358 replies to this topic

[Shadow Wolf]

So every popular game is overrated is what you are saying. This includes Final Fantasy 1-9 (at least. The others debatable) because they were all popular, Halo, Gears, God of War, All Super Mario games. All Legend of Zelda games...basically any video game that has a "fanbase."

So, what is not overrated? Psychonauts? This game probably has the biggest fanbase out of any underappreciated game. Killer 7?

I was afraid of this. It really sounds to me that it's not that you think the game itself is overrated, but the fanbase around it. This paragraph alone proves it. The fanbase over praises something, the fanbase pushes their views onto you. That's not the game's fault. The game never said to you "Oh, this is the best villain ever or best hero." I am going to say this is similar to "Overhyped."

That would be a lie. I know under-appreciated games with a fanbase (Beyond Good and Evil is one of those) and I know that many games are popular and have a fanbase because they're good (Red Dead Redemption, Kingdom Hearts 1-2). So no, I'm not saying that every popular game if overrated. Notice that I used the words "some" and "but not all", meaning that I am not generalizing; so no, I'm not saying that every popular game is overrated. What is not overrated? How can I answer that question anyway?

Let me give you the question I'm trying to answer here: which videogames have a fanbase which think objectively about the game and which videogames have a fanbase which simply idolizes the heroes while overlooking their flaws? Yes, I know this is difficult to answer because you will find fans who think objectively about a game and you will also find whiny fanboys behind any game, but when you think about it, some (and I repeat, "some", not "all") videogames have fans who overpraise heroes/villains.

That's like saying you hate someone because of the people they hang out with. Not that they are a bad person. Hell, they might be the best person ever.

No my friend. Is like saying that I hate when a singer has a popularity that idolizes them to the point of it being ridiculous; and that is not their fault because they might actually be good singers, but, they are not the best. "But who is the best?" you'd probably ask. Well, in all honesty, there is not a perfect singer not a perfect videogame. However, what distinguishes a good fan from a bad fan is their ability to see the game as objectively as possible, recognizing both the game's virtues and flaws.

Of course, this is a double edged sword because well, why is the game popular? Cause it's good. When something is good, it is popular. Are you going to say that Final Fantasy 8 is overrated because it is popular with the fans and which you are apart of it? In fact, in an ironic sort of twist, you are doing the same thing when talking about FFIV Cecil. "He is the better than Cloud, Squall, and Lightning combined and Kefka is the better villain." Sounds familiar, doesn't?

When have I said that Final Fantasy VIII is the best game ever? I said "one of the best", not "The Best". And believe me, I definitely dislike people who think Squall is perfect when he is definitely not. And by the way, don't put words into my mouth please. I never used the word "combined" in my previous post. I said that he left the legacy for them (meaning that some traits from these characters are inherited)

Cecil, Squall, an Cloud are my top three heroes in the Final Fantasy universe.

And I don't have anything to say about this. You like them? That's good. We all have our favorite heroes and villains after all.

Like I said. Your opinion is your opinion, but I kind of hate the whole "I hate it because of the fanbase" excuse. In retrospect, I hate the Sony fanboys, but I think the PS3 is awesome. I kind of treat the fanbase like it doesn't exist.

Did I say "I hate FFVIII"? If I did, then I apologize. I said "I hate the whiny fanbase". I don't hate the games. In fact, I have said many times here that I'm aware that FFVII is a good game. And I can say the same thing about the PS3: I know it is a great console, but I hate the whiny fanboys behind it.

As for the Death battle of Cloud vs Link. I kind of was iffy about that. I am going to look at this at a power bases, not as a popularity contest. In truth, Cloud was severely weakened. Especially if you play FFVII like I played it. Cloud in my game was a beast when maxed out. He even had the ability that if he went down he can revive himself and everyone in his team. Materia is key here. I always figured they had to severely cripple Cloud to make him at an even level with Link, but I guess this is going to be the case with any RPG character they choose.

Same thing with almost every other Death Battle. It's just an opinion based on their analysis. I could complain about the Pikachu vs. Blanka fight, and even about the Peach vs. Zelda fight. But in the end, it's just their research so I don't have to get all angry and whiny about it. And I could also say that Link was also crippled in a lot of ways (though I'm still questioning why did they combined the Roc's Feather with the Pegasus Boots when they're two different items).

One thing I did find odd what the whole "Link can withstand >1000 tons of pressure." I never knew the gloves could do that and I wondered why if that is true why he still takes damage when he is hit by a boulder or something or even why he still takes fall damage. You'd think he's just eliminate the force all together.

I'm also wondering the analysis of the Golden Gloves (along with many other things, like the Z-targetting mechanic, and also how convenient was to give Cloud the Thundaga materia and give Link the Skyward Sword "reflect lightning" mechanic), but again, as I mentioned before, it's their opinion. I don't have to get whiny about it (and before you use this as a comparison with the FFVII fanboys, I'll reply to you that at least they gave me an explanation behind their reasoning. Like I said again, I haven't seen an FFVII fan yet who has provided me with an analysis of the game).

I reiterate: ONE of the first. I don't remember that very many games where a main character bites the dust at that generation of gaming. There were some here and there, but nothing really a concrete practice. It's only up until recently that developers decided to do this with very few actually doing it well.

Now it seems like every game has at least one main character bite the dust, if not all of them. Loses it's shock and awe when you can predict the red shirt.

Don't take this part seriously my friend. Hence why I used the smiley at the end.

I have to ask, do you believe in the whole "Squall is Dead" theory? Cause I don't.

I know two theories: one that claims that he is dead at the end of Disc 1 and another one that he is dead at the ending. And... to me both theories are pointless.

[James S Cassidy]

That would be a lie. I know under-appreciated games with a fanbase (Beyond Good and Evil is one of those) and I know that many games are popular and have a fanbase because they're good (Red Dead Redemption, Kingdom Hearts 1-2). So no, I'm not saying that every popular game if overrated. Notice that I used the words "some" and "but not all", meaning that I am not generalizing; so no, I'm not saying that every popular game is overrated. What is not overrated? How can I answer that question anyway?

Yet, you did cause I mentioned several and you said "Yes, all those games are overrated." Half those games I like, not because they popular, but because I enjoyed them.

Let me give you the question I'm trying to answer here: which videogames have a fanbase which think objectively about the game and which videogames have a fanbase which simply idolizes the heroes while overlooking their flaws? Yes, I know this is difficult to answer because you will find fans who think objectively about a game and you will also find whiny fanboys behind any game, but when you think about it, some (and I repeat, "some", not "all") videogames have fans who overpraise heroes/villains.

It's not a difficult question at all to be honest because I am not a fanboy. I like Halo, which you said was overrated, but I've played that game way before it got such a fanbase and it was good. I've even played Marathon which you can see influence from. I even like Bungie themselves as a developer.

I idolize heroes not because they are flawless, but because they overcome their flaws.

