I can't see a way for Kishi to pull a good NS ending out after this, nor do I have the faith that he can.



Confession - Caused a huge character regression for Sakura.
Naruto saving Sakura - Assuming you mean when they met Sasuke, I did like this one.
Sakura smiling at unsconcious Naruto - Far too miner to be a "moment" in my eyes.

I don't understand what you mean by "She was always at Naruto's side the entire manga when she's not on 615... It's the same thinking when 615 came and the NH "ROFL KISHIMOTO IS A NARUHINA FAN"." Care to clarify?

That's not good development, and certainly not one befitting of a character who is supposed to be strong and independent. No matter what it always comes down to Sasuke-kun and I can't stand that.

Completely agree with you, I still believe NS will happen it's just I don't care anymore even if NH happens because Kishi has ruined it along Sakura's character. It's not good writing by any stretch of the imagination.

[Turson]

Come on. This is rediculus. I said it once and I will say it a thousand times. I gave Hinata more screen time and development in the dialogs than Kishi did in the manga. Her moments were the confession and 615. That is not developing. Naruto in both times for lack of a better phrase didn`t give kitten. He loves Sakura and that who is important to him. Hinata is a friend. He killed Neji because... well I don`t know. But it was certanly not for NH to develop. One of the rookies needed to die and I think Neji was the reasonable choice. The Hyuugas still have a spare.

Things are still the same as they were. Naruto loves Sakura and she is falling in love with him. And Hinata is not going to change that.

Im sorry that Im not as sure as you about our final victory, good sir.

[Fenris]

Just a reminder here.

No matter how much Hinata has been shown, there's no sign of Naruto moving on from Sakura.
There's no sign he's falling for Hinata. There's none of it. The only thing that has been causing this controversy is Hinata's feelings and appearance. But, Naruto has loved Sakura since chapter 3. (Or earlier.) There's still no sign from Naruto that this has changed.

Edited by Fenris, 30 March 2013 - 10:26 PM.

[Turson]

Just a reminder here.

No matter how much Hinata has been shown, there's no sign of Naruto moving on from Sakura.
There's no sign he's falling for Hinata.

Yeah, and that what Im putting rests of my faith in. That its not gonna change.

Edited by Turson, 30 March 2013 - 10:31 PM.

[Shadow1275]

Look bottom line is 615 was blown wwwaaayyyy out of proportion. For those of you who didn't read my earlier threads here you go:
I agree that there is a possibility that NaruHina could happen, however I believe that NaruxSaku has a better chance for a couple of reasons. First off Sakura acts very strangely whenever it comes to Naruto in part 2. When she meets Naruto for the first time after the part 1 part 2 gap she admires his height and while blushing admires something else which I think we can agree is his attractiveness. Then during the Gaara retrieval arc she is very protective when it comes to Naruto including asking Chiyo if a Tailed beast could be removed and admitting that she was worried not for Gaara but for Naruto. Third, after Kabuto talks down about how far Naruto will go for Sasuke, she runs full tilt to Naruto in his tailed beast form, then after being attacked wishes she could do more for him, and Yamato then hints at her having deeper feelings for Naruto. Finally, Kushina told Naruto to pick a girl who is like her. Kushina did not like Minato at first, was always punching him in the face, had one heck of a temper, and thought Minato was useless and pathetic. Sakura hated Naruto at first, is always punching Naruto, has one heck of a temper, and thought Naruto was useless and pathetic. Anyone see a pattern here? Kushina fell in love with Minato when she realized that he has always been there for her. Throughout the whole series Naruto has had Sakura's back.

-Now the biggest point of contention when it comes to NaruXSaku is of course the confession. Some people believe that Sakura was lying when she said she loved Naruto. However, after looking at all the facts I have to disagree. Kishimoto had an interview in 2010 where he said two things. One that Sakura still loves Sasuke. However, he also said that he was portraying a stubborn and HONEST woman when writing the confession chapter. When you add this to the fact that in the databook, Sakura's description includes, "is still sorting out her feelings for Naruto," you can't deny that there is a strong possibility that she is in love with Naruto.

