54216 replies to this topic

[FireFox]

 

1

 

No she knows because he says "Take care of my son..." But yeah I am hoping for some more Minato and Sakura scenes. 

I'm not so sure about it either cus the way Minato address it seems to be in a more quieter manner and more to himself , but i'm not ruling it out it also my be the case but then again we have no reaction from Sakura none zero did she also heard that or mist it , i mean even in RTN she had a reaction when she meet his parents way not here , its just so confusing ? 

[Kster95]

I'm not so sure about it either cus the way Minato address it seems to be in a more quieter manner and more to himself , but i'm not ruling it out it also my be the case but then again we have no reaction from Sakura none zero did she also heard that or mist it , i mean even in RTN she had a reaction when she meet his parents way not here , its just so confusing ?

No its very obvious that he is telling her directly to take care of naruto. Naruto hardly had a reaction so Sakura just went along with it, she did tell Naruto that he didnt seem phased but Naruto explained he sensed it before.

[FireFox]

No its very obvious that he is telling her directly to take care of naruto. Naruto hardly had a reaction so Sakura just went along with it, she did tell Naruto that he didnt seem phased but Naruto explained he sensed it before.

One thing is for sure she still didn't know who he was when he arrived even after Naruto said it .

scan

dunno may be you're right but its still fishy for me i mean come on no reaction none whatsoever that doesn't seem right it doesn't seem right at all , either way i hope next chapter proves it or the one after.  

[xxRomanceGirlxx]

Sorry, I know the topic's kind of changed but I had a bunch of thoughts on the Tsunade/Dan/Jiraiya thing and the NaruSaku parallels that I wanted to share with you guys.  I'd like to see what you think of it.

 

So NaruSaku has three parallels known so far in the manga. JiraTsu, MinaKushi, and ObiRin. Anyway, I started to notice a theme in these couples that not only reinforce the parallel argument, but they also fit extremely well with the surpassing the previous and NaruSaku's future. We already know this of course, but I feel like Kishi was trying to make a pattern somewhere in here other than similarities. It might be I'm just reading too much into it, but it seems to me that Kishimoto's level of obstacles for the NaruSaku parallels had varying degrees of severity and difficulty to it that intensely foreshadow Naruto and Sakura's eventual success.

 

I get the sense that Kishimoto's purpose of these parallels was always meant to blatantly explain that the newest generation will surpass the previous ones and that it was literally always meant to foreshadow NaruSaku was going to be endgame. That was why he had JiraTsu, MinaKushi, and ObiRin have similar backgrounds (more so OR & JT). I don't think he's just trying to show this in similarities, I think he was going in further by gradually lessening the amount of obstacles in each other parallel's relationship. Starting from JiraTsu to MinaKushi.

 

IMO, JiraTsu was by far one with the most difficulty. It had so many issues in Tsunade's core character that was not nearly as simple as loving another man and she also obviously regarded Jiraiya in distain for much longer out of the parallels. It took many, many years for Tsunade to IMO fully understand Jiraiya enough to love him. It was no question she did or at the very least had feelings for him, but I don't believe her feelings for him surpassed whatever she felt for Dan. In my honest opinion, that was the actually the point. It was supposed to be so damaged and impossible to happen to that extent. The first NaruSaku parallel was something in my opinion was one Kishi consciously chose to make that ridiculously hard to overcome to connect itself to Naruto's journey and his relationship with Sakura.

 

ObiRin was different and had much more simplified aspects to it likened to that of Early Part I T7: Boy with love for the female teammate that loved the cool one. It was less challenging than JiraTsu since Rin had always been kind to him from the start and had no trouble understanding him. Though, of course, we can never say for certain if she would've returned Obito's feelings if she hadn't died but the point of this is it was still portrayed as less complicated than the first NS parallel. It still didn't happen and again it wasn't supposed to, but the lack of problems on this in comparison to JT is definitely foreshadowing something for NS.

 

Lastly, we have the newest-introduced parallel MinaKushi. It turned out much, much differently than the other ones. And, looking at it from a simplified stance, it had an even more obvious lack of complications to it's way to canon than both of the other two for sure. All it had was that Kushina disliked Minato at first while Minato always had feelings for her, then led her to fall in love with him when he saved her, getting married, and having a child. Though the one thing they didn't surpass in ... was that had both died before they could truly live a life together as parents and family. Hint, hint.

