105 replies to this topic

[Gojira]

Not necessarily. The memory of Sasuke (with a menacing background and a frown on her face, keep in mind) is triggered when the fodder nin implies that whoever she likes is bound to be a great person. Sasuke at that point did not turn out to be a great person whatsoever. That's the connection she made in her head. There's no hope for a relationship there. Just because she may still have some lingering feelings for Sasuke does not mean she is happy about them, or wants to be with him after what he's done, what he's turned into.
 
The confession wasn't fake. She does have feelings for Naruto. The statement that she no longer cared about Sasuke, that is what was being stretched. That's what Naruto called her out on.

Good point but I still can't help but be confused how this is played out

- Sakura says she loves Naruto and not Sasuke

- Naruto turns her down because she still has feelings for Sasuke and he knows it (which sort of renders all the times he flirts with her and asks her on dates pointless)

- Turns out she was lying and she does still harbor feelings for Sasuke

- Kishi: "She's being honest yet stubborn"

I still don't really see how she's being honest even you refer to her being honest about being in love with Naruto that still leaves the problem of her lying about her not having feelings for Sasuke.

The problem with 539 is that when she turned the fodder nin down saying she loved someone else, she most likely was referring to Sasuke (since by the end of the Land of Iron arc thanks to Naruto she believed Sasuke still could be return) but the thought knowing that he wasn't a great guy brought her down and had her lose some of the confidence Naruto re-inspired her with that's the context of what I got atleast.
 

[CloudMountainJuror]

Good point but I still can't help but be confused how this is played out

- Sakura says she loves Naruto and not Sasuke

- Naruto turns her down because she still has feelings for Sasuke and he knows it (which sort of renders all the times he flirts with her and asks her on dates pointless)

- Turns out she was lying and she does still harbor feelings for Sasuke

- Kishi: "She's being honest yet stubborn"

I still don't really see how she's being honest even you refer to her being honest about being in love with Naruto that still leaves the problem of her lying about her not having feelings for Sasuke.

The problem with 539 is that when she turned the fodder nin down saying she loved someone else, she most likely was referring to Sasuke (since by the end of the Land of Iron arc thanks to Naruto she believed Sasuke still could be return) but the thought knowing that he wasn't a great guy brought her down and had her lose some of the confidence Naruto re-inspired her with that's the context of what I got atleast.
 

 

You identify one of Naruto's flaws there. He's so stuck on Sasuke that if Sakura ever really did stop feeling for Sasuke, that if she loved Naruto and only Naruto, and she told him that with every bit of honesty, then he still probably wouldn't believe her at first, no matter how much he cares for her.

 

For the "honesty" thing, it comes down to the question: which kind of honesty did Kishimoto mean? Did he mean:

 

Possibility #1: She was being honest, as in 100% honest?

or

Possibility #2: She was being honest, as in partially honest?

 

Both are legitimate interpretations, considering how vague the statement is. I don't think we need to question the "stubborn" comment; that's pretty self-explanatory. But for the "honesty" comment itself, it comes down to those two possibilities.

 

Now, let's assume #1 was his intention. By the context of his own story, this is proven to be impossible. She still cares about Sasuke. She couldn't go through with killing him, among other things. That means the other option must be true.

 

But wait! A third possibility comes to mind.

 

Possibility #3: Was Kishimoto was just plain unreliable in this interview?

(Assuming it's indeed a real interview and that's what he actually said in the first place; I'm very skeptical about that, considering I haven't yet seen a legitimate source for it. Anyone, please feel free to prove it's legitimate!)

 

So, #2 and #3 are left standing. Let's figure out which one is dominant. If the context of the story doesn't fit #2, then #3 is the way to go. Does the context of the story fit #2, then?

 

Yes, it does. My previous post is my reasoning.

Edited by zacrathedemon5, 27 March 2014 - 11:43 PM.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

Not necessarily. The memory of Sasuke (with a menacing background and a frown on her face, keep in mind) is triggered when the fodder nin implies that whoever she likes is bound to be a great person. Sasuke at that point did not turn out to be a great person whatsoever. That's the connection she made in her head. There's no hope for a relationship there. Just because she may still have some lingering feelings for Sasuke does not mean she is happy about them, or wants to be with him after what he's done, what he's turned into.

On which doesnt turn down the fact that it refered to the one she loves which is Sasuke.
What he implied wasnt the fact if she wanted to have a relationship with Sasuke or not what is being refered to is the fact if she still loves Sasuke or not on which the scene confirmed it.
 

The confession wasn't fake. She does have feelings for Naruto. The statement that she no longer cared about Sasuke, that is what was being stretched. That's what Naruto called her out on.

