54216 replies to this topic

[TacticalFox88]

I don't know about you guys, but the continued to denial of NaruHina fans of BASIC STORYTELLING is BY FAR the thing that pisses me off the most about the Naruto fandom as a whole.

 

More so than dumb power level discussions, Fan wanking, trolling, this sits at the VERY TOP. 

 

Ugh. 

[soraandven]

I think it was needed, I remember getting a couple PMS on my YouTube channel last night, and these NH fans replied, "This is no NARUSAKU MOMENT, so stop celebrating damn idiot. You should be thankful to Hinata because she tripped on purpose just for Sakura to have a moment" and I was sitting there going, what the hell is this?

wow sorry to hear you got messeges like that they are such hypocrites cuz they went crazy over 615

[Dalton.T.R]

This week wasn't half bad. I got a raise at my job, chap 662 has NH/SS fans in so much denial I'm dying of laughter reading their comments, and Justin Bieber was arrested from drinking under the influence. All in all not too bad at all.

[oksus]

This is probably not the place to ask it, but I think Tumblr hates me.

I have already made a few posts, but I can never find them in tags I put, even when I go to the recent posts. 

Does anyone else experience this ? >.< How to fix it ?

[TouKen4Life3g]

I think it was needed, I remember getting a couple PMS on my YouTube channel last night, and these NH fans replied, "This is no NARUSAKU MOMENT, so stop celebrating damn idiot. You should be thankful to Hinata because she tripped on purpose just for Sakura to have a moment" and I was sitting there going, what the hell is this?

I get the feeling each NaruSaku fans like ourselves have received similar comments from Naruhina fans which again I find pretty sad.

My review never got attacked till now. It's sad.

[ladyannelise]

I think it was needed, I remember getting a couple PMS on my YouTube channel last night, and these NH fans replied, "This is no NARUSAKU MOMENT, so stop celebrating damn idiot. You should be thankful to Hinata because she tripped on purpose just for Sakura to have a moment" and I was sitting there going, what the hell is this?
I get the feeling each NaruSaku fans like ourselves have received similar comments from Naruhina fans which again I find pretty sad.

Hinata tripped on purpose?.. poor Hinata, you should really know what kind of fans you gathered.. then again, i salute them for seeing even the tiny bit of good side on everything you do even if it means falling on your face..
peace!

[Luna]

Hinata's thought as she watch Naruto leave. :( I feel bad for her though. Did she forget her adopted "never give up" nindo?

[FireFox]

Hinata's thought as she watch Naruto leave. :( I feel bad for her though. Did she forget her adopted "never give up" nindo?

Yes she did ,  she leave it all to Neji's spirit to safe Naruto's life "never give up" my ass . Somehow i don't feel so bad for her because she should have learned this lesson a long time ago , you can't just force your self to someone in order to reach out to him it's not how love works and i think with her falling to reach out to him was like the Universe/Kishimoto has spoken to her it's not your place to do that i'm sorry but that place is already taken by someone else who has always been beside him you were to late with your approach in the end.   BTW that song fits her perfectly :)))  

Edited by NarutoFireFoxUzumaki, 25 January 2014 - 02:33 AM.

[Inferno180]

Well I have an interesting thing to say, its not on the pairings themselves, but its rather on a commonly thrown around claim many fans say:

 

Its the ever popular "Kishi is just messing with the pairings to rile the fans."

 

I've said before, this isnt true but not in a great detail so here we go.

 

Just listening to this statement, people are implying that Kishimoto is inhertienly going out of his way to rile up the fans, they are implying that he is using manga space and time to just insert these nitpicks of romantic development and back and forth between the whole Hinata loves Naruto loves Sakura loves Sasuke doesn't give a kitten train.

 

Now this claim in my opinion, its utter garbage and the worst excuse any fans could make at this point, its not that is a very simplistic argument or claim, its the fact that people think the author and manga team themselves purposely go out of their way to do what they are claiming.

 

A better thing to ask is why do people think this and when did it actually start and what really is the difference between a series that has their creation team messing with the fans and those who don't?