Finally here is what we know for sure=

-Naruto has admitted his love for Sakura to Sai

-Hinata has confessed her love to Naruto but received no reaction

-Sakura has confessed that She loves Naruto more than Sasuke. Naruto does not believe her

-Sasuke has always ignored Sakura's affection and has tried to kill her. Not to mention the darkness that has consumed him

-Sakura has not denied Loving Naruto

After considering it all, I think that Sakura has feelings for both Naruto and Sasuke which is why Naruto does not accept her confession. Also, I think the last part of Sakura's development is she either realizes that Naruto has always been there for her and truly cares about her happiness, or Sasuke is redeemed and then she realizes that for whatever crazy reason that Sasuke is the one she has always wanted. In my opinion, Naruto is not going to hook up with Sakura unless she finally believes 100 % that he is the one for her. That being said I think the Team 7 reunion and even her thinking of Sasuke during the war reinforces this theory because she states that her Dream is not Sasuke, but to see Team 7 smile again. Also when she thinks of Sasuke there is a troubled look on her face meaning that she is definitely starting to see the person he has become and showing the inner struggle between her feelings for Sasuke and Naruto.

Either way Hinata is a good character who has a strong character development. The only problem I have with NaruxHina is the lack of development between Naruto and Hinata. Hinata has been in the background until the Pain arc where she made her confession to Naruto. Later however, after Neji dies she slaps him in the face and then holds his hand. Now as for the Hinata development with Naruto, this could change depending on what Kishimoto decides to do towards the end. The problem is with the pain sacrifice, If Naruto hates people who lie to themselves and made his feelings for Sakura clear all the way in Part 1, why did he not answer Hinata after she was revived? As for the hand holding, Neji had been a close friend of Naruto's being one of the Konoha eleven and helping him during the Sasuke retrieval arc. After he died Naruto was shaken and Hinata "helped" him. However, if you look at the manga, it was the Nine-tailed foxe's words that actually made him feel better. http://www.onemanga....o_manga/615/13/ As for the hand-holding, he also held hands with Ino, Choji, etc. The bottom line is the only one who promised not too let go was hinata because Naruto was only tranferring Chakra.

All things aside, NaruxHina is totally possible because Hinata has always loved Naruto, I just think that there is more evidence to the contrary. Why would Kishimoto use up a whole panel to show Sakura's shocked expression when Hinata gave her "pump-up speech" to Naruto and when she found out that Hinata loves Naruto?

Hinata has sacrificed herself twice and she still has not gotten an answer. Now with the Naruto series winding down, Kishimoto does not have the time to develop this. Plus in terms of Sakura's character, Naruto and Sasuke have been two sides of a swinging pendulum and when they fight she will be forced to make a choice. This is hinted at when Naruto tells Sai that he won't confess his feelings to Sakura until he keeps his promise to her.
I just don't see Hinata as a threat but thats just my opinion. Don't forget every movie Kishi has been involved in has been NaruxSaku.

Edited by Shadow1275, 30 March 2013 - 10:32 PM.

[swagosaurus]

So because Naruto and Hinata have been giving each other pep talks, Naruto and Sakura's bond is now somehow lessened?

I understand Sakura has been gone for a while (well, she did contribute alot in the war with the Zetsus and what not), but still. Would you have rather had Sakura slap Naruto and give him a pep talk in 615, then go on to have NH become canon later on?

We all just need a little patience. Sakura's on the battlefield, the Sasuke stuff/the flashbacks are almost over, and we're in the climax of the battle.

[kirabook]

You know, I'm still rereading Kekkaishi and I realize that it seems Kishi has no idea what he's doing with the plot in part 2.

In Kekkaishi, everything seems connected and you can see hints of things showing up full force in later events, and it makes COMPLETE sense. I still marvel at all the super amazing Sharingan uber powers given to Sasuke *and power in general* that had almost no build up before he received it. Even if it was foreshadowed before, it feels as though it's always just given eto him.

But back to my point, I'm sitting here reading Kekkaishi and while some things get pretty complicated sometimes, I feel like everything was planned all the way through. Yeah, there are some unpredictable moments, but they're always well planned and you don't feel like the author had to make a shocking moment just to get readers excited.