As for "overpraising characters," I am not going to answer that question simply because that is not am objective viewpoint.

No my friend. Is like saying that I hate when a singer has a popularity that idolizes them to the point of it being ridiculous; and that is not their fault because they might actually be good singers, but, they are not the best. "But who is the best?" you'd probably ask. Well, in all honesty, there is not a perfect singer not a perfect videogame. However, what distinguishes a good fan from a bad fan is their ability to see the game as objectively as possible, recognizing both the game's virtues and flaws.

Like I said, the game never said it was the best an no I never ask "who is the best" because you can never get an answer for it. At least not an objectified one anyway.

Do you know what separates a regular fan to a fanboy? Yes, it is involves looking at strengths and flaws of a game, but many fanboys love using the word "overrated." COD fanboys: "Halo is overrated." As soon as you used the word "overrated", I immediately threw your argument out the window, no offense. This word has been used by so many fanboys it is ridiculous. Which is why I never like using it. You want to think objectively, that's fine, but then you can't use the word "overrated" because then you become a fanboy. The very thing you hate. That's the point I was trying to make. Also, you heavily implied in your previous post was that the reason why you look down on certain games is because they are "overrated," not really because you like or dislike them based on objective viewin

Besides saying "overrated" is overrated.

When have I said that Final Fantasy VIII is the best game ever? I said "one of the best", not "The Best". And believe me, I definitely dislike people who think Squall is perfect when he is definitely not. And by the way, don't put words into my mouth please. I never used the word "combined" in my previous post. I said that he left the legacy for them (meaning that some traits from these characters are inherited)

I'm sorry for putting words in your mouth.

You didn't and I never said you did. You did however say that Cloud and Sephiroth were overrated because many heighten them to the point of saying they are the best and then you ask "who is the best?" This is why I never use the word "overrated" because it is such a negative word. It diminishes the point you are trying to make, because you automatically come off as saying "Well, Cloud and Sephiroth suck." Whether you said it or not is irrelevant.

And I don't have anything to say about this. You like them? That's good. We all have our favorite heroes and villains after all.

Exactly, but my point is that this doesn't mean the game is automatically "overrated."

Did I say "I hate FFVIII"? If I did, then I apologize. I said "I hate the whiny fanbase". I don't hate the games. In fact, I have said many times here that I'm aware that FFVII is a good game. And I can say the same thing about the PS3: I know it is a great console, but I hate the whiny fanboys behind it.

No, you didn't say you "hate them," but you did say they were "overrated" which is not an objective viewpoint.

Same thing with almost every other Death Battle. It's just an opinion based on their analysis. I could complain about the Pikachu vs. Blanka fight, and even about the Peach vs. Zelda fight. But in the end, it's just their research so I don't have to get all angry and whiny about it. And I could also say that Link was also crippled in a lot of ways (though I'm still questioning why did they combined the Roc's Feather with the Pegasus Boots when they're two different items).

Link kind of got powers from all his generations not just one incarnation. Which is weird too. Not all games had the Roc's feather in it, nor the golden gloves.

Like I said again, I haven't seen an FFVII fan yet who has provided me with an analysis of the game).

Maybe you are asking the wrong people. If you're going to ask a fanboy, then you will get fanboy answers. I am a FF7 fan and can tell you a pretty good analysis of the game and not be a fanboy about it. I even think Rinoa is a better female love interest than Aeris/Aerith.

As I mentioned, if Cloud was up to full playing weight with 100% power, then he probably wouldn't have lost to Link.

I know two theories: one that claims that he is dead at the end of Disc 1 and another one that he is dead at the ending. And... to me both theories are pointless.

I was referring to the first one.

Edited by James S Cassidy, 09 October 2012 - 07:08 AM.

[Shadow Wolf]

Yet, you did cause I mentioned several and you said "Yes, all those games are overrated." Half those games I like, not because they popular, but because I enjoyed them.

OK, let's do something then. Since I know this topic is mainly centered around the word "overrated", I think it would be best if we just leave the definition here and agree on the fact that we both are right on some points while we're still debating some others.

Overrated: To overestimate the merits of; rate too highly.

And with this in mind, you have to admit that some fans overestimate Cloud's and Sephiroth's achievements. Same thing with Master Chief, Kratos, Chris Redfield and Marcus Fenix (notice how I used the word "some", even though I have said so far that that "some" is a bigger amount when it comes to Cloud and Sephi fans, which I don't think I will take back). I know people who love these games and can still hold their heroes at ground level. In the end, there's only one thing I have left to do: I have to play the game by myself and develop my own opinion about it. That way, I'm sure that I will appreciate the virtues of Final Fantasy VII.

It's not a difficult question at all to be honest because I am not a fanboy. I like Halo, which you said was overrated, but I've played that game way before it got such a fanbase and it was good. I've even played Marathon which you can see influence from. I even like Bungie themselves as a developer.

I idolize heroes not because they are flawless, but because they overcome their flaws.

As for "overpraising characters," I am not going to answer that question simply because that is not am objective viewpoint.

The problem of these statements is that you're replying to me as if I'm considering you a fanboy (which you are not).

Like I said, the game never said it was the best an no I never ask "who is the best" because you can never get an answer for it. At least not an objectified one anyway.

Exactly.

Do you know what separates a regular fan to a fanboy? Yes, it is involves looking at strengths and flaws of a game, but many fanboys love using the word "overrated." COD fanboys: "Halo is overrated." As soon as you used the word "overrated", I immediately threw your argument out the window, no offense. This word has been used by so many fanboys it is ridiculous. Which is why I never like using it. You want to think objectively, that's fine, but then you can't use the word "overrated" because then you become a fanboy. The very thing you hate. That's the point I was trying to make. Also, you heavily implied in your previous post was that the reason why you look down on certain games is because they are "overrated," not really because you like or dislike them based on objective view.

Besides saying "overrated" is overrated.

To look down on something means to underestimate it, to look at it with contempt (which means considering something worthless) or with disdain (indifference); and I can safely say that I have done nothing like this. I have played some of the games and they are good. But as I've been saying all over again, some fans put their heroes on a Godly pedestal while forgetting that they also have flaws and forgetting about other aspects of the games, which are just... and many times more important than the heroes.

People say: FFVII is a good game!
I ask: Why?
They say: Because Cloud... and Sephiroth....
I'm like: OK. What else? Gameplay? Story? Music?
and they end like: Uhh.... I need to play it again.

So either they played the game being way too focused on the Hero/Villain while ignoring these basic elements, or these elements were not important at all. What am I suppose to think about that? A game which people appreciate it only because it has a Hero or a Villain, nothing else. To me, that's what overrated is all about. So which games aren't overrated? Games in which people can see and appreciate many aspects of the game, praising and criticizing each one accordingly.

I'm sorry for putting words in your mouth.

