514 replies to this topic

[James S Cassidy]

Yes i see i'm hoping for Naruto to get the rinnegan because it's time for Sasuke to receive his payback with interest included.

Wait, you don't think he should have the TFG technique, but think he should gain the Rinnegan? I don't get it.

I think you are conflating "hatred" with the "cycle of hatred".
As you say, hatred will never be removed, and there will always be reasons to fight, kill, or do evil.

The "cycle of hatred" is the system that breeds and develops the worst in people, instead of the best.
It puts Danzo in power, because people are afraid and want to feel that his despicable actions will protect them.
It makes Gaara's father turn Gaara into a monster, rather than a defender of the village.
It is the idea that it is okay if civilians are hurt as long as the enemy is defeated, without thinking about how many more enemies will be created in the future by harming civilians.

So I don't think that hatred is being treated as an all encompassing universal cause.
But the cycle of hatred is like a cancer, metasizing more ill for the rest of their society.
And that is what Naruto/Jiraiya wanted to correct.

I have already made several long post about so I won't go into too much detail, but I figure it is not about ending hatred itself, but ending the desire to act upon said hatred. You can't end hatred, but you can endure past it. You can overcome it and I think that is the point where the cycle ends.

Edited by James S Cassidy, 08 May 2013 - 01:41 PM.

[Chatte]

But hw exactly did Obito knew about all this with Rin?

[James S Cassidy]

But hw exactly did Obito knew about all this with Rin?

Perhaps through the Sharingan? Seeing how it can share visions, perhaps it can share memories as well.

[Chatte]

Perhaps through the Sharingan? Seeing how it can share visions, perhaps it can share memories as well.

I am really curious about that detail, to be honest. Because supposedly, he was in shock that Rin died, how come he got to know all this?
I guess you are right about the sharingan part...

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

It isn't really. Not only is it in discordance with Naruto's fighting style (his being centred around utilizing only a few jutsu in conjunction with clones whilst having to perform few handseals; the Rinnegan prides itself upon its technique versatility and heavy utilization of seals) but the resemblance with the sage pertains to their similar philosophies and fated endeavour of bringing about peace in the world. It was never suggested or stated that Naruto would acquire the Rinnegan. By that logic I could state that since the Sot6P was once the jinchuuriki of the Jubi that Naruto will become it as well. However, what do you believe is the likelihood of that occurring?

Actually would be awesome if he could share the rinnegan's powers with his clones and we also never see how the sage mode would fit in with the rinnegan(which probably the former sage of the six paths could have been used to), which would be insteresting more than Kyuubi mode with sage mode because since both have similar powers.

Wait, you don't think he should have the TFG technique, but think he should gain the Rinnegan? I don't get it.

I dont remember what's TFG?

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 08 May 2013 - 01:49 PM.

[六道仙人]

I am really curious about that detail, to be honest. Because supposedly, he was in shock that Rin died, how come he got to know all this?
I guess you are right about the sharingan part...

Don't forgotten that the one who was involved behind the yondaime mizukage's affairs was Obito himself. Kisame stated that Obito was the mizukage who manipulated Yagura... So being the yondaime mizukage through yagura, Obito must came to know the truth about the sanbi and Rin...

Now i understand why he became the mizukage and did all these orrors who gave to the mist the title of "the village of bloody mist"

Edited by 六道仙人, 08 May 2013 - 01:52 PM.

[Chatte]

Don't forgotten that the one who was involved behind the yondaime mizukage's affairs was Obito himself. Kisame stated that Obito was the mizukage who manipulated Yagura... So being the yondaime mizukage through yagura, Obito must came to know the truth about the sanbi and Rin... ;)

Now i understand why he became the mizukage and did all tese orrors who caused to the mist the title of "the village of bloody mist"

Oooooh, now I see. You are right!

[Chatte]

I know that most of you don't think about it, but remember Sakura's role as the human one from this manga and how she cherished the human life? The hting I wrote in my analysis? I am just happy that all this is shown in the manga now, how the fact that keeping your emotions and that old code lead to what it's happening today.

