1209 replies to this topic

[arian_rad]

This is particularly why I could see Sasuke pushing either Naruto or Sakura toward the other especially with the events in Part 1. 

With what I said earlier which led to this, is what I meant, I didn't want sasuke to tell her to give up romantically on him just to Persue naruto. I wanted him to see in his eyes that the way perhaps sakura use to be with him is the way she now is with naruto. Him noticing that change, maybe he could make a comment on it and clear some of the shadows that cover sakura's emotions. Nothing romantic , just a small hint

[Branden]

Why am I reading page after page after PAGE of anti-NH prattle? Why are people posting comments about what other pairings fans say about NS or Sakura, and offering axes and bows to 'destroy' these people? And worst of all, apart from the fact that all this chatter borders-on-to-being-actual-bashing, is the fact that it's taking place in a CHAPTER thread.
 
Is it REALLY that hard for some of you to LAY OFF the anti-NH/SS chatter? Really?
 
Smiter himself recently proposed a new rule to ban ALL forms of NH/SS chatter from the boards. But we decided that you all were grown up enough not to have to be babysat so rigidly, and so we decided not to go ahead with it.
 
However...now going through all these pages and pages and posts upon posts of anti-sentiment...I'm thinking we were being a bit too hasty in NOT fully considering a forum-wide ban on ALL NaruHina and SasuSaku discussion.
 
Take this as the LAST WARNING before we truly start to get serious here.
 
NO MORE NaruHina/SasuSaku discussions IN CHAPTER THREADS.
 
Absolutely NONE.
 
A chapter thread is supposed to be dedicated to discussing the latest happenings in the newest manga chapter.

 

From this day forward ANYONE who violates this rule will get a warning. We're pretty sick and tired of constantly telling a good number of you to LAY OFF the NH/SS chatter/bashing.
 
Obviously action needs to be followed up with our words. Again, this is the LAST and FINAL unofficial warning you all will receive. We'll start handing out official warnings after this to anyone who sees fit to drag other fandoms into chapter discussions.

As someone who skips pages at a time on these chapter threads I really think that if this is going to be a new rule you should re-post this somewhere everyone can see.

[arian_rad]

As someone who skips pages at a time on these chapter threads I really think that if this is going to be a new rule you should re-post this somewhere everyone can see.

Yeah, I posted something without seeing this post and it started somewhat of a spiderweb of comments. Even though it wasn't bashing any other ship at all. Probably would be better if a personal message was sent to all members so they would be notified might be a good idea.

Edited by arian_rad, 11 June 2013 - 05:52 PM.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

 

 

You're taking my post as if I want it to happen. May I encourage you to read first and not jump to conclusions please? I hate when people do that.

 

The intentions behind my post are to show that this could be an idea, not that I expect it to happen. And my wish is that, if it were to happen (which I don't want to, but hey, Kishi can do what he wants, right?), then that it does not show any romantic hint whatsoever.

 

Now then...

 

Much like you say, I admit that I do not believe in Sakura's love for Sasuke. To me, is pretty much en empty type of love, where the only thing you "love" what what once was about said person (in a way, you only love memories, and not the person per se). I'm not telling you that she loves Sasuke, but she is conflicted with her feelings up to this point in the manga (and by this I don't mean that she loves both, but rather that she has not realized just how much she loves Naruto), which is why I also agree with what you speak about finding someone "suitable" for her.

 

The reason why I would not have problems in Sasuke mentioning something about Sakura loving Naruto all along is because in part one, he witnessed Sakura's romantic smile for Naruto as seen here (Here's him explaining what Naruto did for Sakura) and here (in the upper-right panel, you can see Sasuke witnessing Sakura's smile), and he also witnessed the limits Naruto can overcome for Sakura's sake.

 

This of course, is something that I dropped to consider over the course of the manga because Sasuke is too proud to acknowledge things like these and because it would obviously be out of character for him at this point. Plus of course, I also believe that Sakura will realize herself just how much she loves Naruto.

 

And as for your final note: I could care less. My interest are the two new "Smash" games and Bayonetta 2, so you can easily figure out which consoles have my interest.

What remains is that the event you said, it can only be triggered if there is romantic undertones first like Sakura wanting to talk with Sasuke or her making a confession to him again to be rejected unless if you're implying a scene like out of nowhere with no reason Yondaime asks Naruto if Sakura is his girlfriend.

Which could be reasonable an scenario like that, but even being a nice scene to NS (Minato's question) still he had any reason to say that because doesnt make sense, if it was HInata, or Ino, or any girl in Naruto there he would ask the same question.(?)

It seemed rather that Kishi put Sakura there because Minato would made that question.

 

Still if something like that would happen, would be most him telling her that Naruto loves her or some sort of, because on that scene he was all thinking about himself and how he was capable of doing nothing while Naruto owned Gaara.