You didn't and I never said you did. You did however say that Cloud and Sephiroth were overrated because many heighten them to the point of saying they are the best and then you ask "who is the best?" This is why I never use the word "overrated" because it is such a negative word. It diminishes the point you are trying to make, because you automatically come off as saying "Well, Cloud and Sephiroth suck." Whether you said it or not is irrelevant.

And as you can see, I've been using the word while keeping in mind what it means. Does that makes me a fanboy?

However, I see that you feel really uncomfortable with it. If so, then I would like you to exchange that word for a more "appropriate" one.

Exactly, but my point is that this doesn't mean the game is automatically "overrated."

Refer to my points above for a reply to this.

No, you didn't say you "hate them," but you did say they were "overrated" which is not an objective viewpoint.

I've been providing my reasons as to why I've considered them overrated. And as I stated in my previous posts, this is my opinion.

Link kind of got powers from all his generations not just one incarnation. Which is weird too. Not all games had the Roc's feather in it, nor the golden gloves.

That's what you get when you favor one character over the other (which is what I believe Death Battle has been doing in some of the matches). But again, as I said, this is their opinion so I don't have to get all whiny about it. And I'm not saying that you are whiny my friend. I agree with you on these points and I also questioned the analysis of the Golden Gloves (Much like I've been wondering the Sheep interference in the Peach vs. Zelda and Blanka's electric resistance on the Pikachu vs. Blanka episode).

Maybe you are asking the wrong people. If you're going to ask a fanboy, then you will get fanboy answers. I am a FF7 fan and can tell you a pretty good analysis of the game and not be a fanboy about it. I even think Rinoa is a better female love interest than Aeris/Aerith.

Which is what also discourages me. People I've been asking about are close friends of mine, whom I have played with them for more than 5 years and who like games because of all these aspects I mentioned earlier. So what can I say about them? That they're good gamers but all of them are FFVII fanboys? (You don't need to answer this because you don't know them, of course. Plus these are pretty much rhetorical questions)

As I mentioned, if Cloud was up to full playing weight with 100% power, then he probably wouldn't have lost to Link.

I could say the same thing about Link. The problem is that you have to choose: either composite heroes or one-game heroes. In the former, Link would defeat Cloud. In the latter, Cloud would own Link. Many aspects can be considered and many different results would happen.

I was referring to the first one.

Well, as I said earlier: it's pretty much a pointless theory for the simple fact that Squall was pierced with the ice strike in his right shoulder.

[James S Cassidy]

OK, let's do something then. Since I know this topic is mainly centered around the word "overrated", I think it would be best if we just leave the definition here and agree on the fact that we both are right on some points while we're still debating some others.

Overrated: To overestimate the merits of; rate too highly.

And with this in mind, you have to admit that some fans overestimate Cloud's and Sephiroth's achievements. Same thing with Master Chief, Kratos, Chris Redfield and Marcus Fenix (notice how I used the word "some", even though I have said so far that that "some" is a bigger amount when it comes to Cloud and Sephi fans, which I don't think I will take back). I know people who love these games and can still hold their heroes at ground level. In the end, there's only one thing I have left to do: I have to play the game by myself and develop my own opinion about it. That way, I'm sure that I will appreciate the virtues of Final Fantasy VII.

Yes, there are fanboys who over-appreciate their favorites. However, I try not to listen to them because it's just not an accurate study. I rather look at the entire fanbase and base the rating on that.

The biggest problem with using the term "overrated" is because it is not an objective point. It is a subjective. There is no factual evidence to support what is overrated and what isn't. You might think Cloud is overrated, but you base off of a few a**holes on youtube who argue based on favoritism. This is why I don't look at those comments. It the same reason why I came here to this website than sticking to Naruto forums. This site has member that agree with me yes, but I can actually debate with people here who do not give in to favoritism for the most part.

You like Cecil. What if I said Cecil was overrated because people like him? Am I right? There is no factual backing to such a claim. What if a fan truly believes Cloud is a great hero as much as you believe Cecil is the better hero with the same ideas. This is the problem with fanboys in general. They are so loud and obnoxious that people ignore the true fans who enjoy and truly believe what they believe and back it up with not only facts, but personal feeling without starting a flame war.

You say here that Master Chief is overrated. Besides fan comments, what makes him overrated? Like you said, you only want to look at facts. So what factual evidence says that Master Chief is an overrated hero? I mean, honestly, if they are only overrated cause "people like them more," I don't accept that. In a scientific study, personal viewpoints don't fly.

If this is the case, then every character is overrated. Every villain, every hero, every game that is popular is overrated. The definition you give above is if the game sucks and they give it a perfect score, but what if they give the game a score and it reflects well on the society by how many gamers think it is good. (How many sales it has made.) I could sit here and scream that "Call of Duty is the most overrate game ever," but the numbers don't lie and if it is any reflection on fact vs opinion. My opinion is that COD is overrated, but by the facts the game made millions, sold millions, and was declared the "best sold game of whatever year."

We also have "underrated" games. Games that got bashed by the critics, but among the gamers was very popular. Who do we listen to here? The fans or the critics? What viewpoint in more truthful.

I rather look at how the game does among the gamers. Yeah, you got fanboys, but they are only part of it. If I put up a poll in this forum asking who is the better Final Fantasy hero and the majority says that Cloud is the best based on their opinion, then I can't argue with the results. There might be fanboys yes, but not every person is a fanboy.

Instead of "overrated" I prefer the term "over-appreciated."

Overrated looks at their merits, but who decides what they merit? What is the official rating? If you look at individual opinions he is either under or overrated. Instead, I would take his popularity from the entire spectrum of FF fans. (Rate Cloud on 1-10 scale with 10 being the best) and if he gets a score on average an "8," then that's the score he merits. If another site says he deserve an 11 from a biased source, then yes I will say that compared to my scores, he is overrated, but that doesn't mean he is "bad" or the "worst" hero. That would be underrating him. I also wouldn't fault the character itself, but fault the study points of the people of the site

I really want to emphasis this point: "If you look at individual opinions he is either under or overrated." I really mean this. Individual opinions alone just don't cut it. You have to take the individual opinion and compare it to the majority of the fan base.

Here is a kicker question. How would you rate Cloud? From 1 (worst)- 10 (best). What score does he deserve? Forget comparing to others. I just want to know your opinion. Where is Cecil on this rank...and where is Squall?

Although I have not played every Final Fantasy, I will give my own score to compare after you decide yours.

My ranks --Click here to view--

My ranks.
1 - Vaan
2 -
3 -
4 - Tidus (He would be much higher if his personality didn't kill it for me. I know, poor reason, but something about him makes me want to....punch him.)
5 - Lightning
6 -
7 - Zidane
8 -Cloud
9 -Cecil
10 - Squall

l

The problem of these statements is that you're replying to me as if I'm considering you a fanboy (which you are not).

