Jump to content

Close
Photo

The NEW NaruSaku Debate Thread


  • Please log in to reply
54188 replies to this topic

#11581 Dkey

Dkey

    Summoning Master

  • Summoning Master
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,408 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Bucuresti

Posted 30 November 2013 - 08:03 PM

I'll laugh if in the end he uses gedo rinne tensei.
Madara seems to be a guy that he will also realize that what he did was wrong, it's possible for Kishi to lengthen the story by instead of making Obito use the Gedo Rinne Tensei, he decides to write Madara's redemption and make him use it instead.


hopefully we will see how Madara will be handled next chapter or see what the volume will be about.
As for the redemption part it's a strong posibility. out of all characters he kinda wanted peace the most.

#11582 TouKen4Life3g

TouKen4Life3g

    Heaven and Earth Deity

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 35,306 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 30 November 2013 - 08:23 PM

hopefully we will see how Madara will be handled next chapter or see what the volume will be about.
As for the redemption part it's a strong posibility. out of all characters he kinda wanted peace the most.

Well, I don't know. Right now, I only get the feeling he will die out like how one villain will learn a lesson at the very last second, literally. Kind of like Gurren Lagann final boss. In short, I don't see him getting a long redemption development like Obito. Madara has been built as a guy who clearly lost his mind and not much of a redemption to be seen. Plus we already saw his flashback or anything else that doesn't scream "save me" like Obito, so he's on his way to die as a man.

Edited by NaruSaku4Life3g, 30 November 2013 - 08:24 PM.


#11583 BakeNeko-Chan

BakeNeko-Chan

    Commander

  • Missing Nin
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 2,017 posts
  • Gender:Not Telling
  • Location:Sometimes here, sometimes there
  • Interests:Reading and writing. Anime/Manga.

Posted 30 November 2013 - 08:27 PM

Well, I don't know. Right now, I only get the feeling he will die out like how one villain will learn a lesson at the very last second, literally. Kind of like Gurren Lagann final boss. In short, I don't see him getting a long redemption development like Obito. Madara has been built as a guy who clearly lost his mind and not much of a redemption to be seen. Plus we already saw his flashback or anything else that doesn't scream "save me" like Obito, so he's on his way to die as a man.

 

That's what I'm hoping for. I do not want to see Madara redeemed, it would just be unnecessary, and I don't feel there's been any kind of build up to it. Not that I would be surprised if Kishimoto did redeem Madara, but I really don't want it to happen.



#11584 TouKen4Life3g

TouKen4Life3g

    Heaven and Earth Deity

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 35,306 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 30 November 2013 - 08:31 PM

 
That's what I'm hoping for. I do not want to see Madara redeemed, it would just be unnecessary, and I don't feel there's been any kind of build up to it. Not that I would be surprised if Kishimoto did redeem Madara, but I really don't want it to happen.

Well like you said, there is no buildup to redemption for Madara. In fact, when you think about it, is there really any of them? It's best to get him understanding when he's about to die in a second literally. Like Gurren Lagann ending. Did he repair the damage? No, but at least he understands that there's another way to peace so begone. Can't really play peace card because it's used on Nagato already. Kishi don't do encore with a new guest.

#11585 Sakamaki Izayoi

Sakamaki Izayoi

    Heaven and Earth Deity

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,679 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 30 November 2013 - 08:53 PM

 

 

That's what I'm hoping for. I do not want to see Madara redeemed, it would just be unnecessary, and I don't feel there's been any kind of build up to it. Not that I would be surprised if Kishimoto did redeem Madara, but I really don't want it to happen.

This whole, "i dont want" it's void to use as argument, "the would be just unnecessary" it works for almost all the villains who got redeemed, "After i realized that I.." Kishi always make those villains being redeemed in the end anyway.

 

 

Well like you said, there is no buildup to redemption for Madara. In fact, when you think about it, is there really any of them? It's best to get him understanding when he's about to die in a second literally. Like Gurren Lagann ending. Did he repair the damage? No, but at least he understands that there's another way to peace so begone. Can't really play peace card because it's used on Nagato already. Kishi don't do encore with a new guest.

 

Actually there's, It's proved that he still like Hashirama as someome who he cares about, but the same kind of relationship between Naruto and Sasuke.
Madara is going out on this route because he found out the truth about the shinobis, they got the power and the wars became more gruesome, and he was right, on this world it's possible for one guy alone destroy an entire village or even the world itself.

