150 replies to this topic

[Beastbomb]

Same thing would happen if any of the pairings become canon. Most here would probably be willing to brace for that storm when the time comes around though.I'm willing to bet many members would be overjoyed and most likely ignore the hate.

[Moriarty]

Its not even that she only has 10 chapters, its also that 9 of 10 chapters are: NARUTO-KUN and beeing unconscious nothing more. 615 was the only development she got.

Development isn't limited to current chapters. Event happens, inspiration happens, resolve happens. Very staccato.
I think you missed a lot of her actions. You are reducing her character because you don't approve of few specific things. As my friend said Hinata draws inspiration from Naruto and her thoughts are relevant to what is currently happening.

This is one of the best things I can think of for NaruSaku, basically debunks most of this "evidence" NaruHina101 put up

http://narutoxsakura...dated-299391235

This one gets attention from all over the web.

I don't think it necessarily debunks NaruHina. I see more like opposing views. It would be in the same position vice versa.

[PhenixElite]

Development isn't limited to current chapters. Event happens, inspiration happens, resolve happens. Very staccato.
I think you missed a lot of her actions. You are reducing her character because you don't approve of few specific things. As my friend said Hinata draws inspiration from Naruto and her thoughts are relevant to what is currently happening.



I don't think it necessarily debunks NaruHina. I see more like opposing views. It would be in the same position vice versa.

Show me the chapters of hinata getting development pls. Remember, hinata saying naruto kun and saying that she goes to war to protect him is no development. Her copieng narutos nindo is also not really development.

Edited by PhenixElite, 29 March 2013 - 12:23 AM.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

Show me the chapters of hinata getting development pls. Remember, hinata saying naruto kun and saying that she goes to war to protect him is no development.

On the war arc only the part of Naruto's speech and nothing else.
(which makes her to stop chasing Naruto).
Ino had a way better development on this arc.

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 29 March 2013 - 12:24 AM.

[PhenixElite]

On the war arc only the part of Naruto's speech and nothing else.
(which makes her to stop chasing Naruto).
Ino had a way better development on this arc.

Yup as said, her only real development was chapter 615 nothing more.
I guess hinata is better developed then sakura right

[sushi.]

To me, Hinata has had 3 character developments.
1. In the chuunin exams, where Kishi expanded on her character and opened up her potential.
2. When she jumped in front of Pain, finally spoke to Naruto.
3. 615, her heroine moment.

These are the only progresses in her character. I don't think I've forgotten anything. Because to me, development is when a writer expands or changes a character, usually for the better.

Edited by sushi., 29 March 2013 - 12:27 AM.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

Yup as said, her only real development was chapter 615 nothing more.
I guess hinata is better developed then sakura right

615 wasnt a development her development to do that to Naruto was on his speech to her saying she was strong and all.
Naruto was being tested by Obito while Hinata dont, Neji died but she just cried and 0 flashbacks about her and Neji, she didnt get any development on Neji's death unlike all the other characters, she didnt thought about her life or about her clan, she went into the background until suddenly she slapped Naruto.

The only development that had on 615 was about Naruto.

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 29 March 2013 - 12:28 AM.

[PhenixElite]

To me, Hinata has had 3 character developments.
1. In the chuunin exams, where Kishi expanded on her character and opened up her potential.
2. When she jumped in front of Pain, finally spoke to Naruto.
3. 615, her heroine moment.

These are the only progresses in her character. I don't think I've forgotten anything. Because to me, development is when a writer expands or changes a character, usually for the better.

I dont see a confession as character development.
I also dont really see any during the chunin exam. She only copied his nindo.
Her character only started to change during war.

@Dαrkrєrsŧ:
I think 615 is combined with her words during 573(if thats right). In 615 it was her first time to pep talk him like before always naruto had to do with her.
In 573 she made the decission to do so.

Edited by PhenixElite, 29 March 2013 - 12:32 AM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Is this true? I haven't been all that involved in the Naruto fandom for a while, but I recall hearing several different versions of this story from shipping fans, and don't recall ever having seen any proof of it past an old sketch from one of the data/art books.

Actually, she was meant to be a villager, not a ninja, but yeah, that was changed. I don't know if this is true, but she was placed in a team for the sake of the balance of a team. Now, the recent development described on why Hinata had that body feature because of fanservice.

[merryGOflava]

I dont see a confession as character development.
I also dont really see any during the chunin exam. She only copied his nindo.
Her character only started to change during war.

....I gotta ask... how many times has she talked about naruto's nindo?

I only remember the chunin exams......when else?

[Slextrem]

I can't respond to the whole thing, but here are some responses to the first little chunk.

Sakura's violence

I can understand why some people aren't drawn to Sakura's violent side, however, there were some keen things you did not mention in your analysis.

