130 replies to this topic

[dl316bh]

I'm struggling to see how any of that related to anything I said.

[Fox-And-Flower]

Ok Naruto is literally a dumbass!

What is he holding on to? Why focus so much on a friend who's too far away than the ones close to you? If he wants to be Hokage, doesn't he realize he must do things for the sake of the village?

He should grateful that Tsunade was nice enough to allow him to save Sasuke because in reality since he's a nukenin & joined with the enemy, he should be put to death.

I hope Sai does tell Sakura so she remove Naruto from this promise. Besides Kishi should give her a power boast if you wants to a team 7 battle to occur then Sakura needs to catch up with the boys, yes its harder since she doesn't have a bloodline nor demon but still.

Here's the power lineup:

Taijustu
Sakura
Naruto & Sasuke needs to power up in order to have a stronger from while Sakura is pure natural strength. However Sasuke does stand a chance since he's faster than Sakura.

Genjustu
Sasuke
Naruto purely sucks and Sakura never bother to train in it. Assuming if Sasuke uses his MS like Itachi he will have a greater edge and could possibly break Naruto. Now Sakura stands a chance since its her natural gifted field and possibly better if she trains in it.

Ninjustu
Sasuke
Sakura lacks it and Naruto doesn't have much of it and relies heavily on his clones. Sasuke has 2 elements at his disposal and many more jutsus that haven't been reveal yet; also take the sharigan to account may have been coping some thus gaining more in a fast rate. Naruto can match but remember he only has wind element and the rasigan is the only one he uses and that take time to form. So should Sasuke use something else Naruto may have trouble.

I made Naruto sound weak but when you think about it he's more power than skill & techinque. Hell if Shikamaru gain more jutsus he could probably beat Naruto. Brains vs. Brawn (brawn doesn't always win)!

Now the kage meeting should be interested I wonder when we will see everyone around the ninja world since its focus on the leaf and occasionally sand. I hope Sasuke have some common sense and not attack the Hokage. Doesn't he know there'll be 4 other kages there and won't stand around while he's trying to assassinate Danzo?

naruto may not have very many jutsu like sasuke does, but he doesnt have JUST brawn. he's pretty smart himself, even if most of the time he doesnt show it. sure, he's no shikamaru, but he's very good at deceiving his enemies. he thinks of his next move on the spot, so yeah, he doesnt plan ahead like some others do, but thats just the way he is.

and yes, most of his attacks rely quite a bit on his clones, but its a very usefull technique, and he's a master at it! ><
Its not how many jutsu one has, but how one uses them

and it was said by shika himself that naruto would win against him in a fair fight.

honestly, i dont really care how many techniques naruto has, he's got other abilities that other dont, such as his crazy stamina, regenerative abilities(thank you, kyuubi^^) his freaky power to change others just through talking (or a good fist to the face, whichever XD) his ability to always being able to get up no matter how badly injured or how bad the situation. he'll always get up until the job's done. these are things i admire him for.

what i like to see is the way he uses the techniques that he knows, and alot of the time, it surprises me, the things he comes up with

oh, and sakura's strength isnt natural. its chakra enhanced, she wasnt born with it X3 (not THAT much strength at least XD)
Tsunade's on the other hand is natural, sakura was just able to find a different way of doing what tsunade does.

unless of course, this has nothing to do with what you said and i completely misunderstood it XD if you mean sakura USES nothing but strength (her fists, as in, no ninjutsu or anything like that...) to fight, then yes, she does X3

Edited by Fox-And-Flower, 05 July 2009 - 02:02 PM.

[RyrineaHaruno]

This is true. However, I am starting to think Naruto is getting a little ridiculous in his mission to "save" Sasuke. Not everyone can be saved; often enough they have to lie in the bed they've made. Naruto doesn't want to believe that. In truth, it's almost coming off as denial about now. Who knows, maybe that's the point.

Sasuke has arguably never actually killed anyone, true, but at what point do the sum of your actions rival something as "deplorable"? This is something the manga's never really addressed. One can rationalize all day long, but the truth is that Sasuke has still done a lot of deplorable things and joined up with a lot of nasty people.

