H&E's NaruSaku Debate Thread!
#1061
Posted 31 May 2012 - 01:09 AM
As if. It is Sakura's decision. Her decision and true feelings have been building up for a very long time now. I highly doubt Sasuke suddenly returning her confused not yet confirmed feelings will change anything dramatically because his feelings could never erase the past.
It's naive to think that someone can't have feelings for more than 1 person at a time. Sometimes it happens, the circumstances are always different, and it can't be ignored. It's not a matter of who she loves, it's who she loves more. Sakura may still love Sasuke, but who has she shown the most affection and care for time and again? Over and over?
As NS fans, we feel development is important right? If the characters haven't had development, then that pairing is less likely to happen. Why is it that when it comes to Naruto's development with Sakura, we have extreme leaps over NaruHina, but when it comes to NS against SS, people are trembling in their boots wonder what will happen if Sasuke suddenly has feelings for Sakura and it rewrites history?
I'll admit, if Sasuke hadn't left Konoha and he actually did develop romantic feelings for Sakura back then, SS could have been a high possibility. I think it could have been a race between NS and SS, with SS having a higher ground over NS.
But that's not the case. Sasuke did not develop feelings for Sakura. Sasuke left Konoha behind. Sasuke denied any any bonds with Sakura and Naruto. Sasuke tried to kill them all on multiple occasions.

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#1062
Posted 31 May 2012 - 01:19 AM
You also say something about flashback, that I really cannot agree with, maybe NH flashback would work, but SS hell no Sasuke try to kill Sakura without any hesitation 3 times he treated her like trash, you will never do that to someone you truly love.
Sakura only needs to tell Naruto that she truly miss him, she doesn't want to see him get hurt he kills her inside, he means a lot to her, hugging then kiss him and NS is resolve. Can you Honestly do that with NH or SS.
Also the bolded part are things we already know about Sakura>>>Naruto.
Alright. What if a redeemed Sasuke becomes a good man? That means everything that he has done in the past will be irrelevant. And if Sasuke rejects her again, Naruto becomes her second choice or second best.
Even if she tells Naruto that she misses him, it will not be enough. Naruto must witness, first hand, Sakura does not love Sasuke. Only by Sasuke being alive will help her be committed verbally. If Sasuke dies, than Naruto will have doubts about Sasuke being her true love. Not him, and its something that is going to hunt Naruto for the rest of his life.
As for the flashback parts, I only mentioned NH possibilities after the Pain Invasion Arc. I don't see anything that can fit SS during the war. But never count out Kishi.
And if I'm was the author, I would have made NS canon a long time ago. I'm with you all the way. I still trying to get in Kishi's head, picturing his logical explanations on how the pairings with the lowest amount of interaction (NH and SS) can coexist. While, the other pairings with the most interaction (NS and ShikaTem) is left out with the dust. This is where the manga is currently heading, unless, this is all just a ploy to bash Hinata's character, making her believe she could hold Naruto's hand.
Sounds bias to me.
As if. It is Sakura's decision. Her decision and true feelings have been building up for a very long time now. I highly doubt Sasuke suddenly returning her confused not yet confirmed feelings will change anything dramatically because his feelings could never erase the past.
It's naive to think that someone can't have feelings for more than 1 person at a time. Sometimes it happens, the circumstances are always different, and it can't be ignored. It's not a matter of who she loves, it's who she loves more. Sakura may still love Sasuke, but who has she shown the most affection and care for time and again? Over and over?
As NS fans, we feel development is important right? If the characters haven't had development, then that pairing is less likely to happen. Why is it that when it comes to Naruto's development with Sakura, we have extreme leaps over NaruHina, but when it comes to NS against SS, people are trembling in their boots wonder what will happen if Sasuke suddenly has feelings for Sakura and it rewrites history?
I'll admit, if Sasuke hadn't left Konoha and he actually did develop romantic feelings for Sakura back then, SS could have been a high possibility. I think it could have been a race between NS and SS, with SS having a higher ground over NS.
But that's not the case. Sasuke did not develop feelings for Sakura. Sasuke left Konoha behind. Sasuke denied any any bonds with Sakura and Naruto. Sasuke tried to kill them all on multiple occasions.
It's nice to see you again and here in H&E, Kirabook.