 

I might be entirely wrong and feel free to disagree, but the pattern seems to indicate that Kishi might've broke down the NaruSaku parallels from being as hard as possible to not even hard, though still lacking the final touch. It was meant to foreshadow that NS was given a mixture of almost all of these challenging obstacles deflecting their road to canon, but in the end it would be worth it because they'd surpass the previously failed relationship parallels. We know that part, but I'd like to think that my theory that Kishimoto simplifying the parallels was another means to imply NaruSaku, it was just a lot more subtle.

 

I'd appreciate feedback on this, I very much want to know if any of you think my argument has validation. I'd be glad to hear your agreements or disagreements.

[TouKen4Life3g]

^To be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if that's the idea in the first place.

[TacticalFox88]

I want to agree with it so badly, but I just can't shake the feeling that outside of MinaKushi (which Kishi was about as subtle as a sledgehammer) that any other pairing parallel is just something Kishi doesn't conciously think about. I'm a cynic, and feel fandoms tend to read more into this stuff than the author ever intended. Biggest evidence for this is that Kishi missed a GOLDEN opportunity to make a ObiRin parallel. 

[TouKen4Life3g]

I want to agree with it so badly, but I just can't shake the feeling that outside of MinaKushi (which Kishi was about as subtle as a sledgehammer) that any other pairing parallel is just something Kishi doesn't conciously think about. I'm a cynic, and feel fandoms tend to read more into this stuff than the author ever intended. Biggest evidence for this is that Kishi missed a GOLDEN opportunity to make a ObiRin parallel. 

Not to rebuild hope or anything, but Obito is alive. I'm only throwing it out there.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

One thing is for sure she still didn't know who he was when he arrived even after Naruto said it .

scan

dunno may be you're right but its still fishy for me i mean come on no reaction none whatsoever that doesn't seem right it doesn't seem right at all , either way i hope next chapter proves it or the one after.

I wish i would know, why they are taught that he's the fourth, the purpose of the hokage mountain and their faces being drawn and even they are taught on the school about the hokages when even one of them appear before them they still dont know who they are, i'm srsly surprised on Sakura didnt knew who he was even with her reading books, being on the hokage office where there are pictures about them, then a guy with a cloak written "super fourth hokage" on the back she still doesnt know who this guy is.

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 11 January 2014 - 01:49 PM.

[T XD]

I want to agree with it so badly, but I just can't shake the feeling that outside of MinaKushi (which Kishi was about as subtle as a sledgehammer) that any other pairing parallel is just something Kishi doesn't conciously think about. I'm a cynic, and feel fandoms tend to read more into this stuff than the author ever intended. Biggest evidence for this is that Kishi missed a GOLDEN opportunity to make a ObiRin parallel. 

I do think that Kishi made the characters who were probably would be together and the ones who are canon pairing to be based on NS.

 

Each pair has two persons who share a very similar character and same personality as Naruto and Sakura which are JT, MK, OR, HM ( HashiMito, though we don' know much about Mito, but a character like Hashirama is bound to have a character like Sakura, from my knowledge on characters and their romantic partners, and once we saw her in a flashback by Obito which she gave an impression of a tsundere. But, the latter is from my perspective), YK ( YahiKonan, still Konan wasn't that much like Sakura, but she has healing abilities, had feelings for Yahiko who is like Naruto as well, and was together with him. Sakura and Konan don't have that much in common, from what I can think of, but for a character who has the most close similarity to Konan, I think of Sakura ).

 

The war hasn't finished, so OR can still have a canon parallel to NS. If it didn't happen, and by what Kishi has showed us many times when we see Team Minato flashbacks on how each were, act, and with Obito and Rin interaction, the two characters who are similar to Obito and Rin are Naruto and Sakura.

 

By the way, the OR parallel, if it does happen, doesn't have to be from Obito. It can be from Minato or Kakshi. They know Rin as well.

Edited by T XD, 11 January 2014 - 04:15 PM.

[KnS]

One thing is for sure she still didn't know who he was when he arrived even after Naruto said it .

 

I wish i would know, why they are taught that he's the fourth, the purpose of the hokage mountain and their faces being drawn and even they are taught on the school about the hokages when even one of them appear before them they still dont know who they are, i'm srsly surprised on Sakura didnt knew who he was even with her reading books, being on the hokage office where there are pictures about them, then a guy with a cloak written "super fourth hokage" on the back she still doesnt know who this guy is.