I don't think so even his teacher did the same thing with his friend for sometime. I HIGHLY doubt that Sasuke is too far gone to even be consider saving.


Please for give me if this had nothing do with what you said. I HAD TROUBLE UNDERSTANDING YOUR POST.

Edited by RyrineaHaruno, 05 July 2009 - 03:40 PM.

[Cloud]

In the end, Sasuke is way too far off to save. Naruto still sees some good in him, while the others don't. He joined Orochimaru, started up Hawk, joined Akatsuki after his brother tried to save him from that path...

It seems Sasuke will never see the light in what others do for him. In the end, I hope he dies the tragic avenger like he's supposed to, like the old Shakespeare plays.

[Dreamer]

I'm struggling to see how any of that related to anything I said.

Sorry, I used the wrong smiley face that accidentally confused you. The statement below was just a projection i thought about.

In the end, Sasuke is way too far off to save. Naruto still sees some good in him, while the others don't. He joined Orochimaru, started up Hawk, joined Akatsuki after his brother tried to save him from that path...

It seems Sasuke will never see the light in what others do for him. In the end, I hope he dies the tragic avenger like he's supposed to, like the old Shakespeare plays.

So, True Cloud.

The only way i see Naruto actually going for vengeance on Sasuke is if one or more ninja close to him: Sakura, Kakashi, Iruka, Tsunade, Konohamaru, or one of the other Rookie members were killed by Sasuke's hand.

Edited by 6thHokage, 05 July 2009 - 03:50 PM.

[catsi563]

It may seem that way but once people may have said that Gaara was irredeemable. Gaara has killed, and gaara has maimed and nearly crippled people.

And yet gaara now stands as the Kazekage, and as Narutos friend.

Sasuke hasnt killed yet, hasnt maimed or crippled anyone. Killerbeee offered a glimpse of the sasuke of old team 7 when sasuke was able to grab the power needed to save them.

hes on the edge right now. he could tip either way.

Id like to see naruto gain a little perspective I grant. id like him prepared for the possibility of sasuke being irredeemable. But if he gave up entirely he just wouldnt be the naruto we all know and love. Thats ame stubborn determination is why he made the promise to sakura. its why he never gave up on her even after all shes done to him.

[canis]

In the end, Sasuke is way too far off to save. Naruto still sees some good in him, while the others don't. He joined Orochimaru, started up Hawk, joined Akatsuki after his brother tried to save him from that path...

It seems Sasuke will never see the light in what others do for him. In the end, I hope he dies the tragic avenger like he's supposed to, like the old Shakespeare plays.

I'd say that's up to debate... Has anyone of the Konoha 12 ever ranted about Sasuke? The only thing coming close to it I can think of is Kakashi's explanation about the logic behind Danzou's order 1 or 2 chapters back... And I think he was just playing the devil's advocat there. And as long as someone believes in Sasuke and is willing to put in the effort he has a chance of redemption.
Apart from Sakura at least Shikamaru is willing to lend Naruto a hand...

Edited by canis, 05 July 2009 - 06:49 PM.

[dl316bh]

Sorry, I used the wrong smiley face that accidentally confused you. The statement below was just a projection i thought about.

Ah, no worries. I was merely having difficulty seeing how what you said correlated to my post. That and the eyeroll threw me.

It may seem that way but once people may have said that Gaara was irredeemable. Gaara has killed, and gaara has maimed and nearly crippled people.

And yet gaara now stands as the Kazekage, and as Narutos friend.

Sasuke hasnt killed yet, hasnt maimed or crippled anyone.

This is only if you hold killing by our standards. In the context of the manga, much of it is almost a fact of life for ninja. So I don't hold it in as high a regard in the context of the manga as others may.

The thing about Gaara is that he had a lot rolling against him. He was ostricized and hated by everyone and had the One Tail inside of him. He maimed and killed, yes, but most of the time it was in service to his village. Key words being "most of the time"; even still killing is supposed to be fact of life for ninja, though in the case of most of the Rookie Nine that's debateable considering the path the manga's gone with them.

