19964 replies to this topic

[redragon88]

Well with the obirin parallel, kakashi knew obito liked rin.

Probable because Kakashi caught him trying to make out with a photo of Rin. Actually, why on earth was Kakashi spying on Obito back then?

Maybe people should start a meme saying "Kakashi is always watching".

[T XD]

When he was still in Konoha, Sasuke seems that he's aware of Naruto's love for Sakura. Like whenever Naruto does something for Sakura, Sasuke, sometimes, smiles the smile of a person who knows what's going on XD

Edited by T XD, 27 January 2013 - 10:24 PM.

[MangaReader]

@all post above me~ Exactly Heck Sasuke even told Sakura that Naruto was the one who saved her from Gaara

Edited by MangaReader, 27 January 2013 - 10:24 PM.

[sushi.]

What's so natural about this is that Sakura smiles around Naruto to. Whenever they are together, they smile and give eachother genuine looks to eachother. It seems they themselves do not notice this, but thirdparties have seen it quite often.

[T XD]

What's so natural about this is that Sakura smiles around Naruto to. Whenever they are together, they smile and give eachother genuine looks to eachother. It seems they themselves do not notice this, but thirdparties have seen it quite often.

For example, Sai, Yamato, Kakashi... XD

Edited by T XD, 27 January 2013 - 10:29 PM.

[Qia]

What's so natural about this is that Sakura smiles around Naruto to. Whenever they are together, they smile and give eachother genuine looks to eachother. It seems they themselves do not notice this, but thirdparties have seen it quite often.

She did it when she found out the Gaara thing, she did it after her confession. It's all there...*sigh*. Which is why it would be really disappointing if it all meant...nothing. That would mean throughout the entire manga we were being lied to...or we saw everything wrong. Or we were lead to believe it meant something when it didn't ;-;.

Edited by Qia, 27 January 2013 - 10:40 PM.

[KeikoxYusuke]

Has anyone seen Fancynancypigs1 on Youtube lately? I haven't seen her comment in a long time.

Hey, that's my account..I somehow lost that account so now I comment as "Fancynancypigs."


I have a picture of Korra as my profile. and I still got the Sakura background on this account as well.

I felt really bad when all of a sudden I had to stop going on that account, and I couldn't tell anyway why I suddenly wasn't commenting.

I hope you will be able to find me again.

[StriderC]

She has turned down his requests for dates or just ignored them, though, and otherwise made it clear to Naruto that she is not interested in him. Naruto knows she loves another man.


Do you mean the scene where she cries after Sai tells her about Naruto's feelings? My take of that scene was quite a bit different. I think she knew how Naruto felt and was sad and called him an idiot for it because she knew that she did not love Naruto the same way.


Yeah, Kishi does that a lot with NS, doesn't he? Creates these moments between Naruto and Sakura that are just not clear. He never seems to make it clear that Sakura is in love with Naruto, for example. And in the scene you mention Naruto does not even answer whether he still wants Sakura. Why? Could it maybe be because Naruto already has moved on from her? Or is he too embarrassed to admit still wanting her because he knows that Sakura herself is faking her love? You remember our talk earlier about how Sakura not stating things clearly that she does not love Naruto certainly leaves room for interpretion but is far from proving that she does love him? Same thing here.


I think we have to see a scene like this one, no matter what pairings happen. Kishi could even make it a flashback back to when Naruto and Sakura came back home after the summit arc and only now show it to the readers.


If anything, that quote reminds me of Naruto's relationship to Sasuke. Doesn't Naruto even say that he wants to be the wind to Sasuke's fire? Oh Kishi...

Seriously, though. If Sakura has not fallen for Naruto despite everything that they have been though, that in itself is enough for Naruto to move on. Can't force that love. Hinata is there, she is a great support and help to Naruto, she is willing to be with him. Why not move on?


Sakura knows she doesn't love Naruto. Naruto knows she doesn't love him. Naruto is told by Sai how Sakura plans to kill Sasuke because she loves Sasuke so much. Sakura has never indicated that she is in love with Naruto, except in the confession, which Naruto dismissed as a lie. Does Naruto need her stating the obvious, "I don't love you, sorry"? There might be scene like that to make it all clear to the readers, but it is not like Naruto hasn't realized it all on his own.