Honestly, yes I did feel that. See, this is what gets me upset in this day and age. If I like something and one person says it is overrated, what does that say about me? I get called being a poser or saying "You only like it cause it is popular." What if I like it because I think it is good? The the whole thing with the "My Little Pony" Bronies. Some people think this show is only popular because it is a trend, but I like the show myself because it is not over girlyfied, the stories are funny and have some great jokes in it, and I enjoy it. Yeah it is about ponies and meant for children and I even crack jokes about the show saying "insipid" some characters are.

Calling a game "overrated" is insulting the real fans who like the game because it is good.

To look down on something means to underestimate it, to look at it with contempt (which means considering something worthless) or with disdain (indifference); and I can safely say that I have done nothing like this. I have played some of the games and they are good. But as I've been saying all over again, some fans put their heroes on a Godly pedestal while forgetting that they also have flaws and forgetting about other aspects of the games, which are just... and many times more important than the heroes.

Then you label the fans, not the game. That's like saying "Gamestop sucks" when really the only problem I have is with one store. (Having a problem with the main company is a different kettle of fish, but that's not the point.) In response, I get a lot of people telling me the same thing. "You shouldn't base all stores on just one visit to one. Each one is privately owned" Fair enough, so I reply. "Well, then I will say that most of the stores around my area suck cause I get horrible service."

You say "this such thing is overrated," but just as you tell me that fans need to look at the game itself, you can't look at the fanboys and assume that's how everyone sees the game. Which is what you are assuming, dude. You wouldn't be saying the game was "overrated" if you were looking at all the facts and you probably say the same thing I say about COD.

"The game is not my kind of game, but I see why people like it so much because of such and such reasons."

So either they played the game being way too focused on the Hero/Villain while ignoring these basic elements, or these elements were not important at all. What am I suppose to think about that? A game which people appreciate it only because it has a Hero or a Villain, nothing else. To me, that's what overrated is all about. So which games aren't overrated? Games in which people can see and appreciate many aspects of the game, praising and criticizing each one accordingly.

Really? Then you need to go the real websites of the games and see the fans there. Halo.Bungie.Org. Biggest Halo fanbase, but they are not fanboys about it. There, some say Halo Reach sucks. Some say Halo 2 sucks. Some say "Bungie did a horrible job on Halo 2, but they made up for it in Halo 3."

Adam Sesslar even said to people why Halo 3 deserved the score it got because it was a good game. I have been trying to find the video, but can't at the moment.

Duke Nukem website. Half the members there say that Duke Nukem Forever is the worst game they ever played, while the other half said it was a great game and enjoyed it despite it's flaws. Is it overrated or underrated? According to the fans, the game is average. According to the critics, it is the worst game ever made. Who is right? I don't thin DNF deserves a 3/10. The game is not THAT bad. That's gross underrating. I think the game deserves a 7.5/10 - 8/10. Not the best, but for what I expected I got exactly what I wanted.

And as you can see, I've been using the word while keeping in mind what it means. Does that makes me a fanboy?

No, but looking at one viewpoint does. That's the whole reason why we are discussing this, is it not? If you're just looking at comments from a stupid youtube video instead of going to the real fans of the series, then of course you're going to think the game is overrated. Of course, the fanboys are going to make the most noise because they are the loudest.

I've been providing my reasons as to why I've considered them overrated. And as I stated in my previous posts, this is my opinion.

Your reasons are biased based on your own opinions instead of looking at the facts. You said so yourself that gamers need to look at the facts before looking to their own views.

You've explained that you like Cecil better than Cloud because you think he is a better hero with better personality and etc. I get that and that's fine. I think Squall is a better hero because he is a more well balanced character who changed and developed over the story course, but how does this make Cloud overrated? Why is Cecil not overrated or Squall?

Again, this is why I never use the term "overrated" and prefer the term "over-appreciated." Cloud is a hero and his story is good and his merits are sound, but he is not the only character to do such things.

If we asked every Final Fantasy fan, and Cloud was the least favorite out of all the FF characters, then yes I will say he is overrated, but if the majority of the fans believe that he is a good hero, whether or not he is the best, then he is not over or underrated. He is right where he deserves to be.

This is the whole point I am trying to make.

That's what you get when you favor one character over the other (which is what I believe Death Battle has been doing in some of the matches). But again, as I said, this is their opinion so I don't have to get all whiny about it. And I'm not saying that you are whiny my friend. I agree with you on these points and I also questioned the analysis of the Golden Gloves (Much like I've been wondering the Sheep interference in the Peach vs. Zelda and Blanka's electric resistance on the Pikachu vs. Blanka episode).

Personally, I am not basing my ideas on favoritism because I like both characters. I am basing my ideas on potential power each character dishes out with some facts I never even knew existed. (Again, the power glove thing.) I look at what each character is capable of, what powers are known to them and use all powers to fight their enemy.

I agree with you that some of the Death battles are somewhat biased in that some characters have been weakened to their weakest potential to make the fights more...."fair." Some are spot on in their abilities which I will explain below. I never saw the Blanka vs Pikachu fight however cause I can't get that video to load.

Which is what also discourages me. People I've been asking about are close friends of mine, whom I have played with them for more than 5 years and who like games because of all these aspects I mentioned earlier. So what can I say about them? That they're good gamers but all of them are FFVII fanboys? (You don't need to answer this because you don't know them, of course. Plus these are pretty much rhetorical questions)

I would have to talk to them myself. If they are as fanboyish as you claim, then I wouldn't take their ideas to much value unless they gave me go enough reasons.

I like your opinions better even if I do disagree with them.

I could say the same thing about Link. The problem is that you have to choose: either composite heroes or one-game heroes. In the former, Link would defeat Cloud. In the latter, Cloud would own Link. Many aspects can be considered and many different results would happen.

Not even that. Let's say we just used Link in OoT. What if we use kid Link who can't use the gloves or the master sword? Cloud would win hands own without breaking a sweat. I can even say "What difference would it make to have Link wield the silver gloves and not the golden ones?"

I really didn't like this Death battle. Not because Cloud lost and Link won or anything like that, but the fact that the fighters weren't at their peak potential. Cloud can be used to full potential and so can Link. I guess it was all in the name of fairness, but I don't know. I would have been more satisfied if both were at their full potential, even if Link still won.

I actually can give a better show with Master Chief vs Doom where most of the fans believe Doom Guy should have won. They are both marines, but Master Chief is genetically enhanced in every way, has armor that can deflect energy weaponry, and was a soldier for most his life. I like Doom, but facts are facts. In reality, MC would win hands down

Well, as I said earlier: it's pretty much a pointless theory for the simple fact that Squall was pierced with the ice strike in his right shoulder.

Yeah, but we also have time compression in this game with characters who can manipulate time and not only move it forwards, but backward as well. I also think that in a word of fantasy, anything can happen.

All in all, at least we can agree to disagree if we can't make a decision.

Edited by James S Cassidy, 10 October 2012 - 01:57 AM.