Anyways, what's going to play a factor in Sakura loving Naruto more than Sasuke?
1. How will Sakura react to Hinata's second confession (in the near future).
2. If naruto has a fan-girl club, just like Sasuke, will this benefit Sakura's choice?
2. Will Naruto's war heroic effort have a significant factor?
3. If Naruto is elected to become the Rokudaime Hokage, will this any effect whatsoever?
4. Most important, will Naruto's heritage (Sakura doesn't know his parents) will play an immensely role?
Any suggestions?
Edited by Konoha'sCrimsonFox, 31 May 2012 - 01:42 AM.

"My name is Sung Ji-woo. Some called me the Assassin of Death. A Necromancer Deity... My journey has been nothing but walking over a mountain of corpses. My legion of the dead reigns supreme. None shall block my way or... face the wrath of my blades!" --Solo Leveling.
#1063
Posted 31 May 2012 - 01:31 AM
Naruto already witnessed Sasuke trying to kill Sakura first hand, he may still believe that she has feeling for him, but if she come around he will clearly understand why.
I Also have a question isn't Sakura her own character, I'm very sure she does not have a sign on her forehead that says I am property of Sasuke Uchiha. You are a NaruSaku fan right? Then have some faith in Sakura.
@kirabook
Well that's something you see in every fan club, no one ever thing that Sakura saying no to Sasuke would be great for her character, many fans think that Sasuke will say, ok Sakura you know the deal I'm back so you need to prepare yourself to pop out some Uchiha babies.
Where is Sakura dignity?
Edited by donjoseph19, 31 May 2012 - 01:52 AM.
#1064
Posted 31 May 2012 - 02:49 AM
Even if she tells Naruto that she misses him, it will not be enough. Naruto must witness, first hand, Sakura does not love Sasuke. Only by Sasuke being alive will help her be committed verbally. If Sasuke dies, than Naruto will have doubts about Sasuke being her true love. Not him, and its something that is going to hunt Naruto for the rest of his life.
As for the flashback parts, I only mentioned NH possibilities after the Pain Invasion Arc. I don't see anything that can fit SS during the war. But never count out Kishi.
And if I'm was the author, I would have made NS canon a long time ago. I'm with you all the way. I still trying to get in Kishi's head, picturing his logical explanations on how the pairings with the lowest amount of interaction (NH and SS) can coexist. While, the other pairings with the most interaction (NS and ShikaTem) is left out with the dust. This is where the manga is currently heading, unless, this is all just a ploy to bash Hinata's character, making her believe she could hold Naruto's hand.
Sounds bias to me.
It's nice to see you again and here in H&E, Kirabook.
Anyways, what's going to play a factor in Sakura loving Naruto more than Sasuke?
1. How will Sakura react to Hinata's second confession (in the near future).
2. If naruto has a fan-girl club, just like Sasuke, will this benefit Sakura's choice?
2. Will Naruto's war heroic effort have a significant factor?
3. If Naruto is elected to become the Rokudaime Hokage, will this any effect whatsoever?
4. Most important, will Naruto's heritage (Sakura doesn't know his parents) will play an immensely role?
Any suggestions?
The things you listed are startlingly similar to the shallow reasons Sakura listed off for liking Naruto during 469. She even says that he's become more heroic--a savior, and why should she still like Sasuke after seeing this transformation?
Imo, the likeliest scenario would be seeing Naruto get hurt or something. I don't think him getting any greater in ability or otherwise would make a significant impact. But that's just me.
Edited by AzureWaters, 31 May 2012 - 02:50 AM.
#1065
Posted 31 May 2012 - 02:53 AM
Edited by kidNinja, 31 May 2012 - 02:53 AM.
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#1066
Posted 31 May 2012 - 02:55 AM
Anyways, what's going to play a factor in Sakura loving Naruto more than Sasuke?
1. How will Sakura react to Hinata's second confession (in the near future).
2. If naruto has a fan-girl club, just like Sasuke, will this benefit Sakura's choice?
2. Will Naruto's war heroic effort have a significant factor?
3. If Naruto is elected to become the Rokudaime Hokage, will this any effect whatsoever?
4. Most important, will Naruto's heritage (Sakura doesn't know his parents) will play an immensely role?
Any suggestions?[/color]
She doesn't need some of those reasons you listed to love Naruto. That is shallow. That's what she loved Sasuke for, she was the definition of shallow when she was younger.