 

The panels you put for me it's almost similar when Kakashi told Rin that Obito loved her, it was basically him telling Sakura to acknowledge Naruto's efforts and give him the credit he deserves.

It makes way more sense him telling Sakura that Naruto loves her(pulled out a huge ammount of chakra because of Sakura and on the valley of the end when he talked about Sakura) rather than telling Sakura that she has feelings for Naruto when on the end of part 1 she confessed to him, while he never give a kitten about it anyway, like Naruto did to Hinata.

 

But HUE, it would be funny the most oblivious to romance guy of the manga giving romance advice to Sakura which whom is the character who is responsible for the romance subplot, combining that with Minato's out of nowhere question and Naruto telling Sakura that she is his girlfriend after 615 and that cover(which they claimed Naruto moved on) and combining with Hinata friendzoning herself, well butthurt everywhere.

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 11 June 2013 - 06:10 PM.

[catsi563]

To clarify a prior point I made about Hinata. I do not believe Hinata to be a roadblock or for NS to need Hinatas approval before it can become canon.

 

The prior post was related to what I viewed as Hinata development in the manga, and where I thought a next logical step would be for that development, IE the letting go of her feelings.

[Mistraal]

Why am I reading page after page after PAGE of anti-NH prattle? Why are people posting comments about what other pairings fans say about NS or Sakura, and offering axes and bows to 'destroy' these people? And worst of all, apart from the fact that all this chatter borders-on-to-being-actual-bashing, is the fact that it's taking place in a CHAPTER thread.
 
Is it REALLY that hard for some of you to LAY OFF the anti-NH/SS chatter? Really?
 
Smiter himself recently proposed a new rule to ban ALL forms of NH/SS chatter from the boards. But we decided that you all were grown up enough not to have to be babysat so rigidly, and so we decided not to go ahead with it.
 
However...now going through all these pages and pages and posts upon posts of anti-sentiment...I'm thinking we were being a bit too hasty in NOT fully considering a forum-wide ban on ALL NaruHina and SasuSaku discussion.
 
Take this as the LAST WARNING before we truly start to get serious here.
 
NO MORE NaruHina/SasuSaku discussions IN CHAPTER THREADS.
 
Absolutely NONE.
 
A chapter thread is supposed to be dedicated to discussing the latest happenings in the newest manga chapter.

 

From this day forward ANYONE who violates this rule will get a warning. We're pretty sick and tired of constantly telling a good number of you to LAY OFF the NH/SS chatter/bashing.
 
Obviously action needs to be followed up with our words. Again, this is the LAST and FINAL unofficial warning you all will receive. We'll start handing out official warnings after this to anyone who sees fit to drag other fandoms into chapter discussions.

 

 

In regards to this, if Hinata's feelings are relevant to the chapter then they will likely get discussed and people's opinions about the characters in question will come out. Some folk dislike her, some folk are apathetic and she's others #2 heroine.

I can understand prohibiting posting offsite links to make fun, and making tasteless bashing comments but I don't feel it's the correct route to ban conversation about NS x NH x SS altogether since Kishi is making it very apparent in his chapters that it's still relevant. When Hinata is in the manga the only thing she talks about is how she feels so it's difficult to discuss her without discussing her feelings because it's really all she has as a character.

To surmise, I think a distinction needs to be made regarding chapter discussion and critique involving Hinata & Sasuke and and their feelings and "character bashing".

Edited by Mistraal, 11 June 2013 - 07:20 PM.

[Inferno180]

If that's all that SasuSaku gets from this point on, that will be surprising. I mean, all she did was say his name.

 

I'm expecting an SS moment that's on the same scale as #615. Something big that shakes up the fanbase and completely misleads some into thinking SasuSaku is canon... Until Sakura says she's doesn't feel the same way as she used to, that is.

 

(Although lately, it seems that any interaction between Sakura and Sasuke makes the fanbase think they're canon. )

 

I feel like the reason why he's kept Karin away for so long is because he's brewing up something for SasuSaku. I wonder how different things will be pairing-wise by the time she makes it to the battlefield...

 

I wouldn't be surprised if she instead says she wants to assist Naruto, basically at this point give an early notion of her not being total Sasuke this and that as most people would still think she would be. Basically show her more towards Naruto this late but still have some minor SS interaction. Ultimately though it could be the case in her realizing Sasuke is not what she imagined.

[Dkey]

 
 
In regards to this, if Hinata's feelings are relevant to the chapter then they will likely get discussed and people's opinions about the characters in question will come out. Some folk dislike her, some folk are apathetic and she's others #2 heroine.

I can understand prohibiting posting offsite links to make fun, and making tasteless bashing comments but I don't feel it's the correct route to ban conversation about NS x NH x SS altogether since Kishi is making it very apparent in his chapters that it's still relevant. When Hinata is in the manga the only thing she talks about is how she feels so it's difficult to discuss her without discussing her feelings because it's really all she has as a character.