[James S Cassidy]

Actually, before the whole argument happened, I wanted to give you this video. I figured since we are here, why not make it NaruSaku?

[Shadow Wolf]

Yes, there are fanboys who over-appreciate their favorites. However, I try not to listen to them because it's just not an accurate study. I rather look at the entire fanbase and base the rating on that.

And when you put it this way, I have to agree with you. Again, I need to recall the fact that I have used the word "some" for this very reason.

The biggest problem with using the term "overrated" is because it is not an objective point. It is a subjective. There is no factual evidence to support what is overrated and what isn't. You might think Cloud is overrated, but you base off of a few a**holes on youtube who argue based on favoritism. This is why I don't look at those comments. It the same reason why I came here to this website than sticking to Naruto forums. This site has member that agree with me yes, but I can actually debate with people here who do not give in to favoritism for the most part.

Funny thing is that I've never had any interest in seeing people overpraise Cloud on youtube. As I said, my opinion has been based on what I've seen in the comments section of the Death Battle episode and on what my friends have spoken about Cloud. That this is not objective? Of course not, this is an opinion after all. When is an opinion a fact. An opinion is a point of view, and as a point of view, it is obvious that people will disagree with it. However, what I want is that you don't feel like I'm pointing a finger at you. As I said, this is my opinion and it's OK to disagree with it. Just, as a friendly request, do not expect my opinion to be based on facts because just like you said, every person has a different approach on games. Some might rate it good while others might say that it sucks (hey, I have a friend who considers FFXIII the only good FF game. I could go and debate this with her, but in the end, its just her opinion).

Now, what would be your friendly request: that I try to appreciate Cloud a bit more and that I play the game (sorry if this sounds kinda mean, I'm trying to express this in a friendly way but it is difficult to do so when you can only rely on words)? If so, then all I have to say is: "Hey, no problem. I will play the game someday and I'm sure that I will see Cloud as the hero that he is... of course, without puttimg him over the top as some fanboys do.

You like Cecil. What if I said Cecil was overrated because people like him? Am I right? There is no factual backing to such a claim. What if a fan truly believes Cloud is a great hero as much as you believe Cecil is the better hero with the same ideas. This is the problem with fanboys in general. They are so loud and obnoxious that people ignore the true fans who enjoy and truly believe what they believe and back it up with not only facts, but personal feeling without starting a flame war.

Then I would say: Yes, some people have him as overrated, and some people see him as an underrated hero. It's all opinions my friend. Some people will express their opinion with respect, while others will try to insult the other person to try and get their point across.

You say here that Master Chief is overrated. Besides fan comments, what makes him overrated? Like you said, you only want to look at facts. So what factual evidence says that Master Chief is an overrated hero? I mean, honestly, if they are only overrated cause "people like them more," I don't accept that. In a scientific study, personal viewpoints don't fly.

If this is the case, then every character is overrated. Every villain, every hero, every game that is popular is overrated. The definition you give above is if the game sucks and they give it a perfect score, but what if they give the game a score and it reflects well on the society by how many gamers think it is good. (How many sales it has made.) I could sit here and scream that "Call of Duty is the most overrate game ever," but the numbers don't lie and if it is any reflection on fact vs opinion. My opinion is that COD is overrated, but by the facts the game made millions, sold millions, and was declared the "best sold game of whatever year."

We also have "underrated" games. Games that got bashed by the critics, but among the gamers was very popular. Who do we listen to here? The fans or the critics? What viewpoint in more truthful.

I rather look at how the game does among the gamers. Yeah, you got fanboys, but they are only part of it. If I put up a poll in this forum asking who is the better Final Fantasy hero and the majority says that Cloud is the best based on their opinion, then I can't argue with the results. There might be fanboys yes, but not every person is a fanboy.

Instead of "overrated" I prefer the term "over-appreciated."

Overrated looks at their merits, but who decides what they merit? What is the official rating? If you look at individual opinions he is either under or overrated. Instead, I would take his popularity from the entire spectrum of FF fans. (Rate Cloud on 1-10 scale with 10 being the best) and if he gets a score on average an "8," then that's the score he merits. If another site says he deserve an 11 from a biased source, then yes I will say that compared to my scores, he is overrated, but that doesn't mean he is "bad" or the "worst" hero. That would be underrating him. I also wouldn't fault the character itself, but fault the study points of the people of the site

I really want to emphasis this point: "If you look at individual opinions he is either under or overrated." I really mean this. Individual opinions alone just don't cut it. You have to take the individual opinion and compare it to the majority of the fan base.

I didn't say anything about facts. Thinking objectively doesn't mean that you will become a scientist and look only at the facts. To me, having an objective opinion means what you mentioned earlier: That you appreciate a hero not because you overlooked his/her flaws, but because he was able not only to accept them, but to overcome them. In this particular aspect, you admit that you hero has virtues and flaws and you appreciate it without putting him/her in a pedestal.

Now, let's look at Master Chief. Why he has been considered overrated (based on an article by IGN so credist to IGN and to Jesse Schedeen, author of the article)

Why he's overrated: Given the pedigree of some of the yahoos on this list, we're almost surprised you went with Master Chief as the most overrated character in gaming. But who are we to argue with the readers?

Granted, the hubbub over Master Chief is disconcerting at times. Halo fans make this Spartan soldier out to be a paragon of storytelling greatness, but really - what is there underneath all that armor to warrant such praise? Chief rarely even talks, much less offers up compelling nuggets of drama. Half the time he could be swapped out with Gordon Freeman and gamers wouldn't know the difference.

No, the truth of the matter is that 95% of what makes Halo so enduringly popular is not exclusively tied to its hero, but rather to its multiplayer mode. The other 5% is the catchy theme music. At the end of the day, Master Chief is just a generic action hero riding on the coat tails of a much better game.

Now, you will probably disagree with some of the statements that he wrote here, but let's look at a few details before that. Who wrote it? A person, right? If it's a person, don't you think that in the end, this is just an opinion? Is it based on facts? Keeping all of this in mind, all I can say is: yes, he provided his reasons as to why he considers the character overrated. But these are his reasons. It's his opinion. You're not going to discredit an opinion but if you disagree with it, then it's fine. That's the point I've been trying to make: that this is my opinion and that I'm not trying to convince you to change yours. So at the end of the day, if I consider Master Chief an overrated character and you don't then it's OK to disagree. And like you said, as long as you give your opinion without offending anyone, then hey, enjoy the debate.

Here is a kicker question. How would you rate Cloud? From 1 (worst)- 10 (best). What score does he deserve? Forget comparing to others. I just want to know your opinion. Where is Cecil on this rank...and where is Squall?

Although I have not played every Final Fantasy, I will give my own score to compare after you decide yours.