1. Sakura already had time to react to Hinata's confession. Her reaction was nothing. We aren't even sure if she heard Hinata's confession though she realized that Hinata loves him after stupidly jumping out there knowing she had no chance whatsoever.
2. Sakura is not that shallow anymore. She's not 12 and fangirlish anymore. Naruto being a hero is probably a plus, but that's not going to be the sole reason why Sakura loves him. She's shown feelings for him WAY before his hero status.
3. See answer 2.
4. That, I doubt even more. It hasn't been much of a deal in the Naruto realm who his parents are other than for Naruto himself. Others kept it a secret for unknown reasons, but again, don't see it as being a big deal if he happens to tell anyone. Too shallow and OOC for Sakura now.

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#1067
Posted 31 May 2012 - 03:28 AM
He probably knows who he's gonna pair up in the end. I'm writing a book myself, and I already know who gets who and I'm barely half way through my first book. I'm pretty sure Kishi has the pairing figured out by now.
#1068
Posted 31 May 2012 - 03:39 AM
"I already know how it is going to end, I just have to make it all make sense." -Masashi Kishimoto
Left Hand to the Future Pirate King
Vinsmoke "Black Leg" Sanji
#1069
Posted 31 May 2012 - 04:22 AM
A writer always knows the beginnings and endings of his stories, whether it be completely laid out in paper, or just in his head. They know the basic's of it. I doubt he'd change that for a fanservice.
It was pretty evident since chapter 3 that everyone knew Naruto and Sakura would eventually end up together - they just didn't know how. Every story has that within it. There's that one couple that if you look back to the beginning, you say: "Oh, we totally saw that coming." Even though it had build up suspense. A lot of people say the same thing with Harry, Hermione and Ron. A lot of people say they knew right from the scene where Hermione first met Ron and told him he had dirt on his nose, they'd end up together in the far future - even though Hermione later had some (arguable) flirtatious moments with Harry that could be assumed as romantic, or with-romantic intentions. The pairing came through in the end that was hinted at from the very beginning. Same with a lot of other movies and shows. Look at something as simple as Hey Arnold, Helga was EXTREME tsundere towards Arnold, and everyone could (Now that we're older...) could now see both sides of her. I think i rambled too much. But i'm just sayin' y'know, like, a lot of future-canon pairings go through a lot of treading through dangerous waters (merging with other 'ships' if you will) but usually the right one makes it out at the end.
Edited by Fenris, 31 May 2012 - 04:25 AM.

†
#1070
Posted 31 May 2012 - 05:02 AM
I was addressing the fandom as a whole, not you specifically - I didn't mean to confuse you, I apologize. I'm aware you are cognizant of Sakura's feelings for Sasuke.
Sakura may still be in love with Sasuke, but the manga has made it abundantly clear that she prioritizes Naruto over Sasuke. Take 3 examples, one from part one and two from part two.
Part One:
- Sakura raising her hand to quit the chuunin written exams in order to preserve Naruto's dream. Did she even give a passing thought to Sasuke, or how quitting might effect him? No - her concern was fully on Naruto.
Part Two:
- Sakura is told the rookies have decided to kill Sasuke right after Sai has told her Naruto is in love with her. Yet when we see her thoughts, who is her only concern? Naruto. Naruto's emotional pain, that is not a pressing immediate need, takes precedence to Sakura over Sasuke's death sentence from the comrades who had always supported her and Naruto's efforts to get him back.
- Sakura's actions at the summit. In going to see Naruto first, and putting him and his group on alert that something was wrong, she was effectively putting Naruto over Sasuke. She told Naruto, "I don't want you going after Sasuke if it puts you in danger! I just want you to come back to the village with me!" If Naruto accepted that offer right there, regardless of his belief in anything else she said, Sakura would not have been able to sneak off and kill Sasuke herself out of love to save him. If she intended to convince Naruto, and then sleeping gas all of them, why not just go try and kill Sasuke first, and then go to Naruto? Because Naruto took priority. She had to see what would work with Naruto first, and then her plan to kill Sasuke was the back up plan.
