1876 replies to this topic

[catsi563]

wont be a world war of countries. Itll be much much worse.

The worst case scenario is that the rampant muslim baiting leads some muslim extremists to get hold of a WMD. they attempt to use it and irregardless of whether they succeed or fail. The world will be shocked and angered. now this could lead to two possible scenarios. Either the muslim world ((specifically the silent majority)) stands up to the extremists, and fights them with us which leads to muslims the world over fighting and living under harsher conditions then they do now.

Or the muslim world fails to act and draconian antimuslim laws are put in to place declaring inslam to be a terrorist cult and not a religion. This results in concentration camps, reeducation centers, and flat out religious warfare on a scale unheard of since the crusades.

While islam may survive much as the catholic church did under Henry the 8th it will do so in a severly dimished form.

I pray that neither scenario ever comes to pass and that muslims the world over fight these extremists decry them openly and force them to surrender. because if they dont then hatred may rule the day before all is said and done.

[Codus N]

You had me at Gundam. And or Spartans, I'm haunted by my death on Reach.

Also I want to talk about this.... Who knew the Germans were like this!?!

Yes, I purposefully did that to lighten the mood a bit After all, if WWIII breaks out, chances are high Japan will have created a REAL Gundam by then through secret funding. (I'm thinking a Gundam project would take at least 25 years to make considering the current technology we have as of now)
And yeah, the amount of paranoia is REALLY getting irritating.

@catsi: if you're talking about us Indonesians, well, on one hand, we want to keep our foreign policy the way it is but on the other hand, I feel some of us would like the government to be a bit more aggressive with our military power. And we also hate Muslim radicals just as much as you guys. So, it's kind of 50/50 if it ever breaks out. We could try to form a demilitarized coalition with other countries (like Swiss). We will only fight when it's absolutely necessary (direct attack to our country or attacks on our citizens) The reason why we probably won't join you guys is because our nation holds the multicultural ideology strongly. Remember that we're not a muslim country. We are simply a majority. Nothing more, nothing less. If we were to fight, some people might get the wrong idea, and it may cause a civil war (which we definitely don't want to happen)

[Strangelove]

wont be a world war of countries. Itll be much much worse.

The worst case scenario is that the rampant muslim baiting leads some muslim extremists to get hold of a WMD. they attempt to use it and irregardless of whether they succeed or fail. The world will be shocked and angered. now this could lead to two possible scenarios. Either the muslim world ((specifically the silent majority)) stands up to the extremists, and fights them with us which leads to muslims the world over fighting and living under harsher conditions then they do now.

Or the muslim world fails to act and draconian antimuslim laws are put in to place declaring inslam to be a terrorist cult and not a religion. This results in concentration camps, reeducation centers, and flat out religious warfare on a scale unheard of since the crusades.

While islam may survive much as the catholic church did under Henry the 8th it will do so in a severly dimished form.

I pray that neither scenario ever comes to pass and that muslims the world over fight these extremists decry them openly and force them to surrender. because if they dont then hatred may rule the day before all is said and done.

Catsi...those times are over. The world is mostly secular now, and religion has taken a backseat in most of Europe and North America. Your case scenario has no backup whatsoever.

As a matter of fact, the world survived 8 years of Bush and 2 years of Obama. I actually feel happy because it has survived for so long.

Edited by Strangelove, 20 October 2010 - 01:34 AM.

[Insurrection]

Catsi...those times are over. The world is mostly secular now, and religion has taken a backseat in most of Europe and North America. Your case scenario has no backup whatsoever.

As a matter of fact, the world survived 8 years of Bush and 2 years of Obama. I actually feel happy because it has survived for so long.

Doesn't anyone want to talk about European stuff instead? Like the German Chancellor saying Multiculturalism has failed in her country or that there were violent protest in France because they're considering raising the retirement age to *GASP* 62!?!

The American Political talk is just getting stale right now.

Edited by Insurrection, 20 October 2010 - 02:39 AM.

[Kyuudaime]

Doesn't anyone want to talk about European stuff instead? Like the German Chancellor saying Multiculturalism has failed in her country or that there were violent protest in France because they're considering raising the retirement age to *GASP* 62!?!

The American Political talk is just getting stale right now.

I'm guessing most of the people in this (specific) thread are either American or interested in American politics... anyone could easily take the initiative though to start with something else, that might be nice.

[Codus N]

@catsi: gotta agree with Strange there. Although I wouldn't put it past them to actually do that, but chances are 20-30% I'd bet.

[Insurrection]

I'm guessing most of the people in this (specific) thread are either American or interested in American politics... anyone could easily take the initiative though to start with something else, that might be nice.

I'm American and I'm saying until next week everything we talk about is equated to anime filler for American politics there's nothing new, it's the same freakin' stump speech from everyone.

Catsi is on a liberal soapbox stereotype

Newkerz is upset about the belief that America and Islamic radicals are going to destroy the earth because there isn't a shared comparison of morality.