[James S Cassidy]

Don't forgotten that the one who was involved behind the yondaime mizukage's affairs was Obito himself. Kisame stated that Obito was the mizukage who manipulated Yagura... So being the yondaime mizukage through yagura, Obito must came to know the truth about the sanbi and Rin... ;)

Now i understand why he became the mizukage and did all these orrors who gave to the mist the title of "the village of bloody mist"

Or that....I was about say that could have been how he learned of it too. He did have a good twelve years before he started his plan and everything so he could have had some time to figure something out.

[Inferno180]

I'm excited to see what comes from Kakashi vs Obito, this could become one intense fight given Obito is part zetsu. It's literally going to be one of the best battles with the sharingan. Also could serve as a precursor of what Naruto could face in his future fight with Sasuke.

From this chapter though there are a few things that would already be said:

-I loved the panel with the tailed beasts minus the 8 tails, Naruto is still fighting not only for the world but also to save the tailed beasts, I still think that this could be something to counter the ten tails, the will of the 9 tailed beasts against the 10 tails.

-Sakura and Hinata did do just minor stuff this chapter, Sakura doing what she knows best and Hinata gave an order for everyone to join forces, but I wound'nt get so overblown by it, this is what they have been doing the entire war so Hinata is just on repeat, the rest of the shinobi have gotten it by now. They need to protect Naruto, in truth even the readers knew this, its nothing major but everyone was thinking the same thing, they all ran over to Naruto before Hinata said anything.

-Looks like the ten tails recognizes Naruto as the sage because he has a signature of all the tailed beast chakras. It can sense the frequency of the other tailed beasts, all those who gave their chakra to Naruto, including Shukaku who has been out of commission since he was extracted from Gaara.

-Sakura may become a higher target being close to Naruto but as others said as he heals him (and her medical skills are among the best like Tsunades and Kabutos, not counting any zetsu or hashirama instant healing powers) this could be a point for her to do what she said before in 573. I don't even think Sakura would die, there is no point in the story for it. Plus she still has not had her "moment" Some people are getting impatient but this is Sakura, right now the focus of the ten tails fight is Naruto, the relation of him and the rest of the alliance aiding him, still nothing saying Sakura cannot aid him in her own way beyond just healing, she should get that moment in the future, if not here but there will be development between her and Naruto especially when Sasuke comes back into the picture. Even then I don't think the SS scare would come true. Still too illogical and insane for the story logic this late.

-Rin was apparently a jinchurki trap so that the three tails would have broken free and destroyed the leaf when she got back in, those sneaky mist ninja, literally made rin a Trojan horse. Though she has been a Jinchurki, she is still a parallel to Sakura due to being a medic and having the same team dynamic as team 7 at the start. Now it kinda seems like NS should succeed because Obito had done all this not only cause of Rins death, but he gave up on the world. Obito is the pure opposite of Naruto now, Naruto is trying to save the world did not give up on it, he also did not give up on Sakura (most likely for many logical reasons).

So we have another chapter up and gone, still some things can come forward. Though Sakura is healing Naruto nothing saying she won't have her moment in this arc or definitely the reunion when taka and the kages some. This 3 party interaction just looks to have so much of it come forward, I still don't expect her to just go all the way back to Sasuke, she has Naruto on her focus for now. She is still open to get the development to overcome Sasuke even by his change, plus we still don't know everything from Sasuke's view from his recent change. Not to mention we don't know why Orochimaru actually wanted to destroy the leaf, it was not out of revenge as Sasuke said and it has yet to be revealed. I also don't expect anything from Hinata overly major, she had her moment, now its more or less expected she is just present and around as the story goes. Most of the characters right now, they just take a minor role kinda like team 7 and 8 did in the Itachi pursuit arc. Just support roles. If the actions of Sakura, Hinata, and the rest of the shinobi proved anything this chapter, it was a build on what Naruto said last chapter with his friends.