Sasuke's a much different story. He's never killed anyone, perse, but he's arguably done far worse. He turned his back on his village to join it's greatest enemy. He threw away everything and everyone that cared about him, placing power above anything he had worth a damn. Not only that, but he's shown willingness to kill his friends if necessary. Being a traitor is generally considered deplorable. In his case even moreso; he was not tricked into betraying his village, it was a conscious decision. As we know, in the world of Naruto treachery and treason aren't tolerated. This is all not mentioning how easy he is to manipulate into betraying others; any sane body of order would see him as a liability at this point that's more trouble than he's worth.

Then, of course, he cut off ties with that enemy and ended up joining one even bigger; arguably the enemy of the entire world. What does it really take to redeem something like that? I don't believe he really cares if what he did was wrong; the impression gleaned is that he would probably do it again if given the chance. Even if he were to suddenly have a change of heart, his actions have hurt others immensely either directly or indirectly and the impression given is that he doesn't care.

Even if you want to play fast and loose with what you define to be "redeemable", Sasuke still goes way too far over the line in terms of deplorable actions. As I mentioned earlier, at what point do the sum of your actions bring you beyond such concepts as the redemption of your honor or character? Wherever you place that point, Sasuke has probably jumped the line a long time ago.

But if he gave up entirely he just wouldnt be the naruto we all know and love.

I agree, but at the same time it feels like Naruto doesn't face reality in some regards. I could see Naruto continue trying to bring Sasuke back right up until it became impossible, through death or otherwise, because that's just the way he is. The fact that he doesn't seem to truly acknowledge how far Sasuke's gone over the line, however, feels a little ridiculous.

He doesn't have to live in denial over it though. It reminds me of Daredevil from Marvel comics. He harbors no real thoughts that the justice system is perfect and he accepts that, but he believes in it anyway and strives to uphold it as best he can. He holds to his beliefs. I see Naruto in a similar light, he just seems unwilling to accept everything that Sasuke has done and whether he truly can come back or not. Naruto probably could redeem Sasuke in his own eyes, maybe even get him to turn away from the path of evil, but he doesn't seem to acknowledge that there isn't any way that Team 7 will be the way it was again and that things have progressed to a point where there's a good chance that Sasuke can't be redeemed.

Naruto doesn't need to fool himself to continue never giving up.

Has anyone of the Konoha 12 ever ranted about Sasuke?

That would matter more if we saw most of them more than once every fifty chapters. Kind of hard to know what characters think about anything when they're never around.

Edited by dl316bh, 05 July 2009 - 08:25 PM.

[Sora no Kitsune]

Ah, no worries. I was merely having difficulty seeing how what you said correlated to my post. That and the eyeroll threw me.


This is only if you hold killing by our standards. In the context of the manga, much of it is almost a fact of life for ninja. So I don't hold it in as high a regard in the context of the manga as others may.

The thing about Gaara is that he had a lot rolling against him. He was ostricized and hated by everyone and had the One Tail inside of him. He maimed and killed, yes, but most of the time it was in service to his village. Key words being "most of the time"; even still killing is supposed to be fact of life for ninja, though in the case of most of the Rookie Nine that's debateable considering the path the manga's gone with them.

Sasuke's a much different story. He's never killed anyone, perse, but he's arguably done far worse. He turned his back on his village to join it's greatest enemy. He threw away everything and everyone that cared about him, placing power above anything he had worth a damn. Not only that, but he's shown willingness to kill his friends if necessary. Being a traitor is generally considered deplorable. In his case even moreso; he was not tricked into betraying his village, it was a conscious decision. As we know, in the world of Naruto treachery and treason aren't tolerated. This is all not mentioning how easy he is to manipulate into betraying others; any sane body of order would see him as a liability at this point that's more trouble than he's worth.

Then, of course, he cut off ties with that enemy and ended up joining one even bigger; arguably the enemy of the entire world. What does it really take to redeem something like that? I don't believe he really cares if what he did was wrong; the impression gleaned is that he would probably do it again if given the chance. Even if he were to suddenly have a change of heart, his actions have hurt others immensely either directly or indirectly and the impression given is that he doesn't care.