To surmise, I think a distinction needs to be made regarding chapter discussion and critique involving Hinata & Sasuke and and their feelings and "character bashing".

I agree with mods thou. Ever since this volume started the chapter threads were bombarded with NH Hinata but mostly NH fan bashing. Even neutral conversations in the thread were somewhat silenced by the constant Hinata based discussions. One chapter thread had Hinata as a discussion subject even thou her character didn't do anything.
This last weeks it felt we were discussing NH/SS more then NS

[TouKen4Life3g]

I guess because the fans are more loud than ever that Hinata just shafted to the side now since Sakura got a lot of spotlight as well as Team 7 and NS. NS is the crucial one because everything they have said about parallel and Naruto's second thought. All of that have been answered and now well, you get the picture. As for me, I came to conclusion that Hinata just want to be equal in a friendly term. Nothing more, nothing less. That said the mentions of fans and characters in a bashing way should end. I'm ok with that.

[catsi563]

The only reason I brought Hinata up was because her development was directly relevant to the chapter at hand.

 

naturally the question of where she goes from here is relevant in that regard to the next chapter

[Slextrem]

I believe the mods are more concerned about us "discussing" the NH and SS fandoms, rather than the pairings and/or characters involved... Unless you're bashing said characters or pairings, of course.

[Mistraal]

I believe the mods are more concerned about us "discussing" the NH and SS fandoms, rather than the pairings and/or characters involved... Unless you're bashing said characters or pairings, of course.

I would like some clarification. Where the line has been drawn seems foggy and I feel I could easily accidentally break a rule simply by discussing a page of the manga like this one:

Hinata Page

[StriderC]

I can understand the mods wanting us to knock off the actual bashing and harsh criticisms of other fandoms considering this IS an open forum that welcomes everyone. I don't think actual discussion regarding said couples is restricted as long as it sticks to the chapter, and isn't bashing. I could even see one listing off predictions off of chapters, and recollecting past chapters to connect it to the current one. 

[sushi.]

I think we should discuss this topic in the mod Q&A thread or something, not in the chapter thread.

And oh I agree with Slex.

[James S Cassidy]

"What if what I want makes you sad at me?"

What if Kishi's understanding of the fanbases is actually reflected in the characters he works with? Something I have been thinking about...or over thinking about it is. Which each character reflects a certain type of viewpoint.

Word of the post: Appreciation.

Let's dive into the lives of the characters themselves:

Naruto.
Naruto is a character that is the embodiment of the word. He is a man who grew up with no parents, no friends, and no "power" so to speak. He was the "little guy" as some put it. The underdog of this fight. Over the course of the series he fought to gain respect and power; striving for the goal to become Hokage so he could be loved and respected. Little did he know that to be Hokage you needed to have the people follow you. Maybe that was the true goal all along. What is it that they say? A man who has never known power understands the value of strength, and knows compassion.

Naruto soon gains power and friends. He appreciates them more than anything in this world. Maybe even more than his dreams as he is willing to sacrificing everything for them. Albeit a little over appreciative, Naruto is the story of a weak boy becoming one of the most powerful men the world has ever known. A moral standing that, while flawed, shows the best of humanity. I'll explain even more how this plays into a bigger picture later.

Sakura.
A girl who what we call the "middle-ground." She had power, but never focused on it because she too interested in her own desires. She soon learns to appreciate the small things in her life. She still strives for what she desires, but she also becomes aware of things she never knew she had. Stuff she used to take for granted. This includes her friends and her love life. She wanted Sasuke so bad, but learned that Naruto did everything for her. She grew to appreciate him and because of that understood the meaning of power as well. She knew strength was not just in physical, but emotionally as well. Letting things get to you is what keeps you from reaching true potential. When she learned to let go of selfish gains, she appreciated what she had and worked harder for the right reasons and in teh right area.

Sasuke.
I shall call him the "Man who had everything." He knew his parents. His powers are basically hand-me downs granted to him all because he "feels." His heritage made him prestige and praised. Popularity came easy to him. The girls wanted him and the guys wanted to be him. Because he already was in the lap of luxury he took for granted everything. Literally the opposite to Naruto, a man who has it all and yet wants none of it. Never appreciates his friends. Never appreciates his power, and never understood to appreciate the little things in life. Little did he know how much he influences. To this day he still doesn't care. It is all about him. Sure he could get a girl easy, but because it was easy is why he never appreciates it. Thus he takes it all for granted.