I'm not even going to start with other stuff but this is just a plea, PLEASE can we talk about something other than the normal junk. Still political but not the same stuff.

Can't we jump on Europe's problems once and awhile? Just Sayin.

Edited by Insurrection, 21 October 2010 - 05:57 PM.

[Strangelove]

Doesn't anyone want to talk about European stuff instead? Like the German Chancellor saying Multiculturalism has failed in her country or that there were violent protest in France because they're considering raising the retirement age to *GASP* 62!?!

The American Political talk is just getting stale right now.

Right, when i saw the French thing i said "Don't destroy your whole country just because they raise your retirement age..."

The German chancellor doesn't surprise me, Germany and Multiculturalism don't mix.

[catsi563]

The German chancellor doesn't surprise me, Germany and Multiculturalism don't mix

Gee that wasnt a racict and generalizing statement or anything.

next thing we know you'll say that Christians and religious tolerance dont mix.

[Strangelove]

Gee that wasnt a racict and generalizing statement or anything.

next thing we know you'll say that Christians and religious tolerance dont mix.

Christians and religious tolerance don't mix.

There, i said it.








I don't mean to say things as a whole, more around. Reputation. Especially very bad reputations like persecutions.

Edited by Strangelove, 21 October 2010 - 11:06 PM.

[catsi563]

that pretty well covers most of the white race, and a large chunk of the french and hispanic and asian and muslim races.

So pretty well most of humanity.

*Shrug* oh well.

[Strangelove]

that pretty well covers most of the white race, and a large chunk of the french and hispanic and asian and muslim races.

So pretty well most of humanity.

*Shrug* oh well.

Actually, it covers everyone.

[Codus N]

I'm American and I'm saying until next week everything we talk about is equated to anime filler for American politics there's nothing new, it's the same freakin' stump speech from everyone.

Catsi is on a liberal soapbox stereotype

Newkerz is upset about the belief that America and Islamic radicals are going to destroy the earth because there isn't a shared comparison of morality.

I'm not even going to start with other stuff but this is just a plea, PLEASE can we talk about something other than the normal junk. Still political but not the same stuff.

Can't we jump on Europe's problems once and awhile? Just Sayin.

It's okay, I don't mind. After all, I prefer international issues. And BTW, I get the feeling you're forgetting that I'm a foreigner.....

And oh yeah, catsi started it.....

Edited by Newkerz, 22 October 2010 - 05:32 AM.

[catsi563]

Started It? I havent started diddly squat yet. Get me really angry, then Ill start a revolution thatll make that little tea party thrown in the 1700s look like a little girls sleep over.

[Nee-sama]

wont be a world war of countries. Itll be much much worse.

The worst case scenario is that the rampant muslim baiting leads some muslim extremists to get hold of a WMD. they attempt to use it and irregardless of whether they succeed or fail. The world will be shocked and angered. now this could lead to two possible scenarios. Either the muslim world ((specifically the silent majority)) stands up to the extremists, and fights them with us which leads to muslims the world over fighting and living under harsher conditions then they do now.

Or the muslim world fails to act and draconian antimuslim laws are put in to place declaring inslam to be a terrorist cult and not a religion. This results in concentration camps, reeducation centers, and flat out religious warfare on a scale unheard of since the crusades.

While islam may survive much as the catholic church did under Henry the 8th it will do so in a severly dimished form.

I pray that neither scenario ever comes to pass and that muslims the world over fight these extremists decry them openly and force them to surrender. because if they dont then hatred may rule the day before all is said and done.

Sorry, I'm an American too, so there's not too much I know about European politics. I don't understand where the French revolting get off, since their retirement age was lowered from 65 in '89 if I remember right. They must have far less patience with their government than we do currently.

I was hanging out with 'grandma and grandpa' (my Dad) yesterday so unfortunately I got to watch Fox news all day. They played the Juan Williams story ALL DAY, every show, every hour. Good lord. And Fox gave him a (longer) contract already so he isn't even out of work.

I just wanted to say that his comments were offensive any way you slice it. Sure, he was just "Saying what's on the minds of most Americans" as my Dad put it, but it's discriminatory and I don't blame NPR for not wanting that kind of reputation. They have just as much right to tell the people they hire what they can and can't say, as Williams has the freedom of speech. He knows what he said is offensive, that's why he defended his position before he even said it. What, like you can't be a bigot because you are black, dude?

88% of Fox listeners agreed that they always feel fear if a person wearing Muslim garb is on the same plane. I think catsi has a valid worry when it comes to the provocation of radical Muslims to attack. These people like my Dad can't even understand that their hatred and fear leads to more hatred and fear on the other side; Much less understand that in Islam you have to get down on your knees and worship Allah twice a day no matter where you are and what you're doing (including airports, am I correct?).

Oh and I lol'd at "irregardless" just sayin'

[Codus N]

Started It? I havent started diddly squat yet. Get me really angry, then Ill start a revolution thatll make that little tea party thrown in the 1700s look like a little girls sleep over.