The confession was fake because she did that with other objectives on her mind, to keep Naruto out of danger not in order to have a genuine relationship with him.
Her feelings for Sasuke being emphasized right after the confession is other strong argument that makes me say it's fake, the arc was about her feelings and it made it clear at that moment, she loved Sasuke however she cares about Naruto and wanted to help Naruto in some way and returning his feelings was the idea she got about it.
 

Possibility #1: She was being honest, as in 100% honest?
or
Possibility #2: She was being honest, as in partially honest?
 
Both are legitimate interpretations, considering how vague the statement is. I don't think we need to question the "stubborn" comment; that's pretty self-explanatory. But for the "honesty" comment itself, it comes down to those two possibilities.
 
Now, let's assume #1 was his intention. By the context of his own story, this is proven to be impossible. She still cares about Sasuke. She couldn't go through with killing him, among other things. That means the other option must be true.

She still loved him the "caring" word doesnt apply it looks like you're judging that moment with our actual timeline, before Naruto departed she indeed showed her feelings for Sasuke when she was asked about what Sasuke was for her and she was cut off by Naruto.
We all knew she loved Sasuke at that time, and during that confession it was kind obvious she was going to take a decision.
She didnt resolved her feelings for Sasuke, we all knew that would not work.
 
 

But wait! A third possibility comes to mind.
 
Possibility #3: Was Kishimoto was just plain unreliable in this interview?
(Assuming it's indeed a real interview and that's what he actually said in the first place; I'm very skeptical about that, considering I haven't yet seen a legitimate source for it. Anyone, please feel free to prove it's legitimate!)
 
So, #2 and #3 are left standing. Let's figure out which one is dominant. If the context of the story doesn't fit #2, then #3 is the way to go. Does the context of the story fit #2, then?
 
Yes, it does. My previous post is my reasoning.

I think people are taking Kishi's interview and twisted it.
He wasnt unreliable, i just can see clearly that the people who claim that Kishi said Sakura was being honest is purposely ignoring the fact that on the same interview he says that she still loved Sasuke and cares too much about Naruto.
I dont know why the reason people cant seem to accept even the idea of her confession being fake it's like being an insult for her character or it's like take out the shine of that moment.
I'm not trying to force my point of view or trying to say that some views are wrong but i'm yet to see someome to wrap all this idea of Sakura being honest on her confession and provides proper arguments with proof to at least counter-argument the parts that disagree with the said argument but i'm sick of people coming in and saying she was being honest and telling i'm against what the author said based on their personal interpretation.

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 28 March 2014 - 12:31 AM.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

Okay Darkrest you say she was lying, Kishimoto said she was been honest. So am I going to believe? The author of the manga or you lol?
Kishimoto can make a live broadcast telling the entire she was been honest in her confession and STILL the western fandom wouldn't believe him. He can tell the entire world Sakura has moved on from Sasuke and is now is in love with Naruto and STILL they wouldn't believe him. Apparently the fandom knows more about the manga than the mangaka himself.

Did he said she was being honest?
No, he said i thought i depicted an honest girl with a surprisingly stubborn expression.
Being honest and depicting a honest girl are two totally different things for me.

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 28 March 2014 - 12:32 AM.

[CloudMountainJuror]

On which doesnt turn down the fact that it refered to the one she loves which is Sasuke.
What he implied wasnt the fact if she wanted to have a relationship with Sasuke or not what is being refered to is the fact if she still loves Sasuke or not on which the scene confirmed it.

 

She still has feelings for Sasuke; I don't deny that anywhere. The reply of mine that you quoted was a response to Pepsi, who explicitly said:

The Kishi interview is what makes this so confusing

He says she's being honest that she loves Naruto when he goes out of his way to make the point across that the confession was fake, and later reinforced with 540 and 632. To add to the confusion she apparently is still confident enough in making her relationship with Sauce work that she immediately turns someone down for it.

So that's what my reply was targeted towards. Note the bolded; that's why I noted that she has no hope for a relationship at that point in the story.

 

The confession was fake because she did that with other objectives on her mind, to keep Naruto out of danger not in order to have a genuine relationship with him.

 

That doesn't mean what she was saying about loving Naruto was a lie. She has feelings for Naruto; that's the "honesty" Kishimoto must have been allegedly referring to. Since the part about loving Naruto is true (to a conflicted extent, sure, but the feelings are there), the confession was true. Meaning it was not fake.

Now, on the other hand, the things she says surrounding the confession (her not caring about Sasuke anymore, etc.) obviously aren't truthful.