 

Lets look at it bit by bit:

 

Why do people think this: Really this is the most vast area, people imply this because we all receive the content of the naruto manga differently, again this also goes into different perceptions such as symbolisim, cultural differences (mainly the japan themes different reception by each country such as America, Russia, Germany, China, England, etc) This differs by individuals and is so vast, theres no easy way to go about it. This is really focusing on the entirety of the series, but for the stuff about how people recieve the thought of kishi and the manga team purposely messing with the pairings, it depends. People are what I call "aware of the story at different levels" some people follow only the dialouge, obviously thats not the only thing to do in a manga series which given pictures also has meaning. Some go about taking everything word for word or otherwise looking too deep into other things. Some people are accustomed to the series in different ways, many I know first saw the anime, others saw the manga. Many differences, not counting filler exist between the canon anime and orignal content of the manga. Others just may forget one event to another (one guy in a 662 review honestly forgot Hiruzen came back in the tree of life events to save naruto, he was yelling how this was some crap kishi pulled for him just being back there, this is the type I mean, someone who forgets easily).

 

Its nothing against people with these differences, no reader is perfect, but the deal is in my opinion, people really may have just attributed it to what they concluded from individual preceptions of the author's writing style and ability. Many remember how kishi pulled stuff like tobi being obito, orochimaru being revived, madara being the super weapon of kabuto, etc. In the pairings, maybe it was just due to the stuff of how when one event that could be said pairing wise occured, another different one did come. This is really the only thing I can put on it like we got Hinatas confession followed by Sakuras hug and so on, while many would think its messing, its not and theres a good reason why. This goes to the next section of when this all started.

 

When this all started was during yes, Hinata's confession: It was that moment I would say the pairing wars esclated, then Sakuras hug was recived as a notion of war to really start it and it only super intensified with 469 and the varied reception from it, the kushina foreshadow, and the fact both the aftermath of sakuras land of iron events (confession plus sasuke attempted killings) and hinatas confession, they were never addressed. Many felt this would be a good reason kishi messed with everyone, yet there are good reasons to counter this claim.

 

First, look at Hinata, her confession was a big moment, but in the entirity of the manga, she had not been used really at all since the chunin exams, until neji was defeated, she had purpose in part 1, after that, none. That was like 4-5 years of no importance or development on her character. Yes she was in the itachi pursuit, but there was no real development in that arc, not even for naruto or sakura, that was sasuke's arc. So whats the problem here? its because kishi chose to use Hinata and then didnt follow up with it. The confession itself is really still been almost forgotten, naruto remembered her actions in 559 but thats it, we still have no notion of narutos thoughts to her. Really the problem is kishi basically fired off a big gun too soon and didnt nail or follow up with anything on it. usually in shounen series, the big L-bomb comes in later or when someone knows they are done for, otherwise he just made a spotlight for hinata but didnt follow up with it. In the time that has followed, we just see Hinata doing more of what we always see her do, say narutos name and just go on. 615 was a big moment for her, but its faded just as quick, 615 is really more about nejis death. Again kishi didnt follow up but the other problem is, he keeps throwing obsticiles in when he would boost NS. But wait, if he throws obsticles in with NS is that messing with NH fans? No its really just the opposite:

 

Second, yes this reason is the author's intent. If kishi really was messing with fans, then why intend so much with one relation like Naruto and Sakura? This doesnt mean NS is canon, but he sure as hell gave a lot of focus on the relation between them gradually going in the series, it started as sakura thinking naruto is annoying, but now we are at the point she is ready to cry because he is dying. NS gradually developed over the series run. The fact of this is well, not a thing to be argued, no matter what anyone says, this is one of the most dynamic changes in any relationship in the series from where it started (sakura hating narutos guts) to where its now her begging him to keep strong as she tries to keep him alive. The whole aspect of the childhood relation to her tolerating him then seeing him as a friend to the shippuden parts of learning about his status as a jinchurki, seeing the 4 tails, the impact of the promise, and now this, all these moments have had a heavy emotional toll on sakura and yes the current one should too. Sakura came to care more for naruto each event that came. Not love necessarily but yes much more concern and compassion each time. Because kishi did many Naruto and Sakura events like these, its best to assume this was his intent love or not.

 

On the hinata side, he has done some stuff but not much, its just like he sets something up for nh but then either leaves it unaddressed or just puts another obsticle in for it.

 

On the SS side, its even more self evident that this one is just well, derailed, if he hasnt done anything with it aside from the negative stuff like the defection and land of iron stuff, yeah no need to explain.

 

So what would his real intent be? Well thats what we dont know but its best to assume in his writing style, he isnt intending to go out of his way to "mess with the pairings" that brings us to the third point

 

What is messing vs non-messing?

 

This is the big part, what exactly is a situation when the creators mess with "pairings" or to "rile the fans?"