Hinata.
Another girl who "understands what she gets, but always desires more." She also doesn't appreciate stuff, but not because she can't, but rather because she is greedy. She wants more. Once isn't enough. Reminds of the man who pleads to God for something finer, bargaining for even a moment, and when finally give wants more than what she bargained for. Nothing is good enough until she gets exactly what she wants...and what she wants keeps changing. Little does she realize, she is greedy. Unlike Sakura who understands the situations, she is too busy into what she wants that she ignores the reality that she lives in for the fantasy she creates. She is not a bad person, but rather is just too greedy to notice anything beyond what she wants to see.


How the pairings reflect?
NaruSaku.
A pairing who grew to understand each other. They are aware of each other's desires and wants...although it can be argues that Naruto still sees Sakura as part 1. Point is, it is not about themselves. It is about the other. What the other person wants, not what they desires themselves. While Sakura started out selfish, she developed into something more. Both appreciate each other and what they have done for each other over the years. The only issue is that Naruto needs to open up his eyes to a truth that maybe Sakura wants him as much as he wants her. He does suffer a Hinata syndrome of not realizing the truth, but not for the reason of greed. Rather he is so appreciative of her, he wants her happiness to be above all else. That means when he does get a moments of romance or a moment of Sakura caring for him, he appreciates it. Same with Sakura. She appreciates and understands everything Naruto does.

SasuSaku
A rather selfish pairing. It is all about themselves. Before Sakura was all about her to the point that she abandoned her friends for it. A mistake she soon rectified. A pairing built on a lie rather than truth, Sasuke is also a person who cares not for anything, but himself. A desire he has that changes like the wind. Revenge, mostly. Perhaps his new dreams of Hokage is also for revenge, but a different kind of revenge. This pairing shows that following self-satisfaction goals, lead to unimportant moments and caring now of what is happening in the real world.

NaruHina
A pairing built on greed. This is different than self-satisfaction. Unlike self-satisfaction, greed can have emotions and caring. Doesn't mean you aren't greedy. It just means you're narrow minded. It is all about this and nothing else matters. So is Hinata. A very narrow-minded girl who sole ideals are based around her love for Naruto. His nindo, his lifestyle, his motivation, and vision. Yet, she never notices his desires. She never built her own either. His goals are her goals. His way of life is her way of life. She is like a mirror and just reflects who ever she points at. Unfortunitly, she is a cloudy mirror and never reflects the light that shines on her. She never appreciates the moments when Naruto actually pays attention to her and desires more. "I want to confess. I want to tell him." She did and it wasn't enough. "I want to be seen as strong." Naruto says she is and it still wasn't enough. "I want to hold his hand and walk beside him." And still, it isn't enough. (Again, arguably, people will say the last one is a different case, but I am waiting to see how she truly takes such a thing. So for now, I'll remain constant.) Greed.


How does this reflect on the fanbase?

NaruSaku fans
For the most part, the NS fans seem to know when the moments exist. The moments that are so small, but play such a huge role. The hug scene, the feeding the scene, the bridge scenes, perhaps even moments in part 1. NS fans appreciate the moments no matter how small and see as them getting closer. Maybe as friends, or maybe as something more. We understand that they can be friends, but aware that sometimes this is only the first step to a successful relationship. Every moment counts, no matter how small or insignificant it may seem. While our moments are sometimes small and a bit ambiguous, we love them none the less. We love every interaction and love how not only Naruto, but Sakura have grown.
 
SasuSaku fans
SS fans only see what they want to believe. Sakura loves Sasuke. Even of story. They see Sakura as selfish and Sasuke as this true successor. Sounds familiar? I hope it does. Do they see the change? I think the real question is, does it matter to them? It doesn't matter what changes over the course of time. They don't appreciate the other stuff because they care not to. Like Sasuke, they care for nothing, but the own desire of the fandom. SS must be canon no matter what has changed. No matter how Sakura or Sasuke change, she will always be selfish and he will always be the best choice for her. He tried to kill her? Naw, he just doesn't realize his feelings yet. The feelings he secretly desires.

NaruHuna fans.
How to explain this one? "Kishi, we want Hinata to express how she feels to Naruto." Chapter 437 happens and Naruto shows no response to it other than her "dying." "I want more. Now I want Naruto to see Hinata's strength" Chapter 559 Naruto saves Hinata and says to her "Don't be so hard on yourself. You're strong too." "Now I want Naruto to acknowledge Hinata now and I want Hinata to get her wish to hold his hand." Chapter 615 got exactly that. Naruto acknowledged her and held her hand exactly how she wanted. It lead to nothing. "Waaaah, I want more." All the while ignoring Naruto's love for Sakura, ignoring Sakura changing development, and ignoring everything that has happened in the manga. Instead of appreciating all the moments that NaruHina does get, they whine and desire more. Also sound familiar? Nothing is ever satisfactory and nothing else matters. It is all about Hinata and her desires, never about anyone else. Naruto? Who cares what he wants, we care not. We just want Hinata because she deserves it. Hinata may seem good on the outside and her personality is shy and kind, but reality is she is very greedy. A sour among the sweet.