If anything this chapter just moved stuff along, we got to see a revelation about Rin's death that was also not just Obito doing this because of her, because he had lost hope in the world. I'm actually glad he is testing Naruto and denying everything Naruto replied with, makes him seem like the villain we need, doing it for the sake of just being evil at this point. So the story goes on, NS is still green, I'm actually happy with the panel of Sakura healing Naruto, its just more for the buildup section Not to mention that her moment is to come, maybe because of this defense formation, her "No matter what you say this time we will be together, we'll all fight together this time" will come true, I feel its coming here, it was only relayed by Hinata's speech in 615 but what Sakura said would be taking form now, they are in a very bad position, they lost their advantage of the tailed chakra shroud and Naruto is worn out, the ten tails is in full form (possibly?) they are all in danger but they don't care, all the ninja are ready to die for Naruto to succeed. Sakura's role may be coming up, she will have her time and hopefully it will be good. Overall it is nice to see her getting screentime again in these past couple chapters. Aside from all this stuff, I cannot wait to see how the Kakashi vs Obito confrontation begins, hell Kishi could make this confrontation last another 10 weeks, I'd be okay with it!

[Dkey]

I know that most of you don't think about it, but remember Sakura's role as the human one from this manga and how she cherished the human life? The hting I wrote in my analysis? I am just happy that all this is shown in the manga now, how the fact that keeping your emotions and that old code lead to what it's happening today.

As I recall you were talking about shinobi being tools. That was the old way and what was expected of a shinobi to be a tool, not human. But we see the repercussions of the cycle of hatred and this desire to protect. Obito is so in denial with Rin's death that he blatantly calls it a fake. Madara probably reached a similar conclusion by trying to find ways of protecting his brother. Madara failed to protect him and so he started to go into denial. It was helped by the fact that most of the villagers also started to reject his way of thinking.

Anyway the other volume talked about a flaw the current system has and Obito's speech also refers to this flaw. Not sure thou if is this ( the fact that shinobi are used as tools but they're human side get's the better of them and they start to hate) or some other flaw. We also have Sai one who became a emotionless being but Naruto managed to bring him back.

[HauntedCake]

Some people are getting impatient but this is Sakura, right now the focus of the ten tails fight is Naruto, the relation of him and the rest of the alliance aiding him, still nothing saying Sakura cannot aid him in her own way beyond just healing, she should get that moment in the future, if not here but there will be development between her and Naruto especially when Sasuke comes back into the picture. Even then I don't think the SS scare would come true. Still too illogical and insane for the story logic this late.

Bolded: yeah that would be me..

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

Wow, I actually loved this chapter. I know some people are worried about what Hinata was doing, but honestly Hinata AND Sakura are actually doing exactly what they are supposed to be doing during this whole war. Yeah we love pairing drama, but when you have it forced it is very weak and nerve racking. Here we have both Hinata and Sakura doing exactly what they were meant to be. Not just pairing fodder. Sakura is supposed to heal Naruto and Hinata being more than just oogling him.

I still don't like the way Hinata's portrayal of character, but this gets a +1 in respect from me. She still has a long way to go before I finally start to like Hinata again, but this was a step in the right direction. I see no pairing bouts in this what so ever. Just Sakura healing Naruto as she should and Hinata creating a "wall" (as she is....just kidding.XD) If anyone really tried to start a pairing bout I would mostly likely slap them whether it NH or NS because that just mean they are only reading this manga for the pairing wars. Not the story. I hate to admit, but this is what I wanted Hinata doing this whole time. Not that crap she pulled in 615-616. I wish she do more stuff like this.

Sakura and Hinata were both being heroic here.

I second to this but for me the problem is not her being like this, it's how it's portraited like your opinion.
She does stuff with no development at all, the speech which was crap too she didnt had development for that, Neji died yes but no flashbacks or somewhat her thoughts about Neji that would justify what she's doing she's just BAM gives a speech, BAM becomes a leader.
This chapter just proved that, where's her development to became a leader? there's none Kishimoto just shoved on our faces she acting like a leader with no development.
Based on this i have no doubts that soon she will transform into a dragon and defeat the juubi, or even get into the middle of Naruto and Sasuke fight and claims that she understand Sasuke.

Despite that i liked the chapter.

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 08 May 2013 - 02:29 PM.