Well, it goes back to my opinion that no moment between NS has yet been obvious enough for me to think that Sakura is in love with Naruto. And no moment that I have seen has shown me that Sakura no longer loves Sasuke. So it is hard for me to see how Sakura is the most likely one to change her mind.


--


Well, Kishi has left so many moments between NS vague and unclear. It is possible that bridge scene is a red herring, not a genuine hint at NS. The handholding, too, is still vague enough to leave room that Naruto is not in love with Hinata. The same with the hug, the bridge scene and so on.

I'm gonna reply to the bolded here and in order just so you know btw.

1. My take on that scene is different, but it's not necessarily concrete just like a lot of scenes that involve NS. I thought she called him an idiot because he loved her still AFTER all that has happened and what he has witnessed in the past. Then the fact that she supposed played a part in his suffering as well. Why wouldn't she call him an idiot after all of that?

2. Yeah, Kishi definitely does this a lot. Hell, he's doing it right now IMO with NH and he's using what we've known for the longest. If he TRULY wanted to go the NH route, then we wouldn't need the constant use of outside forces playing into what's happening here and then in such a short period of time, but with that, we're not seeing anything that would suggest Naruto feels the same about Hinata. We're only given what we've already known about Hinata for the longest time, but when it comes to what Sakura and Naruto feel for one another, we're left in the dark. Don't you find it odd that Kishi hasn't had them really interacting since he's been there? Strange how he let Hinata do the honors of bringing him back to reality? But the girl who has been there for so long hasn't said a word. We're left with expressions that could mean quite a few things. I believe Kishi is going the route of NS. He's just milking the fandoms. There's no rift between NS. It's just that Kishi is stalling and having us NS fans wait on the development between them unfortunately. LOL

But he's only using what we've known.

Showed us that Naruto still has feelings for Sakura in Pt 2 but he feels he shouldn't tell her how he feels given he can't even keep a promise. Does this mean he'll confess when Sasuke is redeemed? Is he waiting to see if Sakura will still choose Sasuke over him at that time? It's possible.

We're shown recently that Sakura still has feelings for Sasuke. We've known this as well, but she doesn't seem happy about it. We're also shown all throughout Pt 2 that Sakura definitely views Naruto differently and it could be a lot more. Her comfortably has grown and she's sweeter toward him as well. She cares a lot about his well being and she's willing to go the extra mile for his safety.

Hinata still loves Naruto. We've known this as well.We've known this since the beginning pretty much actually.

Here's what we don't know.

Is Sakura in love with Naruto now? I believe she is or she's just about there at this point.

Does Naruto love Hinata? I very much doubt he does. Kishi has been careful with his scenes revolving around them it seems, and I believe it's because he doesn't want to send the wrong message.

[b]Does Naruto still love Sakura[?/b]I definitely think he does. It's just, he's not ready to confess given what he said in the flashback. It's only a matter of time before things with Sasuke get resolved.

I don't even include SS because I feel it's a dead ship to be quite honest...

That's my take on the matter.

[luffyq1]

There's no evidence to support the idea of Sasuke knowing that Naruto loves Sakura. Sorry, folks.

And please don't blow the scene where Sasuke tells Sakura who really saved her out of proportion. It was merely Sasuke giving credit where credit is due. Nothing more, nothing less.

Edited by luffyq1, 28 January 2013 - 02:06 AM.

[xxRomanceGirlxx]

Wow I missed a fun debate against a SS fan. Damnit!

Lol, just kidding. I think I'll jump in now.


Poision, my earlier comment about NaruHina isn't wrong. Throughout a lot of Part 1, Hinata never actively tried to be there for Naruto. Technically, her "sitting doing nothing" is what happened. She interacted with him a few times, but if she was truly trying to get her affections noticed, Hinata would have spent time with Naruto and been there for him. However, her shyness prevented that. Most of Part 2 Hinata demonstrated this too, until her confession. However, she strunk back into her "just doing nothing" shell and didn't interact with him post-confession. Not until the war arc, which is when she started being more upfront with her feelings. Unfortunately at the cost of her character development since she now considers winning Naruto more important than being strong for her Clan.