Taking these things into consideration, perhaps Kishi is trying to reflect the fanbases in the manga with the pairings themselves. I wouldn't put it past him and the subliminal messages could be the key. Kishi is often a man who plays stupid, but really is very smart. Time and time again he throws us curve balls and what not like crazy and at times we find ourselves the morons. Assuming something that isn't and even at times claim him to be a bad writer when really he isn't. Yes, he can make mistakes and at times has written things....sub-par; mostly because he had written himself into a hole that he had to use a cheap trick to get out of it. He is human after all, but when he truly writes the story the story is near perfect. I even say genius in some ways. I don't know what he is planning, but I am expecting great things.





 

Edited by James S Cassidy, 12 June 2013 - 12:15 AM.

[Slextrem]

There is a thread to ask the mods questions. If anyone needs a mod to clarify Sakura Blossoms post, I suggest asking here: http://www.narusaku....showtopic=12911

 

To get back on topic, I'm really excited to find out about the new summons, specifically Sakura's new slug and how she'll be using it. Obviously, she summoned it to heal, but does that mean Sakura is going to fall back and let the boys take care of the fighting? I hope not. 

 

Perhaps we'll see Sakura do the same kind of thing Tsunade did during the Pain arc, where she gave her chakra to Katsuyu to split apart and heal everyone. My only concern about that is it seemed to waste away Tsunade's chakra, and I don't want to see that happen to Sakura.

 

I'm a little torn because, while I would love to see Sakura and her summon working together, I'm worried that that will push her back into the medic role again. So, at the same time, I'm also hoping that the slug will be able to handle healing on it's own while Sakura continues to fight.

 

Since it appears that Team 7 is leading the pack, I want her to play a part in actually defeating the Juubi.

[Atheck]

If Sakura's role is intended to resemble Tsunade's during the battle against Madara then her participation should not be relegated to support after having bypassed the precepts of the medical shinobi. The context of her words may have been referring to her being available for healing whilst she assumes the offensive alongside Naruto and Sasuke. The slug summoning has received only a minimal amount of characterization and Kishi needs to rectify that error by having her become centrally involved with the summonings' offensive against the Jubi. Sakura distributing most or all of her chakra from the seal to the summoning and having it disperse so that everyone may receive a slug for restorative purposes would be quite the disappointment.

 

Personally it's not just Sakura's continued involvement in the battle that is so concerning but whether this Shikkotsu Forest area that has been exalted as a sanctuary for learning the sage arts alongside Mount Myoboku and Ryuchi Cave will ever be addressed in the future. More than anything else I really want to see Kishi verify the existence of a Slug Sage Mode by Sakura entering it in the upcoming chapters.

 

[Luna]

"What if what I want makes you sad at me?"

What if Kishi's understanding of the fanbases is actually reflected in the characters he works with? Something I have been thinking about...or over thinking about it is. Which each character reflects a certain type of viewpoint.

Word of the post: Appreciation.

Let's dive into the lives of the characters themselves:

Naruto.
Naruto is a character that is the embodiment of the word. He is a man who grew up with no parents, no friends, and no "power" so to speak. He was the "little guy" as some put it. The underdog of this fight. Over the course of the series he fought to gain respect and power; striving for the goal to become Hokage so he could be loved and respected. Little did he know that to be Hokage you needed to have the people follow you. Maybe that was the true goal all along. What is it that they say? A man who has never known power understands the value of strength, and knows compassion.

Naruto soon gains power and friends. He appreciates them more than anything in this world. Maybe even more than his dreams as he is willing to sacrificing everything for them. Albeit a little over appreciative, Naruto is the story of a weak boy becoming one of the most powerful men the world has ever known. A moral standing that, while flawed, shows the best of humanity. I'll explain even more how this plays into a bigger picture later.

Sakura.
A girl who what we call the "middle-ground." She had power, but never focused on it because she too interested in her own desires. She soon learns to appreciate the small things in her life. She still strives for what she desires, but she also becomes aware of things she never knew she had. Stuff she used to take for granted. This includes her friends and her love life. She wanted Sasuke so bad, but learned that Naruto did everything for her. She grew to appreciate him and because of that understood the meaning of power as well. She knew strength was not just in physical, but emotionally as well. Letting things get to you is what keeps you from reaching true potential. When she learned to let go of selfish gains, she appreciated what she had and worked harder for the right reasons and in teh right area.

