210 replies to this topic

[ShippudenGirl]

Okay people! Authors don't target a specific individual. If you don't like it then you can't do anything about it. END;

______


I wonder what Tsunade will think of this whole mess. She'll most likely be okay with Naruto protecting the Village against Sasuke, but call him stupid for saying he's gonna die.

Edited by ShippudenGirl, 02 April 2010 - 01:03 PM.

[narukunsakuchan]

anyways everyone back on topic.

I still want to know how sasuke will react to zombie itachi.

Lol I had a crazy thought what if Sasuke learns edo tensei to bring his family back to life lol(Yes I know that would happen just a funny thought.)

[James S Cassidy]

Look, Prime...No WhereMan. Dl316bh has every right to an opinion whether bashing or not. I am not saying anything along those lines. I am just saying that I find it sad that someone is easily wavered into changing their heart about Naruto series all because of a few chapters they did not understand.b(By understand I mean, the reason why Kishimoto did what he did.) Nothing against him personally, but I can't think of a bad moment in the Naruto series.

Every time another twist happens, while I am frustrated at first, I see each chapter exciting and different. A window closes and a door opens and that's what I love about this manga. That is why I started reading it and following. Sure NaruSaku plays a part, but that was something that was a product of it, not the result.

Now these past chapters have closed one door and opened another one. We go some questions answered and got new questions.

We have endless possibilities. We have Naruto going to train with Killer Bee. We have the Akatsuki regaining ranks with their dead men. We got Sasuke who has Itachi's eyes and we have the whole relationship between NaruSaku that still needs resolve.

I have a feeling that Sasuke is not going to find out about reincarnated Itachi until a little later. Which I have a feeling is not going to go down well. Kabuto will probably betray Madara down the line to either gain the power for himself or to kill Madara. Possibly both.

We have Naruto about to learn a new jutsu, plus unlocking the full potential of the Nine-tails. With the help of Killer Bee.

Speaking of Killer Bee, we have Kisame who is hiding in the sword. What's going to happen? I have a feeling Kisame is going to die...for real this time. Either Naruto is going to take him out or Killer Bee.

The battle between Naruto and Sasuke is probably one of the final things that will happen at the end of the manga. I have a feeling Sasuke is going to sacrifice himself to save Naruto. He finally redeems himself, and redeems his clan.

That's what I can gather at this point.

[Dreamer]

Annnddd, It's AKATSUKI THRILLER!!!


Tell me who's watchin watchin, I always feel like somebody's watchin me!!(It's really one of my favorite songs though from MJ not disking or anything)

(Sasori, Nagato, and Kabuto! )

Come on, somebody had to do it!

Edited by Uzumakikage, 02 April 2010 - 02:38 PM.

[Gravenimage]

Annnddd, It's AKATSUKI THRILLER!!!


(Sasori, Nagato, and Kabuto! )
come on, somebody had to do it!

Oh man you're killing me here and what's more funny that you made Deidara the woman zombie and Itachi too haha.

Edited by Gravenimage, 02 April 2010 - 01:45 PM.

[ShippudenGirl]

@James-kun

Yeah, that's how I see it too. Sasuke saves Naruto from Madara and dies in the process, thus a swift redeem for a long-time criminal.
As crazy as it sounds, I think Sasuke really is gonna come out of his crazy state sometime. Maybe for a short-burst if Naruto gets through to him, they fight Madara and Sasuke dies in the process. There really is no way for Sasuke to be redeemed alive. He can sacrifice himself and save the hero. It makes me think of Greek Drama Tragedy.
As for Killer Bee, how can you be so sure Naruto or Bee will train with each other...? They might meet, but maybe Naruto can learn to control Kyûbi on his own. Eh, you're probably right about Bee training him but I'm just thinking up a theory.

[shadow_Uzumaki]

It's also possible that Kisame's infiltration might work and take out Killer in the process. Who knows? Each of the Akatsuki is at least Kage level and there's always a chance that Kisame might catch Killer Bee off guard.