Sarcasm now? So what if I don't see the NH hand-holding terribly impactful? It was down-played when Naruto gave chakra to everyone else, he high-fived most of them, held Tenten and Shikamaru's hand. It was a lot quicker, but you convienently leave out why. Kurama specifically told him in 616 it took him a bit longer to gather all of his chakra together to do the transaction, he even apologized for it. Naruto was fine with it, he was just glad it worked. That's why it took longer compared to the others. And the emphasis seemed done to me for Hinata development, not that it was hinting NH endgame. Naruto was being very general with her the whole time. Sorry, I just don't see this "very likely" chance that meant Naruto would develop romantic feelings for her. If you read my posts, I have said multiple times that NH's chances have increased with 615 and that NaruHina is a possible pairing. I don't think it's likely, because Naruto shows absolutely no sign he likes her like you seem to want him to. If I'm wrong, I'm perfectly able to admit it. My opinion isn't fact, it's just what I believe. But I see no reason to say Naruto has feelings for her this quickly.

And here's something I can't help but comment on. You say Naruto is automatically forcing his feelings on Sakura because he loves her and has some small flame of hope he can be with Sakura. You have no idea how much I disagree with you. Naruto was forcing his feelings on her in Early Part 1. He constantly pestered her for dates and always tried to express his feelings to her so she could like him. Hell, look at the frickin' Bench Scene. Naruto transformed into Sasuke to see how she felt about him. That part wasn't completely terrible, 'cause she wouldn't talk or listen to him if he didn't do it otherwise. But the messed-up and selfish part was that when Sakura tried to kiss him, thinking he was Sasuke, Naruto was actually going to let her because of his own feelings for her. That was forcing, manipulative, and selfish. Back then, his feelings were immature that way. It stopped being that way a long time ago. Nowadays, Naruto rarely actually asks her for dates or references his feelings for her. He keeps it inside and locked, despite it obviously still being there. I dare say Naruto's love for Sakura were displayed the same way Hinata's were post-confession, though the difference is he actually hanged out with Sakura and understood her personality. With Hinata, her excuse was shyness. With Naruto, his reasons is selflessness and possible insecurity. (PoaL says hello) I just can't believe you would even try and put Naruto's love for her in a bad light like that. Sure he has hope to be with her, but's he never actually open about it like "You will be with me, no matter what! I'll show you how much I love you so you can notice me!" God, that was Part 1 Sakura's shtick with Sasuke and Hinata's relationship with Naruto. They force their feelings on their love interest, Naruto's far from it.

You think Sakura was crying during the tent scene that long because she knew she didn't love Naruto? Are you kidding? Are you forgetting the Third Databook sentence that stated bluntly "What are her feelings for Naruto? Sakura has still hadn't found the answer."? I think this is the first time I've heard that argument. Sakura's tears were very easily created by her guilt and care for Naruto's feelings, not because she knew she didn't love him. It was because she had caused him all the pain during the Promise of a Lifetime and her feelings for Sasuke back then. Sai stating "Aren't you a part of it too?" about Naruto's inner pain I think made her feel bad, and that was when she thought her feelings for Sasuke hurt him too much. I highly doubt Sakura was thinking when she flashbacked to the promise, was thinking "I love Sasuke, not him!", she was just wallowing in her pain that she had hurt Naruto back then that badly. Sakura knows she loves Sasuke, she doesn't know about Naruto. Her tears then were because she hurt Naruto and his selflessness hurt her, because she never wanted that for him. And her "The fool's in love with me" line was because of her unworthiness of Naruto's love. It's reinforced even more strongly by her next inner monlogue. "I'm the one that caused him the most pain ... I've done nothing but make mistakes ... I don't want to make another one."

Here's what I don't get with you. Why is it suddenly so much easier to see NS as the red herring than NH? I truly don't get that logic at all. Kishimoto hinted at NaruSaku far too much for it to be a red herring. Look at the major examples: The Tenchi Bridge scene, 1st NaruSaku hug (with the crowd blushing), Unfinished sentence, how most of her confession was Naruto and his safety/feelings before her love for Sasuke, Third Databook confirming her own confusion regarding Naruto, Yamato's unfinished sentence, Sakura's genuine anger at Naruto calling her a liar and pointedly saying "I'm the only one who knows what I'm feeling!". How does these multiple scene equate to a red herring? In comparision, what does NH have that could be dubbed a red herring? Major moments: 2. Naruto getting angry after she was stuck down and 615. NaruSaku has 7 moments that could imply romance. If it's a red herring, it's given way too much focus. Why not give NaruHina those 7 moments? It gives a lot more backing and it makes more sense.