My ranks --Click here to view--

My ranks.
1 - Vaan
2 -
3 -
4 - Tidus (He would be much higher if his personality didn't kill it for me. I know, poor reason, but something about him makes me want to....punch him.)
5 - Lightning
6 -
7 - Zidane
8 -Cloud
9 -Cecil
10 - Squall

l

Well, there are 13 games (excluding sequels), so let's see:

Lou's Final Fantasy Heroes list --Click here to view--

10-Squall Leonheart (Final Fantasy VIII)
9-Cecil Harvey (Final Fantasy IV)
8-Terra Brandford (Final Fantasy VI)
7-Cloud Strife (Final Fantasy VII)
6-Onion Knight (Final Fantasy III)
5-Bartz Klauser (Final Fantasy V)
4-Claire (Lightning) Farron (Final Fantasy XIII)
3-Warrior (Final Fantasy)
2-Tidus (Final Fantasy X)
1-Vaan (Final Fantasy XII)

A-Zidane Tribal (Final Fantasy IX)
B-Firion (Final Fantasy II)
C-Shantotto (Final Fantasy XI)
(I placed these three here because these are the characters to which I have less knowledge of. So starting from A to C, that's the order I would like to gather info about them)

Honestly, yes I did feel me upset in this day and age. If I like something and one person says it is overrated, what does that say about me? I get called being a poser or saying "You only like it cause it is popular." What if I like it because I think it is good? The the whole thing with the "My Little Pony" Bronies. Some people think this show is only popular because it is a trend, but I like the show myself because it is not over girlyfied, the stories are funny and have some great jokes in it, and I enjoy it. Yeah it is about ponies and meant for children and I even crack jokes about the show saying "insipid" some characters are.

Calling a game "overrated" is insulting the real fans who like the game because it is good.


Then you label the fans, not the game. That's like saying "Gamestop sucks" when really the only problem I have is with one store. (Having a problem with the main company is a different kettle of fish, but that's not the point.) In response, I get a lot of people telling me the same thing. "You shouldn't base all stores on just one visit to one. Each one is privately owned" Fair enough, so I reply. "Well, then I will say that most of the stores around my area suck cause I get horrible service."

You say "this such thing is overrated," but just as you tell me that fans need to look at the game itself, you can't look at the fanboys and assume that's how everyone sees the game. Which is what you are assuming, dude. You wouldn't be saying the game was "overrated" if you were looking at all the facts and you probably say the same thing I say about COD.

"The game is not my kind of game, but I see why people like it so much because of such and such reasons."


Really? Then you need to go the real websites of the games and see the fans there. Halo.Bungie.Org. Biggest Halo fanbase, but they are not fanboys about it. There, some say Halo Reach sucks. Some say Halo 2 sucks. Some say "Bungie did a horrible job on Halo 2, but they made up for it in Halo 3."

Adam Sesslar even said to people why Halo 3 deserved the score it got because it was a good game. I have been trying to find the video, but can't at the moment.

Duke Nukem website. Half the members there say that Duke Nukem Forever is the worst game they ever played, while the other half said it was a great game and enjoyed it despite it's flaws. Is it overrated or underrated? According to the fans, the game is average. According to the critics, it is the worst game ever made. Who is right? I don't thin DNF deserves a 3/10. The game is not THAT bad. That's gross underrating. I think the game deserves a 7.5/10 - 8/10. Not the best, but for what I expected I got exactly what I wanted.

No, but looking at one viewpoint does. That's the whole reason why we are discussing this, is it not? If you're just looking at comments from a stupid youtube video instead of going to the real fans of the series, then of course you're going to think the game is overrated. Of course, the fanboys are going to make the most noise because they are the loudest.

Your reasons are biased based on your own opinions instead of looking at the facts. You said so yourself that gamers need to look at the facts before looking to their own views.

You've explained that you like Cecil better than Cloud because you think he is a better hero with better personality and etc. I get that and that's fine. I think Squall is a better hero because he is a more well balanced character who changed and developed over the story course, but how does this make Cloud overrated? Why is Cecil not overrated or Squall?

Again, this is why I never use the term "overrated" and prefer the term "over-appreciated." Cloud is a hero and his story is good and his merits are sound, but he is not the only character to do such things.

If we asked every Final Fantasy fan, and Cloud was the least favorite out of all the FF characters, then yes I will say he is overrated, but if the majority of the fans believe that he is a good hero, whether or not he is the best, then he is not over or underrated. He is right where he deserves to be.

This is the whole point I am trying to make.

Personally, I am not basing my ideas on favoritism because I like both characters. I am basing my ideas on potential power each character dishes out with some facts I never even knew existed. (Again, the power glove thing.) I look at what each character is capable of, what powers are known to them and use all powers to fight their enemy.

I agree with you that some of the Death battles are somewhat biased in that some characters have been weakened to their weakest potential to make the fights more...."fair." Some are spot on in their abilities which I will explain below. I never saw the Blanka vs Pikachu fight however cause I can't get that video to load.

I would have to talk to them myself. If they are as fanboyish as you claim, then I wouldn't take their ideas to much value unless they gave me go enough reasons.

I like your opinions better even if I do disagree with them.

Not even that. Let's say we just used Link in OoT. What if we use kid Link who can't use the gloves or the master sword? Cloud would win hands own without breaking a sweat. I can even say "What difference would it make to have Link wield the silver gloves and not the golden ones?"

I really didn't like this Death battle. Not because Cloud lost and Link won or anything like that, but the fact that the fighters weren't at their peak potential. Cloud can be used to full potential and so can Link. I guess it was all in the name of fairness, but I don't know. I would have been more satisfied if both were at their full potential, even if Link still won.

I actually can give a better show with Master Chief vs Doom where most of the fans believe Doom Guy should have won. They are both marines, but Master Chief is genetically enhanced in every way, has armor that can deflect energy weaponry, and was a soldier for most his life. I like Doom, but facts are facts. In reality, MC would win hands down

Yeah, but we also have time compression in this game with characters who can manipulate time and not only move it forwards, but backward as well. I also think that in a word of fantasy, anything can happen.

All in all, at least we can agree to disagree if we can't make a decision.

I would like to provide a closure to all of this with one final statement: These points I've been talking about here are not facts. You can't expect me to give an opinion based on facts because that's what it is: an opinion. Once again, I need to recall that I've been using the word "some", meaning that I do not consider all Cloud fans to be fanboys (which also means that I do not consider you a fanboy). This is why I've been stating this over and over again, because I want you to know that I am not directing this at you. On the contrary, thanks to this debate, I have come to understand that I will gain a better insight and knowledge after both playing the game and after considering many more opinions about the game (to which I encourage you to provide me with a brief review on Final Fantasy VII as a friendly request). So in the end, if I say "I dislike Cloud" or "I dislike Final Fantasy VII", don't take it as an offense because this is just my opinion. So if I say that a game is overrated, then it doesn't say anything about you because it is my opinion and not yours. I say that it is overrated, you say that it isn't, then that's fine. Like you said, we agree to disagree.