[ShippudenGirl]

Imagine that's how Killer Bee and Naruto meet each other… They both get caught xD

[naruto-z]

Yes.

Actually, in one of the Naruto video games where you can play the Yondaime, you can do the very thing. He charges the Rasengan and then teleports behind the enemy and smacks him with it.

Here is the video and watch him. If you are wondering where he does it it is at 2:35.

4th hokage is such a beast. if naruto learned this, god...i can just see a naruto sasuke battle with all this. it'd be soo cool, better than valley of death battle. and i have an idea of what may happen when naruto does learn the flying thunder god technique (which i'm sure he will in order to fight madara). think of his extreme amounts of chakra and kyuubi. the more high level version of the flying thunder god technique may simply be having the user place his chakra somewhere as in pouring ur chakra into the ground or something to spread to a certain area where u no longer have to use kunai. reason no one used it is cuz no one had enough chakra. and jaraiya told naruto not to use it because he couldn't yet control the kyuubi. so that'd make sense. plus, let's say naruto were to use the kyuubi, he'd be able to travel just about anywhere for a good long distance and using sage mode he could just as easily find people.

[dl316bh]

Or what if your favorite band makes a song you hate? Are you going to stop liking that band because of one song?

I've had that happen. Hell, some of my favorite bands of all time have songs I don't like. I don't listen to them. A song is a singular work, at the same time, that runs anywhere from three to nine minutes, then the artist moves on to their next work. If it's bad, it's bad. Naruto is a four hundred and eighty nine chapter continuous narrative. A singular work. The bad parts drag down the good, know what I mean?

Yes, there is going to be something you hate about anything, but one shouldn't give up on it because of one bad moment.

That's what I've been trying to say though, dude. It hasn't just been because of one moment. If that were the case, I really would not be as disgruntled over the manga as I am or surprised by two good chapters.

I have to ask, what is the point of being a fan if you are only a fan when it is good?

I've seen this question posed many a time in the past. But the thing is, we're talking about entertainment here. Sure, die-hards will say that you should stick by it through the bad, but if it's consistently bad, what's the point? We're still talking about a medium that's supposed to bring enjoyment, not misery or sadness because it's bad. Which is why I've taken leave of reading the series for months at a time in the past.

You don't need to excuse issues to be a fan. To give an example relevant to my interests, I'm a fan of the Teen Titans comic series. That doesn't mean, however, that I'm going to excuse or not call it on the times when it's awful; and, despite how much I wish it was, it hasn't been of a great quality lately. It doesn't make me less of a fan. Just not a die-hard. Same here; I still enjoy the first 3/5's or so of the manga this far and think it's good, but I don't kid myself about where it's gone. I'm okay with not being a die-hard or what some define as a "true fan".

A fan sticks by something through the good and the bad.

I would argue that such is probably more of a "die-hard", really, than a fan, but that's just details, really.

Also everyone has to keep in consideration that one mans trash is another mans treasure.

That's great, more power to you; I'm not going to stop calling it as I see it.

People were wild over the Spice Girls once too; everything has people that like it no matter the quality.

But there is no reason to share an opinion if you have no plan on telling people why you have that opinion unless you are bashing.

I've stated my opinion and my reasons I think the manga's become a pile of ass a good deal in the past. I'm not reiterating them every thread just because someone might get their panties in a bunch. You want to call it bashing? You clearly do not understand the word.

If it bothers you, set me to that handy ignore button; you're not hurting my feelings any, because you're the only one of the two of us taking this conversation a hundred percent seriously.

You cannot say "we've"

You're fun in a "is this guy even paying attention" kind of way. If you'll notice, I've never spoken for anyone else. I've talked about what I think of it. The only time I've used "we" in my past couple posts is in response to your own use of the word.

unless i stop reading it and if I do i will not come on a website that is not only a fan of the Manga but a fan of a pairing and bash it.