Basically, I'm detecting a lot of double standards that you're saying. Naruto apparently has to move on from Sakura when he truly has no reason to at all. Her feelings for Sasuke, okay. But the PoaL crushed most of his dreams and confidence that could end up with Sakura, yet he still had feelings for and eventually his feeling matured even more seriously in Part 2. He really has no confidence at all when it comes to Sakura ever loving him, her confession made that perfectly clear. Yet he still doesn't try to move on. Like "I know the odds are against me, but I won't know unless I try" feeling going on. He's not forcing his feelings, he doesn't really expect everything, but's he's being there for her and wanting her to be happy. That's what I love about Naruto. Yet Sakura is suddenly a different matter entirely? When she is made it completely clear she doesn't want to love Sasuke and is actually of ashamed of how she feels for him? She has the most reasons out of anyone to move on. Without a doubt, she's the most likely one to change her feelings. Her growing relationship with Naruto throughout Part supports it even more.

I don't understand this. After all of the NS moments and development throughout the manga, one major moment with NaruHina makes you immediately jump on the "NaruHina's gonna happen now" bandwagon? There is something seriously wrong with this picture. NaruSaku has had way more focus and it still hasn't convinced you as a likely canon couple but NH, with it's scarce moments, is enough for you. That's one big, giant double standard you're sporting, Poison.

Edited by xxRomanceGirlxx, 28 January 2013 - 03:59 AM.

[Zatheko]

Wow I missed a fun debate against a SS fan. Damnit!

Lol, just kidding. I think I'll jump in now.


Poision, my earlier comment about NaruHina isn't wrong. Throughout a lot of Part 1, Hinata never actively tried to be there for Naruto. Technically, her "sitting doing nothing" is what happened. She interacted with him a few times, but if she was truly trying to get her affections noticed, Hinata would have spent time with Naruto and been there for him. However, her shyness prevented that. Most of Part 2 Hinata demonstrated this too, until her confession. However, she strunk back into her "just doing nothing" shell and didn't interact with him post-confession. Not until the war arc, which is when she started being more upfront with her feelings. Unfortunately at the cost of her character development since she now considers winning Naruto more important than being strong for her Clan.

Sarcasm now? So what if I don't see the NH hand-holding terribly impactful? It was down-played when Naruto gave chakra to everyone else, he high-fived most of them, held Tenten and Shikamaru's hand. It was a lot quicker, but you convienently leave out why. Kurama specifically told him in 616 it took him a bit longer to gather all of his chakra together to do the transaction, he even apologized for it. Naruto was fine with it, he was just glad it worked. That's why it took longer compared to the others. And the emphasis seemed done to me for Hinata development, not that it was hinting NH endgame. Naruto was being very general with her the whole time. Sorry, I just don't see this "very likely" chance that meant Naruto would develop romantic feelings for her. If you read my posts, I have said multiple times that NH's chances have increased with 615 and that NaruHina is a possible pairing. I don't think it's likely, because Naruto shows absolutely no sign he likes her like you seem to want him to. If I'm wrong, I'm perfectly able to admit it. My opinion isn't fact, it's just what I believe. But I see no reason to say Naruto has feelings for her this quickly.

And here's something I can't help but comment on. You say Naruto is automatically forcing his feelings on Sakura because he loves her and has some small flame of hope he can be with Sakura. You have no idea how much I disagree with you. Naruto was forcing his feelings on her in Early Part 1. He constantly pestered her for dates and always tried to express his feelings to her so she could like him. Hell, look at the frickin' Bench Scene. Naruto transformed into Sasuke to see how she felt about him. That part wasn't completely terrible, 'cause she wouldn't talk or listen to him if he didn't do it otherwise. But the messed-up and selfish part was that when Sakura tried to kiss him, thinking he was Sasuke, Naruto was actually going to let her because of his own feelings for her. That was forcing, manipulative, and selfish. Back then, his feelings were immature that way. It stopped being that way a long time ago. Nowadays, Naruto rarely actually asks her for dates or references his feelings for her. He keeps it inside and locked, despite it obviously still being there. I dare say Naruto's love for Sakura were displayed the same way Hinata's were post-confession, though the difference is he actually hanged out with Sakura and understood her personality. With Hinata, her excuse was shyness. With Naruto, his reasons is selflessness and possible insecurity. (PoaL says hello) I just can't believe you would even try and put Naruto's love for her in a bad light like that. Sure he has hope to be with her, but's he never actually open about it like "You will be with me, no matter what! I'll show you how much I love you so you can notice me!" God, that was Part 1 Sakura's shtick with Sasuke and Hinata's relationship with Naruto. They force their feelings on their love interest, Naruto's far from it.