 

It would be when there are constant releationships between said various characters and different social dynamics occur to the point it leads to shifting recpetions and attitudes between characters on the points of friendship and more, generally yes romantic relations.

 

First off lets look at Naruto, its a shounen, it has some romance but all that lies behind the action, drama, adventure, etc. It takes a good backseat to most stuff. Its targeted towards 13 year old boys, boys at that age arnt really generally concerned with romance, generally they are still in middle school and just starting their teenage years, not really the top concern for guys at this age.

 

Next Naruto is a manga, as a manga, it needs to follow a pacing and spacing factor, that is everything that is placed in there is placed to fit a timeframe. Its just like comics in the west or other graphic novels that run long periods of time. All of these forms of media need to follow a timeframe and advocate the content and progression of the story they intend to best tell. Basically this is a critical part saying Kishi and his team cannot or just have no reason to take a good chunk of space only for the sole purpose of annoying fans or messing with them. Why would they take space when they are limited and need to keep the story moving when they are the most critical? They can throw humor in but their series is a shouen, its again action mostly, they stick to that.

 

Naruto also, it doesnt have what is said in the bolded above, there are not constant events when one lover is basically ticked off or recepted differently, there isnt a whole active love triangle when one girl is concerned about how a guy she likes is in love with another. Yes naruto has a love triangle, but when have we ever seen Hinata concerned with Naruto loving Sakura? What about Sakura with Hinata loving Naruto? It hasnt gone to that point at all in the story where one girl is concenred about the feelings of a guy for who they love or like. Its not like say Love Hina or Koroko Connect (as a friend told me) where there are different changing receptions in the romance aspect. Naruto doesnt really do this, the only time I can really say it did happen was with Sakura and Ino over sasuke, but even then Sasuke didnt give a crap. If anything it this stuff would be true only if kishi had put in some constant reception between other members of the love triangle as the story went on and it slowly changed, but it hasnt gone that way, its really been rather singular and simple, though some are aware of others love, it hasnt been constantly touched upon to the point some fans make as it would be normal in other series like yes Love Hina.

 

So why do we still see some romantic stuff in naruto in the anime extensions, fillers, and other media? Thats because the anime, SD, and other teams are free to do what they want. They just reiterate the story or make orignal content. The fillers could get away with other romantic elements or stuff like ep 235 with Naruto confessing his love about Sakura and how he wont give up on her, its not their job to make the confession come if it does, they only need to do what they feel is to make a good filler. Media like games such as UNS2 and 3, they had slight romantic stuff but that was fanservice. Naruto has fanservice but hardly in the main series, the main series needs to tell a story as said before, the other media series get the freedom to do what they want as long as its in character.  Look at SD, it went so overboard, it made fun of and invoaked all sorts of fanservice, its a non-canon spinoff, they even took events in which they referenced diehard and other animes, they crank it up to 11 in terms of ridiculousness. SD is basically the insane dumping ground for tearing everything up we love about naruto and making fun of the series and fans itself. Kishi and his team dont mess with the fans, they have no or little time or even need for that. Studio Perriot sometimes does but not much. SD however goes out of their way as they are non-canon and have a free pass to make jokes out of all the orignal content they want, thats their ability to do so. SD has no story, its just naruto wacky fun time.

 

So what about other series? Well there are a few:

 

Avatar the last airbender: Zutara is all I can say, there is proof and even admittance and evidence of them messing with those who thought Zutara would come true, other pairings were also messed with from time to time like Sokka and toph or Sokka and Suki. Really this is the prime example.

 

Teen titans 2003: I remember this one, the only canon pairing at the end was Robin and Starfire (but it was hinted and brought up many times in the series) however there were many instances of messing on the Beast Boy Raven and Terra front. Many thought raven and beastboy had a chance and they did grow closer but not romantically. The biggest stab was when the final episode had terra leaving her past life to be normal not wanting to see beast boy anymore. Even in the series itself, there were many instances of raven and beastboy at one part having something mutual and then unmutual or even jealous/worried about the other when another came in, talk about a mindgame.