PS: Sorry if I make you feel a bit sad with what I'm about to say, but in a way, the song you recently posted here made me think of how you have sometimes seen the world through Rebecca (through her eyes). May we always remember the people who gave us a reason to move forward with a smile.

[James S Cassidy]

No, no. Ummm....it seem we're are confusing personal opinion versus what I am trying to say.

My point is not that we as a gaming community need to stop with the whole "Overrated" stuff. I want to drop saying "overrated" because fanboys love this word. They use it all the time on why a game sucks or why they never play a game. It's not fair to the game. If you play the game and say to me "I don't like." That's fine, but I hate when people put down a game just because they hate the fanbase. That's cheap and stupid.

And I know you don't want to insult me, but I still take it as an insult because I want to be a gamer that is truthful and honest. You want be a gamer that is truthful and honest. I hate the word "overrated" because it's just insulting to gamers. Again, it's not about the opinion you have of Cloud, it just the word itself that I hate because it has been used by so many fanboys and overused that it just has become a terrible word.

I got into a discussion with a friend about Assassin's Creed series and the Halo series. He says that AC series is a much richer story and has deeper meaning. I agree that compared to AC, Halo is a shallow-er story. Does this mean that Halo is overrated? No, it just means it is different. I did bring up a point that AC has a leg up cause it is based on historical fact so more or less half the story is written while Halo is a brand new story all together with no real historical fact.

"Overrated" is such a tricky word to use because it doesn't make sense with using things that are popular. "Such and such thing is overrated," then why is it so popular? This is why I hate this word. I only really use this word if something is really bad, but critics claim it is really good. Then it is overrated, not if something is popular and because you personally believe something is better.

This is why I use the word "over-appreciated," because it is a more humble word to use and still retains the same meaning.

Now, let's look at Master Chief. Why he has been considered overrated (based on an article by IGN so credist to IGN and to Jesse Schedeen, author of the article)

Biggest mistake right here because IGN are Sony fanboys believe it or not. That's why I don't read their stuff. I rather read a game website that plays no favorites.

Second, I wouldn't call this an "opinion" because he says "In truth, 95% of the fanbase only cares about the multiplayer." Okay, 95%? Really? I have been talking to real Halo fans and I see discussions there are more than just multiplayer. I see them asking questions about the books by Eric Nylund and Karin Traviss, documentation of in game stories, theories of what Halo 4 is about. Where did he get "95% of the fanbase" from? Has this Jesse Schedeen ever been to a real Halo fanbase website? Like I said, go to Halo.Bungie.Org and you will see that it is not true at all.

See this is what I am talking about. He really asked 95% of the fanbase? Opinions are one thing, but putting down a statistic and then claiming that it is the majority fact? Shame on you, IGN.

Opinion or not, he is stupid for even bringing that kind of argument up. Again, this is why I hate IGN. They give off this "We are right. If you don't agree then you're wrong" attitude.

Now, you will probably disagree with some of the statements that he wrote here, but let's look at a few details before that. Who wrote it? A person, right? If it's a person, don't you think that in the end, this is just an opinion? Is it based on facts? Keeping all of this in mind, all I can say is: yes, he provided his reasons as to why he considers the character overrated. But these are his reasons. It's his opinion.

No, because he doesn't say it is his opinion. Compare that article to what we say and you will see his jargon is much different. He doesn't use the words "I believe..." or "I think..." He just says "Master Chief is overrated and here is why." He doesn't try to be humble about it and right here insults the fanbase.

Granted, the hubbub over Master Chief is disconcerting at times. Halo fans make this Spartan soldier out to be a paragon of storytelling greatness, but really - what is there underneath all that armor to warrant such praise?

Does this really sound like an opinion? Cause it doesn't to me. He says Halo fans see MC as a great hero. That should have been the end of the story, because knowing how many Halo fans there are there are millions of opinions on why MC is a good hero. Now, if this was an opinion he would follow. "This is why I think Master Chief is overrated." Instead, he just basically says that the entire Halo fanbase is wrong and then gives this hyperbole statistic that's not even based on real fact.

95 percent? I guess we can put all games that have a multiplayer on that list too unless in reality not 95% of the people who play the game just enjoy the multiplayer. What about the games that don't have a multiplayer? Where do they fall in that 95%? What about the people who do love the story which is about 95% of the Halo fanbase? What about games that are strictly multiplayer with no story or single player campaign (Team Fortress 2, Counter Strike?)

Fanboys do this all the time. They slander the stuff they hate, claim their ideas are not opinion, but fact, and make up these wild statistics. I don't care if their opinions are different or not, but the fact that they make such claims is just...stupid.

I am not looking at what their opinion is, but how they have that opinion. If that how is shallow and stupid with nothing, but falsified facts, terrible debate skills, and an attitude that says that "There are only two opinions. Mine and the wrong one," then I don't want to talk to them even if they agree with me because not only do they give the game a bad name, but they give the real fans/gamers (like you and me) a bad name as well.

A professional writer should know this.

Side opinion --Click here to view--

Also, just a side opinion: I hate the argument about MC and his sort of "mute-ness" being a flaw. Look at how many other gaming icons that are popular and yet mute too: Link, Gordan Freedom, Jack from BioShock, Most of the characters you play in COD, but people don't see to have a problem with it. Why all of a sudden Master Chief gets a bad rep for it? This is what I never understood. How can you only apply something to one opinion? How can one characters mute-ness be a problem for one character, but for another it is perfectly fine? At least stay consistent, I say.

Well, there are 13 games (excluding sequels), so let's see:

Lou's Final Fantasy Heroes list --Click here to view--

10-Squall Leonheart (Final Fantasy VIII)
9-Cecil Harvey (Final Fantasy IV)
8-Terra Brandford (Final Fantasy VI)
7-Cloud Strife (Final Fantasy VII)
6-Onion Knight (Final Fantasy III)
5-Bartz Klauser (Final Fantasy V)
4-Claire (Lightning) Farron (Final Fantasy XIII)
3-Warrior (Final Fantasy)
2-Tidus (Final Fantasy X)
1-Vaan (Final Fantasy XII)

A-Zidane Tribal (Final Fantasy IX)
B-Firion (Final Fantasy II)
C-Shantotto (Final Fantasy XI)
(I placed these three here because these are the characters to which I have less knowledge of. So starting from A to C, that's the order I would like to gather info about them)

Funny how our scores are very close to each other. I am willing to bet dollars to donuts that most of the fanbase feels the same way. Which is why I don't see Cloud as "overrated." He is just exactly where he needs to be.

Looking at that, Cloud is about a 7.5 on the hero scale. Not the best, but not under-appreciated either. Compared to mine, he is not overrated. Now compare your opinion to a fanboy: he is overrated. Now compare your opinion to a fan who utterly hates him: He is underrated. Cloud can be seen a both over and underrated at the same time depending on who you talk to. See what I mean?