 

Since we know Sakura already understood the concept of Edo Tensei -- because she was with Kakashi and Sai when they encountered Zabuza and Haku and the Seven Swordsmen at the beginning of the fighting -- she's too smart to have forgotten the concept or misunderstood that Minato had been revived by Edo Tensei when she saw him.

 

Maybe Sakura said, "Who is he?" not because she didn't recognize Minato, but because -- just like us -- up until that point she had believed Minato could not be resurrected due to the manner of his death.  So when he appeared she didn't think it could actually be him, Edo Tensei or otherwise.

 

I mean, it wasn't until Kishimoto did the goofy asspull that allowed Orochimaru to revive Minato that WE knew it was possible for Minato to come back.  So it's conceivable that Naruto's smart girl would have been confused by his return.

  

It's a stretch, but the only other explanation is that Kishimoto totally spaced about six big details in his story while at the same time making Sakura look like a vapid dingaling.  However, I am forced to admit it's entirely possible.  

 

I want to agree with it so badly, but I just can't shake the feeling that outside of MinaKushi (which Kishi was about as subtle as a sledgehammer) that any other pairing parallel is just something Kishi doesn't conciously think about. I'm a cynic, and feel fandoms tend to read more into this stuff than the author ever intended. Biggest evidence for this is that Kishi missed a GOLDEN opportunity to make a ObiRin parallel. 

 

I have to disagree.  Even if there is no further allusion to the parallel between NS and OR, it is still a very obvious parallel.  

 

It is absolutely clear in the flashbacks of Team Minato that the dynamic between Obito, Rin, and Kakashi was meant to be the same as Team 7 -- and actually had as much if not more focus on the romance angle.  Obito seemed to be less embroiled in a man-to-man competition with Kakashi as Naruto has been with Sasuke.  

 

We might have seen more of a man to man rivalry if Kishimoto had taken the time to expand on the Gaiden, but the fact is what he has chosen to show us through all of Obito and Kakashi's flashbacks is the romance dynamic -- that Obito was in love with Rin, and her feelings for Kakashi were in the way.  That's an inarguable parallel.

 

Just because Kishimoto didn't choose to use his sledgehammer again and do some kind of additional obvious comparison (at least so far) doesn't change the fact that OR is still a parallel of NS.

Edited by KnS, 11 January 2014 - 04:01 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Besides, isn't it too obvious for NS already? There's no need to have a pairing war anymore. I even made pictures edited to demonstrate my thoughts on the war. It's really a whatever situation to me. I couldn't care less.

[Hanabi]

I wish i would know, why they are taught that he's the fourth, the purpose of the hokage mountain and their faces being drawn and even they are taught on the school about the hokages when even one of them appear before them they still dont know who they are, i'm srsly surprised on Sakura didnt knew who he was even with her reading books, being on the hokage office where there are pictures about them, then a guy with a cloak written "super fourth hokage" on the back she still doesnt know who this guy is.

when minato jumped in his cloak was up in the air. and then he turned around with his face full of edo tensei cracks, the fact that he's edo tensei is obviously more important.

[TacticalFox88]

Besides, isn't it too obvious for NS already? There's no need to have a pairing war anymore. I even made pictures edited to demonstrate my thoughts on the war. It's really a whatever situation to me. I couldn't care less.

Pictures edited? I'd like to see this. 

[TouKen4Life3g]

Pictures edited? I'd like to see this. 

Well, it's based on my page, so yeah, that's me in the nutshell.

http://sparda3g.tumb...uld-give-a-damn

[BakeNeko-Chan]

I want to agree with it so badly, but I just can't shake the feeling that outside of MinaKushi (which Kishi was about as subtle as a sledgehammer) that any other pairing parallel is just something Kishi doesn't conciously think about. I'm a cynic, and feel fandoms tend to read more into this stuff than the author ever intended. Biggest evidence for this is that Kishi missed a GOLDEN opportunity to make a ObiRin parallel. 

 

Fandoms definitely do read into things too much at times, especially where pairings are concerned, but in the case of the parallels in Naruto, I'm with KnS. Parallels are not a new or unusual storytelling device, Kishimoto just uses them more blatantly than others, and if MinaKushi, ObiRin and JiraTsu were the only parallels in the story, I might be inclined to give it leeway as coincidence, but then there are also the parallels of Hashirama and Madara's rivalry to Naruto and Sasuke's; Naruto being paralleled to Hashirama, Minato, Obito and Jiraiya; Sasuke paralleled to Orochimaru and Madara. And so on and so forth. There's just too many connections for me to think it's just coincidence or not something that Kishi does consciously, he does it on purpose, I'm pretty much convinced of that. And truthfully I can be a bit of a cynic as well sometimes so...   