But I remember my experience reading Naruto *mostly part 2 in more recent bits* it DOESN'T feel like the events of now are attached to the events prior. In my mind, it's almost like Naruto is divided into sections that barely relate to each other. You have part 1 ,early part 2, and then more recent chapters. Part 1 and Part 2 are very intertwined and almost continues where it left off plot wise. The more recent chapters... (I'd have to say... around the time Sasuke killed Orochimaru and onwards, or maybe around the time Jiraiya went off and died)

I think this is more evidence that while Kishi does have the skeleton of the plot figured out, he's failing really really badly with the details. Details aren't always important, but it's getting ridiculous. The details can make it or break it. I have no doubt NS is in the skeleton, but Kishi is ruining the details that made me support NS in the first place. He needs to plan better.

It really does feel like he's pulling stuff out of nowhere now. I could never drop this manga, not unless it gets to Air Gear levels of ridiculousness, but... I wonder what happened to the Naruto I fell in love with.

[Awes9]

You know, I'm still rereading Kekkaishi and I realize that it seems Kishi has no idea what he's doing with the plot in part 2.

In Kekkaishi, everything seems connected and you can see hints of things showing up full force in later events, and it makes COMPLETE sense. I still marvel at all the super amazing Sharingan uber powers given to Sasuke *and power in general* that had almost no build up before he received it. Even if it was foreshadowed before, it feels as though it's always just given eto him.

But back to my point, I'm sitting here reading Kekkaishi and while some things get pretty complicated sometimes, I feel like everything was planned all the way through. Yeah, there are some unpredictable moments, but they're always well planned and you don't feel like the author had to make a shocking moment just to get readers excited.

But I remember my experience reading Naruto *mostly part 2 in more recent bits* it DOESN'T feel like the events of now are attached to the events prior. In my mind, it's almost like Naruto is divided into sections that barely relate to each other. You have part 1 ,early part 2, and then more recent chapters. Part 1 and Part 2 are very intertwined and almost continues where it left off plot wise. The more recent chapters... (I'd have to say... around the time Sasuke killed Orochimaru and onwards, or maybe around the time Jiraiya went off and died)

I think this is more evidence that while Kishi does have the skeleton of the plot figured out, he's failing really really badly with the details. Details aren't always important, but it's getting ridiculous. The details can make it or break it. I have no doubt NS is in the skeleton, but Kishi is ruining the details that made me support NS in the first place. He needs to plan better.

It really does feel like he's pulling stuff out of nowhere now. I could never drop this manga, not unless it gets to Air Gear levels of ridiculousness, but... I wonder what happened to the Naruto I fell in love with.

Great post, some events seems directly coming out of Kishi's ass, everything is so forced nothing is natural, when you read it it looks so fake and out of the blue that you can only get surprised with such a development (and surprised not in the good sense). Some bonds are forced down our troaths without previous warnings or gradual development that you keep asking yourself "hey how the kitten did we get here, did I miss some chapters or what".
You said it perfectly there's a lack of connection between events and it it doesn't help that sometimes Kishi postpones some events as if nothing happened only to resolve it later when he feels it's time.

Edited by Awes9, 30 March 2013 - 10:47 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

I just feel that the war arc is the one he's having problems with the most because of his habit of closing everything, even the smallest bit will get a closure. Not only that, but the focus gets too out of control because at times, you'll get like 3 boss fights in one sitting. Funny how it works out smoothly in Search for Itachi arc. One thing I feel like at times is that sometimes side characters' developments with Naruto doesn't feel like it exists when it comes to the next arc. It only exists in the following arc. Like Kage Summit Arc. It felt like Naruto is back to square one: Sasuke, and all others (frogs, Hinata, etc.), meh. That's the vibe I get.

[swagosaurus]

I just feel that the war arc is the one he's having problems with the most because of his habit of closing everything, even the smallest bit will get a closure. Not only that, but the focus gets too out of control because at times, you'll get like 3 boss fights in one sitting. Funny how it works out smoothly in Search for Itachi arc. One thing I feel like at times is that sometimes side characters' developments with Naruto doesn't feel like it exists when it comes to the next arc. It only exists in the following arc. Like Kage Summit Arc. It felt like Naruto is back to square one: Sasuke, and all others (frogs, Hinata, etc.), meh. That's the vibe I get.

This. The war arc is definitely the worst one in the manga in terms of pace, development, events and writing.

Hopefully once it's over the manga will revert back to decency, which I think will happen