 

Her feelings for Sasuke being emphasized right after the confession is other strong argument that makes me say it's fake, the arc was about her feelings and it made it clear at that moment, she loved Sasuke however she cares about Naruto and wanted to help Naruto in some way and returning his feelings was the idea she got about it.

 

Right there, in the bolded, you just verified what I said immediately above in this post. Again, I don't deny she has feelings for Sasuke. It's very clear she still does (for better or worse, on Kishimoto's part). But she also has feelings for Naruto. That much is clear as well.

 

She still loved him the "caring" word doesnt apply it looks like you're judging that moment with our actual timeline, before Naruto departed she indeed showed her feelings for Sasuke when she was asked about what Sasuke was for her and she was cut off by Naruto.
We all knew she loved Sasuke at that time, and during that confession it was kind obvious she was going to take a decision.
She didnt resolved her feelings for Sasuke, we all knew that would not work.

 

I hesitate to use the word "love" when referring to Sakura's feelings towards Sasuke. It doesn't feel like she ever loved him in a romantic sense. It started as a childish crush, he left while it was a childish crush, and she's had residual feelings about this childish crush ever since. At no point in the series is there credible reason for Sakura to love Sasuke in a romantic sense. If that's the bond Kishimoto wanted to portray, then he failed miserably.

To be fair, yes, Naruto's feelings towards Sakura also started as a childish crush. Only semi-recently in the series has it been able to progress beyond that, though. If Kishimoto comes to expect us to believe Sakura's feelings for Sasuke were to have progressed to the point of love while he was gone for all those years, then that's just plain ridiculous.

 

I think people are taking Kishi's interview and twisted it.
He wasnt unreliable, i just can see clearly that the people who claim that Kishi said Sakura was being honest is purposely ignoring the fact that on the same interview he says that she still loved Sasuke and cares too much about Naruto.

 

That's fair.

 

I dont know why the reason people cant seem to accept even the idea of her confession being fake it's like being an insult for her character or it's like take out the shine of that moment.
I'm not trying to force my point of view or trying to say that some views are wrong but i'm yet to see someome to wrap all this idea of Sakura being honest on her confession and provides proper arguments with proof to at least counter-argument the parts that disagree with the said argument but i'm sick of people coming in and saying she was being honest and telling i'm against what the author said based on their personal interpretation.

 

Honestly? It would be absolutely fine if the confession was fake. Hell, most of my arguments here are going on the assumption that this interview is actually credible. Until I saw people start quoting that interview everywhere, I thought it was fake myself. Only after reading the scene thinking about it more objectively did I see the little possibilities presented in it here and there that suggest it could be genuine (again, I only mean the confession itself; the stuff surrounding the confession, like her claiming to have stopped "loving" Sasuke, etc. is complete bullsh**). The scene can be interpreted either way. Because it can, Kishimoto's testimony on this matters and contributes to the scene's meaning, considering his claim is consistent with one of the possible interpretations.

 

But only if it's real. I hope it is. If it isn't, well, I've wasted a lot of time writing these responses, haven't I?

Edited by zacrathedemon5, 28 March 2014 - 02:58 AM.

[Gojira]

Those are fair points. It is possible that she was being partially honest and being serious about loving Naruto and its backed up by the fact that she did the whole thing for him, and only called out his name when they were both in danger.

Part of the problem with chapter 539/540 is that it contradicts Kishi's interview, which is why I think it should have been left ambiguous I mean yeah it would have made NS that much more obvious but still without the ambiguity, Kishi saying she was honest about being in love with Naruto while only thinking of Sasuke when it comes to being in love with someone is what makes this so confusing. Her blushing at the end of 632 and comically forgetting that Naruto was there certainly doesn't help either.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

That doesn't mean what she was saying about loving Naruto was a lie. She has feelings for Naruto; that's the "honesty" Kishimoto must have been allegedly referring to. Since the part about loving Naruto is true (to a conflicted extent, sure, but the feelings are there), the confession was true. Meaning it was not fake.
Now, on the other hand, the things she says surrounding the confession (her not caring about Sasuke anymore, etc.) obviously aren't truthful.

The problem is that if those feelings were there she would have accepted that or even didnt tried to try to wrap up the whole Sasuke case.
Her feelings of Love for Naruto are not there not the love you're trying to imply, she does care about Naruto that's love but not the romantic one on which the confession implied.
She accepts her feelings for Sasuke as genuine love on which is confirmed during the summit when she's about to kill him.
She is hurt and is sad about the said feelings however she accepted those feelings.
Sakura still has feelings to be developed when it comes to Naruto.
He did a lot of things for her however she has yet to develop romantic relationships, the confession was her taking the decision to be with Naruto because of Naruto not because of "her feelings" for him that's why it's fake on my point of view, she didnt make a confession with her feelings or even expressed the "I love you" with her own emotions but rather trying to deceive Naruto.
No matter what people might think like Kishi said, she indeeed used Naruto's feelings on that confession however he disagreed with the VA when she said that she was using Naruto's feelings for her own benefit.
She wasnt looking for consolation.
 