You talk like I just joined and came to bash it. I've been here close to three years. In that span of time I've watched the quality go downhill and I've lost a lot of love for a manga I used to be really into. That does not mean that I suddenly have to stop coming to a place I rather like just because some other member doesn't like dealing with someone who thinks the work has gone down the toilet or does not like my opinion.

If I said "In my opinion I don't like you," Would it really matter?

Course not; I really don't give a **** if you like me, so it doesn't matter at all.

Of course not because opinions have no effect on what is REAL.

This is an amusing statement.

If he wants to come to a Naruto site, as a fan of the series but not approving of the developments during the latest part, that is his prerogative.

... Now that I've looked at this post, I have to wonder why I bothered with my responses, since you pretty much nailed it in one sentence here.

Look, Prime...No WhereMan. Dl316bh has every right to an opinion whether bashing or not.

I appreciate you sticking up for me, James; while we don't exactly agree on the terms of fandom and I'm not sure you a hundred percent understand my general outlook on the series, I greatly respect the fact that you're willing to have a calm discussion about it without trying to label me just because we don't see eye to eye.

See my above responses to part of your previous post, as it pretty much covers your second as well.

Edited by dl316bh, 02 April 2010 - 05:43 PM.

[pharix]

I'm curious as to how Naruto and Killer Bee are gonna meet.

I've been thinking...maybe Karin overhears him talking to someone trying to figure out what the "octopus" is?

[RedDelicious]

Another thing i'm wondering is if the person with powerful eyes is not actually Sasuke but somebody else completely, for the Seer who is as old as dirt everyone is young, even Jiraiya so even Maara (sic) would be young in his eyes, or someone else who we have yet to meet. It probably is Sasuke but we could be seeing another twist there.

Too bad the Seer didn't mention how many powerful eyes were involved.
Half-dozen = Danzo, wall-o-weird eyes = Madara.

[Dreamer]

Okay guys I'm starting to see tension slowly building up in this thread, so can we please find a way to make peace. Everyone's open to their opinion of the chapter (as long as their no bashing on other fandoms) and each and every member is suppose to have respect for each other.

Edited by Uzumakikage, 02 April 2010 - 06:42 PM.

[James S Cassidy]

@James-kun

Yeah, that's how I see it too. Sasuke saves Naruto from Madara and dies in the process, thus a swift redeem for a long-time criminal.
As crazy as it sounds, I think Sasuke really is gonna come out of his crazy state sometime. Maybe for a short-burst if Naruto gets through to him, they fight Madara and Sasuke dies in the process. There really is no way for Sasuke to be redeemed alive. He can sacrifice himself and save the hero. It makes me think of Greek Drama Tragedy.
As for Killer Bee, how can you be so sure Naruto or Bee will train with each other...? They might meet, but maybe Naruto can learn to control Kyûbi on his own. Eh, you're probably right about Bee training him but I'm just thinking up a theory.

I can't see Sasuke redeeming himself at all unless through self-sacrifice. Besides that seem to be the whole point of the manga is bonds and friends who don't abandon friends and such. Self-sacrifice is something Itachi did. We all thought he was a bad guy, but in the end he was good. He just had to do what he had to do. Sasuke might be the same way only to Naruto for the very same brotherly thing.

I can't tell you really, but Kishimoto alludes a lot to Naruto meeting with Killer Bee. The fact that they are the two last kyuubi left. They both have this upbeat attitude, so I can see some comical moments between them, the sage frog giving the prophecy of him with an "octopus" which no doubt who he is referring to and few other small signs. I sure everyone else here can point them out, but it's a good and strong feeling that they will meeter and either train or Naruto will be taught something.

I've had that happen. Hell, some of my favorite bands of all time have songs I don't like. I don't listen to them. A song is a singular work, at the same time, that runs anywhere from three to nine minutes, then the artist moves on to their next work. If it's bad, it's bad. Naruto is a four hundred and eighty nine chapter continuous narrative. A singular work. The bad parts drag down the good, know what I mean?