Number one, you make it sound like she's smacking him around all of the time, when that simply isn't true. If you re-read the manga, you'll find that the last time Sakura hit Naruto in a violent tirade was here:

Chapter 311 - Nicknames --Click here to view--

Chapter 311, page 13. We're 625 chapters into the series. That means that Sakura hasn't hit Naruto with no reason for 314 chapters. The funny thing is, Naruto wasn't even her target here. As you can see, the only reason why he was hit was because he was holding her back from attacking Sai. So really, I don't see the point in criticizing her for being violent towards Naruto. It's been a long time since Part One. I suggest you get over it.

Number two, I'd like to bring up Studio Pierrot. I'm not sure if you're a fan of the anime, but they tend to make Sakura out to be a lot more violent than she actually is. They enjoy taking the quirks of each character, such as Hinata's tendency to faint around Naruto or Chouji's outbursts at being called "tubby", and turning it into comedy. They do the same thing with Sakura by having her send Naruto flying to the sky every so often.

This most often occurs in filler which are completely irrelevant to the canon series. It's meant to be funny, not taken seriously. A good example is Naruto SD: Rock Lee's Springtime of Youth. If you've seen that series, you know it's not supposed to be taken literally by the fans. It's a spoof series that makes fun of the characters and has Sakura throwing her fists around all of the time.

Number three, Sakura is a Tsundere. If you aren't familiar with the term, a Tsundere is a female character who is usually cold, but she becomes spoony on her lover. Or, she is cold to the main character at first, but she becomes lovestruck later. We've seen this development in other Tsundere characters, such as the following:

Kagome --Click here to view--

Akane --Click here to view--

Winry --Click here to view--

Rukia --Click here to view--

Sakura --Click here to view--

It's in Sakura's character-type to be easily annoyed and to take it out on the main character. However, just like the other examples provided, it's also in her character-type to develop strong feelings of love for the main character as well. Those feelings don't show all of the time, but they are there.

Lastly, I just want to point out that not all of Sakura's punches are filled with rage.

Chapter 450 --Click here to view--

What was that list of yours again? Love, care, concern, friendship, and "tough love"? I won't include flirting though. She did that earlier.

Chapter 245 --Click here to view--

Naruto’s colour scheme consists of Yellow/Orange while Hinata’s consists of Blue/Purple. These colours are opposites on the colour wheel, hence showcasing how these two are opposites.

Color scheme isn't exactly what I would call a solid pairing argument, but if we're going to go there, the NaruSaku color scheme is something I'm pretty sure I've seen before in the manga...

Just saying~ --Click here to view--

Oh, right! It's the same color scheme as both MinaKushi and KizaMebu.

NaruHina parallels GokuChi, a pairing from DBZ, the show that has GREATLY inspired Kishimoto.

...But GokuChi is nothing like NaruHina. They have all of the things that you said turned you off about NaruSaku.

Teenage Chichi:


You remember that list of Tsunderes I was talking about earlier? I forgot to mention that Chichi is another one.

: --Click here to view--

"]

Hinata's name means something like "Towards the Sun" and Naruto is commonly described as being like the sun, as he shines light into the darkness in people's hearts.

And? What of it?

That's not even a pairing argument. LOL. I can speculate something just as absurd by bringing up Sakura's name, which means Cherry Blossom, which is a flower, which needs the sun to survive so NaruSaku is canon.

Let's stick to more solid arguments that come from the actually series, instead of bringing up silly things like names, color schemes and horoscopes.

Missus is an informal way to refer to someones wife. Now obviously Naruto and Hinata aren’t married (yet), but this was right after the hand-holding scene, so you get my drift.

This was also a mistranslation. One of Heaven & Earth's Japanese to English translators, 六道仙人, cleared that misunderstanding up for us on our 616 thread after we noticed the conflict between MangaPanda's translation and MangaStream's translation.

lol, MS... I checked on 2ch now about Ohana's script (pretty accurate from the original)

she written: "小娘" which means young girl so Mangapada was right here.

anyway madara doesn't gives a damn about this, he's just... Madara xD

Chapter 616 --Click here to view--

This is Madara's actual dialogue.

From my experience, MangaPanda is the best site to read the fan scanlations from, as they're the roughest and therefore the closest to what Kishimoto would have actually said. MangaStream likes to change the dialogue around so that it flows better in English, however, that often leads to misleading translations.

If you don't trust us on this issue, you can always check the official translation when it's released.

Look at Obito’s expression to Hinata and Naruto’s interaction.

Do you mean this?

Chapter 615 --Click here to view--

He wasn't reacting specifically to their interaction. As Madara explains, he was waiting to see how Naruto would respond, likely to see if he would still react the same way that Obito did when Rin died (which I'm sure is what Obito was expecting.)