[HauntedCake]

I second to this but for me the problem is not her being like this, it's how it's portraited like your opinion.
She does stuff with no development at all, the speech which was crap too she didnt had development for that, Neji died yes but no flashbacks or somewhat her thoughts about Neji that would justify what she's doing she's just BAM gives a speech, BAM becomes a leader.
This chapter just proved that, where's her development to became a leader? there's none Kishimoto just shoved on our faces she acting like a leader with no development.
Based on this i have no doubts that soon she will transform into a dragon and defeat the juubi, or even get into the middle of Naruto and Sasuke fight and claims that she understand Sasuke.

Despite that i liked the chapter.

Hahaha funny post

[Atheck]

I think you are conflating "hatred" with the "cycle of hatred"

No, I'm not. Hatred itself is the critical element through which this professed "cycle of hatred" is born from. The CoH itself refers to hatred's existence in the minds of people and how it has perpetuated itself throughout history.

As you say, hatred will never be removed, and there will always be reasons to fight, kill, or do evil.

So you are in agreement then. I only wish that Kishi would acknowledge this fact and attempt to address various other concerns that should realistically be looked upon when discussing the concept of what amounts to a chimerical society devoid of conflict and misunderstanding.

The "cycle of hatred" is the system that breeds and develops the worst in people, instead of the best.

It's one particular method for forging abhorrent individuals. Personally I would say that someone like Hidan is exceedingly worst than the likes of Pain or Tobi. At least for the latter two they have motivations that they perceive as beneficial to not just themselves, but everyone as well. For Hidan he's literally a sadist who takes great pleasure in the suffering that he brings upon others as he preys to his malevolent deity to help maintain his immortality. He has no ethical qualms with this crimes and there is altruistic intention with what he does.

You refer to a character, not born from hatred or any system that fosters ill will like the one being propounded in the manga, that could be denigrated as evil and I would refer to Hidan as evil (quite literally in fact). With hatred you can at least comprehend that those who abide by an "unconventional" approach at life did so with some element of tragedy that you are able to understand and possibly even sympathize with. As horrible as Pain or Tobi's actions were I would place my life in their hands before I did someone like Hidan who oftentimes tried to kill his own comrade IIRC.

It puts Danzo in power, because people are afraid and want to feel that his despicable actions will protect them.

Danzo's organization and actions symbolizes what could be perceived as a "necessary evil". Because despite the infantile ambitions of Naruto and his friends there will always exist that situation where actions which may go beyond what their morality would entail may be necessary. My perception of Danzo is that he's a flawed militaristic extremist believing that his ideology is best. Now is he accurate when it comes to applying those beliefs in a political system? No, at least not in its entirety. I do feel that taking any ideological extremity, including the one which Naruto had to have his companions disillusion him from (in reference to his belief that he was capable of preventing any deaths from occurring), is incorrect.

What would probably amount to as the "best" system to utilize will likely be a combination of the Younger and Older Son's teachings. This includes Danzo's willingness to use military effort in the event that something goes awry. Don't get me wrong, his approach is still heavily flawed. I just believe that there are some elements from his perspective that would logically be applicable in a system that is endeavouring to prevent conflict or carnage. We saw examples of this with Hashirama choosing to put the safety of the village above his "friendship" with Madara and Jiraiya appropriately designating Orochimaru as a dangerous missing nin that needs to be silenced to prevent future bloodshed (which ironically occurred back in P1; the circumstances of which involving Suna did not even pertain to any "cycle of hatred", I believe it was referenced that they were merely disgruntled with Konoha's authority which would be classified under the intention of power seeking).

It makes Gaara's father turn Gaara into a monster, rather than a defender of the village.

I can't really dispute this. His father's approach to instilling Gaara with the necessary capabilities for protecting Suna did somewhat backfire on him although given how jinchuurikis in general were disparaged and alienated from society I think he would still experience some emotional tribulations even if his father decided to assume a more direct and affectionate method for training Gaara. It just wouldn't be as severe as it became in the manga.

You could attribute Gaara's suffering to Chiyo as well since she was the one who burdened Gaara with the status of jinchuuriki in the first place. Gaara's father merely gave the instruction to do so. In some ways Chiyo is even more responsible for Gaara's suffering than his father.