Stuff like this is all over the manga - so I don't know where you're getting this absurd idea that Sakura treats Naruto as second best in comparison to Naruto. Did you miss the part where she snapped at Sasuke when he told Naruto to shut up?
On top of that, her feelings for Sasuke, though definitely still there in some shape or form, has had nothing but negative development since the first reunion, and especially since the summit. How is that good for the chances of SS? Sasuke's inevitable redemption does not change things - he's never shown ANY romantic interest in Sakura, so why would he suddenly do so after being redeemed? Sakura's romantic feelings are already changing in a negative direction, so again, Sasuke's redemption provides no issue if Sakura is already in the process of getting over Sasuke romantically.
Edited by Paptala, 31 May 2012 - 05:06 AM.


#1071
Posted 31 May 2012 - 05:21 AM
It was pretty evident since chapter 3 that everyone knew Naruto and Sakura would eventually end up together - they just didn't know how. Every story has that within it. There's that one couple that if you look back to the beginning, you say: "Oh, we totally saw that coming." Even though it had build up suspense. A lot of people say the same thing with Harry, Hermione and Ron. A lot of people say they knew right from the scene where Hermione first met Ron and told him he had dirt on his nose, they'd end up together in the far future - even though Hermione later had some (arguable) flirtatious moments with Harry that could be assumed as romantic, or with-romantic intentions. The pairing came through in the end that was hinted at from the very beginning. Same with a lot of other movies and shows. Look at something as simple as Hey Arnold, Helga was EXTREME tsundere towards Arnold, and everyone could (Now that we're older...) could now see both sides of her. I think i rambled too much. But i'm just sayin' y'know, like, a lot of future-canon pairings go through a lot of treading through dangerous waters (merging with other 'ships' if you will) but usually the right one makes it out at the end.
Exactly. If a writer doesn't at least picture the ending of his story, he wont make a very good ending. Although no one knows what the author thinks or does to get his ideas, we know by their style of writing it'll be a romantic, drama, action, EXC ending.
A lot of writers (my self included) become very at peace with their characters and pretend they're real people just to better understand them. If an author doesn't know his characters, then there's no way anyone else will. Sometimes you can tell the ending of the story just by how the characters act towards one another. Naruto and Sakura have a very strong friendship, and they look out for eachother. Naruto doesn't have that strong of a bond with anyone else excluding Sasuke...maybe Shikamaru. Thus the fact that Naruto was created as an immage of Kishi, and Sakura based from his wife lays NaruSaku out on the table as double Aces.
For a person who reads the story for the romantic side of it and knows a little about the author and knows who his characters are based from, they know who gets who in the end. They just have to have the patients to read the story to the end.
Of course each writer has their own style of writing and tend to be better at different grammer ellemements than others.
But by a writer's styl you can tell what the end will be like. Will the lead male confess to the female before taking his final breath or vise versa? Or will the male ask her to merry him on a beach by the ocean with a red and orange sunset? Or will they join eachother hand in hand in heaven and live happily for all eturnity? Or will they have kids? Things like that the reader won't know till the end.
But as far as Naruto goes. I think NS may practically be cannon now. Wouldn't it be kind of odd if Kishi made a character he based from himself and a character based from his wife not end up together? That would be a little strange imo
#1072
Posted 31 May 2012 - 05:44 AM
If I were a mangaka, I'd probably do the same thing. Don't make anything official until the end. And not only with the main couples. Look at Shikamaru x Temari. Maybe the least controversial and most accepted het pairing in Naruto's fandom. But if you make it canon right now, you'll tick off every Shikamaru x Ino fan. And there are a lot of them. Why risk alienating any fan?
And once you get two characters together, they can suffer from Shipping Death Bed. Their interaction as a couple might not live up to the fans expectations. So I can understand waiting until the end of the manga for any official couples.
Edited by Deej, 31 May 2012 - 05:48 AM.