The fact is that since Madara didnt cared about the world anymore he lost his humanity and value of life, we know where it ends, Naruto and friendship is magic.

It will ends up certainly with him realizing he was wrong.

 

It was where Hashirama failed, all the kages got the chance to make up for their mistakes, Minato got his and Hashirama by helping to redeem Madara will make up for his mistake.


Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 30 November 2013 - 08:55 PM.

SK-303_image007.jpg

#11586 TouKen4Life3g

TouKen4Life3g

    Heaven and Earth Deity

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 35,306 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 30 November 2013 - 09:00 PM

Well so far, there's none to buildup. The fact Hashirama killed him made Madara proven right that peace is meaningless in real world. It's like those moments of something that can't be repaired. It's no wonder we don't hear any talk to Madara by anyone. Everyone who talks to him is about themselves, not as whole. Even Tsunade talking about women and medic, but nothing scream "convert yourself." At most, until anything else, he will get the very last second lesson learned with death around the corner. So he can get the understanding, but will it be done with final moment or done with a long life lesson alas Nagato and Obito. That's yet to be seen.

#11587 BakeNeko-Chan

BakeNeko-Chan

    Commander

  • Missing Nin
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 2,017 posts
  • Gender:Not Telling
  • Location:Sometimes here, sometimes there
  • Interests:Reading and writing. Anime/Manga.

Posted 30 November 2013 - 09:03 PM

 

 

This whole, "i dont want" it's void to use as argument, "the would be just unnecessary" it works for almost all the villains who got redeemed, "After i realized that I.." Kishi always make those villains being redeemed in the end anyway.

 

 
 

Actually there's, It's proved that he still like Hashirama as someome who he cares about, but the same kind of relationship between Naruto and Sasuke.
Madara is going out on this route because he found out the truth about the shinobis, they got the power and the wars became more gruesome, and he was right, on this world it's possible for one guy alone destroy an entire village or even the world itself.

The fact is that since Madara didnt cared about the world anymore he lost his humanity and value of life, we know where it ends, Naruto and friendship is magic.

It will ends up certainly with him realizing he was wrong.

 

It was where Hashirama failed, all the kages got the chance to make up for their mistakes, Minato got his and Hashirama by helping to redeem Madara will make up for his mistake.

 

 

Well, it's not an 'argument' at all that's why, it's called expressing my opinion. My opinion, is that I don't want it to happen and it is not an argument against Madars's hypothetical redemption, so I don't know where you would get that idea. I don't see that Kishi has yet laid out any redemption for Madara, like he did with Nagato or Obito, but that does not mean he won't, I don't know and I don't claim to know.


Edited by BakeNeko-Chan, 30 November 2013 - 09:04 PM.


#11588 Sakamaki Izayoi

Sakamaki Izayoi

    Heaven and Earth Deity

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,679 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 30 November 2013 - 09:07 PM

Well so far, there's none to buildup. The fact Hashirama killed him made Madara proven right that peace is meaningless in real world. It's like those moments of something that can't be repaired. It's no wonder we don't hear any talk to Madara by anyone. Everyone who talks to him is about themselves, not as whole. Even Tsunade talking about women and medic, but nothing scream "convert yourself." At most, until anything else, he will get the very last second lesson learned with death around the corner. So he can get the understanding, but will it be done with final moment or done with a long life lesson alas Nagato and Obito. That's yet to be seen.

I know this but the problem is that it all should had been ended with his death and later losing when he was on his edo form, but then Kishi decided to revive him.

Which obviously will lead to his redemption almost similar to obito and others, because on an edo form any kind of interaction is pratically meaningless since he's already dead(will he care about what he's doing since na edo tensei or suffer consequences about his actions).

I wish it didnt happened that way but i believe that it's jump thing, and a way to lengthen the manga.


Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 30 November 2013 - 09:10 PM.

SK-303_image007.jpg

#11589 TouKen4Life3g

TouKen4Life3g

    Heaven and Earth Deity

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 35,306 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 30 November 2013 - 09:11 PM

I know this but the problem is that it all should had been ended with his death and later losing when he was on his edo form, but later he's revived once again.
Which obviously will lead to his redemption almost similar to obito and others.
I wish it didnt happened that way but i believe that it's jump thing, and a way to lengthen the manga.