You think Sakura was crying during the tent scene that long because she knew she didn't love Naruto? Are you kidding? Are you forgetting the Third Databook sentence that stated bluntly "What are her feelings for Naruto? Sakura has still hadn't found the answer."? I think this is the first time I've heard that argument. Sakura's tears were very easily created by her guilt and care for Naruto's feelings, not because she knew she didn't love him. It was because she had caused him all the pain during the Promise of a Lifetime and her feelings for Sasuke back then. Sai stating "Aren't you a part of it too?" about Naruto's inner pain I think made her feel bad, and that was when she thought her feelings for Sasuke hurt him too much. I highly doubt Sakura was thinking when she flashbacked to the promise, was thinking "I love Sasuke, not him!", she was just wallowing in her pain that she had hurt Naruto back then that badly. Sakura knows she loves Sasuke, she doesn't know about Naruto. Her tears then were because she hurt Naruto and his selflessness hurt her, because she never wanted that for him. And her "The fool's in love with me" line was because of her unworthiness of Naruto's love. It's reinforced even more strongly by her next inner monlogue. "I'm the one that caused him the most pain ... I've done nothing but make mistakes ... I don't want to make another one."

Here's what I don't get with you. Why is it suddenly so much easier to see NS as the red herring than NH? I truly don't get that logic at all. Kishimoto hinted at NaruSaku far too much for it to be a red herring. Look at the major examples: The Tenchi Bridge scene, 1st NaruSaku hug (with the crowd blushing), Unfinished sentence, how most of her confession was Naruto and his safety/feelings before her love for Sasuke, Third Databook confirming her own confusion regarding Naruto, Yamato's unfinished sentence, Sakura's genuine anger at Naruto calling her a liar and pointedly saying "I'm the only one who knows what I'm feeling!". How does these multiple scene equate to a red herring? In comparision, what does NH have that could be dubbed a red herring? Major moments: 2. Naruto getting angry after she was stuck down and 615. NaruSaku has 7 moments that could imply romance. If it's a red herring, it's given way too much focus. Why not give NaruHina those 7 moments? It gives a lot more backing and it makes more sense.

Basically, I'm detecting a lot of double standards that you're saying. Naruto apparently has to move on from Sakura when he truly has no reason to at all. Her feelings for Sasuke, okay. But the PoaL crushed most of his dreams and confidence that could end up with Sakura, yet he still had feelings for and eventually his feeling matured even more seriously in Part 2. He really has no confidence at all when it comes to Sakura ever loving him, her confession made that perfectly clear. Yet he still doesn't try to move on. Like "I know the odds are against me, but I won't know unless I try" feeling going on. He's not forcing his feelings, he doesn't really expect everything, but's he's being there for her and wanting her to be happy. That's what I love about Naruto. Yet Sakura is suddenly a different matter entirely? When she is made it completely clear she doesn't want to love Sasuke and is actually of ashamed of how she feels for him? She has the most reasons out of anyone to move on. Without a doubt, she's the most likely one to change her feelings. Her growing relationship with Naruto throughout Part supports it even more.

I don't understand this. After all of the NS moments and development throughout the manga, one major moment with NaruHina makes you immediately jump on the "NaruHina's gonna happen now" bandwagon? There is something seriously wrong with this picture. NaruSaku has had way more focus and it still hasn't convinced you as a likely canon couple but NH, with it's scare moments, is enough for you. That's one big, giant double standard you're sporting, Poison.

Holy hell that was a terrific post!

I agree with everything you said especially with sakura having the most reasons to move on from her love of sasuke, our of all three of the pairings SS is BY FAR the most negative of them, it does not have a good message at all and the only thing it really does is hurt sakuras character.

I see her love for sasuke as something she will eventually get over and it will be a part of some HUGE development for her.

[xxRomanceGirlxx]

Holy hell that was a terrific post!

I agree with everything you said especially with sakura having the most reasons to move on from her love of sasuke, our of all three of the pairings SS is BY FAR the most negative of them, it does not have a good message at all and the only thing it really does is hurt sakuras character.