Chapter 615 --Click here to view--

That being said, I'm not sure I understand why his reaction is relevant. What does it have to do with NaruHina becoming canon?

And don’t forget what pain said after he “killed” Hinata.

This is everything that Pain says after Hinata is backhanded into the ground:

Chapter 437 --Click here to view--

Let me go over this.
First, he compares Hinata's "death" to when his parents were killed.
Then he mentions how love (which can be any kind of love, given his prior example of familial love) leads to sacrifice, which leads to hatred, and then pain.
After that, he notes that Naruto is angry and unleashed the Kyuubi. (Durr~)
He doubts in Naruto's ability to understand the pain of others.
And finally ends by stating that his pain is greater than Naruto's pain.


...Again, I'm not sure how any of that ties into NaruHina.

Naruto unleashed the Kyuubi out of anger, yes, but that isn't an indication that he's fallen in love with Hinata. He would have reacted the same way if it had been anyone else. Protecting his friends is a big deal to Naruto, but in this particular instance, he wasn't able to do anything. He was helpless and forced to watch as Pain completely crippled Hinata's body. Of course he was going to fly into a rage over it.

Everytime Hinata gets the spotlight it has something to do with Naruto. NaruHina not happening would be severely neglecting Hinata and her theme.

I didn't realize this series was called Hinata Shippuden.

If Kishimoto wanted NaruSaku he would have made Hinata's feelings fade, but he didn't.
If Kishimoto wanted NaruSaku, he would have probably made it canon by now, they're all alone without Sasuke, so why hasn't it happened?

Not necessarily. He's very capable of making a pairing canon without fading the feelings of other characters. Hinata's love for Naruto, as well as Sakura's love for Sasuke, add a touch of drama to the story, but just because they're included, it doesn't mean that they'll be the final pairings.

I can answer your second question with one word: development. NaruSaku is a slow-burn pairing. Kishimoto has done a lot of progressive build-up for it starting all the way back in chapter 3, but like I said, it's been slow. There have been, and still are, a lot of obstacles for Naruto and Sakura to overcome - one being Sakura's love for Sasuke, which is very close to being put out. (Chapter 540, anyone?)

The hard part about being a NaruSaku fan is having the patience for it, but as they say, good things come to those who wait.

Sakura knows about Hinata's feelings for Naruto, it wouldn't be very nice on her part to still chase after him.

I'm afraid that's not how love works, dear. Let's not shaft the main character's feelings. He still loves his Sakura-chan and she's starting to reciprocate.

Anyway, that's all I have the time for, for now. The Hobbit awaits me! (I finally bought it! I'm so excited~ )

Edited by Slextrem, 29 March 2013 - 12:38 AM.

[Beastbomb]

Sadly if NaruSaku becomes canon, we will get a crap storm of spam and hate slander over simple fan pairings which are meaningless in the end, my guess is this is just a bored NH fan who decided to come here, especially since today of all days is Sakuras birthday.

All I know is, if the day for NS becoming canon does come, this site better lockdown for a few days.

Development isn't limited to current chapters. Event happens, inspiration happens, resolve happens. Very staccato.
I think you missed a lot of her actions. You are reducing her character because you don't approve of few specific things. As my friend said Hinata draws inspiration from Naruto and her thoughts are relevant to what is currently happening.



I don't think it necessarily debunks NaruHina. I see more like opposing views. It would be in the same position vice versa.

How many person to person talks have they had. The only two I can remember was the Chunin exams which are the panels when she gives him medicine and before Naruto and Neji's fight. They do not have very many if any at all personal interactions. Most of Hinata's actions with Naruto are her and how he "gives her strength" through his nindo or how much she "loves him." Sakura and Naruto have personal interactions all the time. Naruto seeks her out, when do you see Naruto looking for Hinata? Never. The quality of the interactions aren't that great when it comes to Hinata and Naruto either. Hinata only comes in for sensational moments where she can shine. You never see her doing anything else with Naruto, nothing, nada. There is not enough development between them wether it be quality or quantity unless Kishi decides to step up his game in the following chapters.

Edit: forgot to add that talking about the nindo is filler as well when it comes to personal talks between the two.

Edited by Beastbomb, 29 March 2013 - 12:38 AM.

[PhenixElite]

....I gotta ask... how many times has she talked about naruto's nindo?

I only remember the chunin exams......when else?

Not sure i somehow remember her talking about his nindo in part 2 as well, or maybe it was only filler-

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

I dont see a confession as character development.
I also dont really see any during the chunin exam. She only copied his nindo.
Her character only started to change during war.

@Dαrkrєrsŧ:
I think 615 is combined with her words during 573(if thats right). In 615 it was her first time to pep talk him like before always naruto had to do with her.
In 573 she made the decission to do so.