I do get it, but then I don't as well. If I may, these "bad parts" that you point out (Again I don't see real bad parts to the manga, so forgive me. I am trying to be sensitive) can as well enhance the better parts. It's like the saying "there must be a bad side in order to describe the good side and vice-versa."

Maybe if you told me more on what you consider "weak" I will say in the manga and maybe go from there. Is it the parts where they are just lame cop outs or confusing story plot holes? Or perhaps the whole "talk no jutsu" is getting old really fast. Which I agree to a point.

You can say a song is a singular work, but what about the album it is on? Do you consider an album a singular work? Most of the time the song is from one album. Not sold individually. Are you not going to buy said album because of the one song? Keep in mind in relative to the manga, an album only contains perchance 12 to 21 songs depending on who. The manga has a good 500 chapters rounding.

How many chapters did you think were weak? If you say like 20 chapters out of the 500. Then that's like what? 4% of the manga in it's entirely. That's also like saying you don't like the first few seconds of a said song, but love the rest of it.

Now personally, I break the Naruto manga into two parts. Naruto and Naruto Shippuden. They are from the same tree, but different branches. In terms in literature, I considered them seperate the same way one considers the Harry Potter series separate or the Ringworld series...or even the Twilight series. Story stretches between the four books, but they are four books regardless.

I think this is what I don't understand. I have seen people buy a whole album just for one song, but I have never seen someone NOT buy an album because of one song.

I forgot to mention. You say "entertainment," but I ask...what isn't entertainment? Some have their own views on what qualifies, but we all find ways to be entertained. Not judging on your definition, but it's funny when someone mentions a topic and, in technical terms, everything in some way falls under the category. Then we get into the topic of opinion vs opinion and that's where things get hazy.

Dl316bh, I bring up another thing that is relative: Red Sox fans. Ever heard of the Bambino Curse? Some believe in it, but the point is that the Red Sox did not win a world series in 86 years. Even thoughtthey got there several times. The fans never gave up on their team even when they lost. They had fun whether winning or losing.

In short, I understand what you mean, but then I don't understand at the same time. If that makes sense at all.
There are fans and then there are fanboys/fangirls. Fans like the series, but even admit that it has weak points. Overall they like it despite the problems. The fanboys/fangirls will love something no matter what. Even if the said thing betrays them. They will support it even if they have to die for it.

Edited by James S Cassidy, 02 April 2010 - 06:59 PM.

[dl316bh]

Maybe if you told me more on what you consider "weak" I will say in the manga and maybe go from there. Is it the parts where they are just lame cop outs or confusing story plot holes? Or perhaps the whole "talk no jutsu" is getting old really fast. Which I agree to a point.

These are part of it. Also, another thing I think the manga lost focus on in part 2 is in regards to who it is focusing on. The plot just completely meandered someplace around halfway through Part 2, focusing on characters that either had no true bearing on the greater narrative or were being stretched way too long. What I look at in regards to this is the Team 10 arc, where I felt like things were starting to go wrong, and that long, never-seemed-to-end Sasuke arc that didn't accomplish a whole lot. When we got back to Naruto, finally, he... well, one can certainly argue what is in character and what isn't, but I felt like a lot of what we got up until perhaps a couple of chapters ago just did not feel like Naruto. Then we got a bunch of cop outs, plot holes and stuff like that.

The talk-no-jutsu can get annoying as well, but that's not as huge a thing for me. I've read a decent amount of American comics from the late seventies on back. So I'm perhaps a bit used to exposition.

You can say a song is a singular work, but what about the album it is on? Do you consider an album a singular work?

It depends. If it's a concept album or tells a story, absolutely. If it's just an album of your songs, not so much. Jimi Hendrix's "All Along the Watchtower" shouldn't be reliant on, say, "Fire" or "Stone Free. If you're trying to tell a story across your album though, there's a certain pressure on it for the whole thing to hold up.