Who knows. I thought him being Edo has more redeeming quality than being alive. Because you know, Edo can die by feeling redeemed, so I thought it was calling for redemption. With him being alive by Obito, who was forced and turned in a new leaf, that's low of him and if Obito does die next chapter, Minato and Kakashi will have huge grudge. It would seem Kishi is building up for certain characters to have huge grudge on Madara and could very well end up like Kakuzu only with lesson learn as killed by well pick your character.

#11590 Sakamaki Izayoi

Sakamaki Izayoi

    Heaven and Earth Deity

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,679 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 30 November 2013 - 09:14 PM

Who knows. I thought him being Edo has more redeeming quality than being alive. Because you know, Edo can die by feeling redeemed, so I thought it was calling for redemption. With him being alive by Obito, who was forced and turned in a new leaf, that's low of him and if Obito does die next chapter, Minato and Kakashi will have huge grudge. It would seem Kishi is building up for certain characters to have huge grudge on Madara and could very well end up like Kakuzu only with lesson learn as killed by well pick your character.

Yep he could die being redeemed but the fact is that being alive he can use Izanagi to escape like he did against Hashirama probably.
Killing him wont be easy because he can escape or even fake his own death, dunno if Naruto will be able to sense him or whatever.

But he does have a lot of escaping jutsus so killing him wont be so easy, being alive gives quality to his redemption but it's a quality from 0/10 to 1/10, because his motives are ridkittenulous.

 

I hope that Obito survives because i believe he needs a chance to make up at least for his actions.

the problem with Kakuzu is that his background was never explored it was impossible for him to be redeemed with kishi not showing his motives.


Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 30 November 2013 - 09:16 PM.

SK-303_image007.jpg

#11591 TouKen4Life3g

TouKen4Life3g

    Heaven and Earth Deity

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 35,306 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 30 November 2013 - 09:16 PM

Yep he could die being redeemed but the fact is that being alive he can use Izanagi to escape like he did against Hashirama probably.
Killing him wont be easy because he can escape or even fake his own death, dunno if Naruto will be able to sense him or whatever.
But he does have a lot of escaping jutsus so killing him wont be so easy, being alive gives quality to his redemption but it's a quality from 0/10 to 1/10, because his motives are ridkittenulous.

Well time will tell. I'm still wondering what's next. I mean I have seen one picture of him being revived, only for millions of others looking at him, and then Madara begs Obito to revert it. Funny but seriously I really wonder.

#11592 Sakamaki Izayoi

Sakamaki Izayoi

    Heaven and Earth Deity

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,679 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 30 November 2013 - 09:24 PM

Well time will tell. I'm still wondering what's next. I mean I have seen one picture of him being revived, only for millions of others looking at him, and then Madara begs Obito to revert it. Funny but seriously I really wonder.

i'm just hoping for Sai to not die.

Anyway i wonder what kind of moment will be when the romance subplot strikes again.


SK-303_image007.jpg

#11593 TouKen4Life3g

TouKen4Life3g

    Heaven and Earth Deity

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 35,306 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 30 November 2013 - 09:50 PM

i'm just hoping for Sai to not die.
Anyway i wonder what kind of moment will be when the romance subplot strikes again.

Oh yeah, that reminds me. Won't it be awesome if Madara does a time bomb moment and Sai takes that time bomb to the sky to protect everyone and it explodes. Don't worry, Sai is alive and ok, just dirty from smokes. That would be great.

#11594 Sakamaki Izayoi

Sakamaki Izayoi

    Heaven and Earth Deity

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,679 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 30 November 2013 - 09:56 PM

Oh yeah, that reminds me. Won't it be awesome if Madara does a time bomb moment and Sai takes that time bomb to the sky to protect everyone and it explodes. Don't worry, Sai is alive and ok, just dirty from smokes. That would be great.

I know Sai is alright i just hoping for Madara doesnt make him a target or kill him on the next chapters.

I'm hoping for no one to die.

Despite i'm hoping for Tsunade's death.


Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 30 November 2013 - 09:56 PM.

SK-303_image007.jpg

#11595 TouKen4Life3g

TouKen4Life3g

    Heaven and Earth Deity

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 35,306 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 30 November 2013 - 10:00 PM

I know Sai is alright i just hoping for Madara doesnt make him a target or kill him on the next chapters.
I'm hoping for no one to die.
Despite i'm hoping for Tsunade's death.

Ok, someone missed the joke.

Anyway, well, for some reason if Sai dies, I always imagine "the witch is dead" song playing in NH/SS minds. I don't know why...