 

Right there, in the bolded, you just verified what I said immediately above in this post. Again, I don't deny she has feelings for Sasuke. It's very clear she still does (for better or worse, on Kishimoto's part). But she also has feelings for Naruto. That much is clear as well.
 
 
I hesitate to use the word "love" when referring to Sakura's feelings towards Sasuke. It doesn't feel like she ever loved him in a romantic sense. It started as a childish crush, he left while it was a childish crush, and she's had residual feelings about this childish crush ever since. At no point in the series is there credible reason for Sakura to love Sasuke in a romantic sense. If that's the bond Kishimoto wanted to portray, then he failed miserably.

No but people clearly downplay it, i even understand because the reasons for her to love Sasuke are ridiculous as the reasons why Naruto loves Sakura on my opinion.
However she acknowledge her feelings for Sasuke as genuine and despite being an asspull her feelings for Sasuke are stupidely strong.
I agree with what you said above, from the readers perspective the plot and doesnt sustain her strong feelings for Sasuke and it never made an attempt justify it.
Kishi failed like you pointed out but he portray her feelings for Sasuke as strong.
 

To be fair, yes, Naruto's feelings towards Sakura also started as a childish crush. Only semi-recently in the series has it been able to progress beyond that, though. If Kishimoto comes to expect us to believe Sakura's feelings for Sasuke were to have progressed to the point of love while he was gone for all those years, then that's just plain ridiculous.
That's fair.

Actually talking about Naruto's feelings i think it even doesnt justify, despite Sakura helped Naruto her dire moments on her moments of affection, Naruto never witnessed it, the confession shows how he's actually hurt about the fact she loves Sasuke.
The melancholic tone when he says that he loves her shows his disaproval of that relationship and how he suffered when he accepted the promise.
When part 1 ended there was no reason on my opinion to keep loving Sakura, he should have moved on but however Kishi didnt introduced any other female character who could win or even have a chance to win his heart.

  

Honestly? It would be absolutely fine if the confession was fake. Hell, most of my arguments here are going on the assumption that this interview is actually credible. Until I saw people start quoting that interview everywhere, I thought it was fake myself. Only after reading the scene thinking about it more objectively did I see the little possibilities presented in it here and there that suggest it could be genuine (again, I only mean the confession itself; the stuff surrounding the confession, like her claiming to have stopped "loving" Sasuke, etc. is complete bullsh**). The scene can be interpreted either way. Because it can, Kishimoto's testimony on this matters and contributes to the scene's meaning, considering his claim is consistent with one of the possible interpretations.
 
But only if it's real. I hope it is. If it isn't, well, I've wasted a lot of time writing these responses, haven't I?

I took the interview as credible i just dont agree with the people who says that she was being honest on her confession about her feelings for Naruto when on the same interview he confirms she still loves Sasuke and cares about Naruto.
In my opinion i believe that wasnt even a confession to begin with.
It started all wrong and not even in a chance Naruto would believe on that with Sakura telling him she loves him when it was obvious to everyone she had feelings for Sasuke.
Even Sai admitted it and during he was explaining about Sakura's motives he admits he didnt knew what she was going to do and started using words like "i guess" and "i think", to avoid Naruto realizing she was doing it for him.

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 29 March 2014 - 01:32 PM.

[narusaku256]

You know, what I personally think made the confession interpretation a mess was not its context but how it came and in what background. I don't know but, it was just so...sudden. Even if it wasn't, it sort of came at a time which was not appropriate and the background situation/situations making it worse. Taking into consideration the background things which were going on, the confession piece just did not fit the puzzle, IMO. Now, IMAGINE a scene wherein the war is over and everyone is rejoicing and waiting for their hero(Naruto) due to whom they were able to win, to return from wherever he is. You can take the scenario pretty much like when Naruto returned to Konoha after his talk with Nagato. There's nothing to worry about and everyone is rejoicing, and Naruto brings Sasuke infront of Sakura. (To make this short, I won't include the dialogues and all the thought process). Sakura realizes her true feelings and then she plays out the confession again at Naruto, infront of everyone. Now is it possible for Naruto to deny saying that "You still love Sasuke!" after all she said and did for him? No, right? It will just fit the flow pretty much like the hug Sakura gave Naruto when he returned to Konoha(Pain arc). Now, its just my opinion and I can be wrong, but its just what I feel.
 