Even if you want to play fast and loose with what you define to be "redeemable", Sasuke still goes way too far over the line in terms of deplorable actions. As I mentioned earlier, at what point do the sum of your actions bring you beyond such concepts as the redemption of your honor or character? Wherever you place that point, Sasuke has probably jumped the line a long time ago.


I agree, but at the same time it feels like Naruto doesn't face reality in some regards. I could see Naruto continue trying to bring Sasuke back right up until it became impossible, through death or otherwise, because that's just the way he is. The fact that he doesn't seem to truly acknowledge how far Sasuke's gone over the line, however, feels a little ridiculous.

He doesn't have to live in denial over it though. It reminds me of Daredevil from Marvel comics. He harbors no real thoughts that the justice system is perfect and he accepts that, but he believes in it anyway and strives to uphold it as best he can. He holds to his beliefs. I see Naruto in a similar light, he just seems unwilling to accept everything that Sasuke has done and whether he truly can come back or not. Naruto probably could redeem Sasuke in his own eyes, maybe even get him to turn away from the path of evil, but he doesn't seem to acknowledge that there isn't any way that Team 7 will be the way it was again and that things have progressed to a point where there's a good chance that Sasuke can't be redeemed.

Naruto doesn't need to fool himself to continue never giving up.


That would matter more if we saw most of them more than once every fifty chapters. Kind of hard to know what characters think about anything when they're never around.

One word. EPIC!!! Everything and anything i could have thought of was listed in your post and i couldn't agree more with this post.

[canis]

Ah, no worries. I was merely having difficulty seeing how what you said correlated to my post. That and the eyeroll threw me.


This is only if you hold killing by our standards. In the context of the manga, much of it is almost a fact of life for ninja. So I don't hold it in as high a regard in the context of the manga as others may.

The thing about Gaara is that he had a lot rolling against him. He was ostricized and hated by everyone and had the One Tail inside of him. He maimed and killed, yes, but most of the time it was in service to his village. Key words being "most of the time"; even still killing is supposed to be fact of life for ninja, though in the case of most of the Rookie Nine that's debateable considering the path the manga's gone with them.

Sasuke's a much different story. He's never killed anyone, perse, but he's arguably done far worse. He turned his back on his village to join it's greatest enemy. He threw away everything and everyone that cared about him, placing power above anything he had worth a damn. Not only that, but he's shown willingness to kill his friends if necessary. Being a traitor is generally considered deplorable. In his case even moreso; he was not tricked into betraying his village, it was a conscious decision. As we know, in the world of Naruto treachery and treason aren't tolerated. This is all not mentioning how easy he is to manipulate into betraying others; any sane body of order would see him as a liability at this point that's more trouble than he's worth.

Then, of course, he cut off ties with that enemy and ended up joining one even bigger; arguably the enemy of the entire world. What does it really take to redeem something like that? I don't believe he really cares if what he did was wrong; the impression gleaned is that he would probably do it again if given the chance. Even if he were to suddenly have a change of heart, his actions have hurt others immensely either directly or indirectly and the impression given is that he doesn't care.

Even if you want to play fast and loose with what you define to be "redeemable", Sasuke still goes way too far over the line in terms of deplorable actions. As I mentioned earlier, at what point do the sum of your actions bring you beyond such concepts as the redemption of your honor or character? Wherever you place that point, Sasuke has probably jumped the line a long time ago.


I agree, but at the same time it feels like Naruto doesn't face reality in some regards. I could see Naruto continue trying to bring Sasuke back right up until it became impossible, through death or otherwise, because that's just the way he is. The fact that he doesn't seem to truly acknowledge how far Sasuke's gone over the line, however, feels a little ridiculous.

He doesn't have to live in denial over it though. It reminds me of Daredevil from Marvel comics. He harbors no real thoughts that the justice system is perfect and he accepts that, but he believes in it anyway and strives to uphold it as best he can. He holds to his beliefs. I see Naruto in a similar light, he just seems unwilling to accept everything that Sasuke has done and whether he truly can come back or not. Naruto probably could redeem Sasuke in his own eyes, maybe even get him to turn away from the path of evil, but he doesn't seem to acknowledge that there isn't any way that Team 7 will be the way it was again and that things have progressed to a point where there's a good chance that Sasuke can't be redeemed.

