4869 replies to this topic

[Chidori Mistress]

They linked me to an essay called 'An Enduring Faith'.

[Music!]

Could you post it?

[SakuDotz]

Yeah, I'd like to have a look at that.

[Penandsword1]

Hey I found it! An Enduring Faith
The author wanted us to know that she isn't bashing NaruSaku pairing but trying to counterdebate Mizura's essay. Very possibile that it would have NaruSaku bashing despite the assurance.

[Chidori Mistress]

Yeah, she does bring Sakura into it alot.

Question: “The essay you’re countering is against Naruto/Hinata, yet you mention Naruto/Sakura multiple times. Why are you bringing Sakura into this?”

Answer: If you read Mizura’s essay, you’ll notice that she often tries to point out flaws in a Naruto/Hinata relationship by comparing it in a negative light to Naruto/Sakura. Since this is a direct counter to Mizura’s essay, it’s only natural that I would fight on the same battlefield.

>_>
I finished the essay and reading the comments Mizura left.

[Chidori Mistress]

OH LAWD!
Now I know where some of these arguments have come from.
the most ridiculous one is the one claiming Naruto reminiscing about the chuunin exams was about Hinata.
The Chuunin Exams may be NaruHina fans biggest moment for Hinata but alot went on I doubt Naruto was thinking about that.

*carries on reading comments*

[Mizura]

Bah. I started replying at first, then my internet went dead during the period I was supposed to counter the second round, then when it did come back, I decided that it was not worth the trouble, and that I could let the manga speak for itself.

And it's paying off big time. She claims that Kishimoto "can Make Hinata relevant" (as if by magic), but has he? Naaaah.

I'm surprised she still has it in her sig. If I were her, I'd have taken it off now because it's so obviously not happening. But apparently she thinks that Hinata is "obviously being held back right Now just so that she'll have a big role Next arc."

.... right. =\

[MagusKyros]

Each and every time I see the other side argue with easily counterable facts, I lose the will to argue with them, and just hope that what happens in the manga will persuade them otherwise.

There is so much a person can turn a blind eye to before they can turn no longer; for they will be forced to view the truth.

[Power06]

@Magus: That's a good statement, the only thing is that even when it is blatantly obvious, some people will just willingly deny the truth and gather facts that have been countered countless times in the past, to give themselves hope. Mind you now, this is only an observation that I have been analyzing in this fandom.

[Mizura]

One thing I'm particularly fed-up about is the databook "up and love story" statement.

The databook also states that Ino will never give up on Sasuke.

And when I tell that to them, they say "The databook has to be put into context! [blablabla]"

Why don't they follow their own advice? The databook stated that Hinata gained a crush on Naruto because she admired him. If anything, the "up and down" statement shows that it isn't something very serious.

Geez.

[Silent Shinobi]

Actually, Hinata has had some pretty deep thoughts about Naruto, and was the only one until Sakura thought about his loneliness in part 2; however, that was it.

Like you said though, Sakura has reacted to everything Naruto has done. From the chalkboard eraser, to retrieving his forehead from Zabuza, to thanking him in her fight against Ino, to inspire her after defeating Neji, to smile a grateful smile when he saved her from Gaara, and finally to show a surprised reaction when Naruto stated that he did understand her.

Umm, I wasn't speaking of deep introspectives, I was speaking of changes in opinions. IIRC, most of Hinata's thoughts on Naruto were opinions she had of him from her introduction. I was saying that Sakura was the only one who noticiably heightens her opinion of Naruto.... each and every time.

Hey I found it! An Enduring Faith
The author wanted us to know that she isn't bashing NaruSaku pairing but trying to counterdebate Mizura's essay. Very possibile that it would have NaruSaku bashing despite the assurance.

Lol, Darkhope and Phoenixblood.... how unsurprising it is to see those names in the credits XD. I'll give it a shot to see what she has to say - should be interesting.