#11596 Sakamaki Izayoi

Sakamaki Izayoi

    Heaven and Earth Deity

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,679 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 30 November 2013 - 10:10 PM

Ok, someone missed the joke.

Anyway, well, for some reason if Sai dies, I always imagine "the witch is dead" song playing in NH/SS minds. I don't know why...

Well he's one of the greatest support for NS, i mean he was the responsible for making Sakura realize that Naruto sees her romantically and she also started to view Naruto on a romantic light.


SK-303_image007.jpg

#11597 TouKen4Life3g

TouKen4Life3g

    Heaven and Earth Deity

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 35,306 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 30 November 2013 - 10:11 PM

Well he's one of the greatest support for NS, i mean he was the responsible for making Sakura realize that Naruto sees her romantically and she also started to view Naruto on a romantic light.

Well they need more people to kill off to have no NS supports. Then again, that's the entire population. *high five*

#11598 Luna

Luna

    aespa

  • S-Class Missing Nin
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,551 posts
  • Gender:Female

Posted 30 November 2013 - 11:14 PM

@narusakur4life LMAO you been reading fairy tail too much. HAH  SIDENOTE: Happy should have died.



 


#11599 Inferno180

Inferno180

    Elite Jounin

  • Elite Jounin
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 2,480 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Mountain's Graveyard

Posted 30 November 2013 - 11:20 PM

For the current stuff ahead, it makes me wonder for the pairing stuff just what to expect such as

-building on 631, for it hinting the answer of kushinas foreshadow what will occur for naruto and sakura in the future epically since the high moment for them hasn't occurred yet.
-how will Kishi handle hinata for the remainder of the manga if it's coming to a close and the final 2 fights arnt even important for her.
-how will the aspect of sakura not trusting Sasuke and Sasuke resolving to fight naruto go?

Looking back, this whole pairing war was low for a while until Kishi wrote hinata confessing to naruto, that was the event which ignited the pairing war and it intensified with sakura hugging naruto, sai revealing narutos feelings to sakura, the 469 event, Sasuke trying to kill Karin and sakura, naruto saving sakura from Sasuke, 540, 615, and 631. Just looking back at what Kishi did with hinata in that moment, it really intensified to all the stuff fans have been debating and because of it, the way it has gone, Kishi wrote himself into a corner posing problems for the story on both ns and nh ends especially with the 469 events because he left stuff unresolved.

On the ns side, before the invasion of pain he gave us a good emphasis on a growing relation between naruto and sakura due to some events like sakura learning about the nine tails, akaskuti, seeing the 4 tails, it was all going in a solid path. He did put emphasis for impacts on sakura with the land of iron and both seeing how she hurt naruto and saw what Sasuke became, sakura experienced two bad things, though she did try to make up things to naruto. The deal was though, 469 was left with unresolved answers to fans, nothing said on him being past sakura or going to hinata. It was just easier to say naruto loved her until proven otherwise and well 631 gave us a good indicator and kushinas foreshadow is a hint to an ending pairing. The problem for ns though, if Kishi chose to just divert from the emphasis he has shown the audience with the events between naruto and sakura, it would have been completely unusual and like a waste to include many scenes of her crying for him if it was just to end in friendship. If anything Kishi made it clear that naruto loves sakura but also that sakura was highly concerned and cared about naruto for all those events she ended up crying over him. Yes we can name many events she cried over him, learning what happens to a jinchurki if the tailed beast was removed, seeing the 4 tails, lamenting herself for not being able to help naruto, crying over what sai revealed to her, crying silently for lying to naruto, crying over the aspect of him dying. And people say she doesn't care, she shed tears many times for naruto. I'm suprised this isn't mentioned more. But the problem is with things left ambiguous to some fans, should ns not happen then this is a big problem I mean just why bother then?

For nh the problems just for bigger, the other half of kishis problem was for nh, at the time it didn't go much anywhere. It had a lot of potential to just rocket after hinatas confession but naruto never answered her back and it had suffered from not much development even at the point of pain. In the span of the manga to that point, hinata honestly didn't do much, she had a role in the Chunin exams but there were many other important characters in that arc too and hinata didn't have much of a role in the itachi pursuit arc, rather no leaf ninja did. It was Sasuke and itachis arc that's all. Now for her to suddenly take the light, she could have done more but not much happened. Then the confinement arc started sending naruto away so no pairing moments for a while. Then came the war. Naruto met hinata for a small time and gave a memory scene to the pain event but that's it. 615 came but naruto wasn't focusing in the hand holding cause well he has a battle to fight. There hasn't been emphasis on it. The problem here was that Kishi hadn't used hinata to give us enough association with hinata before throwing the confession action with her. And with the time then open which had plenty of opportunity to give them space to build nh, nothing happened. Then 615 came, it was short, then 631 came in and we all know the disaster 631 caused over 615. The problem was Kishi didn't use hinata enough prior to 437 and didn't do enough with hinata after 469 if he was serious about naruto moving on from sakura.