Sasuke.
I shall call him the "Man who had everything." He knew his parents. His powers are basically hand-me downs granted to him all because he "feels." His heritage made him prestige and praised. Popularity came easy to him. The girls wanted him and the guys wanted to be him. Because he already was in the lap of luxury he took for granted everything. Literally the opposite to Naruto, a man who has it all and yet wants none of it. Never appreciates his friends. Never appreciates his power, and never understood to appreciate the little things in life. Little did he know how much he influences. To this day he still doesn't care. It is all about him. Sure he could get a girl easy, but because it was easy is why he never appreciates it. Thus he takes it all for granted.

Hinata.
Another girl who "understands what she gets, but always desires more." She also doesn't appreciate stuff, but not because she can't, but rather because she is greedy. She wants more. Once isn't enough. Reminds of the man who pleads to God for something finer, bargaining for even a moment, and when finally give wants more than what she bargained for. Nothing is good enough until she gets exactly what she wants...and what she wants keeps changing. Little does she realize, she is greedy. Unlike Sakura who understands the situations, she is too busy into what she wants that she ignores the reality that she lives in for the fantasy she creates. She is not a bad person, but rather is just too greedy to notice anything beyond what she wants to see.


How the pairings reflect?
NaruSaku.
A pairing who grew to understand each other. They are aware of each other's desires and wants...although it can be argues that Naruto still sees Sakura as part 1. Point is, it is not about themselves. It is about the other. What the other person wants, not what they desires themselves. While Sakura started out selfish, she developed into something more. Both appreciate each other and what they have done for each other over the years. The only issue is that Naruto needs to open up his eyes to a truth that maybe Sakura wants him as much as he wants her. He does suffer a Hinata syndrome of not realizing the truth, but not for the reason of greed. Rather he is so appreciative of her, he wants her happiness to be above all else. That means when he does get a moments of romance or a moment of Sakura caring for him, he appreciates it. Same with Sakura. She appreciates and understands everything Naruto does.

SasuSaku
A rather selfish pairing. It is all about themselves. Before Sakura was all about her to the point that she abandoned her friends for it. A mistake she soon rectified. A pairing built on a lie rather than truth, Sasuke is also a person who cares not for anything, but himself. A desire he has that changes like the wind. Revenge, mostly. Perhaps his new dreams of Hokage is also for revenge, but a different kind of revenge. This pairing shows that following self-satisfaction goals, lead to unimportant moments and caring now of what is happening in the real world.

NaruHina
A pairing built on greed. This is different than self-satisfaction. Unlike self-satisfaction, greed can have emotions and caring. Doesn't mean you aren't greedy. It just means you're narrow minded. It is all about this and nothing else matters. So is Hinata. A very narrow-minded girl who sole ideals are based around her love for Naruto. His nindo, his lifestyle, his motivation, and vision. Yet, she never notices his desires. She never built her own either. His goals are her goals. His way of life is her way of life. She is like a mirror and just reflects who ever she points at. Unfortunitly, she is a cloudy mirror and never reflects the light that shines on her. She never appreciates the moments when Naruto actually pays attention to her and desires more. "I want to confess. I want to tell him." She did and it wasn't enough. "I want to be seen as strong." Naruto says she is and it still wasn't enough. "I want to hold his hand and walk beside him." And still, it isn't enough. (Again, arguably, people will say the last one is a different case, but I am waiting to see how she truly takes such a thing. So for now, I'll remain constant.) Greed.


How does this reflect on the fanbase?

NaruSaku fans
For the most part, the NS fans seem to know when the moments exist. The moments that are so small, but play such a huge role. The hug scene, the feeding the scene, the bridge scenes, perhaps even moments in part 1. NS fans appreciate the moments no matter how small and see as them getting closer. Maybe as friends, or maybe as something more. We understand that they can be friends, but aware that sometimes this is only the first step to a successful relationship. Every moment counts, no matter how small or insignificant it may seem. While our moments are sometimes small and a bit ambiguous, we love them none the less. We love every interaction and love how not only Naruto, but Sakura have grown.
 
SasuSaku fans
SS fans only see what they want to believe. Sakura loves Sasuke. Even of story. They see Sakura as selfish and Sasuke as this true successor. Sounds familiar? I hope it does. Do they see the change? I think the real question is, does it matter to them? It doesn't matter what changes over the course of time. They don't appreciate the other stuff because they care not to. Like Sasuke, they care for nothing, but the own desire of the fandom. SS must be canon no matter what has changed. No matter how Sakura or Sasuke change, she will always be selfish and he will always be the best choice for her. He tried to kill her? Naw, he just doesn't realize his feelings yet. The feelings he secretly desires.