Naruto doesn't need to fool himself to continue never giving up.


That would matter more if we saw most of them more than once every fifty chapters. Kind of hard to know what characters think about anything when they're never around.

Well, we've got Shikamaru's way of thinking... In part I when he was talking about Sasuke being one of them and that they'd bring him back no matter what. Everyone on the team was smiling in approval.
This was reinforced by his promise to help Naruto on his mission as soon he was able to. I'm not saying that noone of the rookies has anything against him but apparently they were ready to look past that (and Shika seems to uphold that mindset). I don't think it's just because of Naruto.

I don't think that Naruto doesn't accept what Sasuke has done or how far in darkness he is... Kinda difficult, when he tried to kill him by piercing his lung. And last chapters speech about knowing how it feels like to be living for hatred and revenge indicates that as well. Despite all those difficulties and Sasuke's deeds he's still ready to give it a shot.
But I don't think that his persuasion is going to get him anywhere. Sasuke won't stop without a nasty brawl...
I also don't think that they'll be able to even have on open conversation without punching each other. So I guess Kishi will make sure he'll get it
And Naruto's gung-ho attitude which sometimes borders on denial is a remainder of a time when he was completely on his own. To not give up hope I guess he would cling to anything to be able to go on.
The worse the situation the more he needs to convince himself it's going to be ok. I guess this tells us a lot about his doubts concerning his former teammate.
But he's been changing lately... Though I doubt he'll every rid himself completely of this way of thinking.

As for Sasuke becoming irredeemable... I think as long as someone is willing to forgive him and welcome him back, he's redeemable. No matter what outsiders think of it.
If Naruto and Sakura ever stop trying then it's pretty much over for Sasuke...

[dl316bh]

Well, we've got Shikamaru's way of thinking... In part I when he was talking about Sasuke being one of them and that they'd bring him back no matter what. Everyone on the team was smiling in approval.

A lot's changed since Part 1 and Sasuke's done worse things since that time. We don't see much of anyone and haven't for a while now, so what they think about the situation anymore is anyones guess.

I don't think it's just because of Naruto.

If any of them are still gung-ho about saving him, I'm going to assume it's because of Naruto. Much of the Nine did not have ties to Sasuke as strong as Naruto and Sakura did. When he left for Orochimaru, one could easily argue he was misguided and needed someone to get through to him. Now? Not so much. Not everyone in the manga runs under Naruto's general line of thinking, but they trust him now; I don't think there's any way at least some if not all of the Rookie Nine aren't starting to think Sasuke's a lost cause. But Naruto believes and they believe in him.

Really, much of anything to do with the Nine is conjecture; we don't see or hear from them enough to get their thoughts on, well, anything.

I don't think that Naruto doesn't accept what Sasuke has done or how far in darkness he is... Kinda difficult, when he tried to kill him by piercing his lung.

Not so much that he doesn't accept how far Sasukes fallen so much as he doesn't seem to acknowledge the consequences. Every now and then one tends to get the impression he still thinks he can bring Sasuke back and Team 7 can go back to how it once was. At this stage that's pretty much the equivalent of denial.

And Naruto's gung-ho attitude which sometimes borders on denial is a remainder of a time when he was completely on his own. To not give up hope I guess he would cling to anything to be able to go on.

True, but that's also from a time when he was younger. He's maturing in his own ways and you'd think that his beliefs would too. I had expected by now that Naruto would have grown to the point where he could accept that things don't always go the way you want them to and that his mission would not end the way he wanted to, but he would still believe and never give up.

Instead he sometimes seems to wallow in denial, desperately clinging to a dying ideal.

As for Sasuke becoming irredeemable... I think as long as someone is willing to forgive him and welcome him back, he's redeemable. No matter what outsiders think of it.

But in what fashion? Maybe redeem himself to Naruto, whom would probably settle merely for Sasuke returning, but others in the village? Sasuke doesn't seem to have much in the way of guilt over what he's done; can someone even be redeemed if they don't even believe what they had done was wrong?