P.S-  I do sense some discrepancy here, but its just sort of a prototype version to give a rough idea on what I want to say. The way things can turn out in practicality may differ by leaps and bounds. The example is just to convey my point.

Edited by narusaku256, 29 March 2014 - 07:19 PM.

[Gravenimage]

I'm probably the only one who believes Sakura was been honest. Oh well agree to disagree. Like I said Kishimoto can tell the entire world Sakura was been honest, that she has moved on from Sasuke and she's now in love with Naruto and still the western fandom wouldn't believe him only the Japanese fans will believe him.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

I'm probably the only one who believes Sakura was been honest. Oh well agree to disagree. Like I said Kishimoto can tell the entire world Sakura was been honest, that she has moved on from Sasuke and she's now in love with Naruto and still the western fandom wouldn't believe him only the Japanese fans will believe him.

That's what one of the things i'm talking about.
Okay if you believe she's honest but dont come telling me or even suggesting that it's what Kishimoto meant on the interview based on your personal interpretation of the interview.
Kishi telling the whole world that Sakura loves Naruto now, is way different than the interview he gave and is posted on this thread.
On which has nothing to do with what's being discussed here.

Also i dont even need to point out that generalization you did there.

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 30 March 2014 - 01:39 AM.

[Gojira]

Ok can someone please verify this interview because I'm starting to get suspicious

Either the interview doesn't exist and people are getting trolled or it does and people are probably misinterpreting what he's saying. It's just weird for him to practically canonize this pairing by saying she's honest about loving Naruto. I mean yeah the show indicates NS being endgame to begin with but its been moving at a snails pace for a long, long while and him suddenly coming out and verifying that her feelings are no longer ambiguous is kind of weird to me. It would be like if a fan were to ask Kishi who Tobi's real identity is and him responding with "Who knows, maybe its not really Madara but one of Kakashi's supposedly dead friends ;)" (we know Kakashi has a lot of dead friends but its obvious which one he would be referring to) and therefore even though the identity of Tobi was obvious the second Kabuto summoned that mysterious coffin it would sort of prematurely end the game he was setting up.

[BakeNeko-Chan]

I think the interview was proven to be authentic in the past, but unfortunately I don't where to find the original source to prove its validity. I can totally understand wanting proof, because taking something you read online at face value can lead to misinformation, so hopefully someone who can offer up proof will step forward.

[Gojira]

I think I recall the interview being said here.

Though I'm still confused....why did she make the arguably fake confession? Her plan was to get him to go back to the village with her but how would she be able to kill Sasuke if she was returning to the village with Naruto?

I just wish Kishi didn't make this so confusing, I don't even know what context it was meant to be in other than to stir up the pairing wars.

[rocci]

@pepsi
It's for drama and maybe to include sakura in team 7 reunion.

I still believe narusasu battle should happen after pain arc with naruto as the winner and then sasuke find the truth and the next battle will decide who is the true winner. But that just my opinion.

[Gojira]

Well ofcourse it was for drama but that wasn't really what I was asking.

 

I was asking in what way did Kishi intend for us to look at it because what makes it so confusing is the fact that Sakura had multiple objectives, and multiple ways to carry them out.

[rocci]

@pepsi
I don't know if this's right, but I always think that what sakura to naruto is the same like what itachi did to sasuke.

[TouKen4Life3g]

@pepsi
I don't know if this's right, but I always think that what sakura to naruto is the same like what itachi did to sasuke.

What do you mean?

[rocci]

@ns4life
No matter how much itachi love his family&village, he always love sasuke.
No matter how much sakura love sasuke, he always care(?) to naruto.

Both of them are smart character who excellent in illusion department(sakura not there yet).

Both of them get a hard choice told by anbu root person.

If sakura success in killing sasuke, naruto will hate her and not the village and stop chasing sasuke.
This is all for his own well being.
For me it's very heroic. Luckily it's failed lol.

Btw this just my opinion and I know maybe don't like this kind of comparison.

Btw can you give me your lap about Yamato word?

[TouKen4Life3g]

Well it's in my tumblr collection post. It's the explanation on why I became a shipper. I wish I can direct you but I have small time for now.

[Gojira]

I just don't really understand what context we were supposed to take it.

 

Is it that she was trying to love Naruto over Sasuke, or that she thought she had switched from Sasuke to Naruto or that she is starting to understand that she's in love with Naruto? (which is contradicted by things like the fodder scene)