[EDIT]This essay seems to be a mix of some fairly good points, some hilariously minor points of over-exaggerated importance, and some ridiculous speculation.

At a glance, things like these stood out:

Hinata’s rejection from the Hyuuga clan needs to be resolved, likely by her father acknowledging her (And the Hyuuga clan as a whole, but her father is the central point of this aspect of Hinata’s character. His acceptance could count for the entire clan’s acceptance). Though Hinata becoming clan head is a possible conclusion, it is not necessary to fulfill this part of her character. So long as Hiashi acknowledges her as a changed person worthy of the Hyuuga name, preferably by mentioning/implying that she would make a worthy clan head at the same time, this part of her character will be resolved even if she doesn’t actually become the Hyuuga leader.

Example of a good point. Not only is this true, but likely, as a small, arguably partial resolution would fit such a minor character.

Why would Kishimoto have Hinata miss out on a scene that could play such a strong role in her character development? Perhaps since Naruto/Hinata had already received a good deal of development during the chuunin exam arc, Kishimoto decided to save it for later?

LMAO. Example of a ridiculous speculation. "Save it for later"? Over 3 years and 200 chapters later? For a minor point that only affects a minor character? No offense, but get real.

Besides, why would Kishimoto keep Hinata’s affections after the time jump if he didn’t plan on resolving them?

Glaring example of an over-exaggerated minor point. As if every character had to have some profound reason for every facet of their personality.

It's called comic relief. Believe it or not, most shonen manga use it every now and again.

Honestly, I don't know why it's so hard for some people to understand that Hinata's just not that important? She's like the polar opposite of A1 Steak Sauce.

...in part, I blame filler.

[Power06]

I rarely debate with them concerning ships and what not. I am not giving 100% assurity, that NaruSaku will be canon, but watching Yamato telling Sakura that it's her feelings for Naruto that will make a difference and if Naruto really wants to protect Sakura, he must do it with his own eyes strengthens my belief that these two are growing closer to one another, throughout struggles and difficulties.

Per my observation, other ships opposed to NaruSaku tend to leave this details out or trim it down to a fine point.

[Radon]

I can say with complete confidence that 75% of ALL fandoms completely ignore the other pairings evidence. Thats the main problem as to why things are so hostile at times. People just ignore what the other side is saying. NaruHina, SasuSaku and NaruSaku fans are all guilty of this.

It's easy to say your side has more evidence but hard to back it up.

Rose colored glasses my friends.

[Rick (Bonta-kun)]

I can say with complete confidence that 75% of ALL fandoms completely ignore the other pairings evidence. Thats the main problem as to why things are so hostile at times. People just ignore what the other side is saying. NaruHina, SasuSaku and NaruSaku fans are all guilty of this.

It's easy to say your side has more evidence but hard to back it up.

Rose colored glasses my friends.

thats true, not too mention all fandoms think there side has more evidence.

I think its really how people percieve things, we may think that a scene is NaruSaku based, they may think its SasuSaku based, different minds have different views, similar to politics i guess

[Radon]

Something I noticed that I don't think anyones mentioned is that Sakura seems to have less emotional outbursts when Sasuke is mention after she and Naruto saw him at the end of the bridge ark.

In chapter 246 when Kakashi mentions Sasuke's name Naruto and Sakura go into crying mode, but after the bridge encounter when Ino mentions that Sai looks a lot like Sasuke, Sakura barely reacts.

[Chidori Mistress]

thats true, not too mention all fandoms think there side has more evidence.

I think its really how people percieve things, we may think that a scene is NaruSaku based, they may think its SasuSaku based, different minds have different views, similar to politics i guess

Thats so true.
Such as the 'Promise of a Lifetime'.
Some fandoms use that and the infamous Hospital scene to say Naruto has given up on Sakura.

[Daidoji_Tangen]

OMFG! Daidoji, thank you SO much for pointing that out! This was on my mind for a couple of weeks ago.
Seriously, how can NaruHina gonna pull off without the view of the clan, especially her father's views of their (if its gonna happen) relationship?