615 was just the outcome of Naruto's speech and 573.
I said that her nindo that she copied from Naruto was never tested this is the reason why i disagree when people say that Naruto and Hinata are alike, it's easy to copy someome's else nindo but if you dont pass thought the same obstacles it's the same as nothing.
While Sakura does not have a nindo but had to pass on situations that she had to prove like her near-death situation against Sasori.
"i promised i cannot give up".

Naruto was tested thoughout the entire manga while Hinata did nothing it's even kind of irrational for her to not waver like Naruto and i think the reason for this is that Neji wasnt special to her.

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 29 March 2013 - 12:37 AM.

[Moriarty]

Show me the chapters of hinata getting development pls. Remember, hinata saying naruto kun and saying that she goes to war to protect him is no development.

Well, depends on where you want to see it. I could bring in all the chapters but that wouldn't make a difference. I find that event in the pit, when she confessed as development. And I don't mean the confession specifically, the way she said it and her determination is great development. Also not because she went to war to protect him. Which I really don't see it to be completely true. I don't think she went to war to just protect him. Protecting Naruto was an objective for the whole clan because he does have something the other side wanted that would kinda screw everyone over if he got caught. And yes, Hinata may have had a bit of extra motivation because she likes him, Hinata really does care about her clan, she was on par with all the other teams.

Anyways the pit, I very much see it as a declaration of her devotion to help. Stating her presence as a fellow comrade that is willing to take a hit for Naruto. And yeah, saying I love you too. There was no stuttering, there was no shying away. There was still insecurity there, but that doesn't mean there is not progress. And I think that

[PhenixElite]

615 was just the outcome of Naruto's speech and 573.
I said that her nindo that she copied from Naruto was never tested this is the reason why i disagree when people say that Naruto and Hinata are alike, it's easy to copy someome's else nindo but if you dont pass thought the same obstacles it's the same as nothing.
While Sakura does not have a nindo but had to pass on situations that she had to prove like her near-death situation against Sasori.
"i promised i cannot give up".

Naruto was tested thoughout the entire manga while Hinata did nothing it's even kind of irrational for her to not waver like Naruto and i think the reason for this is that Neji wasnt special to her.

Yeah as said 615 is combined with 573.

[Beastbomb]

Well, depends on where you want to see it. I could bring in all the chapters but that wouldn't make a difference. I find that event in the pit, when she confessed as development. And I don't mean the confession specifically, the way she said it and her determination is great development. Also not because she went to war to protect him. Which I really don't see it to be completely true. I don't think she went to war to just protect him. Protecting Naruto was an objective for the whole clan because he does have something the other side wanted that would kinda screw everyone over if he got caught. And yes, Hinata may have had a bit of extra motivation because she likes him, Hinata really does care about her clan, she was on par with all the other teams.

Anyways the pit, I very much see it as a declaration of her devotion to help. Stating her presence as a fellow comrade that is willing to take a hit for Naruto. And yeah, saying I love you too. There was no stuttering, there was no shying away. There was still insecurity there, but that doesn't mean there is not progress. And I think that

No, plz do. I have an open mind. But i don't think you have the evidence to support your claims.

Edited by Beastbomb, 29 March 2013 - 12:42 AM.

[Moriarty]

No, plz do. I have an open mind. But i don't think youhave the evidence to support your claims.

I may not have added imagery but I'm sure I just talked about a specific event. Unless you want a picture of that.

[PhenixElite]

Well, depends on where you want to see it. I could bring in all the chapters but that wouldn't make a difference. I find that event in the pit, when she confessed as development. And I don't mean the confession specifically, the way she said it and her determination is great development. Also not because she went to war to protect him. Which I really don't see it to be completely true. I don't think she went to war to just protect him. Protecting Naruto was an objective for the whole clan because he does have something the other side wanted that would kinda screw everyone over if he got caught. And yes, Hinata may have had a bit of extra motivation because she likes him, Hinata really does care about her clan, she was on par with all the other teams.

Anyways the pit, I very much see it as a declaration of her devotion to help. Stating her presence as a fellow comrade that is willing to take a hit for Naruto. And yeah, saying I love you too. There was no stuttering, there was no shying away. There was still insecurity there, but that doesn't mean there is not progress. And I think that

And how is that character development? Yeah she confessed, but theres nothing on that, that shows development in anyway. Also i dont see a develpment in her wanting to protect naruto, since this is something she wanted to do from the beginning.

Nothing of these points changed her character.

[Beastbomb]

I may not have added imagery but I'm sure I just talked about a specific event. Unless you want a picture of that.

Think one event in the entire manga is going to change my mind? I need more than just one quality moment that allows Hinata to shine by killing off a charcter in order for her to obtain her development.