NaruHuna fans.
How to explain this one? "Kishi, we want Hinata to express how she feels to Naruto." Chapter 437 happens and Naruto shows no response to it other than her "dying." "I want more. Now I want Naruto to see Hinata's strength" Chapter 559 Naruto saves Hinata and says to her "Don't be so hard on yourself. You're strong too." "Now I want Naruto to acknowledge Hinata now and I want Hinata to get her wish to hold his hand." Chapter 615 got exactly that. Naruto acknowledged her and held her hand exactly how she wanted. It lead to nothing. "Waaaah, I want more." All the while ignoring Naruto's love for Sakura, ignoring Sakura changing development, and ignoring everything that has happened in the manga. Instead of appreciating all the moments that NaruHina does get, they whine and desire more. Also sound familiar? Nothing is ever satisfactory and nothing else matters. It is all about Hinata and her desires, never about anyone else. Naruto? Who cares what he wants, we care not. We just want Hinata because she deserves it. Hinata may seem good on the outside and her personality is shy and kind, but reality is she is very greedy. A sour among the sweet.

Taking these things into consideration, perhaps Kishi is trying to reflect the fanbases in the manga with the pairings themselves. I wouldn't put it past him and the subliminal messages could be the key. Kishi is often a man who plays stupid, but really is very smart. Time and time again he throws us curve balls and what not like crazy and at times we find ourselves the morons. Assuming something that isn't and even at times claim him to be a bad writer when really he isn't. Yes, he can make mistakes and at times has written things....sub-par; mostly because he had written himself into a hole that he had to use a cheap trick to get out of it. He is human after all, but when he truly writes the story the story is near perfect. I even say genius in some ways. I don't know what he is planning, but I am expecting great things.





 

Lovely post! -likes-

[Strangelove]

"What if what I want makes you sad at me?"

What if Kishi's understanding of the fanbases is actually reflected in the characters he works with? Something I have been thinking about...or over thinking about it is. Which each character reflects a certain type of viewpoint.

Word of the post: Appreciation.

Let's dive into the lives of the characters themselves:

Naruto.
Naruto is a character that is the embodiment of the word. He is a man who grew up with no parents, no friends, and no "power" so to speak. He was the "little guy" as some put it. The underdog of this fight. Over the course of the series he fought to gain respect and power; striving for the goal to become Hokage so he could be loved and respected. Little did he know that to be Hokage you needed to have the people follow you. Maybe that was the true goal all along. What is it that they say? A man who has never known power understands the value of strength, and knows compassion.

Naruto soon gains power and friends. He appreciates them more than anything in this world. Maybe even more than his dreams as he is willing to sacrificing everything for them. Albeit a little over appreciative, Naruto is the story of a weak boy becoming one of the most powerful men the world has ever known. A moral standing that, while flawed, shows the best of humanity. I'll explain even more how this plays into a bigger picture later.

Sakura.
A girl who what we call the "middle-ground." She had power, but never focused on it because she too interested in her own desires. She soon learns to appreciate the small things in her life. She still strives for what she desires, but she also becomes aware of things she never knew she had. Stuff she used to take for granted. This includes her friends and her love life. She wanted Sasuke so bad, but learned that Naruto did everything for her. She grew to appreciate him and because of that understood the meaning of power as well. She knew strength was not just in physical, but emotionally as well. Letting things get to you is what keeps you from reaching true potential. When she learned to let go of selfish gains, she appreciated what she had and worked harder for the right reasons and in teh right area.

Sasuke.
I shall call him the "Man who had everything." He knew his parents. His powers are basically hand-me downs granted to him all because he "feels." His heritage made him prestige and praised. Popularity came easy to him. The girls wanted him and the guys wanted to be him. Because he already was in the lap of luxury he took for granted everything. Literally the opposite to Naruto, a man who has it all and yet wants none of it. Never appreciates his friends. Never appreciates his power, and never understood to appreciate the little things in life. Little did he know how much he influences. To this day he still doesn't care. It is all about him. Sure he could get a girl easy, but because it was easy is why he never appreciates it. Thus he takes it all for granted.

Hinata.
Another girl who "understands what she gets, but always desires more." She also doesn't appreciate stuff, but not because she can't, but rather because she is greedy. She wants more. Once isn't enough. Reminds of the man who pleads to God for something finer, bargaining for even a moment, and when finally give wants more than what she bargained for. Nothing is good enough until she gets exactly what she wants...and what she wants keeps changing. Little does she realize, she is greedy. Unlike Sakura who understands the situations, she is too busy into what she wants that she ignores the reality that she lives in for the fantasy she creates. She is not a bad person, but rather is just too greedy to notice anything beyond what she wants to see.


How the pairings reflect?
NaruSaku.
A pairing who grew to understand each other. They are aware of each other's desires and wants...although it can be argues that Naruto still sees Sakura as part 1. Point is, it is not about themselves. It is about the other. What the other person wants, not what they desires themselves. While Sakura started out selfish, she developed into something more. Both appreciate each other and what they have done for each other over the years. The only issue is that Naruto needs to open up his eyes to a truth that maybe Sakura wants him as much as he wants her. He does suffer a Hinata syndrome of not realizing the truth, but not for the reason of greed. Rather he is so appreciative of her, he wants her happiness to be above all else. That means when he does get a moments of romance or a moment of Sakura caring for him, he appreciates it. Same with Sakura. She appreciates and understands everything Naruto does.