That's the funny thing about opinions and why I never use the words "overrated - underrated" cause the two scales vary heavily on who you talk to.

I do want to say this as a closing statement. If only your own opinion matters and you don't care what other people think. Then the word "overrated" cannot be applied. In order for something to be "overrated" it must be compared to another that is grossly different, but if only your own views of Cloud matter, then he is not overrated. He is exactly where he should be. The moment you start comparing is the moment that you start labeling him as such. Honestly, I find it much more fair to compare Cloud's impact on the entire Final Fantasy fanbase, not just what a few FFVII fanboys say.

Feels like I am reliving the whole "good" and "bad" debate I had in the Naruto Chapters. Has a similar concept that the state of being varies on the personal view.

PS: Sorry if I make you feel a bit sad with what I'm about to say, but in a way, the song you recently posted here made me think of how you have sometimes seen the world through Rebecca (through her eyes). May we always remember the people who gave us a reason to move forward with a smile.

I am not sad about Rebecca being gone. I have made my peace with it as I said, so it doesn't make me sad anymore. She doesn't want me to be sad. I still miss her though and yes, may we always remember those who change our lives.

Edited by James S Cassidy, 11 October 2012 - 06:15 AM.

[narulsaku]

hey guys . i want to creat a blog. advice please. i created a blog long ago but that was a totaly flop. so you have blogs so please advice this little poor kid in english language. i mean i am not that good at english.

[Shadow Wolf]

James: I haven't ignored your post. I've been distracted lately with a few things so I got kinda lost in the debate. I'll see to reply sometime later, if that's OK with you.

naruIsaku: Well, I don't think blogs are a flop or anything. In my opinion, you could update your blog. As for advice, I don't really have any. As you can see, mine doesn't get much replies except for my updates every now and then and some replies from a few people, so I don't consider my blog to be a good one. All I can say is, be yourself in your blog and use your words to bring kindness instead of pain. As for grammar, we learn that in the process so reading and things like that could help.

____________


Well, it's currently 5:45am. I should be sleeping (considering that I went to bed yesterday at 1am, I haven't slept at all), but I made a mistake (and a pretty silly and basic one). I woke up kinda thirsty and, since the first thing I grabbed to calm the thirst was an orange juice, my stomach is now really active (is not bad, but it doesn't let me sleep). Heh... funny how I still slip up big time at the most basic things.

Anyway, not much going on... watching a new anime, trying to be grateful to a few friends who have helped me lately and of course, thinking, thinking, thinking...

This song reminds me of many things, but the one I want to focus right now is on the second part of the song (where it pretty much says that I wish to live and learn despite having a naive/confused heart)



That's all for now. See ya next time.

Louis (Shadow Wolf)

[Shadow Wolf]

Well, I should have no net problems now. My roommate is looking forward to play League of Legends as a team now, since there will be no lag problems. Plua I plan to download Sonic Adventure 2 on XBLA (those cute little Chao). Heh, hopefully I'll be able to hang out a bit more around here, though I don't think there's much for me to contribute (Except in the fun cafe, maybe, XD). Anyway, job hunting has gotten a bit harder lately. Still, everything is fine so the search continues.

Funnily enough, I had a conversation with a friend of mine a few days ago. I was talking to her about the fact that I actually consider things like Halloween and Christmas to be "normal" days for me. Maybe it's because every time I saw my parents getting drunk, I just lost interest in celebrating anything, or maybe because I've never been much of a party guy to begin with... but I felt kinda bad when I noticed that she was in shock for me not celebrating those things. So I kinda took her advice and I'll try to take part in them at least in this year.

It's been a while since a song actually made me shed tears. And when I read the lyrics... well, you'll see what I mean:

Song: Egoist - Departures (Guilty Crown OST)

Lyrics and Translation

Louis (Shadow Wolf)

[James S Cassidy]

I like Christmas for the atmosphere. Just the feeling of Christmas feels special. Maybe because it feels like people can be at peace with each other. I also watch A Christmas Carol every year.

I don't really want to argue anymore if that's alright.

[narulsaku]

hey hey guys cheack out the new one. i mean my blog and please tell me how to improve. i need advice.

[T XD]

Hey James, now we know we can tease T XD with ghost stories, hahahahaha

I hope they won't be too frightening to get some sleep in the night

Heheheh, well, I better hide my Nutella if you visit me someday, hahahaha. Nah, just kidding. I'd probably share it.

You better be XD

[James S Cassidy]

I hope they won't be too frightening to get some sleep in the night

Lol I'll give you some creepy pasta if you want. i got one that will scare the crap out of you.

You better be XD

NUTELLA FOR ALL!!!

[T XD]

Lol I'll give you some creepy pasta if you want. i got one that will scare the crap out of you.

No, thank you

NUTELLA FOR ALL!!!

I'M WITH YOU FOR SPREADING CHOCOLATE TO THE WORLD XD

Edited by T XD, 21 October 2012 - 06:56 PM.

[James S Cassidy]

No, thank you

You know, one time someone said to me that if I didn't send their post to 25 people, a dead girl was going to show up in my closet.

Sweet, guess who's getting laid tonight.....THIS GUY!!!

[T XD]

You know, one time someone said to me that if I didn't send their post to 25 people, a dead girl was going to show up in my closet.

Sweet, guess who's getting laid tonight.....THIS GUY!!!

Nice one
To think that superstitions has merged with what you do on the internet.
Guess it progresses with the development of the world.
Although, the one who came up with the prank didn't see it as somewhat dull but I'm sure it has gotten to a lot of people to think of it

[narulsaku]

You know, one time someone said to me that if I didn't send their post to 25 people, a dead girl was going to show up in my closet.

Sweet, guess who's getting laid tonight.....THIS GUY!!!

so what happen . you know if i would have that message i wouldnt have slept that night. seriously

[Shadow Wolf]

Wow... so much activity XD.

James: You have a point there. Hence why this Christmas might be different for me (being in a different place and everything). So hopefully, those bad memories of the past will vanish and be replaced with new and memorable ones.

Oh, and I don't think we were arguing. We were just debating and discussing some points. And well, it was fun, so I hope we can have another debate sometime.

Oh, and I was kinda traumatized thinking that I would have to have sex with a dead girl. *shudders*

T XD: Heh, and what if I don't share my Nutella with you?

narulsaku: Well, I think the only thing you need to work is on grammar. The rest is OK; I've seen that you're friendly and cheerful, so that makes many blogs lively, including yours.

__________

I has a neutral running chao.

Mission for this week: Make it a Sonic Chao

(Topic: Chao raising in the game Sonic Adventure 2)

Chao (Kawaii) --Click here to view--

Current state of Yi (Running neutral chao)


Future state of Yi (Running/Running Neutral "Sonic" chao)

[narulsaku]

i am sorry my 1st language is nt english.. i am poor at grammar.i am trying to improve .