It is the idea that it is okay if civilians are hurt as long as the enemy is defeated, without thinking about how many more enemies will be created in the future by harming civilians

Yes, but you also have to factor in the emotional, mental, and intellectual factors behind each individual's response to a situation. Properly educating the populace with the reasoning as to why so-and-so happened and attempting to reach out to them with emotional support would likely yield, at the very least, some benefit in averting anyone from becoming like Pain or Tobi again. Because as we see with the likes of Gaara it is possible to alter the mindsets of those afflicted with some form of suffering.

Not that this approach would prevent all possible criminals from being born but my presumption is that it would significantly reduce the amount of them that exist currently.

So I don't think that hatred is being treated as an all encompassing universal cause.

But you didn't really address my points about there existing other motivating factors behind someone choosing to become "evil"; neither has Kishi really. But if you want to please refer me to the segment of the manga where he makes an effort to directly address the issue of these other motivating factors.

Actually would be awesome if he could share the rinnegan's powers with his clones

Forgive me for saying this but your sentiments in that regard are irrelevant considering that Kishimoto has made it a point to establish Naruto as a character who doesn't require KG or any special abilities to become a powerful shinobi. Granted that point has been contradicted somewhat with the most powerful bijuu's chakra sealed within him being available to use at any time as well and recently with the realization that he is a descendant of a prestigious clan who specializes in advanced sealing techniques and possess a naturally large amount of chakra.

I would like to see Sakura's superhuman capabilities become incredibly more powerful, including her speed, whilst providing her with some additional skills like advanced genjutsu abilities, some elemental ninjutsu, Slug Sage Mode, and possibly the ability to unlock the inner gates to compliment her taijutsu skills but you don't see me attempting to affirm that opinion as being probable. I realize the unlikelihood of Sakura even receiving any additional power ups, as much as I hate to say that.

and we also never see how the sage mode would fit in with the rinnegan(which probably the former sage of the six paths could have been used to),

I'll grant you that SM, considering the enhancements to all of a character's stats that it provides, would greatly compliment the applications of Rinnegan. However, no insinuations were made to suggest that the Sot6P knew how to use SM. If this statement is incorrect then please provide the chapter and page number pertaining to the reference of the Sot6P being able to use SM.

which would be insteresting more than Kyuubi mode with sage mode because since both have similar powers.

They have different enhancements, different extrasensory capabilities, and different aesthetics. Not to mention there's the possibility of fusing with Ma and Pa now who offer their own repertoire of techniques. Regardless of what you or I think though we were provided with a blatant display of Naruto using both modes in conjunction back during the Invasion of Pain arc. There's more evidence to reinforce the prospect of Naruto combining the modes together than him receiving a discrepant powerup which he cannot even obtain without first extracting the Sharingan from someone else and then implanting it into himself. That's an action that we would never see from someone like Naruto.

But the cycle of hatred is like a cancer, metasizing more ill for the rest of their society.
And that is what Naruto/Jiraiya wanted to correct.

Yes, it is a very significant predicament. That wasn't my point. I was referencing the fact that there exists other motivations for people altering their mindsets to where they become iniquitous aside from them hating one another or seeking to apply their brand of "justice" on others for a past wrong that was committed either in war (Chiyo's initial attack against Kakashi) or during a "treacherous" act committed by someone else or an organization (Sasuke attempting to avenge his clan).

[Inferno180]

I second to this but for me the problem is not her being like this, it's how it's portraited like your opinion.
She does stuff with no development at all, the speech which was crap too she didnt had development for that, Neji died yes but no flashbacks or somewhat her thoughts about Neji that would justify what she's doing she's just BAM gives a speech, BAM becomes a leader.
This chapter just proved that, where's her development to became a leader? there's none Kishimoto just shoved on our faces she acting like a leader with no development.
Based on this i have no doubts that soon she will transform into a dragon and defeat the juubi, or even get into the middle of Naruto and Sasuke fight and claims that she understand Sasuke.

Despite that i liked the chapter.