Sorry, sorry... what I meant was your crazy imagination. catsi, that's the one that kinda got me. (and scared me a bit ) But like Strange said, I believe the world is secular enough and NOT stupid enough to be provoked into going to WWIII. Y'know, your rants sometimes amuses me a bit. I always manage to get a chuckle out of it. Not that I'm mocking you or anything, I completely respect you and I have a similar viewpoint to you as well, which is why I always like reading your posts, but the way you convey your thoughts is rather amusing to me. Don't worry, there are other times when I go through your posts without a single chuckle.

Edited by Newkerz, 22 October 2010 - 01:53 PM.

[catsi563]

Its not WWIII that im positing. its kind of hard to put my exact thoughts on this matter in written form.

To try and explain. Ive always felt there were two sides to islam. There is a quiet yet peaceful majority. And a Vocal loud and extreme minority. It is this minority which drastically misinterprets the koran and its teachings and gives rise to this extremist movement which commits atrocities.

But worse due to the silent majorites quiet consent This loud and vocal majority has come to represent the remainder of Islam to the world. It is this failure of the silent majority to act and become more vocal, and more agressive in speaking up about these fundamentalists that has led to Islam being painted with the same brush.

My fear is that with the rampant Anti muslim baitiing going on, the extremists will do something Stupid. Like getting hold of a WMD, or pulling off a mumbai or 9/11 style vicious attack, that leaves lots of civilian--especially children-- casualties.

They of course will crow in triumph of the ""lethal blow they struck agaisnt the infidel/crusader/zionist etc etc"" and the pictures will come of people dancing in the streets and handing out candy.

This will be met by silence or scattered condemnaton from the silent majority who would rightly be disgusted by the attack. However this will be pointed out as complicity to the attack by racists and Anti Muslim forces as so called token Action or sound bites.

This leads to the passage of anti muslim laws the world over. Which the extremists point to as evidence of the great war agaisnt Islam etc etc. And They engage in more attacks thus reinforcing the cycle and spiraling us into a rage filled cycle of retribution against islam which either leads to Muslims the world over having to fight for their religion, or just silently be pushed into so called reeducation camps where the religion slowly dies out.

Is it my imagination? God I hope so, and I hope it stays that way. too because I have a very vivid and active imagination and I can forsee a lot of horrible ways this can happen and go wrong. The images of a mushroom cloud over Israel or a Bio attack on Tel Aviv with hundreds of dead people will be seen as an atrocity of epic proportions. And it is the type of stain that the silent peaceful majority of muslims cant just push off as "" Well its just a few extremists they dont speak for all of Islam."" if they dont speak up and become the vocal majority.

Right now the notion that all muslims are terrorists is ridiculous. As is the notion that all terrorists are muslim.

But if the Silent majority of muslims does not begin to get louder and more vocal in their protestation of these extrmists and begin to take more direct action against thm. Then the notion of all Terrorists being muslims is going to become the norm since the only muslims speaking for Islam will be terrorists.

We can already see this happening partly because right now as much as most people are speaking out against the absurd notion, the hatemongers like Newt Gingrich and Fox news are speaking too the hatred and mistrust which can ultimately lead to an untennable situation. I believe these hate and fear mongers are as wrong as the extremists are.

They say there is a muslim problem in america and the world. I agree there is. But its a problem thats being exacerbated by the hate on both sides. Both sides have been burned by radical islamists. But you dont heal a burn by sticking it in a fire. You heal it by cooling it down thus soothing the burn.

As I said before I hope this scenario stays in my imagination, and as you say the world remains secular and smart enough to avoid the mass reactionary policies which led to Japanese internment camps in WWII.

I really hope it does.

[Nee-sama]

^This is pretty much exactly what happened surrounding 9/11/01, except instead of anti-Muslim laws and re-education camps there was a rise in religious persecution and discrimination. People in America consider themselves the victim (and they were, I'm not saying they weren't) but they tend to brush off the idea that Al Queda was provoked. The truth is they were nurturing their hatred for many years before they acted out their plot.

[catsi563]

Thats correct they were and were planning such an attack for a long while. Intelligence surfaced years before 9/11 that men of muslim decent were taking flying lessons. and chatter had surfaced of the use of planes as weapons.

9/11 was kid of the wake up call for us, and in many ways should be seen as a warning to more peaceful muslims. This type of extremism can become seen as the norm if they do not act to keep it from becoming such.

We already have hate and fear mongers spewing their bile on both sides quite frankly. But at least after 9/11 we had cooler heads prevail. HELL Ill even give president Bush credit as one of the few things he did right was to denounce the attack as the work of extremists and not Islam as a whole.

But that was then and In a post 9/11 world a large scale attack like that could lead to the complete opposite effect.

[Strangelove]

The French have lost they're minds.

http://www.reuters.c...E69J4HI20101020

Just a bunch of crazy college kids. You would think college makes you more mature. Apparently that's not really the case in Europe where college makes you into an angry Anarchist.

Edited by Strangelove, 23 October 2010 - 01:57 AM.