#1073
Posted 31 May 2012 - 05:53 AM
It was pretty evident since chapter 3 that everyone knew Naruto and Sakura would eventually end up together - they just didn't know how. Every story has that within it. There's that one couple that if you look back to the beginning, you say: "Oh, we totally saw that coming." Even though it had build up suspense. A lot of people say the same thing with Harry, Hermione and Ron. A lot of people say they knew right from the scene where Hermione first met Ron and told him he had dirt on his nose, they'd end up together in the far future - even though Hermione later had some (arguable) flirtatious moments with Harry that could be assumed as romantic, or with-romantic intentions. The pairing came through in the end that was hinted at from the very beginning. Same with a lot of other movies and shows. Look at something as simple as Hey Arnold, Helga was EXTREME tsundere towards Arnold, and everyone could (Now that we're older...) could now see both sides of her. I think i rambled too much. But i'm just sayin' y'know, like, a lot of future-canon pairings go through a lot of treading through dangerous waters (merging with other 'ships' if you will) but usually the right one makes it out at the end.
The Harry Potter part, I have known since the first movie. Ron seem to like Hermione and in part two he stick by her side, why people were complaining about it? I reallt don't know, but from the first movie I knew they would be a couple, the only surprise couple for me was Harry and Ginny.
#1074
Posted 31 May 2012 - 06:25 AM
The inevitability of Harry and Ginny was established in the very first book, with Ginny's appearance on the train platform. It was actually foreshadowed just before the Ron/Hermione moment with the dirt on Ron's nose. JK Rowling set her ships up immediately, and although she gave each character other romantic intrigue in the interim, the final ships were pretty clear unless the reader didn't want to see it. (The movies are a different deal, since they -- like the Naruto anime -- toy with all the shippers, even the Remus/Sirius slashers.)
Kishimoto is doing pretty much the same thing. He set Naruto/Sakura up in the very beginning, is providing some interim romantic intrigue with SS and NH, but in the end it will be the ship he set up in the beginning.
#1075
Posted 31 May 2012 - 07:05 AM
Kishimoto is doing pretty much the same thing. He set Naruto/Sakura up in the very beginning, is providing some interim romantic intrigue with SS and NH, but in the end it will be the ship he set up in the beginning.
Again, clear and precise. Damn it, I love your arguments, KnS.
#1076
Posted 31 May 2012 - 07:20 AM
You flatter me, sir.
And I thought of something else Kishimoto and Rowling have both employed in their stories that I should have included in my other post. In Potter, the hero looked just like his father, and the girl he was destined to end up with was smart, vivacious, and red-haired like his mother.
Sounds familiar....
#1077
Posted 31 May 2012 - 07:30 AM
I've said quite a few times n the past that Kishi planned his story out from the beginning. (I have the ending to my own story in my head as well.) what I meant, is why i think he hasn't made said pairing official YET.
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#1078
Posted 31 May 2012 - 07:32 AM
Kishimoto is doing pretty much the same thing. He set Naruto/Sakura up in the very beginning, is providing some interim romantic intrigue with SS and NH, but in the end it will be the ship he set up in the beginning.
At the time, I thought it was going to be Hermione until Luna debuted. Which made me lean in that direction. When Harry x Ginny became official in Half Blood Prince. THEN, it whacked me on the head and I looked back in hindsight.
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#1079
Posted 31 May 2012 - 07:33 AM
Imo, the likeliest scenario would be seeing Naruto get hurt or something. I don't think him getting any greater in ability or otherwise would make a significant impact. But that's just me.
Thank you for the input. Technically, she shouldn't have any romantic feelings for Sasuke. But Kishi made it clear in that one panel, that those feelings were still there, even though, it was not in the good light. Don't get me wrong. I do support NS, but not having high hopes that it will become canon. I only follow the facts.
1. Sakura already had time to react to Hinata's confession. Her reaction was nothing. We aren't even sure if she heard Hinata's confession though she realized that Hinata loves him after stupidly jumping out there knowing she had no chance whatsoever.
2. Sakura is not that shallow anymore. She's not 12 and fangirlish anymore. Naruto being a hero is probably a plus, but that's not going to be the sole reason why Sakura loves him. She's shown feelings for him WAY before his hero status.
3. See answer 2.
4. That, I doubt even more. It hasn't been much of a deal in the Naruto realm who his parents are other than for Naruto himself. Others kept it a secret for unknown reasons, but again, don't see it as being a big deal if he happens to tell anyone. Too shallow and OOC for Sakura now.
I agree with the ones i never bold out.