I see her love for sasuke as something she will eventually get over and it will be a part of some HUGE development for her.

My posts are usually good, I think. They just become LAPs in the blink of an eye. I talk a lot, obviously.

Out of all the Big 3, NaruHina is the one with the less amount of angst and less amount of conflict. It's literally unicorns and rainbows. I think that's why I dislike it, it's so peaceful and boring. I hate SS 'cause it has too much angst and unhappiness. NaruSaku is the balance: it's both fluffy puppies and angsty. My point with this is, though SS is by far the most terrible and unhappy non-canon couple, NaruSaku is also unhappy to an certain extent. With Naruto, he seems to suffer pain because of Sakura's feelings for Sasuke and both feel like they are unworthy of the other. But it's usually a lot more happy than angsty, and truly follows the story's messages perfectly.

Bolded: Yup! Sakura's character development will be completely finished when she lets go of her lingering affection for Sasuke and realizes she has grown to love Naruto (or at least developed feelings for him).

[Chucky-kun]

My posts are usually good, I think. They just become LAPs in the blink of an eye. I talk a lot, obviously.

Out of all the Big 3, NaruHina is the one with the less amount of angst and less amount of conflict. It's literally unicorns and rainbows. I think that's why I dislike it, it's so peaceful and boring. I hate SS 'cause it has too much angst and unhappiness. NaruSaku is the balance: it's both fluffy puppies and angsty. My point with this is, though SS is by far the most terrible and unhappy non-canon couple, NaruSaku is also unhappy to an certain extent. With Naruto, he seems to suffer pain because of Sakura's feelings for Sasuke and both feel like they are unworthy of the other. But it's usually a lot more happy than angsty, and truly follows the story's messages perfectly.

Bolded: Yup! Sakura's character development will be completely finished when she lets go of her lingering affection for Sasuke and realizes she has grown to love Naruto (or at least developed feelings for him).

If by peaceful you mean naruto going all 6 tails on peins ass then sure.

[xxRomanceGirlxx]

If by peaceful you mean naruto going all 6 tails on peins ass then sure.

Right, the Pain Arc. Probably the only angsty moment NaruHina will ever have.

[StriderC]

My posts are usually good, I think. They just become LAPs in the blink of an eye. I talk a lot, obviously.

Out of all the Big 3, NaruHina is the one with the less amount of angst and less amount of conflict. It's literally unicorns and rainbows. I think that's why I dislike it, it's so peaceful and boring. I hate SS 'cause it has too much angst and unhappiness. NaruSaku is the balance: it's both fluffy puppies and angsty. My point with this is, though SS is by far the most terrible and unhappy non-canon couple, NaruSaku is also unhappy to an certain extent. With Naruto, he seems to suffer pain because of Sakura's feelings for Sasuke and both feel like they are unworthy of the other. But it's usually a lot more happy than angsty, and truly follows the story's messages perfectly.

Bolded: Yup! Sakura's character development will be completely finished when she lets go of her lingering affection for Sasuke and realizes she has grown to love Naruto (or at least developed feelings for him).

that was a very good post and I pretty much agree with everything you said. You covered all the bases and yeah you made a very good response and normally your posts are really good so I agree myself. I would have responded to more for her post but it was a lot and I thought that the bolded was more important and I was pretty busy but anyway very good job with your post.

[Slextrem]

Wow I missed a fun debate against a SS fan. Damnit!

Lol, just kidding. I think I'll jump in now.


Poision, my earlier comment about NaruHina isn't wrong. Throughout a lot of Part 1, Hinata never actively tried to be there for Naruto. Technically, her "sitting doing nothing" is what happened. She interacted with him a few times, but if she was truly trying to get her affections noticed, Hinata would have spent time with Naruto and been there for him. However, her shyness prevented that. Most of Part 2 Hinata demonstrated this too, until her confession. However, she strunk back into her "just doing nothing" shell and didn't interact with him post-confession. Not until the war arc, which is when she started being more upfront with her feelings. Unfortunately at the cost of her character development since she now considers winning Naruto more important than being strong for her Clan.