Maybe its all an asspull to give Hinata development to be the leader of her clan? All at the cost of Neji? Still the fact that she has no idea about Sasuke or any correlation with him just makes her that much harder to justify as being important. NS is at least entwined with the central plot of Naruto vs. Sasuke, heck even SS is worse than NH and it has more priority than NH does. If there is any reasonable development for Hinata possibly going into a leadership mode, its to end her development displaying a leadership position like her father so she can take the head of her clan. If most are saying Hinatas role to Naruto is encouragement (and even in the manga that is what it tended to be) then Hinata's character could have been going from having no confidence and being in the back to having confidence and leading the front. This makes a good understandable end development with her. In fact without Naruto is possibly better (hinata really needs to do at least one thing not focused on Naruto and yet I feel its too late for that). Kishi can just make Hinata's end development come forward with her acting like a leader becoming worthy to take the place as head of the clan, he can even make NS come and Hinata simply be happy for him, she is still a minor character no matter how people try to justify it. She still only has what, only like 5-8 or so real chapters of importance in part 2? I can understand kishi putting Hinata around either on his own will or due to the editors because of how Hinata fans act like she is the second coming of Jesus or whatever, they see one panel even unrelated to Naruto and think NH canon! (if we go by the really insane fans).

I mean Sakura is the heroine still, people try to act like Hinata is, but the hinata they love does not exist. Hinata still loses more credibility being developed more in anime fillers than canon material. Her past with Naruto, fighting pain, etc None of that technically happened, manga is the original source, manga is the canon material. Sakura is in the majority of that material and her development has been shown again and again. I repeat, Sakura was sidelined and has not been as active since the 5 kage summit save for her role in the white zetsu event but people need to realize this: If Sakura is not the heroine, how does Hinata plan to make up for 332 consecutive chapters of no importance? Shoundn't she as a heroine as people claim have more importance than just 5 or so chapters and 2 short moments in part 2? Heck if Hinata wants to be proven as a Heroine, she would need another arc with a lasting and important role like the chunin exams, but its too late for that too. There are times when we think Sakura is not the heroine, but she still is. The deal with kishi is, Sakura has a good skill set but he just never chose to use it to a bigger degree than the Sasori fight. He did use Sakura a lot but developed her mentally rather than physically most of the time. Plus any shortcomings he has on Sakura just makes all the other female characters look weaker by comparison save Tsunade and Kushina, Tsunade is well established for herself. Both Tsuande and Kushina also have important occupational roles and had the mentalities to back them, they are exempt from this in a way. All other female characters suffer under shortcomings from Sakura though, if Sakura takes a hit with credibility, it makes it harder for the other female characters. I mean people say Sakura is still focused on Sasuke, Sakura at least looks 2 ways between herself with both Naruto and Sasuke, when has Hinata ever looked at anyone besides Naruto? Its that simple.

[Shadow Wolf]

Hmm... interesting... OK, so I know we usually seek parallels for couples and stuff, and also for characters. Did anyone else found the "kage" parallel between Naruto, Gaara and Tsunade?

There's also something I'm wondering. Yes, Naruto is out of chakra. However, we can see the vision of the tailed beasts and the eyes of the Sage of teh Six Paths reflected in him. Is this actually what the Ten-tails is seeing in him? After all, it is right after these panels that he prepares to attack.

Hehehe... on a personal opinion, Madara sometimes ticks me off. He sensed Hashirama and now he loses interest in fighting the alliance. Hey, if you desire to battle so much, why not get yourself in Reaper Death Seal, hahahahahaha.

One panel for Hinata... one panel for Sakura with Naruto... Naruto thinking about everyone... all good.

Finally... Kakashi vs Obito... I have to wonder if Obito learned about the weakening of the Jinchuuriki seal in this very village. After all, if the same plan was meant for Rin (speaking about unleashing the Three-tails in comparison to releasing the Nine-tails) then it would make a bit of sense on how he gained the intel. That aside, Obito's words remind me a lot on the movie Inception. His denial of reality goes as far as to call the real world fake. And with no heart (apparently), he has no feelings. How can he be killed? Hmm... I guess Kakashi will have to quote "Wolverine" on this one (I'm gonna cut your head off! See if that works!). If that diesn't work... then I guess he's gonna have to ask Shikamaru for tips on defeating an immortal, hehehehe.

Anyway, it was also nice to see Rin's history. Not the most surprising one, but it actually makes me see that she had a good soul. We called her a spy at one point, but she sacrificed herself to protect the village, and that makes those theories vanish.