1. I was referring to the second confession, you know, the part she said she's going to hold his hand after the war (future). Not the confession in the Pain Arc. And if you rewind back to the part she was healing Hinata. Neji asked Sakura,"Why did she do it?" And Sakura mentally said Hinata loves Naruto. Her expression was not too bright about the fact Hinata loves Naruto. And it just makes me wonder, how Sakura will reat to Hinata asking Naruto out. Will she ignore or resent Hinata?
4. I absolutely have to disagree with this one. I'm sure Naruto being Minato's son will have both positive and negative influence on Sakura's character. By human nature, and being a teenage girl. She's going to experience some brief awe-raging-hormone sensation about Naruto being born from the passing Yodaime Hokage and a war hero. And negativity, she's going to be more hurtful for she'd done to Naruto in the past, realizing that she was berating and hitting the Yandaime's son all this time, while she was fangirling a traitor all this time, without knowing what family Naruto came from.

"My name is Sung Ji-woo. Some called me the Assassin of Death. A Necromancer Deity... My journey has been nothing but walking over a mountain of corpses. My legion of the dead reigns supreme. None shall block my way or... face the wrath of my blades!" --Solo Leveling.
#1080
Posted 31 May 2012 - 12:29 PM
I agree with the ones i never bold out.
1. I was referring to the second confession, you know, the part she said she's going to hold his hand after the war (future). Not the confession in the Pain Arc. And if you rewind back to the part she was healing Hinata. Neji asked Sakura,"Why did she do it?" And Sakura mentally said Hinata loves Naruto. Her expression was not too bright about the fact Hinata loves Naruto. And it just makes me wonder, how Sakura will reat to Hinata asking Naruto out. Will she ignore or resent Hinata?
4. I absolutely have to disagree with this one. I'm sure Naruto being Minato's son will have both positive and negative influence on Sakura's character. By human nature, and being a teenage girl. She's going to experience some brief awe-raging-hormone sensation about Naruto being born from the passing Yodaime Hokage and a war hero. And negativity, she's going to be more hurtful for she'd done to Naruto in the past, realizing that she was berating and hitting the Yandaime's son all this time, while she was fangirling a traitor all this time, without knowing what family Naruto came from.
So you have low hope and you want us to feel the same way I got it.
I also understand your post, being classified now as not helpful for NS and not relevant to me.
Naruto call out Sakura because she was lying to herself, why is he allow to lie to himself when all his live he only loved Sakura? Just to make Hinata happy? Who is Hinata? If I believe Hinata was more important to Naruto than Sakura or more relevant than her in this story in general, I would not ship NS.
If I have the mentality that Sakura will not grow out from the person that hurt her I would not ship NaruSaku. If I still believe that Sakura will always be a Sasuke fangirl I would not ship NS.
If I believe that Sasuke already claimed Sakura before he left, I would not be a NS.
If I believe all Sakura's advance, her deep bond with Naruto, being questioned about her feeling for Naruto, her choosing Naruto over Sasuke in the past, Naruto's love Sasuke's hurt and the fact that Sakura finaly acknowledging both guys would still lead to SS, I would not ship NS.
If I believe that the day Sasuke try to date Sakura (highly unlikely) Sakura's will not tell him go to hell, I would not ship NaruSaku.
If I believe that Kishi message is leading to, you most learn to give up you will save your friend, you will save the world, but you will never get the only girl you ever love to love you back, I would not ship NS.
If I believe that all Naruto's effor to make things right and the wish he has that one day Sakura could grow to love him will be thrown in the garbage, I would no ship NaruSaku, and you know why? Because that's exactly the way or NH and SS fans thinks.
Thier is something all NaruSaku fans needs to keep in mind, thier is a reason why Kishi made Sakura fully aware of the deep of Naruto's feelings and how debasted Sakura was because she ignored them and hurted him at the same time. Sakura will always know there is someone that loves her deeply and will go to the end of the world to see her happy, she will always have that in her mind. Has we could see, Naruto appreciated Hinata feelings and Sasuke thanked Sakura, but none were deeply moved by that fact that the other party love them. Plus none of the girls were willing to go to the end of the world just to see their love interest happy, even is that happiness was not with them, Kishi clearly illustrates that to the fans.
Edited by donjoseph19, 31 May 2012 - 01:04 PM.
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