Sarcasm now? So what if I don't see the NH hand-holding terribly impactful? It was down-played when Naruto gave chakra to everyone else, he high-fived most of them, held Tenten and Shikamaru's hand. It was a lot quicker, but you convienently leave out why. Kurama specifically told him in 616 it took him a bit longer to gather all of his chakra together to do the transaction, he even apologized for it. Naruto was fine with it, he was just glad it worked. That's why it took longer compared to the others. And the emphasis seemed done to me for Hinata development, not that it was hinting NH endgame. Naruto was being very general with her the whole time. Sorry, I just don't see this "very likely" chance that meant Naruto would develop romantic feelings for her. If you read my posts, I have said multiple times that NH's chances have increased with 615 and that NaruHina is a possible pairing. I don't think it's likely, because Naruto shows absolutely no sign he likes her like you seem to want him to. If I'm wrong, I'm perfectly able to admit it. My opinion isn't fact, it's just what I believe. But I see no reason to say Naruto has feelings for her this quickly.

And here's something I can't help but comment on. You say Naruto is automatically forcing his feelings on Sakura because he loves her and has some small flame of hope he can be with Sakura. You have no idea how much I disagree with you. Naruto was forcing his feelings on her in Early Part 1. He constantly pestered her for dates and always tried to express his feelings to her so she could like him. Hell, look at the frickin' Bench Scene. Naruto transformed into Sasuke to see how she felt about him. That part wasn't completely terrible, 'cause she wouldn't talk or listen to him if he didn't do it otherwise. But the messed-up and selfish part was that when Sakura tried to kiss him, thinking he was Sasuke, Naruto was actually going to let her because of his own feelings for her. That was forcing, manipulative, and selfish. Back then, his feelings were immature that way. It stopped being that way a long time ago. Nowadays, Naruto rarely actually asks her for dates or references his feelings for her. He keeps it inside and locked, despite it obviously still being there. I dare say Naruto's love for Sakura were displayed the same way Hinata's were post-confession, though the difference is he actually hanged out with Sakura and understood her personality. With Hinata, her excuse was shyness. With Naruto, his reasons is selflessness and possible insecurity. (PoaL says hello) I just can't believe you would even try and put Naruto's love for her in a bad light like that. Sure he has hope to be with her, but's he never actually open about it like "You will be with me, no matter what! I'll show you how much I love you so you can notice me!" God, that was Part 1 Sakura's shtick with Sasuke and Hinata's relationship with Naruto. They force their feelings on their love interest, Naruto's far from it.

You think Sakura was crying during the tent scene that long because she knew she didn't love Naruto? Are you kidding? Are you forgetting the Third Databook sentence that stated bluntly "What are her feelings for Naruto? Sakura has still hadn't found the answer."? I think this is the first time I've heard that argument. Sakura's tears were very easily created by her guilt and care for Naruto's feelings, not because she knew she didn't love him. It was because she had caused him all the pain during the Promise of a Lifetime and her feelings for Sasuke back then. Sai stating "Aren't you a part of it too?" about Naruto's inner pain I think made her feel bad, and that was when she thought her feelings for Sasuke hurt him too much. I highly doubt Sakura was thinking when she flashbacked to the promise, was thinking "I love Sasuke, not him!", she was just wallowing in her pain that she had hurt Naruto back then that badly. Sakura knows she loves Sasuke, she doesn't know about Naruto. Her tears then were because she hurt Naruto and his selflessness hurt her, because she never wanted that for him. And her "The fool's in love with me" line was because of her unworthiness of Naruto's love. It's reinforced even more strongly by her next inner monlogue. "I'm the one that caused him the most pain ... I've done nothing but make mistakes ... I don't want to make another one."

Here's what I don't get with you. Why is it suddenly so much easier to see NS as the red herring than NH? I truly don't get that logic at all. Kishimoto hinted at NaruSaku far too much for it to be a red herring. Look at the major examples: The Tenchi Bridge scene, 1st NaruSaku hug (with the crowd blushing), Unfinished sentence, how most of her confession was Naruto and his safety/feelings before her love for Sasuke, Third Databook confirming her own confusion regarding Naruto, Yamato's unfinished sentence, Sakura's genuine anger at Naruto calling her a liar and pointedly saying "I'm the only one who knows what I'm feeling!". How does these multiple scene equate to a red herring? In comparision, what does NH have that could be dubbed a red herring? Major moments: 2. Naruto getting angry after she was stuck down and 615. NaruSaku has 7 moments that could imply romance. If it's a red herring, it's given way too much focus. Why not give NaruHina those 7 moments? It gives a lot more backing and it makes more sense.