 

Adventure time: yes this kid cartoon for as funny as it is, it has pairing disputes and the creators made seasons of what people thought could happen only to have finns tiny heart stabbed out twice. First was the ship Finn and PB, this was seen as funny and admiral but then when PB reverted back to 13 years of age, people thought this would kick in. Then she returned to being 18. Then as the later episodes came (before burning low) Finn realized PB couldn't do all the stuff he did, a difference in age and responsibilities was their main difference. In burning low, this pairing died by all means when flame princess was introduced. Someone more age appropriate for finn entered the scene. Finn let go of his crush on PB and went to flame princess, after some episodes they became together, then finn  messed it up in frost and fire by provoaking a fight between her and ice king. Then it came to the point she would forgive and still be friends with him after she took over the fire kingdom and as the ruler she could no longer be with him. So then Finn x flame princess burnt out just like the one before it.

 

Regular show: Yes this show too, everyone remembers how Mordecai loved Marget, 4 to 5 seasons they finally get together only for Marget to go to college and he lets her. Then the new years one comes around and reintroduced the cloud girl CJ.

 

If Regular show and adventure time have anything, its they build up these for so long only to dump them, this is what many think kishi is doing with NS, but the 2 shows here are for humor, naruto is serious and has gone on for years longer. Naruto is a single story, the others are just shorts with a continuity but no main overlying plot, just one episode after another, they dumped these pairings and just yes, messed with the fans.

 

Its in the end, I can understand why some people think kishi would mess with the pairings, but in truth he does not. Kishi hasnt done anything like this in naruto, even with people thinking 469 removed NS, throwing in 631 and never showing a change in feelings on his end for sakura, thats just really countering this claim itself. Kishi and his team dont mess with pairings because its not in their prime concern or focus too, naruto in the main manga never really has messed with the fans, maybe the twists like madara being the secret weapon or obito being tobi were like this, but those are just plot twists and revleations, implemented long ago to be revealed later on. But in terms of romance, no just no. Kishi doesnt do this and if anything its evident itself that it would serve no purpose to do this even in a late serious moment. People claiming NH tripping is a rile up the NH fans event, sorry but no, its just drama plain and simple. She loves naruto but couldnt reach him. Sakura is the focus though and yes will have a big reaction but its not suprising considering Sakura regarding naruto has been evident and used much more gradually developing when again kishi does use hinata, he doesnt lead her anywhere. Just like how 631 could have been written differently, he legitmetley could have had hinata join the ride but didnt. Really this event is just seeminly another case of NS advances and NH gets another obsticile thrown in, its not messing with the fans either. If 631 was his way of continuing the Kushina foreshadow revealing to the audience that Sakura is the girl like Kushina that Naruto is hinted to be with at the end, then its not messing with the fans or throwing a bone to the NS fans, its just the authors intent and its what he believes will progess his story in the way he feels is right, not going out of his way to make us complain and go crazy.

[MangaReader]

And in the heat of all this pairing stuff, I managed to read this on a non-Naruto site ^^; 

 

"Ino's been amazing during this war; aside from her controlling the Juubi for a second and connecting Hashirama to everyone, I loved how she saved Choji when they were fighting zombie Asuma. I totally expected her to be the damsel in distress in that fight, but she proved to be very valuable. I actually wish she was the main female protagonist at this point."

 

Which was a response to this: 

 

"The females in Naruto are nothing special, but sometimes even small feats can get them a nod of approval from ole Platinum fan. For example I never expected Ino Yamanaka to be useful in the field. I always assumed she'd be like Tenten once she stopped hanging with Sakura. The character proved me wrong. She's not super strong, and she's still a very minor character but she's been more useful then half the Konoha pack outside Naruto, Sasuke, Shikamaru, and any nearby healers. I never expected her to take control of the Juubi even for a split second or link Hashirama with everyone. It just shows you don't need broken Biju or Uchiha powers to be helpful, even if it's minor. I had to eat a slice of humble pie in regards to Ino. I just wish Tenten did at least one thing on panel during this war. Females really do get the short end of the stick."

 

It's like Sakura just can't win ಠ_ಠ

[TouKen4Life3g]

i don't know why but I am still shocked about the whole NS/SK situation in this latest chapter. It's almost surreal.

[Dalton.T.R]

I want to know where NH/SS fans are coming up with the idea of Sakura finding Sasuke and just abandoning Naruto when she sees him, and Tsunade taking over Naruto's condition.  Sakura is nowhere near Sasuke, she doesn't even know where he is, much less knows he's expecting a visit from the Grim Reaper, Tsunade stayed behind with the others and therefor was left in the dust by Gaara, Karin knows about Sasuke, and probably knows where he is (arguably) 

 

I just don't get how they're getting this idea. Once Garra tells Sakura what happened to Naruto , she's going to freak! She's not going to care about what's going on with Sasuke at this point. She barely has enough chakra to take care of Naruto, let alone the both of them!