How many chapters did you think were weak? If you say like 20 chapters out of the 500. Then that's like what? 4% of the manga in it's entirely. That's also like saying you don't like the first few seconds of a said song, but love the rest of it.

It's more than that. I've loosely broken it down in the past to me thinking the first hundred chapters were gold, the second hundred silver, the next hundred or so bronze and the rest into iffier territory. So you might say we're closing on, say, two fifths of the manga being weak to bad with some chapters that were good and restored some hope.

I think this is what I don't understand. I have seen people buy a whole album just for one song, but I have never seen someone NOT buy an album because of one song.

Something to keep in mind is that if things pick up from here and the finale is good, it will help things. But my point is that it will always have it's flaws, just like a concept album that fails to get it's story across in a third of the album, but nails it in the other two. What I think is being lost is that I'm here to enjoy things and if the finale is good, I'm going to say it's good; I'm just not going to sugarcoat the other parts of the manga either. Some people don't like that, that's cool, doesn't bother me.

And I have said the last few chapters have been enjoyable - hell, I haven't even outright mocked it for several chapters now - and I'm reading it each week again, so that does count for something in it's favor. I'm just not going to, again, excuse the past.

Then we get into the topic of opinion vs opinion and that's where things get hazy.

Part of it's definitely opinion, but there have also been questionable technical choices, which were mentioned earlier, that are harder to handwave away.

Dl316bh, I bring up another thing that is relative: Red Sox fans. Ever heard of the Bambino Curse? Some believe in it, but the point is that the Red Sox did not win a world series in 86 years. Even thoughtthey got there several times. The fans never gave up on their team even when they lost. They had fun whether winning or losing.

I don't begrudge those people. If you're enjoying yourself regardless, that's great. But I've also seen fans of that same team get depressed or sad every year when they don't win. I don't see the point in that. Sure, I get taking pride in loyalty and all that, but not allowing entertainment to hurt you because someone else can't get the job done. Same here. Hell, I used to be a huge fan of wrestling, but when it started to go downhill in the 2000's I stopped watching it regularly. Doesn't mean I don't enjoy it, I just enjoy it when it's good and don't sugarcoat when it's bad.

I suppose loyalty to your entertainment or things you enjoy makes more sense to some than others.

What's funny is that this whole thing started over me merely remarking that two good chapters along don't make up for all the crap rolling through the manga over the past couple years or erase the problems it's had, while simultaneously remarking that I hoped this meant a strong finish.

Fans like the series, but even admit that it has weak points.

This is me; I'm just a hell of a lot more blunt about it when things are weak.

Edited by dl316bh, 02 April 2010 - 07:40 PM.

[Gravenimage]

I don't want to cause arguing or a rant that might lead to bashing but I am glad that Kishi is taking his time to bring this awesome story for us to read. I love Naruto and that will never change every chapter gets better and better that's my opinion. If people don't like the manga then why are they still reading it??? if they don't like it don't read it period. Nobody is obligating them to read the manga none of us are contributing on Kishimoto's wallet because were not buying his manga but reading it online for free to be exact. If they don't like how the manga has been going in the past chapters then simply take the conclusion to stop reading if its going to keep on disappointing the audience it's that simple.

But for those who love Naruto let's continue enjoying the manga let Kishimoto run the show like he has. Now back on topic.

Edited by Gravenimage, 02 April 2010 - 08:39 PM.

[dl316bh]

Yup, this discussion is clearly going absolutely nowhere but in circles; let's just drop the whole thing and get back to talking about the chapter, because this is getting rather boring.

[Insurrection]

I'm getting dizzy.

[dl316bh]

I'm getting dizzy.

My apologies for the circular argument; I didn't quite expect it to play out as it did.

[soot-r]

I just love Karin in this chapter. What's even better the akatsuki is back, but what is Sasuke's reaction will be when he sees Itachi as a zombie. This is getting better by the chapter in my opinion.