SasuSaku
A rather selfish pairing. It is all about themselves. Before Sakura was all about her to the point that she abandoned her friends for it. A mistake she soon rectified. A pairing built on a lie rather than truth, Sasuke is also a person who cares not for anything, but himself. A desire he has that changes like the wind. Revenge, mostly. Perhaps his new dreams of Hokage is also for revenge, but a different kind of revenge. This pairing shows that following self-satisfaction goals, lead to unimportant moments and caring now of what is happening in the real world.

NaruHina
A pairing built on greed. This is different than self-satisfaction. Unlike self-satisfaction, greed can have emotions and caring. Doesn't mean you aren't greedy. It just means you're narrow minded. It is all about this and nothing else matters. So is Hinata. A very narrow-minded girl who sole ideals are based around her love for Naruto. His nindo, his lifestyle, his motivation, and vision. Yet, she never notices his desires. She never built her own either. His goals are her goals. His way of life is her way of life. She is like a mirror and just reflects who ever she points at. Unfortunitly, she is a cloudy mirror and never reflects the light that shines on her. She never appreciates the moments when Naruto actually pays attention to her and desires more. "I want to confess. I want to tell him." She did and it wasn't enough. "I want to be seen as strong." Naruto says she is and it still wasn't enough. "I want to hold his hand and walk beside him." And still, it isn't enough. (Again, arguably, people will say the last one is a different case, but I am waiting to see how she truly takes such a thing. So for now, I'll remain constant.) Greed.


How does this reflect on the fanbase?

NaruSaku fans
For the most part, the NS fans seem to know when the moments exist. The moments that are so small, but play such a huge role. The hug scene, the feeding the scene, the bridge scenes, perhaps even moments in part 1. NS fans appreciate the moments no matter how small and see as them getting closer. Maybe as friends, or maybe as something more. We understand that they can be friends, but aware that sometimes this is only the first step to a successful relationship. Every moment counts, no matter how small or insignificant it may seem. While our moments are sometimes small and a bit ambiguous, we love them none the less. We love every interaction and love how not only Naruto, but Sakura have grown.
 
SasuSaku fans
SS fans only see what they want to believe. Sakura loves Sasuke. Even of story. They see Sakura as selfish and Sasuke as this true successor. Sounds familiar? I hope it does. Do they see the change? I think the real question is, does it matter to them? It doesn't matter what changes over the course of time. They don't appreciate the other stuff because they care not to. Like Sasuke, they care for nothing, but the own desire of the fandom. SS must be canon no matter what has changed. No matter how Sakura or Sasuke change, she will always be selfish and he will always be the best choice for her. He tried to kill her? Naw, he just doesn't realize his feelings yet. The feelings he secretly desires.

NaruHuna fans.
How to explain this one? "Kishi, we want Hinata to express how she feels to Naruto." Chapter 437 happens and Naruto shows no response to it other than her "dying." "I want more. Now I want Naruto to see Hinata's strength" Chapter 559 Naruto saves Hinata and says to her "Don't be so hard on yourself. You're strong too." "Now I want Naruto to acknowledge Hinata now and I want Hinata to get her wish to hold his hand." Chapter 615 got exactly that. Naruto acknowledged her and held her hand exactly how she wanted. It lead to nothing. "Waaaah, I want more." All the while ignoring Naruto's love for Sakura, ignoring Sakura changing development, and ignoring everything that has happened in the manga. Instead of appreciating all the moments that NaruHina does get, they whine and desire more. Also sound familiar? Nothing is ever satisfactory and nothing else matters. It is all about Hinata and her desires, never about anyone else. Naruto? Who cares what he wants, we care not. We just want Hinata because she deserves it. Hinata may seem good on the outside and her personality is shy and kind, but reality is she is very greedy. A sour among the sweet.

Taking these things into consideration, perhaps Kishi is trying to reflect the fanbases in the manga with the pairings themselves. I wouldn't put it past him and the subliminal messages could be the key. Kishi is often a man who plays stupid, but really is very smart. Time and time again he throws us curve balls and what not like crazy and at times we find ourselves the morons. Assuming something that isn't and even at times claim him to be a bad writer when really he isn't. Yes, he can make mistakes and at times has written things....sub-par; mostly because he had written himself into a hole that he had to use a cheap trick to get out of it. He is human after all, but when he truly writes the story the story is near perfect. I even say genius in some ways. I don't know what he is planning, but I am expecting great things.





 

 

 

Nice post, but as Sakura Chan said...this is a chapter thread...you should have put it in the debate thread.

[Gravenimage]

Any spoilers for 634 yet?