So this is another difference between 631 and 615 and I'm suprised many don't use this either, 631 is bound in a foreshadow. 615 is a short moment, we don't need emphasis on a foreshadow, readers know they persist until either the revelation comes or they get some build. 631 built on kushinas foreshadow yet it's beyond me why people think this doesn't count when it's the only thing to have come so far and even then Kishi still could have either saved it for later, used hinata, or ignored it fully leaving it ambiguous to fans over what Kushina meant. But he chose to use it on sakura. Comic moment, yes but worthless or unimportant, i wouldn't go that far. I can understand why nh fans see the 615 hand holding as important, but the foreshadow is the bigger factor here because well foreshadows tell you what will happen or at least hint it and so far Kishi said there would be one pairing, revealed the foreshadow with Kushina, and brought minato in, the only other who knew kushinas last words. Kishi said it in an interview long ago one pairing of unretiquited love would be returned, brought Kushina in with a similar background to sakura in interacting with naruto, made Kushina say find a girl like her, and then we get to minato asking about the relationship of naruto and sakura and thinking of Kushina as similar. In all this time people still think some big change will occur, that minato will just say hinata is like Kushina or himself. If Kishi really really did this, it would only make things even more of a mess. 631 is potentially the game maker chapter for the pairing wars. If it goes forward then 631 was the dark omen of the end for SS and nh. This chain makes sense too yet it's beyond me why people just need to ignore this to the point it becomes mocked and not simply just enough for fans to say, maybe it can happen, that's all it's saying right now.

When people insult my OTP



Insulting a man’s ship, be worse than insulting his mother.

#11600 Sakamaki Izayoi

Sakamaki Izayoi

    Heaven and Earth Deity

  • Kyuubi
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,679 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 30 November 2013 - 11:27 PM

For the current stuff ahead, it makes me wonder for the pairing stuff just what to expect such as

-building on 631, for it hinting the answer of kushinas foreshadow what will occur for naruto and sakura in the future epically since the high moment for them hasn't occurred yet.
-how will Kishi handle hinata for the remainder of the manga if it's coming to a close and the final 2 fights arnt even important for her.
-how will the aspect of sakura not trusting Sasuke and Sasuke resolving to fight naruto go?


Looking back, this whole pairing war was low for a while until Kishi wrote hinata confessing to naruto, that was the event which ignited the pairing war and it intensified with sakura hugging naruto, sai revealing narutos feelings to sakura, the 469 event, Sasuke trying to kill Karin and sakura, naruto saving sakura from Sasuke, 540, 615, and 631. Just looking back at what Kishi did with hinata in that moment, it really intensified to all the stuff fans have been debating and because of it, the way it has gone, Kishi wrote himself into a corner posing problems for the story on both ns and nh ends especially with the 469 events because he left stuff unresolved.

I think it did, but Kushina got three moments in one, first Minato saving her life, second proving he was a great shinobi to her and third by complimenting her forehead and making her drop her insecurity.
With Narusaku we had two, Naruto saving Sakura's life, the second on the war arc with him showing how a great shinobi Naruto is(Path towards Radiance), the third it's her insecurity without any doubt.

 

Hinata is not part of the romance subplot because she doesnt add drama towards it, there's a very high chance that he will never respond to her confession because he doesnt have feelings for her and by rejecting her she would feel bad obviously, so it will remain unadressed by Naruto and it's something Hinata has to figure out by herself and i could not care less.

 

Actually nothing, Sakura not trusting Sasuke has to do with his intentions obviously, but it's due to the fact she knows what he's capable to, i mean he tried to kill her but way before in part 1 she knew his intentions and what he is after, she's not a fangirl obviously but that showed with her fake smile that she didnt wanted to involve her friends into this, she wanted to take it along with Naruto.

 

Actually i never cared too much about it before so i dont have any insight towards it but i think it's due to the fact the Manga it's towards the end.


Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 30 November 2013 - 11:49 PM.

SK-303_image007.jpg




4 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 4 guests, 0 anonymous users