 

LOGIC, PEOPLE! SOME LOGIC WOULD BE NICE HERE!

 

 

And the whole Hinata would have been better than Sakura...how? I want to know the answer to this. How would she have been better for Naruto given the circumstances?

 

AGAIN! LOGIC! USE IT, PEOPLE!

 

Classic!

Edited by Dalton (I stink at names), 25 January 2014 - 03:52 AM.

[TrueSacrifice]

Given the climax of the chapter it seems incredibly unlikely that Sakura is going to be the one to come to Sasuke's aid. Chalk it up to wishful thinking from desperate fans.

[bthug]

Any idea what Kurama's plans are? I think it might have something to do with Kushina

[TouKen4Life3g]

Not sure yet, but the chance of Minato is increasing.

[DattebayoXShannaro]

^ Actually, I think Madara will go after Minato to get the other half.  There must be a reason why he had the Gedo Mazou leave.  Also, the battle wasn't that far away from Minato, Kakashi and Obito to make a trip to the Alliance to get a healer to prolong Naruto's life.

 

This week wasn't half bad. I got a raise at my job, chap 662 has NH/SS fans in so much denial I'm dying of laughter reading their comments, and Justin Bieber was arrested from drinking under the influence. All in all not too bad at all.

 

Come on, man.  Let's just take it as fitting consequences and leave it at that.  Nothing to get happy over,

[TouKen4Life3g]

Well it's possible that the beast is recharging to enter the complete before hatching. Not to mention it lost a body part, so perhaps it will take a short time. Or there could be something he wants to do first.

Plus, I wonder if he knows about the other half. Either way, the reason is to get the eye back or the other half. We don't know until we know where he left.

Edited by NaruSaku4Life3g, 25 January 2014 - 12:54 PM.

[Superman333]

^ Actually, I think Madara will go after Minato to get the other half.  There must be a reason why he had the Gedo Mazou leave.  Also, the battle wasn't that far away from Minato, Kakashi and Obito to make a trip to the Alliance to get a healer to prolong Naruto's life.
 
 
Come on, man.  Let's just take it as fitting consequences and leave it at that.  Nothing to get happy over,

If he's happy about it he's happy about it . I burst end in laughter when I heard about .

[Inferno180]

Well despite the 663 predictions like where gaara is going along with where Madara is going, many theories are able to conflict and pose issues.

With the minato giving dark kurama to naruto stuff yes while it could work in hindsight, it also depends on where Madara is going. Not really good if gaara runs into Madara with an injured naruto. Unless Madara is just casually walking to spiral zetsu or somewhere else entirely then there's no real clue but at this point but it can depend in one part on Madara, it would be even worse if Kakashi is left alone with Madara going there. Really this depends on madaras next action.

The other popular one is gaara takes naruto to the legendary fruit (if it's there) and the only problem I see with this one, how can things be fair in the final fight if it essentially gives naruto god mode powers? It would make things harder in the final naruto vs Sasuke fight. Unless Sasuke gets the rinnegan, but I really just cannot imagine a god mode battle between them, even on just naruto. Really when I see the final fight, I would rather see tailed beast mode with sage mode naruto facing Sasuke using a Madara scaled sussano. But really this is also dependent on what kurama told gaara.

Sakura sacrificing herself for naruto is out of the question, kuramas plan doesn't involve someone needing to die as far as we know, not to mention it makes no sense for sakura to only keep naruto up only to kill herself for him. There's nothing plot wise adding up for this.

Really this depends on gaaras action and madaras next move. Madara is arrogant fortunately for the SA Madara didn't just unleash the ten tails or decide to finish them off. It's safe to assume he is going either to obito, spiral zetsu or to fight the other shinobi but we are stuck waiting on this one.

If he isn't going to the obito location, if gaara and sakura go to minato, well that's good for a few ns reasons like sakura meeting minato again, it makes sense in a situation like this since she met him before.

[Hiraishin]

^ Actually, I think Madara will go after Minato to get the other half.  There must be a reason why he had the Gedo Mazou leave.  Also, the battle wasn't that far away from Minato, Kakashi and Obito to make a trip to the Alliance to get a healer to prolong Naruto's life.
 

Good point. I never thought that they were going to go to Minato in the first place (what could he do?), but this pretty much proves that they're not going to Minato, imo. I wonder where they're headed...