Finally, what do I expect? As far as couples go, nothing yet. It may sound silly, since Sasuke is arriving at the battlefield, Sakura is healing Naruto, Hinata is acting more of a leader, but for now, I'm taking it in stride. We're probably going to witness interaction between Hashirama-Madara and Minato-Naruto and probably even Naruto-Sasuke before pairings IMO (midst of a war after all), so let's see how all of this unfolds.

Battle of the immortals coming up... I'm kinda looking forward to it.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

Maybe its all an asspull to give Hinata development to be the leader of her clan? All at the cost of Neji? Still the fact that she has no idea about Sasuke or any correlation with him just makes her that much harder to justify as being important. NS is at least entwined with the central plot of Naruto vs. Sasuke, heck even SS is worse than NH and it has more priority than NH does. If there is any reasonable development for Hinata possibly going into a leadership mode, its to end her development displaying a leadership position like her father so she can take the head of her clan. If most are saying Hinatas role to Naruto is encouragement (and even in the manga that is what it tended to be) then Hinata's character could have been going from having no confidence and being in the back to having confidence and leading the front. This makes a good understandable end development with her. In fact without Naruto is possibly better (hinata really needs to do at least one thing not focused on Naruto and yet I feel its too late for that). Kishi can just make Hinata's end development come forward with her acting like a leader becoming worthy to take the place as head of the clan, he can even make NS come and Hinata simply be happy for him, she is still a minor character no matter how people try to justify it. She still only has what, only like 5-8 or so real chapters of importance in part 2? I can understand kishi putting Hinata around either on his own will or due to the editors because of how Hinata fans act like she is the second coming of Jesus or whatever, they see one panel even unrelated to Naruto and think NH canon! (if we go by the really insane fans).

She should be a leader to her clan but ask me where's the development?
Neji died yes, he did, but he dies and there's no flashbacks or even some scene that Neji tells her that she should lead her clan, on the war arc.
But no, then 615 comes, she didnt waver she didnt had development she just suddenly "A wild hinata appears and give a speech" Chouji,Ino and Shikamaru had development to give a speech like that but not Hinata how could she understand how Naruto was feelings on that moment if her nindo or better if she wasnt even tested.
She didnt faced any situation like all the other characters that i pointed out demanded.
She just BAM gives a speech and deal with it.

629 was basically this, where's the development for her to become a leader when on the last panel we saw her chasing Naruto on the battlefield chasing him and "healed" his arm.
The problem with her character is just those off panels development that are getting ridiculous, she's becoming what she should be but not with development for sure.

I mean Sakura is the heroine still, people try to act like Hinata is, but the hinata they love does not exist. Hinata still loses more credibility being developed more in anime fillers than canon material. Her past with Naruto, fighting pain, etc None of that technically happened, manga is the original source, manga is the canon material. Sakura is in the majority of that material and her development has been shown again and again. I repeat, Sakura was sidelined and has not been as active since the 5 kage summit save for her role in the white zetsu event but people need to realize this: If Sakura is not the heroine, how does Hinata plan to make up for 332 consecutive chapters of no importance? Shoundn't she as a heroine as people claim have more importance than just 5 or so chapters and 2 short moments in part 2? Heck if Hinata wants to be proven as a Heroine, she would need another arc with a lasting and important role like the chunin exams, but its too late for that too. There are times when we think Sakura is not the heroine, but she still is. The deal with kishi is, Sakura has a good skill set but he just never chose to use it to a bigger degree than the Sasori fight. He did use Sakura a lot but developed her mentally rather than physically most of the time. Plus any shortcomings he has on Sakura just makes all the other female characters look weaker by comparison save Tsunade and Kushina, Tsunade is well established for herself. Both Tsuande and Kushina also have important occupational roles and had the mentalities to back them, they are exempt from this in a way. All other female characters suffer under shortcomings from Sakura though, if Sakura takes a hit with credibility, it makes it harder for the other female characters. I mean people say Sakura is still focused on Sasuke, Sakura at least looks 2 ways between herself with both Naruto and Sasuke, when has Hinata ever looked at anyone besides Naruto? Its that simple.

Well i'm not talking about heroine role but still i would comment this, i see Sakura supporting Naruto as a medic ninja and Hinata asspulling all the time which is bothering me, it's not what Sakura is doing but what Hinata is doing without development.