It doesn't just come down to Naruto; there's an entire village and, hell, even world of people he's turned his back on. Convincing most of them that they should harbor his treacherous presence? I know this is a fantasy-esque shounen series and all, but come on.

Also, outsiders kind of do matter in the end. Sasuke's been chillin' with Akatsuki. It's kind of the rest of the worlds business at this point. If he was welcomed back to Konoha with open arms, as unrealistic as that possibility seems, there's no way that things wouldn't get very tense and relations would be hurt badly. Konoha relies at least partly on other villages, as I recall; it really isn't as simple as someone wanting him back and it's done.

If Naruto and Sakura ever stop trying then it's pretty much over for Sasuke...

I doubt Naruto ever will until Sasuke's either dead or it becomes well and truly hopeless to redeem him in even the smallest regard. The kid doesn't give up; that's his schtick. Sakura? I'm not sure anymore. Judging by her reactions and such, I can't help thinking that she's starting to wonder if Naruto is continuously chasing after a fleeting dream that's long since begun to fade away.

Edited by dl316bh, 05 July 2009 - 10:02 PM.

[Nee-sama]

^ Cannis has a pretty good point, I think you may be over thinking things.

Edited by Nee-sama, 05 July 2009 - 10:11 PM.

[dl316bh]

^ Cannis has a pretty good point, I think you may be over thinking things.

I admittedly do that from time to time, but I don't think this is one of those cases.

[Paptala]

Here's the power lineup:

Taijustu
Sakura
Naruto & Sasuke needs to power up in order to have a stronger from while Sakura is pure natural strength. However Sasuke does stand a chance since he's faster than Sakura.

Genjustu
Sasuke
Naruto purely sucks and Sakura never bother to train in it. Assuming if Sasuke uses his MS like Itachi he will have a greater edge and could possibly break Naruto. Now Sakura stands a chance since its her natural gifted field and possibly better if she trains in it.

Ninjustu
Sasuke
Sakura lacks it and Naruto doesn't have much of it and relies heavily on his clones. Sasuke has 2 elements at his disposal and many more jutsus that haven't been reveal yet; also take the sharigan to account may have been coping some thus gaining more in a fast rate. Naruto can match but remember he only has wind element and the rasigan is the only one he uses and that take time to form. So should Sasuke use something else Naruto may have trouble.

I made Naruto sound weak but when you think about it he's more power than skill & techinque. Hell if Shikamaru gain more jutsus he could probably beat Naruto. Brains vs. Brawn (brawn doesn't always win)!

Now the kage meeting should be interested I wonder when we will see everyone around the ninja world since its focus on the leaf and occasionally sand. I hope Sasuke have some common sense and not attack the Hokage. Doesn't he know there'll be 4 other kages there and won't stand around while he's trying to assassinate Danzo?

I'm really sorry, but I doubt that Sakura trumps Sasuke and Naruto in taijutsu. Naruto just got trained in frog fu style, or however you want to call it. Even in base mode, Naruto was able to take on Pein one to one using ONLY taijutsu. Sakura has power in her blows, but no real strategy. If she can't land a blow, her strength is useless. She's not fast enough to land the majority of those blows, and what she needs is speed training. Sasuke's not a hand to hand fighter really so I'll agree with you that Sakura has better taijutsu than him, even though he's too fast for her to hit.

Genjutsu I agree with you, and ninjutsu as well. Naruto is a better on the spot fast thinker than Sasuke is though. His ability to surprise his opponents with the unexpected is one of his biggest advantages. Naruto is not just brawn.

True Naruto is unpredictable but when Naruto fights in techniques he relies only on 2 and after awhile he's really not that much to figure out which is why I said he's weak in taijustu & genjustu but strong in ninjustu he learns more or use justus that Jiraiya actually taught him.

Naruto may not have a lot of moves, but he knows how to use them in tricky clever ways. This is pretty much a non issue. The only attack that was pretty much useless because Pein saw it too many times was FRS. No matter how often he saw rasengan or kage bunshin, it didn't matter because of the way Naruto utilized them.


What I'd really like to see is Sakura getting some speed training, and then using her medical abilities to attack vital areas of the body to incapacitate them like Kabuto did in his fight against Tsunade and Shizune! That would be awesome!