Basically, I'm detecting a lot of double standards that you're saying. Naruto apparently has to move on from Sakura when he truly has no reason to at all. Her feelings for Sasuke, okay. But the PoaL crushed most of his dreams and confidence that could end up with Sakura, yet he still had feelings for and eventually his feeling matured even more seriously in Part 2. He really has no confidence at all when it comes to Sakura ever loving him, her confession made that perfectly clear. Yet he still doesn't try to move on. Like "I know the odds are against me, but I won't know unless I try" feeling going on. He's not forcing his feelings, he doesn't really expect everything, but's he's being there for her and wanting her to be happy. That's what I love about Naruto. Yet Sakura is suddenly a different matter entirely? When she is made it completely clear she doesn't want to love Sasuke and is actually of ashamed of how she feels for him? She has the most reasons out of anyone to move on. Without a doubt, she's the most likely one to change her feelings. Her growing relationship with Naruto throughout Part supports it even more.

I don't understand this. After all of the NS moments and development throughout the manga, one major moment with NaruHina makes you immediately jump on the "NaruHina's gonna happen now" bandwagon? There is something seriously wrong with this picture. NaruSaku has had way more focus and it still hasn't convinced you as a likely canon couple but NH, with it's scarce moments, is enough for you. That's one big, giant double standard you're sporting, Poison.

Now that is what I call a great post!

Preach on! --Click here to view--

Edited by Slextrem, 28 January 2013 - 06:44 AM.

[Chatte]

You know what I'm tired of? Why do NS moments have to be brought down yet SS or NH have to be cannon material? Really now? How double standarded, if I may say so, are people? All the interaction between NS has to be questioned, yet the other have to be full of absolute proof, although all the moments between NS are more legit than any other moments between any other pairings? I really don't get people.

And if you look at the triangle... NaruSakuSasu/NaruSakuHina... what's the common point between these two? Yup.. NaruSaku!

[Gravenimage]

If you believe and your thought is like that than that is your opinion on the forcing stuff. Whereas, Naruto is not forcing her. Forcing her is him pleading her or threatening her. Naruto just loves her, and showing his affection. That's all. I don't know why you keep mentioning that Naruto wants to force her to be with him.

And about the goal, I said it before and I'll say it again he's showing that he loves her from the beginning and doesn't shift his love. If you want him to literally say " She's my goal" than hope for it but I'm pointing at the things that I said before which is he won't out of the blue stop loving her. It can't be that way.
I hope you understood the way you're bringing the goal thing.

And how will Sasuke will be interested in her, again, out of the blue. Plus, Sakura doesn't love him like before. Things have changed. If Sasuke returns to Konoha, it doesn't mean that Sasuke and Sakura can be together. Again, same with Naruto about Hinata. Kishi to make them canon, have to start from the beginning of shippuden.

This^ agreed on everything.

Chatte@ I can think of several words to answer your question to why NS moments are one sided but NH and SS moments are absolute and canon. Desperation, denial and hypocrisy.

Edited by Gravenimage, 28 January 2013 - 11:31 AM.

[Chatte]

Chatte@ I can think of several words to answer your question to why NS moments are one sided but NH and SS moments are absolute and canon. Desperation, denial and hypocrisy.

Guess you're right. But really, I'm stuffed that us, NS fans, always have to be the good guys who say that yes, SS and NH is a possibility but others brush NS like it's nothing. Really, now!

[Gravenimage]

Guess you're right. But really, I'm stuffed that us, NS fans, always have to be the good guys who say that yes, SS and NH is a possibility but others brush NS like it's nothing. Really, now!

I have always seen NH and SS happening in the manga to a 0.!% chance of actually happening why do I think like that? Kishi has shown me in his manga and that's how I see it. Seriously if Kishi wants NH and SS to be canon why does he keep pushing them aside, then use those pairings for fan service only to troll the fans big time and instead he focuses so much in developing Naruto and Sakura's relationship? I have never seen Kishi trolling NS, he has always left things incomplete for the pairing but never to a point he will troll fans like he does with NH and SS. Why does he has troll those pairings at the RTN movie only to focus on the NS bond? It just doesn't make sense for Kishi to start developing a pairing since the beginning only to troll it badly and make pairings he has ignored, not focus or troll them in the end.

Edited by Gravenimage, 28 January 2013 - 11:48 AM.