Sakura is the main heroine , her importance lies with the fact of the team 7 which seems to be the whole theme of this manga, resolving Sasuke's situation and the bromance which damaged the story on shippuuden.

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 08 May 2013 - 03:00 PM.

[Gravenimage]

Wow, I actually loved this chapter. I know some people are worried about what Hinata was doing, but honestly Hinata AND Sakura are actually doing exactly what they are supposed to be doing during this whole war. Yeah we love pairing drama, but when you have it forced it is very weak and nerve racking. Here we have both Hinata and Sakura doing exactly what they were meant to be. Not just pairing fodder. Sakura is supposed to heal Naruto and Hinata being more than just oogling him.

I still don't like the way Hinata's portrayal of character, but this gets a +1 in respect from me. She still has a long way to go before I finally start to like Hinata again, but this was a step in the right direction. I see no pairing bouts in this what so ever. Just Sakura healing Naruto as she should and Hinata creating a "wall" (as she is....just kidding.XD) If anyone really tried to start a pairing bout I would mostly likely slap them whether it NH or NS because that just mean they are only reading this manga for the pairing wars. Not the story. I hate to admit, but this is what I wanted Hinata doing this whole time. Not that crap she pulled in 615-616. I wish she do more stuff like this.

Sakura and Hinata were both being heroic here.

BTW, I haven't seen Naruto that badass in a long time. I mean, look at that...

Holy Battle wounds, Batman. --Click here to view--

Also, looks like we can actually say that Obito and Naruto are officially parallel seeing how the manga basically said it itself. Glad we finally got to know why Rin died. I am glad she wasn't a traitor and actually went down because she didn't want to kill anybody with that plan. I hope nobody really compares that to Hinata's Pain arc thing cause that would just be asinine. Rin's death has no parallel and it is in it's own right a separate thing.

What would be interesting is that Obito said he knew everything, but it would be funny if Kakashi revealed something obito didn't know. Perhaps something Rin said before she died saying that she loved Obito or something. How interesting would that be? I am actually sad Rin died the way she did and I am actually starting to feel even more sorry for obito now. Not because of his loss, but because the loss and the world has altered his view such dramatically. I actually want Obito to be redeemed more than Sasuke at the moment. Mostly because I feel Obito's story is more succinct than Sasuke's.

Look I do want to say something. The only fight I really want to see Sakura in is in fighting Sasuke. I know some wanted to see her fight sooner or some other bad guy, but if she fought Sasuke would be a whole deal greater impact than her just fighting some random battle. Hinata didn't get a fight either so take that as you will. I want this story to have meaning and purpose, not just senseless forced scenes or mindless action. It was fine during the earlier chapters, but now we don't need that. With us coming to the end of the manga I don't want to see things happen for no reason. If Sakura fought side by side with Naruto against Sasuke it would do so many things and it would prove that Sakura has chosen the true side she wanted to be on.

You know that will be a really painful blow to Obito if Kakashi tells him that Rin loved him all along and she realized the truth before it was too late. That what she had for Kakashi was just infatuation turning into obsession just like Sakura for Sasuke. If that's the case then that will make it official of Obito/Rin been another parallel of NS that will eventually be overcome as the saying of" the next generation surpassing the old."

[TouKen4Life3g]

I do wonder who will be left standing. If the heal process takes a while, I think Naruto and Sakura will be the very few named character to stand. Hey, I'm starting to see Kishi's plan. Anyway, it's crazy because I noticed in chapter 617 there were so many of them. Look at 628 again, they are losing badly. Then at 629, it's growing less. What's worse is that there's no chakra protection for a while, so expect more casualty. Funny, because as much as I like Hinata finally acts like a leader, she seems asking for knock out or dead (not likely). I think the next time Naruto recovers, something extraordinary will happen. So the only questions are:

1) How long Kakashi/Obito fight will last as well as planning to go back to real world?

2) How long does it take for Naruto to gather back chakra since Kuruma wasn't present, meaning he got to work again?

Next chapter awaits!

Edited by NaruSaku4Life3g, 08 May 2013 - 03:09 PM.