And you pull out pretty good theories there as well and make sense in a political sense. Now Kudos to you!

Although... NaruHina will probably say she will leave the clan... but like you said, Kishimoto's theme will make no sense if she does that.

Actually, after the Chunin Exam, I think Hiashi has a good view of Naruto. Which is why I could see Naruto/Hanabi happening if a political marriage takes place.

Of course in this scenerio (political marriage), it doesn't help. The only way it could is if Hiashi acknowledges her worth and lets her leave the clan for a man who doesn't love her so the clan can gain influence. That doesn't seem right to me.

Bah. I started replying at first, then my internet went dead during the period I was supposed to counter the second round, then when it did come back, I decided that it was not worth the trouble, and that I could let the manga speak for itself.

And it's paying off big time. She claims that Kishimoto "can Make Hinata relevant" (as if by magic), but has he? Naaaah.

I'm surprised she still has it in her sig. If I were her, I'd have taken it off now because it's so obviously not happening. But apparently she thinks that Hinata is "obviously being held back right Now just so that she'll have a big role Next arc."

.... right. =\

I read your comments to her essay.

Umm...Hasn't Neji been resolved? He challenaged destiny and won by defeating an opponent who he admitted was much stronger than him. He also lived as his father told him to.

I love Neji and think he rocks. But his story is more or less resolved. His current story purposes are tied with Lee's and Hinata's subplots.

And it's always the next big Arc. In the current one, Hinata has been given plenty of opportunties to further NaruHina. She has done nothing. True love. True love.

At this rate, NaruIno (I know it's crack, but I love this pairing) has a better chance than NaruHina.

I wouldn't be surprized if NaruSaku does happen, people will claim it's just temperory. It'll be NaruHina in Part III (regardless of whether Kishimoto plans Part III or not).

Naruto and Sakura have kids. Just wait. Sakura will die, and Hinata will comfort him. And he'll realize he loved her all along.

There is so much a person can turn a blind eye to before they can turn no longer; for they will be forced to view the truth.

That is incredibly false. True for some, but people will believe what they want to.

Look at Mel Gibson's father who believes the Earth is flat.

[Chidori Mistress]

Bah. I started replying at first, then my internet went dead during the period I was supposed to counter the second round, then when it did come back, I decided that it was not worth the trouble, and that I could let the manga speak for itself.

And it's paying off big time. She claims that Kishimoto "can Make Hinata relevant" (as if by magic), but has he? Naaaah.

I'm surprised she still has it in her sig. If I were her, I'd have taken it off now because it's so obviously not happening. But apparently she thinks that Hinata is "obviously being held back right Now just so that she'll have a big role Next arc."

.... right. =\

Lol, I see.
That is the best thing to do.
I also have no idea why it's so suprising to people that you people can like Hinata without liking NaruHina.
About 10minutes ago someone asked:

i dont really get why ya'll like hinata but hate naruhina....its like one of her dreams to be with him.

[Power06]

Thats so true.
Such as the 'Promise of a Lifetime'.
Some fandoms use that and the infamous Hospital scene to say Naruto has given up on Sakura.

To add to this, I dont know why they still use this scene. Naruto never gave up on Sakura, he was mature not to interrupt the moment, even though it was hurting him on the inside. He had a choice, and he decided not to let his personal feelings overshadow the importance of Sasuke being revived out of that coma and Sakura grateful that he was okay. Remember Naruto is one person that will place others' happiness above his own.

As for the promise of a lifetime, rather than Naruto flood Sakura's heart with his own pain of unrequited feelings,he silenced them, as hers were more important. Naruto cares and loves Sakura enough that he would sacrifice his own feelings and chances with her if that would make her happy.

[whoamii]

yeah, people do use the hospital scene to show that naruto gave up on sakura. I don't get it, though, because didn't Naruto tell her that he would get Sasuke back even though he was wrapped up like a mummy?