Edited by Paptala, 05 July 2009 - 11:16 PM.

[shadow_Uzumaki]

oh, and sakura's strength isnt natural. its chakra enhanced, she wasnt born with it X3 (not THAT much strength at least XD)
Tsunade's on the other hand is natural, sakura was just able to find a different way of doing what tsunade does.

Actually, both Tsunade and Sakura don't have natural strength. They amplify their strength by storing and releasing chakra at the point of contact.

[Nate River]

This is true. However, I am starting to think Naruto is getting a little ridiculous in his mission to "save" Sasuke. Not everyone can be saved; often enough they have to lie in the bed they've made. Naruto doesn't want to believe that. In truth, it's almost coming off as denial about now. Who knows, maybe that's the point.

Sasuke has arguably never actually killed anyone, true, but at what point do the sum of your actions rival something as "deplorable"? This is something the manga's never really addressed. One can rationalize all day long, but the truth is that Sasuke has still done a lot of deplorable things and joined up with a lot of nasty people.

I pretty much agree with most of what you said in your posts. As you mention, people often have lie in the bed the make and that's one reasons why I hate Part 2 Sasuke. Up to this point, he hasn't had to do that, regardless of what he's done.

As you said, he's a traitor. He ran off to join the villages greatest enemy who wants to use him to destroy his village; something Sasuke is aware of when he defects. Not only that Orochimaru was the one that murdered their beloved Hokage and one of Naruto's precious people. The normal course of business for what Sasuke did is Hunter-nin's tailing you with an order to kill. Sasuke got five genin and was allowed to wander around in arms of an enemy for three years. While Sasuke didn't kill anyone, treason is treason. Nobody ever takes kindly to being sold out by their own people.

Moreover, Sasuke's also wanted to destroy Konoha. Instead, Pain saves him the trouble and the guy who replaced Tsunade is someone who no one of relevance likes. If Sasuke, kills him, Atlus will shrug. Sasuke only didn't succeed in killing anyone one by independent actions. Sasuke's intent, however, was to kill people within his own village.

[NarutoNamikaze]

Actually, both Tsunade and Sakura don't have natural strength. They amplify their strength by storing and releasing chakra at the point of contact.

Yes your right it just Tsunade has improven it so much that she barely even has to do anything and her super stregthcomes to her, which i believe Sakura will be able to do in a couple of years.

Did everyone forget about sage Naruto because for me that is better than a tech. Theres no way Sasuke is faster than him.

His MS won't work because in sage mode Naruto takes energy from the outside so even if he did get Naruto in it the energy from the outside would release it.

So all Sasuke has left is the cursed seal, but naruto has Kyuubi which is better, and then Sasuke has his elements, that is all he beats Naruto in.

Naruto wins in 3 of the 4 and can easily get the 4th in like two training chapters.

Also I hope Sakura realizes what she is doing to NAruto with that stupid promise. She should tell him he doesn't have to then it will be only for him to get Sasuke not for her which is very annoying.

Just my two cents

[Cloud]

Correction: Sasuke no longer possesses the cursed seal. Removed by Itachi and his Susanoo technique.

And I'm pretty sure MS would still work on Naruto. It has nothing to do with the energy outside, rather, it traps people inside an illusion. (For Tsukuyomi, that is)

But I'm pretty sure Itachi gave Naruto something to counter that.

Edited by Cloud, 06 July 2009 - 01:03 AM.

[NarutoNamikaze]

Correction: Sasuke no longer possesses the cursed seal. Removed by Itachi and his Susanoo technique.

And I'm pretty sure MS would still work on Naruto. It has nothing to do with the energy outside, rather, it traps people inside an illusion. (For Tsukuyomi, that is)

But I'm pretty sure Itachi gave Naruto something to counter that.

I forgot about Susanoo my bad. LOL

I still Ms can be broken with outside energy, but maybe not.

[NutMan]

These past few chapters have been pretty good actually. I'm really liking where things are going. What's getting annoying is the preachy "Don't fight, no revenge" stuff. Sasuke as of right now is way too far off to be saved.