Edited by BakeNeko-Chan, 11 January 2014 - 05:20 PM.

[Phantom_999]

Um guys, I really don't think that calling NH fans delusional is exactly fair because I recall that that at the beginning of the year lots of us were bawling our eyes out for that Naruto holding Hinata's hand scene, and it took  chapter 616 PLUS a few weeks of away from the "drama queen" incedent to calm everyone down again. So while We all support NS and some NH fans do spew nonsense, I think it's pretty hypocritical to laugh at their faces and call what they say "talking BS" if we have not done any better regarding 615. I even remember some members saying that they give up on NS and have jumped ship. Was it meant to be romantic? No, but did it convince us NH has stepped up initially? Don't lie to yourselves. Point is, leave the questioning of sanity and desperation out of debates. it brings out the worst in people, and I say that from personal experience and watching hell unleash when an NH moment comes out of the blue and  many members here cries "foul".
 

No. Delusional is EXACTLY what they are.
 
When you try to pass of 631 as a joke just because you can't accept what was said at Face value, then you certaintly qualify.

Oh? and how lots of us reacted at 615 wasn't "delusional"? how some NS fans said  "I jump ship!" before the manga ended wasn't "delusional"? I'm not saying saying that the  NH fans that make those arguments are not, but the fact remains that we call them delusional while we behave no better when there are NH moments is hypocrisy therefore leave that those personal attacks on them out. We know that they are making excuses, whether they acknowledge it or not but we don't have to call them out on it or insult them. It's a waste of energy and again we would not be talking if Kishi sucker punches us with another NH moment in the future. I am not defending them but I can not excuse how many of us NS fans acted out either so don't trash talk the arguments and don't trash talk the mentality. Simply debunk it with your own logical thoughts like a debate should be. 

Edited by Phantom_999, 11 January 2014 - 05:16 PM.

[TacticalFox88]

Um guys, I really don't think that calling NH fans delusional is exactly fair because I recall that that at the beginning of the year lots of us were bawling our eyes out for that Naruto holding Hinata's hand scene, and it took 616 PLUS a few weeks of away from the "drama queen" to calm everyone down again. So while We all support NS and some NH fans spew nonsense, I think it's pretty hypocritical to laugh at their faces and call what they say talking BS if we have not done any better regarding 615. I even remember some members saying that they give up on NS and have jumped ship. Was it meant to be romantic? No, but did it convince us NH has stepped up? Don't lie to yourselves. Point is, leave the questioning of sanity and desperation out of debates. it brings out the worst in people, and I say that from personal experience and watching hell unleash when an NH moment comes out of the blue and everyone here cries "foul".

No. Delusional is EXACTLY what they are.

 

When you try to pass of 631 as a joke just because you can't accept what was said at Face value, then you certaintly qualify. 

[TouKen4Life3g]

Well I understand what you mean, but calling all of them is not the right way to point out. There are ones that knows better and we have met them that will admit this and that. Heck, we know some that actually saw 615 as the end of NH. Let's keep it easy with the bashing, ok.

[咲耶姫]

Oh? and how lots of us reacted at 615 wasn't "delusional"? how some NS fans said  "I jump ship!" before the manga ended wasn't "delusional"? I'm not saying saying that the  NH fans that make those arguments are not, but the fact remains that we call them delusional while we behave no better when there are NH moments is hypocrisy therefore leave that those personal attacks on them out. We know that they are making excuses, whether they acknowledge it or not but we don't have to call them out on it or insult them. It's a waste of energy and again we would not be talking if Kishi sucker punches us with another NH moment. I am not defending them but I can not excuse how many of us NS fans acted out either so don't trash talk the arguments and don't trash talk the mentality. Simply debunk it with your own logical thoughts like a debate should be. 

I agree completely with your post, but I wouldn't call those NS fans reaction "delusional", it's more "over reacted". An example of NS delusional reaction to 615 was those who denied the fact that it was a NH moment, cause romantic or not it was a moment between Naruto and Hinata. 

But you're absolutely right, insulting all of them doesn"t make us look better than them. It just make us look cocky, too much self confident.

[Phantom_999]

Ah, yes. Thank you for the correction.  Right, overreacting would be the right word. So anyways Overeacting is no better than being delusional so it's best to just not get involved with it. just debate normally.  

Edited by Phantom_999, 11 January 2014 - 05:27 PM.